Winner 2013 Webby Awards for Best Political Website
Top Banner, Site wide
Apr 17, 2014

 Choose a size
Text Size

Top Leaderboard, Site wide

Star-Spangled Baggage
Science Finds New Routes to Energy




Paul Robeson: A Life


Truthdig Bazaar
Losing the News

Losing the News

By Alex Jones
$16.47

more items

 
Report

The President’s Address to Congress

Email this item Email    Print this item Print    Share this item... Share

Posted on Feb 24, 2009
White House

(Page 4)

This budget builds on these reforms.  It includes an historic commitment to comprehensive health care reform – a down-payment on the principle that we must have quality, affordable health care for every American.  It’s a commitment that’s paid for in part by efficiencies in our system that are long overdue.  And it’s a step we must take if we hope to bring down our deficit in the years to come.

Now, there will be many different opinions and ideas about how to achieve reform, and that is why I’m bringing together businesses and workers, doctors and health care providers, Democrats and Republicans to begin work on this issue next week.

I suffer no illusions that this will be an easy process.  It will be hard.  But I also know that nearly a century after Teddy Roosevelt first called for reform, the cost of our health care has weighed down our economy and the conscience of our nation long enough.  So let there be no doubt: health care reform cannot wait, it must not wait, and it will not wait another year.   

The third challenge we must address is the urgent need to expand the promise of education in America. 

Advertisement

Square, Site wide
In a global economy where the most valuable skill you can sell is your knowledge, a good education is no longer just a pathway to opportunity – it is a pre-requisite. 

Right now, three-quarters of the fastest-growing occupations require more than a high school diploma.  And yet, just over half of our citizens have that level of education.  We have one of the highest high school dropout rates of any industrialized nation.  And half of the students who begin college never finish.

This is a prescription for economic decline, because we know the countries that out-teach us today will out-compete us tomorrow.  That is why it will be the goal of this administration to ensure that every child has access to a complete and competitive education – from the day they are born to the day they begin a career.

Already, we have made an historic investment in education through the economic recovery plan.  We have dramatically expanded early childhood education and will continue to improve its quality, because we know that the most formative learning comes in those first years of life.  We have made college affordable for nearly seven million more students.  And we have provided the resources necessary to prevent painful cuts and teacher layoffs that would set back our children’s progress.

But we know that our schools don’t just need more resources.  They need more reform.  That is why this budget creates new incentives for teacher performance; pathways for advancement, and rewards for success.  We’ll invest in innovative programs that are already helping schools meet high standards and close achievement gaps.  And we will expand our commitment to charter schools. 

It is our responsibility as lawmakers and educators to make this system work.  But it is the responsibility of every citizen to participate in it.  And so tonight, I ask every American to commit to at least one year or more of higher education or career training.  This can be community college or a four-year school; vocational training or an apprenticeship.  But whatever the training may be, every American will need to get more than a high school diploma.  And dropping out of high school is no longer an option.  It’s not just quitting on yourself, it’s quitting on your country – and this country needs and values the talents of every American.  That is why we will provide the support necessary for you to complete college and meet a new goal:  by 2020, America will once again have the highest proportion of college graduates in the world. 

I know that the price of tuition is higher than ever, which is why if you are willing to volunteer in your neighborhood or give back to your community or serve your country, we will make sure that you can afford a higher education.  And to encourage a renewed spirit of national service for this and future generations, I ask this Congress to send me the bipartisan legislation that bears the name of Senator Orrin Hatch as well as an American who has never stopped asking what he can do for his country – Senator Edward Kennedy.

These education policies will open the doors of opportunity for our children.  But it is up to us to ensure they walk through them.  In the end, there is no program or policy that can substitute for a mother or father who will attend those parent/teacher conferences, or help with homework after dinner, or turn off the TV, put away the video games, and read to their child.  I speak to you not just as a President, but as a father when I say that responsibility for our children’s education must begin at home.

There is, of course, another responsibility we have to our children.  And that is the responsibility to ensure that we do not pass on to them a debt they cannot pay.  With the deficit we inherited, the cost of the crisis we face, and the long-term challenges we must meet, it has never been more important to ensure that as our economy recovers, we do what it takes to bring this deficit down.

I’m proud that we passed the recovery plan free of earmarks, and I want to pass a budget next year that ensures that each dollar we spend reflects only our most important national priorities.

Yesterday, I held a fiscal summit where I pledged to cut the deficit in half by the end of my first term in office.  My administration has also begun to go line by line through the federal budget in order to eliminate wasteful and ineffective programs.  As you can imagine, this is a process that will take some time.  But we’re starting with the biggest lines.  We have already identified two trillion dollars in savings over the next decade.

In this budget, we will end education programs that don’t work and end direct payments to large agribusinesses that don’t need them.  We’ll eliminate the no-bid contracts that have wasted billions in Iraq, and reform our defense budget so that we’re not paying for Cold War-era weapons systems we don’t use.  We will root out the waste, fraud, and abuse in our Medicare program that doesn’t make our seniors any healthier, and we will restore a sense of fairness and balance to our tax code by finally ending the tax breaks for corporations that ship our jobs overseas.

In order to save our children from a future of debt, we will also end the tax breaks for the wealthiest 2% of Americans.  But let me perfectly clear, because I know you’ll hear the same old claims that rolling back these tax breaks means a massive tax increase on the American people:  if your family earns less than $250,000 a year, you will not see your taxes increased a single dime.  I repeat: not one single dime.  In fact, the recovery plan provides a tax cut – that’s right, a tax cut – for 95% of working families.  And these checks are on the way. 

To preserve our long-term fiscal health, we must also address the growing costs in Medicare and Social Security.  Comprehensive health care reform is the best way to strengthen Medicare for years to come.  And we must also begin a conversation on how to do the same for Social Security, while creating tax-free universal savings accounts for all Americans.


New and Improved Comments

If you have trouble leaving a comment, review this help page. Still having problems? Let us know. If you find yourself moderated, take a moment to review our comment policy.

By Mbadger, September 11, 2009 at 4:46 am Link to this comment

iv’e got to agree with JK on his points, obama is the most forward thinking president for years. He’s attempting to singlehandedly fix everything that bush broke through neglect and stupidity, while at the same time drag america kicking and screaming into the 21st century global society. Like he said bush would never have tried to computerise medical records or improve america’s mobile broadband network. The mans doing the right thing, hes trying to generally improve the living conditions of his citizens and others across the world, his stance of detente and reconcilliation with the middle east is the best thing he has ever and will ever do. At last some sanity and cool headedness in the white house.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, March 3, 2009 at 9:00 am Link to this comment

Anyone who still thinks China is not capitalist is kidding themselves.

Deficit spending is the CLASSIC tool to break a recession cycle.  Just ask FDR.  Military spending isn’t as good as infrastructure spending, but it’s a heluva lot better than dumping it into banks who then don’t lend it out so it’s totally wasted (a la Paulsen).

Kleptocapitalism?  Stick two words together and you get something that doesn’t mean either—like Islamofascism—both are like “butterfly” which has nothing to do with butter or flies.

At least I’ll give you credit for HOPING we emerge from this mess in good shape.  That’s better than Rash Limpwad who wants the President’s plans to all fail.  So what if 100 million Americans are out of work and lose their life savings?  As long as it gets the GOP back in he’s just FINE with that.

Report this

By Folktruther, March 2, 2009 at 7:52 pm Link to this comment

The reason China is important is because it provides a contrast to the US, whom it is replacing as the world’s leading power.  In China the state owns the banks as well as a third of the economy,most the big industrial firms: sttel, oil, cement, etc.

In the US, the banks own the government, through their control of the parties by money, media and political management. Zionists largely own the banks.  Just as China created a new form of economy, party capitalism, so has the US.  The US ecnomy is now kleptocapitalism, led by the bank owners. It occurs because it is much more profitable to steal money by financial means then to make it by producing goods.

These are new economic forms not discussed by Marx.  Party capitalism is a huge success so far. In IS kleptocapitalism, many progressive economists, or “economists” in Ihherit’s idiom, do not see any solution at all.  John Paul Roberts, the assistent tresurer under Reagan, and increasingly radical, see only increased debt without a solution, leading to bankruptcy, Chalmers Johnsom prediction.  Chossidosky on global exchange predicts disaster as well.

Obama is increasing military expenditures, which are now plus or minus a trilliion dollars.  The current historical situation is unprecidented as the economy continues to decline.  And a public relations cipher, who looks and sounds real good on TV, is ostensibly in charge.  He is escalating the AF-Pak war.

Possiby we will emerge from this in good shape.  I don’t see how.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, March 2, 2009 at 7:23 pm Link to this comment

Folktruther:

Of course I’m an intellectual primitive: I’m not a Marxist.  Only a Marxist can be intellectually sophisticated.

Such flows your circular logic. A thing must be true because its implications must true and the implications must be true because the thing is true.

This is called nonsense, but is the heart of all your arguments.

China is no longer a Marxist state. Marxism has failed spectacularly in China, to be replaced by capitalism. China’s leadership is merely a dictatorship claiming to still be “Marxist” while abandoning every part of it but “Dictatorship of the…” (even “proletariat” no longer applies). This dictatorship is encouraging economic growth and capitalism, not realizing that, sooner or later it must become a Western-style democracy or collapse.

You can skip the phony compliments.

Report this

By Folktruther, March 2, 2009 at 11:41 am Link to this comment

Inherit, it bothers me that you don’t understand marxism.  You are an intelligent, intellectually courageous intelllectual primitive and you just don’t seem to get the idea.  This is common with Ameican workers as well, including leftists.  It’s just a lot of words to them, blah, blah blah.

I think one of the major porblems is that the unstated presuppositions are so different.  You obviously think social theory is cheap debating points combined with schoolbook American history, suppliemnted by irrelevant bullshit picked up on Wikipedia.  You simply don’t understand that there has been an honest movment of theory formulated from a world historical perspective.  A good example is Chris Harmons recent A PEOPLE’S HISSTORY OF THE WORLD.  A better world history than the American people’s history of Zinn.

When you say that muarxists make predictions and they are wrong, this is quite correct.  Just as non-marxist predictions are wrong.  Lenin a month before the February revolution stated that they were likely not to see revolution in their lifetimes. 

And being subjected to American mainstream truth, you don’t understand the problems of seige socialism, trying to industrialize while being threatened with invasion by capitalist powers.  And the American truth tradition simply ignoring the success of marxist ideology in forming the current party capitalism of China.  It is developing at three or four times the rate of the capitalist powers simply by invessting 40% or so of annual income in the economy.  American ideology makes one blind to implications of what exists in plain sight in the world.

It is doubly difficult for you because you identify with the Zionist tradition, and the Israeli Homeland, and this is incompatible with socialism.  Socialists, like your Menshivik grandfather, are consequently, as you think,  anti-semitic, and people like me, as you’ve stated before,  hate all Jews.  The Aipac drivel.

But at least you have no compunctions aboout displaying your ignorance. Your statement that Marx should have known Recoardo but it is not clear that he did, is problably quite true: for you.  Actually Marx admired both Adam Smith and Ricrado, as opposed to the corrupt degeneration of the later bourgeois economists.  CAPTIAL is bascially a critique of their economics.

In order to clarify the world historical implications, marxism has to be placed in a world historical setting, rather than the Western setting of developed capitalism.  This can now be done. 

It is possible to develop math conceptual structures that conceive relations among the past, present and future persons of the earth in a simple holistic way.  This enlargement might paradoxically make it esier to understnad world historical theories from a population prospective rather than from a national or regional power perspective.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, March 2, 2009 at 5:15 am Link to this comment

FT:

Are you annoyed? Too bad! I’m tired of your nonsensical dogma. I’d say get a background in History of Economics—any proper grad course covers Marx—his “criticism” was based on older tools an methods. He should have known who Ricardo was but it’s not clear he did.  And, Cournot predates Marx.

If you want to take on Keynes and Samuelson, then you need to know that they both build DIRECTLY on the work of Pareto and Walras—they didn’t just come out of the blue.  Pareto is NOT irrelevant—if you think so, it’s yet again a mark of your ignorance clouded by your dogma.

I’ve been hearing Marxists and neo-Marxists all my life and overwhelming confidence they have that they know EXACTLY what’s going to happen has been shown to be wrong again and again.

Think on it: According to the Marxists, we have been on the brink of a new Socialist order since the 20’s.  Then in the 30’s the CP was actually main-stream (had it broken with Stalin then it might have stayed main-stream).  Of course, after the War, there was the McCarthy suppression of dissent, but it arose again in the 60’s and 70’s—never as far.

By 1980 the Marxists were yet again predicting the collapse of the Western economies.  Instead they missed predicting the collapse of the planned economies of the East.

The absolutist “analysis” that Marxists and neo-Marxists present (like you) is amazing in that
a) It is consistently wrong in being able to predict the future.
b) You continue to use it, count on it, rely on it, and make absolutist pronouncements as if it actually worked.

I point this out and you get angry and call me a racist, an advocate of “ethnic cleansing” and a fan of Netanyahu—all of which are patently untrue.  Yet you repeat these falsehoods again and again.

So you’re annoyed: You have two choices—deal with it—nobody plays softball here, or refuse to respond.  You don’t HAVE to press the “SUBMIT” button.

Report this

By Folktruther, March 1, 2009 at 8:55 pm Link to this comment

Inherit, what Marxist “scholars” are you talking about?  I didn’t mention any.  They generally don’t specialize in mnth economics.

Marx mathematical models were obsolete?  He didn’t use any.  Leon Walras and Pareto published after Marx. What are you talking about?

Do you think Marx didn’t know the classical economists like Adam Smith and Recardo?  His whole work was a critique of classical economics.

All this sstuff is totally irrelevant.  What I maent by math econ, which I am not much interested in, began in earnest after WW2 with people like Sameulson.  Of much greater importance was game theory, a math theory of simple conflicts developed primarily by John von Neumann.

I suppose that the idea is to disguise your ignorance by saying I am ignorant or put down marxists putting marxist “scholars” in quotation marks. This is simply childish.  Most of this stuff is irrelevant to useful theory so ignorence of it is perfectly understandable.  I was joking when I called you ignorant.  But I don’t think bullshit is funny.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, March 1, 2009 at 2:31 pm Link to this comment

Folktruther, March 1 at 5:09 pm #

I see, Ihherit, you just make the stuff up as you go along.  Math economics began historically long after Marx.  And theory truths are quite independant of which individuals engage in behavior.  Birth and death are major events in a person’s life but but population studies are devloped independeantly of which persons are born or die.

You just justify mistatments and lack of understanding with polemic, and get by with that.  OK. But that obviously precludes interesting discourse.
************************************************

You think Marx invented mathematics in Econ, or that it was invented after him?  I’m not making this up—you are just simply declaring your ridiculous dogmatic ignorance yet again.

Before Marx was Adam Smith and, less known but more important, David Ricardo.  Before them, the Scholastics and others.

Marx never studied the writings of either Auguste Walras or his far more important son, Leon Walras.  Walras was influenced toward mathematical economics by Augustin Cournot who was born nearly 2 decades ahead of Marx.

Walras laid down the first general equilibrium model, but you wouldn’t know about that.  Nor would you know that Vilfredo Pareto took it and streamlined both the math and the graphical representations of it that led to the foundation of modern models.

I’m not making this $#!t up—it’s even out there on Wikipedia if you want to look it up.

Just because your Marxist “scholars” said there wasn’t any mathematical economics before Marx and that it was all weak after him, doesn’t make it so.  Marx’s capabilities as an economist were LIMITED, as brilliant as he was, because his mathematical tools were OBSOLETE!

I’m not saying anything thst’s not easily verified independently.

Report this

By Folktruther, March 1, 2009 at 1:09 pm Link to this comment

I see, Ihherit, you just make the stuff up as you go along.  Math economics began historically long after Marx.  And theory truths are quite independant of which individuals engage in behavior.  Birth and death are major events in a person’s life but but population studies are devloped independeantly of which persons are born or die.

You just justify mistatments and lack of understanding with polemic, and get by with that.  OK. But that obviously precludes interesting discourse.

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, March 1, 2009 at 12:26 pm Link to this comment

Hold on call the Sheriff, I have been pondering over my political and social navel,  from advice, of self proclaimed geniuses, who promote a new meaning of humility. 

When I was working as a sheep herder, I was taken from my job herding sheep, to install Sheetrock in a bathroom, because they asked me if I had some experience in sheet rocking.  I said “yes”. 

After the job was done, they said, “you told us you had experience in doing Sheetrock”?  I will not elaborate why they asked me this.

I replied,  “yes I had experience doing Sheetrock, but I never told you I did it well”.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, March 1, 2009 at 11:19 am Link to this comment

Folktruther, March 1 at 2:22 pm #

Inherit, you ignornant boob.  Acutally I was trained in mathematical models in the social sciences.  LIBERAL social science.  It is mostly a fraud, like the fabricated official statistics that the US distributes to measure unemployment, inflation and growth. It is faudulent in the same way of much of the mainstream truth distributed by the learned and mass media and other truth organs.

However.  Conceptual innovations associated with 20th century American social science allows us, if ww wish, to transform our worldviews of reality. 

...............................
Unfortunately, conceptual revolution in social science subverts the political-scientific worldview of capitalist polities.  That is why social science lags histoically so far behind the natural sciences. 
..................

blah, blah, blather, blather—I can’t quote all of this and still have enough space to finish….......
.......................

However marxism absorded the ideological underpinnings of the Western worldview, notably scientism. Scientiific conceptual structures in social science generate ideological implications that subvert the traditional scientific ideology that justified them.  Consequently a revolution in social science, as opposed to the scientific revolutions in the natural sciences, must be an UNSCIENTIFIC revolution.
****************************************************

Thanks, FolkTruther.  I add to “ridiculous ignoramus” the adjective “dogmatic”.

I, too, was trained in what you refer to as the mathematical models of social science, specifically graduate-level economics.  Your descriptions of them is totally fallacious, like claiming a hammer is really a screwdriver, and then attacking it for being a lousy screwdriver.

It means you understood nothing, but that’s no surprise. It also means you never understood that by the time Marx was doing his groundbreaking work (even non-Marxists credit him with inventing the social sub-science of Economic History), the mathematics of Economics had already left him far behind, stuck in the tools that had been unable to develop relevant models.

Of course, this obsolete modeling by Marx became the foundation for future Marxist “Economists” (the terms are not actually compatible).

Your truly silly and predictable assertions about non-Marxist social science simple demonstrate my case for me: Dogma replaced logic in your mind long ago and now you try to map the world and human behavior to that dogma.

Great international geo-political systems are nothing more than amalgams of the behaviors of millions of individuals, each making their own choices about how to live.  You cannot model the systems until you can model the individuals.

The bottom line is: Marxism has failed everywhere it’s been tried.  The MOST successful example has been the Israeli Kibbutzim, but even these are failing. 

Unbridled and unregulated neo-capitalism has failed as well, though not nearly as spectacularly (despite Bush’s best efforts we still have our government and Nation—unlike the Soviet Union). 

Only a well-regulated capitalist system, that rewards SUCCESSFUL risk-taking, innovation and merit, punishes unsuccessful risk-taking, and counteracts the chance that cheats and short cuts can succeed.  Checks and balances, laws enforced, and an educational system that fosters that, starting in kindergarten.

But I never expect you to be able to grasp this—it means abandoning your “religion” and that’s too horrible for you to conceive of—that everything you know is wrong.

If you do away with our system, you’ll only have a dictatorship.

“Scientism” Is that like “scientology”, a made-up phony term pretending to be based on science?  The bolded section is especially funny!

Report this

By Folktruther, March 1, 2009 at 10:22 am Link to this comment

Inherit, you ignornant boob.  Acutally I was trained in mathematical models in the social sciences.  LIBERAL social science.  It is mostly a fraud, like the fabricated official statistics that the US distributes to measure unemployment, inflation and growth. It is faudulent in the same way of much of the mainstream truth distributed by the learned and mass media and other truth organs.

However.  Conceptual innovations associated with 20th century American social science allows us, if ww wish, to transform our worldviews of reality.  This occurred in the history of the natural sciences over the past four centuries and was legiitmated by great scientific revolutions.  They had to be revolutions becuase the simple ideological truths generated by conceptual transformation subverted the religious-political worldivew of feudal polities.

Unfortunately, conceptual revolution in social science subverts the political-scientific worldview of capitalist polities.  That is why social science lags histoically so far behind the natural sciences.  It cannot develop and legitimate scientific conceptual structures without subverting the ideological worldview of the power structure that sponsors and subsidizes them.  The simple truth about relations among the past, present and future people of the earth, formulated from a world historical perspective, subverts the Wesstern worldview that has legitimated capitalist Democracies the past few centuries.

These math conceptual structues generalize the underlying preconceptions of marxist social theory, the major world social theory in the 20th century.  Marxism was largely repressed and distorted in the US during the War on Communism, which is why you have such a cretinous notion of it.

However marxism absorded the ideological underpinnings of the Western worldview, notably scientism. Scientiific conceptual structures in social science generate ideological implications that subvert the traditional scientific ideology that justified them.  Consequently a revolution in social science, as opposed to the scientific revolutions in the natural sciences, must be an UNSCIENTIFIC revolution.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, March 1, 2009 at 6:08 am Link to this comment

altlic, March 1 at 5:09 am #

...but before I let you go, FT.

Conspiracies. Sorry dude, this is the red flashing light that lets me know right off the top that you have a hyperactive mind. The book sounds like a good read though.

Where the hell did I say that Obama is not serving the interests of power??

And don’t accuse me of being contemptuous of people. You may like to think you’re looking out for the common folk but I don’t think that’s your real motivation.

You strike me as a zealot, prone to being irrational in your devotion to the cause, and showing intolerance and contempt for those who disagree.

Anyway, that’s it for this thread.
***************************************************

You are merely stating the obvious.  What’s your point?

FolkTruther is a neo-Marxist.  He considers himself an intellectual because he’s read and studied a lot of Marxist thinkers—historians, political scientists and economists.  Therefore he thinks he knows how everything is going to play out via his understanding of the dialectic.

What he sadly does not and never will understand is that all these “scholars” he reveres are no different than the “scholars” that the ultra-“Christian” Right cites against global warming, evolution and The Big Bang—just a different context.

And he is equally dogmatic.  Consequently, totally predictable.

Unlike Shingo or Cyrena.  Shingo catches me by surprise all the time—I usually hate his postings but I gotta give the man credit for independent thinking.

And Cyrena:  There are SO many times I’d like to scream at what she writes, but somehow I cannot help but really like and appreciate her—and hold back the poisoned pen.  Must be a male chauvinist residue on my part—I love truly intelligent women who effectively challenge my thinking (even if they are occasionally wrong)—that’s why I’m married to one.

Report this

By altlic, March 1, 2009 at 1:09 am Link to this comment

...but before I let you go, FT.

Conspiracies. Sorry dude, this is the red flashing light that lets me know right off the top that you have a hyperactive mind. The book sounds like a good read though.

Where the hell did I say that Obama is not serving the interests of power??

And don’t accuse me of being contemptuous of people. You may like to think you’re looking out for the common folk but I don’t think that’s your real motivation.

You strike me as a zealot, prone to being irrational in your devotion to the cause, and showing intolerance and contempt for those who disagree.

Anyway, that’s it for this thread.

Report this

By altlic, March 1, 2009 at 12:24 am Link to this comment

FT,

No difference between ideological insanity and being stupid, unless your a nerd. You’re just splitting hairs.

It’s all of a piece - the institutions are there because the populace is out of control. That’s why people WANT the ideology, the simplistic religion, the jingoism. They WANT the army, police, etc.

In the big picture we have been experimenting for the last few hundred to two thousand years with individuality and personal freedom. Think Pandora’s box.

See you next post down the road?

Report this

By Folktruther, February 28, 2009 at 12:44 pm Link to this comment

Bertil, Altlic:  I do NOT believe that tht American people are idiots, Altlic.  We are ideologically insane.  If you will read Bertil’s post, you will understand that power strutures lie to the people to promote their power interests, and over historical time this insstitutionalized deception of the learned and mass media they control distorts our conceptual of reality, especially poltiical reality.

It is true that we are intellectually cowardly, since the simple truth about power subverts the power delusions that we were taught from childhood to legitmate authorized power.  We have been miseducated, misinformed and misentertained from childhood to instill the misconceptions that legitimate the power of the Educcated classes.

Except for yourself, Altlic.  You understand that Obama is supporting the interests of the population not the interests of power.  Because he looks and sound so good on TV.  And saying that he is rehablitating Bushite policies doesn’t help us follow Obama’s lead. 

Your quarrel here is with Nafooz Ahmed, a brilliant British think tank director, who said it first and I merely stole it, as I steal truths from everyone.  He wrote an astonishingly erudite examination of 9/11 within US and Western foreign policy, praised by Vidal and Pilger, called THE WAR ON TRUTH. 

You wouldn’t be interested in this book, Altlic,  because it consideres 9/11 a conspiracy theory and you already know that they don’t exist.  The media tells you so. It is one of the reasons that you are so much more intelligent than the American population.

Report this

By Bertil, February 28, 2009 at 10:25 am Link to this comment

One fatal flaw I’ve noticed in any power structure (I thought I’d never use that phrase.) is that they need to believe that they are putting one over on the underlings.  It happens from slumlord and tenants to corporate management and workers.  It is especially true in government.  They can’t help themselves, they have to lie, to make everyone believe whatever line of bullshit their selling, while they skulk behind a thin veneer of some politcal theory or of character to mask their ploys to remain in power.
John Pilger tells the story of the Russian press, how they didn’t believe a word from the government until the final denial.
To rephrase an old saying:  You can fool all the people some of the time, and you can fool some of the people all the time.  But Americans are in a constant state of being fooled.  Noam Chomsky’s right, despots the world over would love to have a populace like the ours.  Say anything until you see it echoed on a blog and you’ve penetrated.

Report this

By altlic, February 27, 2009 at 10:19 pm Link to this comment

“rehabilitate Bushite policies”... you see FT this is just an example of how you exaggerate stuff and it just doesn’t help. Obama is not running cover for Bush/Cheney, nor is he in favor of the kleptocracy. But he IS making horrible compromises. Most of all, as you know, the American people are craven idiots.

Whatever the revolution brings, we are a LONG way from having an egalitarian society. There will be another ruling class, perhaps more enlightened, perhaps not, after this dynasty fails, and they will condescend and play on people’s fears and embrace violence to keep the peace.

Why do I think this? Look around. Humanity is immature, massively traumatized and impoverished. It is going to take centuries for this stuff to get worked out, maybe thousands of years, if we’re still around.

I don’t think America will respond in time to the challenges of the 21st century. America and the West show classic signs of a civilization in irreversible decline. But there’s always hope.

Personally, I am not doing much to change the world. I find myself hoping instead for another Ghandi, another movement, to take hold somewhere. Maybe that’s why I’m cruising this site, looking for some inspiration.

I sincerely feel that Obama, although he is a politician, is possibly someone for people to coalesce around and push for big changes. I think he is someone who will respond positively to a civic reawakening.

What is the alternative? I don’t see one. Anarchists, academicians, conspiracy freaks, religious nuts, self-help cults…there’s nothing out there. What is it going to take to get people to walk down main street and yell “I’m not going to take this anymore”

Now when things get scary enough, then as you say, we shall see.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, February 27, 2009 at 8:34 pm Link to this comment

Folktruther, February 27 at 4:46 pm #

you’re right, Inherit (intermixed with your Zionist gibberish) that I have never posted a analysis of how Israel could remain a predominantly Jewish state.

The only way I can see that happening historically is if the Palestinians can become militarily-politically strong enough to force Israel to retreat to their pre-1967 boundaries.  Perhaps by the Egyptians or other peoples overthrowing their US installed puppet regimes.
***************************************************

So your only answer is a military crushing of Israel, which will, of course lead to a slaughter.  Israel, if she could be sure of security would go back to the ‘67 borders faster than you realize (naturally).  The key is how to guarantee Israel will be secure—until then it won’t happen.

*************************************************
Should that happen, a permanent peace could be negotiated, and volentary exchanges of population might ensue.  I don’t know how likely that is.
*************************************************

Not if the Palestinians and Egyptians etc mount a major assault against Israel.  I guess you have a problem understanding that fighting and negotiating aren’t the same thing…..  No surprise there.

***************************************************
Your idea of socialism is too clueless to even criticize.  You accept your dad’s absurd notion that your grandfather, who you apparently never knew, was anti-semitic because he was a Meshevik.
****************************************************

Sometimes, FT, I cannot believe how stupid you are. I mean it, I really can’t. My grandpa was a Menshevik. That explains WHY he was anti-semitic.  My father didn’t infer his father’s anti-semitism from that but from the things Grandpa said in front of Dad.  I swear sometimes you are just too dense for words.

I suppose you figure Marx and Engels didn’t understand Socialism…after all, NOBODY but FolkTruther truly understands Socialism…excuse me while I puke.

(there, that’s better.)

*************************************************
Russia under the tzar was very anti-Semitic and both wings of Social democracy were strongly against anti-Semitism and included many Jewish leaders in their leadership.

Your dad was a political dingbat.
**************************************************

Yes, Dad was a political dingbat.  But then he wised up and stopped thinking and talking like you. (moronic, that is)

Happily, while he remained a TRUE Progressive all his life, he out-grew your childish dogma well before I was born.

Report this

By Folktruther, February 27, 2009 at 3:22 pm Link to this comment

Another alternative, which I had ruled out, is that Obama puts pressure on Israel to establish a viable Palestinian state.  Which Sec of State Clinton appears to be doing, or at least beginning to do.  I didn’t, and don’t, see how this could happen, but conceivably there may to a glimmer of reason in the US power structure.  Or it could be more bullshit.  We just have to wait and see.

Report this

By Folktruther, February 27, 2009 at 12:46 pm Link to this comment

you’re right, Inherit (intermixed with your Zionist gibberish) that I have never posted a analysis of how Israel could remain a predominantly Jewish state. 

The only way I can see that happening historically is if the Palestinians can become militarily-politically strong enough to force Israel to retreat to their pre-1967 boundaries.  Perhaps by the Egyptians or other peoples overthrowing their US installed puppet regimes. 

Should that happen, a permanent peace could be negotiated, and volentary exchanges of population might ensue.  I don’t know how likely that is.

Your idea of socialism is too clueless to even criticize.  You accept your dad’s absurd notion that your grandfather, who you apparently never knew, was anti-semitic because he was a Meshevik. 

Russia under the tzar was very anti-Semitic and both wings of Social democracy were strongly against anti-Semitism and included many Jewish leaders in their leadership.

Your dad was a political dingbat.  Like my dad, acutally, and probably most dads.  And we don’t seem to have done much better.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, February 27, 2009 at 5:02 am Link to this comment

Bertel, Inherit is a Zionist and they identify with the Aipac line that all who oppose the Israeli power system hate Jews.  They just make the stuff up as they go along, just as Inherit attributes to me that I advocate the nationalization of all businesses.  This isn’t true but it doesn’t matter, he’ll just make something else up if I refute that. That I am infavor of the massacre of all Isreali Jews.
***********************************************

I make stuff up?????  Yer $#ittin’ me, right?  According to you, I’m a Black Hat in payos carrying an Uzzi and a white phosphorus bomb ready to shoot down any child who isn’t a fellow Black Hatter!  Oh…and drooling while I do it. I’m also (in your fantasy) part of the “International Conspiracy” of AIPAC seeking to destroy the world solely for the advancement of Jewry.

As I said, my Jewish grandfather was anti-semitic and so are you…must be something about being socialist or, in your case, neo-Marxist.

You consistently deny that I’m in favor of a REAL 2-state solution, deny that I’m TOTALLY against “ethnic cleansing”, saying, rather I WANT it, deny that I HATE racism, saying I’m a racist, claim that I’m part of AIPAC, when I detest that organization, etc, etc, etc.

In fact, you have NEVER posted a post that advocated ANY policy that allowed Israel to continue to exist, except as another Arab Moslem state using that name.  You have NEVER acknowledged that anyone anywhere ever had a bad thought against Israeli Jews, or that ANY act of terrorism committed against non-combatants was unjustified.

Your own self-hatred of your long Jewish heritage, whether cultural or religious is your own problem you have to deal with.  It’s out there, it’s real and it’s in every post where you invent my thoughts for me.

I don’t need to make up $#it about you—your own views exceed my wildest fantasies about the absurd.  I just keep waiting for extra-terrestrials to come into it.  BTW, are they Marxist or Capitalist running dogs?  (never understood that insult—I like dogs)

Report this

By Folktruther, February 27, 2009 at 3:52 am Link to this comment

Although it’s a little late for me to join the hivemind, Altlic, in a certain sense I agree with you.  If I were president, and made president the same way that Obama was, I could not do any different than he is without being assassinated.He is there is serve the interests of the power structure and rehabilitate Bushite policies, and to get pseudo-progressives to support them.  And you are quite right, that is the way it is.

Apparently a majority of Americans approve his sending an increase of 17 thousand troops to escalate the war in Af-Pakistan.  Just as Americns initially approved Johnson escalating the Vietnam war.  And that is the way it is.

But that is not the way it will be historically in the future.  With the political revolution ingeneered by the Bushites, we have entered the age of kleptocapitalism.  The banks and financial institutions have discovered that it is much more profitable to steal money than to earn it by producing goods.  So that is what they are doing, stealing by the hundreds of billions and trilliions of dollars.

And instead of increasing the means of production, they are increasing the means of distruction, Obama increasing the aount spent on the military from even Bushite levels.  While increasing taxes on the population and legallizing not paying what is owned in social security.  Continuing the increase in economic inequality which has reach grotesque proportions.  And spreading the gospal of Hope, just as the Gops spread the gospal of Faith. 

And as TAU continues to critique, the power structure keeps the Americandreammachine running fulltime.  And that’s the way it is.

But for how long, Altlic?  With your penetrating insight into the nature of things, and your immense intellectual courage to cosider dissident alternatives, you must understand that a lawless power system based on institutionalized theft cannot long endure.  As the people become more impoverished, they will either become mmore hopeless or more enraged.  And that is why we have the American military in the US, to shoot down the enraged.

And then what, Altlic?  After the American people see that the American power structure is there to exploit them and shoot them if they protest.  And that the US with all its weapons and all its killing can’t win its wars in Iraq, Afghanistan or Israel.

Well the 21st century was a century of revolution, revolutions occurring all over the world, freeing the colonial countries from the grip of Western imperialism.  And now the Muslim countries.  I suggest to you that shocks of reality will penetrate even the Americandreammachine, and the American people will find that the American power system is not only brutal, barbarous, and murderous, but corrupt, incompentent and obsolete as well. Increasingly so, as time goes on.

and that the American people can form a new Convention under article 5 of the Constitution, if they wish,  to revise the American constitution.
Even wasps with a hivemind get angry at the bears stealing their honey.  And so, as has happened all through history, but do not teach it in the history books, people rise up and change their society.

But to what, Altlic?  We don’t know yet.  But I suggest to you that even a hive mentality will find out.  After it occurs.

Report this

By altlic, February 26, 2009 at 11:43 pm Link to this comment

Folktruther

you must join the hive mind
resistance is futile
you have fought well
but you must realize
that in the end
you will be assimilated
muhahahahahaha
MUHAHAHAHAHA

Hello,
Obama is president of the US of A
he’s not Che Guevara
I am as frustrated as anyone that Nader and a bunch of others
do not get a seat at the debating table
But hey that’s how it is
So now what?
Try to blow Obama out of the water?
But people on the right are cheering you on FT
It’s counterproductive

And try putting yourself in Obama’s shoes
How far do you think you would get with your agenda?
Being president means you gave up your ideals a long time ago in exchange for the dark arts of power.
If there is a glimmer of light in there,
I, with full awareness, will take it.

Report this

By Folktruther, February 26, 2009 at 6:38 pm Link to this comment

Yeah, you’re right, truthdigger, the American people are being gaslighted by the learned and mass media.  but why don’t they reject it, and realize that their personal interests and those of their chldren are dependent on the political or power process?  How does it happen that only 8% of the people opposed Obama’s speech.

the only answer I can think of is that the powerless WANT to be deluded by authority.  As well as not want to.  And these two tendencies war in the American soul as they do in all people.  What is paramount at any time depends on the shock crisis and the progressives and conservatives competing for our souls.  Who do you think would win at the present time if there is another Terrorist Incident?

Bertel, Inherit is a Zionist and they identify with the Aipac line that all who oppose the Israeli power system hate Jews.  They just make the stuff up as they go along, just as Inherit attributes to me that I advocate the nationalization of all businesses.  This isn’t true but it doesn’t matter, he’ll just make something else up if I refute that. That I am infavor of the massacre of all Isreali Jews.

Zionists have to be irrational and intellectually dishonest because they are defending barbaric oppression that most decent people in the world oppose.  So Zionists explain this as the world hates Jews, rather than hatred of the oppression they object to. 

Of course there is anti-Semtism in the world, particluarly in the Christian West.  But the conflation of anti-Semtism and anti-Zionism is their only justification for defending the ethnic cleansing policies of The Homeland, as Inherit calls it.

Report this

By truedigger3, February 26, 2009 at 4:15 pm Link to this comment

Folktruther wrote:
“You know, Bertil, I don’t understand it either.  Why are Americans fooled so easily?”
____________________________________________________

Folktruther,

The problem is the MSM. The American people is being
lied to, bullshitted and distracted 24/7.
Most people are busy earning a living and raising
their kids to have the time,  energy and sometimes the means to sift through and analyse what is happening.  They depend on quick
sound bytes or headlines for explanation and justfications for what is going on.
And to add insult to injury, the education system is
being transformed gradually to graduating compliant
non-critical , non-thinking robots.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, February 26, 2009 at 3:46 pm Link to this comment

Bertil, February 26 at 2:19 pm #

I know Folktruther (FT) doesn’t need it, but I feel obliged to come to his support.
FT represents a real threat.  On previous threads, he divulged that he is a Jew and, therefore, the usual first line of attack that he’s an anti-semite cannot be leveled against him.

************************************************

Nonsense!  My grandfather was Jewish (both sides), son of a very devout man and was anti-semitic as all h#11! He was an old Menshevik, was sent to Siberia by the Tsar,  and my dad, who was as left-wing as them came, described him as anti-semitic.

I would describe 99.9% of modern Black Republicans (all 16 of them!) as racist AGAINST BLACK PEOPLE!  (starting with the RNC chair).

Report this

By JFoster2k, February 26, 2009 at 3:41 pm Link to this comment

FT,

Thanks for the replies. We obviously differ greatly in our views, but it’s nice to have spirited discussion.

The Gaza issue and our relationship with Isreal is a sticky situation. Even in stable economic times it would be difficult and even dangerous to divest ourselves from it… not that any of the mideast nations would ever believe it considering our long history of support. We cannot abandon them. They may be powerful, but in context of the religious ideologies (mythologies) that pit the Jews and Islam against one another as mortal enemies, Isreal would not last long. You have to understand that the Koran is interpreted to say specifically that Allah wants them to be exterminated.

The Islamic fumdamentalism that permeats every society in the mideast is like stepping into the 14th century. Moderate Islam does not officially encourage barbaric acts of violence, but they do not condemn them either. To do so is to question the will of Allah. And that is a crime punishable by death. They simply ignore passages to which the fundamentalists adhere. It’s much like moderate Christians ignoring much of Leviticus and Deuteronomy wherein God calls for blashpemers, adulterers and homosexuals be put to death.

Report this

By Bertil, February 26, 2009 at 1:57 pm Link to this comment

Folktruther,
I think your wife hit upon something more basic than what we are talking about here.  Ed Demmings realized that the more you pay attention to the workers, the more they produce and the more involved they are.  They become part of the process.
I couldn’t watch Obama on tv.  I had enough.
I am so sick of being lied to that I find more honesty in doubting everyting I hear and looking at everything I see on tv with a fish eye, even on DemocracyNOW!

Report this

By Folktruther, February 26, 2009 at 1:35 pm Link to this comment

YOu know, Bertil, I don’t understand it either.  Why are Americans fooled so easily?  You suggested that the hype is based on sitcoms, and it may be that the underlying preconceptions of hhe Entertainment industry presupposes Americans to identify with authority.

My wife once took a political science class-mostly bullshit as they usually are- but the only thing she remembers is that everytime a president did something, even something wrong, his approval went up in the polls.  This happened after the Bay of Pigs, and Kennedy said to his staff, “the worse I do, the better they like me.”

A poll of Obama’s speech stated that 64% were strongly impressed, another 24% were moderately impressed, and only 8% opposed it.  I don’t watch TV but I was appalled when I read it.  TV may influence people in some way print doesn’t; at least that is the view of Al Gore in THE ASSAULT ON REASON.

Report this

By Bertil, February 26, 2009 at 12:24 pm Link to this comment

I used to wonder: what if the conservatives were right: that small government and free market economy holding sway would bring the American Dream into fruition?
Well, we found out. 
There is something missing in their arguments. Seriously missing. Their old idea of a liberal press is easily dismissable, Pshaw!
The facts of the situation remain:  High unemployment, rising local fees, and a general uneasiness in the populace. It all leads to the realization that these elected cronies are not leftist at all, but simply manipulators of the current noise.
Why can’t we filter out a real Democrat and elect him ot her.  Why are we being fooled again and again by these ersatz Democrats.
After all, it’s pretty simple.  FDR did it 70 years ago.  Economics has not changed. A decent wage paying job is the key.
In retrospect, maybe this is all foolishness,  and we are be used, laughed at, and forgtotten.  Until the next generation, the next laugh.
Gof bless you all.

Report this

By Bertil, February 26, 2009 at 11:35 am Link to this comment

In continuing listening to Thom Hartmann show, I have to remark that” what is the government going to to do when Bin Laden gets old and it becomes all to noticeable that this character can’t be a threat anymore. 
I swear that all this hype is based on sitcoms.  The problem becomes what to do when a Beaver or a Wally, or whenever the child hood star becomes too old to sell as a child or as a terrorist.
I am not afraid.
If your life, your worldview, relies on information you get from any politicians or some corporate news organization, maybe it isn’t worth that much after all.
I say listen.

Report this

By Bertil, February 26, 2009 at 11:19 am Link to this comment

Obama is neo BSA, Bull Shit Artist.

I say watch!

I am listening to Thom Hartmann at the CPAC and he is interviewing a young ultra right wing representative of what brainwashing can do.

He said the US is not for helping Americans; it’s for protecting people.

I say the U.S. IS the people, and that is the point the founders made.

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, February 26, 2009 at 11:07 am Link to this comment

Folktruther,

Thanks for the response.

Report this

By Freya, February 26, 2009 at 10:49 am Link to this comment

I liked Obama’s speech, I thought that it addressed what it needed to and lay forward priorities and morals, which is the first step towards solutions.  I feel really inspired about is when he talks about energy and infrastructure. There’s a superb podcast as part of the Thinking Big conference/book release, called “Green Jobs and America’s Role in the World” with guests Jim Harkness and Jason Walsh from Institute for Agriculture and Trade Policy and Green For All, respectively.

Report this

By Folktruther, February 26, 2009 at 10:40 am Link to this comment

continued from below

3. the bailout swindle.  It is quite true JFoster that I am not a financial wizard or a wizard of any kind.  But you don’t have to be a fucking wizard to know when you are being ripped off.  And Obama, like Bush, is looting the tax payers money to give it to the banksters.

If Obama wanted to create jobs like Roosevelt, than he would give the money to the states and localities to hire teachers aides, medical aides, park workers, construction crews, etc.  But low paid workers don’t contribute the nearly trillion dollars necessary to run election campaingns.  Bankers and financial wizards do. And they control both poltiical parties.  So Obama, like Bush, funds the rich instead of nationalizing the banks and funding workers dierectly.  You don’t have to be a wizard to understand why.

4.  Leefeller wants to know what ethnic cleansing is.  Israel was established as a state 1n 1948 partially by terrorizing and killing nearly a million Palestinians to leave their homes, which were destroyed and replaced with homes for the Jewish population.  This continued after the 1967 war when Israel began destroying Palestinian homes, by bulldozer and blowing them up, sometimes with the people still inside of the them, to pur up Jewish settlements funded by the US. 

All the major Israeli parties supported removing Palestinians, often by killing them, and replacing them with Jewish settlers.  Last year the number of Jewish settlers increased by 67%.  This could only be done by patitioning up the Palestinians is separated Bantustans, as apratheid South Africa did, and destroying the Palestinian economy.

In Gaza, under Sharon, the Jewish settlers were removed and Gaza blockaded on all sides to turn it into a giant concetration camp holding about a million and a half Palestinians formerly displaced from their original homes.  There is currently a starvation blockade by Israel to prevent food and medicines from reaching the Gazan people.

It is a great progressive change to have an African- American as president, considering the racist past and present of the US.  But Obama has been put in power not to change Bushite policies, but to rehabilitate them.  Zionists obviously support this as do the unthinking and unreflective public who only see the superfical appearance of Hope n Change.  But Bushite policies are continuing, is some case worse than under Bush.  One has to look under the surface to see it, and this requires accepting distastful truths that many American progressives don’t want to know.

Report this

By Bertil, February 26, 2009 at 10:19 am Link to this comment

I know Folktruther (FT) doesn’t need it, but I feel obliged to come to his support.
FT represents a real threat.  On previous threads, he divulged that he is a Jew and, therefore, the usual first line of attack that he’s an anti-semite cannot be leveled against him.
As far as Israel being the only friend to US in the middle east, I find worrisome.  With friends like that who needs enemies.
While Bush was backing his attack on Iraq by saying that by setting up a democracy in Iraq he will guarantee the safety of the U.S because democracies do not attack democracies.  Then Israel bombed the hell out of Lebanon, which had in their recent history had an election.  They bombed it because it was a thriving democracy—the jewel of the Mediterranian—it just not the outcome that the U.S wanted.
Now, we have everyone turning their his to look the other way while war crimes are being committed to disestablish the Palestinins, and all Arabs for that matter.
Oy!

Report this

By Folktruther, February 26, 2009 at 10:14 am Link to this comment

Leefeller, JFoster—Thank you for your posts.  I can’t understand what people are thinking unless they are irritated enough to express themselves or ask questions.  I will just briefly discuss four issues that Obama espouses which continues Bushite policies:  social security, torture, the bailhout swindle, and Israeli ethnic cleansing.

1.  social security:  JFoster says that Obama is not trying to GUT social security but REFORM it.  Actually it was Bush that attempted to Reform it, convering it to private stock accounts that would have collapsed with the stock market.

Obama wants to STREMGHTEN it, by cutting benefits and converting it to private accounts.  Many progressive economists have stated that social security is financially strong and could exist without changes untill the 2040’s.  But the US has taxed workers to create a SURPLUS in the trust fund and looted it for other purposes, primarily military.  REFORMING or STRENGTHENING social security means operatively not paying the money in the trust fund back.  What reducing Entitlements means is not paying the American people what they are owed.

This was done more subtly under the Clintion adminstration was reducing the inflation index to exclude food, so that social security, indexed to inflation, who have to pay out less benefits.  That is the attempt of both Bush and Obama, to set up private accounts to avoid paying back money owed on social security.  If you don’t like the term ‘gut’ you are welcome to make up your own.  As long as it is not as deceptive as Bush’s or Obama’s.

2.Torture: both Bush and Obama, when Bush was in office, have said that the US does not turture.  They were both lying through their teeth, most obviously since Gitmo was in plain view.  Obama says he is going to close Gitmo.  Eventaully.  He now says that he can say without equivication the the US does not torture.  So, since he has said it right their on TV, I must be delusianl according to JFoster to say that the US continues to torture under Obama.

No.  Obama is still lying through his teeth.  The US has prisons and prison ships around the world, and control client- regimes that DO TORTURE. Whether it is actaully US personel or client personal that perform the actual procedures is quite irrelevant to the people being tortured.  TORTURE IS STILL US POLICY UNDER OBAMA, as part of rendition if nothing else.  It is still US policy even though Obama is smarter than Bush, and smiles nicer. 

It has to be becuase the War on Terrorism is being continued by Obamaa against populations and torture, as his chief intelligence adviser, John Brennon has stated, is a vital tool in this War.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, February 26, 2009 at 9:49 am Link to this comment

Leefeller, February 26 at 1:23 pm #

Folktruther,

JFoster2k touched on many of your comments, but I will focus and ask you to focus and maybe expand on this, define ethnic cleansing please and explain how Israeli is preforming ethnic cleansing, after many posts on other threads I still do not understand.
***********************************************

Because FolkTruther is a talented mind-reader and mentalist and knows what people are thinking, even if BOTH their words AND actions prove he’s just makin’ it up because it suits him.

See, FT is so caught in cognitive dissonance that he cannot, simply cannot accept anything that Obama says or does isn’t part of an international, particularly ZIONIST international conspiracy.  In this delusional state he “knows” what I’m thinking and what I really mean—even when I KNOW it’s exactly opposite. 

This is why he constantly says I’m a racist and in favor of ethnic cleansing and that it’s some sort of false flag when I say the truth: I want a negotiated 2-state solution.  It’s like something out of a “The Far Side” cartoon.

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, February 26, 2009 at 9:23 am Link to this comment

Folktruther,

JFoster2k touched on many of your comments, but I will focus and ask you to focus and maybe expand on this, define ethnic cleansing please and explain how Israeli is preforming ethnic cleansing, after many posts on other threads I still do not understand.

Report this

By JFoster2k, February 26, 2009 at 8:20 am Link to this comment

Folktruther,

I may have “drunk the coolaide” as the neocons are want to say, but the problem here is that you are spouting misguided or manufactured talking points:

“I am against war and he is not only continuing Bush’s wars but escalating them dangerously.”

Just like the economy, Obama inherited the mess in the middle east. He has made exit from Iraq a priority and, while his timeline for withdrawl may have adjusted a few months, the goal is the same. Do I like leaving a residual “non-combat” force of 50,000 troops there for several more years? Hell no, but that is not written in stone. If the Iraqis can handle things we won’t have to stay. That much is simple.

“I am against Israeli ethnic cleansing and he tacitly supported the Gaza war.”

Foreign Policy is a delicate matter… especially in the mideast. Thumbing our nose at our strongest ally in the region while we are engaged in 2 wars, looking at the potential of a nuclear Iran and dealing with an epic economic crisis would not be a wise course. Obama must focus most of his attention on our economic situation at home right now, so not rocking that boat is prudent. We need to be a little patient in that regard.

“I am against giving hundreds of billions of dollars to bankers on the false grounds that this will save the economy.”

We agree on that point. However, I am not a financial wizard and would hazard a guess that neither are you. Everyone seems to be against this, but no one seems to have a real alternative solution. This one just makes me sick.

“I am against torture and OBama is for it while saying the US doesn’t torture.”

On this point you are either delusional or living in denial. Did you sleep through Obama’s first day in office when his first executive order was to close Gitmo within a year? Are you so cynical that you simply refuse to believe anything our president says?
If words and deeds do not convince you, what would?

“I am against militarizing and corporatising the schools, which Obama’s Education minister Duncan believes in and is doing.”

Wait… What? “Militarizing” our schools? That’s a new one.

“I am against gutting social security which Obama says is necessary.”

I must have missed the speach where Omaba said, “gutting social security is necessary”. I’ve heard the word “reform”, which, in my dictionary, is not a synonym for “gut”.

Look, you are jaded and skeptical. I get that. Hell, to a large degree I share it. But I take great offense to your “throw the baby out with the bathwater” approach. Moreover, your deliberate distortion of his torture position is pure “Hannity”.

But the biggest issue I have with your position is the comparison of one of the smartest, forward thinking presidents in a generation with a retarded warmonger like GWB. Would Bush have ever pushed to wean us off of oil? Would Bush have championed legislation to lay broadband lines? Hell, Bush likely doesn’t even know what broadband is. Would Bush be willing to let the tax cuts for the top 2 percent expire? Would Bush have driven the effort to computerize medical records? The list goes on.

There is a lot to do and not a lot of time to do it. I, for one, am willing to give Obama some latitude on foreign affairs. If, by mid 2010, demonstrable progress has not been made regarding Gitmo, Iraq, Afghanistan, Gaza, etc., I’ll be the first to call foul, but the issues at home and the worldwide economic situation must be first priority.

Report this

By Bertil, February 26, 2009 at 6:50 am Link to this comment

On DemocracyNow! this morning, it was reported that Panetta testified that the administration retains the right to extraordinary rendition.  Yesterday, an army general said the 50,000 soldiers will remain in Iraq.
In Pakistan, drone attacks will conitnue, killing mainly civilians.
How long before the progressives wake up to this bait and switch ploy?  Obama makes noises like he’s a progressive, the turns around and puts on his Bush Thinking Cap.
Bush handed Obama all these powers to future administrations and Obama is reluctant to let them go.  As long as he heaps praise on Stevie Wonder and such, the raving progressives will continue to blindly support him.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, February 26, 2009 at 4:54 am Link to this comment

Hey! If nobody is listening I can say anything I damn please!

Like:

Rush Limbaugh wanted to be a closet homosexual but the Gay community disowned him.

Ann Coulter really IS a man.

Dennis Kucinich really IS a dwarf.  He’s just really good a walking around on stilts.

FolkTruther was the kid who always struck out at softball.

Cyrena’s really Toni Morrison moonlighting.

Robert’s real name is Hamid.

Fadel DOES wear a skirt.

99% of Democrats, 99.8% of Republicans and 97% of Independents think Ralph Nader is a butthead.

Wow! This is fun! I can make this $#it up just as well as FolkTruther can! 

Except I’m telling you I made up all this stuff and if ANY of it is factual, it’s by pure dumb luck.

Colonel Flagg: “There’s only one thing wrong with your scenario.”
Hawkeye (astonished): “Only one?”

Report this

By M.B.S.S., February 26, 2009 at 12:30 am Link to this comment

obama is relatively liberal in the context of the narrow band of ideologies that makes up the senate.  in this context he is markedly different than george w. bush.

also, because obama is black he is markedly different from george w. bush.

in that obama presents the appearance of incorporating different viewpoints he is the complete opposite of g.w.b.

that is all well and good

unfortunately on many of the fundamental issues engaging us today he is no different then our last president.

i guess im obligated to list:

war machine
neoliberal economic philosophy (Von Hayek is from chicago academia also)
israel
FISA
civil liberties
corporate/congressional collusion

and so on and so on.  so it never helps us to take our eyes off the larger picture.  is obama a breath of fresh air in contrast to bush jr, a president in which one hadnt the slightest hope of receiving an open ear? of course.  is it nice to have some movement in the right direction? of course.  are the democrats closer to where i am than the conservatives?  yes, but i feel they are much more insidious and dangerous because they will co-opt the progressive/green/independent message but never deliver.  also economically they are just as bad or even worse the the other side of the aisle.  and to me that is the key issue.  follow the money, follow the money.  and remember, obama raised a ton of money, from grass root democrats and from some extremely powerful entrenched forces.  hes their boy, not yours or mine.  remember that.

is it possible that obama may try to make a real move to enact fundamental change eventually?  maybe.  i will hold out some hope from him, but the outlook is below grim.  am i willing to support him when he comes to some more reasonable conclusions with regard to war and economics and a whole host of issues?  yes. 

is there anything wrong with incrementalism?
im not sure, but im not on this earth to wait around for people to figure out what is right;  im here to make it happen now.

Report this
Outraged's avatar

By Outraged, February 26, 2009 at 12:02 am Link to this comment

Re: Folktruther

I’m gauging you haven’t given MY premise any merit.  AGAIN….

My earlier comment: “I’m talking about ITW and Folktruther.  I agree with both of you, and yet I disagree with both of you.  To slur each other regarding the other’s position for ideological reasons, rather than for factual ones…. negates any of the legitimate points you actually DO HAVE.

Suddenly…. no one is listening to EITHER of you, because YOU BOTH are being stupid.  There!... if you have a problem with my comment, don’t come to me…go ask your mother.  Have her read these posts, and then…. straighten your act up…! (why…do I know what she say is going to say to the both of you…?, oh… just a “guess”, it’s not like I don’t have six children and have heard this BS a MILLION TIMES!).

Report this
Outraged's avatar

By Outraged, February 25, 2009 at 11:49 pm Link to this comment

Re: rollzone

Your comment: “illegal immigrant workers getting loans are supposed to in some way help?”

personally… this is the comment, that threw up the red flag for me… however, your other comment,

“i do not truly believe that this man has ever done an honest day of work in his life, if he thinks the American dream depends on getting loans. you have to earn a penny before it would ever occur to you to save it. the average person finance a business- what a hoot! howbout autographing my butt?

In regards to “autographing” your butt… I’ll do you one better, I’ll ENGRAVE the SOB….are we “good” now?

Report this

By Folktruther, February 25, 2009 at 11:42 pm Link to this comment

Don’t you get it?  I am against Obama, but not because I am ignrant, racist, stupid, Republican or whatever.  I AM AGAINST HIS POLICIES.

I am against war and he is not only continuing Bush’s wars but escalating them dangerously.

I am against Israeli ethnic cleansing and he tacitly supported the Gaza war.

I am against giving hundreds of billions of dollars to bankers on the false grounds that this will save the economy.

I am against torture and OBama is for it while saying the US doesn’t torture.

I am against militarizing and corporatising the schools, which Obama’s Education minister Duncan believes in and is doing.

I am against gutting social security which Obama says is necessary.

What is difficult to understand about that? 

OUTRAGED, I thought you were for Nader because the major parties sold out the population.  Have you turned your criticism in for pompoms?  Are you a fan now, rooting for him, and anyone who criticizes him is on the other team?

Listen.  WE ARE NOT ALL ON THE SAME TEAM.  I am not on the team that supports war, torture, cutting social security, etc no matter how many nice words they say about not being for it.  I am morally and ideologically against it.  If you don’t possess strong moral and ideologial values about policy, and support whoever looks and sounds nice on TV, then we are not on the same team.  If you can be politically seduced so easily, you are useless for any significant political change.  And most people can and most people are.

But there are some who can’t, including some truthdiggers.  The question I am obsessed with is how to increase the number and power of these people.

Report this

By Shift, February 25, 2009 at 10:32 pm Link to this comment

We have a cat in the white house being advised by three blind mice.  This doesn’t bode well for cathood.

Report this

By rollzone, February 25, 2009 at 10:24 pm Link to this comment

hello.  i no longer have my ear to the pulse of this great nation, so i cannot comment on what everyone else’s situation may be. i can only say that this is this first time in my middle-aged lifetime that i have ever turned down the volume, when the president of these wonderful United States speaks. i was appalled, at the end of this presentation; that he signed autographs alike a celebrity. i found the eloquence of the speechwriting to be very noble and heroic; and read not a word of believability into it. is this the change: that now that the president is spending more time in bed with the oil industry lobyists, that he is spending less and less time there with his wife? there is no honest math for the economic solutions; that amount to only the rebuilding of a house of cards: government foremost should stay out of economics. illegal immigrant workers getting loans are supposed to in some way help? could the burning of fossil fuels be the leading cause of cancer in the world? can not multiple bids on government contracts still result in astronomical waste? is not the growth of more government the root of our national deficit? i do not truly believe that this man has ever done an honest day of work in his life, if he thinks the American dream depends on getting loans. you have to earn a penny before it would ever occur to you to save it. the average person finance a business- what a hoot! howbout autographing my butt?

Report this

By altlic, February 25, 2009 at 10:14 pm Link to this comment

Folktruther,

I was being deliberately childish, just for the hell of it, because you sound so outraged and all.  Also, I take back the martyrdom thing, that was mean.

I also can feel outraged, although I don’t cross the line into conspiracy-land like 911 truthers, and others that believe in a cadre of Dr. Evils.

If I let myself be skeptical, I’d say this whole world is beyond redemption and will continue to disintegrate, simply because things go in cycles and it’s seems we are at the end of ours. How bad it gets is anybody’s guess. Ah, life can be so cruel to our cherished expectations.

So what am I trying to sell here? Basically that this is as good as it gets. If you don’t find any redeeming qualities in BO, if you don’t think things can move forward, then they probably won’t, because there’s millions of others who agree with you, just for different reasons.

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, February 25, 2009 at 9:29 pm Link to this comment

Outraged,

You are right, I was addressing the tone, it rang a bell and seemed so similar to closed minded bigotry, so yes your perception was correct, though at the time it was subconsciously placed.

You all burn in hell mentality crowd,  is not going to work,  people are more aware of what is happening to them now then anytime I can remember. 

Diversions sponsored by the self proclaimed righteous or just plain old right wings will not stop the momentum of the peoples mood.

Though I do not agree with everything Obama has done or will do, I will support him until I cannot, only if he forgets the people.

Report this
Outraged's avatar

By Outraged, February 25, 2009 at 9:08 pm Link to this comment

Re: Lefeller

Your comment: “Distaste for Obama seemingly so bitter almost seems bigoted,  saying he lies and promotes nothing but lies, and hoping he crashes big time so we can have what?”

I agree.  Although I wouldn’t say bigoted (and maybe you meant it this way also) in the racist sense, but bigoted in an ideological sense.

To everyone else: I agree and disagree with many, but I also see many “arguments” simply based on an ideological premise and not a factual one.

Well, yep… I’m talking about ITW and Folktruther.  I agree with both of you, and yet I disagree with both of you.  To slur each other regarding the other’s position for ideological reasons, rather than for factual ones…. negates any of the legitimate points you actually DO HAVE.

Suddenly…. no one is listening to EITHER of you, because YOU BOTH are being stupid.  There!... if you have a problem with my comment, don’t come to me…go ask your mother.  Have her read these posts, and then…. straighten your act up…! (why…do I know what she say is going to say to the both of you…?, oh… just a “guess”, it’s not like I don’t have six children and have heard this BS a MILLION TIMES!).

Now, regardless of our PERSONAL AGENDA’s, PurpleGirl is right:

Heads Up folks we have no time, nor the Luxury, to screw around with pet ideologies- Not from the Right and Not from the Left. those 4 decades are gone and now we have to FOCUS on pulling our Asses out of the fire anyway we can ,and it is gonna take all of US working together.”

Listen…., if the house is on fire and my kids were sitting around arguing the merits of city water or well water, they’d be so…so… sorry, and I’d make sure of that.

(yes, I know you quoted PurpleGirl too…ITW, but you turned around and did the, “do as I say, not as I do” deal)

Report this

By Folktruther, February 25, 2009 at 7:35 pm Link to this comment

altlic- I don’t really care about the childish drivel you exude but what really bothers me is that you can’t seem to distinguish between the personalities in office and the policies that they pursue.  Obama may be a nicer man that Bush- I think he is—but he is pursuing the same policies as Bush with marginal changes and a different rhetoric.

And this appears to be a fundamental defect of the American people, endosing political leaders because they like them rahter than appraising their policies like the powerful do and hold their feet to the fire when they deviate.  The mush in your head appears to be the same mush in a large fraction of Americans.
And I don’t know how to get it out.  But there will be no positive political change unless we do. 

sooner or later a Bush or Obama will gut social security and medicare and further drive the people into the ground.  While looking good on TV and speaking gloriously.

Report this

By Bertil, February 25, 2009 at 4:28 pm Link to this comment

Someone on another thread asked who Geithner reminds them of.  After watching him on PBS tonight, he looks like Eddie Haskell and sounds like Professor Irwin Corey.

Report this

By altlic, February 25, 2009 at 4:27 pm Link to this comment

This is Folktruther -

jabber, jabber, jabber
whine, whine, whine
he sounds like a fundamentalist
which he is
hmm, let’s see, what do we know about fundamentalists?
they are sooo sure they are correct
and in this lily-white world
where America has lily-white hands
it will be heaven on earth

small steps, Folktruther,
evolution happens in small steps
try being grateful for something
(hey I’m grateful for the information that you put out)
or else martyrdom is always an option

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, February 25, 2009 at 4:15 pm Link to this comment

Distaste for Obama seemingly so bitter almost seems bigoted,  saying he lies and promotes nothing but lies, and hoping he crashes big time so we can have what?

Asking for something like this is quite demented. Should we prefer more Bush lies or lies of a different type only the hoarders of truth know?  How about the Bush crash not bad enough?  We are supposed to believe the bitter chicken little song and dance routine offers the answer? 

I have not seen any options,  please feel free to enlighten the lemmings, Obmaites or any other name preferred used and promoted by such enlightend commenters, we accept with open arms any great ideas, since we now know we are lemmings heading off a cliff.  Such enlightenment requires acceptance.

Report this

By Bertil, February 25, 2009 at 4:00 pm Link to this comment

Then again, some people are born to follow.  Some also act like lemmings.
When one has seen enough, then enough is enough.  Anyone can follow this foreflusher as long and as far as he or she wants.  I am already hoping for a one-term disaster, rather than eight years of this mish-mash, old boys network.

Report this

By Folktruther, February 25, 2009 at 3:53 pm Link to this comment

Obama is continuing the Bushite wars, neoliberal policies, and human rights violations of arbitrary imprisonment and torture, continuing the assault on social security begun by Bush, AND SAYS SO, but he really looks good on TV and talks real nice.  And this sesms to soothe people for a while.

Excuse me.  like Bush he does say the US doesn’t torture, but,like Bush,  he is lying, just as Bush was.

As Eric Prentis indicated, if the captain of the Titanic said that he expected things to turn around later in the year, and articulated it real nice, amazingly many of the passangers would agree. IF they were like some truthdiggers, they would agree vehmently.  I suppose reason and evidence must take a back seat when people feel they have no other way out.

Report this

By altlic, February 25, 2009 at 3:25 pm Link to this comment

Okay, there’s the ideologues (Obama is a traitor to the revolutionary cause) and then there’s the populists (it’s all the elite’s fault).

Re: the populists: Democracy is a complicated thing that tries to fold noble ideas (1 person 1 vote) into practical solutions (government).

Human beings, and nature as a whole, have this tendency to get “long in tooth and claw” in a lot of creative ways.

One accepted premise of democracy is that you can’t just let the unwashed masses (the mob) take too much control out of the hands of the aristocracy (the supposedly educated and wise) or vice versa. Both factions are basically untrustworthy.

In other words it’s… complicated. If you want to complain about Obama, go right ahead and join the chorus. If you want to see something get done in this country, you could do worse than get behind the Obama agenda in a way that you feel good about.

Report this

By Bertil, February 25, 2009 at 2:48 pm Link to this comment

” The economy is doing fine, but the people aren’t.”—General Emelio Medici, head-of-state of Brazil, 1971

Report this

By Mercy Me, February 25, 2009 at 2:20 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

“As soon as I took office, I asked this Congress to send me a recovery plan by President’s Day that would put people back to work and put money in their pockets.”

Stop spending $350,000,000 a day in Iraq and on all the other futile misadventures—CREATE FEDERAL JOBS!  People need work—they need to be employed—stop all the obstructionist crap and get the ball rolling.

Report this

By mmadden, February 25, 2009 at 1:47 pm Link to this comment

newrddb wrote “We all want it to work, him to be correct. Part of his job is to articulate a moral vision for the future.  He excels at that.  But I do not trust those with whom he surrounds himself; I do not like that he avoids pointing the finger where it belongs. And I cannot imagine getting over the fact that he, like so many of his predecessors will continue/will escalate an illegal war.”

The Afghan war is not illegal. This is the country that Al Qaeda attacked us from. The Taliban refused to turn Osama bin Laden over so we went in. The Iraqi war is illegal. We should never have gone to Iraq.

Report this

By Bertil, February 25, 2009 at 1:41 pm Link to this comment

Why is it that when things go well, they pat each other on the back, but when the country goes into deep shit, it’s our fault?  The “we” is rolled out.  We have to go through a tough period.  We have to work harder.  Why don’t they work harder?  Why don’t they say, Americans deserve a friggin’  break?  Not the ones like the $13 bucks a week on tax breaks for those who are working, but a serious good turn.  Duck Durbin of IL said that they were going to give the taxpayers a $500 break, but to assuage the Republicans, they lowered it to $400.  And he said that on television.  I’d like to see him crawl up to the podium and aplogize for that like he had to do when he called out the Republicans for acting like Nazis.
I could tell that Joe Biden, watching from the background, was so impressed by how clean cut and well spoken Obama is that he wanted to reach out and rub his little head.
Obama doesn’t know shit about governing, just like Bush.  He’s taking his directions from someone else.

Report this

By Big Wes, February 25, 2009 at 1:36 pm Link to this comment

When did Obama start advocating private investment accounts?  Was he rummaging through his desk in the Oval Office and find some of W’s old doodles and think “What the heck, we’ve tried everything else.”  Of course, Obama reaped a huge amount of contributions from Wall Street and the finance industry (as do most politicians), so he’s beholden to them.  What better way to covertly capitalize Wall Street than to create accounts funded with taxpayer contributions what will be managed by the same fat cats that ruined our economy?  They can use our money interest free to invest in their bloated corporate greed machines—thus replacing the money withdrawn from the market by speculators—and charge the government a nice administrative fee to boot for “managing” these funds.  Thanks but no thanks.

I had, and still have, hope for the Obama administration.  But just like every other administration I remember, they’ll most likely talk a good game, but keep playing the same old way.  Business as usual will not save our nation (if it can even be saved); it will only accelerate the decline.

Report this

By marta kaye, February 25, 2009 at 1:28 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

President Obama is a good messenger, and promises a good tomorrow, but what is lurking in the shadows may be an up coming War, against Iran, by Israel, Britain, United States, and perhaps, Canada, France, or others who can be drug into it. Like the Iraqi war. Israel wants the land, and the others the oil beneth.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, February 25, 2009 at 1:13 pm Link to this comment

By JFoster2k, February 25 at 11:26 am #

Folktruther, you are demented.
******************************************

But as predictable as Old Faithful or the next 10 solar and lunar eclipses!  He IS consistent! (consistently wrong that is.)

*******************************************
How you can possibly compare Obama to Bush is not just absurd, it is downright stupid.
********************************************

Didn’t I call it?
PurpleGirl: “No doubt the ignorant will cling to their ideology which have not come to fruition and continue to bitch. That means both the stubborn Right and the Stobborn Left.”

ITW (Me): “No doubt. I can hear FolkTruther et al saying this is Bush III.”

********************************************
You apparently hear only the negative distortion of content as it filters through your own twisted ideology. I’d attempt to convince you otherwise, but there is no changing the minds of dogmatic anti-intellectuals. I’d pity you if you were not so venomous.
*********************************************

In his own way, FolkTruther is just like the Bobby Jindal/George W. Bush Republicans: Only one answer to address every problem. 

The Jindal/Bush answer? More tax cuts for the rich. 

FT’s answer? Nationalize all private property and all businesses, create a modern Marxist state, then blame Zionists for all the evil in the world.

Report this

By altlic, February 25, 2009 at 12:54 pm Link to this comment

Kudos to Inherit the Wind and Purple Girl.

We are living in the real world. Left wing ideologues (Folktruther) need to drop the outrage. Being POTUS is a highly compromised position from the outset. 1. You have to get yourself elected. 2. You are standing on top of history and the hand that is dealt you. 3. You have to wield your limited power shrewdly.

Obama is the best we can hope for. The rest is up to us. If millions of people protest war around the world, Obama is not going to give you the finger like Dubya. If progressive Americans stand up, get organized and support Obama’s bold plans for health care, energy and education, then we get the ball rolling in the right direction.

But I think it is going to take real effort. We should be finding ways other than opinion polls to back him up. We should be doing a lot at the community level. We should be coming together. The danger is to sit back and think Obama is either a savior, or that he is just another Bush.

Report this

By JFoster2k, February 25, 2009 at 12:26 pm Link to this comment

Folktruther, you are demented.

How you can possibly compare Obama to Bush is not just absurd, it is downright stupid.

You apparently hear only the negative distortion of content as it filters through your own twisted ideology. I’d attempt to convince you otherwise, but there is no changing the minds of dogmatic anti-intellectuals. I’d pity you if you were not so venomous.

Report this

By Amon Drool, February 25, 2009 at 12:13 pm Link to this comment

eric l. prentis…..GREAT POST!!  voltaire is smiling down at u.

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, February 25, 2009 at 12:12 pm Link to this comment

Folktruther,

Interesting perspective, keeping up your objectivity in such a positive way must be overwhelming.

Hope you are wrong on all accounts, but the war hawkish approach, has always bothered me from the inception. I only hope he is carrying a big stick in one hand and olive branch in the other, is the impression he made to me.

Report this

By JFoster2k, February 25, 2009 at 11:43 am Link to this comment

President Obama’s address to the joint congress was nothing short of masterful. It was often sobering yet simultaneously encouraging and inspiring. He did not avoid unpleasant truths about our economy and lack of responsibility, yet he couched it with optimism and the promise of opportunity. Like most Americans, I was very impressed.

Governor Jindal’s response, on the other hand, was as predictably obstructionist as we have come to expect from the republican party. In face of undeniable economic catastrophy and overwhelming populist demand for action, he and his far rightwing comrades persist with the ridiculous stance of admitting they “lost their way” for the last decade, but that we should somehow just dismiss their lies and lack of substantive solutions and support them rather than the men and women we elected to replace them. 

The idea of “post-partisanship” is absurd. My hope is for “non-partisanship” by voting the rest of those obstructionist neocon grandstanders out of office.

Report this

By Folktruther, February 25, 2009 at 11:28 am Link to this comment

Obama’s speech was horrifying.  Apparently Americans want to be deluded by Obama’s rhetoric and do not want to understand the subtext of what he is saying.  What he is saying is that he is going to continue Bushite polices: more war, more neoliberalism, more poverty, more hopelessness which he calls Hope.

He is going to try to gut social security, as Bush tried,  and set up private accounts, and not pay back the enormous amount stolen from the truxt fund and used for other purposes, notably military.  In rhetoric this is no longer Reforming it, as Bush called it, but Strengthening it.  In reality, according to non-right wing economists, it is sound through 2041.  But, like the Strengthening of Medicare, is part of turning the US into a third world country.

He is going to continue giving money to the bankers instead of nationalizing the banks and funding investment.

He is going to continue the wars, and the War on Terrorism, not allowing the Terrorists a half a world away to Plot against the American people.  He will continue bombing the Plotters, their families, and anyone else around who defies Freedom and Democracy, i.e. US imperialism.  To assure progress toward Permanent Peace for Israel, he has send an envoy.

He is going to continue torture around the world while saying, like Bush, the United States of America does not torture. Eventaully abolishing Gitmo to use the prison ships and Gitmos around the world to continue to abduct “illegal combatants”, to be tortured by US client-states.

What is horrifying is that Americans are impressed by this rhetoric, which is articulated in an intelligent and sophisticated way.  It is understandable that the Zionists and bankers would support it, but he is trying, and succeeding, in getting Dem Progressives to support Bushite policies.  Because he looks good on TV, sounds good, and disguises what he says with effective rhetoric.

He is getting people to identify with their own oppression and the oppression of other people.  Just as Bush did with the dupes on the right.  This is not a matter of intellectual ignorance, but emotional denial.  People simply don’t want to understand that the American power structure is bent on driving the American people into the ground.  And this MUST be understand before the America people can organize against it.

Report this

By Apprentice, February 25, 2009 at 11:20 am Link to this comment

We The People elect politicians
who bailout the banks
who donate to politicians
and lend to We The People at huge rates
so that we can keep on living
to keep on working
to keep on bailing
and keep on electing.

Let’s keep “We The People” and eliminate the other two.

Report this
Eric L. Prentis's avatar

By Eric L. Prentis, February 25, 2009 at 10:55 am Link to this comment

If Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke were captain of the RMS Titanic on that fateful April night he would have made the following announcement to the 2,200 frightened passengers and crew, “I contacted vice chairman Tim Geithner who checked with his steering committee, comprised of Schumer/Dodd/Frank, and the best way to handle this crisis is to save the Wall Street bank passengers, first. In addition, all credit cards on file from other passengers have been debited $1,000 dollars because the bankers have catastrophic CDS gambling debts and have run up a huge CDO tab at the bar. In addition, payments for the naming rights to the Mets baseball stadium, a blowout convention in Las Vegas and a professional golf tournament in Florida, sponsored by bankers, require payment. Also, credit card money goes toward banker employment bonuses so that they can give out loans, only if they wish, when they are safely rescued.” Dr. L. Summers Pangloss, although an academic, boarded a lifeboat early by banker invitation, was asked to comment upon leaving and uttered, “All is for the best in the best of all possible worlds.” Captain Bernanke further declared that he expected the Titanic to turn up in the second half of the year and amazingly, the 1,500 doomed passengers and crew agreed.

Report this

By GB, February 25, 2009 at 9:40 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

FINALLY, after eight years of a president who could barely construct a correct sentence in basic english we get an excellent orator. The best playground bully Bush could do is make up nonsense words like Islamofacist to scare the public while Cheney was in the vault emptying out our treasury with no bid contracts from his former company and for oil companies. These funds ended up as billions of dollars in off shore accounts or simply lost to who knows where.
Obama mentioned rectifying the no bid Iraq contracts but Obama and Congress really need to also address the criminal aspect of the hyper corruption in the last eight years to help heal the future.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, February 25, 2009 at 9:00 am Link to this comment

I don’t usually cotton to your posts, Purple Girl, but this is pretty d*** good!

Purple Girl, February 25 at 6:46 am #

Heads Up folks we have no time, nor the Luxury, to screw around with pet ideologies- Not from the Right and Not from the Left. those 4 decades are gone and now we have to FOCUS on pulling our Asses out of the fire anyway we can ,and it is gonna take all of US working together.
***************************************************

In our cynical age this sounds pollyanna-ish, that refrain saved us in the 30’s.  I can hear the Almanac Singers on a scratchy ‘78 record: “..And we’ll all work together to deliver the goods.”

***************************************************
When a Black Democrat can pull my Fearfully Racist Repub mother over to his way of thinking- something I have not been able to do over the last few decades- This man has some extraordinary Talents or we are in such a shit hole, the opposition realizes it’s time to start listening to all options.
**************************************************

Both are true.  Your mother’s smart enough to realize: 1) It’s time to be scared 2) This may be the one man who can lead us out of it.

**************************************************
No doubt the ignorant will cling to their ideology which have not come to fruition and continue to bitch. That means both the stubborn Right and the Stobborn Left.
**************************************************

No doubt. I can hear FolkTruther et al saying this is Bush III.  And there’s Bobby Jindal’s pipe-dream speech last night for the Right.

***************************************************
But frankly the Majority of Americans have been rejecting/ignoring your fantazism,anyways.And considering the Dire situation we find ourselves in, you got an ice cube chance in hell we are going to waste time on your Pet peeves. Not all americnas are going to become ‘Born Again’, Nor are all Americans going to suddenly become Vegans. At best these were distraction, at worst they were counterprodcutive, cauing more revulsion than consensus.
***************************************************

Recent polls confirm that. Obama is more popular than ever.  For the first time I know how my dad felt about FDR.

***************************************************
We need all hands on deck, Grudges shoved back in their resentment boxes and everyone focused on ‘Heave Ho’.Do I want the main player prosecuted for their Crimes- absolutely. But I can let the small fish go as long as they start swimming our way- with the group.
****************************************************

A crime is a crime but…government and law isn’t a suicide pact. It’s a question of priorities.

****************************************************
Summers may be not only working to save his own ass, but on his own mortal redemption- I’m willing to give him that opportunity.Really mere Pawns in a Game being Played on Americans by those who have been tampering in Our politcal and industrial sectors for Decades- Give US Cheney & Rumslfeld!Many of these smaller fish have been playing their games in foreign countries- Let’s throw out like Raw meat for them to consume.“Revenge a dish Best Served Cold”.
****************************************************

I’m good with that!

****************************************************
This Pres is far smarter than the last one, in fact far smarter than most, perhaps it’s time we Lefties also sit down shut up and accept a lil’ schooling ourselves.
I’m a Kucinich prim voter, I am willing to concede this man is the smartest man in ANY room.

****************************************************

If not, he’ll do till the smartest guy/gal gets there!

I said, long ago, when there were a HUNDRED candidates running that the WORST Dem was a thousand times better than the BEST Re-thug.  It’s good to see other Dems see it that way as well.

Report this

By BobZ, February 25, 2009 at 8:58 am Link to this comment

I loved the speech and gave it an A+. No doubt President Obama is the best orator we have had in the White House since JFK.  I am looking forward to his taking on the military-industrial complex and reducing defense spending. Ike’s warnings have been unheeded for far too long. I am perplexed about his Social Security comments. Fixing Social Security is a no brainer - just make the deductions open ended and not capped as they are now. And as American’s live longer, the retirement age could be increased slightly. The real test will be Medicare and universal health care. If anybody is up to the task of taking on the health care industry and defense contractors it is our current prez. He will need our backing to make it happen though.

Report this

By Little Brother, February 25, 2009 at 8:36 am Link to this comment

I tried to simply comment:  talk is cheap.

But the comments software thinks that this simple phrase is either a duplicate post (it isn’t), or too common an expression to deserve posting; it refused to publish it!

As far as the latter point goes, WTF?  (Is “WTF” too common an expression to merit posting too?)

Very strange.  The one time I try to be brief, the cyber-nanny software tells me my fish is so common and tiny that I have to toss it back!

Report this

By 1twenty1, February 25, 2009 at 8:07 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Pie in the sky.

While, rightfully, being encouraging and hopeful, Obama’s plans which if are only half achieved will be a monumental achievement.

Too much to do in too little time with too little consensus.

It would take at least 16 years of solid Democratic control to achieve this starry-eyed agenda.

Report this
Purple Girl's avatar

By Purple Girl, February 25, 2009 at 7:46 am Link to this comment

Heads Up folks we have no time, nor the Luxury, to screw around with pet ideologies- Not from the Right and Not from the Left. those 4 decades are gone and now we have to FOCUS on pulling our Asses out of the fire anyway we can ,and it is gonna take all of US working together.
When a Black Democrat can pull my Fearfully Racist Repub mother over to his way of thinking- something I have not been able to do over the last few decades- This man has some extraordinary Talents or we are in such a shit hole, the opposition realizes it’s time to start listening to all options.
No doubt the ignorant will cling to their ideology which have not come to fruition and continue to bitch. That means both the stubborn Right and the Stobborn Left.But frankly the Majority of Americans have been rejecting/ignoring your fantazism,anyways.And considering the Dire situation we find ourselves in, you got an ice cube chance in hell we are going to waste time on your Pet peeves. Not all americnas are going to become ‘Born Again’, Nor are all Americans going to suddenly become Vegans. At best these were distraction, at worst they were counterprodcutive, cauing more revulsion than consensus.
We need all hands on deck, Grudges shoved back in their resentment boxes and everyone focused on ‘Heave Ho’.Do I want the main player prosecuted for their Crimes- absolutely. But I can let the small fish go as long as they start swimming our way- with the group.Summers may be not only working to save his own ass, but on his own mortal redemption- I’m willing to give him that opportunity.Really mere Pawns in a Game being Played on Americans by those who have been tampering in Our politcal and industrial sectors for Decades- Give US Cheney & Rumslfeld!Many of these smaller fish have been playing their games in foreign countries- Let’s throw out like Raw meat for them to consume.“Revenge a dish Best Served Cold”.
This Pres is far smarter than the last one, in fact far smarter than most, perhaps it’s time we Lefties also sit down shut up and accept a lil’ schooling ourselves.
I’m a Kucinich prim voter, I am willing to concede this man is the smartest man in ANY room.

Report this

By dihey, February 25, 2009 at 7:18 am Link to this comment

This was a pretty strong address.
The following questions must be answered soon.

1. Why is an expansion of our armed forces needed?
2. Is the end of 2011 withdrawal from Iraq absolutely firm?
3. What are the criteria for full withdrawal from the misbegotten Afghanistan adventure (are there any?).
4. What does “reform” of Social Security, Medicare, and Medicate mean? We’ve heard this before, among others from Mr. Bush.

Report this

By Jaded Prole, February 25, 2009 at 6:46 am Link to this comment

A nice speech but purposefully overoptimistic. His comments regarding Social Security reflect a Repug lite approach. Social Security could be made solvent through the next century for far less than he is using to bail out the banks yet he’s pushing “savings accounts”?!

As for us all committing to at least a year of further education, is he committing to pay for it? 

Will bombing and further destabilizing Pakistan achieve any desirable goal or is he pushing it into the hands of militant Islamists? Maybe if he spent that money on humanitarian efforts there we would undermine anti-Americanism and weaken support for Al-qaeda.

Report this

By Rajan, February 25, 2009 at 6:30 am Link to this comment

No amount of lofty speeches and rhetoric read from speeches choreographed by a squadron of speech-writers (including when to pause for the expected standing ovation from the audience) and scrolled on teleprompter will lift the country out of the financial abyss into which it has fallen unless the root causes of this on-going calamity are diagnosed.  But it appears that neither President Obama nor his army of advisors (who are, after all,  the same people who were sleeping at the switch when the roof was caving in over their heads) seem to have acquired any meaningful insight into the underlying problems facing the financial institutions. In the midst of all the hue and cry about the astronomical losses being reported quarter on quarter by leading banks to the point of their possible extinction in this country and also in the rest of the world, no one has come out so far with a clear, intelligible and cogent explanation for this catastrophic phenomenon, which a common man/woman on the street can easily grasp and understand. There is indeed a virtual Babel going on over the whole issue.  Is it not a bit strange that, in a country which boasts of having won a lion’s share of Nobel prizes for Economics, there is not a single “expert” who really knows what caused the downfall of the so-called titans in the financial world.  The Federal Reserve Chairman, Ben Bernanke keeps on changing his prognosis every time he appears before a Congress panel and indeed presents a pathetic picture of a fumbling and mumbling figure!  And, whenever the new Treasury Secretary, Tim Geithner opens his mouth, the Dow Stock Index takes a nose dive! The financial institutions seem to be all suffering from a strange virus infection. Unless the virus is isolated and identified,  no effective cure can be found and all the money that is poured into any stimulus plan will be just draining into a bottomless pit.  The admittedly abnormal trend in defaults in payments on sub-prime (and even prime) mortgages and the consequent foreclosures alone could not have been the sole cause of this infection. Some other vices the institutions have been surreptitiously indulging in might have also had a crucial role. Is it possible that the banks and other financial institutions had been lending money they did not have (driven by insensate greed of the bank executives to earn fat bonuses which depended on the volume of loans granted) in the Micawberish hope that something would turn up to set things right in the end as long as they maintained the false façade of adequate liquidity in the system and that it would be a remote chance that they would be caught with their pants down as it has happened now? This would be the banking equivalent of naked shorting in stock trading (in which you sell stocks which you don’t have in the hope of buying them back later at a cheaper price). Such a scam, if perfected,  would be a Mach 2 version of the ponzi schemes which Madoff and Stanford are accused of. Given the opaque and non-transparent nature of most of the transactions in the rarefied atmosphere of High Finance and the paranoiac secrecy with which the banks generally conduct their affairs and also given the callous and cavalier way in which the concerned regulatory authorities all over the world have been carrying out even their routine fiduciary responsibilities, anything would have been possible!

Report this

By newrddb, February 25, 2009 at 5:13 am Link to this comment

We all want it to work, him to be correct.
Part of his job is to articulate a moral vision for the future.  He excels at that.  But I do not trust those with whom he surrounds himself; I do not like that he avoids pointing the finger where it belongs.
And I cannot imagine getting over the fact that he, like so many of his predecessors will continue/will escalate an illegal war.

Report this

By Shift, February 25, 2009 at 3:49 am Link to this comment

Obama to the Nation:  We will spare no expense to bail out the banks with opacity and dispatch.

Report this

By AFriend, February 25, 2009 at 3:20 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I have a question: How would the president and Congress make plans to send American troops overseas and keep those plans a secret from our enemies by placing troop support contracts into an open - “for bid”- contract system?

Clearly the Congress and Pentagon set up the “no bid” system for a reason.

Report this

By George Vreeland Hill, February 25, 2009 at 2:28 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Thank God Bush is out of office or the economy would get worse and with no hope at all to recover.
The Republicans got us in this mess.
The Democrats will get us out of it.

George Vreeland Hill

Report this

By M.B.S.S., February 24, 2009 at 11:56 pm Link to this comment

bernanke tells the market that there will be no nationalizing of the banks and we a see a jump.

obama says we are going to need more money for the banks.

thats all i see.  with some nice icing by obama.

Report this

By GW=MCHammered, February 24, 2009 at 11:30 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Inspiring.
Smart enough to pull it off.
Finally.

If not.
All beware.

Yet, ennobling.

Report this
Newsletter

sign up to get updates


 
 
Right 1, Site wide - BlogAds Premium
 
Right 2, Site wide - Blogads
 
Join the Liberal Blog Advertising Network
 
 
 
Right Skyscraper, Site Wide
 
Join the Liberal Blog Advertising Network
 

A Progressive Journal of News and Opinion   Publisher, Zuade Kaufman   Editor, Robert Scheer
© 2014 Truthdig, LLC. All rights reserved.