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You Have No Rights

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Posted on Aug 14, 2007
protester arrested
AP Photo / John Marshall Mantel

(Page 3)

Scheer: Another guest we had on this show was Robert Higgs.  I don’t know if you’ve heard of him, with The Independent Institute.  And he takes a radical view about government and he thinks that with crisis times, people run to government—in terms of 9/11, or the New Deal with the Depression.  His point is trying to get rid of government altogether.  Do you think that would be a good way to go?  Do you think the government right now is just so power-hungry that they’ll grab at anything, they’ll cause fear, they’ll spend money wherever they like to spend money and the Senate and the House won’t do anything?  Do you think it’s time we changed the government a little bit?

Rothschild: I believe in government as having a necessary role, both to protect people and also to buffer people from the forces, the cruel forces of the market—in this day and age, the cruel forces of huge corporations.  Now, what Republicans and even some libertarians think is that government is there only to protect us, and what the Bush administration thinks it’s there for is to give the Pentagon a $700-billion annual allowance and to hand out $200-billion checks in corporate welfare every year.  Now, that’s not my idea of a positive role for government.

Harris: It’s almost—at this point, in this war and at this stage in our history—cliché  to say we have to stand up, because when I step back and look, I see fewer and fewer people standing up.  So what are we left with?

Rothschild: We absolutely have got to stand up for our rights, right now, before it’s too late.  Several of the people I profiled in this book, “You Have No Rights,” stood up for their rights after their rights were violated.  They sued the government or they sued the city police or the Secret Service or the FBI.  And they won.  They won lawsuits and settlements.  And so, that’s the way to go.  Otherwise Bush is going to keep taking and taking and taking until we’ve got nothing left.  We can’t be afraid that they’re going to spy on us or that they’re going to arrest us and therefore not exercise our rights out of fear, because if we do that, we’ve already surrendered our rights to them.  They’ve already taken the rights away.  The Bill of Rights [is] already shredded.  We’ve got to make sure that they don’t continue to shred our rights.  We’ve got to tell congresspeople, “Look, get these irresponsible, runaway president and vice president—get them to regard the law as something that they need to follow, and impeach them for not following it.

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Scheer: And not just the vice president and president, but anyone—whether they are Democrat, Republican, libertarian, Green—.

Rothschild: And it’s not about payback against Bush and Cheney or anything.  This is about whether we’re a democracy or not.  We can’t have on the books all these oppressive and repressive bits of executive orders or precedents that these people have established already.

Scheer: The people you talked to, the people you interviewed—are they still happy to be American citizens?  How angry are they?  Did they leave the country?

Rothschild: I talked to a guy named Zakariya Muhammad Reed, whose given name was Edward Eugene Jr., Edward Eugene Reed Jr.  He lived in Toledo, Ohio, for 20 years.  He was in the National Guard.  For 11 years he’s been a firefighter there in Toledo.  He converted to Islam.  He married a woman from Lebanon whose family went to Toronto.  Five times in the last eight months he’s been stopped coming back from Canada by Immigration.  He said it would’ve been OK to stop him once and see who he was.  He understands the risks we face in this country.  But to stop him and harass him five times—and this was harassment.  One of the guards told him, “We should do with these guys what we do with them in Iraq.  We should put hoods over their heads and zip-tie their hands.”  And then another person who was asking him questions, interrogating him, said, “What about this letter to the editor you wrote to the Toledo Blade.”  And the letter he had written to the Toledo Blade that the guy had in front of him was criticizing the Bush administration, saying, “If you want to know why the United States has a bad reputation overseas, why don’t you look at the Bush administration’s war against Iraq and the Bush Administration’s support for Israel’s war against Lebanon and its oppression of the Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza?”  And so the guy, the interrogator, says, “So, you like to write letters to the editor?”  Well, you can’t write a letter to the editor in this country?  What’s that about?

And the fifth time he was stopped—I wrote about him after he was stopped four times.  And then the fifth time he was stopped he was asked about that article on Progressive.org that Rothschild wrote.  The guys are watching every word the guy is saying.

[Chuckling.]

Scheer: Is this guy still happy?

Rothschild: No, he is not happy.

Scheer: OK.

Rothschild: He is outraged about what’s happened to his country.  He said this is not the country he believed in.  This is not the country he served in the National Guard for.  “What has become of our country?” he asks.  And that’s a tough question to answer.

Scheer: It seems like we are creating even more enemies.  You know, we talk about stupid things like little threats, sleeper cells, or whatever.  We’re creating terrorism in this country by making these people feel like fifth-class citizens.

Rothschild: We’re really infuriating people in this country who are Muslim-American or Arab-American and are harassed repeatedly when they are crossing the borders.  The ACLU has filed a lawsuit, a class-action suit, with many of these people who just can’t believe the way they’re being treated.

Harris: What has been the most consequential change, either in loss of freedom or just change in American citizenry in general?

Rothschild: Two of the most flagrant things that George W. Bush has done, impeachable offenses, are the NSA spying, the spying by the National Security Agency, and then these signing statements.


New and Improved Comments

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By jbart, August 21, 2007 at 6:38 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

To ALL the “relevant”(Mossad “shills”& Neocon assholes” excluded, of course)commenters on this site,

FYI - I’m strongly against the excesses of gun owners in our country. BIG TIME AGAINST!!
But, with all the info becoming available of the potential of the declaration of Marshall law, I’m seriously considering getting armed,the thought of which sickens me,to resist. I,for one,love my country,consider myself a patriot,and will procure and use weaponry to defend what it stands for. I believe that we are all facing a scary precipice of a future for us that continues to be leaders of the free world or not. Do we allow what’s hapenning to happen, or do we resist? I’m strongly in favor of resistance. Not wanting to be perceived as paranoid, I still want to retain effective communication with “LIKE-MINDED"people. With the “recent” non-comments occuring on this site, I’m “open” to alternative methods of communication. If any of you “relevant” commenters care to “maintain” effective communication with me,in this regard, let me know and I think it can be accomplished “off line”. Believe me when I say this….I truly care !!

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By NewsSophisticate, August 21, 2007 at 2:26 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Our rights are rapidly being subverted into privileges.
Unfortunately its not just US. 

Homeland Security tightens Grip. Entering Latin America and the Caribbean

It looks like neo imperial America is increasing her empire. Touting “the Time Has Finally Come” and “..the long anticipated event”,Homeland Security and apparently her little sister the, Latin American Caribbean Security Council (LACHSS ), is holding a summit November 7-10, 2007 at the Gaylord Palms Resort and Convention Center in Orlando, Florida. With a goal of bringing Latin America and the Caribbean countries into the existing homeland security apparatus, the LACHSS summit has a stated mission ...

Please read my full article.  It will shock, enrage, and scare you
http://newssophisticate.blogspot.com/2007/08/homeland-security-tightens-grip.html

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By NewsSophisticate, August 21, 2007 at 2:25 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Our rights are rapidly being subverted into privileges.
Unfortunately its not just US. 

Homeland Security tightens Grip. Entering Latin America and the Caribbean

It looks like neo imperial America is increasing her empire. Touting “the Time Has Finally Come” and “..the long anticipated event”,Homeland Security and apparently her little sister the, Latin American Caribbean Security Council (LACHSS ), is holding a summit November 7-10, 2007 at the Gaylord Palms Resort and Convention Center in Orlando, Florida. With a goal of bringing Latin America and the Caribbean countries into the existing homeland security apparatus, the LACHSS summit has a stated mission ...

Please read my full article.  It will shock, enrage, and scare you

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By Michael Shaw, August 21, 2007 at 1:38 pm Link to this comment

I’ve just contacted the webmaster. Hopefully he can resolve this issue.

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By Jeanine Molloff, August 21, 2007 at 1:35 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Here’s something novel—how about EVERYONE CONTACT IN A E-MAIL OR PHONE FLOOD EVERY CANDIDATE RUNNING FOR POTUS.  TELL THEM TO REPEAL ALL THE OFFENDING ACTS: PATRIOT 1 ⅈ, MILITARY COMMISSIONS, WARNER AUTHORIZATION ACT, ANIMAL TERRORISM ACT, CHANGES MADE TO POSSE COMITATUS, NSPD-51 AND HSPD-20.  TELL THEM TO DECLARE ‘SIGNING STATEMENTS’ AND ‘EXECUTIVE ORDERS CURTAILING CIVIL LIBERTIES AS AN ILLEGITIMATE POWER GRAB AND TO MAKE THEM ILLEGAL AND PUNISHABLE BY CRIMINAL JAIL TIME.  TELL THEM TO RESTORE THE BILL OF RIGHTS OR YOU’LL VOTE FOR THEIR OPPONENT.  LET’S MANIPULATE THE SOB’S.  TIME TO TAKE BACK OUR DEMOCRACY AND INCARCERATE THE CRIMINALS IN D.C.

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By Michael Shaw, August 21, 2007 at 1:27 pm Link to this comment

96184

Well mine have all come through. Try clearing your browser or resetting it. That might help.

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By 911truthdotorg, August 21, 2007 at 1:14 pm Link to this comment

cyrena -

No, they’re not.  I was surprised the other one did.

I’ve posted to several articles and none came thru.

Don’t know what’s going on.

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By Stout, August 21, 2007 at 4:10 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

BUSH AND CHENEY ARE THE REAL TERRORISTS!
BUSH AND CHENEY ARE THE REAL TERRORISTS!
BUSH AND CHENEY ARE THE REAL TERRORISTS!
BUSH AND CHENEY ARE THE REAL TERRORISTS!
BUSH AND CHENEY ARE THE REAL TERRORISTS!
BUSH AND CHENEY ARE THE REAL TERRORISTS!
BUSH AND CHENEY ARE THE REAL TERRORISTS!
BUSH AND CHENEY ARE THE REAL TERRORISTS!
BUSH AND CHENEY ARE THE REAL TERRORISTS!
BUSH AND CHENEY ARE THE REAL TERRORISTS!

I say we waterboard them and stack ‘em up naked next to that “thumbs up” Army girl from the Abu Graib scandal. 

If someone on here has enough money and a lawyer, I say (REALISTICALLY) file a lawsuit on those two on behalf of the American public.  Get it on the news.  I forgot the name of the woman in Ireland wo said it (She’s on that Nicleback video, “If everyone cared.” 

“Do not believe that a small group of people cannot change the world.  Indeed that’s the only thing that ever has.”

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By cyrena, August 20, 2007 at 11:07 pm Link to this comment

911 truthdog,

What’s up? Are your posts not coming thru?

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By 911truthdotorg, August 20, 2007 at 9:21 pm Link to this comment

It looks like I’m being blacklisted as well…...

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By Michael Shaw, August 20, 2007 at 7:23 pm Link to this comment

No one here is giving up liberty. It was taken from us by those who gave a king that authority. I agree we need impeachment but there aren’t enough votes in congress to carrying this out. Same goes with the senate who actually do impeach. The republicans won’t support it and neither will some democrats. We can scream for impeachment all we want but if there aren’t enough votes what are we going to do? Also the White house has been blocking investigations every step of the way, using the excuse of national security to hide their crimes. There have been and still are investigations at least(the previous 5 years had none) and one major conviction in Libby. Rove may well be next in line for a perjury conviction since it is now out that he did in fact leak Valerie Plame, something he denied doing under oath. Gonzales is on the run and losing republican support over those federal prosecutor firings so at least something is being done. The ACLU has been conducting lawsuits and pursuing the release of information long before there was a popular demand to do so. So people out there are standing up and the last election shows that people are wising up too! I’ll grant you if more people decided to get off their asses and demand action from their representatives things might get on the right track a bit faster but to say people aren’t standing up or are doing nothing is far from true.

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By Nitro, August 20, 2007 at 6:12 pm Link to this comment

WE HAVE NO RIGHTS ?

As long as we keep letting them tell US that we have no rights, we don’t. We have the right to protect our nation from THE Tyrannical government now in office. We have the right to DEMAND they be removed from office and put them in front of a firing squad in Leavenworth,KS.

The American Sheeple just keep sitting by while the “Decider Guy” keeps insisting on how better off we’d be if we were a dick-tator-ship and he was our Dick-Tator?!” So how much more evidence does our Legislative and Judicial branches need to have the whole damn bunch removed for such an on going list of charges and crimes against the U.S. and it’s people? And the world !

I’ve been reading these posted articles for 6 months now, and every one, every day, just keeps saying the same thing. “We’re fed up! We’re disgusted and ashamed! Impeach the Bastards & Bitches! We’re tired of the lawlessness and crimes against the U.S. and it’s people!” Yet WHAT, has been done or accomplished in the last 6 months against the criminals? Not one damn thing. I see a bunch of the King Bushit rats jumping a sinking ship as well. But no PROSECUTION of above said criminals.

And if the AmericanPeople keep sitting by and pecking out their frustrations and disgust, nothing ever will be done. I really hope and pray that all those 26,000 that left Chicago in July headed for the White House to protest they’re still being in office and to be held accountable for their crimes, on September 11, 2007 make it and are joined by the rest of the Sheeple of this great REPUBLIC we live in, For which it stands, and we finally get rid of the scum that resides in our Great Institution of governing.

Because GETTING RID OF THEM, is the only way to put a stop to the crimes they keep committing against the American People, EVERYDAY !

So I say BULL SHIT to King George Bushit and to Hell w/anyone else who says, We no longer have any rights. You don’t have any Rights…. if you don’t exercise them !

STAND TALL! STAND FIRM! STAND PROUD AMERICA ! But most of all .... JUST STAND UP !!!!

To A Better Day ...

Nitro_

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By Michael Shaw, August 20, 2007 at 1:36 pm Link to this comment

95996 Scott

Franky I believe the cat is out of the bag and has been for quite a while now. The last congressional elections proved that America was finally waking up. Sadly the democrats have come out of it looking like little more than a bunch of hand puppets(at least 41 of them), giving Bush the legal right to spy domestically after many of us fought so hard to expose this abomination.

I think that beyond greed(which I see as key), in many instances what we have seen in regards to republican indifference and indeed the national indifference that occurred until recently, is that people simply could not believe what has been transpiring. How could this be happening in America? That excuse can’t be given now however, because there is more than enough evidence available to all.

The question now is what are we going to do about it? Pundit analogy has it’s uses but it won’t “get er done” on its own. Plain and simply, we need to demand our politicians do the right thing or else we won’t support them. First and foremost however we need to get rid of(vote out) the neocons. Until we do that, none of the other issues will be addressed and nothing will change but only get worse. Once that is accomplished we need to get rid of(vote out) the republicrats who have supported Bush from the get go. I see an opportunity here for independent candidacies and the possibility in a new political powerhouse emerging. This must happen if we are ever to get the two major parties to address the issues that are most important to the bulk of Americans. It will force them to broker an honest debate and come to the realization that if they continue to ignore us, the days of a two party system might well be numbered.

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By Scott, August 20, 2007 at 10:32 am Link to this comment

bogi666 observes that Once people can be made to believe the absurd they can be made to believe anything.

The observation resonates deeply with Greg Bacon’s report that KSLA News 12 has discovered that the clergy would help the government with potentially their biggest problem: Us.

These suggest the direction to look for an answer to the question posed by lawlessone What were they (more sensible moderate Republicans) thinking?

Whatever they, like most human beings were thinking, it was likely influenced by the thick miasma of confusion and superstition that’s cultivated by both religon and government. Many if not most faiths throughout history have had a natural affinity with authoritarianism. It’s no mystery why god features so prominantly in so many constitutions around the world.

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By Stout, August 20, 2007 at 5:57 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Why can’t we assassinate the bad politicians for once?  Reagan, Kennedy, Lincoln, all for the most part good Presidents, got dead.  Why is it no one has murdered these two fascists in cold blood yet?  Caesar shouldn’t have fallen to conspirators, but these two sure as hell should.

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By purplewolf, August 20, 2007 at 12:43 am Link to this comment

“Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety,deserve neither Liberty nor Safety”- Ben Franklin
“A patriot must be ready to defend his country against his goverment,”- Edward Abbey
“When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace.”- Jimi Hendrix
All above quotes are currently on bumper stickers and available from CarryaBigSticker from an ebay store.
These are all often heard statements that,thanks to the madness of King George,could have someone tossed into the pen for the rest of their live.Scary that this has come about and the so called checks and balances,laws of the land and our elected babysitters have failed to corral and correct.By allowing this to continue and expand in the out of control speed which it has occured only proves that the powers that be either don’t care, or are so high on their our over inflated ego trip they fail to see what is actually going on.
In our Sunday newapaper there was a large article(must have slipped by as things are censored in our newspaper)about the new “broad surveillence powers” approved by congress hastily done as they were on their way out the door for vacation time. Thanks to these drones they are now “concerned” they should have been more cautious before signing this bill.To late,we now have the “Foreign Intelligence Surveillence Act”, and there is a lot of domestic spying included in that.
I orginally found Truthdig while researching some disturbing things I had heard about this administration.I started with the July 17 2007 “Executive Order-Blocking Property of Certain Persons Who Threaten Stabilization Efforts in Iraq.” Wow,guess who and their group of cronies are the biggest offenders of this type of behaviour right now? You guessed it.None other that the same person who came up with this illogical rule.
Also disturbing,all the FEMA relocation centers of concentration camps.If you do not believe that our goverment would do that to the people of this country,look no further than the famous “Trail of Tears, and other numerous gatherings of Native Peoples whom this goverment declared “hostile” just to steal the land.History again repeats itself.

Yes G.W wants America to be a dictatorship and has stated on numerous occassions.These following examples were from the mouth of George W.Bush in public places and witnessed by many:

1.” It would be a heck of a lot easier to be a dictator than work a democracy.:-(referrenced in J.H.Hatfield’s “Fortunate Sun.” When Dubya was governor of Texas-1996 exact date unknown

2.“You don’t get everything you want. A dictatorship would be a lot easier.”- George W.Bush July 1 1998

3.“If this were a dictatorship, it would be a heck of a lot easier-just so long as I’m the dictator.” G.W.Bush-a few weeks before taking office(December 18,2000)

4.“This job would be a heck of a lot easier if this were a dictatorship,so long as I’m the dictator,”-President G.W.Bush at White House Press Conference December 2001

5.“A dictatorship would be a heck of a lot easier, there’s no question about it,”-President G.W.Bush July 26,2001

6. “It’s not a dictatorship in Washington, but I tried to make it one in that instance.We are beginning to see some success in opening up federal coffers for faith-based programs.”-President George W.Bush Janurary 15 2004*

Doesn’t it seem like each of these statements coming
from G.W.,also in a documentary,that wanting and trying to turn America into a dictatorship is treasonous and should not only be impeached,but given a lifetime of free room and board, along with various forms of torture,not rape anymore as G.W. claims he took that form of torture off the allowed ones,but waterboarding is still in.His friends can come too,after all they have 800+ FEMA centers,one holds about 2 million people as prisoners,plenty of room for all his friends.

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By bogi666, August 19, 2007 at 12:16 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

The latest proclamation by the Bush king, whereby anyone can be detained without constitutional protection for undefined reasons. This could include being an anti consumer activist as the Bush king could declare it unpatriotic to not be a consumer advocate and to broadcast anti consumerism. Oh, you think it can’t happen here? Once those in power realized that they could make the general public believe their propaganda absurdities they know they can tell us anything. Once people can be made to believe the absurd they can be made to believe anything.

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By Michael Shaw, August 18, 2007 at 11:01 am Link to this comment

Glad you’re back Cyrena. I have an interesting story to tell you about my visit to DC a few years back. I was lobbying the congress over proposed enhancements to the USA Patriot Act with the ACLU. I stayed at the Omni-Shoreham Hotel and got to see lots of incredible guest speakers like Ruth Bader Ginsberg, Mohammed Ali and Robert Mueller. Before Mueller came to speak, security came in with explosive sniffing dogs. I imagined them to be secret service. Earlier that day, while entering the congressional offices building we had to go past “trigger happy” security guards. Very nervous people. Having been to Washington before, what I saw was very disturbing. Soldiers and police everywhere with automatic weapons. Barricades everywhere, all around the capital. Barbed wire blocking off entry to the house of the vice president. Pro west Iranians were passing pamphlets calling for military intervention in Iran. The whole capital looked like a set in a war movie. The only thing that jolted me to any sense in reality was an old black stenciled painting of Richard Nixon with the word OBEY under it on an old bridge trestle across the Potomac from Arlington. I had seen that years before, back in the 70’s during the Vietnam War protests. It was a remnant of the past yet it seemed to fit perfectly into today’s scenario. What I found puzzling about this is that it survived for thirty years. No one bothered to white wash it, perhaps because the message was and still is profoundly clear. After seeing Nadine Strossen debating Mueller then meeting her in person were the highlights of my journey. That and hearing Mohammed Ali struggle with Parkinson’s while belting out his speech and receiving a long standing ovation.

When I exited by cab to Ronald Reagan National I got in line for the usual airport security, had to empty my pockets, take off my shoes etc. Thinking I was finished, I was then suddenly escorted by 4 security people to a room just outside of the check in area. There I was led to a machine that looked like an elaborate ATM, then told to take a credit card, any credit card and swipe it through this machine. When I asked why, they didn’t give me an answer, they merely told me if I wanted to board my flight I had to do it. Then it truly dawned on me that I was experiencing the very thing I came to lobby against. Now the government knows what books I read, what music I listen to, the political parties, clubs and associations I donate money too, where I bank, who my doctors are, who I bought presents for and where I get my underwear. If Bush has a blacklist, and I’m sure he has one, I know my name is on that list as is no doubt every person who stayed at the Omni-Shoreham and lobbied congress on those three days.  “You have no rights!” In my book absolutely not.

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By David, August 18, 2007 at 6:56 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

“Standing up”...Its a quaint notion, as the administration likes to say.  Or to quote our president, “(our consitution) is just a piece of paper”.  And when you think about it in terms of the power structure in this country, he might be right. 

The constitution is only valid if the people in power choose to uphold it.  The branches of our government, for one reason or another, have opted to not uphold it.  So what we have is an ideology.  BushCo. has a very different ideology that suits him and his own.

As far as doing something about it, the forces of the economy are such that standing up, for most Americans, is simply not an option.  Its been well documented that Bush/ Cheney have enacted many policies that have, not so much changed the law governing the 40hr work week, but widened the wage gap while.  Their policies, in effect, have increaded the cost of living (of course as had many other free market factors), while the wage has remained stagnant.  They have enabled corporate expansion through their tax cuts, windfall profits for particular sectors, but have not done anything to allow for the upper middle, middle and low classes to maintain pace.  This is by design, of course, because what their agenda entails is a slide back to a pre-New Deal society, where the elite rule and the rest are ruled. 

So as to this notion of standing up, it is for many Americans, not an option.  To choose between loosing a day’s pay or one’s job to attend a protest? Most people are going to choose feeding their family and paying their bills as to stay above water.  Its beeen known for some time that most of the middle class lives pay check to paycheck. And poor Americans so overwhelmed and crushed by the drudgery of their jobs and the long hours they must work to make ends meet, that they have no time to pay attention to the civil liberties that are being robbed of them.

The capitalist elite have acheived a back-door slavery.      And if someone has an idea of how to mount a meaningful protest, I would love to hear it.  The people did what they thought would hedge this tide by electing Democrats.  Obviously, that did nothing, because they are even weaker and more spinelesss than the Rebulicans have painted them.  Either that or they are simply complicit.  What I would like is to have solid third party candidates, but even in the presidential (curiously at time when they would have a bonafide shot) we are not given that option (yet).

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By cyrena, August 17, 2007 at 9:09 pm Link to this comment

testing again. I see that I was able to get the one through earlier, on the Naomi Klein talk. So, we’ll see.

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By Michael Shaw, August 17, 2007 at 12:56 pm Link to this comment

95672 Greg Bacon

Even a natural disaster like another Katrina or an earthquake could spur Bush to enforce Marshal Law. He gave himself those powers a while back and they were posted on the presidential website. What is also disturbing is the fact he can send in National Guard troops from say South Carolina into California, something that had all of the governors in an uproar. Where is Thomas Jefferson when you need him?

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By Michael Shaw, August 17, 2007 at 12:50 pm Link to this comment

95618 Cyrena, I don’t know why on earth someone like you would be blacklisted. I did notice one of your posts last night was empty. I’m glad you got to the Naomi Kline article. It was wonderful hearing her speech on Democracy Now the other day. She is a brilliant woman and what she speaks is the truth.

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By Greg Bacon, August 17, 2007 at 12:45 pm Link to this comment

SHREVEPORT, LA
Homeland Security Enlists Clergy to Quell Public Unrest if Martial Law Ever Declared

Aug 15, 2007 06:07 PM

Could martial law ever become a reality in America?  Some fear any nuclear, biological or chemical attack on U.S. soil might trigger just that.  KSLA News 12 has discovered that the clergy would help the government with potentially their biggest problem: Us.

    Dr. Durell Tuberville serves as chaplain for the Shreveport Fire Department and the Caddo Sheriff’s Office.  Tuberville said of the clergy team’s mission, “the primary thing that we say to anybody is, ‘let’s cooperate and get this thing over with and then we’ll settle the differences once the crisis is over.’”

    Such clergy response teams would walk a tight-rope during martial law between the demands of the government on the one side, versus the wishes of the public on the other.  “In a lot of cases, these clergy would already be known in the neighborhoods in which they’re helping to diffuse that situation,” assured Sandy Davis.  He serves as the director of the Caddo-Bossier Office of Homeland Security and Emergency Preparedness.

    For the clergy team, one of the biggest tools that they will have in helping calm the public down or to obey the law is the bible itself, specifically Romans 13.  Dr. Tuberville elaborated, “because the government’s established by the Lord, you know.  And, that’s what we believe in the Christian faith.  That’s what’s stated in the scripture.

http://www.ksla.com/Global/story.asp?S=6937987

“Verily, i say unto thee, Drop that weapon and put thy hands up, or i will blow thee to Kingdom Come.”

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Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, August 17, 2007 at 8:42 am Link to this comment

cyrena

Many posts have come up blank with names only, it is not just yours. Now some others I can understand.

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By Skruff, August 17, 2007 at 6:13 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I do not think posts are being “deleted” I believe there is a technological problem.  One of my posts which was lost simply said “I agree” not much comentary there, since the post I agreed with is still there.


Give-em-a-break They’ll get it right soon…betcha

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By cyrena, August 17, 2007 at 6:07 am Link to this comment

Michael Shaw,

I’ve been attempting to respond to the Naomi Klein talk that you directed me to. It was excellant, and I thank you for the prompt/reminder. I’m a great fan of Naomi’s She’s an excellent academic, and she knows her stuff. I’ve had the pleasure of hearing her speak on other occassions.

So thanks. It was very useful. Not in time for me to avoid being blacklisted from the THIS site, (since right after you posted the link I guess. So, all my of posts have been deleted, (it looks really obvious on the blogs…like I’ve got a Scarlett Letter on my chest or something).

So, I’m just hoping that this even goes through. I’ll keep trying.

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By Douglas Chalmers, August 17, 2007 at 5:27 am Link to this comment

#95553 by yezbok drahcir on 8/16 at 5:31 pm: “...Why hasn’t truthdig mentioned anything about the following…”

Our posts are being deleted!

You have no rights!

You do not exist!

Viva Cally-fornia!

Some free-speech zone! Seizing all sorts of authoritarian powers right now by executive decree, duh!

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By 911truthdotorg, August 16, 2007 at 8:18 pm Link to this comment

Very disturbing article and video of how the “clergy” are being trained to quell “dissent” when bush pulls off his next terror attack and declares martial law.
They practiced it in New Orleans.

God help this country.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/august2007/160807_economic_collapse.htm

Google videos: 9/11 Press for Truth, Loose Change 2nd Edition, America: Freedom to Fascism

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By yezbok drahcir, August 16, 2007 at 6:31 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Why hasn’t truthdig mentioned anything about the following?

“Homeland Security Enlists Clergy to Quell Public Unrest if Martial Law Ever Declared”

http://www.ksla.com/Global/story.asp?S=6937987

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By cyrena, August 16, 2007 at 5:28 pm Link to this comment

•  #95524 by Michael Shaw on 8/16 at 2:44 pm
(308 comments total)
95488 Cyrena, read that article of the transcriptby Naomi Kline I posted earlier.  http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=07/08/15/1432250
Michael,

Thanks …so very much…for prompting me again to the Naomi Kline transcript. Her talk was SUPERB!! I thoroughly appreciated it, and it will be extremely useful to my own work. I should say that I’m quite an admirer of Naomi’s work. I’ve had the opportunities to hear her speak in conference here at our campus, and as you may have guessed from other posts, we seem to have arrived at many of the same conclusions.(Naomi and I) So maybe it’s a natural tendency to admire those experts whose opinions can validate our own.

And, she nailed it on the head with that, because the reality of today is that the center for ideas is closed. Within the corporate bureaucracy, any attempt to voice those free ideas is repressed, and Johnny-on-the-spot I might add. They may not do it Tiananmen Square style, but the effects are the same.

Anyway, thanks again. I hadn’t seen this yet, and I really did enjoy it. There’s lots here to contemplate.

As sort of a little “side project”, (that turned far larger) I’ve been trying to follow all of the propaganda campaigns that have made it possible to so effectively pull this off. I mean the war on terror just served JILLIONS of purposes, but that has been the most disastrous. To literally brainwash and psychologically torture an entire population of people.

And even now, I’m still putting together the consequences of so many of these campaigns…especially the religious ones that are founded upon propaganda that has been created from some of the most radical interpretations of the Bible as I’ve ever seen, or could have imagined.

It’s like a “cult” that has formed over the past several years, and some of the mindset that has come from it just downright terrifies me. And it’s all so subtle and nuanced, that the victims of it are totally wiped off their feet. (except they don’t know it) Like in the permanent land of Oprah and “The Secret”.

And, that’s only one of the tools, but it has been powerful enough. Not only do they crush and repress these ideas/alternatives because they know they would WORK, but they also have managed to re-program with these other ideas that are designed to enslave.

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By Michael Shaw, August 16, 2007 at 3:44 pm Link to this comment

95488 Cyrena, read that article of the transcriptby Naomi Kline I posted earlier.  http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=07/08/15/1432250

It talks about the reasons behind the New Deal, in fact as a way to avoid communism. In there Naomi speaks of a “Third Choice.” The New Deal was a third choice, the other two being either fascism or communism. Beyond the glimmering hope of a universal health care plan, today it seems obvious that our government intends to ignore the third choice that saved us in the past. Their only alternative will be to crush unrest rather than appease it. So the obvious choice they’ve made appears more than anything else to be fascism. Apparently the lessons of the French and Russian revolutions have been ignored. This sometimes happens when those with absolute power are arrogant enough to believe their actions won’t have severe consequences.

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By NewsSophisticate, August 16, 2007 at 1:23 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

the Bush Cabal are rapidly subverting our rights into privileges.  View where we were going on Sept. 10, 2001.

Read the Article

Remembering History: Sept. 10, 2001

http://newssophisticate.blogspot.com/2007/08/remembering-history-donald-rumsfeld-on.html

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By cyrena, August 16, 2007 at 1:21 pm Link to this comment

#95473 by Michael Shaw on 8/16 at 11:51 am


We’ve been artificially inflating our economy since Reagan and no corrective measures were ever implemented. Today we stand in insurmountable and growing debt. Now we see draconian government and strings of military prisons going up throughout the entire southwest. I think the politicians know exactly what they’re doing, preparing for the worst economic depression in world history.
==============================

Michael,

As terrifying as it is…I suspect you’re right. That would mean that we need to prepare as well, if that’s even possible.

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By Michael Shaw, August 16, 2007 at 12:51 pm Link to this comment

We’ve been artificially inflating our economy since Reagan and no corrective measures were ever implemented. Today we stand in insurmountable and growing debt. Now we see draconian government and strings of military prisons going up throughout the entire southwest. I think the politicians know exactly what they’re doing, preparing for the worst economic depression in world history.

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By Skruff, August 16, 2007 at 6:15 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

95308 by Douglas Chalmers on 8/15 at 9:14 pm

“What is it that the police think that they automatically have a right to shout at people or to threaten them either physically or with arrest? These are only ordinary citizens in uniform. They are merely civil servants - but playing para-military. Their intelligence is very average but they seem to be able to make the most of their little bit of power and authority.”

We had a family friend who was a New York Police officer (beat cop) for a number of years from the 50’s through the 70’s.  He hated the changes he saw in police attitudes in the late sixties, and related how the riots and protests had played into the hands of folks in high levels who saw this as an opportunity to fully militarize city police forces.  SWAT was introduced, then other “special units” Last night I saw a brief clip where New York City police (as well as other police departments) will now be authorized to use satellite technology to syp on american citizens.  This is no “conspiricy theory” this was reported by New York City Police commissioner on WABC News!

The folks in the suburbs are (reportedly) OK with this, but the city-dwellers and western conservatives are livid!  Do I( see the possibility of a coalition of white NRA westerners, and city folk on the horizon?

Just wishful thinking!

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By cyrena, August 16, 2007 at 6:04 am Link to this comment

#95151 by lawlessone on 8/15 at 10:56 am

•  What I do not understand is why the rest of the Republicans, the ones not in the White House, the ones who want to be re-elected, the ones who have cracked open a history book or two, the ones who have a conscience, the ones who believe the Constitution has merit, went along silently.  Were they afraid? Did they lack the ability to see beyond the next election? Were they hoping against hope that it actually was a permanent Republican majority?

Lawless,
I’ve been asking these same questions, everyday, (maybe several times a day) for longer than it seems like I can remember. I was even asking BEOFRE the dems managed to regain the Congress, because it seemed like, (based on certain odds maybe?) that at least a few of them (repubs) would recognize the present and future danger to the entire system, as has been perpetrated by this rogue administration.

In other words, I love my sibling dearly. However, if she were terrorizing the rest of the family, or the neighborhood, or whatever, I would have to step in, and do something. First, because if I don’t, she could continue the damage to innocents. And, also if I don’t, she could eventually turn on ME as well. So, why don’t the repubs get that? I still don’t have the answers.

I CAN say that I believe the “alternative realities” that the Rovian philosophy has weaved over the past decade or so, has had an enormous effect on the psychology of the nation as a whole. In turn, it displays itself in the mentality of our representatives as well. These are, (to an extent) a different “crowd” that we have in the administration as well as the Congress. We like to think of this “new blood” as a good thing. But in our own reality, it hasn’t worked out that way. There is a “braveness” lacking in our Congressional make-up, which may be only a representation of how far we’ve fallen.

And then there’s the lack of knowledge and/or experience. Louise mentioned this in another post a week or so ago, when we were discussing the impeachment efforts. WHY is this such a difficult thing for them to get behind, when the entire process is straightforward enough? It’s like –right there in the manual- and spelled out in such a way as to make it idiot proof. Here’s the rule. If this applies, then you do this. So, the conclusion that was reached, (at least in this discussion, which was from a Bill Moyers Journal episode) was that CONGRESS apparently didn’t understand the Constitution!!

And, as preposterous as that might seem, it’s pretty much the only explanation. They don’t see the Constitution as a non-partisan document. They don’t see it as their job to undertake the protection of the Constitution. And maybe, as you’ve suggested, they’ve simply been able to do this stuff for so long, that they have come to believe that there are no repercussions, or any expectations of accountability. So, it’s a new breed. A breed that for the most part, appears to lack any bravery, because it DOES require that, to step away from the current, or to stand alone.  And, while “truth-telling” hasn’t been a popular activity in the politics of our nation for a really long time, it’s become downright dangerous, as we see from the mob attacks on those who HAVE been willing to go against the grain.

That said, I suspect that explains most of it. It has ALL become about political expediency, and they are so far oblivious to the permanent dangers that presents.

For what it’s worth…

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By Michael Shaw, August 16, 2007 at 12:01 am Link to this comment

95112 waiting for the fall! Absolutely!

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By Michael Shaw, August 15, 2007 at 11:24 pm Link to this comment

I was listening to Naomi Klein today on UCSC’s Free Radio and I thought this would be relevant to our discussion. It talks about the losing of our liberties from a somewhat different perspective and perhaps in ways we should all be thinking about. Why it affected me so strongly was due to a statement she made about Roosevelt’s New Deal. My father, who lived through the great depression told me years ago that at that time the United States was on the verge of a revolution and if it weren’t for the New Deal it would have happened. You can’t find this in any of the history books. It’s apparently something our government isn’t willing to admit to. But Naomi Klein is aware of it as was my father. At any rate it is certainly worth the read. I hope you find it as interesting as I did.

http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=07/08/15/1432250

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By Douglas Chalmers, August 15, 2007 at 10:14 pm Link to this comment

#95109 by Scott on 8/15 at 8:41 am: ” Douglas, if the people are leaving it up to Democrats it must mean they have no bargaining position. Its effectively already out of their hands….”

According to this well-researched and inclusive documentary, this has been going on building steadily over the last 100 years. One might assume then, that we have all more or less failed to process the knowledge we did have to understand what was going on and to stop or prevent it.

“America: Freedom to Fascism” - Director’s Authorized Version http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1656880303867390173 1 hr 51 min http://www.freedomtofascism.com


#95102 by Skruff on 8/15 at 8:24 am: “...I hate to break it to you Deborah, but I’m so white I glow in the dark, and I’m stopped constantly by the police, although I have done nothing other than wear a upside down US flag on my bumper. The inverse flag is an international sign of distress, so I feel it is appropriate.  The police have a different view. ..........I’m stoped by police who have their weapons out, demand that I lie on the ground with my hands on my head, and search me often ripping items of my clothing. .......This has happend for so long, that I (I am ashamed to say) am used to it….”—————>

I can sympathise, Skruff. I had a police home invasion a few years back directly as a result of a known-to-be psychotic and mildly metally-disabled neighbour who had a brother in the local police force making up false stories about me. Why they were believed is indicative of the levels of mental functioning of police anywhere, sad to say.

The three police who did search my home must have realized they were doing something wrong but still tried to intimidate me. One even tried pushing me - but I pushed back. Making a complaint at a political level also helped then. I wouldn’t like to be in that situation again, though, given how things have developed since 9/11 and Katrina.

What is it that the police think that they automatically have a right to shout at people or to threaten them either physically or with arrest? These are only ordinary citizens in uniform. They are merely civil servants - but playing para-military. Their intelligence is very average but they seem to be able to make the most of their little bit of power and authority.

That kind of offensive and intrinsically rude attitude has to be brought to an end. Some kind of standards have to be set and expected to be adhered to for police as well as the public. Now, they just treat anyone as virtual dogs - doesn’t matter how good you are or how senior you are. Thus, there are no genuine standards behind them, only suppression or repression!

Just because we don’t all live in a white mansion on Pennsylvania Avenue in Washington is no reason for our rights to be ignored or for us to not be respected by government employees as fellow human beings. The fact that we no longer are is sure telling us something - even shouting - that they no longer see themselves as “servants”!!!

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By lawlessone, August 15, 2007 at 11:56 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I can understand why Bush and the rest of his personally appointed cabal wanted to have absolute feudal powers.  Jackals are jackals after all.  It disgusts me and it must be prevented and punished, but at least I can understand why greedy predators like the Bush pack salivate to have such power.

I can even understand why a certain percentage of Republicans outside the White House assumed Bush would get away with it and believed there would be a new permanent Republican domination equal to a monarchy.  There is always a certain percentage of arrogant utterly delusional individuals in the population divorced from any morals and unable to perceive reality.

What I do not understand is why the rest of the Republicans, the ones not in the White House, the ones who want to be re-elected, the ones who have cracked open a history book or two, the ones who have a conscience, the ones who believe the Constitution has merit, went along silently.  Were they afraid? Did they lack the ability to see beyond the next election? Were they hoping against hope that it actually was a permanent Republican majority?

Surely they must have realized that if the dictatorial powers sought were activated, it would be hard to eliminate them once again and, at some point, the Democrats would use them against the Republicans.  Isn’t that an unacceptable risk?

Even more potentially ironical, given the willingness Republican zealots have shown in the past to purge their own who did not conform 100%, surely the more sensible moderate Republicans must have recognized the danger the Czar-like powers would be used against themselves by their own leadership.  What were they thinking?

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By Michael Shaw, August 15, 2007 at 9:58 am Link to this comment

What has been transpiring here lately over the abandonment of the Constitution and Bill of Rights had in reality begun more than two decades ago. Today it rears it’s ugly head more arrogantly perhaps and in hindsight because of inactions on events of the past.

I remember the mid 80’s when MOVE, a radical back to nature and anti technology group, were essentially tried and executed in a house on Osage Avenue in West Philadelphia by Pete Thornburg and Wilson Goode. The national guard dropped an incendiary device on the home with a helicopter and as burning victims struggled to escape the flames they were gunned down by police. In the aftermath 6 adults and 5 children were killed and 62 neighboring homes were destroyed. There were two survivors who were later awarded a settlement along with the victims families and those who lost their homes, but no public official was ever held accountable. MOVE’s crimes were essentially in disturbing the peace, denying health inspectors entry, having speakers outside of their house that they blasted propaganda out of and their own gas powered electric generator which enabled them to cut off PG&E. Later in the 90’s as we recall, came the FBI led WACO massacre on the Davidian’s. I’ll grant you these groups were fringe and radical and were in fact armed, but since when have the police, national guard and FBI become the judge, jury and executioners? Apparently they had as far back as 1985, 15 years before George W. Bush marched into the oval office.

Today what we are seeing is an example of blatant lawlessness by our government on a national rather than a local scale. 9/11 gave the neocons the opportunity they had been waiting for since the first Bush administration and by God now they have it. The bottom line is, what are we prepared to do about it? Until politicians are held accountable for their own actions, nothing will ever come of it. That is why I support the notion of impeachment because if we do nothing, we might all find ourselves living in a house on Osage Avenue.

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By waitingfor the fall, August 15, 2007 at 9:48 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Bush and his minders are just the latest corporate-sponsored mandarins in a 50-year war on the middle and working classes of America.

In 1956 Eisenhower warned America about the military industrial complex and how it robs the citizen and all humanity of its democratic rights.

Obviously…Ike saw what was coming and he left the soiree before it became the tragedy that is is today.

Democracy is already dead…the only thing keeping America functioning as if it is a democracy is the momentum of traditional expectations among the lumpen who still believe the bullshit that is being shoveled at us through bought-off politicians and corporate-owned media.

Soon, with financial collapse, Peak Oil, systemic collapse and global warming on the horizon… the gloves of our authoritarinized government will have to come off in order to keep the working poor in their place. THE DISMANTLING OF THE BILL OF RIGHTS AND THE U.S. CONSTITUTION BY THE LATEST ASMINISTRATION IS FACILITATING THIS. Then most of America, duped into thinking that they have wealth through credit and a measure of control in their daily lives, will taste the bitter end of the holographic illusion we have been living in for the last 51 years.

BUSH and CHENEY are not pioneers in this extractive capitalism scheme that is truly returning America to a feudalistic state….they are merely the current handpicked players carrying out their orders from the richest of the rich who truly run this country. And they despise intellectualism, liberty and any social contract that benefits the “lower classes”.

My advice to any American who owes more than they’re worth or makes less than $300,000 a year: dig in, get off the grid, pay of your debt, know your friends and exits, prepare to do without, learn how to fight, and get ready to see unbelievable violence,death and misery in this country in the wake of the neocon revolution.

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By Scott, August 15, 2007 at 9:41 am Link to this comment

Douglas, if the people are leaving it up to Democrats it must mean they have no bargaining position. Its effectively already out of their hands.

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By Skruff, August 15, 2007 at 9:24 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

94955 by Deborah on 8/14 at 7:44 pm

“The ACLU has filed a lawsuit, a class-action suit, with many of these people who just can’t believe the way they’re being treated….They can’t believe they’re being treated like BLACK PEOPLE have been treated for centuries in this country.”

“I wish the ACLU would file a lawsuit for me for all the times me and mine get stopped by the cops for no reason.”

I hate to break it to you Deborah, but I’m so white I glow in the dark, and I’m stopped constantly by the police, although I have done nothing other than wear a upside down US flag on my bumper. The inverse flag is an international sign of distress, so I feel it is appropriate.  The police have a different view.

I do have a felony on my record from the ‘68 Chicago Democratic convention. Ihe charges included “crossing State lines to incite violence,” and “advocating overthrow of the US government.” there were also a number of misdomeanors and local violations. Although the charges sound serious, they resulted in a $100 fine, and a 366 day suspended sentence. The problem is; they remain on my record, so often I’m stoped by police who have their weapons out, demand that I lie on the ground with my hands on my head, and search me often ripping items of my clothing.

This has happend for so long, that I (I am ashamed to say) am used to it.

“Black people have been screaming for years that America has been practicing for the police state by using us as the guinea pigs. Now that everyone’s else’s rights are being usurped, suddenly it’s a problem.”

And I know exactly what you mean!  When I was young in New York City, the “drug problem” wasn’t a “problem” because only black folks in Harlem and Oceanhill-brownsville were dying from Heroin overdoses.  It BECAME a problem when rich white girls from Scarsdale started using….and dying.

“Bush and Cheney should be tried for treason for what they have done to this country.” 

Why stop at Bush and Cheney?  Clinton, Kissenger, Bush Senior, Dan Quayle, Kennedy, McCain… the list goes on forever! 

Our government has sold us down the river.  We need to “come together” black, white,  xtian, jew, and tell them “This is OUR country, and you work for us!”

Until we do that, they will continually divide and conquor….it has worked well for THEM!

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By Douglas Chalmers, August 15, 2007 at 8:00 am Link to this comment

#94915 by Scott on 8/14 at 4:04 pm: “...Without impeachment there will be no reason to revoke the powers now vested in the Whitehouse….”————->

Calif. Senator Barbara Boxer: “This Is As Close As We’ve Ever Come To A Dictatorship” http://www.infowars.com/articles/ps/dictatorship_boxer_says_this_is_as_close_as_ever_come.htm (with mp3 link)

Quote: “.....I want to say this for our listeners: they want impeachment put back on the table. They want impeachment on the table as a bargaining chip….”

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By Nicole, August 15, 2007 at 7:40 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I’d bet hard cash that the comment written by “Deborah” was written by a white man.  Guaranteed.  Busted!

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By Deborah, August 14, 2007 at 8:44 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Rothschild: We’re really infuriating people in this country who are Muslim-American or Arab-American and are harassed repeatedly when they are crossing the borders.  The ACLU has filed a lawsuit, a class-action suit, with many of these people who just can’t believe the way they’re being treated.


*****
LOL. They can’t believe they’re being treated like BLACK PEOPLE have been treated for centuries in this country.

I wish the ACLU would file a lawsuit for me for all the times me and mine get stopped by the cops for no reason.

Black people have been screaming for years that America has been practicing for the police state by using us as the guinea pigs. Now that everyone’s else’s rights are being usurped, suddenly it’s a problem.

This war has been fought for oil and fueled by racism. Yes, racism. That the brown people couldn’t possibly be as strong or as brilliant as the white people and that there was no way Yankee ingenuity wouldn’t win this war.

America’s Big Stick is broken. Even Rove is running away with his tail between his legs and subpoena dogging his steps.

Bush and Cheney should be tried for treason for what they have done to this country. And all the white people who voted for them, despite the fact that they were WARNED that our Republic would be ruined by them, are every bit as responsible for the state of our Democracy and the lack of civil liberties we have in the name of fighting terrorism.

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By 911truthdotorg, August 14, 2007 at 8:38 pm Link to this comment

If this doesn’t convince any skeptics that the US Gov’t was involved with 9/11, I don’t know what will.
Edwards can’t even lie and say “absolutely not”, “there’s no evidence of that”, or something along those lines! And he’s a lying lawyer!!

When asked by Barbara Walters on the night of September 11, 2001 if the 9/11 attacks were carried out by forces within the U.S. 2008 presidential
candidate and then senate intelligence committee member John Edwards becomes evasive and refuses to answer the question, after having spoken to CIA director George Tenet earlier that day.  «

Copy and paste entire URL:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8866440606326 94627&q=edwards+9/11+walters&total=23&start=0&num=10&so=0&type;= search&plindex=0

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By Scott, August 14, 2007 at 5:04 pm Link to this comment

Without impeachment there will be no reason to revoke the powers now vested in the Whitehouse. The next time the pendulum (as near staionary as it is) swings towards the Republicans the authoritarian changes they have made will carry the weight of Democratic credibility.

The clash between Right and Left will essentially become a completely meaningless distraction if it hasn’t already. The other axis of the political spectrum - the Libertarian/Authoritarian divide is where the real action is these days.

The only relevent question is ‘are you with them or..?’

Perhaps this will help you make up your mind.

The Political Compass

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By Sharon Ash, August 14, 2007 at 1:50 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

War is very difficult for a country, whether you are the country waging the war, or on the receiving end, and it hurts the morale of its citizens.  Impeachment proceedings are very difficult for a country to go through and it hurts the morale of its citizens.  No one would like to see, more than would I, both Bush and Cheney be impeached, but I do not believe it is in the best interest of our country to put ourselves through those proceedings while we are still at war in Iraq.  I would like to see us keep our focus on getting our troops home and then go after Bush and Cheney.

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By 127001, August 14, 2007 at 1:28 pm Link to this comment

This is no surprise. But it has been happening longer in the lower levels of the courts and government. Federal Constitutional law was supposed to protect citizens from abuse by State and local governmental agencies and employees. It doesn’t happen. In fact, the Section 1983 litigation that was to provide accountability is all but abolished in the courts. Attorneys won’t even represent litigants, and those that represent themselves are rubber stamped out.

It is common knowledge that even the courts in this country are broken beyond repair with corruption and abuse. Even in a small claims court anywhere in the U.S., the litigant who pays the most tax or politically supports the judicial candidate or their party receives preferential treatment (and judgment).

Americans are stoooopid! to allow this to continue. But, of course, no one wants to rock the boat. They’d rather be chained like a dog in the back yard for table scraps than earn their food like a wolf in the wild, because that’s not “pretty enough.”

Yuck!

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By carlito paquito, August 14, 2007 at 11:01 am Link to this comment

Proof positive of a democracy? checks & balances. Even I know that. “show me, I may forget, tell me I may remember, include me, i’ll understand” Lao Tze.  Seems like sky writing to me and even I get it.

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By carlito paquito, August 14, 2007 at 10:59 am Link to this comment

Proof positive of a democracy? checks & balances. Even I know that. “show me, I may forget, tell me I may remember, include me i’ll understand” Lao Tze.  Seems like sky writing to me and even I get it.

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By kevin, August 14, 2007 at 10:55 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I would have to agree with Scott. The dem’s see a chance to hold the power if they take the office the re-pubes hold. Only a few politicians are willing to Impeach the King G II and Darth Cheney. They posture for time and that is all they want to do.

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By VietnamVet, August 14, 2007 at 10:22 am Link to this comment

The actual danger from all those Islamic terrorists Bush raves on about is actually nothing when viewed against the danger this man is for our constitution and our rights. Apparently, the MSM has been successful in hiding that danger from the American people. I can see martial law looming in the future. Our only hope is that if that time arrives, our military leaders will have the guts to finally tell Bush and his goons they have had enough. But, given the ambitions of many of our top military leaders, as has been shown, they just might be more protective of their careers than the rights of the American people. I just hope I am wrong!

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By Eso, August 14, 2007 at 8:48 am Link to this comment

What is the most extreme form of protest you are ready to take if all the TALK TALK TALK fails?

What is the meaning of the comment that one reads on so many t-shirts: Just do it?

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By Leefeller, August 14, 2007 at 8:37 am Link to this comment

Japanese interment camps seem to come to mind.  Witch hunts looking for a communist behind every tree in the 50’s peoples lives called on a carpet of fear and madness. Vietenam , now the war on Terror.  Congress should be protecting the Constitution from the likes of Bush, but they have only emulated the yes men we voted out. The rule of law has become a joke.

Liberty has been slowly taken away from us only because we let them.  People need to wake up and not let Fascists in government, the special interests take away any of our rights. Our founding fathers would be appalled by what Bush and Congress have done together to take away and stifle our freedoms. 

It will be so much harder to regain rights lost, than would have been to keep them.  Congress has been instrumental in supporting Bush in his goals, Is it the money or something else?

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By KISS, August 14, 2007 at 8:21 am Link to this comment

Again someone brave enough to tell the truth, something the newspapers and television will not do. Mathew Rothschild have been a leader in standing up to Bush and his destruction of our constitutional rights. NeoFasism is a good term of clarity describing this administrations love affair with corporate Amerika, and the creation of a two-class system.
Why are the candidates, both sides, not being asked about disbanding Executive Order 51 and diluting the power of Executive Order and Executive Privilege?
As Matthew pointed out the dimmo cowards running for Presidency are not addressing Impeachment on this constitutional traitor and his right-hand thugs.
I hope to see ” You Have No Rights” on the best seller list, soon

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By Skruff, August 14, 2007 at 7:08 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I am a bit tired of folks talking about this one, or that one “trampling the constitution.” In fact, the Constitution at its inception may have been a documentwith some absolutes, but since the second president of the United States, (before ratification) US citizens have been restricted by the executive branch as to what they can say and do while excercising their right of “free expression”

Later that “elastic clause” that we all learned to respect in school, allowed the folks in government to make all laws (constitutional or legislative) open-ended. There is no “absolute” law in these United States.

So when the City of Bangor Maine provides city police to patrol the property of the Bangor Mall saying it’s a “quasi-public entity,” and then the Mall administrator declares a ban on “offensive tee shirts” Rationalizing that the Mall is privately owned property, no action is undertaken by our spineless Maine Civil Liberty Union, on the grounds that “If the city manager (not an elected official)approved this arrangement it is a legal contract!” The interesting part of this story is the “offensive tee shirt” was sold from a Mall-based store. The offensive word on the tee shirt was “Peace”

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By Scott, August 14, 2007 at 6:44 am Link to this comment

The Democrats won’t put impeachment on the table unless they are forced into it. The Democratic establishment wants the Whitehouse with all the new exective powers and priviledges that come with it.

So do the corporations that are bank-rolling both parties. It doesn’t really matter to them who’s in power.

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