Top Leaderboard, Site wide
Shop the Truthdig Gift Guide 2014
December 20, 2014
Truthdig: Drilling Beneath the Headlines
Sign up for Truthdig's Email NewsletterLike Truthdig on FacebookFollow Truthdig on TwitterSubscribe to Truthdig's RSS Feed

Get Truthdig's headlines in your inbox!


Loss of Rainforests Is Double Whammy Threat to Climate






Truthdig Bazaar
In the Hot Zone

In the Hot Zone

By Kevin Sites
$15.95

more items

 
Report

Israel Crackdown Puts Liberal Jews on the Spot

Email this item Email    Print this item Print    Share this item... Share

Posted on Mar 15, 2010
AP / Muhammed Muheisen

Israeli soldiers take position next to the highly controversial security barrier, which has been used, critics say, to seize Palestinian land and manipulate the population.

By Chris Hedges

(Page 2)

The purge is under way because of the belief within the Netanyahu government that these groups and activists provided evidence of Israeli war crimes in Gaza to Justice Goldstone. Israel has no intention of lifting the blockade on Gaza, halting settlement expansion, including the 1,600 new homes to be built in East Jerusalem, or reversing its division of the West Bank into impoverished ghettos of Palestinians. The growing brutality and violence of the occupation, no longer easy to deny or hide, coupled with Israel’s growing status as an international pariah, have unleashed a crackdown against all those within the Jewish state who are blamed for the bad publicity. Yuli Edelstein, the Diaspora affairs minister, summed up the witch hunt when he announced that the Cabinet had been “concerned for a time with a number of groups under the guise of NGOs that are funded by foreign agents.”

The Knesset bill, if passed, will force human rights groups to register as political bodies and turn over identification numbers and addresses of all members to the government. These groups will lose their tax-exempt status. Most governmental organizations, such as the European Union, which is a large donor to Israeli human rights organizations, cannot legally pay taxes to another government, and the new law will effectively end European Union and other outside funding. The groups will be mandated to provide the government with the records of all foreign donations and account for how these donations were spent. Any public statement, event or speech, even if it lasts half a minute, by these groups must include a declaration that they are being supported and funded by a foreign power. Those who fail to follow these guidelines, including local volunteers, can face a year in jail.

“This is the first time the human rights dimension of the Israel Palestine conflict has moved center stage,” Finkelstein said. “It has temporarily displaced the fatuous peace process. It is the first time that human rights reports have counted. There are literally, because I have read them, tens if not hundreds of thousands of pages of accumulation of human rights reports condemning Israel going back roughly to the first intifada to the present. The human rights organizations since the 1990s have been quite sharp in their criticism of Israel human rights policy, but nobody ever reads the reports. They are never reported on, with maybe a couple of exceptions, in the mainstream media. The Goldstone report was the first time the findings of these human rights organizations moved center stage. People stopped talking about the peace process and started talking about Israel’s human rights record.”

There is a growing disenchantment among Israelis with the endless occupation of Gaza and the West Bank as well as endemic government corruption. Maj. Gen. Avi Zamir, the head of the Israeli military’s Personnel Directorate, admitted recently to UPI that increasing numbers of Israelis are refusing to serve in the occupied territories. “Taking into consideration Israeli Arab youth, we’re facing a situation in which 70 percent of youths will not enlist in the military,” the general told the news agency. The discontent, along with the international condemnation, is inhibiting Israel’s ability to muster international support for further attacks.

Advertisement

Square, Site wide
“Israel attacked Gaza to restore what it called its deterrence capacity, its ability to terrorize the Arab world into submission,” Finkelstein said. “But it actually diminished its deterrence capacity because it can’t attack. If they were to attack now, anywhere, all hell would break loose and they wouldn’t get sympathy.”

The numbers of so-called refuseniks are proliferating with groups such as the Courage to Refuse, Shministim and New Profile supporting those who will not serve in the Israeli Defense Forces. It is not that many Israelis lack a conscience, it is not that many cannot delineate right from wrong; it is that the Netanyahu government is determined to see that these courageous voices within Israel will be silenced along with those of the Palestinians.


New and Improved Comments

If you have trouble leaving a comment, review this help page. Still having problems? Let us know. If you find yourself moderated, take a moment to review our comment policy.

Liquor Store Larry's avatar

By Liquor Store Larry, April 6, 2010 at 8:26 pm Link to this comment

Most A-rab refugees have no historical tie to the land of “Israel.” Most are recent immigrants, a fact implicitly acknowledged by the United Nations when it altered the definition of refugee to apply to those who have lived “at least two years” in a location.

The whole idea of a Palestinian nation and a Palestinian people is an invention of Arab propaganda. Arafat himself was an Egyptian. The only people to have lived continuously on the land “from time immemorial” are Jews. So many others have conquered, ruled, thrived and ultimately perished there that the list would take hundreds of pages. A mere sample would include: Byzantines, Persians, Arabs, Turks, Circassians, Kurds, Abbassids (Iraqis), Egyptians, Kharezmians (Genghis Khan), Mamluks, Mongols, Latins (Crusaders), Ottomans, French and English.

It is not and never was “Palestinian land.”

Nice try though!

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 8:16 pm Link to this comment

Radson,

“Shingo: your looking at History backwards from present time and your argument is hypothetical.”

If that’s the case, so ITW because he is insisting that Israel has been held to higher standards because Israel made the unfortunate mistake of perpetrating it’s crimes after the UN was created. 

“Actually this one is to easy Shingo ,you did hear of Uncle Joe and all it implied even between Allies.”

That would explain why Stalin is so revered today among the West right?

“This is were the discussion becomes interesting .First of all you’re looking at History backwards again and you’re trying to legitimize the invasion of Polska by the Germans by attempting to spin the question in reverse”

Not at all.  There was no legitimacy for the invasion of Poland, though strangely enough, Shen seems to believe it was an act of defence on Germany’s part. That was my very point.  Just because the concept of War Crimes and international law at the time, doesn’t mean those actions were legitimate, let alone morally sound.

I would argue that ITW’s position is a continuation of the mentality, because he has repeatedly defended Israel’s actions on the basis that other states did it, and got away with it, or that other states are doing it worse. 

This is absurd on multiple counts. No crime ceases to be a crime on the basis that a more extreme violation was perpetrated by another and most importantly, Israel has NEVER been held to account for it’s crimes anyway.  The fact that Israel flouts UN Resolutions and legal findings with such impunity should certainly dispel the myth that Israel is held to any standards at all.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, April 6, 2010 at 8:11 pm Link to this comment

You all miss the point: The Soviet Union AFTER THE WAR HAD ENDED, ethnically cleansed the Eastern third of Poland, and did the same to Germany, moving Poland Westward.  This is well-documented and not subject to reasonable dispute.

The United States and Europe did NOTHING to stop the displacement of millions, solely due to Stalin’s desire to expand the Soviet Union.  Nothing.
Had there been a UN the Security Council would have done nothing as the SU would have vetoed any action.  Nobody did ANYTHING and TO THIS DAY all of those millions are displaced.

Shingo you can pretend till the cows come home that this is irrelevant to the supposed forced eviction of Palestinians.  You can pretend that the world doing nothing about the Soviet actions is totally unrelated to the world condemning Israel, but it is, in fact, a textbook example of the double standard being applied.

If you continue to be irrational on this subject I cannot force you to be logical and won’t even try.

Besides this thread is about to go to Page 4 and I usually give up on threads after Page 2.

Report this

By radson, April 6, 2010 at 7:39 pm Link to this comment

Shingo

Quite true, but beside the point. Would the UN have condemned the Soviet actions, or at lest tried to?  You better believe it.
ITW is trying to make the case that Israel has been scrutinized like no other state, and he uses the argument that the Soviets were worse, which is not an argument at all.—-

————————————

Shingo: your looking at History backwards from present time and your argument is hypothetical.

Did the US condemn the actions of the Soviet Union at the time, or did they smother them with kisses as is the norm with Israel?——————————

————————————————

Actually this one is to easy Shingo ,you did hear of Uncle Joe and all it implied even between Allies.

I see, so by your logic, the German invasion of Poland was perfectly legitimate because the Nuremburg principals were not in existence at the time.  Fascinating.——————-

———————

This is were the discussion becomes interesting .First of all you’re looking at History backwards again and you’re trying to legitimize the invasion of Polska by the Germans by attempting to spin the question in reverse ,but

by whatever machination that you may have the question of culpability always goes back to the victors and their innocence in victory ,hence the continuation of the mentality .

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 7:15 pm Link to this comment

radson,
“Shingo I am sure that that you heard about Yalta ,the UN didn’t exist at the time!”

Quite true, but beside the point. Would the UN have condemned the Soviet actions, or at lest tried to?  You better believe it.

ITW is trying to make the case that Israel has been scrutinized like no other state, and he uses the argument that the Soviets were worse, which is not an argument at all.

Did the US condemn the actions of the Soviet Union at the time, or did they smother them with kisses as is the norm with Israel?

“This arguement is valid if one encompasses the Nuremburg Trials ,but then again it goes farther back in history.”

I see, so by your logic, the German invasion of Poland was perfectly legitimate because the Nuremburg principals were not in existence at the time.  Fascinating.

Carry on…

Report this

By radson, April 6, 2010 at 7:00 pm Link to this comment

Shingo—

Your comparison to the Soviet Union is fascinating and all, but I don;t recall anyone at the UN or Congress endorsing what the Soviet Union did or leveling the blame for their actions on the Poles or the Germans they occupied and displaced.—-

———-

Shingo I am sure that that you heard about Yalta ,the UN didn’t exist at the time!

Did I miss the white House statement that the Soviet Union had the right to defend themselves as they were doing this?  Did I miss the US and Great Britain vetoing UN resolutions calling for the Soviet Union to withdraw from these states?———

———

Once again Shingo your making a fool of yourself and as a matter of Fact ,I am very interestested in what the UN said ’ When it did not exist at the Time ‘

The argument is not whether displacement by victors has taken place elsewhere, but when and where were such actions not only excused, but applauded and endorsed.  Never before has this append, so if there is a double satndards, it is the gratuitous latitude and leniency that Israel have enjoyed.———————————————

————————

This arguement is valid if one encompasses the Nuremburg Trials ,but then again it goes farther back in history.

Shingo : Get your history on Polska straight ,you seem to have acquired an uneducated point of view on the matter ,I could recommend further reading if it interests you and as far as peace in the P/I conflict is concerned ,nothing is impossible.

I f you have any doubts go to Larry’s store and buy a fifth .

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 6:53 pm Link to this comment

Another picture of delightful Neo Nazis proudly waving the Israeli flag:

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2009/09/05/article-1211414-064DD132000005DC-417_636x525.jpg\

Hey LSL, is the guy on the right looking to camera you?  I think it might be time you gave up the Liquor Larry.

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 6:15 pm Link to this comment

“Aint nothin’ quite so entertainin’ as a good ol fashioned Nazi circle jerk and this is apparently the place to find it.”

There’s plenty of places to find it Nazis circle jerking.  Just look for an Israeli flag.
http://mikaeltossavainen.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/confussion1.jpg

German neo-Nazis: We’re pro-Israel, condemn anti-Semitism
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/990228.html

Neo-Nazis for Israel
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3551269,00.html

And how appropriate that the neo Nais for Israel, also happen to be anti Semites and Holocaust deniers?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/max-blumenthal/neo-nazis-for-israel_b_156497.html

There was a time when it was believed that Nazis and Israel made strange bed fellows, but the reality is that there has been very little daylight between them all along:
51 Documents:
Zionist Collaboration with the Nazis
http://www.counterpunch.org/brenner1223.html

You stepped right into your own excrement LSL (yet again).

otta watch that.

Report this
PatrickHenry's avatar

By PatrickHenry, April 6, 2010 at 6:08 pm Link to this comment

In case you missed the anti-Semite Homer Simpson in Israel.

http://www.gilad.co.uk/writings/simpsons-in-israhell-check-it-out-before-it-is-taken-down.html#entry7226640

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 6:05 pm Link to this comment

Shenonymous,

“Just to even things up a little since Shingo feels a reprint is appropriate (resorting to copy/pasting) okie doakie.”

Actually Shen,your husband LSL began this insidious tangent with his little youtube clip here:

Liquor Store Larry, April 6 at 6:42 pm #

The point is that it is all too easy to demonize an entire religion, whether it be Christianity, Islam or Judaism.

Your post missed the boat, but try and keep up.

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 5:41 pm Link to this comment

Inherit The Wind,

Your comparison to the Soviet Union is fascinating and all, but I don;t recall anyone at the UN or Congress endorsing what the Soviet Union did or leveling the blame for their actions on the Poles or the Germans they occupied and displaced.

Did I miss the white House statement that the Soviet Union had the right to defend themselves as they were doing this?  Did I miss the US and Great Britain vetoing UN resolutions calling for the Soviet Union to withdraw from these states?

The argument is not whether displacement by victors has taken place elsewhere, but when and where were such actions not only excused, but applauded and endorsed.  Never before has this append, so if there is a double satndards, it is the gratuitous latitude and leniency that Israel have enjoyed.

“You have actively said it’s impossible for Israel to make peace with the Palestinians.”

False and you will not find any such statement from me to that effect.  I have stated that Israeli policy opposes peace with the Palestinians.  That’s not to suggest it is impossible by any means.

Nor have I said Israel has NO legitimacy at all, just no legitimacy under the sates quo.  How can it be legitimate, when it refuses to accept the internationally recognized borders?

“then there is NO ALTERNATIVE in your argument to Israel’s destruction”

You’re projecting again, unless what you are saying is that a return to the 1967 borders and the dismantling of the settlements, and the cessation of expansion constitutes Israel’s destruction.  Is giving up the occupation an act of suicide on Israel’s part ITW?

I think things are getting heated ITW, and it clouding your thinking.

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 5:28 pm Link to this comment

part 1 of 2

I am surprised that you are only suspicious about Hamas, amd not Fatah, when Fatanh are Arafat’s old gang.

You either heard what you wanted to hear or are lying.  Both Fatah and Hamas agreed that dialogue was the first and best option but that military options should not be discounted.  Explain to me how this is any different to the US declaring that all options are on the table with regard to Iran, or Israel warning repeatedly of the inevitability of war in Lebanon and Gaza?  Your double standards are so blatant that you cannot even fathom them.

Israel would not exist today were it not for the use of violence to achieve it’s aims.  I know you love the Old Testament Shen, but The King David Hotel bombing and the Deir Yassin massacre were not acts of God.

“They see both groups as willing to use violence to gain their objective which is the destruction of Israel.”

Please list the time code (minutes : seconds) in the clip, at which point either party mentioned anything about the destruction of Israel. 

“The college kids want to step into the 21st century not remain in the Middle Ages.  If the Arabs work real hard, they might make it to the 18th century within another half century.”

No one in the audience accused either party of holding back progress for Palestinians.  No society functions very well under occupation, especially when the occupier is bombing factories, homes and infrastructure, forcing workers to wait all day to pass through check points,  and limiting exports to 10% of output.

“For a debate to be possible, there must be an agreement about what determines the truth of an assertion, not verbal bashing.”

Truth is based on facts and Goot’s article was full lies as Israel’s own records prove.  There were not hundreds of rockets fired before the Gaza war, but 19. Israel’s own MFA report states that not only were none fired by Hamas, but Hamas were very careful to observe the ceasefire and arrest the militants that were refusing to comply.

The Fatah spokesman stated that Hamas have not fired any rockets since the Gaza attack.

“Please state what things have changed.”

Is that a serious question Shen?  You are such a confused sole.  On one hand, you accept that the I/P conflict has been about territory and then in others, you revert to arguing that it is a religious war.

As for events that have taken place since 1968, evidently you have a lot of reading to do, but here’s a few major points to get you going:

1.Israel began building settlements in the occupied territories
2.Israel helped fund and create Hamas, to offset the influence of the PLO – a policy that went horribly wrong
3.Israel invaded and occupied Lebanon repeatedly.
4.Israel almost lost the 1973 war, but escaped thanks to arms shipped by Nixon
5.Israel entered into a treaty with Egypt
6.Israel began building nukes
7.It has since been revealed that Nasser was no threat to Israel and Disraeli knew it, but attacked anyway, because they had been itching to lure Nasser into a war since 1956.

“If the Palestinian rockets can’t hit the broad side of any Israeli barn, why do they keep firing them?”

You never did answer my earlier question as to whom the Islamists are Shen.  Because as the Fatah member sated during the debate, Hamas are not firing any rockets.

“If Israel is not paradise what does the Arab world want with it?”

The Arab world does not want it, Palestinians want it.
“If it is such a lousy place, why would it be desirable for the Palestinians?”

Because as Ben Gurion observed, it is their home and has been for many centuries, unlike the majority of Israeli’s who are immigrants or first generation Israelis who would ratehr Israle be part of Europe than the Middle East.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, April 6, 2010 at 5:26 pm Link to this comment

Shingo,
Had you actually READ Hoffer’s article you would have seen that other nations victorious in war displaced MILLIONS with not a word said.  The displacement of MILLIONS of Poles and Germans by the Soviet Union took place in the aftermath of WWII. Since the War ended in 1945 and Israel was founded in 1948, that means the Russians were moving far, FAR more than the 700,000 Palestinians—and the Russians did it less than 3 years earlier.

Of course, the Russians were great “humanitarians” when it came it Palestine, but far worse to Poles and Germans—and Poles weren’t even on the German side—they were the first victim of Hitler’s War.  Of course, not word was ever said in condemnation of the Soviet Union.

Hoffer cited numerous other cases of similar displacements by the victors, and EXPLICITLY noted that ONLY Israel is told “Give it back if you want peace”.

THAT is your double standard.

You have actively said it’s impossible for Israel to make peace with the Palestinians. You no longer qualify it by saying “Unless they elect another Rabin and back him” (but you always added that was impossible).  So….if it’s impossible for there to be peace with Israel, and Israel is, according to YOU a rogue state, a criminal state, with NO legitimacy at all, then there is NO ALTERNATIVE in your argument to Israel’s destruction.  And, since Israel won’t commit suicide, logic leads to the conclusion that Israel must be destroyed.

It is the only conclusion that can be reached from your recent arguments.

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 5:21 pm Link to this comment

Part 2 of 2

As for Israel itself, the situation is rather grim.  A significant number of Israelis have moved abroad and many others would leave if they could. There are somewhere between 700,000 and 1 million Israeli Jews living outside the country, many of whom are unlikely to return. Since 2007, emigration has been outpacing immigration in Israel. According to scholars John Mueller and Ian Lustick, “a recent survey indicates that only 69 percent of Jewish Israelis say they want to stay in the country, and a 2007 poll finds that one-quarter of Israelis are considering leaving, including almost half of all young people.” They report, “in another survey, 44 percent of Israelis say they would be ready to leave if they could find a better standard of living elsewhere,” and “over 100,000 Israelis have acquired European passports.” These figures are a bad omen for Israel.

“Well maybe Israel is not the wasteland Shingo would like everyone to think.”

Maybe, once it ceases it be an apartheid, militaristic state and becomes a pluralistic and tolerant democracy.
“Oren was right, of course.  Israel is the USA’s only ally in the Middle East that can be counted on.”

False on all counts.

Israel is not now nor has Israel ever been a US ally. No alliance treaty exists between Israel & the US.
Not a fact that AIPAC broadcasts, neither the MSM ... but in ‘67, after the 6 Day War & the Israeli seizure of Palestinian lands, LBJ offered Israel an alliance treaty. Israel refused, because all alliance treaties have, inter al, 2 requirements: that all signatory nations state clearly & precisely where their national borders lay; and that any signatory initiating military actions against a non-signatory must inform in advance all the other signatories to the alliance treaty.

Israel has always refused to accept these 2 standard requirements of any alliance.

Secondly, the US has never been able to count on Israel.  Barak Obama stated in Cairo that the Israeli settlements compromise US national security.

As Patreaus and the Pentagon know, Israel is a major impediment to US policy.

Report this
Shenonymous's avatar

By Shenonymous, April 6, 2010 at 4:41 pm Link to this comment

Just to even things up a little since Shingo feels a reprint is appropriate
(resorting to copy/pasting) okie doakie.  The practices of ancient Jews
has been brought up again.  It was posted by one of Shingo’s staffers,
omop, March 23 at 8:43pm.  It is only fair, to post my reply, March 24
at 5:50am, and here is also reprinted:
_______?
While there are more referencing the heinous treatment of females,
here is one from the Qu’ran about prepubescent girls. 

Qu’ran 65:4 - Mature men are allowed to marry prepubescent girls
Maududi, vol. 5, p. 620, note 13 - Therefore, making mention of the
waiting—period for girls who have not yet menstruated, clearly proves
that it is not only permissible to give away the girl at this age but it is
permissible for the husband to consummate marriage with her. Now,
obviously no Muslim has the right to forbid a thing, which the Qur’an
has held as permissible.

Obviously.  To divorce prepubescent girls implies there was a marriage
to them. So the fathers of prepubescent girls may give them away, and
their new husbands may consummate their marriage with them. If Islam
ever spread around the world, no one should be surprised if Qur’an-
fundamentalist-believing Muslims lowered the marriage age of girls to
nine years old.  Do you suppose this idea was borrowed from the Bible?

Thank you anyway, Shingo, for giving me an opportunity to
demonstrate once again the horrors women have faced for millennia,
and from putatively religious men.  We are much obliged.

Shall we repeat our earlier discussion of violence against women?

Report this
PatrickHenry's avatar

By PatrickHenry, April 6, 2010 at 4:01 pm Link to this comment

Leefeller, your right, I am bigoted against arrogant zionists as yourself who wish claim an exclusive state against the will of the inhabitants.  Israel is just another retake of South Africa, but with U.S. government support.

The majority of American citizens I know are against any frivolous waste of taxpayer money and aid to eretz-Israel tops the list.

Aside from your obvious toe fetish, you should reflect on what your philosopher god Hoffer states about racist fanatics as yourself.

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 3:58 pm Link to this comment

Hey LSL,

I didn’t want to play this game, but seeing as you need further proof that religion and
depravity are synonymous. These past few weeks have revealed, yet again, the sexual
exploitation within the Catholic church. Of course, there’s these snippets to
demonstrate it’s not just Muslims and Catholics having all the fun.


  Sanhedrin 54b. A Jew may have sex with a child as long as the child is less
than nine years old.

  Sanhedrin 55b. A Jew may marry a three year old girl (specifically, three years
“and a day” old).

Report this
Shenonymous's avatar

By Shenonymous, April 6, 2010 at 3:47 pm Link to this comment

Shin says - I though of a new mantra for you. Sticks and stone may
break your bones, but facts will never way you.

Shen says - A new edit, Shingo.  But your ‘facts’ will never sway
me.

I admit to being suspicious about Hamas, not Fatah.  But then I was
surprised Fatah still had any substantial standing except in the
government echelons.  They aren’t in the news much.  But on the
debate they capitulated to the call for violence by Hamas. The resort to
violence is proof they do not have the intellect to convince the world
they have justification to destroy Israel.  The college crowd don’t like
either Fatah or Hamas.  I heard them.  Call them what you want they
are the voices we, the rest of the world, heard.  They see both groups
as willing to use violence to gain their objective which is the
destruction of Israel.  The college kids want to step into the 21st
century not remain in the Middle Ages.  If the Arabs work real hard,
they might make it to the 18th century within another half century.

You are an idiot, Shingo, who has not much to say that is convincing
and only resorts to name calling.  You are not a good face for the
Islamists no matter how many names you call me.  And you have a
pervert’s preoccupation with sex.  It regularly seeps out. 

There is no debate here, Inherit The Wind. For a debate to be possible,
there must be an agreement about what determines the truth of an
assertion, not verbal bashing.  That is exactly what the Hamas speaker
on the very right end of that debate did.  I don’t recall his name and for
that I apologize.  I will revisit the “debate” and repost it later.  When
blind passion enters into any alleged talk, it defaults to rants, and
everyone knows rants are smelly wind eggs.  Frankly, at this point, I
couldn’t care less what Shingo says.  If you sum totaled all of his posts
and weeded out the nonsensical vile and infantile name-calling, there is
very little left except defensive Islamist apologetics or raging tirades.
Yes, I’ve heard that the best defense is a vulgar offense.  I’ve had to
fend that off since my very first post on this forum.  Like who the hell
does he think he is and why ought anyone think he has any piece of
the truth?  His staff?

The article described the world in 1968, as Shingo notes, and many
things have changed.
  Please state what things have changed.  I
guess I will now have to start quoting the book to illustrate that not
much has changed in the dynamics called Israel and Islam.

One thing has not: Israel is held to a standard other nations are not
held to under international law.  Hamas and Hezbollah and even Fatah
do not seem to be held to EITHER standard.
  I would appreciate it if
it would be described what EITHER standards are being discussed here?

If the Palestinian rockets can’t hit the broad side of any Israeli barn,
why do they keep firing them?  If Israel is not paradise what does the
Arab world want with it?  If it is such a lousy place, why would it be
desirable for the Palestinians?  Oh, I know, because the Palestinians are
low men on the Arab totem pole.  They can have the dregs of the
Middle East, just so Israel is out of there.  Well maybe Israel is not the
wasteland Shingo would like everyone to think.

Oren was right, of course.  Israel is the USA’s only ally in the Middle
East that can be counted on.

Report this
Liquor Store Larry's avatar

By Liquor Store Larry, April 6, 2010 at 3:46 pm Link to this comment

Aint nothin’ quite so entertainin’ as a good ol fashioned Nazi circle jerk and this is apparently the place to find it.

When Hedges spews, the Nazis dance!

Report this
Liquor Store Larry's avatar

By Liquor Store Larry, April 6, 2010 at 3:42 pm Link to this comment

Leefeller - Touche’

LMAO @ “Shingles”

Close personal friend of
Shingles -> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B82yt3rCMdk

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, April 6, 2010 at 3:30 pm Link to this comment

Larry,

Since Patrick Henry has been posting on TD much
longer then Shingles, I feel eminently more
qualified to comment on Patrick Henry instead of
Shingles simply put, Patrick Henry is a textbook
clear cut bigot, until recently I had my doubts
about Shingles.

One could never sell Shingles short, though I would
prefer too! I reserve my opinion on Shingles, after
all he is kind of like the new kid on the block.
Plus the simple fact if I agreed with you, that
would mean in all fairness I should have been
subjecting myself to reading his very long blowhard
windy wordy touchy feeley posts, who has this much
time on their hands? 

Plus, I am getting ready to get my toe nails trimmed
which means I have to take off my Zionist Nazi Jack
Boots, a major feet and takes several days. 

Larry, your analysis of Shingles does provide some
food for thought and causes me to question my
assessment as to whom may be the most stupid poster
on this thread, I can only take your comments as
fact. as Shingles comments are always facts, one
only need ask him. Though, I have not read all of
Shingles posts only because I have an aversion
forging past his greeting obnoxious insults, a most
well known Shingles trade mark.

One more thing, I have always believed it is not
polite to talk about others while they are in the
room, but I will not let that stop me from doing it.

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 3:15 pm Link to this comment

Inherit The Wind,

You have this unfortunate habit of attributing the desire to see Israel’s destruction, whether or not it is declared or even implied.  Please explain where and how I demanded it, let alone endorsed it?

“One thing has not: Israel is held to a standard other nations are not held to under international law.”
How so?  What other country has been allowed to maintain the nuclear ambiguity policy?

What other country receives so much aid, military and diplomatic support from the US, and still spits in the face of it’s benefactor?

What other country has flouted 10% of the UN resolutions that Israel flouts?

What other country is in violation of the 4th Geneva Conventions on human rights and is not held to account?
What other country routinely massacres defenceless populations, but received 90% endorsement by the Congress for whatever it does?

You are right in a way ITW.  Israel is indeed held to a standard other nations are not held to under international law.  It’ happens to be unlike any other nation because unlike any other nation, it is allowed to get away with murder and still claim to be a light unto the nations.
Hamas, Hezbollah and Fatah have committed war crimes yes, but since when has Israel ever been held to account for it’s war crimes, especially given that they are orders of magnitude greater than anything perpetrated by the above?  Let’s talk about Hamas, Hezbollah and Fatah war crimes when and if Israel is made to face justice.

Shenonymous’s recent posts, as was the case with her earlier ones, have been nothing more than racist and poorly informed diatribes that wreak of double standards, hypocrisy and selective morality.  I guess I could agree with her on some points, but it would be like asking me to have sex with another men.  I could theoretically do it if I was extremely drunk and you paid me a hell of a lot of money.

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 2:58 pm Link to this comment

Poor Liquor Store Larry, is still clinging to his fantasies, oblivious to the fact that his Hasbra talking points lie prostrate in this day of readily available information.

As Gilad Atzimon pointed out, the last war that Israel won was 1967, and since then, Hezbollah handed them their asses on 2 occasions.  That aside,  Israel still hangs on to East Jerusalem, the West Bank and the Golan Heights.
LSL exemplifies not only the thuggery and racism of Israel, but lied and hypocrisy. If Israel is so appalled at the idea do becoming a member of the club reserved for savages and barbarians, then you’d think they’d stop whining about how they are not recognized.

LSL really has nothing left.  He’s blown his wad, his talking points are shot to pieces and all he can do now is sit in the corner and hurl his own faeces at those who don’t buy his diatribes.

The gloves are off and LSL has no pretensions about showing us exactly what he is. The reality is that he knows we’re right.  After all, if Israel was such a paradise and if he really believed in what it represented, he’d be living there, not in the US, where the goy are there to keep him safe and sound.

Report this
PatrickHenry's avatar

By PatrickHenry, April 6, 2010 at 2:53 pm Link to this comment

Leefeller, I have little use for philosophers
like Hoffer who come up with crap like “But I hang onto my prejudices, they are the testicles of my mind”.

He is but one step above Ann Rynd.

Being the turd herder that you are, I sense you do need a distraction from your daily rooter action.

Report this

By omop, April 6, 2010 at 2:39 pm Link to this comment

ATTENTION ALL ZIONISTS, ANTISEMITICS AND FELLOW TRAVELLERS.

The time has come to be extra nice to THE ITW’S, GORYM’S, DRUNKEN LARRY’S
AND ALL THEIR DUAL CITIZEN BUDDIES CAUSE WE HAVE BEEN WARNED BY NO
LESS THAN THE ISRAELI GOVERNMENT THAT THE “iDF “protects AMERICA AND
ITS ARMIES.

According to the Israeli Ambassdor to the USA on CNN.last Sunday.Michael
Oren said that the relations between the US and Israel were protecting the lives
of American soldiers serving abroad, as Israel supplies Washington with [spies
with several passports including American and US donated equipment like
missiles, cluster bombs and the like necessary for the wellbeing of US soldiers.

Oren was responding to a statement to Congress made by the commander of
the US Central Command, General David Patraeus, who spoke about the Arab
nations’ response to the close ties between the two countries.

Speaking in an interview with CNN, Oren said that if Israel did not exist,
extremists in the region would join Al-Qaeda in its anti-American sentiment.
“The US is much safer thanks to Israeli-American cooperation,” he said.

The ambassador said Israel supplies the US with intelligence and equipment its
troops use to fight terrorists.

He defined the countries’ relationship as “excellent”. Oren also accused the
Palestinians of being unwilling to enter into negotiations and added that Prime
Minister Benjamin Netanyahu did something no prime minister had done before
him by freezing construction in all settlements for ten months.

So its finally out in the open. If it were not for the Israelis and their US
equipment and their spies the 50 states would have already been overrun by
the barefooted cave dwellers of Afghanistan. And Gen. Petraeus would have to
eat his infamous quote, “Israelis live high while American GIs die”.

Its time therefore to send extra billions as well as cluster bombs so that the
85,000 US military in iraq and the 135,000 US military in Afghanistan keep
being protected by our only democratic ally in the world.

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, April 6, 2010 at 2:17 pm Link to this comment

Patrick Henry,

Leefeller, “I had to read Hoffers dogmatic insight
in English lit, it’s not for me.”.

Obviously Patrick Henry, comprehension was not part
of the course? So when you turned in your profound
two page book Report, using all of two words one on
each page .... “Zionist and Twit” did you graduate
with valedictory honors?

Report this
Liquor Store Larry's avatar

By Liquor Store Larry, April 6, 2010 at 2:08 pm Link to this comment

Leefeller - While I thoroughly empathize with your view of Patrick Henry, are you sure you are not selling “Shingo” short in calling PH “the stupidest moron on TD”?

Consider Shingo’s many comments, one of the rare jewells of which is the unforgettable:

“the Arab world has presented Israel with a golden offer.  They have not only offered to recognize Israel (as per the 1967 borders), but offered to normalize relations with Israel and include Israel into the community of Arab states”

WOW - is this their lucky day or what? Fugging Mazeltov! They can pretend they did not kick the Arabs asses around the block, give everything they won to the losers and best of all, become a member of a club reserved for savages and barbarians who believe it is OK to pleasure themselves between their daughters legs as long as they don’t penetrate, allow strangers to beat their woman senseless if they show their ankles and force them to wear garb that covers their face because to these animals the mouth is just another sex organ”.  Oh happy day.

Ya gotta love a guy (Shingo) who is trying to sell us that the Jews don’t know a good deal when they see it but the Arabs who would literally eat each other for lack of living skills if they did not have oil, which by the way we have to show them how to remove from the ground, were only kidding when they said they “wanted to drive every Jew into the sea” and are really extending olive branches. No, personally I think Shingo is the biggest moron and PH is in the second position. I wonder if there is a lightness to being that empty headed? If ignorance is bliss, Shingo has acquired Nirvana!

Report this
PatrickHenry's avatar

By PatrickHenry, April 6, 2010 at 1:47 pm Link to this comment

Leefeller, I had to read Hoffers dogmatic insight in English lit, it’s not for me.

Being from the ardent cadre of zionist fruitloops I can see where it all comes together for you reading his work.

President Ray-gun gave him a medal, nuff said.

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, April 6, 2010 at 8:15 am Link to this comment

An Imbecile of a new order, please except my apologies,
I am texting this and on holiday!

When I observe an imbecile who without failure proves
beyond a unreasonable doubt they are an imbecile of
extraordinary proportions, one can only conclude they
are an imbecile.

Patrick Henry’s comment about Eric Hoffer; calling
Hoffer a “Zionist Twit”; is beyond a doubt the most
imbecilic statement ever stated on this thread and in
the history of human evolution.  Patrick Henry has
clearly developed a new lower order and degree of
unthinking imbecilic ranting, it is recommended one
should remove Patrick Henry from moron status and strip
away his…... “Morons are Us card”.
~

Though I usually do not like to promote insults on these
sacred TD threads, let me remove my politeness, for I
must take exception here.

Patrick Henry you are without any doubt the stupidest
moron on TD and one with unexceptional abilities, even
dragging down the word stupid to a new low level. So, it
is recommend after this; to remove idiot from the word
imbecile for imbecile defined; is a stupid idiot.  We
need to create a new word in Patrick Henry’s case. 
Maybe, if possible when any other Imbecile achieves the
Patrick Henry level of stupidity, one could refer to
them as Patrick Henry or maybe we others have some
innovative ideas?

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, April 6, 2010 at 5:53 am Link to this comment

This thread has gone so toxic that nobody is debating the inferences from facts.

Shingo has lost his perspective, demanding Israel’s destruction (a change for him) and LSL promotes racist stereotypes about Palestinians that are flatly wrong. And they are not “animals”. 

The ONE thing LSL noted of value, and that Shingo correctly found the flaw in, is Hoffer’s 1968 article.  The article described the world in 1968, as Shingo notes, and many things have changed.

One thing has not: Israel is held to a standard other nations are not held to under international law.  Hamas and Hezbollah and even Fatah do not seem to be held to EITHER standard.

Despite Shingo’s diatribes against her, Shenonymous’s recent posts are extremely thoughtful and, IF Shingo could put aside his hatred of her, he might find significant parts he could agree with.

If…...

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 3:58 am Link to this comment

Shen,

I though of a new mantra for you. Sticks and stone may break your bones, but facts will never way you.

Your mind was already made up about what Fatah and Hams before you even watched the Doha debate.  You see, no mention was made by wither party of destroying Israel, only resistance to occupation, but in the mind of a backward and anti intellectual bigot like yourself, Palestinians have no rights to resist occupation and any suggestion of military action or resistance is unacceptable – at least when people with brown faces are discussing it.

You are without doubt, one of the most poorly educated, ignorant, anti intellectual, small minded and pathetic people I have ever come across. You represent the very worst of what America has become,.  A Sarh Palin wanna be who thinks that knowledge comes from attending PTA meetings and a the odd Google or Wikipedia search.

You have demonstrated that you have no comprehension or knowledge about the 1967 war, the founding of Israel the 2006 Lebanon war, the Israeli occupation of Lebanon, much less any concept of economics.

For example, let’s take this mind numbing observation:
“It is truly amazing that this tiny little country has almost the entire Arab population all out to rid it from the Middle East (well there are some Arab Muslims who are not).”

Yet, if you had any education or awareness of world affairs, you would know that the Arab world has presented Israel with a golden offer.  They have not only offered to recognize Israel (as per the 1967 borders), but offered to normalize relations with Israel and include Israel into the community of Arab states.  Israel have rejected the offer every year, because it means giving up the land it stole and even more importantly, it means having to treat Arabs as equals.

Let’s look at your next mind boggling and reality free statement:

“A microcosm of this is seen in the conflict between Israel and the militants in the Palestinian territories but is continually seen in the now long history of suicide bombings that keep killing innocent people.”

You see Shen, if you have any grip ion reality and any grasp of current affairs, you would realise that suicide attacks stopped in 2006 and did so when Hamas decreed an end to suicide attacks.  Liek LSL, you live is a fact and reality free world, where you simple sift through rubble to find the one piece of garbage that affirmed your bigotry, your hatred of humanity and your vile and inherent racism.

It comes as no surprise that you find kinship with LSL, one of the most vile, hate filled racist posters this forum has ever seen.  I’m sure LSL reminds you of your own husband.

You have never been to the Middle East have you Shen?  I doubt you’ve even let the country or have a passport, so how would you possibly know how it really is?  All you’ve ever known is your white society, your white neighbourhood.

You try so very desperately to sound intelligent and relevant and try to hard to prove you have something to say, but you are just a sad and insignificant little person who’s only sense of power comes from expressing her bigotry and hatred of the world she can’t possibly comprehend.

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 3:36 am Link to this comment

Part 1 of 2

The Geneva Convention on War crimes stipulates that the greatest war crime of all is a war of unprovoked aggression.  It differs from all other war crimes by the mere fact that it encompasses all the war crimes that follow. Israel’s decision to launch and unprovoked attack against Gaza constitutes such a crime.

The Goldstone Report accused both Hamas and Israel of war crimes.  It just so happened that the scale and severity of Israel’s war crimes were an order of magnitude greater. 

Having spent quite bit on time in Australia, I am all too familiar with the Murdoch tabloid known as the The Austraian and Robert Goot is among it’s chief right wing propagandists.

Israel has not only failed to investigate any of the accusation levelled against it by the
Goldstone Report, but completely rejected it’s findings. Israel had the opportunity to participate in the Goldstone investigations and refused, yet, when the findings were published, it expressed outrage that the report was biased.

Israel went to such extremes that it even threatened Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas that if he didn’t defer on endorsing the Goldstone Reports, that Israel would turn the West Bank into a “second Gaza.”
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1143038.html

Israel has since been targeting NGO’s and human rights groups to silence them. 

Goot is lying of course.  The Goldstone Report did indeed cover the rockets fired during the Gaza massacre. Of course, the fact remains that Hamas fired no rockets until Israel violated the ceasefire on November 4th, 2008.  Israel’s own statistics show that Hamas fired NO rockets at Israeli citizens prior to the Gaza war and thus, the justification that Israel was defending its citizens is false on all counts.

Goot should know this, but his track record as an investigative reported is a joke.

Goldstone has not denounced any one sided mandate, because he himself would never have accepted such a mandate.
Goldstone has not been deceived on any level.

The UNHRC did not receive support from it’s western contingent, because the governments of these countries has been co-opted and corrupted by Israeli lobbies and because states like the US, Great Britain and France risk being implicated for their appalling human rights track records. 

Goot shows himself to be a classic Israeli propagandist.  He cites as evidence, video footage taken by Israeli forces during the Gaza operation which Israel claims shows Hamas gunmen using civilians as human shields. Of course, Israel have themselves to blame having banned all foreign journalists form entering Gaza during operations,  in direct violation of their own Supreme Court.

As for claiming that Hamas deliberately concentrated their forces in civilian areas, this too is hugely absurd, given that Gaza is the world’s most populous region.  Goot is used to preaching to a dumber down readership who are ignorant of this matter.

Of course, it is Israel that have themselves to blame, having made similar accusations during eh 22006 war with Hezbollah when they were unable to control and censored the media.  All fo Israel’s accusations about human shields and Hezbollah fighting in civilian areas were subsequently debunked.

Amnesty and HRW Claims Discredited in Detailed Report
http://www.ngo-monitor.org/article

/amnesty_and_hrw_claims_discredited_in_detailed_report
Human Rights Watch: Troubling Report

http://www.nysun.com/opinion/human-rights-watch-troubling-report/46037/

Israeli ‘human shield’ claim is full of holes

http://www.thenational.ae/article/20090113/FOREIGN/591536290/1002

Ironically, Israeli soldiers later admitted that it was they who were using human shields.

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1246443696703&pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull

Report this

By Shingo, April 6, 2010 at 3:35 am Link to this comment

Part 2 of 2

IDF soldier: We used Gazans as human shields / Amos Harel
http://www.shovrimshtika.org/oferet/press_item_e.asp?id=8

There was no mandate given to Goldstone that Goldstone rejected. 
Little
wonder that Goldstone complained bitterly to the Swiss paper Le
Temps that the recent UNHRC resolution “saddens me; there is not a
single phrase condemning Hamas as we have done in the report. I hope
the council can modify the text.” Modifications were subsequently
made, but there was still no mention of Hamas.”
Source:  http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/opinion/a-blind-eye-
to-hamas-atrocities/story-e6frg6zo-1225794831291
“Don’t miss the picture of the man, from Thailand, killed by a rocket fired from Gaza.”
As opposed to the dozen Palestinians Israel has murdered since then, let alone the 13 air strikes Israel has conducted in Gaza in the past week.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8600285.stm
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6304JQ20100401
Yesterday’s headline reported in The Jerusalem
Post at http://www.jpost.com/Israel/Article.aspx?id=172485
reads Palestinians to halt rocket attacks by Khaled Abu Toameh
and Herb Keinon.  This decision is applauded as it is it could be a basis
for possible dialogue between the principles of this conflict.  However,
it also reveals that Palestinian ‘factions” have been launching rocket
attacks against Israel. 
“Part of that headline also said Kassam hits Negev, causing no harm.  So a rocket was launched after The Islamists said they would stop firing the rockets.”
Who are the Islamists Shen?  Ignorant and anti intellectual bigots like yourself will complain ad nauseam that Hamas aren’t doing enough to stop the rocket attacks and when they do take the law into their hands, you cry foul at Hamas that they are being to heavy handed.
Based on your bigoted and anti intellectual rationale, it would be fair to say that the b\Baruch Goldstein massacre was the fault of the Israeli government for not preventing it.
Is there some disingenuousness going on here Shen?  Oh Yeah.

Report this
Shenonymous's avatar

By Shenonymous, April 6, 2010 at 2:49 am Link to this comment

And Gertrude Stein, that great Jewish lady of letters said, “A rose is a
rose is a rose.”  The distinction of calling a people what they want to be
called is sort of important. Pigs do not want to be called goats.  Just ask
Leefeller!  Goats or pigs, what the hell difference does it make, my god,
they are all animals, right? 

After watching the Fatah and Hamas debate the other day there is only
one conclusion.  The Arabs continue in their sole intention to destroy
Israel and will continue their violent and militant attack to serve that
purpose.  The horde of moonbats on this forum are proof of that.  A
moonbat epithet refers to radical leftist and is the equivalent of the
wingnut used against radical rightists.  And the lexicon of name-calling
is the resort of the ones who are really the desperate ones.  They have
no other ammunition in a verbal battle.  Funny thing on the way to
being a radical leftist with respect to the Middle East, Israel and the
Palestinian territories in particular, the radical leftist Islamists
transmute into radical rightists!  Strange how that happens.  It happens
because the essence of fanaticism does not really care about real
fundamentalism where the original motive of a religion is really
practiced but gets forgotten in the passion of the need for political
dominance. 

There is only one way to see the whole picture in one frame.  If you
dare, look at a map of the Eastern Hemisphere. 
take a look at this map:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Jewish_distribution.png
then take a look at this one:

http://www.mideastweb.org/arabinvasionmap.htm
then this one
http://www.mideastweb.org/maps.htm
There are several re-mapping links listed under the shown map.

Then look at the size of Israel and the size of the Arab world.  It is
truly amazing that this tiny little country has almost the entire Arab
population all out to rid it from the Middle East (well there are some
Arab Muslims who are not).
http://formermuslimsunited.americancommunityexchange.org/
http://arabsforisrael.blogspot.com/2009/02/2who-are-we_09.html
But here, in a democratic spirit, here is a treat for the Islamists:
http://www.jews-for-allah.org/
Have fun with that one!
In a word, nationalism, is what describes the intention of the Arab
world.  The long essays on this forum show the claim of an increase of
nationalism and the practice of the Muslim religion as decreasing.  The
religion is being used to further the aims of the Islamist hierarchy. A
microcosm of this is seen in the conflict between Israel and the
militants in the Palestinian territories but is continually seen in the now
long history of suicide bombings that keep killing innocent people. 

Liquor Store Larry is a Jew.  The rest of you are Islamists or Islamist
apologists or sympathizers.  It is comparably proportional to the
Israel/Arab conflict,  just an observation.  LSL tells it as he sees it and
the Islamists despise his truth. But they do not disprove his truth.

Report this
Shenonymous's avatar

By Shenonymous, April 6, 2010 at 2:48 am Link to this comment

It is often said that Truth is in the eye of the beholder.  Oh, maybe that
was beauty? Naw, it was Truth for Truth is the measure by which all the
other ideals are measured.  Beauty, the Good, and all the virtues that
are engendered by these three are judged by the degree of truth they
display.  For without truth, beauty can deceive, without truth, the good
is oft interred with the bones of the good who die from self-righteous
lies.  Truth is timeless.  Truths understood 3000 years ago are just as
true today.  Only the ignorant cannot see that.  The inability to read
and understand the importance of what is said by an enlightened
thinker such as was Eric Hoffer, is a misfortune.  Eric Hoffer would
laugh himself silly at your calling him a twit, PatrickHenry.  Funny how
much you fit the description in his classic, True Believer, to a T of the
self-delusional fanatic. 

In November 2009 Robert Goot of The Austraian.com newspaper asked
the same question I ask now. 
Has Hamas been investigated to any conclusion about the accusation of
found in the Goldstone Report?  The answer is No.  It is interesting how
the Goldstone Report may be used to show Israel’s culpability but the
part where it calls for investigation of Hamas is given an Alzheimer’s
moment.

“THE UN Security Council is tonight debating the Goldstone report. Yet
from the moment the UN Human Rights Council decided to establish a
“fact finding” mission “to investigate all violations of international
human rights law and international humanitarian law by the occupying
power, Israel, against the Palestinian people throughout the Occupied
Palestinian Territory, particularly in the occupied Gaza Strip, due to the
current aggression”, it was obvious that it was not intended to, nor
would it be an impartial inquiry.

The terms of reference were crafted to ignore the hundreds of rockets
deliberately aimed and fired by Hamas at civilians in Israel prior to the
Gaza war, and to pillory Israel for defending its citizens.

Even the head of the mission, Richard Goldstone, has since denounced
what he called a “one-sided mandate” that was “stacked against Israel”.
He was so repelled by the bias that he only accepted his appointment
on the basis of a verbal assurance by the president of the UNHRC that
the mission would also be empowered to investigate violations of
international law committed by Hamas during the Gaza conflict.

Report this
Shenonymous's avatar

By Shenonymous, April 6, 2010 at 2:47 am Link to this comment

It is now clear that in accepting this assurance Goldstone allowed
himself to be deceived. On October 16, 2009, when the UNHRC
resolved, without the support of a single western democracy from
among its 47 members, to refer the matter to the UN Security Council,
the text of the resolution was directed exclusively at Israel and made
no mention whatsoever of Hamas. It closely reflected the wording of
the original mandate that Goldstone himself had rejected…Little
wonder that Goldstone complained bitterly to the Swiss paper Le
Temps that the recent UNHRC resolution “saddens me; there is not a
single phrase condemning Hamas as we have done in the report. I hope
the council can modify the text.” Modifications were subsequently
made, but there was still no mention of Hamas.”
Source:  http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/opinion/a-blind-eye-
to-hamas-atrocities/story-e6frg6zo-1225794831291

More recent source:  http://world.globaltimes.cn/in-depth/2010-
03/514409.html
As time goes by, the truth of Gaza War fades out - Global Times, by
Xinhua March 19, 2010.
Following the fighting, the UN established a committee to investigate
what happened in Gaza. The panel was headed by South African jurist
Richard Goldstone…The fact-finding mission, after five months of
investigation, published a widely disputed report that said both Israeli
army and Hamas fighters were likely guilty of war crimes and
potentially of crimes against humanity.  Don’t miss the picture of the
man, from Thailand, killed by a rocket fired from Gaza. 

While there is criticism of Israel’s effort to conduct an investigation into
accusations of atrocities, “Both Palestinian Authority and Hamas
recently established committees to investigate the Palestinian role in
the fighting, but Pillay said “there is no indication of credible
investigations having taken place. In addition, the late launching of
these initiatives brings into question the commitment of responsible
Palestinian authorities to satisfying the criterion that a remedy be
prompt.”

Yesterday’s headline reported in The Jerusalem
Post at http://www.jpost.com/Israel/Article.aspx?id=172485
reads Palestinians to halt rocket attacks by Khaled Abu Toameh
and Herb Keinon.  This decision is applauded as it is it could be a basis
for possible dialogue between the principles of this conflict.  However,
it also reveals that Palestinian ‘factions” have been launching rocket
attacks against Israel.  Part of that headline also said Kassam hits
Negev, causing no harm.  so a rocket was launched after The Islamists
said they would stop firing the rockets.  Is there some
disingenuousness going on here?  Oh Yeah. 

Let the rain fall on me!

Report this

By Shingo, April 5, 2010 at 11:28 pm Link to this comment

firefly,

“What a sick and despicable human being Liquor Store Larry is, no doubt completely inebriated with liquor and incapable of compassion, rational thought and any humanity at all.”

Larry represents the ugly and vile truth of what Israel has become and what ti stands for.  Larry and his racist colleagues know the end is near and are in a panick.  They can see the writing in the wall and have given up any pretense to mask their true racist and racial supremacist beliefs.

Larry didn’t miss a single wingnut / seriously spoonfed nutter point, but What we are witnessing from Larry is just the beginning.  These putrid Zionist extremists (is there any other kind?) are only going to become increasingly frantic and more desperate and their language will reflect that.

The tide has turned and these fanatics will become increasingly isolated and marginalized as their paranoia festers and they begin to identify more and more of society as their enemy.

Israel reminds me of a class in biology that anytime the host to a parasite is weakened (ie. the US), the parasite’s metabolism increased, hastening the demise of its host and destroying itself in the process. We are now witnessing this phenomenon with Israel and US.

Report this

By Shingo, April 5, 2010 at 11:10 pm Link to this comment

Liquor Store Larry,

Part 1 of 2

“There’s just one thing about that: There are no Palestinians. It’s a made up word.”

That Hasbara BS is so old it’s got cowebbs on it.

The reference/title Palestine was determined by the British Mandate of Palestine, in 1922 and included all the land lying to the west of the Jordan River; that is, all of what is now Israel, the West Bank, and Gaza Strip. The term “Palestinian” referred to all people residing there, regardless of race or religion. Those granted citizenship, were granted “Palestinian citizenship”. That included descendents of Judah who were there. For the most part Palestinians got along fine until the Russian and European refugees began to arrive.

So for the sake of honesty, let’s DEFINITELY use word “Palestinian” because that’s what the inhabitants of Palestine were called.

“Before the Israelis won the land in war, Gaza was owned by Egypt, and there were no “Palestinians” then, and the West Bank was owned by Jordan, and there were no “Palestinians” then.”

Just like before Israel was created in 1948, there were no Israelis and no Israel. Of course, what the inhabitants of Palestine called themselves is entirely irrelevant. They were a majority population who had lived there for centuries and owned most of the land, irrespective of who’;s control Gaza and the West Bank came under.

As Ben Gurion and many of Israel’s founding fathers stated, they had inhabited the land for many centuries.  In fact, Shlomo Zand, the Israeli scholar points out in his book, “When and How Was the Jewish People Invented?” after the Roman wars, the remaining inhabitants of ancient Judea converting to Islam and assimilating with their conquerors when Arabs subjugated the area. They became the progenitors of today’s Palestinian Arabs, many of whom now live as refugees who were exiled from their homeland during the 20th century.

“As soon as the Jews took over and started growing oranges as big as basketballs, what do you know, say hello to the “Palestinians,”

Absolute rubbish.  Up until Israel drove the Palestinians from their land, the Jews were a minority in Palestine and the Palestinians already had produced abundant orchards growing oranges long before the Jewish immigrants began arriving.

http://www.uruknet.de/?colonna=m&p=51428&l=x&size=1&hd=0

“ any more to describe these delightful folks, who dance for joy at our deaths until someone points out they’re being taped.”

You mean like these delightful folks?

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/fiveisraelis.html

“Instead, let’s call them what they are: “Other Arabs From The Same General Area Who Are In Deep Denial About Never Being Able To Accomplish Anything In Life And Would Rather Wrap Themselves In The Seductive Melodrama Of Eternal Struggle And Death.”

Just listen to the racist bile pouring from your oral cavity!! Jim Crowe couldn’tt have said it better. It’s clear who the Nazi is here.  Nazis made similar statements about the Jews trapped in the Warsaw ghetto.

Of course, Ben Gurion disagrees with you:

“The right which the Arabs in Palestine have is one due to the inhabitants of any country . . . because they live here, and not because they are Arabs . . . The Arab inhabitants of Palestine should enjoy all the rights of citizens and all political rights, not only as individuals, but as a national community, just like the Jews.” (Shabtai Teveth, p. 170)

Report this

By Shingo, April 5, 2010 at 11:08 pm Link to this comment

Part 2 of 2

“They could’ve had their own country any time in the last thirty years, especially two years ago at Camp David.”

Rubbish.  See Shlomo Ben Ami’s own admission that the offer was grossly inadequate. IN fact, even Barak knew it was inadequate, which is why he and Clinton called for the talks at Taba. At Taba, both leaders stated that they would have reached an agreement had they more time.  It was Barak who called off the talks early to focus on the impending elections.

“Think of all the Arab countries as a football field, and Israel as a pack of matches sitting in the middle of it.”

So if I were to steal 7 million bucks from Warren Buffet’s bank account, he’d have no right to complain because he gets to keep 99% of his wealth, is that it?

The fact is that in 1948, Jews only owned 7% of the land and Palestinian Arabs owned over 50%.  So even if you want to try the false argument that there was no Palestine, there certainly was private property that was owned and subsequently stolen by Israel.

“Hey, but what about the string of wars to obliterate the tiny country and the constant din of rabid blood oaths to drive every Jew into the sea? Oh, that? We were just kidding.”

Well, seeing as Israel has started every war since 1948, yes, they’re probably telling the truth.

“Imagine five hundred million Jews and five million Arabs. I was stunned at the simple brilliance of it.”

It’s easy to stun simpletons with small brains.

“Can anyone picture the Jews strapping belts of razor blades and dynamite to themselves?”

No, and why would you when you have F-16’s given to you at US taxpayer expense.  If suicide attacks bother you so much ( and there haven;t been any since Hamas renounced suicide attacks), lobby you r Congressman to send some Apache Helicopters, and F-16’s to Gaza and I promise you, there will be no more suicide bombings.

“Or dancing for joy at the murder of innocents? Impossible.”

Are you referring to Israelis or Arabs?  How fitting then that Netenyahu happens to be the only political leader in the world who said that 9./11 was a good thing?

In any case, Israel’s best days are behind them.  The world is sick to it’s stomach of Israel and Israel if Israel are crazy enough to start a war with Iran, it will be the last one they start.

Akiva Eldar also pointed out something that has gone entirely unreported in the MSM in the US.

The United States, the European Union, Russia and the United Nations have agreed to turn PSalam Fayyad’s state-building plan from a unilateral initiative into an international project.

“The Quartet declared that it was backing the plan, proposed in August 2009, to establish a Palestinian state within 24 months.”

“This means Israel has less than a year and a half to come to an agreement with the Palestinians on the permanent borders, Jerusalem and the refugees. If the Palestinians stick to Fayyad’s path, in August 2011, the international community, led by the United States, can be expected to recognize the West Bank and East Jerusalem as an independent country occupied by a foreign power. Will Netanyahu still be trying to explain that Jerusalem isn’t a settlement? ”

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1159849.html

I can just picture the heads of the Jewish Taliban in the occupied territories losing their heads at this development and they lose what little remains of their sanity.

Report this

By firefly, April 5, 2010 at 10:59 pm Link to this comment

What a sick and despicable human being Liquor Store Larry is, no doubt completely inebriated with liquor and incapable of compassion, rational thought and any humanity at all.

There are Palestinians. It’s not a made up word.

As Shakespeare says, what’s in a name?, a rose is still a rose by any other name. Whether they are Palestinians or Arabs, is irrelevant. These are people fenced into the longest existing concentration camp in world history, heavily guarded and persecuted on a day to day basis by the sadistic, aggressive Israelis who have absolute power and control over the lives of people who have lived without freedom and justice for over 40 years. Whatever their ‘name’, they deserve to be treated with the dignity and respect that should be afforded to all human beings, not just Jews. When their shackles are removed, maybe then they will be able to “accomplish something in life” rather than have to fight and struggle for their survival. Who loves their oppressors?

As long as Israel continues to steal land that doesn’t belong to them in order to settle only Jews, they are inflicting an apartheid regime on the Palestinian people that live there. This pathetic and short sighted progression can only fail in the long term. When there’s no more land to steal from the Palestinians, Israel will either have to commit genocide with the remaining Palestinian people or grant them citizenship, which will mean that Israel is no longer a ‘Jewish’ homeland. Then it will have to decide whether to be a democracy, or a minority dictatorship (see how that worked out in South Africa!)

If Israel wants to live in peace with its neighbors, it must return the land to the Palestinian people and go back to the 1967 borders, something that has been called for over and over and over again and brazenly ignored by Israel, despite the fact that most of the land has been attained through the process of war and theft, something that is illegal under international law.

As for being ‘illiterate and poor’, that is not a criminal offence, and nor is it surprising considering that Israel bombs Palestinian schools and denies the entry of any educational materials into the occupied territories.

Finally, as your racist attitude towards the Arabs clearly demonstrates, Jews like you are incapable of living in the Middle East in peace with the neighbors and very evidently think that Israel can remain a fortress forever with its arrogant sense of superiority and exclusiveness. What will happen when America stops giving money to Israel? When Israel can no longer rely on the western world turning a blind eye to its crimes against humanity?

“Can anyone picture the Jews strapping belts of razor blades and dynamite to themselves?”

Actually, yes I can. If you have no other choice left to you, if you have been imprisoned for 40 years without any prospect of freedom and dignity, if you are forced to live behind barbed wire, with foreign soldiers patrolling your streets and arbitrarily shooting at you at leisure, if you have been denied medical supplies, food and water, if it takes you 6 hours to travel 2 miles because of the checkpoints, if you are 10 years old and get imprisoned for a year because you throw a stone at a soldier,  if you have to face a daily ritual of humiliation and insults and if you have powerful bombs dropped on you with impunity, you do not know how you would respond if you were in those shoes……  you are in too much of a privileged position to ever know, and evidently lack the imagination and the empathy of a people that were persecuted during WWII!

Report this
Russian Paul's avatar

By Russian Paul, April 5, 2010 at 10:43 pm Link to this comment

Larry, this is for you. Maybe you already have one.

http://www.terrasantalibera.org/a8.jpg

Report this
Russian Paul's avatar

By Russian Paul, April 5, 2010 at 10:36 pm Link to this comment

Larry you racist pig, of course Israel doesn’t strap it’s soldiers with dynamite,
it’s the 4th largest military power in the world, they have fancy guns and
bombs and white phosphorus to drop on people! How can you explain the
most recent example of Israeli terrorism? What was the Gaza Massacre?

No, it wasn’t self defense, Israel broke the ceasefire on Nov. 4 when they raided
and killed 6 Hamas gunmen, BEFORE Hamas launched any rocketfire. This has
been established. And it wasn’t a “war.” There were no battles. It was a criminal
terrorist onslaught on an innocent population. Over 1400 innocent civilians
were killed. 1/3 of them were women and children. Hospitals were targeted. UN
buildings were targeted. Ambulances were targeted. And civilians in general
were targeted.
It was not a war, it was a violation of international law, it was terrorism, it was
a disgusting massacre. How could you, if you indeed have a heart beating in
your chest, dismiss the suffering of the Palestinians? Public opinion IS turning
and you are stuck in the past. Israel’s blatant disregard for human rights is
becoming too obvious and so is the racist supremacist ideology of its terrorist
leaders. Israel can either reform or self-destruct. You are on the “team” of
helping it self-destruct.

Report this

By Shingo, April 5, 2010 at 10:30 pm Link to this comment

Liquor Store Larry,

” Before 1948 Jewish families and Palestinian/Arab families used to babysit the children during Yom Kippur.” Jews & Palestinian/Arabs got along well before Zionism came along.
“BWAAA HAAAAA HAAAAA HAAAAA - yea, sort of like the Hebron Massacre in 1929.”

List he said, BEFORE Zionism came along.

You Nazis cling to your revisionist clap trap fantasies but it matters not because you always lose in the end.

“I make no biblical claim whatsoever.”

Then where to you get your 4000 years BS because the fact is that there is no archaeological evidence to support it.  Have you ever wondered how the remains of civilizations that pre-dated any so called Israeli Kingdom are still visible while all the Zionists could produce was a few shards of pottery?

“ The A-Rabs have had many chances for peace and an autonomous state and they have blown every one.”

Typical Hasbara BS that has been debunked years ago. As Shlomo Ben Ami, Israeli foreign minister at the time of the Camp David talks said, if he were a Palestinian, he too would have rejected the crappy offer at Camp David. 

“The Nazis lost and the Arabs who have repeatedly tried to ethnically cleanse the entire middle east have lost.”

But the Ziofascists who successfully ethnically cleansed Palestine have won haven;t they LSL?  What a great example of hwo vilence pays dividends. 

It is interesting that you are completely unable to construct a sentence without the word Nazi.

“NOW ITS YOUR TURN SHINGO! You lose! Maybe that is why all they can do is attack and whine”

Yes it is LRL. The gloves are off and it’s no longer forbidden to call the state of Israel what it is.  A failed apartheid state who’s existence rests entirely on it’s genocidal policies and it’s big brother to wipe it’s nose every time it gets in trouble.

“Because they are not smart enough to figure out how to actually make a living and stealing each others goats and rugs isn’t much of an job!”

You mean as is the way Israel doers it, by living off the world’s biggest welfare cheques and getting their weapons for free and stealing land that does not belong to them?
You’re soiling yourself in public yet again LSL.

Report this

By yours truly, April 5, 2010 at 9:59 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Whereas, General David Petreaus, Vice-President Joe Biden and Secretary Of State Hlllary Clinton have acknowledged recently that Israel’s instransigence vis a vis settling the Mideast Conflict not only is why they hate us but is endangering our troops in Afghanistan and Iraq…

and Whereas, last week the Defense Department identified the following American military personnel who died in Afghanistan, Iraq, Africa and at sea…

  Randy Heck, lance corporal, Marine Corps; private
  first class, Army; Raymond N. Pacleb, private
  first class, Army National Guard; Jacob A. Ross,
  lance corporal, Marine Corps; Miroslav Zilber-
  man, lieutenant, Navy

It therefore follows that Americans who give material aid to Israel (be they Jewish, Christian, Buddhist, athiest, whatever), to the extent that said aid enables Israel to continue its aggression against the Palestinian and Lebanese people, are complicit in the death of these Americans.  As for Americans who are dual citizens of both Israel and the U.S. of A., the Justice Department should demand that they choose one, lose the other.

It also follows from the above that the Pentagon high command, in their recent agreement to provide Israel with the latest high tech airplanes, are themselves fueling the hatred that underlies the violence endangering our troops.  Which raises the question as to how these Pentagon generals can chastize Israel for its aggression when they themselves are arming that settler-state?  Something about the pot calling the kettle black?

Report this
Liquor Store Larry's avatar

By Liquor Store Larry, April 5, 2010 at 9:02 pm Link to this comment

The Palestinians want their own country. There’s just one thing about that: There are no Palestinians. It’s a made up word. Israel was called Palestine for two thousand years. Like “Wiccan,” “Palestinian” sounds ancient but is really a modern invention. Before the Israelis won the land in war, Gaza was owned by Egypt, and there were no “Palestinians” then, and the West Bank was owned by Jordan, and there were no “Palestinians” then. As soon as the Jews took over and started growing oranges as big as basketballs, what do you know, say hello to the “Palestinians,” weeping for their deep bond with their lost “land” and “nation.” So for the sake of honesty, let’s not use the word “Palestinian” any more to describe these delightful folks, who dance for joy at our deaths until someone points out they’re being taped. Instead, let’s call them what they are: “Other Arabs From The Same General Area Who Are In Deep Denial About Never Being Able To Accomplish Anything In Life And Would Rather Wrap Themselves In The Seductive Melodrama Of Eternal Struggle And Death.” I know that’s a bit unwieldy to expect to see on CNN. How about this, then: “Adjacent Jew-Haters.”

Okay, so the Adjacent Jew-Haters want their own country. Oops, just one more thing. No, they don’t. They could’ve had their own country any time in the last thirty years, especially two years ago at Camp David. But if you have your own country, you have to have traffic lights and garbage trucks and Chambers of Commerce, and, worse, you actually have to figure out some way to make a living. That’s no fun. No, they want what all the other Jew-Haters in the region want: Israel. They also want a big pile of dead Jews, of course—that’s where the real fun is—but mostly they want Israel. Why? For one thing, trying to destroy Israel—or “The Zionist Entity” as their textbooks call it—for the last fifty years has allowed the rulers of Arab countries to divert the attention of their own people away from the fact that they’re the blue-ribbon most illiterate, poorest, and tribally backward on God’s Earth, and if you’ve ever been around God’s Earth, you know that’s really saying something. It makes me roll my eyes every time one of our pundits waxes poetic about the great history and culture of the Muslim Mideast. Unless I’m missing something, the Arabs haven’t given anything to the world since Algebra, and, by the way, thanks a hell of a lot for that one.

Chew this around and spit it out: Five hundred million Arabs; five million Jews. Think of all the Arab countries as a football field, and Israel as a pack of matches sitting in the middle of it. And now these same folks swear that if Israel gives them half of that pack of matches, everyone will be pals. Really? Wow, what neat news. Hey, but what about the string of wars to obliterate the tiny country and the constant din of rabid blood oaths to drive every Jew into the sea? Oh, that? We were just kidding.

My friend Kevin Rooney made a gorgeous point the other day: Just reverse the numbers. Imagine five hundred million Jews and five million Arabs. I was stunned at the simple brilliance of it. Can anyone picture the Jews strapping belts of razor blades and dynamite to themselves? Of course not. Or marshalling every fiber and force at their disposal for generations to drive a tiny Arab state into the sea? Nonsense. Or dancing for joy at the murder of innocents? Impossible. Or spreading and believing horrible lies about the Arabs baking their bread with the blood of children? Disgusting. No, as you know, left to themselves in a world of peace, the worst Jews would ever do to people is debate them to death.  - Larry Miller

Report this
Liquor Store Larry's avatar

By Liquor Store Larry, April 5, 2010 at 8:58 pm Link to this comment

” Before 1948 Jewish families and Palestinian/Arab families used to babysit the children during Yom Kippur.” Jews & Palestinian/Arabs got along well before Zionism came along.

BWAAA HAAAAA HAAAAA HAAAAA - yea, sort of like the Hebron Massacre in 1929.

You Nazis cling to your revisionist clap trap fantasies but it matters not because you always lose in the end. I make no biblical claim whatsoever. The A-Rabs have had many chances for peace and an autonomous state and they have blown every one. LIKE SHINGO, the Arabs and the neo Nazi revisionists that suck up Hedges hateful muck raking always lose. The Nazis lost and the Arabs who have repeatedly tried to ethnically cleanse the entire middle east have lost. NOW ITS YOUR TURN SHINGO! You lose! Maybe that is why all they can do is attack and whine. Because they are not smart enough to figure out how to actually make a living and stealing each others goats and rugs isn’t much of an job!

Report this
Robert's avatar

By Robert, April 5, 2010 at 6:37 pm Link to this comment

Rabbi Feldman Protest Against Israel and Zionism


For those who are not sure about the difference(s) between Judaism and Zionism...take a look at what Rabbi Feldman has to say. Listen to his descriptions of Zionism and other matters concerning this topic.

” Before 1948 Jewish families and Palestinian/Arab families used to babysit the children during Yom Kippur.” Jews & Palestinian/Arabs got along well before Zionism came along.

Click to view this 9 minute video of Rabbi Feldman telling it like it is:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svYhUdCWCGA&feature=related

Report this

By Shingo, April 5, 2010 at 5:42 pm Link to this comment

“EVEN MORE TRUE TODAY AS HEDGES AND HIS NEO NAZI MINIONS DEMONSTRATE:

ISRAEL ‘S PECULIAR POSITION…by Eric Hoffer –
Los Angeles Times May 26,1968.”

LSL’s talking points are stick stuck in 1968.  Another surprise!!

Report this

By Shingo, April 5, 2010 at 5:37 pm Link to this comment

LSL,
Imagine my surprise when you turned out to be one of the dead enders who’s grasp of history is based on references to the Old Testament?  I have no way of knowing what space ship you arrived on, but while you were gone, Zionism was born less than 200 years old and the state of Israel celebrated it’s 60th birthday in 2008.
Then again, what else can one expect from a devotee to an ideology that is founded on socially corrosive, anti-intellectual, militant, ethnocentric racism?
My team Larry?  Are we talking a baseball game here, because if that’s the rules you want to play by, then we can both sink to that level.
You see, your team created an apartheid racist, terrorist state, based on terrorism. Your country was established by terrorist groups who’s leaders went on to become elected to the office of prime Minister.
It’s hardly surprising then, given that Zionism promotes men who carried out massacres on their behalf and that YOUR TEAM killed more people during it’s 18 year occupation of Southern Lebanon than all the terrorist attacks you listed. 

Yes, I am afraid that dimwits like me do conclude that the problem is Israel. The problem for dead enders like you is that not only are dimwits like me in the majority, but that the consensus is growing, even among Jews.

Israel outraged as EU poll names it a threat to peace

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2003/nov/02/israel.eu

 

But like all ideologues, you’ll ignore this as evidence of anything other than your desperate beliefs that none of this has anything to do with ISrael behave like an international thug, and that such opinions are based on anti Semtism, or in the case of Jews, the growing scourge of self hatred.

 

The sad fact is that the only people that have ever protected Jews have been Muslims, as they did in Spain, and Zionists showed their gratitude by driving the Palestinians from their own land and massacring them. Of course, this is nothing new.  Israel demonstrated their love towards their allies with the bumming of the King David Hotel, (which they celebrated for the 60th time in 2006) and in 1967 with their attack ion the USS Liberty.


If you want to talk Nazis, take a look in the mirror.  Your heroes, the Stern gang collaborated with the Nazis during WWII.

Your heros demonstrated what concern for fellow Jews meant during WWII during the bombing of the SS Patria in Haifa harbor by Haganah. Apparently these brother’s keepers didn’t like the British plan to send European Jewish refugees to camps in Mauritius for the duration of the war. A couple hundred were killed so the terrorists could make the point that Jewish victims of the Holocaust were better off dead in Eretz Israel, than alive in Mauritius.
Then there was the first Israeli PM, who explained what should be done to Jews who lacked the sufficient pioneering spirit.
“If I knew that it was possible to save all the children of Germany by transporting them to England, and only half by transferring them to the Land of Israel, I would choose the latter, for before us lies not only the numbers of these children but the historical reckoning of the people of Israel.” — David Ben-Gurion


So yes, like the Nazis, it is hardly surprising that you look upon and entire religious denomination as a “bunch of animals"m, then again, your beloved PM and former terrorist leaders, Menachem Begin put it best when he proclaimed that you were the “master race” and that compared to your race “other races are beasts and animals, cattle at best. Other races are considered as human excrement”.

 

How the American public must appreciate the fact that they are subsidizing your pathetic little failed state to the tune of billions, while they fight to salvage a living and fight your wars for you.

So yes LSL, keep up the good work, because your putrid ideology is sure to lead Israel off the edge of a cliff.  I think I will enjoy seeing Jews reclaim Judaism from Zionism.

Report this
PatrickHenry's avatar

By PatrickHenry, April 5, 2010 at 5:14 pm Link to this comment

Eric Hoffer sounds like a zionist twit.

I see spinning and twisting condemnation of Israel into criticism of all things jewish is still fashionable in the zionist mindset.

Being “Jewish” is all in one’s mind, being a zionist is more a political affiliation advocating racism, apartheid and ethnic supremacy.

Report this
Liquor Store Larry's avatar

By Liquor Store Larry, April 5, 2010 at 4:55 pm Link to this comment

EVEN MORE TRUE TODAY AS HEDGES AND HIS NEO NAZI MINIONS DEMONSTRATE:

ISRAEL ‘S PECULIAR POSITION…by Eric Hoffer –
Los Angeles Times May 26,1968.

The Jews are a peculiar people: things permitted to other nations are forbidden to the Jews.
Other nations drive out thousands, even millions of people and there is no refugee problem. Russia did it, Poland and Czechoslovakia did it. ... See More
Turkey threw out a million Greeks and Algeria a million Frenchman.
Indonesia threw out heaven knows how many Chinese and no one says a word about refugees.
But in the case of Israel , the displaced Arabs have become eternal refugees.
Everyone insists that Israel must take back every single one.
Arnold Toynbee calls the displacement of the Arabs an atrocity greater than any committed by the Nazis.
Other nations when victorious on the battlefield dictate peace terms.
But when Israel is victorious, it must sue for peace.
Everyone expects the Jews to be the only real Christians in this world.
Other nations, when they are defeated, survive and recover but should Israel be defeated it would be destroyed.
Had Nasser triumphed last June [1967], he would have wiped Israel off the map, and no one would have lifted a finger to save the Jews.
No commitment to the Jews by any government, including our own, is worth the paper it is written on.
There is a cry of outrage all over the world when people die in Vietnam or when two Blacks are executed in Rhodesia .
But, when Hitler slaughtered Jews no one demonstrated against him.
The Swedes, who were ready to break off diplomatic relations with America because of what we did in Vietnam , did not let out a peep when Hitler was slaughtering Jews.
They sent Hitler choice iron ore, and ball bearings, and serviced his troops in Norway .
The Jews are alone in the world.
If Israel survives, it will be solely because of Jewish efforts. And Jewish resources.
Yet at this moment, Israel is our only reliable and unconditional ally.
We can rely more on Israel than Israel can rely on us.
And one has only to imagine what would have happened last summer [1967] had the Arabs and their Russian backers won the war, to realize how vital the survival of Israel is to America and the West in general.
I have a premonition that will not leave me; as it goes with Israel so will it go with all of us.
Should Israel perish, the Holocaust will be upon us all.

Report this
PatrickHenry's avatar

By PatrickHenry, April 5, 2010 at 4:27 pm Link to this comment

One must tiptoe through the false flag events perped by Israel since its founding up till the present.

http://www.ascertainthetruth.com/911/falseflag.htm

With spokespersons like LSL, its no wonder why Israel falls flat on its face in the win their hearts and minds category.

Report this
Liquor Store Larry's avatar

By Liquor Store Larry, April 5, 2010 at 3:55 pm Link to this comment

Shingo - “no person of conscience supports them any longer”?  YOU MUST MEAN UNLIKE that massive support the Jews have enjoyed for the last 4000 years? Was that your attempt at a joke?

If you only knew how idiotic you sound trying to mask your bigotry you would not say that but of course if you knew that you would not BE an idiot.

I also REALLY like your prosaic line: “the Israelis as a mutant line of Judaic zombies, an evolutionary dead end” ... LMAO

.... yea, not highly sophisticated on the evolutionary scale like YOUR TEAM, the guys who blow up discos in Bali, pizza parlors in Israel, train stations in Barcelona, hotels full of Hindus in India, theaters full of hostages in Moscow, fly planes into buildings in New York, torch embassies over cartoons in Europe, blow up Buddhist antiquities in Afghanistan and shoot kneeling woman through the head in Afghan soccer stadiums, push cripples in wheelchairs off ships in the middle of the ocean, and when they run out of Jews and Christians and Hindus to murder they murder each other so naturally “progressive” dimwits like you can conclude that the problem is Israel ... surely if we make a human sacrifice of the Jews, then these savages will love us? The Nazis just didn’t do it right? Keep up the good work Shingo because you have us all fooled. A tiny Jewish state surrounded by animals is not acceptable but any “throat cutting back stabbing murderer in a Kaffiya” who says “the entire Middle East is Moslem land” is OK in your book. The world needs Jews just to offset dunces like you.

Report this

By Shingo, April 5, 2010 at 2:49 pm Link to this comment

Good point LSL. Winograd, Goldstone and Breaking the Silence. Is it all one big
conspiracy or could it be that they’re onto something? As much as you want the world
to believe the Earth is really flat, evidence is hard to hide.

As for Israel, no person of conscience supports them any longer. Jews of character
recognize the Israelis as a mutant line of Judaic zombies, an evolutionary dead end, a
disgrace and embarrassment. That’s why dead Enders like GRYM have resorted to
sitting in the corner of the room, dribbling from their mouths and rocking back and forth
while they chant incoherent bile.

Report this
Liquor Store Larry's avatar

By Liquor Store Larry, April 5, 2010 at 2:02 pm Link to this comment

I see - only Goldstone is a self loathing neurotic, Hedges involvement is only mastabatory. LMAO

See Marcy Winograd, she is just hitching a ride too. Where do you people come from?

Report this

By Shingo, April 5, 2010 at 1:49 pm Link to this comment


“Brutal war crimes exposed”? Hedges is nothing but a simple garden variety terrorist
loving anti-Semite!”

It was Goldstone who exposed those war crimes, a Jewish Zionist, not Hedges.  So
what are you boing to call him LSL?  A self hating Jew or a self hating Zionist?

Report this
Liquor Store Larry's avatar

By Liquor Store Larry, April 5, 2010 at 12:48 pm Link to this comment

It’s great to be Jewish! I am intoxicated with my own power. It’s not easy owning the banks, controlling Hollywood and manipulating international affairs all at the same time, but somebody has to do it. It might as well be me. I don’t know why anyone even prints Hedges. He is such a thinly veiled bigot and so sophomoric in his views. The man becomes sexually aroused watching a self loathing Jew bash other Jews.

Report this
Liquor Store Larry's avatar

By Liquor Store Larry, April 5, 2010 at 11:13 am Link to this comment

“Brutal war crimes exposed”? Hedges is nothing but a simple garden variety terrorist loving anti-Semite!

Report this

By omop, April 5, 2010 at 8:40 am Link to this comment

The people that the GRYM is always blaspheming and blaming for the sunrises
are at it again. AIPAC has persuaded more than three-quarters of the members
of the U.S. House of Representatives to sign a letter calling for an end to public
criticism of Israel and urging the US to ‘reinforce’ its relationship with the Jewish
state.

  it is worth noting one fact of American citizenship: American servicemen and
women, all federal employees, and elected representatives who swear to defend
the U.S. Constitution do not affirm “dual allegiance” to Israel or any other country
regardless of whether the sun rises or sets.

  Three quarters of the US Congress seem to go along with the views that
comply with this slogan that “Israelis expect to live high while US Gi’s die”.

Report this
Go Right Young Man's avatar

By Go Right Young Man, April 5, 2010 at 7:20 am Link to this comment

Yet Another Day in which the sun has risen from
the East. Damn those Zionist dogs!

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, April 4, 2010 at 12:21 pm Link to this comment

It is with little trepidation I find myself in a delirium of sorts, because of the frequented unmitigated use of the word Zionist on these very pages, so it seems I find myself in the same plight, for my attempts to copyright the word Zionist have been thwarted!
*********************************************

Steve Jobs’ legal team is trying get if for Apple?

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, April 4, 2010 at 8:14 am Link to this comment

Someone of distancing repute has stated, as fact; two posters on TD are beloved soul mates and on the same wave length, plus my name was added?  Does this mean both ITW and Radison have 14 toes plus a large helping of leniency?  ITW, I only trim 12 toes I use other two as feelers, you may want to try that. 

Radison, may be possible my “consistent inconsistency” comment was derived from Tao Walkers dissertations on the subject, though I feel more directly it is attributed and prompted by a most recent Radison comment.

My love of stereotyping has been unparalleled or at least until recently. Let me announcel I have seldom unintentionally called or labeled anyone undeserving as an idiot, a moron or a imbecile and it should be further known, I never (an absolutism here)  use the word stupid, since it is already covered under the word imbecile.  My attempt to copyright these words has been thwarted by the very people who I would use to discriminate them with. 

It is with little trepidation I find myself in a delirium of sorts, because of the frequented unmitigated use of the word Zionist on these very pages, so it seems I find myself in the same plight, for my attempts to copyright the word Zionist have been thwarted!

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, April 4, 2010 at 4:15 am Link to this comment

Leefeller:
Don’t you trim the 13th and 14th toes as well????

Report this

By radson, April 3, 2010 at 8:24 pm Link to this comment

TD3
Thanks for your response and opinion ,I have no ill feelings towards you ,and if your personal business is that urgent ,then I wish you gods-speed to do what you must . But don’t get me wrong I do appreciate your input and do keep in touch .

cheers

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, April 3, 2010 at 7:33 pm Link to this comment

Al Jazeera? Yeah, I have been really Al Jazerraing it up on every post! Especially since I have absolutely no opinion on Al Jazeera nor do I have any facts about Al Jazeera, have only watched Al Jazerra once or twice and If I ever (which is unlikely)  mentioned Al Jazeera in any way, shape or form in any of my previous posts, it would be only because I just like saying Al Jazeera for the hell of it.

Now that I know Al Jazeera is a Zionist program, I am tempted to tell one of my favorite Zioniest jokes, but I will spare everyone until TD3 returns from his urgent business, he has told me I am so funny. Being so saddened by his absence will effect me so I cannot seem to even play the bag pipes, though my cats will appreciate it until his return.

How many times has it been when someone has some alleged urgent business or had to leave the post for some important reason. (like getting their ass kicked) why do they always attempt at being so rat tears polite about it, with a few most affectionate parting jabs? 

You, know last time I needed to be absent from TD for a period of time for personal business; was to get my twelve toe nails trimmed. I forgot to announce it, so next time I will make sure to check in, but of course after I insult someone using nothing but facts.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, April 3, 2010 at 6:51 pm Link to this comment

TD3:
Good luck with your personal business.  It’s not fun. 

Been there the last few months myself. It’s finally easing up.

What happens on Truthdig should stay on Truthdig.

Report this

By truedigger3, April 3, 2010 at 5:42 pm Link to this comment

ITW & radson,

What I meant by “beloved”, is that you two people,  and add Leefeller, are all on the same wavelength, or to put it in other way, are “soul mates”.
I stand by what I said about Al Jazeera, and as I said, their programming and who owns them support me.
If it make you feel better, that you call that an opinion, that is fine, this is a free country and that is your prerogative to call anything what do want to call it.
For few weeks, I will be distracted by urgent personal business and I will not be reading truthdig.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, April 3, 2010 at 4:25 pm Link to this comment

“Beloved”?  I guess that means I’ve given you hell about your opinions only half as much as I’ve given TD3 Hell.

TD3 assigns meanings to words depending on the context, counting on his opponent to be caught in Yesterday’s definition.

“When I use a word,” Humpty Dumpty said in rather a scornful tone. “It means just what I choose it to mean - neither more or less.”

Report this

By radson, April 3, 2010 at 4:05 pm Link to this comment

ITW
Before jumping the gun I believe thar TD3 was in a sense reaching out ,however bizarre that may sound and his own admission was a statement towards that regard ,although I am not sure about his statement concerning the use of the word ‘Beloved’ .TD3 can you please explain ?

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, April 3, 2010 at 3:24 pm Link to this comment

Your beloved friend, ITW, keep harping about a proof, and as I said over and over, the proof is in their programming and who own Al Jazeera.
Of course, I cannot get any documents, and he knows it.!!!

*************************************

Game over. TD3 is a crackpot inventing conspiracies without proof, BY HIS OWN ADMISSION.

Report this

By radson, April 3, 2010 at 2:15 pm Link to this comment

Leefeller

Have you borrowed a page from Tao Walkers’ script,the consistency of being inconsistent leads to what? You could turn this discussion upside down and still come to the same conclusion and a repeat of Groundhog day all over again and again and again .So yes ,the table keeps turning ‘actually I prefer the old vinyl’s ’ as compared to CD’s the sound is better and I could actually appreciate the artwork simultaneously.Where this Muddle ‘yes! I have chosen the Dutch term ’ which accurately describes the situation is leading to is subject to much conjecture ,yet the bottom line always comes down to one falsehood or other ,basically that Peace is in the ‘grasp’ yet unachievable.What would you tell your neighbor and or your confidant’s ,philosophically speaking .Children have no reason to be subjected to such Adult folly and if there is a solution it lies within them ,I state this because the adults have proven to be illiterate in the matter and the Planet keeps on spinning .

Report this

By Amon Drool, April 3, 2010 at 1:38 pm Link to this comment

no wonder why tao walker called it a day on TD

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, April 3, 2010 at 8:31 am Link to this comment

I work very hard at being inconsistent, actually seems a full time job. So, when I see others working much harder and longer than I at being inconsistent, I must congratulate them on their persistence.

Now under the aspersions of politeness, I would never name the original contingent or congratulate them, for that would be rude. My granny taught me not to be rude, (she just carried a large hand bag) so when I see opinions as fact and with such a blind degree of religious fervor, I must step back in awe; and say to myself.  Stupidity has a place in this world, and under the name of free speech must be allowed to beget, just like the blowhards who usually promote opinions as facts. For only in the name of closed minded self righteousness will the world continue to be consistent.

If Democracy; was really democracy,  probability may prove that stupidity would be in majority, so the unreasonable man would rule with a pragmatists yielding compassion of the predatory rat, while calling himself reasonable and blowing opinion as truth.

Report this

By radson, April 3, 2010 at 8:15 am Link to this comment

Shenonymous
You are most welcome.
and CZESC to you.

Report this
Shenonymous's avatar

By Shenonymous, April 3, 2010 at 7:37 am Link to this comment

You are stumbledancing with the devil Shingo. Hahaha.  You are the
shapeshifter here.  You accuse then move quickly out of the crosshairs
of anyone’s aim that shows how full of crap you are! hahaha But we all
see it. Even your staff!

I sufficiently covered the subject of American’s revival of manufacturing. 
No need to be redundant.

I am the scholar.  I am not the encyclopedic scholar which you try to
make of me.  I know I know, you think I am omniscient.  I keep telling
you I am not.  But you insist on trying to make a religious icon of me. 
Do take stock.  But if you must bow, well I can’t stop you.  Thing is,
Shingo, I know how to research for which you obviously have no skill. 
It’s all right.  We can’t all be brilliant.  When you look my way, you
should wear sun glasses. FYI:  XSports sunglasses are a product with
China frames and USA made polarized lens.  Yippie! yippie doo!  Would
you like to know where you can get a pair or two?  Or if you think you
need safety glasses, why I could tell you where you could get a pair, FYI
again, they are completely made in the USA. 

http://formermuslimsunited.americancommunityexchange.org/???
http://arabsforisrael.blogspot.com/2009/02/who-are-we_09.html

Report this

By truedigger3, April 3, 2010 at 7:36 am Link to this comment

radson wrote:
“Thanks’ for the response ,is TD3 alluding to the same Al Jazerra that Dudya wanted to bomb during the invasion of Iraq,if so then there are inconsistencies in his/her arguments and how would Haaretz stack up comparatively speaking.”
____________________________________________________

As I said, the politics of the M.E is very nuanced and very murky with a lot of smoke and mirrors, and in the lingo of intelligence people, what they call “chicken feed”, or feeding and creating false impressions.
Hey, the British were instrumental in creating Israel, but some Zionist terrorists bombed King David hotel in Jerusalem to kill as many British Officers as possible.???!!  Go figure!
Your beloved friend, ITW, keep harping about a proof, and as I said over and over, the proof is in their programming and who own Al Jazeera.
Of course, I cannot get any documents, and he knows it.!!!

Report this

By Shingo, April 3, 2010 at 6:58 am Link to this comment

Well done Shen, you just wasted a few hundred words not even adressing the off topic
subject of the decline of America’s manufacturing base and exports. I guess it’s time for
you to now move on to another unrelated topic since you lost the debate on this topic,
the last of the half a dozen you’ve tackled. You admittedyou were no scholar and you
seem determined to prove it every opportunity you get.

Such is the existence of an anti intectual, insufferably ignorant, moronic, paranoid,
Islamophobic Zionist shill.

So sad.

Report this
Shenonymous's avatar

By Shenonymous, April 3, 2010 at 6:47 am Link to this comment

It is amazing how you are always wrong, Shingo.  I said you were an
Islamist apologist. March 27 12:18pm and especially at March 27
12:58am And Leefeller didn’t call you an American apologist, radson
did (March 24 at 5:06pm and 10:25pm)! You need to see Leefeller’s
last paragraph at March 26 3:36pm.  What a boob you are.  You even
defended yourself to radson March 25 at 12:26am and again at 1:33am
(better have your short-term memory banks checked out!) 

Mannnn, can’t you ever get things right, Shingo?  Mannnn get some
help!

It doesn’t matter one twit if the USA imports stuff, that shows it is in a
global economy. We have lots of beebles here.  And here’s the rub:  If
Americans are importing so much, then that means they have more
money than is reported!  Maybe we are not as bad off as the population
is made to think.  It is good politics to spin ‘facts’ as felt most
beneficial to one’s own story (take notice at how Republicans do that
all the time. LOL)  What matters is that the USA exports as well!  Which
is the point, but then soft heads cannot fathom when points are made. 
Duh!

Flat earther?  FLAT EARTHER?  Are you mad?  5 Yups.  I am the epitome
of the Spherical Earther!  5 more Yups! (That is 10 Yups)  I even have a
T-shirt that says “Shenonymous, Spherical Earther!”  That proves it! 
And my Uncle Christopher proved the earth was not flat!  Well, nothing
better ought to be expected of you.  Besides being flatlined, you only
see obliquely one-dimensionally out of a half-closed eye, it is no
wonder everything looks flat to you!  That is quite a trick.  If you can
hurry you catch up with that carnival show that just left town.  (BTW if
you added laughter and the enjoyment of music to your life, you could
raise yourself up to be 2-dimensional, just a suggestion).  To be fully
3-dimensional you would have to evolve to a well-rounded thinking
being, a tough haul for you, I know, I know.

http://formermuslimsunited.americancommunityexchange.org/??
http://arabsforisrael.blogspot.com/2009/02/who-are-we_09.html

Thank you, radson, for your offer.  Happy Spring Equinox to you and
anyone else who finds spring joyful.  It is most refined of you to post a
happy wish for everyone!  It is most appreciated by this TD resident. 
Thank you.

Report this

By radson, April 3, 2010 at 5:46 am Link to this comment

Thanks’ for the response ,is TD3 alluding to the same Al Jazerra that Dudya wanted to bomb during the invasion of Iraq,if so then there are inconsistencies in his/her arguments and how would Haaretz stack
up comparatively speaking.

Report this

By Shingo, April 3, 2010 at 5:39 am Link to this comment

Shenonymous,

“More about the productivity of the United States!  Yayyyyy! for the USAAAAAA!”

Rather odd that you should be sheerleading teh USA when a week ago you and Lefeeler were labelling me as an apologist for America.

“USA Clothing & Textile Factories”

Not only is clothing production not even in the top 10 US indutried, but it doesn’t even rate in the top 20 export earners.

Desperate and deluded.

“And toys too!”

The US imports ten times the volume of toys that it exports.

Desperate and deluded.

Oh, and as for fruits and berries, the US could never produce enough to even service the interest on government debt.

Better to be a flat liner and in touch with reality, then be a flat earther like yourself.

Liek I said, manuacturing and exports in the US are headed over a cliff, as is the US economy.

Report this
Shenonymous's avatar

By Shenonymous, April 3, 2010 at 5:06 am Link to this comment

More about the productivity of the United States!  Yayyyyy! for the
USAAAAAA!

http://www.apparelsearch.com/America.htm
  USA Clothing & Textile Factories
Looks like you are looking only for clothes with one eye half closed. 
Get a grip.

http://americanmadeyes.com/clothingamerican.html?gclid=CKbF2f-
86qACFclM5QodMVtPIA
The Best Label - MADE in the USA
American Made Men’s Clothing

http://www.americansworking.com/clothing.html

http://www.toysmadeinamerica.com/clothes.html

And toys too!
http://www.toysofusa.com/

And for a list of EVERYTHING!  http://www.madeinusa.org/

http://formermuslimsunited.americancommunityexchange.org/?
http://arabsforisrael.blogspot.com/2009/02/who-are-we_09.html

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, April 3, 2010 at 4:58 am Link to this comment

radson, April 2 at 10:47 pm #

elisalouisa

You’re probably right !ITW and Folktruther were notoriously argumentative individuals ,but I may add ,they had a certain respect for one another and that’s the chivalry that tends to be forgotten amongst the readership.
*******************************************

I enjoyed FT unless he was reverting to posting deliberate falsehoods about me, such as I was a mindless devotee of Ayn Rand (I’m highly critical of much, maybe most, but not all of Rand’s ideas) or that I was a total apologist for any and all actions by Israel. I regretted when he did that because it spoiled the fun of arguing with him.

TD3 cannot deal with facts and logic the disprove his assertions. He cannot deal with the concept that his assertions must be proven, so his only response is to tell me to “GET LOST!”  Then he tries to dismiss me using ad hominem justifications to not evaluate what I write.  He doesn’t have to read it.

I’m still trying to see if TD3 can actually PROVE his assertion that Al Jazeera is Zionist.  He hasn’t so far, and cannot, because it’s all a fantasy on his part.  This has released a torrent of abuse and claims that I can be “ignored”—because I don’t toe the “Party Line” of “The Contingent”.

Report this
Shenonymous's avatar

By Shenonymous, April 3, 2010 at 4:08 am Link to this comment

Hope springs eternal for camp followers, eh… right, EL?
Small potatoes (small minds) yields small potatoes (small minds).

When there is a scarcity of culture, the word has no meaning to the
uncultured.  Culture means more than Hortie Culture LOL.

Nevertheless, get to know your potatoes! Check out
http://www.dtnprogressivefarmer.com/dtnag/common/link.do?
symbolicName=/ag/blogs/template1&blogHandle=grainmarkets&blogE;
ntryId=8a82c0bc268be2db0127ba91095c0f05

For the US tables, fresh produce not only comes seasonally from
Mexico and South American farms, excellent berries by the way, sweet
and luscious, but also from California, Texas, Florida.  You might wipe
the ideological film away that is causing mental cataracts in your
judgment.  See:
http://www.producenews.com/  for an up-to-date report of exactly
how the farm industry is going.  And hey you flatliners stop lying
about the United States.  Life gets bumpy sometimes, get over it and
get over yourselves.


http://formermuslimsunited.americancommunityexchange.org/?
http://arabsforisrael.blogspot.com/2009/02/who-are-we_09.html

Report this

By truedigger3, April 2, 2010 at 10:31 pm Link to this comment

elisalouisa wrote:
“Perhaps I misunderstood your comments since you have never been in law enforcement. 
Glad you asked, if I have not clarified the issue please say so, my misunderstanding.”
____________________________________________________


I am very baffled.! Since I never mentioned utterly anything about law enforcement in my comments, what did trigger that misunderstanding???!!!

Report this

By elisalouisa, April 2, 2010 at 8:43 pm Link to this comment

To be fair, it’s not just Israel, food is coming in from Mexico, South America and other parts of the world. As to the farmers and where this is all going to end I do not know. This is what Chris Hedges has been telling us all along.
Shingo you are absolutely correct about traveling. It does open your eyes and you start wondering why things are as they are. There are some things news cannot convey, you must experience. There should be tax exemptions for travel to certain
countries, on a tight budget of course. Something like the traveler Peace Corps.
The big question, would our government really want its citizens to be educated in that manner?
My good wishes to all TDers during this early Spring season whether you observe Passover, Easter or just have a holiday.

Report this

By elisalouisa, April 2, 2010 at 7:57 pm Link to this comment

Sorry if I confused you TD3. You have never complained of “law enforcement harassment.” What I meant to convey is that people in law enforcement are harassed at times and that goes with the territory, that’s all. Perhaps I misunderstood your comments since you have never been in law enforcement. 
Glad you asked, if I have not clarified the issue please say so, my
misunderstanding.

Report this

By radson, April 2, 2010 at 7:47 pm Link to this comment

elisalouisa

You’re probably right !ITW and Folktruther were notoriously argumentative individuals ,but I may add ,they had a certain respect for one another and that’s the chivalry that tends to be forgotten amongst the readership.Shen I realize that your working on a book and your quest for ‘info ’ does at times lead to consternation ,whether the ‘accomplice ’ realizes it ,is subject to conjecture.Shen if you wish to quote certain passages
that I had written ;by all means do so ,as a matter of fact I encourage you to do so.
I would like to wish a happy Easter to all TDers and their Families regardless.

Report this
Robert's avatar

By Robert, April 2, 2010 at 7:27 pm Link to this comment

By elisalouisa, April 2 at 8:35 pm #

“Shingo, of course you are correct in your assessment that America imports most of its products.Everything and I do mean everything I buy with the exception of food, is imported. It is about the global economy. Factories in America are gone. Period. Never to return. What has Truthdig been saying? Has
nothing been absorbed? The right wing mentality that you are not really an American but one of the Internet terrorists if you criticize this country is beyond belief. This country has changed drastically and not for the better. Look at the labels, most say “made in China.“What is imported and from where has to do with corporations and where a product can be made with slave labor working under poor conditions with no benefits and little pay. It no longer has anything to do with culture. Washington sold this country out to the corporations for the money.”
~~~~~~~~~~~~

ElisaLouisa,

You are quite right about the labels on just about everything. I was buying clothes/gifts right before Christmas and I could not believe all those “Made in Labels” from China, Philippines, Vietnam, Mexico, Guatemala, India, Israel, Malaysia…Yep…almost nothing is made/assembled in these United States. Just the other day I bought two flashlights from Lowe’s and guess what…made in China. Even the furniture is made/assembled in China.

What a damn shame…our greedy American companies have shut their damn doors on our American workers. Shall we call them “greedy terrorists”?


Just take a look at what our US government is doing to the American farmers.

~~~~~~~~~

Obama Administration Takes from American Farmers, Gives to Israel

Policy change slips in under the radar

Alison Weir

October 23, 2009

At a time of financial crisis in the United States in which thousands of Americans have lost their jobs and homes, an Israeli news service reports that President Obama has just signed a presidential memo eliminating a tariff on Israel that protected American dairy farmers and that raised money for the American economy.

In addition, according to the Israeli report, US trade authorities have ordered the return of $17,000 to an Israeli export agent for a levy paid for butter produced by an Israeli company.

The move comes at a time when American dairy farmers have been facing what industry representatives call a “crisis.” According to the National Milk Producers Federation website, “U.S. dairy producers have been facing unprecedented losses over the past year due to low milk prices and high input costs. The dire economic straits have forced many dairy farmers to exit the industry, oftentimes having to sell their herds or farms.”

According to the news report by Israeli wire service Ynet, the Obama memo, which was signed several days ago, removed the import subcharge on dairy products from Israel.

The report noted that such levies are important for protecting local production against competing imports, “which put the local production at risk.” The levy is required from most countries that export dairy products to the U.S.

According to Ynet, Israeli agricultural attaché Yaakov Poleg was able to convince the US that “the trade agreement between Israel and the US prohibits placing taxes on exports from Israel.”


*******

Click on link for the rest. BTW, when the Arab oil producing countries buy from the US, they pay cash for. Its NOT given to them at the American taxpayer’s expense. Also, most of their revenues are invested in the US. Just imagine what would happen if these countries hinted or elected to pull their billions out. What would happen to our economy?

http://www.ifamericansknew.org/us_ints/po-dairy.html

Report this

By truedigger3, April 2, 2010 at 7:27 pm Link to this comment

elisalouisa wrote:
“TD3 as part of law enforcement, I believe that’s what you said, you surely have been harassed before, just let it roll off. ITW needs to let off stream and since Folktruther has not been around he chooses another for whatever reason, usually someone who like Folktruther, questions some aspects of Zionism. Of course, Folktruther had a knack for snappy, classy comebacks and that is something ITW misses.
____________________________________________________

elisa,

Your choice of words is confusing, and people might not know exactly how to interpret what you are trying to convey.
Someone reading what you have written above, might implies that I had compplained of “law enforcement harrassment” which I never did and I never said anything about law enforcement before here!!!

About ITW, he proved his intellectual bankruptcy by reverting to name calling and trying to redicule any point of view that is not in line with his “zionist vision”. He he has no effect on me. He is brainwashed nobody.!!

Report this

By Shingo, April 2, 2010 at 7:08 pm Link to this comment

Shenonymous,
Just when it seems you could not be any more poorly educated or informed, you turn your intention to a new topic and reveal a whole new dimension to your monumental stupidity. First , you link to a report from 2003, which, had you bothered to read, does not reveal any optimism.  The US is 4th in the world in terms of exports, and the majority of those exports are not manufactured goods, but raw materials (namely scrap mental and wood chips. 
Yeah, the world must be so envious of our exports and culture.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_exports
The fastest growing industry in the US is the prison system.  Exports vastly outweigh exports:
http://www.trade.gov/press/press_releases/2009/export-factsheet_021109.pdf
As for the US crawling itself out of a recession, the gains on wall Street are not driven by manufacturing but the same unsustainable practices that led the US into the hole we’re in. And FYI, it was under Clinton that the US removed all the regulatory measured that would have prevented the disaster we are in today.
Every economist knows that the worst is yet to come. High volume traders are sitting on the sidelines, to afraid to get their feet wet.  The commercial real estate bubble, which will make the sub prime look like a small bump in the road, has yet to pop.
Your next link is even more of an own goal.
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=a_.lKyRsGFJg”
All this link suggests is that we are approaching the bottom, though we are still in decline. Do you even read your own links or just peruse the headlines and assume that will suffice.  My God, are you truly that stupid?
Helen Wang, naturalized citizen of the US, author and observer of
China, has a different view about China than you do”
What are Wang’s credentials? Oh that’s right, she says something that you like the sound of, so that should suffice.
“MIT’s latest e-news release, March 31 gives a complete antithesis to
your unsubstantiated latest invective. 
http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2010/future-manufacture-0331.html”
Another article you linked to without either reading, it without comprehending.  This article only serves to highlight that the US manufacturing base in freefall and discusses possible easy to rescue it. 
Thanks for proving my point yet again,
“ Anyway,  thank you for giving me the opportunity to trumpet American manufacturing and it’s returning to a world leader in production.”
Yeah, tell that to the population of Detroit.  Feel free to provide the comic relief, just like you did when you refused to explain your theory that Hitler’s invasion of Poland was an act of defence. 
“Why do you suppose the Arabs can’t get their act together and start manufacturing goods, and present some culture the world would like to experience?”
Could you be any more racist and bigoted? How much of the world wants to experience Israel’s culture you pathetic and backward ignoramus? Have you ever travelled to the M idle East?  Have you even travelled outside of your own country?  I bet you never even owned a passport right Shen?  It’s not like you need one for the local PTA.
“They could take a lesson from the clever and resourceful people from Haiti in the face of misery.”
Haitians have the US to thank for the poverty imposed on them.  How many invasions and coups have the US inflicted on Haiti?  Do you have a clue about the history of Haiti, or did you blindly just expose yet more ignorance on your part?
“http://formermuslimsunited.americancommunityexchange.org/
http://arabsforisrael.blogspot.com/2009/02/who-are-we_09.html”
What is the purpose of posting repeated links to groups that have been exposed as useful idiots for Israel?
We get that your are an anti intellectual and an idiot Shen. No need to keep reminding us.

Report this

By elisalouisa, April 2, 2010 at 5:35 pm Link to this comment

There is something odd about AlJazeera Chief Wadah Khanfar stating that the Egyptians really loved Obama’s speech. Most Egyptians don’t like America or anything American so this is hard to accept.
Shingo, of course you are correct in your assessment that America imports most of its products.Everything and I do mean everything I buy with the exception of food, is imported. It is about the global economy. Factories in America are gone. Period. Never to return. What has Truthdig been saying? Has
nothing been absorbed? The right wing mentality that you are not really an American but one of the Internet terrorists if you criticize this country is beyond belief. This country has changed drastically and not for the better. Look at the labels, most say “made in China.“What is imported and from where has to do with corporations and where a product can be made with slave labor working under poor conditions with no benefits and little pay. It no longer has anything to do with culture. Washington sold this country out to the corporations for the money. Follow the money.  As to McDonald’s representing America I would respond that the
American military base not too far from McDonald’s in many foreign countries is more representative of our nation and culture as far as the native population of other countries is concerned.
TD3 as part of law enforcement, I believe that’s what you said, you surely have been harassed before, just let it roll off. ITW needs to let off stream and since Folktruther has not been around he chooses another for whatever reason, usually someone who like Folktruther, questions some aspects of Zionism. Of course, Folktruther had a knack for snappy, classy comebacks and that is something ITW misses.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, April 2, 2010 at 5:02 pm Link to this comment

firefly, April 2 at 11:48 am #

Russian Paul,

I also listened to Al Jazeera Chief Wadah Khanfar on Democracy Now, and came away with completely different assertions and conclusions from you. I’ve lived and worked in countries all over the world (especially Africa), and much of what Khanfar said, resonated with my view that the majority of Americans are absolutely insulated from understanding real people and their lives outside of this country. As the Middle East and Europe in particular are geographically much closer and share histories that go back thousands of years, their understanding of each other is not so easily based on political denunciation, criticism and propaganda.

As one man once said to me, because America has been exporting its culture (Hollywood, MacDonalds etc) language and belief systems for the last 50 years or more, most other countries have a good understanding of America. Generally speaking, America, a very narcissistic nation (very like Israel), takes very little interest in the cultural norms of other nations, learns little about their histories (except those they make up) and fails to ‘import’ any real knowledge about other people. In fact, most migrants that come to America are encouraged to ‘discard’ their own backgrounds and embrace America’s which is a shame, because America could learn so much from other people if only it didn’t feel so superior.

If Al Jareeza were able to open the eyes and ears of mainstream America, it would make an enormous difference to the way the world functions.
****************************************

But, but, but….How CAN they? TD3 tells us, (without any support but his reception of ET transmissions) that Al Jazeera is ...ZIONIST!

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, April 2, 2010 at 4:58 pm Link to this comment

truedigger3, April 2 at 3:39 am #

By Inherit The Wind, April 1 at 9:44 pm #


ITW,

Ther is no “telepathic transmission” or sectret conspiracy ploy.
Al Jazeera is owned and controlled by the government of Qatar which is, “under the table”,  a VERY good friend of Israel.
*********************************************

Your brilliance is dazzling! Next you’ll be saying “Incotheivable!”

Qatar is a VERY good friend of Israel? How do you figure? Like the US is? Because they don’t actively advocate sending in suicide bombers?  Therefore they MUST be Zionists????  Oh, of course, I forgot: you believe the Israel is a Svengali capable of controlling the US by…MIND WAVES!!!

Your paranoid delusions are just plain, well, silly.
____________________________________________________

ITW,

I tried to keep the discussion with you conducted in a civil way, but you keep insisting on name calling, jumping up and down tooting horn and trying to find a suicide bomber in every place.
It is futile and waste of time to try to reason with unreasonable people. GET LOST.

******************************************

“GET LOST”  That’s your message to ANYONE who doesn’t accept your biased POV.

You don’t understand the CONCEPT of “Reason”. It means you have a REASON (ie a fact and a logical inference from that fact) for your view.  I have challenged you REPEATEDLY to support your assertion that Al Jazeera is Zionist.  You have not shown ONE fact that proves that. Your SOLE argument is based on AJ being in Qatar, and since Qatar doesn’t actively support terrorists, and is moderately friendly with Israel, YOU make the absurd leaps of
a) Israel MUST control Qatar
b) Qatar MUST control Al Jazeera
c) “a” ==> “b”, “b” ==> “c” and therefore Al Jazeera MUST be Zionist.

Your train of thought is NOT logical, and NOT reasonable.  Therefore you NEVER INTENDED to carry on a “reasonable” discussion.

So you respond with “GET LOST”.  Not happenin’ bud.

Report this
Shenonymous's avatar

By Shenonymous, April 2, 2010 at 3:08 pm Link to this comment

Really?  USA imports all manufactured goods these days?  M’thinks
Shingo you need to take your shuffling foot and put it back into your
mouth right where it is being missed and take that word ‘all’ and shove
it up your nose.  It might be true that the US’s manufacturing quotient
is not as much as it has been since 2003, when it was the world’s
leading producer of manufactured goods, perhaps you can prove false
the 2003 US government report at
http://www.manufacturing.gov/report/index.asp?dName=report
and you know what, I don’t give a rat’s ass if you believe it or not.  And
while US production might be in a decline, things slump just like your
brain.  But there is a ray of light, unfortunately not for you, that the
recession is crawling itself out of the hole the previous irresponsible
Republican administrations put this country in, which perhaps can be
observed by those with eyes in their head, unlike the slug you appear
to be that In July of 2009 the picture was not as bleak as it had been. 
Recovery from the nearly disastrous economic recession takes time. 
You obviously just want to denigrate me and this country, which
reinforces my belief that you are not really an American but one of the
Internet terrorists who wish only to tear this country down in your small
minded way. You still offer puffed up belches of comments and do not
provide any references for your continual blowhard speeches. 
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?
pid=20601087&sid=a_.lKyRsGFJg

Helen Wang, naturalized citizen of the US, author and observer of
China, has a different view about China than you do.  She provides
resources for her views as well as giving voice to many other observers
of the Chinese manufacturing superiority.  You continue to be the
jackass you have shown to be on this entire forum.
http://helenhwang.net/2010/03/myth-of-manufacturing/

MIT’s latest e-news release, March 31 gives a complete antithesis to
your unsubstantiated latest invective. 
http://web.mit.edu/newsoffice/2010/future-manufacture-0331.html

You might try some of that tequila that Leefeller praises occasionally. 

The main stress of my earlier post was obviously about culture not
manufacturing which you would not be able to intuit because of your
lack of culture.  Anyway,  thank you for giving me the opportunity to
trumpet American manufacturing and it’s returning to a world leader in
production. Why do you suppose the Arabs can’t get their act together
and start manufacturing goods, and present some culture the the world
would like to experience?  They could take a lesson from the clever and
resourceful people from Haiti in the face of misery.  I am much too
important to you Shingo, you need to reevaluate your priorities.  I am
flattered.

http://formermuslimsunited.americancommunityexchange.org/
http://arabsforisrael.blogspot.com/2009/02/who-are-we_09.html

Report this

By Shingo, April 2, 2010 at 2:18 pm Link to this comment

Shenonymous,

“As much as America exports its culture and products, the rest of the world imports them because they are more attractive compared to what they think they have.”

Anoltehr perfect example of you opening your mouth to change feet without thinking through your argument.

The US imports all manufactured goods these days, amd most from China.  It ecently overtpook Gemrany as the world’s biggsst expoerter.

Does that mean Chinese products are more attractive compared to what Americans think they have?

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, April 2, 2010 at 10:06 am Link to this comment

Thanks She, printed out “The Philosophy of the Reasonable Man” and I will enjoy reading it asap. Thanks!

Guess today in order to be politically correct depending on ones proclivity, it would be preferred to say; the ‘reasonable Zionist’,plus it would also seem much less sexist.

Enlightenment can be so enlightening. Everyone should take Shenonymous’s first grade. Really it won’t hurt!  Kidding! From what I have seen, for some it would really hurt!

Report this
Shenonymous's avatar

By Shenonymous, April 2, 2010 at 9:14 am Link to this comment

As much as America exports its culture and products, the rest of the
world imports them because they are more attractive compared to what
they think they have.  The grass is always greener when it is imported,
you know that old axiom.  Of course what ‘culture’ means is
important.  If Americans don’t import culture from other countries,
which I do not agree is the case, especially music and other arts from
England and Europe as well as to a degree from the Middle East and
Asia, it might be because they do not export their culture. 
Philosophical perspectives are almost instantaneously imported by the
American cognoscenti from not only Europe but Asia as well these
days.  The tea I drink, copious amounts, are all imported.  It seems it is
a matter of perspective, viz., on which side of the pond one is mired.

Oxford philosopher, J. R. Lucas, Merton College writes in 1963 an
insightful essay on the Philosophy of the Reasonable Man.  Leefeller,
see http://users.ox.ac.uk/~jrlucas/reasble.html

An unassociated question:  Is anyone else seeing this article and forum
as extraordinarily wider than their screen?  It seems to have started a
few days ago.  None of the other forums are affected far as I can tell. 
Formatting as rtf would help the situation if the problem is endemic.

Report this

By firefly, April 2, 2010 at 8:48 am Link to this comment

Russian Paul,

I also listened to Al Jazeera Chief Wadah Khanfar on Democracy Now, and came away with completely different assertions and conclusions from you. I’ve lived and worked in countries all over the world (especially Africa), and much of what Khanfar said, resonated with my view that the majority of Americans are absolutely insulated from understanding real people and their lives outside of this country. As the Middle East and Europe in particular are geographically much closer and share histories that go back thousands of years, their understanding of each other is not so easily based on political denunciation, criticism and propaganda.

As one man once said to me, because America has been exporting its culture (Hollywood, MacDonalds etc) language and belief systems for the last 50 years or more, most other countries have a good understanding of America. Generally speaking, America, a very narcissistic nation (very like Israel), takes very little interest in the cultural norms of other nations, learns little about their histories (except those they make up) and fails to ‘import’ any real knowledge about other people. In fact, most migrants that come to America are encouraged to ‘discard’ their own backgrounds and embrace America’s which is a shame, because America could learn so much from other people if only it didn’t feel so superior.

If Al Jareeza were able to open the eyes and ears of mainstream America, it would make an enormous difference to the way the world functions.

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, April 2, 2010 at 8:11 am Link to this comment

Define reasonable people, lets see from here it looks like;

Anyone who accepts ones opinion as fact? An absolutist who has all the facts and wants everyone else to know it? Someone who will not let another agree with them because the other person is not holing their head just right?  Those kinds of reasonable people?

Reasonable people, anyone who has not been labeled a Zionist?

Now anyone out there have a;  philosophical not pathological definition of; “reasonable people”.

Report this

By truedigger3, April 2, 2010 at 12:39 am Link to this comment

By Inherit The Wind, April 1 at 9:44 pm #


ITW,

Ther is no “telepathic transmission” or sectret conspiracy ploy.
Al Jazeera is owned and controlled by the government of Qatar which is, “under the table”,  a VERY good friend of Israel.
*********************************************

Your brilliance is dazzling! Next you’ll be saying “Incotheivable!”

Qatar is a VERY good friend of Israel? How do you figure? Like the US is? Because they don’t actively advocate sending in suicide bombers?  Therefore they MUST be Zionists????  Oh, of course, I forgot: you believe the Israel is a Svengali capable of controlling the US by…MIND WAVES!!!

Your paranoid delusions are just plain, well, silly.
____________________________________________________

ITW,

I tried to keep the discussion with you conducted in a civil way, but you keep insisting on name calling, jumping up and down tooting horn and trying to find a suicide bomber in every place.
It is futile and waste of time to try to reason with unreasonable people. GET LOST.

Report this

Page 3 of 11 pages  <  1 2 3 4 5 >  Last »

 
Monsters of Our Own Creation? Get tickets for this Truthdig discussion of America's role in the Middle East.
Right 1, Site wide - BlogAds Premium
 
Right Skyscraper, Site Wide
Right 2, Site wide - Blogads
 
Join the Liberal Blog Advertising Network
 
 
 

A Progressive Journal of News and Opinion   Zuade Kaufman, Publisher   Robert Scheer, Editor-in-Chief
© 2014 Truthdig, LLC. All rights reserved.