It seems in every recent mine disaster, the mine owner was deliberately engaging in dangerous and illegal activities.  The last disaster, it was back-mining (I think that’s what it’s called) where when an area is played out, you then cut out the supporting pillars of coal.  How f***ing stupid and greedy is THAT?  “Gimme a match. I think my tank’s empty.”

But it will be forgotten yet again.  It always is.  It’s much more fun to play pile-on and attack President Obama for not doing what he never said he’d do.

Gerard—-Thanks for the information.  I’ll save
your comments for future reference.  First thing
is to get the book written.  I can do it.

Please see Ralph Nader’s article today on Counterpunch.org
“The Black Death”

As I have heard explained of the rulers of Spain, the Bourbons,
from circa 1700s: ‘they learned nothing and they forgot nothing’
or ‘they forgot nothing and the learned nothing’.

I do find that analogous to america these days with the big
fucking fat cat rulers who run/ruin things.

*** Will We Forget the Miners Again?

Probably! We’ve forgotten everything else!

Peace, Best Wishes and Hope

christian96:  Another place to look for people interested in the history of Pennsylvania mines and miners:  Univ. of Pgh., Dept. of Pennsylvania History.  Also Pennsylvania Historical Society. Also,United Mine Workers,  Historical Archives,  Pennsylvania History.  Even though it turns out that none of these places publish books or stories, ask them to refer you to people and agencies interested in, or archiving, personal memoirs of miners and their families. I know that such places exist because I have accidentally run onto them online recently while I was researching Pa. history myself.

The headline of this piece should be, ” We Will forget the Miners Again.”

Gerard—-Thanks for the encouragement.  I’m seriously considerit writing the book.  I’m not
sure who I could get to publish it but one step-at-a-time.  First, write the book. So you are from Pittsburgh.  I was raised about 75 miles south of
Pittsburgh in Marion County West Virginia.  The
Governor of West Virginia is a friend of mine.  He
was raised in Marion County about 15 miles from me.
He lost friends and family in a terrible coal mine
explosion in his hometown, Farmington, West Virginia
in 1968.  His name is Joe Manchin. As Governor I
would expect Joe to do something about coal mine
safety especially non-union mines but it’s my belief
Joe has political ambitions.  He proably doesn’t
want to rock any boats right now.  I think he has
his eye on Robert Byrd’s senate seat once he finally
meets the grim reaper which shouldn’t be to far off
in the future.

Christian96:  Your long-ago-previous post got by me:

“I’m considering writing a book and titling
it “Coal Miner’s Son” as a take off on Loretta Lynn’s
“Coal Miner’s Daughter.”  I could not only give an
inside look at growing up in Appalachia but also
relate what it’s like leaving Appalachia to go out
into the world outside of Appalachia.  Thanks for
showing an interest in coal miners.  I’m afraid
the reaction of many people when they heard about
the explosion was, “Oh, my God, what’s going to
happen to my stock in Massey?”

Just to encourage you to write your story.  The world needs it. And real live stories have a lot more impact than statistics or preachments.  I’m from Pittsburgh and saw something of the mines around California, Pa years ago. Certain historical groups in the Pittsburgh area are collecting personal real-life stories to archive them and save them for future reference.  Google:  Pittsburgh History.  That might list them somewhere.

Big Branch should have been shut down. It wasn’t - not by the Bush
administration, and not by the Obama administration. Now Massey should be shut
down permanently. These mine owners should not be allowed to appeal their
citations anymore. They should be made to comply or shut down. Period.

RE DIONNE:  “Blankenship views this as the cost of doing business. “Violations
are unfortunately a normal part of the mining process,” he said in a radio
interview with West Virginia Metro News. “There are violations at every coal
mine in America and UBB (Upper Big Branch) was a mine that had violations.”

Surely justice will prevail, E.J.  .  .  The Supreme Court has declared that
corporations are natural persons, and since natural persons are held
accountable for their conduct, I’m sure Massey’s Board of Directors, major
shareholders, and corporate management - along with all the politicians who
aided and abetted them - will be prosecuted for criminal negligence.

“. . . Criminal negligence is a ‘misfeasance or ‘nonfeasance’ (see omission),
where the fault lies in the failure to foresee and so allow otherwise avoidable
dangers to manifest. In some cases this failure can rise to the level of willful
blindness where the individual intentionally avoids adverting to the reality of a
situation .  .  . The degree of culpability is determined by applying a reasonable
person standard. Criminal negligence becomes “gross” when the failure to
foresee involves a “wanton disregard for human life. .  .”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criminal_negligence

By christian96, April 10 at 9:31 am

My heritage is from europe but I recognize a better civilization
when I see one, albeit too late except in knowing which
societies are the better ones and I wholly believe that the pre-
european invasion indigenous people were vastly more of a
better people and of better ‘faith’.

One of my favorite quotes:

““Their wise ones said ‘we might have their religion’ but when
we? tried to understand it we found that there were too many
kinds ?of religions among white men for us to understand, and
that ?scarcely any two white men agreed which was the right
one to ?learn. This bothered us a good deal until we saw that
the white?man did not take his religion any more seriously than
he did his ?laws, and that he kept both of them just behind
him, like ?helpers, to use when they might do him good in his
dealings with ?strangers. These are not our ways. We kept the
laws we made ?and lived our religion. We have never been able
to understand ?the white man, who fools nobody but himself.”“?
Plenty Coups
?Absaroke Crow Indian

Maybe this disaster will help people think differently about the “Obama war on coal miners.”

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2010/04/10/us/AP-US-Mine-Explosion-Politics.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=west virginia coal AP&st=cse

Maybe they will go back to locking doors in sweat shops in case of fire!...... Oh, they have, just not in the USA.  compassionate corporations and free enterprise lobbying 24/7,  have been successful in bringing the USA back to the 1890’s or early 20th century, a successful sentiment against unions. 

Using the same tactics against the steel workers, union in about 1914, publicizing through copious advertisements, stressing fear, saying unions were nothing but socialism and Communism,  public sentiment turned away from the steel workers. One would believe, their own best interests then as today seems very close to the same public support of corporations against the workers,  after all corporations are people too!

The past 20 years has become much worse for the working slob, Tea Baggers are a prime example of people being against their own best interests, seemingly an extension of corporations today manipulating and lobbying an agenda of continuous programed manipulations.

Samosamo—-Are you native American?  I am a blood
relative of Quanah Parker, the last Chief of the
Commanches who never lost a battle to the white man.
I’m proud of that heritage.  I spent hours this
morning trying to discover the fate of the 4 remaining miners trapped in the mine.  I couldn’t
get any information from CNN because they were too
busy covering Tiger Woods.  Around 3 am, I finally
discovered from the Charleston Daily Mail, Charleston, West Virginia that the 4 miners had been
found dead.  My grandfather worked 50 years in the
coal mines.  My father worked 40 years.  I worked
6 months while going to college and hated every
minute of it.  Terrible job.  Dark, dirty, and
dangerous.  I worked in a union mine which is more
safe than a non-union mine.  In a non-union mine
workers fear losing their jobs if they report a
condition in the mine which is not safe.  Tiger
Woods.  I am sick of hearing about him.  Many times
on television I have seen him say “God Damn” when
he makes a mistake in golf.  It looks like God
humbled him a little.  He hasn’t seen anything yet.
Wait until he dies and is judged by God.  Let’s see
Buddah help him then.

In answer to your title to this piece, ‘Yew betcha! After all it is
corporate and there is NO time for compassion or amenities for
those lost, them big boys gotta get them boys left over back to
extracting that toxic stuff out of the ground and times a wastin
here.

It takes events as this to vividly show how corporations work, or
better yet, don’t work for the people, and from what I see with
this massey group, they will push those miners back in when the
gas still is high enough to touch off another explosion.
Remember Utah in August 2007? Later in Oct. it was found the
mine owners were amiss with violations of mine inspections.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/10/03/congress.crandall.mine/i
ndex.html

We kill people to dig out and destroy the environment so to kill
more people or incur dangerous health situations by igniting the
poisons dug out of the earth. A weird kind of insanity because it
isn’t like they keep doing the same thing over and over hoping
for a better result, they just keep doing the same thing to rape
the land, endanger people to just make an almighty profit.

Mestizo Warrior—-Well spoken.  I couldn’t have
said it any better myself.

The Times had a story this afternoon about how a WV congressman is under attack for not being sufficiently pro-mining, but they took it down before I could get the link. Looks like Massey is making a full-court press.

The miners at the Massey coal mine will only be forgotten if we allow that to occur. All workers, miners, refinery workers, truck drivers, nurses, hotel workers, farm workers, etc, all of us work to feed our families and provide decent shelter.

Mining bosses like Don Blankenship make all the money and he did not ever get his hands soiled. Not once did Blankenship do even a fraction of the work that a miner does, yet he is more than generously rewarded for being a money pinching mizer! Blankenship has shown his contempt for federal mine safety regulations now and in the past. He has never had to pay a personal price for his gross negligence and indifference. Perhaps the government should shut all Massey coal mines down, nationalize them and then repoen them and use the revenues from the coal produced to assist miners and their families. Blankenship should be indicted, prosecuted and jailed!

JDmysticDJ—-They have already forgotten the miners.
I spent this morning trying to get news about an
update on trying to reach the 4 remaining miners
that haven’t been located.  Most of the CNN coverage
was about a 90 year old man retiring from the Supreme
Court this summer.  There was less than a minute
coverage that the area where the 4 miners are located
cannot be reached because of smoke which leads them
to believe a fire is in the mine. The mine my father
worked in was forced to close in the 80’s after a
fire in the mines.  Concrete was poured into all
openings to cut off oxygen to the fire.  The mine
never re-opened.  Many men and women lost their
jobs when the mine closed.  You mentioned John Prine’s song “Daddy take me back to Muhlenburg County.”  I was born in Muhlenburg County, Kentucky
on April 15, 1940.  When I was 5 we moved to Marion
County, West Virginia where my father’s brother got
dad a job in the mines.  My maternal grandmother,
Susie Abercrombie, was born in Marion County. Mom
told me we are related to the Abercrombies who own
the department store but I’m not sure how. Somehow
grandma got to Kentucky and married grandpa Cardwell
but I’m not sure how.  During the miners vacation,
usually in June, daddy would take us back to Muhlenburg County to visit relatives.  My maternal
and paternal grandparents lived very close to the
Green River mentioned in John Prine’s song.  When
I was about 15, daddy took me back to Muhlenburg
County to attend a celebration for Merle Travis,
a native of Muhlenburg County.  Merle was famous
for writing the song “16 Tons” which Tennessee Ernie
Ford sang.  Merle also appeared in the movie “From
Here To Eternity” singing the song “Re-enlistment
Blues.”  While we were watching two boys sing on stage, daddy said, “Those boys are pretty good.”
I responded, “Yeah, they’re real good.”  Daddy
responded, “They are Ike Everly’s boys!”  It wasn’t
long after that day the Everly Brothers became
popular worldwidee.  Ike Everly lived next door to
my maternal grandfather and grandmother in Muhlenburg
County.  Merle Travis also wrote a song titled “Dark
As A Dungeon” about working in the mines.  I worked
six months on midnight shift in the mines and believe me it is dark as a dungeon.  When I hear those old songs they bring back a lot of good memories.  I’m considering writing a book and titling
it “Coal Miner’s Son” as a take off on Loretta Lynn’s
“Coal Miner’s Daughter.”  I could not only give an
inside look at growing up in Appalachia but also
relate what it’s like leaving Appalachia to go out
into the world outside of Appalachia.  Thanks for
showing an interest in coal miners.  I’m afraid
the reaction of many people when they heard about
the explosion was, “Oh, my God, what’s going to
happen to my stock in Massey?”

I wouldn’t want to force people to move from a beautiful place like West Virginia, but I do wish we had a way of creating a new economy there. As it is, we are just cannibalizing the land and the people for short term gain. A hundred years from now when it’s all mined out, the environment will be devastated still and ordinary people will have little to show for it.

I too have little hope for “Clean Coal.” Shutting down the mines just might be a noble goal.

Guessing first we’d have to find or develop an alternative energy source and convert existing power plants. After that maybe offer some serious retraining and replacement jobs for thousands (hundreds of thousands?) of American miners. If you’re thinkin’ solar or wind, then a lot of West Virginians would have to be relocated as well. Sorry, It’s the pragmatist speaking.

In the meantime how about a couple of environmental suits and oxygen tanks should “stuff” happen again?

Progwoman:

“If you’ll note, schools are substandard in mining areas. If people had better educations and more options, and knew they did, we could break their dependence on the careless indifference of mine operators. And maybe we could get on with cleaning up the mess that coal mines make. “

You hit the nail on the head. Right-wingers criticize government and spending money on human investment. It keeps the masses from the opportunity to rise above their circumstances and understand how they are being exploited by the privileged.

Keep the masses ignorant and uninformed is certainly a goal of those who are subsidized by our taxes in so many ways: sports team owners, rich farmers getting paid for not growing crops, companies who pollute and kill without paying in money or their lives, those who pay no taxes like the McCourts, those receiving pay without performing like Mitch O’Connell, human (or inhuman as you see it) leeches like Limbaugh, etc.

I spent most of the winter watching dark clouds hover overhead from two nearby coal-burning power plants. Electricity is cheap, and that appeals to people in bad economic times, but we are in denial about the price we pay. There is no such thing as “clean coal,” because the mining industry is never going to invest in the needed technology.

I think the only thing that can be done to keep these mining catastrophes from recurring is to shut the mines. Say that, and people chastise you for being insensitive to the way people have made a living for generations. But surely they feel they have no alternative.

If you’ll note, schools are substandard in mining areas. If people had better educations and more options, and knew they did, we could break their dependence on the careless indifference of mine operators. And maybe we could get on with cleaning up the mess that coal mines make.

How long will it take for it to sink in that no one gives a tinkers damn about workers?  Do they get paid a “fair” salary.  Only the deaf dumb and blind would answer yes. 
In this land of the “free” property is the only real value Those who own our property are living like colonial Indian maharajas.  It is they who make the laws for themselves to protect their property.  Humans and workers are disposible items, easily replaced.  Our justice system is as much a parody of justice as Congress a parody of representation and Washington an isolated Versailles where old men play bilboquet with our lives.

JD - LOL - I was wondering if you were gunna catch that!

:-p

Miners not minors. Though minors are exploited too.

The minors are forgotten already, even when discussing the issue they are forgotten.

I love these condescending comments about minors, suggesting they are just bumpkins whose lives are only about mining. I won’t deify them, but I’m sure they are like other people, some good, and some bad. Some smart, some not so smart. I’m sure they have families, friends, neighborhoods and communities. I’m sure they laugh, and they cry, the fall in love, they get their hearts broken. They teach they’re children to walk and talk, and they watch them grow…  I would be less likely to attribute these human qualities, and emotions, to Blankenship, and Massey’s stockholders.

What the minors need is Joseph Yablonski , to help them to become more noticeable, but the owners killed him.

There’s an old union song that was written by a coal minors woman back in the 30’s, it’s called “Which Side Are You On”? Until the American people and their elected representatives leave the owner’s side, and get on the minors’ side, minors, and others, will continue to be forgotten.

“And daddy won’t you take me back to Muhlenberg County
Down by the Green River where Paradise lay
Well, I’m sorry my son, but you’re too late in asking
Mister Peabody’s coal train has hauled it away”

Is it that Mining Companies do not have environmental suits? Why not?

Gerard, Knuckle dragging folks need to eat too you know!

Exploiting other people is what free enterprise is all about, a constant goal of trying to get people to work as close to free as possible, safety should never be an option getting in the way of profit.

Limbaugh will probably tell us all these miners are faking it!

‘Please, please,’ you say, ‘can’t we just all get along?’ 
Are you kidding? 

That was the most fatalistic and cynical conclusion to a blog I’ve ever read complete with the guise of ‘oh dear, do we have to be so mean?’

Leefeller:  You had better label your previous comment as satire or sarcasm because coming off straight like it is, it’s too close to the actual mind-set of “free-enterprise” knuckle-draggers who don’t know any better.

Mike789—-When I ask the Dean why my contract would
not be renewed he responded, “We have had a cut back
in funds.”  That was a lie and I knew it. If it was
true I shouldn’t have been the one let go because
there was a fellow hired after me.  He should have
been let go.  I had a professor I had become friends
with in the Education department.  She cared deeply
about students and would go out of her way to assist
them in any way she could.  We use to sit in the student union for hours discussing education.  She
was a physically attractive woman and I was above
average in physical apppearance.  I am sure there was
much gossip around campus of a possible affair between us.  I was told in November my contract would
not be renewed.  I went home for the Christmas break.
My divorced sister’s husband had arranged for a female friend to lure my sister out of the home while
he kidnapped their two children.  He refused to allow
the children to come to my mother and father’s home
for Christmas.  The unopened gifts remained under
the Christmas tree for days.  It was hard on my parents.  That’s the only time in my life I thought
about killing someone.  When I realized I would be
killing my niece and nephew’s “daddy” I forgot about
killing him.  It was a bad Christmas.  When I got back to campus I discovered my friend in the Education department had been killed over the Christmas holidays.  Her husband hired a black fellow
to kill her with a shotgun when she answered the door.  I don’t know what was happening domestically
for her.  My guess is the marriage wasn’t a happy one.  My guess is she expressed concern about me being released which probably had some influence
upon his already angry paranoid mind.  All in all,
it was a terrible time in my life.  Back to the
miners.  Larry King, Anderson Cooper, and other
people asking questions on TV do not know what questions to ask.  They should be asking about the
specifics of mine inspections.  (1) Is the air in
the entire mines evaluated or just parts of the
mine?  How are the air measurements made?  If it is
done objectively what is the level considered to be
“dangerous?” What is the standard deviation of the
level considered to be dangerous?  For example, if
an instrument measures methane level of 100 to be
normal the standard deviation might be 15 which
means any reading from 85(100 minus 15) to 115(100
plus 15) would be considered “normal.”  However, a
reading of 114 might be considered normal but it is
quite close to being considered “above normal.”
Not being familiar with coal mining the people on
TV just do not know what questions to ask during
their interviews.

christian96

All I can utter is “Wow”.

It would appear that in your case a trustee or alumni made a stink. Cripes, not even a caution such that you could opt out of the appearance?

My understanding was that only mine operations that stirred up dust were suspended duing inspections.

I think it’s beyond forgetting the miners. It is prosecuting the mine owner with criminal charges cost him beyond a few million dollars.

Government regulations are nothing but another way to socialize.

Businesses are having such a hard time trying to make money without having to deal with all kinds of government regulations always hanging over their heads, business knows what is best for business, that’s why the bile out happened, CEO’s need their annual bonuses!

Capitalism needs to be free, free as the birds and the bees,...... so, you want socialism, What! Do you want to be called…... pinko again?

Mike789—-It’s been over 40 years since I worked
in the mines.  I can’t recall the inspection
process and who conducted it.  I don’t recall the
mines being shut down for inspections but protocol
has probably changed significantly since I was there.
I’m personally concerned about the small non-union
mines.  I can almost assure you if a miner complained
of a safety condition they would receive a pink slip.
There are thousands of people waiting on his/her
position.  I’ve contacted Larry King and Anderson
Cooper by e-mail but haven’t heard from either one.
They don’t know what questions to ask.  They aren’t
going to contact me.  I was teaching at a university
in 1976.  An article came out in the univ. newspaper
that I would be appearing on a TV talkshow to discuss
why wealthy people neglect poor people.  The next
day I was called into the Dean’s office and informed
my teaching contract would not be renewed.  After
that I was never able to locate another university
teaching position.  I’m almost certain I’m on a black
list somewhere.  Wealthy people in power do not want
me close to a television program.

christian96

This detailed and comprehensive questionaire is appreciated. It should be forwarded to every Congressional committee member at the forthcoming investigation.

Listening to NPR yesterday, an author who also had worked in a mine mentioned another obvious shortcoming of the inspection process. The mines operations are virtually shut down during inspectons which effectively skews its monioring.

Nothing will happen. Our politicos will look the other way, the company considers the miners cannon fodder. But worse is the public, who just don’t give a shit about our class of Morlocks. As long as our homes have electricity and natural gas we could care less.

The true shame of this latest mine disaster is the fact that we have all been shown by the MSM the sub-culture of these mining towns that exists in the 21st century USA. In this “Land that Time Forgot” are people who have not left 1930. They have but one ambition, go to the mine, just like daddy and grand-daddy, and most likely die younger than every other american. In their little closed eco-system these are the only jobs. None of them have aspirations outside their little valleys. We are as invisible to them as they are to us.

I expect this slug, the owner, will pay his way out of this.  We can almost guess what the authorities will say in his defense.  He will, of course, make major contributions to various political parties and candidates which will grease this decision.  He will walk away, a few dollars poorer, but still very much in control.  Only when someone puts a slug in this slug will there be changes in Massey’s   behavior.  I’m not advocating anything ... just doing a Fox News “what if” scenario.  Hey Glenn, how’s about taking this one on?

I was raised in a coal mining town in West Virginia.
My grandfather worked 50 years in the mines.  My
father worked 40 years.  I worked midnight shift for
6 months while attending undergraduate school. I hated every minute of it.  I was fortunate to complete Master and Doctoral degrees, teach at several major universities and serve as School Psychologist for public schools.  I would like to
see the individuals on TV ask the following questions:

(1) How many times is a mine inspected? Daily? Weekly? Monthly? Yearly?
(2) Is the entire mine inspected or just a section
of the mine?
(3) Who does the inspecting?  Coal company inspector? United Mine Workers of America inspector? State inspector? Federal inspector?
(4) What is the protocol for inspections? Is the
mine owner notified in advance of the impending
inspection?  If so, how long in advance of the inspection is the miner owner notified?  When I served as School Psychologist our Special Education Director and Superintendent would be notified by
the state months in advance of the inspection of our Special Education program.  To me, this notification in advance seemed to defeat the purpose of the inspection.
(5) Are mines ever inspected randomly without mine
owners and personnel notified of impending inspections?
(6) Once an inspector discovers a violation what is the procedure that follows?  Who receives copies of the written violation? What procedure follows after a violation is written?  Where does it go?  Who
processes the violation?  What is the time-table
from the time a violation is written to the time a
mine owner is notified in writing of the violation?
(7) How long is the owner given to correct the
violation?  Is a follow-up conducted to evaluate
compliance by the mine owner? How long a period of
time transpires between the original inspection and
the compliance inspection?
(8) If the mine owner neglects to comply with correcting the violation what procedure transpires? Does the inspector have authority to shut down
the mining operation until the violation is corrected?
(9) Are coal miners informed of inspection violations?  Can the miners refuse to work until the violation is corrected?
(10) If a coal miner detects a dangerous condition in the mine can he/she resport the dangerous condition?  If so, to whom does the miner report
the dangerous condition?  If the miner lacks the
ability to express the dangerous condition in writing is there an alternative means for reporting the condition? If the alternative means is oral to whom does the miner report the condition?  Does the person receiving the oral report complete a written form including the date, time, and nature of the
dangerous condition?  Do both parties date and sign the form?  What then is done with the form?  If the mine is not a member of the United Mine Workers of America what procedures protect the job of the miner reporting the dangerous condition?
(11) Are miners evaluated periodically for job performance?  If so, who conducts the evaluations?  Are results of the evaluation written, given to the miner, and filed by the coal company?
(12) When a miner is terminated does the miner receive a written reason for the termination? Can the miner appeal the termination decision?  If so, what procedures and individuals are a part of the
appeal process? Is there a state or federal agency to whom the miner can appeal the termination?