I was working in the Gary Steel works when this was going on. JFK had started community reclamation projects, fulfilling his promise to West Virginia. Area Redevelopment Act.  President Johnson,  put in place a program for the victims of management goof-ups . This is history .  People came first.
—————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————————
Sabagio Mauraeno on my way to see my shrink, asking the question am I the only one whose is crazy enough to believe there’s a better way? ============================================================================
STUDEBAKER’S CHAMPION REFLECTS ON PAST
By JAMES WENSITS
SOUTH BEND—2004 John Brademas, who served 11 terms in Congress from 1958 to 1980, was invited to speak at Notre Dame as part of Friday’s premiere of “Avanti: A Postindustrial Ghost Story,”  about the demise of Studebaker. The former congressman, now president emeritus at New York University, recalls that 41 years ago, in August 1963, he and then U.S. Sen. Birch Bayh, D-Ind., went to the White House to express their concern about the dire situation facing the Studebaker Corp. to then President John F. Kennedy and ask for his help. In those days before Congress voted bailouts for major corporations such as Penn Central, Chrysler and Lockheed, the president told the Hoosier lawmakers that there was nothing he could do. A few months later,  JFK was dead, killed by an assassin. In December 1963, Studebaker announced it was closing, and 6,000 workers lost their jobs. Again, Brademas, Bayh and Indiana’s other U.S. Senator, Vance Hartke, went to the White House, for an audience president, Lyndon B. Johnson. Johnson responded magnificently by promising, on Christmas Eve 1963, to help in several ways. For starters, and even before the actual shutdown took place, the president formed an interdepartmental committee to make sure that government resources were used as effectively as possible to deal with problems resulting from the termination of production. Secretary of Labor Willard Wirtz subsequently was directed to establish in South Bend the maximum number of training projects allowable under the new Manpower Development and Training Act. On Dec. 28, 1963, a manpower training initiative to retrain a thousand jobless workers was announced. Nearly 4,000 Studebaker workers were given in-depth interviews and 2,500 were sent to manpower training classes. Twenty-one projects, including basic education courses, were approved for ex-Studebaker workers, some of whom were functionally illiterate. Some of the workers had never applied for another job. Some needed basic education to help with language problems. By 1964, a third of all enrollees in manpower training programs in the state of Indiana were taking classes in South Bend. “It is important to note,” Brademas said, that of 5,700 displaced workers, only 536 of them were younger than 40. Beyond the loss of jobs was the loss of pensions. 4,000 Studebaker workers had to settle for an average payment of about $600, 15 percent of what they were entitled to, while 2,900 others received nothing at all. What happened at Studebaker eventually influenced passage of the Employment Retirement Income Security Act   Johnson also played a role in providing new jobs for South Bend workers , helping to engineer the awarding of an $87 million Army truck contract to Kaiser-Jeep Corp., which agreed to perform the work at the Chippewa Avenue plant it had recently acquired from Studebaker. Kaiser-Jeep was later purchased by American Motors, which formed a subsidiary, AM General, to continue the manufacture of military vehicles here.  The legacy of that effort to maintain manufacturing jobs in South Bend is that AM General, which manufactures Humvee military vehicles as well as its popular sibling, the Hummer H2, is still providing jobs and still contributing to the local economy.

By jackpine savage, December 15 at 8:02 pm #

“The only reason that labor costs are not competitive between transplant workers and US company workers is that the figures always include retiree costs.”

It’s not the “only reason”, but it’s an important one.  Non-union workers don’t receive the excessive legacy benefits that union workers do;  one more reason they’re more competitive.

“And those plants have only been built (as a means to outsource labor) because the states in question have given the companies hundreds of millions of dollars to build (and free land in many cases).  How’s that “free market”?”

By “outsource”, you really mean “insource” - which i assume you support since it means more good jobs for american workers.  State tax incentives are common when wooing industries into long term commitments which bring future tax revenues, jobs, development, and economic prosperity - nothing “un-free market” about that; i’m for tax breaks whenever possible since we’re overtaxed as it is.

I was just speed reading the other comments and noticed the Humvee guy said it was made by general dynamics.  Humvee was designed and built by AMC that is American Motors Corporation—their military contracting subdivision which now I think is a corp on it’s own AM General.

Don’t get me wrong, I think we should probably help the auto manufacturers weather Bush’s financial disaster.  Bush stole 700 billion “for the banks” with his cohorts in the Democratic party.  He should be cut off from the remaining 350 billion and that should remain for President Obama. 

What if we took 50 billion and gave it to all the Americans interested in making electric vehicles, that can be plugged into any outlet, which must be made entirely in the USA.  That would be a great thing. 

Bush is supposed to appoint a “Car Czar”.  “Oh Yippee a Car czar!” exclaims Nancy Pelosy, “this will protect the American people so it won’t be just exactly like my 700 billion to the banks I just BSed the American people about.”  What Pelosi failed to mention is that George W Bush commenced a massive effort in cahoots with his criminal friends in big oil to destroy the electric car and push the big auto makers to make super polluting super ineffecient gas guzzling suvs at taxpayer expense by giving purchasers 100,000 dollar tax credits on each sale of a super sized suv.  See “who killed the electric car.” available for free on the internet.  Bush ran an operation that got Detroit to give up the electric car and even have them all crushed even though they were great cars.  GM failed to use newer battery technology which would have a car go up to hundreds of miles per hour and drive distances over 250 mile ranges between charges.  They now even have rapid charging tech.  But even at the 80 mile rage of the GM cars 90 pus percent of Americans could live just fine on them.  This would remove 90 plus percent of all the gasoline powered cars from the road and if everything largely plugged in their cars for charging overnight it would mean REMOVING nearly all the energy the cars would have used from our national energy requirements.  We would become a NET EXPORTED OF OIL WITHIN A COUPLE YEARS TIME WITH A CONCERTED EFFORT!!!  We would minimize the use of fissile fuels also and and set the stage for their elimination.

WE DON’T NEED THE BIG 3(OR IS IT 2?) actually we should have a hundred or a thousand different brands of auto all competing to produce the best product. 

The reason we come down to just a few companies largely is the legalized bribing of politicians we have in this country.

I say we help Detroit. They could become the top 2 US electric car makers with a huge presence.  Make it a felony for big oil to get in the way of the process or for any US law to have such effect state local or national.

Electric cars are the best way to go for now.  I do believe that electric engine cars running on hydrogen fuel cells will be great when that tech is perfected in years to come but standard lithium ion and other battery powered cars will make our economy grow massively in a very short period of time.  With all the money we waste on importing cars and importing foreign oil all going into the US economy PLUS the enormous bonus of having coast to coast crystal clean air.

driving bear,

Wrong, AMC never made the Hummer.  The Humvee for the military is made by General Dynamics, which sold the rights to make civilian Hummers to GM.  But the only thing that the two vehicles share is a name plate.

Marshall,

The only reason that labor costs are not competitive between transplant workers and US company workers is that the figures always include retiree costs.  Toyota only has 700 retirees total in the US.  And those plants have only been built (as a means to outsource labor) because the states in question have given the companies hundreds of millions of dollars to build (and free land in many cases).  How’s that “free market”?

The $70/hr. figure should be compared to wages for domestic, non-union auto workers; not wages of foreign auto workers as the author does.  Yes it includes benefits, but it’s far too high to be competitive.

The author attributes domestic automaker misfortune solely to the credit crunch, ignoring the the long term decline and more recent high gas prices altogether.  But even so, this article nicely illustrates the bailout slippery slope effect we’ve been warned about; if autos, then why not other industries?

The conditions of falling global auto sales were not “out of the auto company’s control” - they were inevitable, and obviously haven’t sunk foreign manufacturers who continue to build plants in the U.S..

While I agree that public opinion may shift quickly if U.S. automakers go bust, the fact remains that our auto industry is uncompetative, unresponsive, non-innovative, and has been for years.  Bush is wrong on this and we should take our lumps now and allow the free market to cull the heard rather than throw good money after bad and extend the recession even further.

most people here are old enough to remember another car company that went belly up : the old AMC.

true the pacer and gremlin are no longer with us but some of their other offerings are. You may not remember it but at the time AMC also had the JEEP and Hummer brand.

As you know the Jeep brand was acquired by Dodge and the Hummer by GM and the brands are still on the road.

So even if ford GM and Dodge go under this does not mean we will all be driving imports.

By truedigger3, December 14 at 8:05 am

Your re-comment to mine does not leave me with much encouragement for the financial future of this country. While I feel the executives will take advantage of money from a bailout, the start of a bailout is beginning of a most probable unending flow of corporate welfare. There have been big companies go belly up and go the way of the dinosaurs which in a true capitalist economy is as it should be. And while there could be dire consequences for the workers, well, they will join me on the unemployment line. I would be willing to put the rest of the bailout money on the idea of creating and supporting local economies instead of relying on the ‘good graces’ of corporations for doing the buisness of our country. But that interferes with the whole concept of grand larceny that has been going on in this country for the past 3 or 4 decades when reagan decided that milton friedman’s scientific economic plans were to be shoved down every body’s throat.
If you care to see the effects from that, I suggest you research all the South American countries, Indonesia, Eastern European countries, Russia, Africa, India, China to see what affects they have all incurred and what their positions on friedman’s frauduant economics are now. And go back to the 17th century for Britain’s part in this. I hate it that any industry goes under and of course the workers suffer first and the most but right now I don’t see how saving the american auto industry will help as this industry has been very derelect in its treatment of the american market and those executives and marketers are the cause of their current plight.
Just like a bank, working for just about any auto maker, especially american, is not stable work and supporting something existing on a financial lifeline from the over extended government will not help. Matter of fact, if not the rest of the bailout money, at least the $14,000,000,000.00 or $15,000,000,000.00 being kicked around should be used to pay the workers until they pick up employment elsewhere because as I said, if paulson gives the money to them, the executives are first come first serve and the rest is trickle down.
And before I go, just what are your ideas on the current political, economic, religious and environmental system’s ability to provide for the 6.7 billion people on this planet, I mean do you think there are enough natural resources to allow everyone a comfortable life style to the end of time?

Question to all you experts out there..if, say the 3 automakers do go chapter 11 or 13, wouldn’t the bankruptcy judges have a lot to say about how said companies would be restructured or organized, and who would be responsible for doing so? In personal bankruptcies I’ve known, brokered deals do not throw the babies out with the bathwater, and fiscal redemption is encouraged and supported.  How does all that work for big corps, and how would jobs be saved, better yet, brought home from foreign lands and their poorer product quality controls.  Would not current family/worker incomes be maintained?  Could the unions be assigned voting powers via significant voting blocks of preferred stock , so that they would/could be in on the reorganization planning decisions. At the very least they could be in a position to pick a new management team to their liking. Or better yet why not let the unions buy out GM and Chrysler? At bargain basement prices of course.  It was done successfully when USX, et. al., sold off its subsidiaries to employees with vision and talent. The Unions could get big low-interest loans from the $700 billion bailed out bankers who have yet to loosen the purse strings on taxpayer dollars they were supposed to use to reinvigorate the economy.  Companies that were reconstituted in such ways after Viet Nam and before Bush the 1st are still around . Could not the UAW membership be given the same opportunities to borrow and invest, or would it be considered too socialistic? Reganites didn’t complain when such transactions took place in the 80’s.  Just a thought.  Never mind.

Sabagio Mauraeno, biting nails and drinking much at the Falcons Sunday game thriller.

To samosamo,

Bailing out the auto companies is not bailing out the
executives, but it is bailing out the workers and their union who has done nothing wrong.
Those executive are taking advantage of the current
economic crisis to declare bankraptcy and in the reorganisation process which will be oredered by
the court, the union will be busted and all current
contracts with the workers and retirees will be void
and null. After that the workers will not be unionised or with a very weak union and will accept any wages and benefits offered by the management which more likely will stay the same with minor changes.
So, you see, the auto executives want bankruptcy,
they will emerge winners.
The current bail-out hearings are nothing but a charade and theatrics.
Is that make sense that they gave the banks and brokerage companies more than a trillion dollar
and they are not willing to bail-out the auto companies with just 15 billions dollars.!!!??

Since this country has not bottomed out in the current financial fiasco, I would feel really pissed if the american auto industry is bailed out and by spring time everything is gone and I lose because a bunch of auto executives were rewarded for their failed businesses. Which brings to mind that anymore bailout money should go to the taxpayers. Damn the corporations as that is just what they think of us, the people. They are too big or important to fail but the taxpayers are expendable. Local economies may be the saving grace for the US because the corporations have sure failed us and betrayed us.

The same people who had no trouble handing over billions of taxpayers dollars to the overpaid morons who ran AIG and other companies (some of whom were paid $200 million or more EVERY SINGLE YEAR) now think they see a way to smash the carworkers union. Not content with giving billions more taxpayer dollars to foreign car companies to come into America and push America’s car manufacturing industry to the wall they now want to see workers in GM and Chrysler stripped of pay and conditions that generations of car workers fought for. The foreign car companies received these taxpayer dollars as a gift - they never have to pay it back. The Republicans are still on a freemarket bender, even as the consequences of their corrupt and amoral policies plunge the global economy into another great crash like the one of 1929. It was also created by greed and speculation on debt. Roosevelt fixed it but the Republicans and their corporate buddies weren’t going to take that lying down and over time they undid most of what Roosevelt put in place to protect against another crash. How can they justify giving away workers’ hardearned tax money (some of it paid by the carworkers of course)to foreign corporations and then use the crisis their policies created to screw the workers over one more time? Because they’re bastards with no conscience whatsoever, that’s how.The same people who denied climate change and the need to change the kind of cars we make for decades now castigate the carworkers for making the wrong cars! The people who’ve taken bribes from the oil companies for years now pull on a mask in shades of green to denounce social justice as a crime. The have all the class of a toilet brush and the compassion of a guard at Guantanamo.

Like Katrina was able to eliminated the housing projects in New Orleans for the ruling elite, the massive economic downturn for the auto industry will help the Republicans break the UAW.

The last vehicle I bought was a 1977 GMC Suburban. Best thing I ever bought. I junked it in 2005, now I don’t drive. I WILL NOT buy another vehicle with a piston engine. It is an absurdly backward criminally inefficient technology. Still, no matter the technology, the energy has to come from somewhere to move all these cars around. Three big reasons ALL car makers are in trouble.
1. Technology; Innovation being ignored.
2. Energy; Too many cars.
3. Money; Economic crisis.
There is no ‘saving’ the auto industry. It is already dead and rotting.

What is interesting is that while Toyota doesn’t have unions it does have extremely satisfied employees.  Unions are needed when there is an exploitive relationship between worker and owners.  At Toyota, they really work to create a team feeling where everyone feels valued - something that money doesn’t buy. This isn’t feel-good management hand waving either.  Line worker’s opinions are actively sought out and encouraged.  Detroit’s culture and top down style hasn’t worked for decades. Unfortunately, changing a company’s culture takes years - even with a full commitment from management. Detroit has missed the boat I’m afraid and no amount of money will save it.

? Is the auto bailout argument “save the big 3, and we save jobs, not only auto workers jobs(at reduced levels of pay, of course) but the jobs of all those Americans who make their livings supplying the auto industries with goods and services which all go into the assembly of the final products?  Compared to the foreign suppliers to american car manufacturers, how many american suppliers are left that have jobs to be saved in any great numbers that would benefit from this argument?  Not that many I fear.  Is it any wonder that the polls of the general public reflect ambivalence toward saving this “all-american industry?” It was “outsourced” so long ago that these days the only emotional connection Americans have to american cars is watching the motorized junk at NASCAR races. Tis really all about nostalgia this days, and a hankering for the rust bucket gas hogs of yester-year. Even David Brooks, conservation writer for the NYT says he wouldn’t but an American Car.  As for Senator Coker, he’s from Chattanooga, Tennessee and he brokered the deal for Volkswagen to set up shop in a nearby industrial park that had previously been operated by a defense contractor who manufactured munitions for the Viet Nam war effort. It was land owned by US taxpayers and given to Volkswagen. Neat trick, huh, for Coker to now say that it’s the unions who destroyed American automakers ability to compete with foreign car makers? Bottom line? It’s the American people who have been sold out by those they trusted with their welfare. And when these guys have nothing left to sell of the national treasure, what are they going to do next?  Go to war with the rest of the world to get it back?

What’s happening here regarding the auto-industry bailout is far and away the most significant (bad) news in about three decades, not to be passed over as just so much more (bad) news. Conason understates the matter.

Last night, 35 Dixiecrat Republicans sent a message to Americans who labor for meager wages and lousy benefits: “We’d rather feudalist Confederacy, back when labor consisted largely of slaves.” (David Shuster tonight referenced—rightly so—1860 on MSNBC.) The Confederacy was feudalist, founded on the political philosophy that a few are born to rule, the rest born to slave. According to God, rulers forever insist. That’s what Louis XVI believed too. Leaders of the Confederacy had then and have now no use for milquetoast human rights, not even mental room for dignity that is every human’s birthright by any RATIONAL standard. 

As Thom Hartman noted on the same program, what happened last night was set in motion with the choosing of Ronald Reagan, in particular when Death Valley Days got down to union-busting as he lamely followed Thatcher’s example in her ceaseless effort to re-feudalize Great Britain. Shuster held up a memo issued by the Republican Party to their Dixiecrat members to the effect that the vote was their opportunity to bust Democrat labor. Not that Dixies need prodding in the case of those they regard as beneath themselves. Dems too far as that goes; just not last night.

As Conason notes, rumors were spread regarding wages paid auto-workers, which even at $70 would not be much in the context of American economy. Senators are paid more than $70 per hour, not including vast benefits and even more vast “campaign contributions.” What do Senators produce? Other than gas and M(m)onopoly money?

Existing minimum wage is to real American economy as hanging toenail is to cancer. Thirty measly bucks per hour would be minimum wage in the real America.

Reagan, who never labored a day in his life, regarded himself and a few others as persons designated—by God and by History—to rule. Same as Dubyah believes of himself. At what point will we learn that these people are stark-raving mad?

As for 50% of the rest of us, the only possible excuse is willful ignorance aided and abetted by mega-media whose business is distracting from reality while imposing an imaginary reality—semi-imaginatively on display in advertisements. (On the net too, by the way. Net isn’t radically different.) The “news” is but filler in between.

The government of the United States (also by dint of waging illegal wars) has forfeited legitimacy, having violated terms of social contract, whereby their obligation is to see to these here people’s welfare. (Albeit in our case within the context of rapacious capitalist economic system, which by internal logic necessarily excludes significant minorities of various kinds, including shop-worn army of now-burgeoning surplus labor.) Framers could not have foreseen the depths to which post-modern society would descend in pursuit of what became around the world the ALMIGHTY buck, upon which God’s all-seeing eye is depicted. After SOME progress WAS made—directly as result of struggle on the part of the labor movement beginning at the turn of the last century. It’s THOSE gains that have been sold out by deranged pols fairly freely chosen by an ignorant body (im)politic on the bases of good looks and folksy patter.

Of course 35 senators don’t rule all alone. They do so as fronts for multinational business. Government in America has come to be (widely) regarded as just another business, administered by MASTERS in Business Administration in collusion with attorneys. Our representatives are themselves grossly overpaid (willing) slaves to labor-loathing, big-biz paymasters. As willing slaves, government has forfeited legitimacy. Which is serious as it gets.

One important point that most of the posters do not
know is that the American car companies and
the Japanese car companies are all interconnected together in incestuous relations.
They invest in each other, they buy parts from each
other, they share design trends and joint ventures together. Ever noticed that most cars almost look alike in each level of price.
The relinquishing of the lead to foreign auto companies by American auto companies was deliberate
and intended.
It is a part of the continuous transfer of manufacturing everything to foreign companies, whether they are off-shore or they are having manufacturing plants here in the U.S. Those foreign companies offer wages and benefits much lower than given by American companies.
This is weakening the bargaining position of the UAW and is putting continuous tremendous pressure on it to give more concessions.
I am afraid this process will continue until the
unions become impotent or busted all together.
I will not be surprised, regardless of the bail-out
charade, that the auto companies will declare bankruptcies and in that way all their obligations to the workers and retirees under the old contracts will be zero.
After bankruptcies re-organiztion, probably only
Ford and GM will start over with zero obligations
toward their retirees and new set of contract with
much lower wages and benefits if the UAW is still
alive which I doubt it!!
I am sickened and disgusted by a lot of the posters in this thread. Many have swallowed the bait of the corporate Media and joined the chorus calling for busting the unions.
This reflects an ignorance of history and a false sense of eliticism and job security.
Not long ago before there were no unions in this country, children working in factories used to
demonstrate carrying signs asking for lowering
hours/week to 72 hours and not working in sundays!!
Think about that you dumb ignorants.
With the decline of the unions, we are seeing the
decline and the decimation of the middle class.
It is the race to the bottom where eventually most
workers will be grateful if they are paid the minimum wage if there is still a minimum wage law!!!
The unions served the workers very well and without them the workers will be fair game for corporate greed which history has shown it has no limit.

Corker and Shelby are a disgrace - they may as well work for BMW and Toyota. Their continued anti-union bias is nauseating. Sometimes I wish the South had been successful in seceding from the Union. What is really hypocritical is all of the money the U.S. government pours into southern states and then they have the audacity to not give a crap that a major American industry goes in the tank. The auto manufacturers should be given the same consideration as the banking industry. It was the latter that has caused much of the big three’s pain. And by the way, no one in Congress asked banking employees to take pay cuts. What kind of ridiculous double standard to we have here?  At least Bush has the smarts to go against his own party. Thank God there will be more Democrats in office next month so we can just bypass these idiotic conservatives who want to see this country crash and burn in the name of their ideology.

The reason most Americans are against the bailout is because even with the money there is NO GUARANTEE that laim-ass Detroit will ever pull out of the malaise that has crept into the American Corporate Enterprise. GM needs to restructure and cut out at least half of their Mid to Upper Management. The Pork at the top is the Whole Issue today and Americans are sick to death of it. So it comes as no surprise, even though more jobs are at risk, something we definately don’t need now - the greater question is; are they REALLY going to CUT THE FAT out!! Otherwise it’s just an excersise in futility - the bailout.

According to the rebel yahoo southern senators, this is all the fault of unions. If I’ve noticed anything about southern politicians over the years, 2 things stand out; a hatred for “uppity” free labor and a hatred of the United States. No matter how much “patriotism” these guys wrap themselves in, the ghosts of Calhoun & his nullifier cohorts are always at their elbows. Lincoln must be spinning in his grave knowing that these people have commandeered his party.

Yeah, I’d buy a Honda. Today is a haggler’s dream. One can actually get a car dealer to deal in real cost terms, rather than artificial faux dealer costs that ain’t. Bargain City is now the thing at everybody’s lot, Car Max to BMW to well I don’t think Ferrari, Alfredo ... who can tell if you want one? I currently drive a Nissan pickup I bought new in 1986, so I guess a change is in order. Da Truck still runs great and performs the basic function of getting to where I need to go without need of any roadside assistance on the way or a high-tech CD player to sooth a potential for a fit of road rage. Can anyone out there say the same of a Dodge Ram, a Ford 150 or a GMC Silverado?  If you do, you’re either an expert shade-tree mechanic or lucked out and bought a truck that got away unharmed from the dealer/manufacturer.

Sabagio Mauraeno, still waiting for the Snowstorm from Hell, outside Atlanta on the way to a hike up Panola Mountain.

Raise your hand if you would buy a car from a bankrupt company, any company…Honda, Toyota, BMW?

Frank, the auto “bailout” is structured as a loan.  And you’re full of it; the financial bailout was very much industry specific and rewarding terrible management.  Did any of those banks start lending money?  No, they’re hoarding the cash as if it were theirs.

And take a look at the markets this morning…how did they react (in a non specific way) to the failure of reaching an accord?

The “superior” foreign products are in just as bad of shape.  There will be hell to pay for all of this.

IN the South, to be a union member is to be in league with the devil. Tis true, because da preachers say it so, every Sunday, implications abound. So what happens?  Foreign auto makers have flocked South, gotten state financed tax and long term rebates, access to taxpayer financed industrial parks designed to their specifications, a labor force trained by local technical colleges based on their curricula and including courses on how to behave in a say, Toyota Plant, a Kia assembly line, etc. Republican governors in Tennessee,Georgia,Alabama and the South in general appear to be on the payroll as brokers and receive finders fees when the deals are made. Volkswagen Tennessee and Kia South Georgia are the most recent land/labor/tax grabs negotiated by these people. This at the same time GM and Ford have closed down their oldest biggest plants and Chrysler hasn’t been seen in years. What happens?  THese foreign companies pick up a labor force, non-union at the half the price in the so-called “Right-to-work states that also have a legal gimmick called “employment at will” to silence any employee who thinks they have a right to complain about personal and abusive management practices.

Enough said?  Hey, Our Big 3 got their clocks cleaned by the other Biggees of the world because, not only are they nastier than they are, regarding labor, they are smarter, produce a better product and aren’t burden by antiquated anti-monopoly laws that don’t allow our guys to talk openly about how to cut costs throughout industry and still remain competitive with the global network of oligopolies.  Where are the “economists” to help explain all of this in terms of the “bottom line?”  Well, they’re not in evidence among the Media no-it-all Pundits, the Grandstanding Politicians, and the Clueless CEOs whose blank stares and mea culpa, but blame the victims admissions we had to put up with lo these several months of a recession we’ve just been officially told began last year.  Big Steel, US Steel, Bethlehem, Inland, Jones and Laughlin, left under similar circumstances during the early Reagan Rust Belt Era. Nobody especially the Republicans, came to their defense then, mainly because Big Steel deserved their fate. They didn’t keep up with the competition, “foreign imports,” because they thought they had a lock on the local market, beginning with the Big 3 automakers. When things began to go really our, they first blamed the unions and asked for labor contract concessions and government protections and bailouts. What happened then, 25 years ago, is happening now: keystones to our industrial base whose replacement industries have already been sold to the cheap labor countries of China, India , the Southeast in General, leaving the local laborer pools lining up in mass at the unemployment office for cheap change unemployment checks while being accused by local media of being unpatriotic for not buy needless Christmas junk made in China, so as to “save” the retail businesses of their neighbors” like “Made In America” WalMart, Sears, K-Mart, Kroger’s, Office Depot, Circuit City, Target, Walgreens, Rite Aid, MacDonald’s,...and of course, Ford, GM and Chrysler,economic predators all, who drove out home-owned retailers many years ago.

Sabagio Mauraeno, here in DeKalb County Georgia, awaiting the Snowstorm from Hell(New Orleans) so retailers can rejoice that we’re going to get a White Christmas.

Armand, the bailout of the banking system was a bailout of the entire economy. It affects credit lines and lending for all business sectors and ‘classes’ of people. It insures that all business, including responsible small businesses that account for most new job creation in the country will have the money for payroll and training of new employees as they grow. 

The auto industry bailout is very different and is rewarding a specific business segment for very poor business practices at the expense of the taxpayers, most of whom will not benefit in any significant way.

Armonda, the bailout of the banking system was a bailout of the entire economy. It affects credit lines and lending for all business sectors and ‘classes’ of people. It insures that all business, including responsible small businesses that account for most new job creation in the country will have the money for payroll and training of new employees as they grow. 

The auto industry bailout is very different and is rewarding a specific business segment for very poor business practices at the expense of the taxpayers, most of whom will not benefit in any significant way.

congratulations, repubs. once again you’ve shown empathy for your fellow americans. and not just us either: stock markets tanked all over europe today and so did the american dollar, just when it had gotten a little bit stronger. just brilliant. your year is over now, so i guess there will be no encore.

did anyone ever see the interview with the man and woman who’ve been trying to tell the world about toyota’s use of slave labor for the prias? i guess that’s what is in store for the american auto worker if they ever want to work again.

damned republicans, money-grubbing hypocrits.

it not just the Japanese car companies, but European and Korean companies that are setting up shop in the south.

For Example BMW has set up shop in Greer South Carolina. ( FYI the next time the James Bond 007 movie Golden Eye comes on TV , watch it because the BMW sports car 007 drives in it came off the line in SC , I remember the local SC TV stations made a big deal about it at the time)

Mercedes Benz’s has set up shop in Alabama.

BMW and Benz’s’ are German companies and Germany has universal health care

So maybe not having universal health care is a good thing for the auto industry.

Also just this month KIA a Korean company announced that it would be building a new factory in GA. with cars rolling off the line in late 2009.

what do all the factories have in common , they are non union.

So maybe unions are a bad thing for the auto industry.

Think about It

Were i in charge of the Big 3, America would get a rude awakening…here’s what i’d say in the Senate chamber:

“Sirs, after showering a mismanaged industry with no questions asked money you choose to berate us over a sum that the financial industry would turn up its nose at.  Your hypocrisy disgusts me.  Have any of you looked at the books that you manage?  Yet you feel obligated to play the bully for political gain.  Sirs, there is only one thing that a bully understands.  And since you seem intent on cutting off your nose to spite your face, i’ll go so far as to offer the cleaver.  As of December 19th, 2008, we will be shuttering world wide operations.  Not restructuring…shuttering.  On February 1st, 2009 we will begin liquidating our assets.  Cash on hand and that raised through liquidation will be split between current employees, suppliers, and stock holders.  Good day and good luck.”

And i wouldn’t even think about changing my mind until national health care was legislated and the government started spending real money on R&D;(like the Japanese government subsidizing Panasonic and Sanyo for the production of hybrid battery systems) and alternative fuel infrastructure.

We’ve got an interesting Devil’s Night tradition in Detroit that we could teach the nation.  You all want to see it burn?  Just be grateful that i’m not in charge of those companies, because i’d toss the match.

Clear, sane, and all of that.

Did you know that Toyota’s Japanese operations are not very profitable?  Paying a Japanese factory worker costs about the same as paying a UAW worker costs the big 3; the big difference being that Toyota only pays retiree health for two years before the Japanese National Health Care system starts picking up the tab.

Toyota makes the bulk of their money in America…in effect outsourcing production.  Ford makes the bulk of its profit in Europe.  And GM does well in Latin America and Asia while struggling in the States.

Toyota plants in Japan are already idled.  N. American operations are being curtailed.  And the new plant that was to open in Mississippi is being pushed back until 2010, at least.  Nobody’s buying Toyota’s right now either.

There’s a lot of “debate” on the internet about this issue when very, very, very few of the commenters know much of anything about the subject.

On the one hand, the auto makers have been looking backward for the last 40 years, and fighting any and all regulation no matter HOW sane it was.  They followed trends till they were dead, but never set them.  They have buried innovation and ideas, substituting styling changes instead.  They ignored trends, markets, and the blistering success of their Japanese and German competitors.

Now they want our money, still want their $20 million bonuses and try to tell us it’s all the UAW’s fault.  They did EVERYTHING wrong imaginable and STILL Americans were loyal.  Now, they’ve destroyed 99% of their reputation and say it’s because of the union.

1) Fire every SOB in management who can’t prove to a cynical observer he’s doing a good job.  No CEO will pass that test.
2) Make the loans short term bridge loans, and subject them to IMMEDIATE recall if they f*** around with the money.
3) NOBODY gets a bonus or a golden parachute till the taxpayers are paid back…with interest.
4) The Federal Loan is FIRST CALL on all payments—ahead of everyone, even the IRS (oh, the tax boys with HATE that!).  Bankruptcy? Pay US back first.

5) Retroactively apply the same damn rules to the banks that just sucked up our $$$ and kept themselves fat and rich at our expense.

There you go again Joe, believing that somehow your ideas are superior to the beliefs of the American People.  Then you hoist fear upon us to persuade us that we lack vision. Washington elitism at it’s best. Joe, a lot of the American People have been down so long that down don’t bother us.  We have adjusted to poverty.  What you are concerned about is that your next in line and that a collapse of the auto industry will hasten you and others into the down elevator.  It would have been better if you had shown some concern earlier but now that your tush is on the line too it becomes very personal. Don’t despair Joe, people get used to poverty too.

American consumers chose not to spend their money on inferior products from Detroit, and now they are being forced to give their money to Detroit anyway, while getting nothing in return.The bailout is taxpayer robbery.

GM spent $20 Billion in shareholder payouts from 1996-2000, an average of $5 billion per year, which is as much as they spend on health care benefits. Meanwhile, Toyota decided their shareholders would benefit more from investing their cash from that period in research & development for hybrids and other long term improvements. They now have superior product offerings that consumers want, and the success that goes with it.

GM dug their own graves, and the unions helped dig it, so let them lie in it, instead of robbing the taxpayers.

As a libertarian, I have a problem with the idea that foreign countries “subsidize” their automakers with allegedly “free” health care.

If this were so, then Toyota, Honda, and other foreign automakers would not be setting up factories in America; it would make more sense to keep them at home where the allegedly “free” health care saves them money and helps them make profits.

Clearly, it is possible to build automobiles profitably in America, judging by the success of Toyota and others doing just that. Better to allow the bankruptcy system to kick in, allow the American companies to restructure, and once again become competitive. Bailouts just reinforce inefficiencies and prevent firms from taking the necessary actions to make themselves profitable.

Mr. Conasan is correct on so many points but I think he really hits the nail on the head with:

“But it is ironic to think that the Bush administration and Congress would swiftly appropriate hundreds of billions of dollars to save the same firms whose stupidity and criminality drove the economy down—while begrudging a far smaller amount to a major industry brought to ruin by the financial crash.”

Ever since Reagan took office there has been this move to portray our union members as sluggish yet greedy dinosaurs unable to compete against their faster, smarter and harder-working foreign counterparts. Bull.

When we add the same tariffs to cars brought in from South Korea and Japan that they slap on our cars, then we can compare apples to apples.

When our nation provides single-payer health care - as does virtually every industrial, First World nation on earth - then we can compare oranges to oranges.

When we step up and challenge this $70/hour crap spewed out and repeated ad nausuem by the right-wing and the Corporate Media - then we’ll have a level playing field and know who’s producing the lemons.