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Posted on Oct 6, 2009
Flickr / G20Voice

A Twitter user sends an update from the G20 rally.

By Amy Goodman

A social worker from New York City was arrested last week while in Pittsburgh to participate in the G-20 protests, then subjected to an FBI raid this week at his home—all for using Twitter. Elliot Madison faces charges of hindering apprehension or prosecution, criminal use of a communication facility and possession of instruments of crime. He was posting to a Twitter feed (or tweeting, as it is called) publicly available information about police activities around the G-20 protests, including information about where police had been ordered to disperse protesters.

While alerting people to public information may not seem to be an arrestable offense, be forewarned: Many people have been arrested for the same “crime”—in Iran, that is.

Last June 20, as Iranians protested against the conduct and results of their national election, President Barack Obama said in a statement, “The universal rights to assembly and free speech must be respected, and the United States stands with all who seek to exercise those rights.”

His statement was released in English, Farsi and Arabic, and posted on the White House’s very own Twitter feed. His tweet read, “We call on the Iranian government to stop all violent and unjust actions against its own people.”

U.S. Sens. Charles Schumer, D-N.Y., and Lindsey Graham, R-S.C., wrote to Secretary of State Hillary Clinton, urging her to pressure European nations to restrict sales of eavesdropping technology to Iran. They wrote: “Following recent elections, the Iranian government has used a new communications monitoring center to interfere with and suppress internet and cell phone communications as part of efforts to crackdown on Iranian citizens peacefully demonstrating ... including voice calls, email, text messaging, instant messages, and web traffic, as well as posts to social networking sites such as Twitter, MySpace and Facebook.”

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The U.S. State Department, impressed with the importance of Twitter to Iranian protests, asked Twitter to delay system maintenance that might have interrupted the service during the Iranian protests.

While Madison optimistically mused, “I’m expecting the State Department will come out and support us also,” his lawyer, respected civil rights attorney Martin Stolar, said: “This is just unbelievable. It is the thinnest, silliest case that I’ve ever seen. It tends to criminalize support services for people who are involved in lawful protest activity. And it’s just shocking that somebody could be arrested for essentially walking next to somebody and saying: ‘Hey, don’t go down that street, because the police have issued an order to disperse. Stay away from there.’ ”

Madison, his wife and housemates were roused from sleep during the weekend when the Joint Terrorism Task Force swept into their house, keeping them handcuffed for hours, searching the house and removing computers and other property from everyone in the house. Madison said the FBI “for 16 hours, proceeded to take everything, from plush toys to kitchen magnets and lots of books ... they took Curious George stuffed animals.”

Rather than encourage and support the use of distributed, decentralized social networks to strengthen our democracy and dissent (remember, the Obama campaign itself relied extensively on these online and mobile tools), the government seems headed in the opposite direction. Los Angeles Chief of Police William Bratton recently won acclaim at the annual meeting of the Major Cities Chiefs Association, a professional organization of police executives representing 63 of the largest cities in the United States and Canada. Bratton has launched “I Watch LA,” described as “a community awareness program created to educate the public about behaviors and activities that may have a connection to terrorism.” The iWatch program, despite Bratton’s assertion otherwise, is about spying on your neighbors and turning them in to the police.

One Iranian twitterer for the virtual news hub Tehran Bureau recalled the June protests in an essay: “An officer spoke to us through a loud speaker: ‘Disperse: This is your last warning.’ The sight of them made my knees tremble, but the wave pushed on and so I went along.” He was beaten, bloodied, arrested and held for 20 days. While Elliot Madison was not physically harmed, his legal battles are just beginning, and his case could prove central to the future of free speech in the mobile, digital age.

It is time for the digital censors here in the U.S. to disperse.

Denis Moynihan contributed research to this column.

Amy Goodman is the host of “Democracy Now!,” a daily international TV/radio news hour airing on more than 800 stations in North America. She is the author of “Breaking the Sound Barrier,” recently released in paperback.

© 2009 Amy Goodman

Distributed by King Features Syndicate


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MarthaA's avatar

By MarthaA, October 10, 2009 at 5:16 pm Link to this comment

Folktruther, October 10 at 5:51am,

There is no doubt that the United States has gravitated into a full blown police state that began with the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Movement and the candidacy of Goldwater; after that, massacres of United States citizens began blatantly happening. Remember the Kent State University Massacre:

http://www.democracynow.org/2009/5/7/after_39_years_events_surrounding_kent

http://dept.kent.edu/sociology/lewis/lewihen.htm

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kent_State_shootings

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyzoNCJvy4c


And the Orangeburg Massacre:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orangeburg_massacre

President Obama has chosen democracy, instead of autocracy, but it isn’t easy to turn the ensconced Police State tide that has been being set up for the past 40 years by the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Movement. 

Conservative President Clinton, the best Republican President ever, was in power when the Waco,Texas Massacre took place at the Branch Davidian Compound and Alex Jones was there, also the Randy Weaver Family Massacre.

The tyranny of the police state to control the population and keep the people afraid of their government needs to be stopped, but I doubt it can just be stopped with one signature of President Obama, there are lots of laws that have been written and it takes time to get it done, especially with those 6 Conservative Dogs, but I agree—the police state must be dispensed with.

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By Folktruther, October 10, 2009 at 2:51 am Link to this comment

Damn right, Martha, cops were selected from all over the US and they closed down Pittsburgh in Obama’s America.  And they had a combat brigade from Iraq in reserve.  All of them dressed in black to intimidate protesters.  the US under Bush-Obama has degenerated into a neoliberal police state.

Ardee, truthers who are utterly wrong sometimes illuminate the truth in a specific area.  Hitler said that “One brave man with a club is worth ten cowards with guns” and what he said was quite true.  the truth exists independantly of who says it, although not of the perspective that conditions it.
            ***
The world has been ruled in Western history by White Old Rich Men (WORMs)  It is time for non-rich, non-White, non-males and the non-old to enter into citizenship.  Ten year olds are far too ancient to begin voting and learning about the deception of power.  Their moms could begin to teach them at much earlier age.  ” Don’t take candy from that smiling political leader, honey, you’ll ruin your soul.”  He can’t be trusted.

My task is to help restore the distrust of the American people in their religious, political, financial and cultural leaders.  You can’t start too early.

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By Folktruther, October 10, 2009 at 2:35 am Link to this comment

You are quite right, Virgina, the kids little brains would be enticed by lollypops and lies.  but how does that differ from how American ‘adults’ are treated?  Mom’s are usually quite practical and would start pointing out the lies early.  Women are used to being lied to and thus have the experience to teach their children about political lies as well as personal ones.  It would help make a more truthful world.

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By KDelphi, October 9, 2009 at 9:18 pm Link to this comment

I keep reading tyrying to think of something to say, but it all looks the same to me…we are in Bush term 3.

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By stcfarms, October 9, 2009 at 5:39 pm Link to this comment

The right of assembly was originally closely tied to the right to petition. One
significant case involving the two rights was United States v. Cruikshank, 92
U.S. 542 (1875). There, the Supreme Court held that citizens may “assemble
for the purpose of petitioning Congress for a redress of grievances.”
Essentially, it was held that the right to assemble was secondary, while the
right to petition was primary. Later cases, however, have expanded the
meaning of the right to assembly. Hague v. CIO, 307U.S. 496 (1939), for
instance, refers to the right to assemble for the “communication of views on
national questions” and for “disseminating information.”

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MarthaA's avatar

By MarthaA, October 9, 2009 at 4:26 pm Link to this comment

Here is a little clue as to how much of a police state the U.S. has become:

“According to news reports, “U.S. authorities assembled a security force of nearly 5,000 people to safeguard the [G20] event, including 2,500 National Guard troops, 1,200 state troopers, 875 Pittsburgh city police and small groups of officers from other agencies.”

Police and National Guard troops headed off an unauthorized march by some 1000 protesters on Thursday and eventually forced the crowd to scatter.

The police reaction to the protests has been marked by what antiwar activist Cindy Sheehan calls “profound overkill.”

“I have been to dozens of protests, large and small, since my son was killed in Iraq, but I have never seen anything like today,” Sheehan writes. “There were easily two cops/soldiers for every one of us protesters or maybe even 3 to 1.”

Sheehan also witnessed the National Guard troops working with the local police and comments, “Seeing the National Guard troops, fresh from Iraq, broke my heart the hardest. I also talked to dozens of them, none had ever heard of posse commitatus, and asked them if my son, their brother, died in Iraq so they could steal the rights of his mother. Most of them wouldn’t even look at me.”

http://rawstory.com/2009/09/video-appears-to-show-us-troops-kidnapping-protester/

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Virginia777's avatar

By Virginia777, October 9, 2009 at 7:28 am Link to this comment

FT: “Out of the womb and into the voting booth”?

Can’t you just imagine the manipulation of kids via cartoons? along with being manipulated to buy sugar cereals, their little wills will be at once grabbed up to sway their votes!

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By ardee, October 9, 2009 at 2:48 am Link to this comment

And Opollo is right, Ardee, it is the proportion of the POPULATION voting that is relevant to democracy.

Sorry FT but when you side with haters and evil you are tarred with that brush. The enemy of my enemy is my friend…..

As to the absurdity that the path of this nation should be decided by ten year olds, well I know you are tongue in cheek….or stoned.

The vote is reserved for adults, as is the army, or do you also advocate for ‘out of the womb and into a uniform”?

It is bad enough to see how easily manipulated our adult electorate seems to be, and how ridiculous is the thought that statistics can be so easily made dumb.

Those who vote represent 100% of the deciding portion of our population, all numbers and fractions begin there .

Pick better allies FT and certainly pick better fights.

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By stcfarms, October 8, 2009 at 11:07 pm Link to this comment

All Obama has to do to win the support of the people is to write one executive
order. It would remove all previous executive orders from all previous
presidents and ban the practice. He could take back the money given to the
bankers and automakers and build a million windmills. The jobs would last a
few years, the ‘free’ energy would last for generations.

We bashed the hell out of Bush when he was the head criminal but Bush is
gone. Obama could have fixed some problems by now. Instead he made the
previous problems worse by hiring the same fools that got us into this mess in
the first place. If Obama wants our support he better get off his ass and do his
job.

By What the!, October 8 at 11:36 pm #

  He hasn’t even been in office long enough to even address such policies…
Geez… We aren’t stupid enough to fall for the conservative spin and mix bull
crap, so move it to the Fox channel…LOL

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By What the!, October 8, 2009 at 8:36 pm Link to this comment

Mud slides in Indonesia, must be Obama.  Tsunami, oh that Obama again… Liberal this… Neoliberal that… Give me a break!!!! 

Folktruther get a clue!!!!  Look, this system of question nothing was installed since the time of Hoover, it is not an Obama or even Bush issue.  This is the wonderful contination that was sponsored very acceptably by good’ol Cheney.  So enough on the Obama Neoliberal police bull crap.  He hasn’t even been in office long enough to even address such policies… Geez… We aren’t stupid enough to fall for the conservative spin and mix bull crap, so move it to the Fox channel…LOL

(Blessed being a independent versus a conservative or liberal cronie!!!)

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By stcfarms, October 8, 2009 at 4:43 pm Link to this comment

It may be impossible to get the extreme left and right to accept common
sense as they have gone so long without it. Both groups see their crooks as
good and the other sides crooks as bad. The powers that be and the public
fool system have done their job well. Divide and conquer still works.

By Folktruther, October 8 at 6:30 pm #

The neoliberal police state now coalescing in the US is doing so under OBAMA,
not Bush.  The twelve thousand police dressed in black that shut down
Pittsburgh and brutalized the demonstrators was done under OBAMA, not
Bush.  the spying on the population and, as Freddy says, the restriction of the
Internet is done by OBAMA, not Bush.  The consolidation of power in the White
House is continued under OBAMA. In order to fight a police state, allowing the
power struture to do anything they want, it is necessary to fight BOTH parties.

Report this

By Folktruther, October 8, 2009 at 3:30 pm Link to this comment

The neoliberal police state now coalescing in the US is doing so under OBAMA, not Bush.  The twelve thousand police dressed in black that shut down Pittsburgh and brutalized the demonstrators was done under OBAMA, not Bush.  the spying on the population and, as Freddy says, the restriction of the Internet is done by OBAMA, not Bush.  The consolidation of power in the White House is continued under OBAMA. In order to fight a police state, allowing the power struture to do anything they want, it is necessary to fight BOTH parties.

And Opollo is right, Ardee, it is the proportion of the POPULATION voting that is relevant to democracy.  Children should be allowed to vote, not that in these rigged and restricted American elections it would make any difference.  A vote, however, is the right of citizenship. Children should be allowed to vote; no age, sex or race restrictions.  My motto is:

    OUT OF THE WOMB, INTO THE VOTING BOOTH.

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By stcfarms, October 8, 2009 at 12:12 pm Link to this comment

Obviously you have managed to miss all of my posts for the last eight years.
You must understand that there are no honest politicians, anywhere, ever. The
divisions of liberal and conservative do not exist, they are created by the
criminals in Washington to keep the sheep stupid and divided. It is the hard
core extremists like yourself on both sides that keep the myth alive. If you
stop to think, rather than just react, you will begin to understand that they all
are the enemy. The only difference between right wing extremists and left
wing extremists is the lies they tell. Your defense of your criminal over their
criminals helps keep both sets of criminals in power. Ordinarily I do not
respond to posts that are mixed bold and all caps as it shows that the poster
has no respect for internet protocol.

By ThomasG, October 8 at 12:34 pm #

stcfarms, October 8 at 3:39am,

Your indignant outrage should be directed toward the Smash and Grab Right-
Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS

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Virginia777's avatar

By Virginia777, October 8, 2009 at 9:49 am Link to this comment

Its an illusion (that internet innovations will aid free speech and allow for greater dissent).

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ThomasG's avatar

By ThomasG, October 8, 2009 at 9:34 am Link to this comment

stcfarms, October 8 at 3:39am,

Your indignant outrage should be directed toward the Smash and Grab Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS from Goldwater to Reagan, Bush I and Bush II that by way of Borrow and Spend Governance bankrupted the United States, deindustrialized the United States, financialized the economy of the United States, and converted the economy of the United States into dependence upon mercantile imports and borrowed money from Asia, and then created the biggest financial bubble in the history of the world in pursuit of their self-serving greed with “toxic securities” and “credit default swap derivatives” that when the bubble broke, brought down the economy of both the United States and the World; where is your indignant outrage against the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS that created the problem?  Why is it that YOU direct YOUR indignant outrage against the only one who is trying to clean up the mess caused by the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS.

It is true that trillions of dollars of socialized resources have been spent to clean up the mess caused by the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS, but it would not have been necessary to spend those trillions of dollars of socialized resources if the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS had not created such a God awful mess that required cleaning up.

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By stcfarms, October 8, 2009 at 12:39 am Link to this comment

Give him time? Time to throw away $2,000,000,000,000 that could have built
a million wind generators. The wind generators would have produced jobs for
years and power for generations. Obama gave that money to bankers and car
manfacturers. The police state could be stopped with the stroke of a pen if the
hand holding the pen was on a good president. Sure Obama is better than
Bush but the lesser of two evils is a bad way to pick a president. If you feel
that only a black president can heal the nation might I suggest Neil DeGrasse
Tyson. Tyson is a brilliant scientist and an honest man, two things you cannot
say about Obama.

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MarthaA's avatar

By MarthaA, October 7, 2009 at 5:01 pm Link to this comment

Jim Yell, October 7 at 12:07pm,

President Obama can’t be more monstrous than what we got rid of, just give him time.  The Conservative Movement set up the police state and there will have to be a Liberal Movement to change it, which will take time.

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PatrickHenry's avatar

By PatrickHenry, October 7, 2009 at 4:21 pm Link to this comment

Its not the votes that count but who counts the votes…..Stalin.

Until such time as diebold and other hackable voting machines are replaced with those with a paper tail enabling a recount, professional politicians and the monopoly parties have us by the short hairs.

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By ardee, October 7, 2009 at 4:05 pm Link to this comment

KDelphi, October 7 at 4:24 pm #

I am not making this up..I was arrested as a juvenile for telling someone to flush a joint cause a cop was behind them. Charges were dropped.

Hee…I was arrested once, a very long time ago ,for being in possession of a joint. ( where were you when I needed you?) We arrived downtown in the squad car and I stood before the booking desk, handcuffed like the desperado I was, the sergeant asked for the evidence and both cops looked at each other. I grinned and was released.

Upon returning, via bus, to my car I found the joint on the roof of the car where the police had obligingly left it. I lit it up and drove home…...

Now for something completely different…. and someone as well I think.

apolloguide, October 7 at 11:11 am #

Ardee: You continue to refuse to read critically. when 100,000,000 million vote in a national US election and the country’s population hovers around 300,000,000 then 1/3 of the population has voted.
When these voters split then roughly 50,000,000 people vote Democrat (1/6) and 50,000,000 (1/6) vote Republican.  When you take the final step and do the math you find that 1/6 of the population has voted
Republican.  That is expressed as 16.666% NOT 40%.
You need to go back and read the post and let the words sink in.  I used “population” not “electorate”. Please focus on the facts and be more careful and less emotional.

So, the leanings of five year olds, ten year olds fifteen year olds and thirty year olds who do not vote make your statistics nonsense.

By the by, my odd little fellow, you originally said less than 18% and now claim 16%..Thats a problem you encounter when your facts are bullsht to begin with.

The only way to judge the leanings of the population is to use the actual voting public not every kid in his diapers. 40% of those who vote vote for one or the other of the two parties, each and every time in fact. What a six year old in kindergarten thinks about politics seems a silly use of statistics…but not to you I guess.

In order to affect peaceful change one needs a majority of the VOTES.Thus the leaning s of the public in general, which are unknown to you and I, matters not at all.

Please try harder not to waste our time here…thanks ever so much.

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PatrickHenry's avatar

By PatrickHenry, October 7, 2009 at 2:46 pm Link to this comment

Over the past many years since 9/11, I have seen most all the federal buildings in Washington DC and district government buildings, schools, metro centers and courts install metal detectors and x-ray machines. 

As a contractor who routinely goes into machine rooms and performs estimates, it is difficult to access many points without the benefit of a pocket knife, yes, a simple 2” pocket knife will put you in the same arena as OBL and Al-CIAda.

I’m sure glad I’m getting close to retirement, I’ve seen Americas freedoms dimish in the past decade all in the name of security.

It reminds me of the old addage of those who give up freedom for security generally end up with neither.

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By KDelphi, October 7, 2009 at 1:24 pm Link to this comment

I am not making this up..I was arrested as a juvenile for telling someone to flush a joint cause a cop was behind them. Charges were dropped.

You Dems are going to have to accept the fact that you won. Yes, YOUR GUY is allowing this..and some of us actually saw it coming.

D.R. Zing—yes, but, WERE a ‘warring Empire”—now we’re just “warring” in ou death throes.

Are all of you that were angry at the Iranian govt for spying on twittering agnry at the Dem govt now?

I ssaw the CEO of AT&T at some kind of “freedom forum” talking about free speech, free mkts, blah, blah, blah—lol. After the duopoly supported uSA Patriot Act?

The more things “change” the more they reamain the same.

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MarthaA's avatar

By MarthaA, October 7, 2009 at 10:18 am Link to this comment

Ouroborus, October 7 at 8:26 am,

Ouroborus said October 6 at 11:26pm:  “and we were a totalitarian democracy.

MarthaA answer October 6 at 11:43pm:
Totalitarian is NOT democracy.”

Ouroborus said October 7 at 12:11am: “we are in fact (one
description) a totalitarian democracy.”

MarthaA answer October 7 at 12:11am: “A police state is NOT democracy.  Get a clue.”

Ouroborus said October 7 at 8:26am: “Umm, America isn’t a police state?  You get a clue!”

MarthaA’s answer: Duh, Why do you think I said something about America NOT being a police state??????? I didn’t, but America is a police state.  What is a totalitarian state?  A totalitarian democracy IS a POLICE STATE, not a democracy.  YOU are the one who said we are in fact a totalitarian democracy, which is an oxymoron.  There is no such thing as a totalitarian democracy.

America is a totalitarian police state—no democracy, it is just a matter of time until the police get even worse. Like Martha Stewart, the police do as they please and they do it with ease, making money for the city, county, state and federal governments.

Example:  Now if someone gives you a prescription pain pill, one pill, and you do not take it, but put that pill in your pocket and the police stop you, and shake you down for whatever reason, you can go to prison for five years if you do not have a good attorney, and still you will have to pay thousands of dollars to the court and community service, drug testing, etc. besides attorney fees, because you didn’t swallow that one prescription pain pill for your pain that someone thought they were doing you a favor giving to you when you whined, but you get caught with it, and like Elliot Madison, many are facing charges like this for NOTHING, which is a Police State—not democracy in any way.

And we must remember that only the prices of everything is all that is going up——not the cost of living——so there is no reason to adjust the cost of living for the people, because only the prices are going up.

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By Jim Yell, October 7, 2009 at 9:07 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

We voted for Obama, not necessarily because we thought he would do everything we wished, but because we thought he would bring back legality to our government and be thoughtful and balanced in his response to directing our country. He says a lot of needful things, but beyond that he has appointed unimaginative officials, people who are so wedded to the processes that ruined our country in the last 2 decades, that nothing is changing and none of his supposed goals are being achieved.

He is apparently set to increase the brutality of occupation in Afganistan, even though it is clear we can not be a constructive force in that miserable country. Where is he in allowing this police action against our own people? He is missing in action in leading the country. He is becoming the monster we thought we were getting rid of. What is going on?

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By apolloguide, October 7, 2009 at 8:11 am Link to this comment

Ardee: You continue to refuse to read critically. 
when 100,000,000 million vote in a national US
election and the country’s population hovers around
300,000,000 then 1/3 of the population has voted. 
When these voters split then roughly 50,000,000
people vote Democrat (1/6) and 50,000,000 (1/6) vote
Republican.  When you take the final step and do the
math you find that 1/6 of the population has voted
Republican.  That is expressed as 16.666% NOT 40%.
You need to go back and read the post and let the
words sink in.  I used “population” not “electorate”. 
Please focus on the facts and be more careful and
less emotional.

Report this

By notasleep, October 7, 2009 at 8:06 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

FBI terrorists—they hate us for our freedoms.

I one warned a driver not to make an illegal left because a police car was just out of sight.  The police then drove up and one of the cops said to me, “thanks a lot buddy.”  Under the above, unconstitutional, silly, childish theory I would have committed a crime.

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By mestizo warrior, October 7, 2009 at 6:20 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

What’s next? Incarceration for what we think? The capitalist system is crumbling and both neo-liberals and conservatives are fearful of what the people might do.

We have NO real democracy in this country. It is very evident when Congress won’t give us real healthcare reform, not because it can’t be done but because they are all receiving legal bribes from the healthcare oorporations.

Folks, it is time that we all stop and give serious consideration to the situation we have in this country. Do we remain silent as most of Congress did during the Bush regime? Or do we finally see the writing on the wall and organize a viable alternative to the parties of Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dum?

The choice is ours to make. I just pray enough of us have the guts to resist.

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Purple Girl's avatar

By Purple Girl, October 7, 2009 at 5:47 am Link to this comment

Obviously this guy did not pose a threat to security. But what if they had been Tweets from Neo Nazi’s outside an Obama Rally?
We should take a moment and think how this could cut another way.
Granted I don’t want the gov’t- or any other entity- monitoring my activities on the Internet.But then again I’m not up to any nefarious activites and am cognitive of the fact it is a Public domain.
Apparently The Right wing hasn’t figured this out since The Media has exposed some Tweets by dumbass politicians.So ‘privacy’ is a mute point, the ‘World Wide Web’ works both ways. You have access to the World and the World has access to you (or at least as much as you put out there).
And with the uptick of Radical Rigthwingers lately- I might prefer we continue to keep on eye on some of their posts.

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Ouroborus's avatar

By Ouroborus, October 7, 2009 at 5:26 am Link to this comment

MarthaA, October 7 at 8:10 am #
Ouroborus, October 7 at 12:11 am,

I started to say blah,
============================================
Oh, please, not the dreaded blah, anything but the
blah…................
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
A police state is NOT democracy.  Get a clue.
============================================
Umm, America isn’t a police state? Whew, glad to hear
that. Now tell that to Elliot Madison, his wife, and
his roomies. You get a clue!

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godistwaddle's avatar

By godistwaddle, October 7, 2009 at 5:13 am Link to this comment

Because Mao killed millions did not make him wrong.  Sometimes (WWII?) you have to kill fascists.

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MarthaA's avatar

By MarthaA, October 7, 2009 at 5:10 am Link to this comment

Ouroborus, October 7 at 12:11 am,

I started to say blah, but apparently YOU think the tyranny of the MAJORITY by the minority is democracy, but tyranny of the MAJORITY by the minority is NOT democracy.  A police state is NOT democracy.  Get a clue.

Report this

By ardee, October 7, 2009 at 2:55 am Link to this comment

apolloguide, October 6 at 7:06 pm #

Ardee: It is the progressive way of dealing with a big problem.  True progressives recognize that you have to divide and conquer and there are less than 18% of the population now who are solid Republican votes.

Firstly , all polling data indicates that, in every national election ,roughly 40% of the electorate vote Dem and the same number vote GOP. Secondly , I am unfamiliar with any examples of the progressive tendency to “divide and conquer” can you give some examples thereof?

Getting “rid of” ones opposition sort of puts you in rather dubious company, politically speaking, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot, the list continues…..

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By knobcreekfarmer, October 7, 2009 at 2:13 am Link to this comment

Further evidence of the corporate police state we live in that is branded as a “free
country.”

Amy, sorry to hear about your mother.

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Ouroborus's avatar

By Ouroborus, October 6, 2009 at 9:11 pm Link to this comment

MarthaA, October 6 at 11:43 pm #
Totalitarian is NOT democracy.
==========================================
They are not mutually exclusive; we are in fact (one
description) a totalitarian democracy.

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MarthaA's avatar

By MarthaA, October 6, 2009 at 8:43 pm Link to this comment

Ouroborus, October 6 at 11:26 pm,

Totalitarian is NOT democracy.

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Ouroborus's avatar

By Ouroborus, October 6, 2009 at 8:26 pm Link to this comment

This is a genuine WTF moment. Let’s see, for Iranian
protesters tweeting is good; but for those democracy
hating G-20 protesters in the U.S., tweeting is bad.
Now there’s some pretty serious issues going on here.
For the life of me, I can’t remember which morning it
was, when I woke up, and we were a totalitarian
democracy.

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MarthaA's avatar

By MarthaA, October 6, 2009 at 8:19 pm Link to this comment

“Elliot Madison faces charges of hindering apprehension or prosecution, criminal use of a communication facility and possession of instruments of crime.”

I hope he has a good attorney, because these subjective charges can’t possibly stick in an objective court of law.

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D.R. Zing's avatar

By D.R. Zing, October 6, 2009 at 5:40 pm Link to this comment

apolloguide,

I wish you luck but I’m not sure that if we threw out every Republican in Congress anything would change very quickly.  We are a warring empire. Our wealth is created and consumed by war. Democrats, too, feed from the trough.  But, overall, hell yeah, I’m with you, defeat the Republican Party and make it a relic. That’s a good start.

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D.R. Zing's avatar

By D.R. Zing, October 6, 2009 at 5:02 pm Link to this comment

Reminds me of the Clash song “Know Your Rights”:


“You have the right to free
Speech as long as you’re not
Dumb enough to actually try it”

The song ends with a verse that would be mundane in any other context, but is particularly chilling in our current era:

“You have the right to remain silent
You are warned that anything you say
Can and will be taken down
And used as evidence against you”

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By apolloguide, October 6, 2009 at 4:06 pm Link to this comment

Ardee: It is the progressive way of dealing with a
big problem.  True progressives recognize that you
have to divide and conquer and there are less than
18% of the population now who are solid Republican
votes.  It’s actually been that way since before 2000
but with the election rigging of 2000, 2002, 2004,
2006, and even 2008; but it was not apparent to those
of you who equate all Dems with Gop. 

Job One is to get rid of those who identify as GOP. 
We have to get them to less than 1% of the
population.  This is accomplished by exposing them
each and every day.  You need to help because your
stubbornness is a blessing.  Welcome to the free
world !!

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PatrickHenry's avatar

By PatrickHenry, October 6, 2009 at 3:56 pm Link to this comment

Great, tweet police.

Its all in the conditioning.

You didn’t really think switching to HDTV was for the publics benefit, did you?

http://proliberty.com/observer/20090118.htm

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By ardee, October 6, 2009 at 3:43 pm Link to this comment

....and every other thing I have
available to make sure these Republicans and those who carry water for them continue to stay on the run!!!

Last I heard we had a Democrat in the White House, a Democratic majority in both Houses of Congress too…what republicans are they I cannot help but wonder?

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By apolloguide, October 6, 2009 at 3:29 pm Link to this comment

Actually Amy just the opposite is required:::...tweet
and facebook and googlewave and do what ever else you
can to stop this mad machine.  Your title reminds me of
one Ari Fleischer !!  I love you Amy…don’t stop
broadcasting and I won’t stop broadcasting through
tweet, fBook, Googlewave and every other thing I have
available to make sure these Republicans and those who
carry water for them continue to stay on the run!!!

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Fat Freddy's avatar

By Fat Freddy, October 6, 2009 at 3:16 pm Link to this comment

Rather than encourage and support the use of distributed, decentralized social networks to strengthen our democracy and dissent

Since when does any one in government want to do that? Ultimately, politics (government) is about controlling the masses. Too much “democracy and dissent” leads to a lack of control, in the eyes of some. It seems the only dissent allowed in this country, is that of dissent of the Republican Party platform, or the dissent of the Democratic Party platform. When one starts talking about dismantling the warfare - welfare structure, or the Federal Reserve (economics is also a form of controlling the masses), one becomes a threat. There are several ways our government deals with these “threats”. Mostly, it’s simple ridicule by one or both of the two parties. This is usually enough to get an idea booted off the airwaves of the MSM. But more and more people are beginning to get their information and ideas from the internet (for better or worse).

This story is just the most recent attempt by the government to control information and how it is transmitted (the internet). How much longer do you really think Net Neutrality will holdout? The government is really beginning to be concerned about the free exchange of ideas over the internet because of the speed and accuracy (among other things).

Do you think the government has agents that post certain types of comments on blogs, such as this one, in an attempt to control people’s thoughts and ideas? Does the Republican Party…? Does the Democratic Party…? Do the Labor Unions and all the special interest groups intentionally post things for their own benefit? Of course they do. But do they do it overtly or covertly? Are people being paid to do this? By whom? With tax dollars? It’s much more subtle than having the FBI hack and place a virus on a site (or something that most firewalls view as a threat). I can’t tell you how many times I came across that in the earlier days of the internet while looking for “questionable” adult material. wink I used to think it was the ISP doing that, but now I know better.

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Hulk2008's avatar

By Hulk2008, October 6, 2009 at 2:38 pm Link to this comment

Gee.  Do ya suppose the NSA tipped ‘em off ?  Remember way back when the NSA and the CIA were too busy to fiddle with US citizens ?  It sure smacks of Post-Cheney fascism.

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