faith,

Yes, a more constructive path.

I’m afraid that recent evidence is not on your side, faith.  When the Seals went after bin Laden their mission was not to ‘capture’ (your claim about their job) him but very much to kill him and, along with him, his wife, defenseless though they were.  We even bragged about it afterward as if it were something to be proud of.

You seem to be a perfect example of someone who believes what is comfortable for him/her to believe.  You’ve got a great deal of company across the entire political spectrum, but that doesn’t make it right.

PatrickHenry, many choose a more peaceful existence and work once they leave
the Teams.

vector 56, you are absolutely, unequivocally incorrect concerning this matter. Say
what diatribe you will, you are either uninformed or choose not to investigate what
the SEAL teams actually do.  I will so nothing further on the matter.

There are no heroes in a war that is illegal.. heroism does not attach to clandestine
and cowardly activity like assassination. 

The best case in point is Israel’s assassination of Iranian scientists;  no one from
the Israeli government is stepping forward and claiming the perpetrators to be
heroic.  They’re not heroes, they’re murderers, pure and simple, and the Israeli
government lost whatever remained of its integrity and credibility, becoming
indistinguishable from our own unaccountable CIA.  Welcome to tyranny!

Actually they are referred to as operators, efficient tools to those whose purpose is either right or wrong.

Given the end of those who supposedly killed OBL {or one of his family members…DNA} should prove that while they completed the made for TV mission, the real mission found them to be a liability and they were killed.

Once a SEAL leaves the service they are faced with recruitment by CIA or other ‘wet’ asset management teams and these are the ones who take out democratic leaders around the globe.  By that time they are more fully vetted and therefore trusted to break laws and engage in actions contrary to this nations constitution.

“SEALS are precision workers.”

faith:

No, they are highly trained murderers who kill without thought or remorse. Odds are these so-called “heroes” will get an order to snuff out men like Evo Morales, Hugo Chavez (if the cancer does not get him first) or maybe even a few Iranian Scientist and like the overachieving thugs that they are they will slip into their homes and put bullets in the heads of the “target” and any family members who happen to be unlucky enough to wander by. These are the “monsters” in black face and ski mask who slip into your home and slit your throat!

Shame on you faith! These “targeted killers are just the people our corrupt government would send after men like Che Guevara or Aristide in Haiti.
Your so-called “precision workers”  doom generations of poor people to lives without health care, education or jobs that pay a living wage when the snuff out Democratically elected leaders of countries in the service of multinational corporate interest!

also, the idea of calling these stone cold professional killers “precision workers” is one of the most repulsive things I have ever herd in my life! How very dark your heart must be that killing becomes a “normal” job?

@ faith

Is it the SEALS who are killing all those Afghan civilians in night raids???

Are SEALS so different from other Special Forces units???

Too many for responses here, but indeed research before commenting some of
you.  SEALS are precision workers.  They do not take out women and children and
groups of innocents.  Their job, as you can easily note is to capture the individual
that they are after.  Because they do not wipe out groups is exactly why the work
is precise .  These young men sacrifice their lives at great personal cost because
they want to protect the nation.  Loose, ill conceived or analyzed commentary
about them is unfair and inaccurate.

“These psychos are sickos not heroes. trained to kill, kill and only kill.”  What an
outrageous and egregious statement !  And, it is a lie.  Absolutely.

These incredibly brave young men provide the courage, the will, and the ability to
save lives, help the weak, dismantle weapons and lots more.  Their medics are the
best of the best and they save more lives than you are aware of.  Shame on you.

These young men ENDURE incredible training in order to protect us.  They are
indeed heros.  They are not sickos nor psychos.  They are analytical, smart, and
organized.  I say shame on you again and do a little research before you say such
outrageous statements jimnp72.

Why is it that we’re constantly presented with “the Pentagon this and the Pentagon
that” ?  The Pentagon is a building for chrissakes!  When are we gong to attach a
name or names to these actions?  Someone decided to make propaganda movies
with our Defense dollars——who was it? 
Not one agency of our government is operating according to its original charter,
why should the Pentagon be any different?  And while we’re at it we should go
back to the Defense Department’s original name, the War Department, or at least
modify the Defense to Offense which is more accurate.  To the world we are most
certainly very offensive.

vector56,

Cool to hear that George Carlin quote.  Had never
heard it before. You could hear his voice coming back
from the grave. What a beautiful sound.

mrfreeze,

I never saw First Blood but I share your sentiments.

Big B,

Reading 1984 each election year seems like
a fine tradition. 

My own thoughts are:  Yes, it’s a bit creepy that the
final bastion of free speech in America, movies, are
so tightly controlled.  I know that sounds odd,
saying movies represent free speech when so many of
them have been and continue to be garbage.  But each
years dozens, if not hundreds, of great films are
produced, some drama, some documentary—all sorts.

Here’s one example of a great, commercial film that
was at once a big hit and ridiculed, particularly its
director.  The movie portrayed the news media as a
major character in the work of serial killers. It
showed how the news media profits off serial killers.
It showed how some journalists/talk show hosts are like
parasites:  sucking the blood of murder victims and
serial killers to get rich and famous.  The movie showed
how policemen are frequently as violent and perverse
as criminals—but that particular aspect only came out
in the Director’s Cut.  The movie was called Natural
Born Killers and the news media attacked its director
Oliver Stone relentlessly because he dared show them to the
world for the parasitic bastards they are. Stone is now
held up as an example of a delusional Hollywood freak.
History will regard him differently, I suspect.   

Movies have been squashed by an absurd rating system
and profit margin that forces producers and directors
to consider the tastes and intellect of teenagers above
all else. Proof: Watch the original Planet of the Apes.
Compare it to the utter shit released last year
under a similar name. The first movie was for adults.
The one made last year was for teenagers. 

More and more, just like with rock-n-roll,
corporations are determining what gets distributed
and, as they exert more and more control and apply
more and more stupidity, the industry collapses. 

They do this by censoring for children, squashing
dissent, limiting creativity, relying on formulas,
excluding adults from the market and giving customers
the finger (for example, by showing commercials to
customers who have already paid a premium). 

So, yes, big business and big military are in control
of the big movie industry, but it’s a crashing ship.
It will share the same fate as rock-n-roll.  Adults
will shun the movies.  Kids will shun the theaters.
Movies will stream online.  It will become much
harder for actors and craftsman to make a living in
the traditional movie industry. 

Take heart. We’ll all starve together.

““I’d like to see the legacy of Vietnam put to bed,” said “Act of Valor” filmmaker Mike “Mouse” McCoy in an interview with the Huffington Post.”

George Carlin:

Premature Extraction

“Actually, when you think about it, this country has had a manhood problem for some time. You can tell the language we use; language always gives us away. What did we do wrong in Vietnam? We ‘pulled out’! Not a very manly thing to do. No. When you’re fucking people, you’re supposed to stay with it and fuck them good; fuck them to death; hang in there and keep fucking them until they’re all fucking dead.

But in Vietnam what happened was by accident we left a few women and children alive, and we haven’t felt good about ourselves since.

That’s why in the Persian Gulf, George Bush had to say, ‘This will not be another Vietnam.’ He actually said, ‘this time we’re going all the way.’

Imagine. An American president using the sexual slang of a thirteen-year-old to describe his foreign policy.

And, of course, when it got right down to it, he didn’t ‘go all the way.’ Faced with going into Baghdad he punked out. No balls. Just Bush.

Instead, he applied sanctions, so he’d be sure that an extra half a million brown children would die. And so his oil buddies could continue to fill their pockets.

If you want to know what happened in the Persian Gulf, just remember the first names of the two men who ran that war: Dick Cheney and Colin Powell.

Dick and Colon.

Someone got fucked in the ass.

And those brown people better make sure they keep their pants on, because Dick and Colin have come back for an encore.”

The encore is Iran.

They also forgot that they are not allowed to propagandize the US citizenry. But they have no regard for us anyway so what’s the difference. For that matter, what is really the difference between a US civilian and a Taliban to them. Just a matter of time and place and opportunity.

These psychos are sickos not heroes. trained to kill, kill and only kill.

then they can come back here and enroll in the “troops to cops” program.

pscyh

Jim Yell, it’s a bit more complicated than you suggest.  We would certainly LIKE to be able to praise and respect our armed forces, but when what they’re up to does not deserve praise or respect we should not accord them.

It’s certainly also arguable that neither should we denigrate them for doing what their leaders have asked of them, save in cases where what they have done (whether or not after having explicitly been asked to do it) constitutes a personal war crime.  But letting them know that our praise and respect is conditional based on the propriety (not mere legality, to the degree that can be assessed) of their activities has impact on how much they may (and should) push back in the future when asked to engage in something they should not do.

Sure, that puts them in a tough position - but that’s part of what they implicitly accept when signing up and they need to understand that (and hopefully take it seriously enough to do some good).

The bottom line is that if some people are going to insist on greeting returning soldiers from misbegotten actions like that in Iraq with ticker-tape parades, it’s entirely reasonable for others to greet them with the shouts of “Baby killers!” that were heard the last time we engaged in something similarly reprehensible.  I personally would prefer a middle-ground where neither took place, but am not holding my breath waiting for it.

Blueokie - I think there’s a lot to your “Rambo” reference:

I clearly remember going to the original film (First Blood) back in 1982 in the theatre. My best friend turned to me and said “I bet all the gung-ho vets and military creeps are going to get a HUGE hard-on watching this crap.” Prophetic statement.

Ever since that stupid movie came out (its critics were quick to point out that Stalone himself never served) I’ve never gone to see another “American, invincible warrior flick.” They’re all nothing but propaganda.

WE THE PEOPLE ARE SICK OF THE MILITARIZATION OF OUR NATION AND SOCIETY! Frankly, I’m tired of equating patriotism with chauvenism and being manipulated into believing that legalized serial killers are heros! What really did it for me was the swooning over, and glorification of, the memoir of that sniper who MURDERED who knows how many alleged “terrorists” in my/our name! Perhaps if all of these beloved military heros would just “say no” to MURDER, INC. and take off all of those oh, so cool camo uniforms and start acting like people rather than trigger happy automatons, the rest of humanity may actually stop thinking of us as the “Great Satan” and a target for revenge!

Shouldn’t we all receive a free ticket to this propaganda since we paid for it?  I’m looking forward to the scene where a few hundred women, children, and old people in a 3rd world country 9000 miles away are vaporized to keep Amerika safe.  Actually I would probably need two tickets to this “Rambo” update, one to sh*t on, and the other to cover it up.

one can ‘make’ [read, steal] more money by lying
than by working or telling the truth.
now you know why there are billionaires in the
world.

sargon the great [or sargon the idiot, if it makes you feel better] was not happy until he conquered all four quarters of known
world. truman the great, obama the great also want for america [or its numero uno class of people] to one day rule the four
quarters of known earth and thus universe.
beats me why anyone would speak about ONE PERCENT’S forgetfulness of ‘mistakes’ made and then repeating them because
of that.
to me, this type of thinking—oh so ubiquitous in MSM—is the usual halftruthing.
so, US ruling class: master of peace, war, miseducation, disinformation, health care, speech, people are not making mistakes.
as for vietnam, US may one day revisit vietnam; especially, if china and russia cannot prevent/stop or are afraid of stopping
that visitation.

in addition to what i said above, santayama was himself mistaken in saying that those who forget mistakes would repeat
them.
actually, the ruling classes do remember all or most of their crimes—oops, ‘mistakes’  they have committed, but masters of
people and warlords deem them holy, last and only options, defending their interests, freedoms, security,  etc.

D. Sirota says that America is now questioning the efficacy and the morality of military interventions. Not at all, America is only bothered by the huge expense in bad times and the lack of victorious outcomes. Proof of this is that they keep electing a majority of government officials (at all levels) who support war. Furthermore, if there wasn’t a sizable market for self-congratulating war movies, you can be sure the studios wouldn’t be making them.

As far as Hollywood, it is not much more than a cemetery run by entertainment professionals where, for the most part, the art of film is buried time and again.

I was thinking the CIA was probably endorsing this when I saw the absurd previews for this movie.  Probably the same deal as that other one, wings of something-or-other with the black fighter pilots in WWII? Forget the name..

I just knew that one day films would be made portraying a victorious america marching out of Vietnam to a tickertape parade and the tears of a gratful nation. Then our childrens history books will be edited to reflect the same.

Many a fascist has said “the victors write (or re-write) the history books.

Its time for my election year tradition of re-reading “1984”. Funny how each time I read it, it becomes closer to reality.

“Last year, for example, it cemented its first full sponsorship of a major film, “X-Men: First Class,” integrating the movie into recruitment ads.”

Sick, dude.

http://michaelfury.wordpress.com/2009/09/25/first-person-sho0ter/