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Why Liberal Sellouts Attack Prophets Like Cornel West

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Posted on May 22, 2011
Mr. Fish

By Chris Hedges

The liberal class, which attempted last week to discredit the words my friend Cornel West spoke about Barack Obama and the Democratic Party, prefers comfort and privilege to justice, truth and confrontation. Its guiding ideological stance is determined by what is most expedient to the careers of its members. It refuses to challenge, in a meaningful way, the decaying structures of democracy or the ascendancy of the corporate state. It glosses over the relentless assault on working men and women and the imperial wars that are bankrupting the nation. It proclaims its adherence to traditional liberal values while defending and promoting systems of power that mock these values.The pillars of the liberal establishment—the press, the church, culture, the university, labor and the Democratic Party—all honor an unwritten quid pro quo with corporations and the power elite, as well as our masters of war, on whom they depend for money, access and positions of influence. Those who expose this moral cowardice and collaboration with corporate power are always ruthlessly thrust aside.

The capitulation of the liberal class to corporate capitalism, as Irving Howe once noted, has “bleached out all political tendencies.” The liberal class has become, Howe wrote, “a loose shelter, a poncho rather than a program; to call oneself a liberal one doesn’t really have to believe in anything.” The decision to subordinate ethics to political expediency has led liberals to steadily surrender their moral autonomy, voice and beliefs to the dictates of the corporate state. As Dwight Macdonald wrote in “The Root Is Man,” those who do not make human beings the center of their concern soon lose the capacity to make any ethical choices, for they willingly sacrifice others in the name of the politically expedient and practical.

By extolling the power of the state as an agent of change, as well as measuring human progress through the advances of science, technology and consumption, liberals abetted the cult of the self and the ascendancy of the corporate state. The liberal class placed its faith in the inevitability of human progress and abandoned the human values that should have remained at the core of its activism. The state, now the repository of the hopes and dreams of the liberal class, should always have been seen as the enemy. The destruction of the old radical and militant movements—the communists, socialists and anarchists—has left liberals without a source of new ideas. The link between an effective liberal class and a more radical left was always essential to the health of the former. The liberal class, by allowing radical movements to be dismembered through Red baiting and by banishing those within its ranks who had moral autonomy, gradually deformed basic liberal tenets to support unfettered capitalism, the national security state, globalization and permanent war. Liberalism, cut off from the radical roots of creative and bold thought, merged completely with the corporate power elite. The liberal class at once was betrayed and betrayed itself. And it now functions like a commercial brand, giving a different flavor, face or spin to the ruthless mechanisms of corporate power. This, indeed, is the primary function of Barack Obama.

The liberal class, despite becoming an object of widespread public scorn, prefers the choreographed charade. It will decry the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan or call for universal health care, but continue to defend and support a Democratic Party that has no intention of disrupting the corporate machine. As long as the charade is played, the liberal class can hold itself up as the conscience of the nation without having to act. It can maintain its privileged economic status. It can continue to live in an imaginary world where democratic reform and responsible government exist. It can pretend it has a voice and influence in the corridors of power. But the uselessness and irrelevancy of the liberal class are not lost on the tens of millions of Americans who suffer the indignities of the corporate state. And this is why liberals are rightly despised by the working class and the poor.

The liberal class is incapable of reforming itself. It does not hold within its ranks the rebels and iconoclasts who have the moral or physical courage to defy the corporate state and power elite. And when someone such as Cornel West speaks out, packs of careerist liberals—or perhaps one should call them neoliberals—descend on the apostate like hellhounds, never addressing the truths that are expressed but instead engaging in vicious character assassination. The same thing happened to Ralph Nader, Noam Chomsky, Dennis Kucinich, Jeremiah Wright and others who defied the political orthodoxy of corporate capitalism. The corporate forces, which have taken control of the press and which break unions, run the universities, fund the arts and own the Democratic Party, demand the banishment of all who question the good intentions of the powerful. Liberals who comply are tolerated within the system. They are permitted to busy themselves with the boutique activism of political correctness, inclusiveness or multiculturalism. If they attempt to fight for the primacy of justice, they become pariahs.

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Anarcissie's avatar

By Anarcissie, June 14, 2011 at 7:46 am Link to this comment

Part of the distorted self engendered by the culture of slavery (in whose shadow we all live, even those of us out in the woods), is the tendency to invidiously deprecate the character and superficial behavior of others, usually not a whole lot different from our own.  It’s a waste of time (in my opinion—you may enjoy it).  And it’s certainly not getting us down the road to the Revolution, or whatever it is we’re trying to get down the road to.

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By Inherit The Wind, June 14, 2011 at 7:40 am Link to this comment

This Old Savage is asking ‘cause us surviving Free Wild Peoples, of ALL Kinds,
*******

A guy sitting pecking at a computer, on the World Wide Web, on a grossly political web site (and I don’t mean “gross” negatively but rather excessively), using electricity and the ultimate mark of the industrial world, international CON-nectivity…
And this guy clams to be a “surviving Free Wild Person”!

Now THAT is a serious, but hilarious CON-dition!

Hokem-today!

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katsteevns's avatar

By katsteevns, June 14, 2011 at 5:49 am Link to this comment

@ TAO Walker,

You also, will be on the receiving end of her wrath just like the rest of us.
    So I’d suggest you “Settle matters quickly with your adversary who is taking you to court. Do it while you are still together on the way, or your adversary may hand you over to the judge, and the judge may hand you over to the officer, and you may be thrown into prison.”.

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By TAO Walker, June 13, 2011 at 9:04 pm Link to this comment

Maybe “katsteevns” will tell us exactly what “sink(ing)” “ship” s/he seems so
damned sure we’re all on.  Is it the political system, which is nothing but a
CONfidence schemers’ shell-game?  Is it the eCONomy, which is nothing but
the ‘operating system’ for the “civilization” disease?  Is it the make-believe
CONstruct called “America,” which is nothing but a figment of collected captive
fevered imaginations?  Is it the “global” gulag, which is nothing but the last stop
at the DEAD END of the ‘dominance’ paradigm?  Is it the entire “civilization”
syndrome, which is nothing but the effects of the sick and sickening “self”
process, as it wears itself out, again, in its latest attempt to suck all the Natural
Vitality from all of us and All Our Relations and our Mother, and to degrade this
Natural Vitality into the various sorts of degenerate “energy” the damned thing
has come utterly to depend-on. 

This Old Savage is asking ‘cause us surviving Free Wild Peoples, of ALL Kinds,
aren’t actually ‘on’ any metaphorical vessel at-all, but rather abiding firmly
within the Whole Living Arrangement of our our Mother Earth.  So, of course,
are even our tame Sisters and Brothers, though the foundering “ship” (Is it that
infamous “Ship-of-Fools”?) “katsteevns” and so many of ‘em feel so totally
CONtrapped ‘aboard’ is taking-up so much of their precious attention that
they’ve all-but forgotten where it is that they’re all actually living-and-
breathing (more-or-less) together every Day.

That “katsteevns” remains blind to the Living World all around us All, yet
complains here constantly, and somewhat bitterly, about not having it shown to
his/her “self,” only illustrates the accuracy of the old adage about “....those who
will not see.”  That the disability s/he suffers is part-and-parcel of the
“civilization” disease fever dream, and will go-on afflicting him/her ‘til s/he
wakes-up from it, is certainly not the doing of this Old Medicine Man….who has
been here for awhile now poking at the “dreamers” so they’ll maybe, some of
‘em anyhow, come-around enough to at-least start taking their
Medicine….start getting-over their “self.”

So, wake-up, presently captive Persons and Peoples….from the nightmare that
IS your wannabe parasitic and much-too-precious “self”....‘cause, ready-or-
not, Life Herownself is coming to “kick-down” the damned thing’s “doors.”

HokaHey!

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By katsteevns, June 13, 2011 at 7:06 pm Link to this comment

@ TAO Walker

        You remind me of the Born-Again Christians who also preach the “only true way”. They too have a “force field” around them that no one can penetrate. They too have no witness to the life they speak of. They too feel “above” the questions the gentiles put to them. Feeling superior makes it easy to “write off” anything the lower species has to say because they-just-don’t-get-it. If that is not some kind of syndrome, I don’t know what is.
        And the fact that you scoff at the human condition and tell us to “get over ourselves” is not exactly the best tactic for winning friends and influencing people.
        You seem content to watch the ship sink while you pat yourself on the back knowing that you “told us so”. You seem to forget that you are also on this ship, and you will gurgle your last breath like the rest of us..

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By Anarcissie, June 13, 2011 at 4:44 pm Link to this comment

Copwatch is a group or organization that tries to record instances of police violence, brutality and harassment, including textual descriptions and video and audio recordings.  They used to have a web site where the material was collected and categorized, but it seems to be down at the moment.  They also give classes in legal self-defense aimed at those who are most at risk.

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By TAO Walker, June 13, 2011 at 4:19 pm Link to this comment

A lyrical word-of-caution from Bob Dylan might give “katsteevns” (whose
chronic ‘Stockholm Syndrome’ is flaring-up again) some cause for pause.  “That
god that you’ve been prayin’ to’s gonna give you what you been wishin’ on
someone else.”  The fear-ruled “individual” can’t stand even the thought of
anybody not subject to its dictates, and so seeks reflexively to drag everybody
down into the pit of their own “self”-CONtrived virtual ‘cage.’

Still, s/he should not feel so all alone.  There’re many keeping a bizarre kind of
‘company’ in the socio-engineered and industrially CONstructed solitary-
CONfinement of their common “individual”-iized misery.

For us surviving Free Wild Peoples, that CONdition is the very definition of
“hell-on-earth”....and “on-wheels,” too.

HokaHey!

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By katsteevns, June 13, 2011 at 12:42 pm Link to this comment

@ TAO Walker

Well, I guess you don’t talk about the subject of pride either, except when it can make someone ELSE look bad….but I can assure you, without it you would be dead.
  It is only when some people, such as yourself, have taken too large a dose, that alarm bells start going off. This induces some to interdict the conversation, what you call “taking pot-shots”.

Too much pride usually means that the person is overcompensating for a lack in some other area of their lives. Politics is chock full of these types, but instead of calling them to account, politics feeds and nurtures the disease. We see it in our president who is “above morality” when it comes to life and death decisions. Same with the military or CEO’s.

I keep wondering how you are going to fair if a SWAT team brakes down your door, kills your dog, and carts you off to solitary for 10 long years of no natural light and no criminal charges. How will your “NUM-YO-HO-REN-GAY-KYO” help you then?!?

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By TAO Walker, June 13, 2011 at 11:10 am Link to this comment

So one wonders how “katsteevns” would characterize his/her own reactionary
popping-in-and-out-of the virtual woodwork here…. to take potshots at what is,
after-all, only his own made-up cartoon CONfabulation, a caricature drawn from
his own worst nightmares?  S/he prpb’ly looks much more favorably upon the
behavior induced by these distorted images from his/her own troubled
mind….worried “individual” that “katsteevns” so obviously is.

Chances are, too, that the virtual ‘shoe’ s/he tries, again, to force onto this Old
Indian’s ‘foot’ fits his/her own"self” to a T.

HokaHey!

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By katsteevns, June 13, 2011 at 9:04 am Link to this comment

@ TAO Walker

There really is no harm in self-congratulation in Gary Mont’s case.

You can not tell me that you have no pride. Why, it is plastered all over these pages. If that doesn’t emanate from the “self”, then I don’t know what does.
  You may claim that your pride resides only in how it is transformed by the “Way”. But, I bet there are many here who would say that your pride comes from and builds up your"self”.
  You display all the characteristics of the neighborhood bully who needs friends but has a self esteem deficiency. The “Way” is your shield against the cruel world. You step from behind it to sling your exotic arrows as slow pitches, curves and fast balls. Then you dash back to the safe place behind the shield, snickering.

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By katsteevns, June 13, 2011 at 8:44 am Link to this comment

@ Anarcissie,

I don’t know about Copwatch but I would say that Oath Keepers is transformative in the sense that it is geared to awakening cops, vets and politicians to the original oath they swore to at the beginning of their careers, an oath apparently forgotten or glossed over by many.

People like Bradley Manning and Franz Kafka, might not be in prison now if more people were awake to their Constitutional duties and held each other accountable.
    In the US, it seems like this would be a prerequisite to any further self-transformations. There aren’t too many practices that can cause people to endure years of solitary confinement and sanctioned torture.

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By Anarcissie, June 13, 2011 at 8:06 am Link to this comment

katsteevns, June 13 at 4:12 am:

‘... I would suggest that the OATH KEEPERS will be one of the most important groups to emerge.
  This group holds law enforcement accountable for the oath they took to protect the rights of US citizens per the Constitution. ...’

There is also Copwatch.

I was trying to come up with examples of self-transformative practices.  There is nothing wrong with defensive activism, such as that mentioned above, but I don’t know if we can say it transforms the participants.  Maybe it does.  Often one kind of activism leads to other kinds.

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By TAO Walker, June 13, 2011 at 8:03 am Link to this comment

Gary Mont did in-fact claim the mantle of “lone wolf” awhile back….in what at-
the-time and in-CONtext suggested it was used as a somewhat “self”-
CONgratulatory epithet.  Not yet CONvinced of Mr. Mont’s actual kinship with Wolf,
however, this Indian chose the term loner (not in quotes), instead, as being equally
faithful to the evident intent of his basic meaning, but without the perhaps “self”-
satisfying presumptions implicit in his own formulation.  That term was, in-any-
case, meant to be merely descriptive.

“Demeaning,” like so much ‘else,’ lies strictly in the mind’s-eye of the “self”-
selected decipherer.

HokaHey!

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By katsteevns, June 13, 2011 at 7:39 am Link to this comment

By TAO Walker,

If Gary Mont had used the demeaning loaded term “loner” to describe himself, then you would have no cause to repeat it. But, if you can cause people to see him in this light, it augments your argument. Nice move!!

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By TAO Walker, June 13, 2011 at 6:50 am Link to this comment

Thanks to “self”-CONfessed loner Gary Mont for providing a fairly precise
word-picture of a Person caught in the death-grip of a too-precious “self.” 
Thanks to “Anarcissie,” also, for reminding us again of the ultimate
impossibility of “going-it-alone” (as a commenter on another thread
recommended, perhaps ironically, awhile back). 

If “Litl Bludot” just keeps on “dig"ging, s/he will get beneath the abstract
superficialites of all “ideology” (none of which is non-toxic, in the final analysis)
with its make-believe morality plays and the shallow posings and posturings
that are the virtual ‘bread-and-butter’ of all political theater.  She will
recognize the eCONomy for the inherently death-dealing CON-TRAPtion it is. 
S/he WILL, then, get back to basic biology, the “biosphere,” our Living
Arrangement, The Hoop of Life, the never-ending Song ‘n’ Dance of Life
Herownself….‘cause that’s really ALL THERE IS, anyhow.

This Old Savage doesn’t mean to hurt anybody’s feelings here.  Sure, it’s tough
on our tame Sisters and Brothers having to endure, again, the terrifyingly
accelerating disintegration of that virtual world-o’-hurt to which the desperate
“self” is trying, more-and-more vainly, to keep them CONfined.  Yet this is what
always happens during the terminal stages of the “civilization” disease.  There
is just no preventing the process from running-its-course, either….the “self”-
serving CONceits of the most seriously infected ideologues to-the-CONtrary
notwithstanding

Getting through it, however, can be much less difficult, and even relatively
‘easy,’ for those who get together with family and friends and neighbors, right
where they live-and-breathe every Good Day, and who then give, all together,
their precious attention altogether to addressing the real Living Needs of each
other and of our Whole Living Arrangement, as these are presented naturally
and spontaneously, moment-by-moment, here in the Free Wild Living World
some of us call Indian Country.  Hell, even the U.S. military still acknowledges
this as the ultimately unCONquerable ‘homeland’ of all that simply will not,
ever, CONform to the dictates of the CONcentrtion camp “ideology.” 

This coming together (as Natural Persons in-Community) to fulfill together
Humanity’s given Organic Function as a vital component in Her immune system
is, in our long and hard-earned experience, the best and likely only Way to
really get-over the sick and sickening “self”.  What some of us call The
Tiyoshpaye Way, The Way of Living Human Community, The Tao of Humanity, is
the one proven “delivery system” for The Medicine, The Living Virtue of Organic
Functional Integrity, which alone can cure what we are ALL, along with our
Mother Earth Herownself, afflicted-with….the “civilization” disease.

This Living Virtue is in-fact “The Fire” the Ancients spoke of, which is even now
effecting its transformation, cleansing Her and all of us of the dross and
detritus of “self”-delusion.  This is The Great Ceremony of Purification.

So let’s get well….ALL TOGETHER NOW!

HokaHey!

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By katsteevns, June 13, 2011 at 4:33 am Link to this comment

We no longer have freedom; there is only the appearance of freedom. - Chris Hedges

http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/no_justice_in_kafkas_america_20110613/

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By katsteevns, June 13, 2011 at 4:12 am Link to this comment

@ Anarcissi

I would suggest that the OATH KEEPERS will be one of the most important groups to emerge.
  This group holds law enforcement accountable for the oath they took to protect the rights of US citizens per the Constitution.
  I could be wrong but, I am afraid this group’s effectiveness may be nullified in the event of martial law and suspension of the Constitution. And I feel that those at the top of the food chain are sitting on the edge of their seats waiting for the opportunity to implement it.
  Unfortunately, the group is only open, at this point, to those who took the oath: law enforcement, military and vets.

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By Anarcissie, June 12, 2011 at 9:30 pm Link to this comment

Litl Bludot— My suggestion is to combine action on the self with cultural, social and political action, probably beginning with small groups of like-minded people.  I won’t specify exactly what kind of groups because people have different ideas, values, tastes, situations and so forth.  I myself have been involved with projects such as giving away free food in the parks (see http://bedstuyfnb.org and http://tinyurl.com/5uz3hh4 for examples of this sort of thing).  As some people say, ‘Be the change you want to see.’  But do something about the change in the world, too.  Agreed, this sort of thing doesn’t seem very earthshattering, but someday the spark is going to catch.

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By Night-Gaunt, June 12, 2011 at 8:39 pm Link to this comment

Actually its delegating reaction to the nervous system. It is why some people have such astonishing speed because there is no lag time with thinking about it. It just is done. That is why you need to be careful around those with martial arts training. The reactions will be without any empathic input. So they will have to catch up to stop or mitigate the normal swift response. I’ve experienced it. You can be thinking and talking yet the reaction will occur without you having to think about it. Such a capacity can be quite helpful.

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By Inherit The Wind, June 12, 2011 at 7:59 pm Link to this comment

Martial arts, ie. Kung Fu, Karate, Fen Tsu Ying Jow, Chin Na, all for example use repetitive physical movements to bypass the self’s natural reactions to attack, by imbuing the muscles themselves with a sense of self seperate from the mind. In effect, the body often reacts before the mind has decided if the situation calls for a response.

Transendental Meditation uses a mantra - a set of syllables that together have no meaning - such a “yol-suth-ref-makk”, which is repeated silently over and over while seated comfortably, until the analytical side of the brain becomes entirely engrossed in determining the repeated statement’s meaning and wanders off leaving only the imaginative half of the brain resident, so to speak.

Neural Linguistics Programming, while basically a set of psychological analytic tools for psychiatrists, uses “self” transfer in its training sessions in order to lessen the native grip of one’s self by having the trainees exchange personalities with each other - basically a role playing game where people pretend they are the person sitting next to them, which becomes almost real as the day wears on.
********

These things are well known.  Baseball players call it “Muscle Memory”, meaning your conscious mind can’t process a fastball and the spin on it so your unconscious mind provides the short cuts. It’s basic to training, whether it’s kata and bun-kai in karate, or Roman soldiers being told their training was bloodless battles and battles were bloody drills. The modern military puts it: Train like you fight so you’ll fight like you train.

I don’t care if it’s esoteric martial arts (and I have trained Karate) or Red Cross Life Saving: You train to react PROPERLY without thinking when the time comes.  Nothing fancy there.  But good to know.

As for the psychological exercise, well, children have been playing “I’ll be you and you be me” for 10,000 years. When my 6 year old was 3 he watched “Little Bear” play it.

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By Litl Bludot, June 12, 2011 at 7:51 pm Link to this comment

Anarcissie.  Your truism, if the society is screwed up then the laws will be too,
does present a major problem.  But if not the use of the remnants of our “justice”
system, then I hesitate to mention the alternative(s), other than nonviolent civil
disobedience. 

There is a big threshold here, at which point, all biology becomes untenable.  How
much time is left before that point is reached, and what measures do humans take
to save the biosphere and stop the rampant ideological parasitoid infection from
killing us all (probably with a good bit of torture of one kind or another
beforehand)?

What do you suggest??

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By katsteevns, June 12, 2011 at 7:05 pm Link to this comment

“Behind the ostensible government sits enthroned an invisible government owing no allegiance and acknowledging no responsibility to the people.” -
Theodore Roosevelt

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By Anarcissie, June 12, 2011 at 6:45 pm Link to this comment

Litl Bludot—It seems to me the laws are like philosophy:  they’re the disease for which they’re supposed to be the cure.  Philosophy we’re probably stuck with; it’s a virus that has burrowed into the very nucleotides of our psyches.  But the laws?  How about the Drug War laws?  Or, in other times and places, Jim Crow, Apartheid, the Nuremberg Race Laws, the Fugitive Slave Act?  How can we trust this social mechanism?  If the society is screwed up, if its culture is screwed up, then its laws are going to be screwed up.

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By Gary Mont, June 12, 2011 at 4:44 pm Link to this comment

Clarification.

Having delved somewhat into a number of learned “disciplines”  - for want of a better term - which alter the self in some way, or at least one’s perception of the self, I think I understand generally what Walker is referring to.

Martial arts, ie. Kung Fu, Karate, Fen Tsu Ying Jow, Chin Na, all for example use repetitive physical movements to bypass the self’s natural reactions to attack, by imbuing the muscles themselves with a sense of self seperate from the mind. In effect, the body often reacts before the mind has decided if the situation calls for a response.

Transendental Meditation uses a mantra - a set of syllables that together have no meaning - such a “yol-suth-ref-makk”, which is repeated silently over and over while seated comfortably, until the analytical side of the brain becomes entirely engrossed in determining the repeated statement’s meaning and wanders off leaving only the imaginative half of the brain resident, so to speak.

Neural Linguistics Programming, while basically a set of psychological analytic tools for psychiatrists, uses “self” transfer in its training sessions in order to lessen the native grip of one’s self by having the trainees exchange personalities with each other - basically a role playing game where people pretend they are the person sitting next to them, which becomes almost real as the day wears on.

All of these methods and many others allow some detachment from the self momentarily, but as pointed out by Anarsisse below, later on you’re right back there with your self, by your self.

Getting over your self on the other hand, could be taken as simply realizing that you are not the center of the universe and that together, we are far greater than any one individual can ever hope to be.

I was sorta hoping this was the message TW was trying to convey, but in truth, getting a straight answer out of that old man is harder than pulling quills out of a big dog’s mouth.

For me however, my self is the most dependable entity I know, and losing it would be far worse than simply dying. For me, getting over myself can not include the loss of my self or its permanent alteration. I function far better as a lone wolf than as a member of a co-op, or family. C’est la vie. I never have seen myself as the center of the universe however, so I may be wrong in this guess entirely.

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By Inherit The Wind, June 12, 2011 at 2:45 pm Link to this comment

Sleeping on a bed of nails builds character?  Is that like wearing a hair shirt or whipping yourself for “impure thoughts”. Isn’t that gadget some in Agnus Dei wear that digs prongs into their leg to draw blood. If I remember correctly, aren’t such people usually dangerous fanatics?

To my mind someone who does that IS a character.

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By Litl Bludot, June 12, 2011 at 2:22 pm Link to this comment

Anarcissie.  You do see the validity of my theory, and also the dilemma.  It is a matter of historical facts when determining those infected with the pathological ideology.

A definition is required. An ideology is pathological when it harms its host.  As parasites become pathological when they degrade the biology of their host.  In this instance, there is a disease that is unique to humans.  Only humans have ideologies.  There are more than one pathological ideologies.  In this case, to make it simple, we can isolate the one threatening to end life on this planet.  When parasites kill their hosts, they are called parasitoid.

Before the parasitoid ideology evolved into its present virulence and high infectivity, it had been kept under control through measures put in place by those humans still having some immunity to its effects.  We can trace this to the world views of quite a few indigenous societies that lived within nature and had strict mores against any behavior that destroyed the biosphere.  They came up with rules, mores, to keep the disease in check.  Those are still extant.  In fact some are what we call “laws”. 

Those who have broken these laws should be arrested and quarantined, STAT, as one says in a medical emergency.  An example, would be the highly contagious so-called bankster vectors infected with a particular virulent strain of the parasitoid ideology.  And of course, there are their covert vectors, such as Obama, who has broken constitutional laws pertaining to war and murder, if not obvious fraud and deceit.  He is a particularly recent mutation, and an advanced form of carrier for this parasitoid ideology, and as such a very effective vector for the spread of the most virulent strain of this parasitoid, biosphere destroying ideology; in that he is camouflaged brilliantly to present a benign and even healthy antidote to the very disease he spreads.  There are others of this type.

As you see, there are ways to start.  But first it takes those of us who have, for some reason, a resistance to this infection, an immunity which allows us to see that the biosphere (of course this includes everything that is human, what’s left of civilization), to peacefully, lawfully act towards its eradication.

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By Anarcissie, June 12, 2011 at 2:11 pm Link to this comment

My guess is that most people who sleep on beds of nails are providing entertainment, probably as part of a holy man or guru act.  It’s a living, I suppose.  Other reasons to sleep on a bed of nails are to strengthen one’s character or gain greater control over one’s body.  None of these aims seem intrinsically better or worse than sleeping on an innerspring mattress.  Rand is mistaking stuff for value, not a surprise in the context-impaired.

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By Inherit The Wind, June 12, 2011 at 1:09 pm Link to this comment

Somehow, I just got an image of Sid the Sloth sleeping a rock contorted into what must be the most uncomfortable position possible….

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By Inherit The Wind, June 12, 2011 at 1:07 pm Link to this comment

Depends on the context, doesn’t it?  Why is one sleeping on a bed of nails, or laboring to buy an inner-spring mattress?  How did they get where they are?  What’s going on around them?

Among other regrettable failings, Rand was not very good at context, at systems.
********

Can’t argue with that.  However, unless one is doing a circus act I have no problem rejecting out of hand the advantage of sleeping on a bed of nails.  Just what to “hammer” that home! smile

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By katsteevns, June 12, 2011 at 11:57 am Link to this comment

Before anyone considers pulling ones own hair out, this is basically what one will get for an answer from Holier Than Thou TAO Walker on any question that might, God forbid, threaten to squeeze out a FACT:

By katsteevns,
      “How many are you?”

By TAO Walker,
      “There can’t ever be too many,
      and there’s never enough.”

This answer could actually equal ZERO!

Stooping to the level of disrespect he has for most people here is what gets him off. Sure, he may know a few things, most do, but basic knowledge about common courtesy is not one of them.

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By Night-Gaunt, June 12, 2011 at 10:34 am Link to this comment

To the one who willingly sleeps on a bed of nails of course. Forgoing comfort to reach some “higher” level of mind/body continuity. Or so it is said.

Civilization is an important step for humans. However the kind of civilization can be argued as to whether it benefits just a few or all of its members, and how they are benefited.

Humans have the alarming capacity to ignore the outcomes of what they do. They can be self centered to the point that human and the biospheric suffering are as bothersome back ground noise. One of the main reasons, along with greed that we are in this deep shit right now and it will only get deeper as long as we continue on this course.

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By Anarcissie, June 12, 2011 at 9:34 am Link to this comment

Inherit The Wind, June 12 at 8:51 am:

‘... Despite the fact that I’m not a Randian, she did ask a very pertinent question:

Who is morally superior? The man who sleeps on a bed of nails or the man, who by the fruits of his labor, sleeps on an inner-spring mattress?’

Depends on the context, doesn’t it?  Why is one sleeping on a bed of nails, or laboring to buy an inner-spring mattress?  How did they get where they are?  What’s going on around them?

Among other regrettable failings, Rand was not very good at context, at systems.

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By Anarcissie, June 12, 2011 at 9:07 am Link to this comment

If the malformed self indeed fits into the contagious-disease metaphor, then it cannot be ‘cured’ by lone individuals, because (except for the rare immune types) they will simply be ‘reinfected’ by the others.  Nor can the ‘vectors’ be quarantined, because they are one and the same as the people who are supposed to be ‘cured’ of the ‘disease’.  The only possible ‘cure’ is social, cultural, communal, and, probably, political (because part of the ‘infecting’ or ‘deforming’ agency lies in the state, the political system.)

The notion that one can reform one’s self individually, or with the help of a guru, has indeed become a tradition passed down from antiquity, from Socrates to Freud and from Freud to the self-help books in the supermarket.  A parallel genealogy emanates from India.  I am not impressed by the results.

So then the question is, as usual, ‘What are we going to do about it?’

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By Inherit The Wind, June 12, 2011 at 8:51 am Link to this comment

In any case, this Turtle Island Native makes no “claim” whatsoever to being any kind of “american” at-all….and the windy fellah is welcome to keep all his own
“split hairs” to his “self.” 

***********

So where the f… IS Turtle Island if not in North America?  That, you angry old man, is hair-splitting! Are you trying to CON-vince me that because you don’t want to be “American” that’s it’s somewhere else?  “American” generally refers to US citizens, but “North American” refers to anyone living north of the Panama Canal, especially Mexicans, Canadians, and USAers.

“Native American” is merely the current term to describe the indigenous peoples of the Americas who were here before Columbus, who USED to be called “Indians”, as you ALWAYS refer to yourself as “This Old Indian”.  “Native American” has NOTHING to do with USA citizenship, as Andeans and Patagonians can be “Native Americans”  (BTW, you are NOT an Indian. I know DOZENS of Indians and Indian Americans and THEIR ancestral or even direct roots are all in INDIA, not anywhere in the Americas).

Despite the fact that I’m not a Randian, she did ask a very pertinent question:

Who is morally superior? The man who sleeps on a bed of nails or the man, who by the fruits of his labor, sleeps on an inner-spring mattress?

Hokem-To-Day!

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By Anarcissie, June 12, 2011 at 8:45 am Link to this comment

Litl Bludot, June 12 at 12:19 am:

‘It’s fairly simple.  Western culture (and not the only one) is infected with a pathological ideology that is anti life. ...  At some point the infection became epidemic, pandemic.  Those who are the worst infected and the most efficient vectors need to be quarantined ASAP.’

Concentration camps for those who have the wrong ideas?

How do you propose to bring this happy situation about?

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By TAO Walker, June 12, 2011 at 6:25 am Link to this comment

“Spirituality” and “asceticism” are also things to which this Old Man has never
laid claim.  If “ardee” thinks fulfilling our given Human Organic Function, as a
component in Earth’s immune system, is “simplistic,” s/he should maybe try it
sometime.

Isn’t this forum “dedicated,” rather, to “dig"ging beneath the surface
appearances of ‘The Situation,’ penetrating the veneer of the merely “political,”
for instance, and getting to its deeper “truth”....even if that means raising
matters here far outside the CONtrived bounds of CONventional ‘wisdom’? 
Hells bells, even Chris Hedges is saying lately there are no “political
solutions”....though the kind of resistance he proposes is essentially “political”
anyhow.

This Old Indian has simply taken “truthdig” at its own “word.”  If that has
sometimes resulted in “ardee,” for example, feeling that his comfort-zone is
being “hijack(ed),”  maybe it’s him/her who is out-of-place here.

Besides, anybody remains quite free to “turbo-scroll” anytime right past
anything appearing under “TAO Walker”....and is quite welcome to do so.  So
what, exactly is “the problem”?

Meanwhile, “Litl Bludot” recognizes that there is an essentially biological
process occurring here, and sees its effect in the fundamental CONceit of the
“capitalist ideology.”  That CONstruct, however, is only another (particularly
devastating to-be-sure) symptom of the underlying “civilization”
disease….which, in-turn, is generated in our Living Arrangement by the
‘workings’ of the sick (and sickening) “self.”

It is that retro-viral “vector,” present and rampantly run-amok in Persons and
in Peoples, that must be “quarantined.”

HokaHey!

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By Leefeller, June 12, 2011 at 5:06 am Link to this comment

Raccoons seem to be pretty damn smart as critters go. Well here it is 3 O Clock in the morning and it is long since past New Years Eve…. I have to hand it to Mr. Raccoon he just stays up in the tree until the dog goes away, probably even naps through all that barking and carrying on, while I am wide awake listening to my neighbors dog barking from across the pasture, sounding like its right next to the house.

Barking dogs seem to me a lot like people, sometimes they just bark for the sake of barking and other times they bark at Mr. Raccoon. Now my dog does not bark, unless there is a reason to bark, which can be a disadvantage if one wants a guard dog. Awhile back my dog treed a Raccoon which was trying to get into her food, which was one of the few times my dog has ever barked, on occasion she barks at other critters and barks at other dogs when in the back of my truck, but those other varmints called people forget it, she won’t bark at them.

Well,... back to my dog and Mr. Raccoon in the tree.  It was dark late at night and my dog was barking at something in the oak tree right over her dog pen.  Since she seldom barks, I knew something was up. Yep with my flash light I spotted sitting up there was a huge Raccoon looking all comfortable like and at home, maybe even taking a nap.  I knew he was Biding his time waiting to get into my dogs feeder.  So I had to take the dog feeder and lock it in my Pickup and then I took my dog into the house for a couple of hours.

I have to hand it to Mr. Raccoon, he sure can rile up all kinds of things in his real travels as opposed to people in their virtual ones! 

Ah!... No more barking.

TIME TO HIT THE HAY

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By ardee, June 12, 2011 at 3:41 am Link to this comment

TAO Walker, June 11 at 10:35 pm

It is exactly this sort of self serving and childishly defensive post that gives the lie to your spirituality and your supposed asceticism.

In a forum dedicated to finding political solutions to political problems you hijack that purpose in order to push some sort of simplistic way of life that you yourself betray with criticisms that seem unlikely to come from a person really dedicated to said spiritual path.

Perhaps there are better places. places more suited to such discussions. I do not believe that this is that place.

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By Litl Bludot, June 12, 2011 at 12:19 am Link to this comment

Re Tao Walker

It’s fairly simple.  Western culture (and not the only one) is infected with a pathological ideology that is anti life.  It’s perfectly clear now.  The biosphere and all life is being destroyed by the pandemic pathological ideology that views life as a commodity, life as an inorganic entity, devoid of the biology that allows our existence.

Most here do not understand this because they are infected to an extent that they have become vectors for this pathological ideology.  It is a type of parasitic ideology which destroys its host for the sake of its propagation.  i.e. life dies in order for the ideology of parasitic capitalism to survive.  Reality is subjugated to short term profit, in order for this reality to exist, life is wiped out of the consciousness, by the parasitic ideology.

At some point the infection became epidemic, pandemic.  Those who are the worst infected and the most efficient vectors need to be quarantined ASAP.

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By TAO Walker, June 11, 2011 at 10:35 pm Link to this comment

Trying to have a sensible exchange with the inebriated finally gets to be futile,
as it has here with the “self”-besotted, “individual”-ized posters stumbling
around in the cyber-guises of “katsteevns” and “Inherit The wind.”  The first
presents again a hodge-podge of “self”-invented speculation, as completely
inaccurate in its surmises as it is infantile in its strident ‘tone’ (S/he is, to be fair
however, on-record as CONsidering domesticated people to all be “babies.”),
apparently expecting these uneducated “guess(es)” s/he indulges-in to be
taken seriously for cogent thought.  As to “how many” of us surviving Free Wild
Human Beings there are….like Wolf Child says, “There can’t ever be too many,
and there’s never enough.” 

The second subject/citizen CONtinues fraudulently attempting to put his own
CONceits and received notions into this Old Indian’s virtual ‘mouth.’  We sorted-
out his “Native American” nonsense quite awhile ago here, when he was
informed in no uncertain terms that The Tiyoshpaye Way is in-part an English-
language translation and in-part a more-or-less phonetic ‘spelling’ of a term
that some TURTLE ISLAND NATIVES use to refer-to the Organic Form and
Function of Humanity within the Living Arrangement of our Mother Earth.  It is
also known among some Peoples as The Tao of Humanity, and described as the
The Way of Genuine Living Human Community.

In any case, this Turtle Island Native makes no “claim” whatsoever to being any
kind of “american” at-all….and the windy fellah is welcome to keep all his own
“split hairs” to his “self.” 

“Nirvana,” even as rather loosely defined by “Inherit The Wind” below, is again
entirely his own attempted super-imposition, just as his fever-dream “road to
personal peace and tranquility” is nothing but more of the same old sick “self”-
referential make-believe CONstructivitis in which this Person has expressed no
interest whatsoever, as they have nothing really to do with The Living Virtue of
Organic Functional Integrity….except to deprive the “self”-obsessed of it. 
Maybe those two, and some ‘other’ similarly “self- impaired participants here,
will eventually sober-up.  Until then, though, this Old Savage will be giving
them the same wide berth best accorded erratic and inattentive drivers on “The
Road To Perdition.”

Meantime, it’s probably not merely coincidental that among the clearer and
calmer (and genuinely interesting) observers here, we find “Leefeller,” who’s
prodigious intake of fermented Agave, and his remarkable ability to ‘hold’ his
liquor-of-choice while turning-out real Pearls of home-spun good sense, are
literally legendary….the veritable ‘stuff’ of literary legend, even, in some
quarters. 

HokaHey!

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By katsteevns, June 11, 2011 at 5:22 pm Link to this comment

By TAO Walker, June 11 at 1:00 pm Link to this comment

“Free Wild Human Beings”

How many are you?


” We take our chances right along with them.”

So, you all participate in this capitalist system just like everyone else. Probably high paying jobs with very little labor involved(let others do the gardening, ‘dirt’-y work. The better to conserve energy for the higher purpose, that being getting rid of the “self”. Ooooommmmmmmm…..

I am pretty sure, though, that one can not become selfless while accumulating wealth off the labor of others. Then again, money can make anyone feel super human or above morality, so maybe.

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By Inherit The Wind, June 11, 2011 at 3:52 pm Link to this comment

This Old Indian never even mentions (much
less “preaches”) a “Native American” anything (much less “Nirvana”) to anybody. 

**************

Hiding behind hair-splitting now?  That’s not a very taoist way of doing things.  No, you’ve never said “Nirvana”, but you’ve made it clear that YOU know the road to personal peace and tranquility, which in the common parlance is what “Nirvana” means.

Never preaches a Native American philosophy?  So the Tashope Way is NOT Native American?  Where’s it from?

Hokem-to-day!

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By Leefeller, June 11, 2011 at 1:42 pm Link to this comment

Many years ago I worked with a person who talked with a lisp after several months of working together, I found myself occasionally starting to pronounce some words with a lisp.

My point is if I moved to Texas, I would probably end up talking like an ass hole cowboy. 

Simply by association one can change to blend in with the environment, thats why I never want to go to San Francisco or Washing machine DC, for some reason both cities have an ingrained pictorial stereotype of Anthony Weaner and his third member!

Having been posting here on TD for some time, since about 2007 and also having read Tao Walkers works for about as many years now,.... I have to say Tao Walker has me seeing things a bit differently simply by association, for instance I never CONsidered the CONtraption as a CONtrapthon, but now I know it is a damn CONtraption….Also, If it is true you are what you eat, ...this explains why so many posters here seem to have CONtinually developed a CONsiderable and apparently CONsistent instance of CONstpation! 

CONfound it Tao Walker!

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By TAO Walker, June 11, 2011 at 1:00 pm Link to this comment

Here in the Free Wild Living Arrangement us surviving Free Wild Human Beings
don’t subject our surviving Free wild Relatives to the degradation of
domestication….penning them up in that “self”-serving “garden” version of the
CONcentration camp.  We take our chances right along with them, as we’ve
been doing all-along, during the latest onslaught here of the “civilization”
disease.  So, again, “katsteevns” poses a “question” that has even its poor
counterfeit of real meaning only within the CONfines of the virtual world-o’-
hurt, where the ultimate ‘product’ of every “garden” is sickness and
miser….‘cause we are ALL what we eat, after-all.

“Inherit The Wind” is here, again, piling his own CONceits on that effigy, then
kicking the virtual shit out of it.  This Old Indian never even mentions (much
less “preaches”) a “Native American” anything (much less “Nirvana”) to anybody. 
This evidently deeply troubled “individual” regularly displays here a species of
venomous animosity, toward participants who rub his own too precious “self”
‘the-wrong-way,’ of just exactly that sort of which he falsely accuses this
Person.  Anyhow, he chronically mistakes the vituperous eruptions of his own
biliousness for good-faith attempts to engage on ‘substance’....which he almost
never does.

And forheavensakes, is these guys’/gal’s(?) grip, on their make-believe world,
so fragile they think some Old Savage at a library computer is going to (as
“katsteevns” raved awhile back) “rip” them from its rubber nipple.  Here in Indian
Country we won’t even lift a figurative finger to demolish the damned thing.  It’s
inmates are already doing a gangbang-up ‘job’ of that.

Let The Fun begin!

HokaHey!

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By TAO Walker, June 11, 2011 at 12:14 pm Link to this comment

The thoughtful response below by “Anarcissie” is sure a welcome change from
some of the knee-jerk-off ‘droppings’ dumped in here lately by some ‘others’
who, being “self”-pseudonymed anyhow, are best left un-named for now.  They
know “who” they are….but still don’t get exactly WHAT.

At the risk, however, of alienating “Anarcissie” as-well, this Old Indian must say
that the “retro-viral” description of the “self” (both “super-” and “mini-”) is not
a metaphor.  It is, rather, a precise characterization of an actual ‘undead’
invasive ‘entity’ infecting the Whole Living Arrangement our Mother Earth (in its
‘macro’ form), and virulently infesting homo domesticus (in its ‘micro’ one).  The
latter wannabe parasitical form is transmitted from generation-to-generation
the same way the symbiotic ‘separate-organism’ components of our immune
systems are…. umbilically in the womb.  This is only to be expected, since the
primary ‘job’ of the thing is to suppress the Organic Function of Humanity, as
such, within the immune system of Mother Earth.

As “Anarcissie” is no-doubt already aware, not every ‘virus’ has an ‘anti-’. 
Some, in-fact many such organisms, exist in-concert with a ‘host’, either
essentially ‘neutral’ in their effects or even actually being of benefit.  It is a
common misCONception that our immune systems are “war-fighters,”
combating “invaders”....even to the ‘death’ of all-concerned.  The immune
system’s primary function is to come-up with a Way for us All to go on living
together.  That there is often some attrition in the process is only natural, and
thus hardly sufficient ‘reason’ for the CONstant distress under which the
domesticated peoples ‘suffer’ it….much less for all the precious attention they
squander trying vainly to resist it.

There is a specific ‘body chemistry’ incident to the presence, in a Human
birthday-suit, of the retro-viral “self.”  There are biological indicators, as-well,
indicating the relative ‘dominance’ the ‘entity’ has over the behavior of the
Natural Person whose birthday suit it really is.

For thousands of years Humans have developed and practiced disciplines
proven effective in reducing the degree of “self”-CONtrol over our physical
bodies….and of all those aspects of our essential Human Nature, as it is
integrated in All Nature, mediated by our bodies.  Some of these practices can,
and DO, as “Anarcissie” sensibly points-out, pretty-much eliminate (at-least
temporarily) the unhealthy influence of the “self” altogether….on our behavior
and the biological processes (manifesting as various “psycho-emotional” states)
informing and accompanying it.

There is also a specific bio-chemical ‘signature’ indicating the relative
sufficiency (or its lack) of what we call, in the Original Natural Language (as
translated roughly into ‘English’), The Living Virtue of Organic Functional
Integrity.  The biochemistry of Virtue is in-fact an antidote for the degenerative
biochemistry of “self”-ishness.

Even so, at this late stage of the disease process here it likely isn’t really
possible to entirely root-out either the micro-“self” infesting Persons or the
macro-“Self” infecting Earth.  We are left, then, with bringing as much Living
Virtue into play as we can….as Human Beings and as Humanity, as-such.  Our
‘access’ to it, however, is ONLY through our Natural Organic Form….call it Living
Human Community.  The ersatz “self”-ruled “individual,” no matter the ‘size’ of
random collections of them, simply cannot fulfill this vital Organic Function in
our Whole Living Arrangement.

So we’re right back to “Step 1,” however (perhaps impossibly) difficult it might
be for our tame Sisters and Brothers to actually take….get-over your “self.”  The
rest will be relatively ‘easy’....

....believe it or not.

HokaHey!

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By katsteevns, June 11, 2011 at 10:58 am Link to this comment

By TAO Walker

“So many of the “questions” posed by “katsteevns” are of the “Why is the sky not ice cream?” variety.”
        —————

It’s a simple question, my friend.

“What is in your garden?”

It is a tell-all question. Because if you have no garden, then this proves your armchair philosophy has no reality to back it up. It proves you do not sustain yourself (or anyone else for that matter). I would even venture to guess that you seldom break a sweat.

Insinuating that my question is “juvenile” is a perfect excuse to avoid answering it. So, which OLD INDIAN gave you THAT pearl of wisdom?

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By Inherit The Wind, June 11, 2011 at 10:44 am Link to this comment

Tao Walker:
For somebody who preaches a “tao” you seem awfully prone to anger and petty fits of rage at anyone who challenges your mystical pronouncements that you CLAIM will lead us to a Native American version of Nirvana.

I suggest the physician heal himself!

Hokem-To-Day!

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By Anarcissie, June 11, 2011 at 9:40 am Link to this comment

TAO Walker— When you speak of a virus, I am taking it as a metaphor.  (It need not be; there are parasites that change the behavior of their hosts to the advantage of their parasite business.  If you mean a literal, physical virus I will have some other observations and questions.)  Metaphors are generally pretty limited in practical application.  We can’t depend on them to tell us what to do about the thing they are metaphors for.  We can’t take an anti-viral drug to get rid of or mitigate the toxins of the psychological self.

To clarify my view: by ‘the self’ I denote the idea or picture or model (almost) every human maintains mentally of his or her person and its relation to the world.  That idea is very strongly influenced by culture, one might almost say it is invented by culture.  It is very deeply embedded, going back perhaps to the first days of one’s life.  That is one reason it is difficult to deal with.  Another is that any such dealing-with can only be done through the self, and it is tricky to make a tool work on itself, because as it works it changes.  I think as well that most ideas of the self are complex enough to include mechanisms of defense and self-preservation.  The self is not something one can just drop.  (One can take certain drugs or practice certain meditative regimes and temporarily get rid of the self, but then when one comes down one is stuck with pretty much the same self one left behind awhile before.)

So far, you’ve been telling people that they ought to get rid of or get over the self but not how to do it.  Or if you have, I’ve missed it.  Nature doesn’t do it; if it did, we wouldn’t have the problem in the first place.

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By TAO Walker, June 11, 2011 at 7:21 am Link to this comment

Gary Mont is surely aware of the many disciplines developed over the ages to help the “self”-infected “individual” get-over that affliction.  So his lengthy ‘rebuttal’ below is at-best disingenuous, and maybe just plain facetious. 

As reluctant as ‘Mr.’ Mont may be to admit it, most of the ills currently plaguing ‘modern’ homo domesticus are a direct result of their massive failure to ‘pay’ their precious attention to our Whole Living Arrangement….squandering it instead on all the seductive delusions of “self”-satisfaction.  Again, it is of no matter to The Medicine whether any “one’ takes it or not.

So many of the “questions” posed by “katsteevns” are of the “Why is the sky not ice cream?” variety.  They have no basis in actual Natural Fact.  So it seemed kinder to refrain from calling attention to her/his ignorance (feigned or genuine) by simply passing-over them without comment.

Maybe “ardee” could’ve spared his/her own too precious “self” the apparent frustration and disappointment s/he exhibits below by staying away from “home” awhile longer.  Surely there must be other avenues down which s/he can go to do a fair share of that “important work.”  Of course having to be reminded that homo domesticus still languishes in “the stone age,” anyhow, despite tons of “self”-glorifying pretensions to-the-CONtrary, is no-doubt stressful for that “one.”

Like “Leefeller,” this Old Savage is mystified by the apparent obsession some here have with what is, after-all, about as ephemeral a ‘thing’ as there is, here in these Latter Days.  Does that suggest a certain ‘ambivalence’ about the ‘wisdom’ of their own attachments to a CONstruct that is sysematically rendering their own virtual Kind ‘redundant’ to the thing’s purposes?

To “work” on that, maybe “Step 1” will be a good place to start.

HokaHey!

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By Leefeller, June 11, 2011 at 4:46 am Link to this comment

As for hope in either party, I would garner both parties have more than enough hope to be full of themselves,...

Now it appears the Republicans are sponsoring Democrats to run against Democrats in democrat primaries, is this where blue ball Democrats come from?

Do the Independents have primaries?

Racism and Tea Bags go together like eggs and bacon!

Tao Walkers CONdition seems to be CONfounding and CONfusing resulting in CONcussions,...  my CONdolences!

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By ardee, June 11, 2011 at 4:20 am Link to this comment

My goodness, I go away for a few days and come home to find all these responses to a poster who is, basically, Martha/Thomas in a loin cloth.

Come on people, with all the important work to be done why are we wasting our time over such a self involved and childishly irrelevant self proclaimed prophet of a return to the stone age?

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By katsteevns, June 11, 2011 at 4:17 am Link to this comment

@ TAO Walker

No, TAO, you don’t avoid my questions save the ones with the squiggly line at the end of the sentence.

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By Litl Bludot, June 10, 2011 at 11:15 pm Link to this comment

Just read Melissa Harris in The Nation.  Accuses people who criticize Obama of
either being racists, or aiding racists.  This is typical liberal intellectual sophistry
from a Democratic voter, if not one of their supposed leading thinkers.  You can’t
change her mind with facts. As Hedges has said, there is no hope from either
party.

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By Gary Mont, June 10, 2011 at 10:55 pm Link to this comment

Hoka Hey Old Man,

I’m afraid that almost everyone here, save the little lass who wanted everyone to absord that philospher to find their self, probably has and cannot get past the same distruct I have.

You see, when I ask someone to explain the “way” to me, after they have stated that a certain “way” will get me a certain benefit, I just naturally expect a set of instructions that start at step A and run till step whatever at completion, all of which are fully understandable.

I expect the sentences used in the explanation to be made up of sensible, easily understood english words which fit together to form real step by step instructions.

If I have to guess at the meaning of the sentences, then I begin to doubt that the speaker of the “way” actually knows the steps needed to follow that path, otherwise, there would be no need to use esoteric and exotic terms instead of plain english sentences describing in the simplest details, the exact steps to take.

Similarily, MarthaA/B’s wonderful “Sublated unity of balance x=x dialectic”, which s/he claims will free the world from tyranny, has no plain and simple instructions which a person can follow from point A to point Z. It matters not how often she repeats it, it makes no more sense the 77th time than it did the first time.

Your instructions:

1.Get-over your “self.”
2.Pay attention to sensing and responding to the needs of our Whole Living Arrangement, as they are presented to you.

The first step is an instruction to do something entirely impossible, either physically or mentally, as far as most are concerned.

One would need to have already gotten over one’s self in order to even understand how something like that is accomplished.

No step by step instructions are offered on how anyone can be rid of their self, and instead it appears to be assumed that anyone can just walk away from their self at will, without effort, as the instructions clearly say only “get over yourself”.

I submit respectfully, that nobody who has not already gotten over themselves, would have even an inkling as to how such a feat might be accomplished, as they have never experienced such an event and more than likely, never even thought such an event was possible, so the first instruction is literally impossible to follow for anyone who has not already gotten over themselves.

I think that makes the instruction moot. (perhaps a better term than moot might be used, but I think my point is clear)

Step 2 depends entirely upon step one being already fulfilled before it can even begin to have any use.

In other words, the instrcutions are for those who have already accomplished them, not for those who have not accomplished them.

It is very similar to many operator manuals, written by engineers, for engineers, and utterly gibberish to anyone not an engineer.

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By TAO Walker, June 10, 2011 at 6:12 pm Link to this comment

There’s likely much more (in-addition-to the latest example s/he offers below),
about which “katsteevns” says proudly, “I know….,” that in-fact just ain’t so. 
Proof positive, perhaps, that the bliss of ignorance must be its own reward.

“Inherit The Wind” seems to become particularly puerile, even at-times rabid,
when going-after his own “self”-made-up threadbare mental effigy of this Old
Man, who apparently presents (entirely unintentionally) some kind of ‘threat’ to
the fellah’s most cherished CONceits.  Maybe that’s only to be expected,
though, from some"one” who evidently gets his “history” from Hollywood.

It’s a heyoka world after all.

HokaHey!

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By Inherit The Wind, June 10, 2011 at 2:15 pm Link to this comment

I got it!
Let’s all sit in the dirt naked and let the bugs crawl all over us.  We’ll eat raw rhubarb, seeds, fruit and die at 25 or 30.

Yeah, we’ll live like the ape-men in “2001” before they discovered tools.

Doesn’t that sound happy-happy?

Hokem-to-day!

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By katsteevns, June 10, 2011 at 12:32 pm Link to this comment

@ TAO Walker

I know it must be very difficult for you to wrench yourself away from weeding the garden or shoveling out the barn in order to give the world an opportunity to experience your pearls of wisdom on the computer you bought, not for you, but for us. So, just what did you plant this year anyways?

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By TAO Walker, June 10, 2011 at 10:18 am Link to this comment

In belated response to the invitation from “Anarcissie” to give (again) a
description of the “self,” this Old Indian again will put it into basic biological
terms.  The “self,” as such, is an invasive retro-viral (i.e.; not quite either alive
or dead) ‘entity’ whose simulated ‘metabolic process’ manifests in Earth’s Living
Arrangement as the “civilization” disease.  Its “individual”-ized excrescence
infects susceptible Humans in such a manner that the Natural Person we are is
suppressed and displaced by the invasive ‘pseudoform,’ which then co-opts its
‘host’ or ‘hostess’ into serving the “self” in its vain attempt to degrade All of our
Natural Vitality into the degenerate energy this wannabe parasite subsists so
miserably and precariously upon. 

The damned thing is simply a kind of mega(and megalomanic)-version of the
elusive micro-mini-‘agent’ believed to be the generator of that complex of
devastating symptoms, known (when occurring in a Human birthday-suit) as
“AIDS.”  The “self” also induces in its carriers an ultimately lethal CONdition that
can aptly be called the terminally delusional I/ME/MY/MINE syndrome. 

It might be helpful to remember, tenaciously, that most everything our
domesticated Sisters and Brothers “think” about their very own too-precious
“self” (and that of “others”), they’ve been mislead to believe by that selfsame
usurping “self” itself (and that of “others”), in the “self”-perpetuating and
“self”-reinforcing circle-jerk mutual masturbation (and inevitably sterile)
exercise-in-FUtility that IS the “civilization” disease process.  They are NOT,
in-other-words, their “self” at-all….all of its mystifying manipulations and
puerile posturings and hegemonic hoorah, meant to keep them CONvinced
CONtrary-wise, notwithstanding.

Mucking things up with philosophy and ideology only adds to the epidemic of
CONfusion their idolized “self” is inflicting on the “huddled masses.”  To know
the essential nature of anything, it is necessary only to observe sentiently and
calmly the actual effects of its presence in our Living Arrangement.

The “self” is both sick itself and presents here as a species of sickness.  The
specific remedy for it is The Living Virtue of Organic Functional Integrity present
only in the Natural Organic Form of Humanity….Genuine Living
Community….The Tiyoshpaye Way.

Get altogether ALL TOGETHER NOW!, Sisters and Brothers, as Natural Persons
in-Community, attend to our Mother Earth and Her Living Arrangement….get
well in the very doing of it.

HokaHey!

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By geekgirl, June 9, 2011 at 6:53 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Thanks Chris, for a great piece…
it is absolutely dead on - the corporate led world is now in full control and West only pointed this out - There has been nothing even resembling a liberal agenda for so long no one even remembers what it looks or feels like.
The idea of radical in the US is relegated to the historical or theatrical, but politically it is now owned solely by the ‘radical right’ - there is no radical left to be found. It was killed off in a corporate take over decades ago and no one even noticed.  It didn’t hurt that the real people who gave it life blood were all murdered.

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By katsteevns, June 8, 2011 at 9:31 am Link to this comment

By sks711,
” What are all of you waiting for? .....How much more convincing do you need?...... What are you (we) afraid of?...... How much worse can it get?....... Let’s go….. What else needs to be said.”

EXACTLY Mr.sks711!!
  We have our leaders in Sheer, West and Hedges. And as soon as they take a step, we will be right behind them, lock, stock and barrel.

  What ARE they waiting for, indeed?....payday?

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By Anarcissie, June 6, 2011 at 8:54 am Link to this comment

elisalouisa, June 5 at 12:00 pm:

In order to even think of joining a commune(in most social contexts) you’ve got to be a radical individualist. BeatsbyLexx comments.

Not really. One may have an inner sense that we are a small part of the whole and individual pursuit does not make for a satisfying lifestyle and in fact may indicate a malaise in our society.

Sure, but very few people are moved by abstractions or intuitions about the grand scheme of things to actually break away from tradition, custom, and imitation of their neighbors, even in a supposedly individualistic culture like that of the U.S.  Otherwise there would be a lot more variety in people’s ways of life.

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By David J. Cyr, June 6, 2011 at 8:44 am Link to this comment

Those “ignorant” people who vote for Republicans commit a heinous crime against humanity every time they vote, but they clearly aren’t mentally competent to be tried for their crimes.

The well informed and incredibly “intelligent” liberals commit the same heinous crimes against humanity every time they vote for Democrats. If there were any justice the liberals would all be tried, convicted, and punished for their voting crimes against humanity.

A fascist society can confidently have “free and fair” elections because its people will always reliably super-majority vote for fascists.

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By elisalouisa, June 5, 2011 at 12:00 pm Link to this comment

In order to even think of joining a commune(in most social contexts) you’ve got to be a radical individualist. BeatsbyLexx comments.

Not really. One may have an inner sense that we are a small part of the whole and individual pursuit does not make for a satisfying lifestyle and in fact may indicate a malaise in our society.

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By Anarcissie, June 3, 2011 at 8:20 pm Link to this comment

I was thinking of something simpler than Jung’s definition—which is not hard to do for almost anything—but we must find out what TAO Walker meant, and only he can tell us.

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By elisalouisa, June 3, 2011 at 6:16 am Link to this comment

For more than one reason most do not agree with Jung (see link provided June 2, 3:41 pm) concerning the definition of “self,” preferring the dictionary version:
“a person’s essential being that distinguishes them from others, esp. considered the object of introspection or reflexive action: our alienation from our true selves.
My comments are within the dictionary description although I find Jung’s interpretation in more acceptable.

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By Anarcissie, June 2, 2011 at 5:43 pm Link to this comment

Ah, Jung.  I studied him earnestly in my youth for a time.  One of his articles led me to the Book of Changes before it was fashionable and cool!  We’ll see if TAO Walker wants to sign on first, though.

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By Anarcissie, June 2, 2011 at 10:20 am Link to this comment

TAO Walker—It was you who began talking about the ‘self’, I believe.  If you are dissatisfied with my take on the thing you’re talking about, why don’t you just go ahead and define it yourself?  I’d certainly prefer that to floundering about in the endless fields of philosophy, psychology and linguistics trying to guess your meaning.

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By TAO Walker, June 2, 2011 at 8:02 am Link to this comment

“Anarcissie” tells us the ‘location’ (at-least in his own psychic ‘geography’) of “the problem of the ‘self’ among us.”  He declares ex cathedra that it is “internal”....if that can be said to be an actual ‘place’ somewhere or other.  He again remarks the thing’s ability to CON captive Humans into passing it generation-to-generation, using the “civilization” process.  He still hasn’t revealed, however, exactly WHAT he believes the “self” itself to be.  Neither has he stated for us exactly what he feels is “the problem” with it.

Such a reluctance, on the part of the “self”-possessed, to come to actual grips with the “self” as such, or to acknowledge its deleterious effects on our Whole Living Arrangement, and by doing-so to maybe “get out of the pit” that seems precisely co-extensive with “the problem,” is of-course quite common among the virtual subspecies homo domesticus.  So is the tangled web of “self”-deceptive “rational”-izations the infected are “self”-motivated to spin….maybe in vain attempts to find a little cold comfort in their captive isolation.

The ‘bottom-line’ of the “Anarcissie” argument, though, isn’t really whether this Old Savage’s offerings here, whatever inspires them, might be helpful to some.  It isn’t even that a Person not suffering from “self”-affliction, and maybe actually a little “happy” about that, has no standing to communicate with those who are so “self”-abused.  It is, rather, the same old “self”-centered assertion that if his very own too-precious “self” can’t (or won’t) “understand” or “accept” something, then neither can (or will) anybody “else.”

Solipsism is the last resort of the modern major “egotist.”

HokaHey!

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By Anarcissie, June 2, 2011 at 6:16 am Link to this comment

TAO Walker, June 2 at 5:48 am:

‘According to the reasoning “Anarcissie” offers below, no carpenter could repair a damaged house unless their own house was damaged.  No doctor could treat a disease unless they had it.  No soldier could defend a country unless they first attacked some other. ...’

We are not talking about manipulating physical material, which can easily be objectified, separated and dealt with at a distance if necessary, especially in the cases of the technologies you mention, which have thousands of years of history, experience and knowledge behind them.

Nor to my recollection were we talking about external oppression, as in ‘the reservation’.  The problem with the self among us is internal and, once installed by the social order, is self-maintaining.  It’s not immediately obvious nor easy to know how to deal with it, for the reasons I’ve already given.

If you’re just naturally a ‘natural person’, that’s terrific, but it doesn’t tell anyone not in your happy state what to do about getting there.  Maybe you can’t, and in any case you’re not under any obligation to; but this raises the question of why you’re writing little messages on Truthdig telling these poor proggies how screwed up they are.  It could be you’re not above a little schadenfreude yourself, eh?

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By TAO Walker, June 2, 2011 at 5:48 am Link to this comment

According to the reasoning “Anarcissie” offers below, no carpenter could repair a damaged house unless their own house was damaged.  No doctor could treat a disease unless they had it.  No soldier could defend a country unless they first attacked some other.

This Old Indian has said here more than once that we are ALL infected with the “self,” but that some of us, as happens often in Nature (as, for example, those among Native Nations here on Turtle Island who ‘got’ but didn’t die from smallpox, even as many around them perished), have some natural immunity to its effects.  Peoples everywhere have been having to address the “self”-sickness, and it’s degenerative depredations, for many thousands of generations, and have come-up with a variety of remedial “disciplines” for keeping the epidemic more-or-less in-check. 

Yet it appears, here in these latter Days, that these stop-gap measures are daily less-and-less adequate to the increasing virulence of the plague of “self”-ishness.  It further appears that the present “success” of the disease is due entirely to the CONtrived breakdown of Human Community into it’s ersatz “individual” CONstituents, thus suppressing drastically Earth’s natural immune function by co-opting and corrupting that component in Her natural immune system that IS Humanity, as such.

This Old Man, having survived the “reservation” version of “the pit” only by-virtue of membership in a surviving Free Wild Natural Human Community, recommends the restoration of our Natural Organic Human Form as The Medicine for our tame Sisters and Brothers who are today succumbing “individual”-ly in-droves to the “self”-infestation.  So “Anarcissie” maybe should be a little less eager to lecture those of us intimately familiar with CONditions in the CONcentrations camps called “reservations” about “get(ting) out of the pit”....especially if, as seems rather likely, his own “self” knows little-or-nothing first-hand about
“waiting in blood.”

There really is no “technique” for bringing-back genuine Organic Human Community.  As a Living Form it must occur naturally and spontaneously, in-response to an actual Living need, or not at-all.  Still, recognizing that it is their “self”-imposed isolation, from one another and our Living Arrangement, that is making them miserable, might help some among the domesticated peoples to get-over their captivating “self,” emerge again as Natural Persons together in-Community, and begin functioning as Whole Healthy Human Beings again within Earth’s Living Arrangement.

Then again….maybe not.

HokaHey!

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By elisalouisa, June 2, 2011 at 5:18 am Link to this comment

Bias may be a built-in feature Ardee and but one reason for the wars that are waged. The “self” is clever in obscuring such details. Thanks for the nudge, I shall look more closely in that reflective mirror.

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By BeatsbyLexx, June 2, 2011 at 4:16 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

It’s rather like the problem of getting people to join communes.  In order to even think of joining a commune (in most social contexts) you’ve got to be a radical individualist.

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By ardee, June 2, 2011 at 3:13 am Link to this comment

elisalouisa states:
At times, the taint of non tolerance for want of a better phrase comes through on these forums.

It is so easy to see that in others, far more difficult to see it in yourself. But thanks for the chuckle.

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By sks711, June 1, 2011 at 8:59 pm Link to this comment

I just sent a similar comment to Mr. Scheer about this. Cornel West is right. You
are right. What are all of you waiting for? We need a strong, progressive third
party. How much more convincing do you need? Wall Street? Middle class? Health
care? Education? The Environment? Women’s Health? Abortion rights? Children?
The Military? What are you (we) afraid of? Mr. Obama has made it clear that he will
listen to/cave in to/“compromise” with the right/Wall Street/conservatives, etc. and
ignore/insult the left/progressives. How much worse can it get? The lesser of two
evils can no longer be enough. Let’s go. Third Party. Reading The Death of the
Liberal Class now. What else needs to be said.

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By Anarcissie, June 1, 2011 at 7:22 pm Link to this comment

TAO Walker—‘Natural persons’ in the ‘right’ relationship with Mother Earth and all that wouldn’t be concerned with their selves.  They would find it difficult to understand what the problem was with people who had self problems, much less be able to give them advice as to how to deal with their situation.

In order to deal with self problems, you have to understand that you have them in the first place, that you are not a ‘natural person’.  In order to help other people deal with them, you have to have done that—come to grips with your own problems, and then made some progress—so that you have something to tell those you think you are going to help, if only to point out the way.  (Those who have done it know it is a very difficult task.)  This path is not open to ‘natural persons’.  ‘Waiting in blood. Get out of the pit’ was written by someone who had been in the pit, not one of the happy ‘natural persons’ happily playing in the lap of Gaia.

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By Leefeller, June 1, 2011 at 10:28 am Link to this comment

At one time having been a dubious rat partaking in the race as Tao Walker prefers to call it (the huddled masses), I have been among, seen and smelled the those predominate huddled rat droppings portrayed as the horny plenty sometimes known also as urban civilization.

As far as I am concerned, rat dropping may be a nice place to visit, but I would not want to live there and I suppose there are even some urban rat droppings I would not even want to visit!

My life, my existence and as my stomach turns from to much Tequila,... I have learned, realized with much gratitude my life in this world has turned out most fortunate compared to the majority of the living walking suffering on this planet and I would not change my life for anything,... but of course that would depend on what you have to offer!

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By TAO Walker, June 1, 2011 at 9:52 am Link to this comment

So this Buffalo Bull walks into a souvenir shop in Yellowstone Park….
_______________________________

Mr. Mont suggests very few, if any, among the “self”-sickened will take The Medicine.  So what does that matter to The Medicine!?

“Anarcissie,” the now admitted “egotist” (and CONfessed disciple of the Marquis de Sade) sets-up, at-least by-implication, his very own too-precious “individual” “self” as the world “standard,” ignoring any possibility that a Natural Person, rather than being hell-bent on “self”-“improvement,” might simply be “interested” in helping to bring-about some mutually beneficial effects for our Whole Living Arrangement.  “If the shoe fits….,” eh.

No need reminding “elisalouisa” that the “guilty-by-association” label some pseudonymous “individual” tries to paste on her below, is a two-edged sword.  Lie down with gods, get-up with a bad case of the ME’s.
________________________________

....and Coyote waited outside for The Fun to begin.

HokaHey!

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By Anarcissie, June 1, 2011 at 8:35 am Link to this comment

Those who were interested could look into self-free or self-mitigating experiences and situations.  Of course, the problem here is that they’d already have to be concerned with the improvement of their selves.  ‘You think of yourself as something you invest in,’ quoth the prophet Zimmerman.

It’s rather like the problem of getting people to join communes.  In order to even think of joining a commune (in most social contexts) you’ve got to be a radical individualist.

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By Gary Mont, June 1, 2011 at 8:19 am Link to this comment

TAO Walker:Step 1, (for “directions”-dependent Gary Mont, et al):

Yeah, I do feel a little responsible for convincing you to lay it out as instructions old man (assuming of course that my demand for instructions did sway you somewhat in this direction).

In truth, I wanted to see if you could actually put down in words what it was that you were offering as an alternative to living as a mechanical symptom of the civilization syndrome. I can normally handle a little esoteric Carlos-Castenada-type dialogue, but I always prefer simple cause and effect explanations. I’m lazy that way I guess.

Getting over one’s self is, while very good advice, nearly impossible to do for those existing in an ego based “individual VS the universe” social structure and is not the sort of instruction a civilized creature can comprehend readily let alone carry out.

In fact, I believe one would have to have already gotten over one’s self before such an instruction could make any real sense at all.

I fear my demand for instructions was far less helpful than I’d hoped. Sorry about that.

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By Anarcissie, June 1, 2011 at 7:49 am Link to this comment

Actually, it seems sort of egotistical—self-ish—to publish instructions and suggestions which the great majority of readers can neither understand nor follow.

Now, I would do it—I do do it—but I’m an egotist and a bit of a sadist.  People that won’t think deserve some occasional needling, in my opinion.  But from the persona of an Old Indian?

Well, Coyote, maybe.

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By elisalouisa, June 1, 2011 at 5:54 am Link to this comment

The words of every religious preacher, acolyte and convert…I don’t understand the gibberish but I understand the message . .
Really?

they were quick to jump on European horses and European technology to make themselves more dangerous in war.  
It is my understanding that such a way does not include suicidal resignation, in fact encourages taking a defensive stand against those who seek to destroy all that is dear, even your very life.

At times, the taint of non tolerance for want of a better phrase comes through on these forums.

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By Inherit The Wind, May 31, 2011 at 7:40 pm Link to this comment

It is not uncommon to ridicule what one does not understand, and typical for others to join in.
*****

The words of every religious preacher, acolyte and convert…I don’t understand the gibberish but I understand the message: Go live as one with nature the way the ancient Plains Indians did. Supposedly.

Except they were quick to jump on European horses and European technology to make themselves more dangerous in war. 

In other words, they are just like all people all over the world, from Kubrick’s ape-man to flag officers in the Pentagon and the Kremlin.

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By elisalouisa, May 31, 2011 at 6:17 pm Link to this comment

TAO Walker May 31 7:51 am

I agree TAO Walker.  It is not uncommon to ridicule what one does not understand, and typical for others to join in.  I do not see “religiosity” in your posts, just a way of life that is off the mainstream highway so to speak.

TD3 and Ardee, we do disagree on this, let’s just leave it at that.

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By Inherit The Wind, May 31, 2011 at 10:28 am Link to this comment

All my assumptions are tight assumptions, though I sometimes feel they could be tight unsound assumptions!
*********

For these tight assumptions to work should I assume that the assumer also needs to be tight?

Yeah, never trust an electrician named “Sparks” or a knife-juggler nick-named “Butterfingers”

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By Leefeller, May 31, 2011 at 8:09 am Link to this comment

ITW,... who’s counting shots, I always keep a few bottles on hand for back up. On occasion,  I even pour Tequila into my espresso maker instead of water,...I discovered it doesn’t matter if I use good expensive coffee beans or canned coffee or any coffee at all,... though I have gotten used to hot Tequila! ...Plus I found a dual purpose for those espresso cups!

All my assumptions are tight assumptions, though I sometimes feel they could be tight unsound assumptions!

Years ago I worked with an electrician who taught me the importance of taking a few shots of Tequila before working with electricity. (don’t ask me how many), so after awhile he said he doesn’t worry about turning off the electricity before working. (he found circuit breakers an inconvenience)  So getting shocked never was a surprise to him and he even said he was getting the power from electricity,... as he called it. He said sometimes getting shocked helped him see the light even put a sparkle in his eyes and he even found it invigorating,... so by the time he finally got to work he kind talked like my English friend, ...I found in order to understand and keep up with sparky (as I called him)  I found it necessary and important to keep up with the Tequila to understand him. But… I never quite found those electoral charges of enlightenment he kept talking about.

It has been many years since last saw him, but I heard he started some sort an evangelical religion,... not sure of the name,  sounds something like “Suchness of the inner electric arc” or the “Church of the binding Light”, the name supposedly has something to do with his electrical attachments.

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By TAO Walker, May 31, 2011 at 7:51 am Link to this comment

Mentioning no “self”-serving aliases here, but doesn’t attempted character assassination tend more-often-than-not to enhance rather than diminish the significance and stature of the “target-of-opportunism”?  Wouldn’t certain pseudonymed “individual” juveniles be less delinquent, in their dedication to the superficialities of their own “self”-satisfying arrested-development, if they pretended not even to notice the cyberspatial observations of some Old Savage not going-along with their “program”?

This Old Indian neither has nor wants any vested interest at-all in anybody’s “stuff”.  In fact, having just reduced Personal “holdings” down to what’ll fit easily into a 57-year-old pickup truck (and that’s still prob’ly way too much), the trend is quite in the opposite direction.  So “katsteevns” will just have to find another strategy for getting out from under his/her own captivating possessions….maybe give them away to “the poor”?

So, is the “final answer” to Rodney King’s plaintive cry a redsounding “NO!”....at-least from those who remain CONvinced there actually is some “moral high-ground,” and who seem dead-set on seizing it, too, for the exclusive occupation of their own too-precious “self”?

HokaHey!

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By elisalouisa, May 31, 2011 at 6:17 am Link to this comment

Humor abounds. Interesting CONclusions.

CONditions are such in the here and now that you can stop clutching your heart Dick Cheney and smile. Have a glass or two tequila. You might learn something from Leefeller.

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By Inherit The Wind, May 31, 2011 at 3:20 am Link to this comment

LeeFeller,
You can’t just go around making analysis and brash political statements based on vague facts. You have to be able lay out the argument with cold verifiable data.

So enough of vagueness and assertions based on loose assumptions.  DEFEND YOUR POSITION!

So, I challenge you to defend this with a very important detail that you deliberately and sneakily left out:

Exactly how many shots of tequila does it take for you to understand TW?  I mean, what’s “a few”?  Three, four, twelve, sixteen, for him to make sense?  This is critical information!  I’m guessing it would take me at least four but as I’m not the world’s biggest drinker those same four shots would probably put me to sleep first. If I made it to a fifth shot I’d be under the table, and it wouldn’t matter to me whether TW made sense or not, only that the room stop spinning…..

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By Leefeller, May 31, 2011 at 1:40 am Link to this comment

I like Dick Chaney, especially for his pig headed self righteousness and I heard he has the heart of a pig,... hence the true meaning of pork barrels, Chaney said it best, when asked by a reporter; ‘all the people in the land want the US to get out of Iraq’. ....And the great kidder Dick Chaney replied with a straight face,.......“So”!

Why are some of yous guys picking on Tao Walker? I never have any trouble understanding him, he actually makes a lot of sense,... especially after more than a few Tequilas. 

Why cant yous guys accept people for who they are? I have a friend who talks like he has marbles in his mouth he says he talks like that because he is an English man… after a few Tequilas I can even understand him too! ...some things Just take hell of a lot longer getting used to;... except I just can’t quite never get used to being screwed by politicians and their money bagged benefactors!

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By Inherit The Wind, May 30, 2011 at 7:27 pm Link to this comment

truedigger3, May 30 at 5:44 pm Link to this comment

By elisalouisa, May 30 at 8:36 am

elisalouisa wrote:
“Then again, perhaps the alternative of being another Dick Cheney attracts you.”
—————————————————————————
elisalouisa,

So, according to you, anyone who does not agree with TAO Walker and his stupid mumbo jumbo mixed with blather, is another Dick Cheney WANNABE????!!!
Can you tell us, please,  how did you arrive to that strange conclusion??
You are kidding!?... Right?!

***********************

Sadly, TD3, I don’t think so.  By her definition, you, Ardee, and myself are all Cheney wannabes because when it comes to TW, we all fail to see what underlying logic he uses to reach his conclusions and provide, dare I say it?, “advice” on how to live.

It’s kind of like saying if you don’t follow “my” brand of Abrahamic religion, you are, therefore, by definition, a worshiper of Satan.  Just as venal and just as absurd.

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By truedigger3, May 30, 2011 at 5:44 pm Link to this comment

By elisalouisa, May 30 at 8:36 am

elisalouisa wrote:
“Then again, perhaps the alternative of being another Dick Cheney attracts you.”
—————————————————————————
elisalouisa,

So, according to you, anyone who does not agree with TAO Walker and his stupid mumbo jumbo mixed with blather, is another Dick Cheney WANNABE????!!!
Can you tell us, please,  how did you arrive to that strange conclusion??
You are kidding!?... Right?!

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By ardee, May 30, 2011 at 3:39 pm Link to this comment

elisalouisa, May 30 at 8:36 am

I have, in the past, read and agreed with much of what you post. That you choose to don the robes of an acolyte in the cult of TAO seems unfortunate to me but then it is your choice after all.

But then you insist that those who cannot see the glow of religiosity in his ridiculous spiels and occasional childish temper tantrums are somehow inferior to those who claim to do so is more than unfortunate. It is, in the end, a symptom of cult hood.

I’ll stick with my opinion that he is an ecstasy swallowing teen , lives in his mothers basement and has no friends. Now, can we get back to political discussions?

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By Leefeller, May 30, 2011 at 1:27 pm Link to this comment

The suchness of the heart in connotation with Chaney dost seem relative in the grandiosity scheme of things connected to heartlessness or could it simply be just a pigs heart or the Queen of hearts?

“an effort in that direction as the inner core necessary for such an undertaking has not been (yet?) developed.”  Yes my inner core takes many joineries in different directions because of late this is the only way I can travel, because the price of fuse is prohibitive.

“Even more telling is the conviction by some that knowledge alone tells it all.”  More telling to whom? A conviction that knowledge tells it all? ... Ellowesa, knowledge tells something but not all, possibly only a guide to knowing something, which can be either right or wrong.  knowledge does not have to be truth or facts nor do convictions?

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By Anarcissie, May 30, 2011 at 10:11 am Link to this comment

TW is not a libertarian.

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By elisalouisa, May 30, 2011 at 8:36 am Link to this comment

Can one put into words the way of life that is TAO Walker? That is the real question. Such understanding cannot be reached by reading a sentence, essay or book. Many do not have it within them to go such a way nor to even make an effort in that direction as the inner core necessary for such an undertaking has not been (yet?) developed. Even more telling is the conviction by some that knowledge alone tells it all. How sad. As one walks that way, by whatevername,one cannot help but feel a oneness with the earth and all living matter.

Then again, perhaps the alternative of being another Dick Cheney attracts you. Such a way put a choke hold on the heart whereas letting go and accepting the suchness of things unites the heart with all life.

TAO Walker your efforts are not in vain.  Seeds planted preferrably in good soil will take root in time.

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By ardee, May 30, 2011 at 7:59 am Link to this comment

Also, he loses his temper very easily.  To me, if you are teaching a philosophy of living, if you aren’t able to accept it being challenged without fury, you are no different than all the other religious fanatics who are making our world a living hell as the result of the “heaven” they are pushing.

The kernel of why I think him a phony zealot, thanks for posting this. I have long since turbo-scrolled past his religious goofyness.

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By Inherit The Wind, May 30, 2011 at 5:46 am Link to this comment

truedigger3, May 26 at 7:09 pm Link to this comment

Re: By TAO Walker, May 26 at 9:58 am


TAO Walker,

You are nothing but a hardcore Libertarian who has camouflaged himself in your so called, “this old Indian”, mumbo jumbo. According to you, people, instead of working for and demanding social and economic justice, should withdraw from society,  and leave the field wide open for the Corporate/Finance to run amok without any restraints.  Instead of action,  you demand from people to withdraw and do your” Living Virtue of Organic Functional ntegrity”, whatever that blather means!. You are, like your ilk, are blaming the victim and hiding behind that selfish call for that so called “personal responsibility”.  In your opinion, the plutocrats and oligarchs are innocent and it is all the fault of the individual??!! A good teacher shows compassion and awareness of his students level of understanding, instead all your writings reek of contempt and ridicule of your readers, what you call “homo domesticus“, to reinforce their feelings of guilt and responsibility about their plight, totally ignoring the fundamental role of Corporate/Finance in their plight.
************

Wow! TD3, you continue to impress me! I’m not sure I could have gotten that out of Tao Walker’s “philosophy”, but there’s a certain solidity to your argument.

Is it Libertarian? Not really, but the resemblance is definitely there, and the blaming the victim idea is spot-on.

Tao Walker attempts to be a guru and teach his Tashope way all the time, but balks at being called a teacher—he doesn’t want that responsibility after years of preaching his incomprehensible religion at us.

Also, he loses his temper very easily.  To me, if you are teaching a philosophy of living, if you aren’t able to accept it being challenged without fury, you are no different than all the other religious fanatics who are making our world a living hell as the result of the “heaven” they are pushing.

ElisaLouisa agrees with Tao.  I rest my case!

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By Brother Hassan, May 30, 2011 at 4:19 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I discredited this article the moment i saw the phrase,” My FRIEND CORNEL WEST”...clearly, this is an attempt to fluff up a defense to Cornel West’s childish antics. Is Obama a “business as usual democrat”? yes. Is West a scorned Negro intellectual that is venting his hurt through his critique? YES.

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By mary quite contrary, May 29, 2011 at 4:08 pm Link to this comment
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Commentators here galore tend to be emailing each other in full public view, maybe hoping others will find some value in THEIR virtual relationships ? Or why be ‘writing’ to each other. so often, so few of you, so much in one place ?

I had to go way way down to the early posts to find some relevance to Chris’ actual article…. some, not even there were some that spoke to the issues he presents… why so much extra wasted clatter when those who do want to read COMMENTS on the article then have to dig so deep in so much .....wasted verbiage ?

Can we please not monopolize or publicize ourselves and waste this public space here - and stick to the topic more - instead of being sidelined,so liberally ? And this is example of what has often also been described as unhelpful ‘liberalizing’ tendencies -  which here too includes being distracted, disjointed, unorganized and thus unintelligible to anyone who is not joining the ‘family’ spat too ?


pluzzzeee - just stick to the topic and speak to the issues and not just exhibitionize yourselves here too…

this is not the only place I want to READ MORE on the TOPIC or author, and just not wildly odd musings. Write a book or get your own blog. Let those who want to say something more revealing, critical, complimentary or even dissenting about the people [West or Hedge}or subject raised, or relevant to the article presented -  just to be worth reading or ‘get out of the way”, please!

so…..

Liberal[s] has been a “bad word” for a long long time, nothing new about that topic. 


Some shifted to term “progressives” to get out of the garbage-thrown their liberal-like way. But that P-word that word did not do much to shift their tide or style either tho.

The assumption of a Liberal Education, is taken as part of liberalism, no ? It is nothing remotely like what the slang use of the l-word has become. A label, not a description. An alignment with a group, hopefully, but not a revelation nor defined self-description usually.

The vague vision that is raised or lowered or understood by calling anyone the vague or vogue-ish
term “Liberal” has been long ago tarnished, scratched and scrapped as well. As someone noted, as far back as the 1970’s it was useful-er but once the 1980’s arrived, it was declassed as a positive complimentary image. The word was feeble in image and confusing to a listener.

And it is just being repeated because “Liberal” is a derogatory ancient symbolic WORD. used by the political people who like traditional negative things to throw around that are hopefully easily repeated and recognizable. 

The ‘other’ side, meaning the working poorer middle to lower-level-income folk need a word they remember was ‘not me !’ to use for an enemy and fool. The educated, even fortunate if still poorer than they want to be, dont like the old labels but constantly want to create new pretty words and images of a more colorful variety instead.

Even if they dont change their opinions, views or their own lists of their old enemies either, the Liberals are not akin of liberty- or liberate either -word is not clear - not specific at all - but amorphously attempting to align with generalized ‘higher’ ideals and symbols. So who isn’t ?  Liberals are surely not “superior” tho try for that too.

Stale dessicated and useless labels tell us nothing nor do they encourage us to take more productive actions to improve all our lives… no matter what ‘they call us’ or we call them’. Those old repeated words sure do fail us. “Liberals” ? huh ? and they who “conserve” what again ?

That the topic of labeling branding imaging is again and again raised, now by famous Hedges,is always good. Maybe new word-labels can be invented, tried out, misused and again replaced. The old ones are only good for throwing around, not talking about anyone we know, right ?

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