Neither your suggestions nor your ideas are workable.

So hunt the weapons maker and users
Just. F.O.

Who cares ?
The vast majority of us care, and do not want NAZI-types to overtake the world, as they and the zionists have overtaken the USofA, via the fraudulent “Federal Reserve,” the CIA, Halliburton, Blackwater and subordinates.  A real-life, worst-case example is found in “Jamie Lee Jones -/- Halliburton/KBR” which occurred in Bagdahd about four years ago. What parent wants to see that happen to ones daughter, or anyones daughter ?

Money is a mode of barter, the use of which reflects the “talk” of its owners. The original inhabitants of the North American continent say, “what you do speaks so loud, I cannot hear what you say.”  This principle, when applied, is very accurate.

so, who cares if were the NAZIs
Money talks…..

Just as my comments reflect my values and thoughts, each comment reflects the values and thoughts of the writer. Comments that consist of criticism, enmity and hate, simply reflect the hateful, idiosyncratic mental gyrations of their owner.

Interesting.
A review of the comments on Truthdig headings, reflects- not totally, but generally - either a gross, current-information deficit, a cubicle in the Disinformation Division of the CIA, or a stooge-apprenticeschip in a zionist office, somewhere. Occasionally, a combination of all three.

The interesting part of this is the way you cannot fathom the opposition to what you hold sacred, thus it must, perforce, stem from an organized campaign. Why else would anyone fail to see the absolute wisdom of your own beliefs,heh?

I am embarrassed for those like you…so very sad. But a quite small and inconsequential minority. Thus I turn my back on your efforts from this time forward. Hopefully you will wander off, mumbling to yourself.

Wrong Drbhelthi a very few of us are not in any way. No gods, no masters, no heroes and no idols. That just isn’t part of our makeup. No spell binding speakers can work on us either. Yes there are Atheists in fox holes and they even have a group of WWII vets (maybe from other wars too) out there if you will open your eyes a little more.

You’re view is that we all have some impulse and you would be wrong. Not all of us have an interest in sports either or the color red. It is biological and involves evolution.

” - - some kind of religious maniac as well, are we?”
Since you suggest it, perhaps you are. 
All of us are religious, the variation exists in what we worship, or claim to not worship. The term “religious maniac” has become a nonsequitur, similar to many Americanski words that simply reflect the disdain, sometimes hate, sometimes envy, of whoever penned the words. In other words, they reflect idiosyncratic thought.

Interesting.
A review of the comments on Truthdig headings, reflects- not totally, but generally - either a gross, current-information deficit, a cubicle in the Disinformation Division of the CIA, or a stooge-apprenticeschip in a zionist office, somewhere. Occasionally, a combination of all three.

Am I the only parent who notices a decrease in the sons of Judah population, due to activity of the zionists leading Israel to destruction? I guess the parents of each sacrificed soldier also notice it.

By drbhelthi, October 6 at 7:55 am #

Biblical scholars have repeatedly told me that Satan is proud of all his good little pimps, who espouse hate and attempt to pronounce damnation on all who disagree with their dogma. True believers have no need to spout ugly proclamations onto evil propagandists, whose satanic jargon identifies them as doers of evil.

          x x x x x x x x x x x

drb,

So, not just a common garden variety anti-Semite, but some kind of religious maniac as well, are we?

drbhelthi, October 6 at 7:55 am #

Biblical scholars have repeatedly told me that Satan is proud of all his good little pimps, who espouse hate and attempt to pronounce damnation on all who disagree with their dogma. True believers have no need to spout ugly proclamations onto evil propagandists, whose satanic jargon identifies them as doers of evil.

.....................................

Yet you every post is filed with hate, you need a mirror.

Satan as you like to call Sammael was sent by your god to torment and trouble us. If you can believe that myth. I don’t for I am a humanist and if falls on all our shoulders what we do to each other. Until then the biologically induced fantasy will be the ruler of all of us. In evolution the traits that do the best get the most representation. And so it goes.

Biblical scholars have repeatedly told me that Satan is proud of all his good little pimps, who espouse hate and attempt to pronounce damnation on all who disagree with their dogma. True believers have no need to spout ugly proclamations onto evil propagandists, whose satanic jargon identifies them as doers of evil.

drbhelthi, October 6 at 2:05 am

I find your name rather irony filled…You are far from healthy, far from typical thankfully, and you and your hate filled screeds will fade away and be forgotten.

Ref:  propagandists who call others „bigots“

One situation is even worse.  Members and supporters of a maligned religious sect, a subordinate of a major tribe that was cast aside by Jahweh two thousand years ago, continue to spew their propaganda, and demand to have their will accepted, similar to spoiled brats. They call the seekers and purveyers of truth and accuracy, „bigots“, sometimes having an unfortunate influence on the more ignorant and naieve of the populace, although their influence is swiftly narrowing. All this while their leadership, zionists, have parasited on the USA since WWII, under the guise of a holocaust, and have misused the fraudulent enterprise, the „Federal Reserve“ to bankrupt the USA and the western world. The greatest bigots of the world are the narrow-minded who have little defense for their illogical dogma other than calling others, „bigots.“

Fortunately for the western world, eastern world wisdom recognizes their religious dogma farce, has not fallen prey to it, nor will it grant sanctuary to this maligned dogma.

Why don’t Christians and Muslims use the same argument as Jews when being criticized? For example, as soon as Iran is criticized, they should simply retaliate with the accusation that America is anti-Muslim (or anti-Shia). It seems that being accused of being anti-some religious group enables you to avoid and actually reverse the point of criticism entirely.

I am not in the least bit anti-semitic. I have nothing against Jews per se. I do have a lot against Israel though. I think the policy of that country is 100% wrong in relation to the Middle East.

drbhelthi, October 5 at 2:44 am #

Israel, Jews, zionists are three different entities.
Bigots hate accuracy and truth, as do zionists. Having too much wind in ones thinking patterns, and being a bigot for ones own religious grouping, prevents insight into the larger truth. “Jews” are so diversified in their beliefs, they are difficult to define. However, such accuracy is foreign to a religious bigot, with too much wind in ones thinking patterns, who spews venom with every written sentence, who doesnt understand ones own religious grouping.
*************************************************

As usual, a bigot sounds off, gets called to the carpet, then unleashes a torrent of abuse and accusations in an attempt to change the focus.

FYI, I am Agnostic, and am far more justifiably suspicious of the Ultra-Orthodox Jews than you, because, unlike you, I know the REAL dangers they pose, and the phony-baloney ones they don’t pose.  I also know that many Jews think like me, and not like Netanyahu.

But I still know you are an anti-semitic bigot, along with two others who have forced even FolkTruther to recognize them for what they are.

By drbhelthi, October 4 at 3:54 am #

For me, a review of the history of “Israel” poses the question, has the tribe ever been anything other than a “military garrison state”?

      X X X X X X X X X X X X X X X X X

drbhelthi,

Israel has been a “military garrison state” since its beginning in 1948. I doubt if it will ever be anything else. But as to “the tribe”, i.e. the Jewish people, it has rarely if ever had a state of its own before Israel. The whole history and culture of Jews for thousands of years, until Israel, has been that of a migratory people. All those millenia the Jewish people have never held state power. They have always been an internationalist people. In my opinion, militant Jewish nationalism or Zionism is a corruption of the essence of Jewish culture and history.

But as for you, ITW is completely right about you. You are a blatant anti-Semite. Go back to the David Duke blog where you belong. Guys like you and Hitler are the reason Jews think they need a Jewish state to protect them in the first place.

By drbhelthi, October 4 at 3:54 am #

For me, a review of the history of “Israel” poses the question, has the tribe ever been anything other than a “military garrison state”?

      X X X X X X X X X X X X X X X X X

drbhelthi,

Israel has been a “military garrison state” since its beginning in 1948. I doubt if it will ever be anything else. But as to “the tribe”, i.e. the Jewish people, it has rarely if ever had a state of its own before Israel. The whole history and culture of Jews for thousands of years, until Israel, has been that of a migratory people. All those millenia the Jewish people have never held state power. They have always been an internationalist people. In my opinion, militant Jewish nationalism or Zionism is a corruption of the essence of Jewish culture and history.

But as for you, ITW is completely right about you. You are a blatant anti-Semite. Go back to the David Duke blog where you belong. Guys like you and Hitler are the reason Jews think they need a Jewish state to protect them.

Fantastic piece, eloquently says everything that most rational informed people think. Israel is blind, and that, sadly will remain it’s fate until something, someone, can open its eyes.

Inherit The Wind, October 4 at 10:45 pm #

It’s painful to read the hate-filled aspersions cast by such virulent Jew-hating bigots as drbhelthi (what the hell does THAT mean) and Patrick Henry.

Not as painful as the fact that few stand up to these creatures.

Israel, Jews, zionists are three different entities.
Bigots hate accuracy and truth, as do zionists. Having too much wind in ones thinking patterns, and being a bigot for ones own religious grouping, prevents insight into the larger truth. “Jews” are so diversified in their beliefs, they are difficult to define. However, such accuracy is foreign to a religious bigot, with too much wind in ones thinking patterns, who spews venom with every written sentence, who doesnt understand ones own religious grouping.

Such minds and the regimes that they spawn need “enemies” in order to legitimate their very existences. Gobbles once noted that if Jews didn’t exist they would have to create them.

Though in picking your enemies it is better that they are far weaker then you when you exaggerate their influence. When you claim their strength is such that they cannot even live. A strong propaganda machine backed by a specifically narrow and doctrinaire education to continue to keep such synthetic myths alive is necessary. An artificial environment of one myth and half truth and some truths mixed together on a tier each level being re-enforced by the one below. Once the minds have been “educated” then when they go outside of the protected semantic environment they are immune to the outsides effects. Feel in fact as if it is an attack not only on their person but their entire way of seeing the world and living in it. A dangerous thing if they are trained to react to it in violence.

Hear it long enough and even if you don’t readily believe it you will start to incorporate it into your mind as the others have. Part of our evolution is in our relations to each other. The natural instinct is to conform to each other around us. We can override it but most do not even think about it. There are those who know this and move to use it to their advantage. It is working in many areas here.

It’s painful to read the hate-filled aspersions cast by such virulent Jew-hating bigots as drbhelthi (what the hell does THAT mean) and Patrick Henry.  These are people who believe that I, my family and my children are evil just for being born, that we are engaged in some vast conspiracy to destroy the world just for our own benefit.  If that’s true, why haven’t my fellow Jews clued me in to take my part?

Perhaps, using Occam’s Razor, we can determine that it is NOT Jews that are the problem, but, rather, the hate-filled, and evil perpetrators of the on-going myth of the “Evil Jew”.

For me, a review of the history of “Israel” poses the question, has the tribe ever been anything other than a “military garrison state”?

Applying the concept of the “behavior of matter” as a determing factor, one gains a better perception of “God” having more-or-less “trashed” “Israel” approx. two thousand years ago. “Gods chosen people,” perhaps, for a few thousand years, until a couple thousand years back.  Naturally, the self-elected, zionist leadership propagandize to the greatest extent possible in order to a-t-t-e-m-p-t to maintain their concept of being the “chosen of God.” 

Apparently, their propaganda works with some mushbrains such as US president Johnson and Robert McNamara who permitted the zionists to murder 34 and wound an additional 174 American Sailors in their illegal, 5-day war, 1967.
http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/ussliberty.html
The attempted “sacrifice” of Americans was an attempt to assist zionists to render the leadership of Egypt culpable. Thanks to the brave crew of the USS Liberty, they were unable to drag the US into their unholy war.

Since the leading candidates for the US presidency 2008 begged the israeli propaganda machine in DC for support, we must extend the concept of mushbrains beyond the two treasonists, Johnson, McNamara, their puppetry, and their genocidal activities.

Once again, we see that the perhaps neanderthal characteristic of “respect” for, perhaps fear of, taller, larger people is propagated. In the 1960s, American researchers statistically isolated one singular characteristic that separates people in leadership positions from others:  they are taller than average.  Just as five thousand years ago, israeli folk demanded of their prophet, “give us a king whom we can look up to,” the characteristic continues to be visible. Look at the leadership of the US and Germany.  How many are between one-half head and head-and-shoulders taller than average?  People puppetry.  One singular characteristic:  taller than average.

Inherit,

Unfortunately, since the Balfour agreement of 1917, Israel’s existence as a small country among Muslims has only been possible as a client of U.S./British imperialism. I agree with you that that the motives of U.S./British imperialism have nothing to do with Zionism, but it has used people motivated by the Zionist ideal for its own purposes. Because of this, I’m afraid those people would have been better off not emmigrating to Israel in the first place, and I think many Israelis are leaving Israel because it has become nothing but a military garrison state.

It continues to be interesting to me that “formal records” usually establish events, dates and locations. Whether accurate or not. More interesting to me are records provided by insiders and casual participants, which establish the internal reality of events, which certain “officials” do their best to prevent from becoming formal records, e.g., Mae Brussell, Ted Gunderson, Sibel Edmonds, http://www.bobfletcherinvestigations.com, Tatum Chronicals, et.al. Some “good little pimps” for the company still want the public to believe that Hitler died of a gunshot to the head, while altruistic insiders have revealed that he lived to the age of 104 in South America, and very comfortably.  My sources of information are not though-limited to NAZI/zionist propaganda promulgated by certain officials of the company. A huge thanks and a brotherly hug to the few who continue to be American Patriots. Hang in there, folks ! You are GREAT !

For them what is given by their immortal and all powerful and invisible god is forever even as Man becomes as dust in the wind. So your arguments though rational and human will fall on their def ears.

Now if they could look at each other as equals in the eye of their gods than as ones specially chosen and the others not, we might have a basis for communication and eventually an equitable peace for both.

It goes to the heart of their psychology and how it affects every decision they make. What to do? Take the nuclear weapons away for one would be a very good idea. You don’t give the power of the gods to weak and mortal men.

The knowledge of the millenniums is contained in the bible. As the old testament to the New Testament it has instructions for life. As the knowledge of mankind increased, the New testament took over for the old. However, other parts of the world have continued to hold fast to the heritage of their religions. How can you study the New testament and follow an old testament law? The world and the state of Israel need to open their eyes. The grace of God is every where around you. He’s in the Palestinian, the Syrian, the American, and even the Jew and everyone else. Enough of the hog wash of Gods chosen people. The mention of God has become a stepping stone for sin and sinful people. Just the world infidel is an act of war. Consider the battle of Jericho, people that the Jews didn’t even know were living in a walled city so much as ignoring the outside. The Jewish army goes up to their city and killed them all, except the one lady who left them in. They claim that God told them to do that and take over the city for the Jews to live in. O.K. America is mostly christen, they are not Zionist. They want to save the world in the name of the father the son and the holly ghost. In the process they let every religion in the world infest their country. What kind of religion is that? Not to smart I would say, or maybe lost track of their purpose. At any rate, when all the rest of the world has passed on and America is left with the Zionist, what will God tell them to do? Some where the world has lost track of the humble prayer and the ability to repent. The problem more than likely is with all of our religions. Each and everyone one of them may be the true sin of the world. I believe in God and creation, I don’t believe in your religion.

Drbhelthi it was the USA and there weren’t any Zionists there that I am aware of in 1945-1946 for Operation Paperclip and Op. Shadow where Nazis came to the USA to help us against Russia who was doing the same at the mad scramble at the end of the war.

The Federal Reserve came about from meetings by rich bankers on Jeckel Is. in 1910-1913 to have once again a Federal National Banking system. That and the re-implementation of the Federal Income Tax too. The last time for both were in the 19th century.

Zionism first came about in 1893 in Switzerland for Jews to have a home of Zion, in the ancestral lands. True in 1943(?) members of the Irgun and Stern Gang wanted to make a deal with Hitler to let them have Palestine and they would fight for Germany in the Middle East. The answer was “no” to them.

So where are you getting this mishmash of data? I am all for auditing the Fed and making it transparent or to dissolve it if need be. Read Wm. Grieder‘s article in the “Nation” on what we should do with the Fed.

Zionist-types have a few thousand years experience in debiting “God” with their thoughts and power-grabs. Similar expertise in genocide. Just take a look at what they have done, and are doing in their coalition with NAZIs, since “Operation Paper-Clip” at the end of WWII.  Who other than the “zionists” have ever attacked and in essence destroyed an American ship and crew, with the assistance of the US president, Johnson and presidential pimpery.  Just view the video, 
http://video.google.com/videosearch?client=safari&rls=en&q=U.S.+S.+Liberty&oe=UTF-8&um=1&ie=UTF-8&ei=pG3ESu29M8S04Qbk05hJ&sa=X&oi=video_result_group&ct=title&resnum=9#
  Their next “triumph” is the undoing of the strings that have held the USA together, to be visible after Christmas 2009.  Thanks to the NAZI/zionist coalition control of the “Federal Reserve.”  Palestine is for them, just “small potatoes.”  As a blood-soaked, oily empire giant once told a young, female lawyer who said she wanted to be US president, “- we can do that, but it will take some time.”  Whats the value of being elected to the US presidency if the US is a blob of glob being tossed around on world markets while its citizenry is being murdered and forced into NAZI-type stalags?  And just where is the money to come from to pay the several million hired assassins, if the US dollar has little value, and “US leadership” can no longer shuffle its internal debts?

At the rate we are going we could have the Peace of Un-buried Dead as the final epitaph.

Seektruth- While it is true that Jews tend to be fearful due to the holocaust, it is not fear that is driving the neozionists but POWER.  Much of the money is being contributed by Jewish billionaires like Addleson and Saban who are pulling institions like Aipac continually to the right.  And since Jews historically have gone into the truth and money industries, there is enormous power directed by a relatively few people on what in fact are sucicidal aims.

Inherit, the word you want is an ideologue, religions being a form of ideology.  In the 20th century the world ideology was marxism, which will be gnerealized in the 21st.  So you are right, I am an adherant of any ideology that doesn’t yet exist.

Gosh, Ourbus is a really sensitive dingbat, isn’t he.  I forget the point I was making but maybe I should have called him a loony instead.  In avoiding offending poeple, you can’t be too careful.

The Irish peace deal was sealed with a $100 billion peace dividend payable over ten years, the Israeli - Palestinian peace will be commenced with one; the proverbial cart before the horse. Removal of all the settlements alone will cost $80 billion, less if some settlements remain.

Placing 500,000 Palestinians into pre-fabricated homes ($50,000 each) $25 billion, assorted “regional” infrastructure inclusive of Palestine, Israel, Jordan, southern Syria & northern Egypt; ports, airports, highways, communication networks, schools, and hospitals to promote regional industry, commerce, education, health, etc. perhaps $300 billion more.

All in all, the Near East peace dividend, paid by a “coalition of the willing,” will cost less than the $2 trillion dropped on the Iraq War and generates future revenues far in excess of its cost.

Does this sound as implausible as the failed means and methods employed over the past 60 years? The Europe that waged bloody wars, ethnic, religious and gratuitously elected, for over 2500 years,is today represented by an economic union.

What is the difference between Haganah and Hezbollah, Hamas and the Irgun, the Stern Gang and Fatah? If three Israeli prime ministers were leaders of these previous terror groups,excuse me freedom fighters, can the Palestinans be denied the same opportunity to demonstrate their statesmanship as leaders of a new nation; and suffer the consequences if they cannot? The answer is no.

Put the money on the table and then talk peace.

rfidler, September 28 at 10:24 pm

Are you fifteen years old and caught in the angst of a testosterone overload? Where on earth in that response from the admin did it mention who flagged your post?

I certainly have flagged a post or two, usually due to content containing bigotry. Stupidity like the one you (proudly?) claim I generally leave as a sign of the worthlessness of the poster.

I do not recall flagging this one, perhaps another who values this forum did so? Perhaps I did and have forgotten, just as I now forget you….

Inherit The Wind, September 28 at 10:22 pm #
Only TWICE?

You’re a tenderfoot—you can’t say you’ve really been
into it with FT until he’s opened by calling you
names at least 10 times—ok, maybe five.
=============================================

LOL. You may be right. One reality that I do know is;
the anonymity of posting gives cowards brevity and
they exhibit behavior that is inappropriate in face
to face “discussions” (I use that term very loosely
here), thus making true discussions impossible. FT
will not get my attention again. He is welcome to his
own private hell.
I hadn’t intended to engage this thread at all; but
felt the post by Nosferatu shouldn’t go unanswered. I
was raised to never be silent around a bigot when
they spew their poison. Your comments have been
welcome.

rfidler, September 28 at 10:31 pm #

Sorry, I couldn’t possibly post that here; much too
public. I hope you understand.

Ouroborus:

“Sorry, but I’ve been spoiled posting on another site that doesn’t put up with name calling and a general lack of civility.”

What site would that be….. please.

Dear Folktruther:

Do you get the feeling you’re being marginalized? Maybe you need to rethink a few things.

ardee:

Let me refresh your memory. This from the Truthdig webmaster:

From: .(JavaScript must be enabled to view this email address)
Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 23:01:42 -0700
Subject: Truthdig comment policy

Hi rfidler—

It has come to our attention that you have posted comments that are not in keeping with our comment policy. Please review our policy (pasted below) and help us keep Truthdig’s comment community a respectful and enjoyable place to post for everyone. Thank you.

Per our comment policy, posted at http://www.truthdig.com/about/comment_policy/, Truthdig does not tolerate comments that consist of name-calling or personal attacks on our writers or readers. We’re all for challenging our writers’ and commenters’ ideas. As with comments on all topics, however, the level of discourse goes downhill fast once the challenges become personal and once users take advantage of the relative anonymity of the Internet to say things they’d never consider OK to say in any other setting. Please review our policy at http://www.truthdig.com/about/comment_policy/ and help keep Truthdig’s comment community a respectful and enjoyable place to post for everyone. Thank you.

Sincerely,
Truthdig Webmaster

The offending posts:

#  ardee: Get off this blog you worthless hypocrite.
Posted by rfidler,
Go to Pittsburgh, Young Man, and Defy Your Empire

# ardee: Pardon my French but what the fuck do you know about Pittsburgh? Blue collar? That’s so sixties. What do you mean by “that class of people” you pompous fucking snob? What do you mean by “requirements of protecting these folks, regardless of ones opinion about them” you pompous fucking elitist pig? If phrases like that came from someone regarding, say, Katrina victims, you’d be going fucking apoplectic, you worthless fucking hypocrite. I really, really, expected better from you.
Posted by rfidler,
Go to Pittsburgh, Young Man, and Defy Your Empire

Ring a bell?

As I’ve said before, you are one of only a handful of posters on this site whose opinions I (used to) think seriously about.

Only TWICE?

You’re a tenderfoot—you can’t say you’ve really been into it with FT until he’s opened by calling you names at least 10 times—ok, maybe five.

See, FT could NEVER see that Seektruth has actually asked some EXTREMELY valid questions, even though Sepharad (whom FT regularly trashes) also sees their validity.

Seektruth comes INCREDIBLY close to fully understanding the liberal Jewish mentality that both Seph and I have.  He’s almost there.

See, I DETEST the current Israeli government, and I DETEST the religious fanatics there, whom I think are destroying chances for peace, and with it, Israel.  Then again, I detest ALL religious fanatics, Jewish, Christian, Moslem, Hindu, whatever, because they all come round to the same conclusion: It’s OK and even MORAL to murder those who don’t follow your dogma.

Detesting a nation and demanding its eradication is generally insane.  Even after starting two world wars, Germany wasn’t eradicated and its people wiped out—and I’m glad for it.  Germany has learned a harsh lesson and battles far harder than we Americans to ensure it never happens again.

I don’t detest Zimbabwe—it’s Robert Mugabe and his government that are the problem.  I gather Zimbabwe is a beautiful nation filled with wonderful people—who are starving and dying of cholera because they have one sick one driving the bus.

I didn’t abandon America when we “elected” that immoral dimwit, George W. Bush, twice.

The task is to convince the majority of Israelis that they are being led, like lemmings, over the cliff, and that they need to stop it.  They need to realize that the Government of Netanyahu and his religious fanatical supporters, like the Bush neo-cons and co., are LYING to them about everything.

Contrary to popular opinion, I don’t believe that we are the dupes of Israel and that the neo-cons are their dogs, wagging their tails.

Just the opposite: I believe that the right-wing leadership of Israel is the drooling dogs and dupes of the neo-cons at places like the American Heritage Institute.  Just tonight, on Hardball, there was one of these chickenhawk dickheads expounding on why Israel should launch a “surgical” strike on Iran to kill Ahmedinejad and other leaders there.

Clearly this fanatical moron had learned NOTHING from history—or didn’t care, or actually WANTS WWIII to start (as long as he doesn’t have to put HIS cowardly ass on the line).  These demons actually are PUSHING Israel to attack as part of that grand Neo-Con plan that genned up the war in Iraq, predicting a simple victory that would lead to a stronghold in the ME and control of Iraqi oil.  How’s that working out, guys?

Yes, I care about Israel and its existence, as a Jew.  But I want that nation to be purged, not of Arabs and non-Jews, but of religious fanatics and jingoist pawns of the American neocon think tanks!

As a human being I WANT to see a Palestinian state—a nation, a democratic nation at peace with its neighbors.  I believe that once Palestine is established as a state, it will prosper.  But, like Israel, its own religious fanatics threaten that bright future and lure it to disaster.

Like two binary stars circling in on each other faster and closer leading to inevitable catastrophe, these two sets of religious fanatics are going to get a lot of very decent people killed.

Unlike that asshole on Chris Matthews, I really don’t want that to happen.

ardee, September 28 at 8:13 pm #
Ouroborus, September 28 at 12:19 pm #

I would offer that I believe something must have
happened to Folktruther, something rather bad I fear.
He has changed from a poster with whom one could
debate to one whom it seems best to ignore.
===================================================
Of course you are correct.

Inherit The Wind, September 28 at 4:46 pm #
Ouroborus:
In your current bout with Folktruther, you just lost
the battle.  Sorry, but that’s the truth.

You gotta be a LOT tougher if you want to go toe-to-
toe with FT and his particular brand of insanity and
inanity.

Besides, you gotta admire a guy who’s wrong so much
and so often yet who keeps on valiantly tilting at
his windmills.
=================================================

Sorry, but I’ve been spoiled posting on another site
that doesn’t put up with name calling and a general
lack of civility. This is the second time FT has
opened a comment to me by name calling. I’ve never
been one to suffer idiots; but you’re point is taken
and I’ll ignore FT if I continue on this site.

Ouroborus, September 28 at 12:19 pm #

I would offer that I believe something must have happened to Folktruther, something rather bad I fear. He has changed from a poster with whom one could debate to one whom it seems best to ignore.

The last effort of his is almost incoherent and irrational. It is also terribly , terribly wrong headed. One must stand and criticize the actions of a government when it commits genocidal actions. I reject the actions of Israel and the USA as such in fact.

But, just as I do not criticize the Protestant faith, and make no mistakes, those who rule this nation of ours are still chiefly members of that faith, for the actions of our nation, I also do not criticize the Hebrew faith for the actions of the Israelis.

rfidler, September 28 at 4:45 pm

I frankly havent a clue as to what you are babbling about….

seektruth, your comments are most encouraging and, like Jean Gerard’s, imply the possibility of a solution if everyone in Israel/Palestine simply starts behaving like rational human beings of conscience. I’ve long held that there are no innocent cultures involved in the endless conquest cycles that have created every country and every civilization on this earth at some time or other—and that the only hope is to persuade people to proceed as if they were shaping the world for their children and grandchildren (which of course is exactly what we all ARE doing). Salam Fayyad set a tone that has not been reciprocated from the Israeli PM’s party as far as I know, but should be, and perhaps will be, from the majority of people of Israel. (Tzipi Livni did, after all, receive more votes than Netanyahu.)

It may be that it will take a threat such as Ahmadinejad’s to show the Sunnis and the Jews of Israel that they have much to gain from a unified front on grounds that have nothing to do with morality (though it would be better if more than a common threat was the basis for any understanding).

Re American Jewish support for the existence of Israel, apart from the extreme religious-based bigots who certainly exist but are not even close to a majority of us, it is partly a longing for a home that is historically and culturally truly home, and also the notion that there is no assurance that things will always be as safe and happy for Jews as they are now in America. I subscribe to the latter two ideas. A few years ago in San Francisco I was standing in line at an Arab Film Festival and someone passing by noticed my Star of David and asked me if I weren’t afraid of anti-Semitism. I answered, “Not at an Arab film festival.” 

PS to Night Gaunt, radson’s use of Al Andalus instead of Sepharad is accurate. Sepharad is simply Hebrew for Al Andalus as well as for Tree of Life.

Merci Sepharad for your response and the honesty concerning your loved ones ,in times of sorrow it is difficult to express oneself ,especially to a stranger .I can only offer you strength and hope and
courage,take care and don’t lose your internal faith.

It’s the simple things in life that mean the most.

I hate to join a dog fight in progress, but the recent venomous string calls for some comments.

1. Support for Israel in the US is in part due to political money (some from Jews, some from fundamentalist Christians), but this is not the sole or even primary reason the US has pursued such blind support for Israel.  Racism is a key factor: Israelis look like us (they wear ties, they are white, they are educated, they manufacture software). And remember, this country too was founded on ethnic cleansing and the mythology of building a new nation in a “land without a people” (although there were tens of millions of native Americans here).  And don’t forget holocaust guilt—after looking the other way while 6 million Jews died, we eagerly supported their new “homeland”—the dark-skinned locals would just have to move out of the way to accomodate our guilt.  Finally, it did not help that most Arab states allied with the USSR during the Cold War.  This helped create the semi-myth that Israel is our only ally in the region and the only country we can rely on.

2. US Jewish support for Israel is a complex thing.  I am not Jewish (in fact, I am Arab-American) so I do not have a full understanding of it.  But it seems to me that the only explanation for why a community that is for the most part liberal, pro-civil and human rights, and anti-war, can so blindly support what has become a militaristic fascist pseudo-democracy is FEAR.  Many Jews genuinely believe that their lives and the lives of their children would be imperilled if Israel did not exist. Their support for Israel is—in their minds—a life and death issue.  They see any attacks on Israel—physical or verbal—as the beginning of a cascading assault on Jews that could very well end in another holocaust.  Is this insane?  Perhaps—but Jewish history certainly lends support to the argument. Even American Jews, who seem to have it made, are not 100% confident.  After all, the best places in the world to be a Jew in 1928 was Berlin and Vienna; ten years later, they were the worst places to be a Jew.  Things can change, so Israel is like a life-preserver.

3. Still, why can such cosmopolitan, open-minded, liberal people support such a despotic little bully of a state?  Because Israel to most Jews is not a nation-state but rather a myth—more specifically, it is the Jews’ new Golden Idol (of course, I am not speaking of all Jews—Chomsky, Naomi Klein, Avram Burg, and many others do not fit this desciption). You can critisize a state—but you cannot critisize an idol.  You worship idols.  If Moses were to come down from Sinai today and see the folks at AIPAC, the ADL, the JDL and other similar organizations, he would once again shatter his tablets and cry. Israel should replace the Star of David on its flag with a Golden Calf.

So money is only part of the game.  Anyway, the American establishment is still overwhelmingly WASP,and private wealth in America is still predominatly in the hands of WASPs.  And if they did not approve of our policies toward Israel, no amount of Jewish money would make a difference.

Until Israel and the USA are treated the same way as any other country or people we shall have these problems. No country has a right to exist. Now what do we do? Does everyone have the right to self defense? Must anyone who wants a country of their own take it by force? Is that the only way? No to that one, but it is rare indeed. Do the Palestinians and Iranians have the same right to defend themselves as Israel? How about Syria and Lebanon? With the USA controlling the UN it is whatever they want to do—-no sanctions against either of them or any other ally of the USA. That must end.

Childishly sniping at each other accomplishes nothing and shows a certain lack of depth of thought from my vantage point. As diplomats and rhetoricians, it is a failure. Please work your energies to uplift the conversation, not debase it into the gutter of name calling. To me every insult is a blank, no intelligence there.

Ouroborus:
In your current bout with Folktruther, you just lost the battle.  Sorry, but that’s the truth.

You gotta be a LOT tougher if you want to go toe-to-toe with FT and his particular brand of insanity and inanity.

See, FT is a religious fanatic.  Truly religious and truly fanatic.  Like all religious fanatics, he denies any fact or viewpoint that goes against his dogma and his scripture. It’s just that figuring out what that religion is can be tricky.  It’s Socialist, but not exactly socialism.  It’s Trotskyite, but not exactly Trotskyism. It’s Marxist, but not really marxism.

As many times as I’d like use ‘em as a punching bag (and have, rhetorically), I can’t HELP but like FT.

Besides, you gotta admire a guy who’s wrong so much and so often yet who keeps on valiantly tilting at his windmills.

By ardee, September 28 at 7:51 am #

“Not to beat a dead horse, or a closed mind, but..
...dolts and buffoons.”

Just got an email from the Truthdig webmaster warning me of their “decorum” policy. Seems you ratted on me to him following my post to you about the Pittsburgh G20 demonstrations. He says you took exception to my namecalling. Interesting (see above) coming from you.

What are you, a ten year old being picked on at the playground?- “He hurt my feelings! Make him STOP!”

As I said in my offending post to you- I expected better from you.

They only sane tactic for Senator Mitchell to take, is to condemn Israel for its unjust policies towards the Palestinians, and use American pressure to force them to cease.

Will he do this? Never.

Folktruther, September 28 at 11:35 am #

Well fucktruther; you have finally sealed our
relationship. Which is to say we don’t have one.
You’re constant name calling rather than using an
intelligence you obviously lack; shows you for the pompous buffoon you are. There is another thread here
by Chris Hedges which raises the point of our
failure to use the language honestly. You obviously
are deficient in your own native tongue and thus
resort to name calling rather than an honest
discourse. If you have a legitimate issue with me or
any other poster then use your intelligence; lacking
that, then shut the fuck up!

ourbus says

  “I’ve always considered the problem to be the
Israeli government’s policies and thereby, actions; not a Jewish problem or a problem with Jews.”

That’s because you are a dingbat, Ourbus, and Ardee is in denial.  Of course it is a Jewish problem, it is a problem of Jewish power.  Jewish fascists have seized the zionist nationalist ideology and installed a neo-zionism allied with neoconservatism and neo-liberalism of the American ruling class. A fourth of these billionaires are Jewish and most support neo-zionism.  to the grave historical detrement of the world Jewish community.

Israel is on a historical trajectory that will most likely destroy it in a few decades, ne-ozinists either too religously insane to understand it, or who want to go down in flames with the Samson option.  For historical reasons most of the Jewish community are too fearful to think straight and tend to support neozinist oppression.  their leaders are as crazy as loons, like the Bushites or the American right wing.

The worst aspect of neo-zionism is how it affects the US power system.  Neo-zionists are strong supporters of the endless War on Terrorism and helped put Obama in office.  Obama is a bookend to Bush, getting the Dems on board the War Terrorims express.  Obama’s support for the coup in Honduras and the military-police response in Pittsburgh indicate that he is simply continuing Bushite policies.  Possibly out of historical inertia.  Nero Wolf said inertia is the most powerful force on earth.

The point is that the Jewish community has to oppose the neozionism of Israel in order to oppose it in the US.  And this is not some pro forma lip service in favor of Peace or Peace Talks but attacking the neozinists and Israeli power with boycotts, etc.  Some Jews, Finklestein, Naomi Klein, Falk, etc are already doing so, but this must become a strong enough movment to affect the ideologically backward neo-dingbats.  With my customary tact I mention no names.

ardee, September 28 at 7:51 am #

I’ve been fighting this fight since I was in the
second grade, when my black friend Albert was slapped
across the face by our white teacher (Mrs. Browning)
for speaking up; that makes for well over 55 years
and I’m always glad to have a fellow soldier (so to
speak) for company. My parents were far ahead of
their time. You hang in there and not to beat another
dead horse; there are none so blind as those who
won’t see. An old house painter once told me (long
time ago) regarding politics; “don’t let the bastards
get you down”. 

Ouroborus, September 28 at 6:39 am

Not to beat a dead horse, or a closed mind, but…...

Those “liberals and leftists” who condemn wholeheartedly the bigotry of the right concerning the 1.4 billion followers of Islam find no problem in expressing their own form of bigotry concerning “world wide Jewry”....dolts and buffoons.

Wrong is wrong, ideology aside. You and I must fight the good fight for justice and truth I think.

ardee, September 28 at 6:11 am #

I understand. I can’t do anything to change anybody’s
mind, but I can attempt clarity for those thinking
individuals who, like yourself, know what I’m talking
about. My comment was in response (as I’m sure you
know) to the post below mine. It is very important to
differentiate between governments and people;
governments often going rogue and not representing it’s
citizens. Hang in there.

Ouroborus, September 28 at 4:36 am #

I have been hammering, and getting hammered in return, for advancing this very same theme. Far too many use the expansionist designs of the Govt of Israel and the support of those designs by American Jews who support Israel as a way to express their already established anti-Semitism.

Even though I haven’t commented on this thread very
much; I’ve always considered the problem to be the
Israeli government’s policies and thereby, actions; not
a Jewish problem or a problem with Jews. I would hate
to see this thread devolve into something else.

I can’t help but wonder that for Israelis if push ever came down to shove who would win - the will of God that Jews occupy the Holy Land, or the threat of US across-the-board defunding if they carry it out.

Jews fear lack of money more than they fear God….

radson, to say I’m not enthralled with the direction the Likudniks are pushing is a wild understatement. I hate Likud policy the way you would hate someone trying to destroy the life of one of your loved ones, and I do love Israel, including all of her citizens, not just Jews. I’m not doing any of my usual peace-pushing things via Peace Now or Meretz, or for that matter not even reading or commenting on TD. Still grieving for my daughter and now cancer-related reprise in our youngest son. My husband and friends and horses are keeping me sane, as is the knowledge that every day people are losing their children in war and disease and I’m not the only one suffering, but I’m not even close to being sharp enough to engage politics seriously. Don’t even read papers. Most political thing I’m up to is rereading all of Amos Oz, fiction and nonfiction, most recently “The Land of Israel” and “Where the Jackal Howls”. Riding horses with my husband in the backwoods and love are the only things that make me want to keep taking one breath after another.

People like PM Netenyahu do use a religious mandate to take Palestinian lands and reclaim it as theirs given to them in perpetuity by JHVH when they slaughtered the Caananites way back when.

Actually the battle for N. Ireland was as much about territory as different versions of Christianity. The Irish are still on the British flag by-the-way.

“Al-Andalus” what the Islamic Moors called that part of Spain they inhabited for over 400 years till they were kicked out in 1491.

I said that the Zionists of Israel (different from the Zionist Christians here) want a one state solution, only Semitic Jews to live there as regular citizens. All others would become resident aliens. Rather like Kuwait is right now. (Anyone born after 1920 can never be a citizen.)

The Christian Zionists want all Judaism to cease and to convert all the Jews to their version of Messianic Judaism. Kill off the religion, not the people. The Dominionists here want a war but no “rapture” just a cleansing action to evangelize the earth populace by the gun and marketing or even starving to prepare the earth for the return of their Lord and Master. He won’t come before that is done by their reckoning.

I can’t help but wonder that for Israelis if push ever came down to shove who would win - the will of God that Jews occupy the Holy Land, or the threat of US across-the-board defunding if they carry it out.

To Al Andulus

How have you been lately ,are you still out in the woods enjoying your equestrian sport in the backwoods of California.I get the impression by your last post to Seektruth that your not to enthralled with the
current direction that the Likud Party is heading in and also that with the present leadership ,peace is vanishing from the horizon.What amazes me the most is the almost total lack of cognizance by the
majority of citizens concerning the gravity of the situation,perhaps nonchalance combined with the MSM are the contributing factors.Commenter’s have suggested many different approaches to pressure
the Israeli Govt to reevaluate their stance ,and certain international organizations have thrown sticks into the Likuds wheels so to speak ,but unfortunately to little avail.There is an option that is available
to the American people and that is ,reforming the Congress,but that may prove to be rather lenghty and time is of essense at the moment.

Cheers

To ITW

Thanks for your response,there definately is no doubt
with regards to your stance concerning PM Netanyahu.The more the current situation evolves the more difficult it will become for Bibi to justifie the Likud parties position/proposals.

Folktruther, September 27 at 3:06 am #

In never said, Inherit, that you defended natanyahu or that he wanted a one state solution.  But I seem to remember somebody said it.
*********************************************

FT, I’m not sure Netanyahu actually EXPLICITLY stated he wanted a one-state solution, but I’d bet real money he did so in private.

Nor have I ever advocated a one-state solution.

I actually think Obama made a mistake in NYC. The ONE pre-condition he should insist on is that Israel stop all squatter settlement building instantly, and that ALL building must stop except maintenance repairs—and increase the pressure on Israel day by day—every day or week another turn.

Meanwhile, he should tell Abbas that HIS preconditions won’t fly either.

It’s crap like this that causes me to hate the Israeli right and religious fanatics.

In never said, Inherit, that you defended natanyahu or that he wanted a one state solution.  But I seem to remember somebody said it.

seektruth—your very sensible post expresses reality and solutiion. But I am afraid even this is beyond the ken of Israel’s current PM. Wrong man at the wrong time.

TAO Walker, September 26 at 3:48 pm #
“...but no one is required to do this.”
=======================================

I think they forgot that; if indeed, they ever knew it.

radson, September 26 at 3:06 pm #

Cheers
**************************************************

Sorry, radson, but I can’t help your memory lapses. (nor FT’s). I’ve ALWAYS detested Netanyahu, always referred to him as “Whatayahoo”, always said he would be disastrous for both the Israelis and the Palestinians. And bad for America. I have never changed in my opinion that Netanyahu is a dangerous, nasty, religious fanatic putz.  I’ve been adamant about that since his FIRST stint as PM many years ago.

I have never defended Bibi, never apologized for him, never made excuses for him.  He’s trouble and he always has been. He’s making it worse for Israel now, as he always does.

I even agree with FT that Netanyahu REALLY wants a one-state solution, and that he’s a fascist.  These are not new opinions for me, despite FT’s attempts to paint them that way.

Netanyahu as PM is about as bad as Sarah Palin becoming President.  Both are dangerous, vindictive, ignorant religious fanatics.

With Iran declaring another uranium processing plant has effectively put the Palestinian issue on the back burner.  Suddenly a Palestinian problem is now an Iranian problem.  The Sunni ME fears Iran more than it does Israel and the Palestinian issue.

The United States should be giving NO aide to a wealthy, wealthy country like Israel.  Let Israel pay for what it wants.  This tremendous largess to the small Israeli population translates to an outrageous sum per Israeli.  Think of all the very poor people on this earth.  And think of the huge debt that Americans owe that can never be repaid.

It’s crazy to give Israel another penny.

One thing the Palestinians can do to prevail is do nothing. The West (of which Israel is part) is in a systems crisis, and though the West may survive it (somehow or other), Israel is not likely to, because a collapse of the system runs parallel to the financial and economic collapse now in progress. How this will play out in the near term is hard to tell. An Israeli attack on Iran means mining or activating an already mined Strait of Hormuz, a quadrupling of oil prices, and a near instant collapse of the economies the world over. In the long run more Jewish girls will marry Arabs, than Arab girls will marry Jews. The future is too horrible to contemplate no matter from which angle we look at it.

theamericanpeople, having boarded this runaway ‘train’ quite recently compared to both their zionist clients and the Arab Semitic brethren of those same Israelites, seem CONgenitally unable to grasp either the mass or the momentum carrying this blood feud to its inexorable mutually suicidal CONclusion.  This is ‘The Wind’ sewn 4,000 years go delivering-up its swastikian ‘harvest’ here in these latter days. 

That the entire ‘western’ world has foolishly taken a hand in the ‘game,’ and so let itself in for a full share of the CONsequences, certainly explains the desperation with which some in these parts now try to divert the ‘process’ onto some ‘track’ they might be able to go on living with.  What they fail utterly to realize, though, is that the ‘gods’ in whose service it is all taking place are the same ones to whom the Aztecs offered their much less prettily-disguised mass-immolations….the same ones adored by the euro-derived armed occupiers of Turtle Island

These gods demand blood in ever-increasing but never-satisfying quantity.  Americans worship at their altars along with all the other “civilized” peoples.  The days when most of their ‘quota’ could be forcibly supplied by “lesser breeds” are gone.  The long-postponed reckoning is at-hand. 

So is there any viable alter-Native?  There is One.  As suggested by some here, it requires a kind of apostacy….a turning-away from the “global” nightmare that is (and has always been) theamericandream….“individual”-ism, in a word.

Stop feeding these insatiable “entities.”  Nourish, instead, our Mother Earth and all Her Children our Relatives.  Starve your own make-believe ‘selfs,’ and take care of one another.  This is The Tiyoshpaye Way, the Way for Human Beings to fulfill their part in the neverending Song ‘n’ Dance of Life Herownself.

Those among our domesticated Sisters and Brothers too deeply enmeshed in the CONtraption of hatred and ambition and death-worship may have to just go through with it to it’s bitter end, before we can reclaim them as our own….but no one is required to do this.  Just put your precious attention on “....the things that remain.”

HokaHey!

To ITW

I don’t recall the last time that you used such undiplomatic language with reference to the Israeli leader,but it definitely has it’s merits.After having listened to Bibi’s speech encouraging the world to adopt
the Israeli point of view with regards to Iran and the Natural Growth phenomenon ,the thought of a peaceful resolution seems very distant indeed.The more the impasse lasts the more of a foreboding feeling
emanates from the Israeli leadership ,which is very far from being reasonable.If cooler heads don’t prevail the situation in the Middle East will degenerate into a disaster which in this case will implicate most
of the world -is that not what Bibi wants-.A two state solution has become but a dream ,a one state solution is what the Israeli leadership is striving for ,an agreement with Iran is still possible but a reasonable
agreement with the Palestinians is highly unlikely -you can’t have both -Bibi is dictating to President Obama.

Cheers

There is another option that Pfaff does not mention.  That is for the Palestinians to declare their independence, with the 1967 borders as their state, and for the US and other members of the UN Sec. Council to accept and recognize this independence.  The US and Palestine would exchange ambassadors, and the UN—with the US leading the way—would call on Israel to end its occupation of another member state.  Issues such as land swaps and the division of Jerusalem could then be negotiated, but they would be negotiated between two sovereign states, and the world—including the US—would have acknowledged the Palestinians’ rights to the 1967 borders.

There are a number of steps the US and the West could take if Israel refused—as it probably would—to go along.  Ambassadors could be withdrawn for “consultations;” trade and investment agreements could be suspended; landing rights for El Al could be suspended; etc. 

It would help if the Palestinians would offer a vision of what things will look like once they have full sovereignty over their land: for example, an Israel-Palestine-Jordan Free Trade Agreement; perhaps a common currency; an agreement over sharing water resources and developing joint renewable energy projects. And of course, as per the Saudis existing proposal, all Arab states would open relations with Israel.

For any of this to happen, it will require Obama taking a massive political risk at home; Israel to oust its current fascist leadership and replace it with a true visionary; and for the Palestinians to get all of their political perspectives (including Hamas and Islamic Jihad) on board. The beauty, however, is that if the first requirement (Obama’s leadership) takes place, the other two very well could fall into place.

heavyrunner, September 26 at 6:42 am #

YHWH, a fearsome god indeed. But I fear Israel more;
they use their U.S. supplied weapons illegally. There
used to be a hue and cry about this; lately there is
nary a peep. All of the heavy weapon’s are sold to them
with the express condition they cannot be used against
civilians. If there is karma; to be an Israeli who
supports the government, would indeed be a scary thing
to be.

The United States should stop funding Israel and stop supplying military supplies if they continue to operate as a religious state.  There is no god, and if there were, it would not resemble the warmonger Ntanyahoo references.

American religeous nutters control and supply the Likud Party and USAF Base Israel.
Total destruction is the only solution. How else can we"Rapture”?
Save the IDF!
Remember Deir Yassin.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deir_Yassin_massacre
Please send Cpl. Shallit some pasta noodles as “Luxury Foods” arnt allowed in Gaza.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabra_and_Shatila_massacre
Just send it to
CPL. GALID SHALIT
c/o
“The Terrorists
West Bank
Ramala
Palestine (kind of)
Middle East.
Maybe send toilet paper too as there sewers have been bombed and kaput for 4 years.
maybe some water too.
Maybe cut back on the 3.3 billion per year in military donations.
Article 242 1967, says its ILLEGAL TO TAKE LAND BY FORCE!
Settlements are THEFT.
Lies are lies.
Deceit , murder, treachery,cant be covered by the same.
There are more eyes and truth, justice and the american way, like fairness , honesty, and justice has to be learned again in America.

You reap what you sow.

Re ardee, September 25 at 9:58 pm #

“A good start would be the ending of our foreign aide to this war mongering and imperialistic nation”

      x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x

Israel got their warmongering and imperialism from the master - US.

pfaff is saying that Obama must decide to actuallyow enforce a two state solution on Israel, possisbly at the price of losing the election, or continue the inspiring but empty bullshit and allow an apartheid Israel to continue ethnic cleaning.  the latter means not only endless war for Israel, but an endless low intensity war for the US in the middle east.

In the choice of the latter case, Israel will be destroyed, probably within a few decades.  and the US will lose power by backing Israel, both among the billion and i half Muslims and in Western Europe, as well as around the world.

No one knows what Obama will do but based on what he has done before, most people would place their bets on the inspiring bullshit.  It has become obvious that Obama is not capabale of vigorous lieadership, and simply is the public relations face of plutocracy.  He is continuing Bushite policies largely out of inertia.

It is good to see that Inherit and Ardee are beginning to understand that the interests of the neozionist leadership of Israel is against the interests of the world Jewish community.  But it is the neozionist billionaires like Sabin and Addleson that dertermine US policy.  They fund Aipac, etc and the electoral machine that helped elect Obama.  and can help defeat him.  the only real threat of opposition to Isreal neozionism was Carter and Bush 1, and both lost the next election.

A progressive approach to the Isrrali problem would require courage and principles, and it is incrreasingly obvious that Obama doesn’t have any.  The ISraeli future does not look good.

Many compare the Northern Ireland “Troubles” to the Palestinian “Catastrophe” and there are similarities and differences.  The major difference is that in northern Ireland neither party could see a clear way to victory thus a stalemate and eventual road to an agreement.  Not so in the ME, neither party is fully defeated.  The Palestinians believe a protracted resistance will lead to a victory of sorts especially if a pro-Arab US president is in office——maybe it is BHO.  The Israeli economy rest much upon its military machine and is in no particular rush to reach an agreement or even start talks and that includes Syria. The sticking point is Iran——how that plays out should be very interesting both for Israel and the Sunni part of the ME. The West Bank settlements are a red herring——an easy and convenient excuse for both sides to avoid meaningful talks.

The Palestinian people have no power to contribute to a solution. That is the reality of this situation. The solution lies entirely in the hands of the Israeli govt and its people.

As they have shown no inclination to the moral solution , nor have they seen the error of continuing the settlements, they must be coerced from without. A good start would be the ending of our foreign aide to this war mongering and imperialistic nation, and , conjointly, the giving of those funds to the Palestinian people to rebuild Gaza and help with humanitarian aid.

Correct me if I’m wrong: 

The last US president to take a stand against Israel was George H.W. Bush. He threatened, just threatened, to withhold US loan guarantees.  Things didn’t work out so well for him in the next election.

But the peace process did make some progress right up to the point when the guy leading it, Yitzhak Shamir, was assassinated.

Easier said than done.  But I’m all for peace in the Middle East.

Pfaff usually writes insipid articles when it comes to Israel, but this one is unusually cogent and accurate.
The way I look at it is, Benyamin Stillayahoo is to Israel what Slobodan Milosovic was to Serbia.  He himself is garbage and leads his people to stupid shit but do you condemn all Serbia for that?

Yahoo’s position at the UN this week was atrocious and I think the war crimes trials should go forward.  Hopefully, if Israel comes to its senses and elects sane leaders, Abbas will be able to back of the ‘67 borders as a pre-condition even to talk.

The radicals and Yahoo make it harder every day to hold my head up as a Jew.