By Michael Cavlan RN, November 18 at 12:50 am Link to this comment

“Will someone please tell Amy Goodman that the Congressman that she had on her show TWICE, the first Muslim in Congress, Keith Ellison had actually toured Gitmo and reported back that ‘It ain’t as bad as it looks.’”

I have worked for several companies where the managers set all their employees to doing “clean Up” for several hours prior to a visit from the “Big Wigs.” I’m surprised that you would be influenced by the results of a P.R. Tour.

Are you familiar with the term “Asymmetrical Warfare”?

“Casting Doubt on US Claims of Suicide, Attorney Scott Horton Reveals 3 Gitmo Prisoners Died After Torture at Secret Site
Democracy Now! January 20, 2010”

“The story focuses on the night of June 9, 2006 when three prisoners–two from Saudi Arabia and one from Yemen– died at the base. Authorities at Guantanamo said the three men, Yasser Talal Al-Zahrani, Salah Ahmed Al-Salami and Mani Shaman Al-Utaybi had killed themselves.”

“The commander at Guantánamo, Rear Admiral Harry Harris, described their deaths as an ‘act of asymmetrical warfare waged against us.’

But new evidence has emerged suggesting the men died not from suicide but torture. A six-month investigation by Harper’s Magazine indicates the three prisoners were suffocated and tortured during questioning at a secret black site facility at Guantanamo known as Camp No.”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
“AntiWar Radio’s Scott Horton
AntiWar.com January 19, 2010”

“The Other Scott Horton (no relation), international human rights lawyer, professor and contributing editor at Harper’s magazine, discusses the evidence in his article that the June 2006 Guantanamo inmate suicides were in fact homicides, the Seton Hall report that debunks the government cover-up story, Gitmo prison guards who saw the three inmates removed from their cells and transported toward infamous Camp ‘No’ on the night they supposed hung themselves, the Camp America commander’s threatening reminder to Guantanamo servicemen to adhere to the official narrative and the involvement of the DOJ and FBI in the cover-up and in stifling Congressional investigations.”

Yesterday, the verdict found against a Gitmo prisoner was complicated by the use of “Advanced Interrogation Techniques.”

Also the C.I.A., in direct violation of the law, destroyed their video recordings of interrogations.

Two-Cents Tony:  You refer to “The Take”  “It is a good example of how citizens working in solidarity with each other can effectively create meaningful change in the political culture of domination by the few.”

Thanks.  That sounds like a good example of what is needed here and now. I’ll look it up.  Hopefully, the change, differed from the practices of “disappearing” peope, that is, was more non-violent than violent.  My hope—though it is often minimized, even ridiculed—is that citizens working in solidarity will create change in our political culture of domination by the few—using nonviolent methods in order to avoid killing and getting killed in the process. 
  The state apparatus is on thin ice, and knows it.  Otherwise there would not be so much fear-inspiring propaganda, manipulation of thought control, and surveillance.  All these are emblems of a state on the verge of collapse due to over-reaching.  A frightened state is an unpredictable machine throwing out signals of distress, not a powerful in-control aggregation of well-oiled parts working in coordination.
  In Washington, it is not so much that one hand doesn’t know what the other is doing, but that one hand doesn’t care what the other is doing.
  The moment that caring disappears from the political scene and nobody “gives a damn”, no holds will be barred.
  “Caring” may seem like a namby-pamby concept to people honing for a fight, but caring is all we have in the end, and the more mutual, the more effective.

Poor GRYMie, he’s been abused. Fortunately for GRYMie, progressive humanitarians lack the cruelty of character necessary to allow for brutalizing those who have no defense.

DBM,

Good to see you.  You are one of the few here who can disagree without being nasty or making every argument personal.

The Gitmo Six Democrats: Roll call vote

By Michelle Malkin •  May 20, 2009 05:25 PM

“I noted earlier this afternoon that the Senate voted 90-6 to deny Obama funding for his Gitmo closure plans.”

More obfuscation from GRYMie:

The issue here is man’s inhumanity to man, and the undeniable right-wing propensity for brutality. Damn the Democrats who voted to deny, damn the Republicans who voted to deny, and damn GRYMie for turning this issue into an opportunity for obfuscation.

Like demented perverts, some believe it’s alright to give, but not to receive.

“Republican objections” Gerard?  I think it was well put by Go Right ... there is little difference between the parties except on “moral” or “values” issues.  Certainly when it comes to waging war and avoiding culpability for war crimes the two parties fall all over each other in their attempts to “out-tough” each other.

Pathetic weakness IMHO.  It would take real toughness to take a moral stand against stupid wars and to bring war criminals to justice even if this caused “embarrassment” to the country ... and actually, far from embarrassment, most of the world would be impressed and have their faith the U.S. restored if the whole chain of command from the torturers to the Commander-in-Chief were brought to justice.

gerard,

Why wait to have Amy Goodman tell you what to think about Argentina? 

Why must you always go on about “others” taking the initiative while you sit in waiting for a journalist to keep you informed?

Keeping in mind that, after voting to fund the GITMO facility, then publicly condemning the use of the GITMO facility, then passing laws to support the use of the GITMO facility, continue to condemn the use of the GITMO facility democrats in the legislature have continuously refused to fund the shuttering of the GITMO facility.

Akin to the use of the military in Iraq.  Vote to use the military, condemn the use of the military, vote to continue to use the military, again condemn the use of the military, vote again to fund the use of the military and tell the public at-large how “principled”, you are.

The strength of conviction and ethics in Washington is truly impressive.

Amy, thank you for helping us all pay attention to Guantanamo in spite of government inaction in its closing. 
  Your article says:  “Decades later, Argentina has emerged from the dictatorship and risen from economic collapse as one of the new, progressive democracies of Latin America.”
  Wouldn’t it help if you pointed out exactly how Argentina has “emerged” and “risen.”  Specifically, what helped bring about the change?  Of course the mothers of the “disappeared”—but were there other influential factors? Is there anything from Argentina’s experience that would help the U.S. fulfill the campaign promises of closing, providing fair civil trials, etc., with the ultimate result of regaining some of our national moral respect.
  What is missing besides the will to go against Republican objections?  It seems there is some roadblock in this matter beyond simply “not caring” or “trying to avoid disclosures, etc.”  If the remaining detentions are simply to keep the “terrorism” threat alive, that should certainly be pointed out.Was the Argentina story similar in this regard?  Few people know (including myself) and few are likely to research these points.  Please add to your article as soon as you can find the time.