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Is Wright Right About Racism?

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Posted on Mar 27, 2008

By David Sirota

Since the 1960s, bigotry has undergone an aesthetic makeover. Today, the most pernicious racists do not wear pointy hoods, scream epithets and anonymously burn crosses from behind masks. They don starched suits, recite sententious bromides and stage political lynchings before television cameras. For proof, behold the mob stalking Barack Obama’s former pastor, Jeremiah Wright.

Wright has long delivered fiery (and occasionally outrageous) sermons, to little fanfare. Now, though, a gang of thugs is inflicting a guilt-by-association blow to Obama by excoriating his spiritual adviser for three specific declarations.

Sean Hannity, Fox News’ own George Wallace, turned a fire hose on Wright for his church’s focus. “[The church] is all about the black community,” Hannity thundered, claiming that means Wright supports “a black-separatist agenda.”

Pat Buchanan billy-clubbed Wright for saying, “God damn America.” The MSNBC commentator, who avoided the draft, implied that Wright, a former Marine, lacks sufficient loyalty to country. Out of context, Wright’s exclamation was admittedly offensive. But remember: It punctuated a speech about segregation. Buchanan, nonetheless, unleashed, deriding “black hustlers” and insisting descendants of those “brought from Africa in slave ships” owe whites a thank you. “Where is the gratitude?” he asked.

Fox’s Charles Krauthammer berated Wright for saying the 9/11 attacks were “chickens coming home to roost.” Krauthammer labeled the pronouncement “vitriolic divisiveness” despite our government acknowledging the concept of “blowback”—or retaliation—that Wright was referencing. The CIA knows that when it supports foreign dictatorships, there can be blowback from radicals. While blowback is often immoral and undeserved, its existence is undisputed. Yet, Krauthammer alleged that Wright takes “satisfaction in the deaths of 3,000 innocents.”

In promoting the Wright “controversy,” most media outlets joined this mob and embraced “colorblind racism,” says Duke University’s Eduardo Bonilla-Silva, author of “Racism Without Racists.”

It is polite pinstriped prejudice shrouding bigotry in feigned outrage against extremism—the operative word being feigned. After all, John McCain solicited the endorsement of John Hagee, the pastor who called the Catholic Church “the Great Whore.” Similarly, according to Mother Jones magazine, Hillary Clinton belongs to the “Fellowship,” a secretive group “dedicated to ‘spiritual war’ on behalf of Christ.” She is also friendly with Billy Graham, the minister caught on tape spewing anti-Semitism. But while Wright’s supposed “extremism” blankets the news, McCain and Clinton’s relationships with real extremists receive scant attention.

Why is it “controversial” for one pastor to address the black community, racism and blowback, but OK for another pastor to slander an entire religion? Why is it news that one candidate knows a sometimes-impolitic clergyman, but not news that his opponent associates with an anti-Semite? Does the double standard prove the dominant culture despises a black man confronting taboos but accepts whites spewing hate? Does the very reaction to Wright show he’s right about racism?

Clinton seems to think so. Her aides have been describing as their political “firewall” the states they believe Obama will lose. That’s campaign-speak for “race wall”—one built with bricks like Pennsylvania and Indiana. These aren’t the near purely white states where racial politics is often muted (and Obama won). They are the slightly diverse states where racial politics simmers and where the black vote is too small to offset a motivated racist vote. This race wall is now being fortified.

ABC News reports that Clinton’s campaign is “pushing the Wright story” ahead of the Pennsylvania and Indiana primaries. The crass tactic is designed to motivate the racist vote by reminding whites of Obama’s connection to the African-American community. Put another way, Clinton’s message has become simply: Obama Is black.

Wright probably expected this brouhaha. He says our government is “controlled by rich white people” and our culture afflicted by racism. Though these statements are also deemed distasteful by the Establishment, they are truisms. You can see their veracity in the collected portraits of white millionaires commonly called the congressional photo directory. Or, just turn on your television and watch the mob continue stoking the Wright “controversy.”

David Sirota is a best-selling author whose newest book, “The Uprising,” will be released in June. He is a fellow at the Campaign for America’s Future and a board member of the Progressive States Network, both nonpartisan organizations. His blog is at www.credoaction.com/sirota.

© 2008 Creators Syndicate Inc.

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By Fadel Abdallah, March 30 at 3:27 pm #
(382 comments total)

Here’s Part 6 of Tim Wise’s Article!
====================================
So what can we say about a nation that values lies more than it loves truth? A place where adherence to sincerely believed and internalized fictions allows one to rise to the highest offices in the land, and to earn the respect of millions, while a willingness to challenge those fictions and offer a more accurate counter-narrative earns one nothing but contempt, derision, indeed outright hatred? What we can say is that such a place is signing its own death warrant. What we can say is that such a place is missing the only and last opportunity it may ever have to make things right, to live up to its professed ideals. What we can say is that such a place can never move forward, because we have yet to fully address and come to terms with that which lay behind.
What can we say about a nation where white preachers can lie every week from their pulpits without so much as having to worry that their lies might be noticed by the shiny white faces in their pews, while black preachers who tell one after another essential truth are demonized, not only for the stridency of their tone--which needless to say scares white folks, who have long preferred a style of praise and worship resembling nothing so much as a coma--but for merely calling bullshit on those whose lies are swallowed whole?
And oh yes, I said it: white preachers lie. In fact, they lie with a skill, fluidity, and precision unparalleled in the history of either preaching or lying, both of which histories stretch back a ways and have often overlapped. They lie every Sunday, as they talk about a Savior they have chosen to represent dishonestly as a white man, in every picture to be found of him in their tabernacles, every children’s story book in their Sunday Schools, every Christmas card they’ll send to relatives and friends this December. But to lie about Jesus, about the one they consider God--to bear false witness as to who this man was and what he looked like--is no cause for concern.
Nor is it a problem for these preachers to teach and preach that those who don’t believe as they believe are going to hell. Despite the fact that such a belief casts aspersions upon God that are so profound as to defy belief--after all, they imply that God is so fundamentally evil that he would burn non-believers in a lake of eternal fire--many of the white folks who now condemn Jeremiah Wright welcome that theology of hate. Indeed, back when President Bush was the Governor of Texas, he endorsed this kind of thinking, responding to a question about whether Jews were going to go to hell, by saying that unless one accepted Jesus as one’s personal savior, the Bible made it pretty clear that indeed, hell was where you’d be heading.
So you can curse God in this way--and to imply such hate on God’s part is surely to curse him--and in effect, curse those who aren’t Christians, and no one says anything. That isn’t considered bigoted. That isn’t considered beyond the pale of polite society. One is not disqualified from becoming President in the minds of millions because they go to a church that says that shit every single week, or because they believe it themselves. And millions do believe it, and see nothing wrong with it whatsoever.
So white folks are mad at Jeremiah Wright because he challenges their views about their country. Meanwhile, those same white folks, and their ministers and priests, every week put forth a false image of the God Jeremiah Wright serves, and yet it is whites who feel we have the right to be offended.
Pardon me, but something is wrong here, and whatever it is, is not to be found at Trinity United Church of Christ.

Tim Wise is the author of: White Like Me: Reflections on Race from a Privileged Son (Soft Skull Press, 2005), and Affirmative Action: Racial Preference in Black and White (Routledge: 2005). He can be reached at: timjwise at msn dot com
This essay originally appeared in Lip.

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By Lee, March 31 at 11:04 am #
(118 comments total)

RE: Fadel Abdallah

You know, there are still a lot of Americans who are patriotic, and proud to be Americans. Although there are some things wrong with this country, there are a lot more things right with this country. I guess that’s why in spite of the continual America bashing from people like you and Cyrena and Leefeller, you choose to live here, instead of the Islamic countries you constantly defend. What have you three ever done to positively contribute to America? Have you been in the military, or public service of any kind? I have ... as did my father, cousins, uncles, etc.. Please let us not forget that thousands of Americans of all races have either risked their lives, or given their lives for the freedoms you ingrates now enjoy.  My Grandparents came here from an oppressive foreign country in order to start a ‘free’ new life. They ran into bigotry and racism, but they respected and embraced the American culture, instead of bashing it. They worked in sweat mills, along with people representing other countries and races to help make this country they were so proud of a better place. Like many others who came here, they assimilated into the American melting pot. People like you, Wright, etc. enjoy all the benefits of living here, while constantly complaining, accusing, etc..  This whole country is composed of various minorities with difficult histories, but you seem to think this country owes you entitlements over and above the rest of us.  if you think it’s so bad here, why don’t you move to an Islamic country, and see how many rights, freedoms, and harsh punishments you would endure. Talk is cheap! You malcontents wouldn’t even have the freedom to shoot off your mouth in the Islamic countries you defend. One of the great acts of wisdom that was established in America was to separate church and state. The thought of living under a 12th century theocracy with brutal restrictions and punishments is pretty scary. If you America bashers prefer to live under that kind of tyranny, fine ... but, don’t try to shove it down our throats.

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By bert, April 2 at 6:40 pm #
(686 comments total)

Reply to Lee

This is beautiful, Lee. You are so right. Despite her faults there is still much to be proud of and love.

Like you my maternal grandparents were from, ‘the old country.’ And they had similar expereinces as yours.

And I am glad you spoke out to those who only have bad things to say about the US.

When I was in ccollge in the 60’s and marched against Vietnam and for civil rights and women’s rights Some printed up some bumper stickers that a lot of us slapped on our b cars that read, “America - Fix it or Forget it.”

So some local truck drivers came up with a bumper sticker that saud, “Anerica - Love it or Leave it.”

Today with a few more years and a lot more expereince I realize both groups were wrong. The bumper sticker should have said “America - Love it and Fix it.”

If you are not in the trenches teaching in an inner city, working in a political party, walking in the marches or on the picket lines, lobbying and testifying before city, county, state and federal legislative bodies, working a food kitchen for the poor, enlisting in the military then you really don’t get it.

Again Lee, great post and thanks for telling it like it is.

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By Leefeller, March 31 at 1:46 pm #
(1232 comments total)

Walked to school in the snow bare foot

Your over contumelious denial of Racism and bigotry is exactly the problem.  But only in part, their are many other problems in our country that need address, seems for some and you denial is a river in Egypt.

Your assumptions are without merit, the flaw in your craw is you assume way to much.

Tim Wise article address a problem of how people perceive things, compassion would go a long way in helping your assertions.

Report this

By cyrena, March 30 at 6:12 pm #
(4155 comments total)

Re:

Dear Fadel,

Thanks so much for posting this article/piece from Tim Wise. Indeed, it is superb, and extraordinarily appropriate for this thread.

It probably goes without saying that it is an extremely helpful addition to my own on-going work, since the theme is consistent with my own endeavors. Basically, the US has a history of racism dating back to its very conception, and the bottom line is that as a collection of 300+ million citizens, far too few of us KNOW it, (this history) or are able to connect the conceptual dots to understand its effects on the collective social psychology of our nation.

It probably also goes without saying that there are MANY ways to study this development, (of racism in America) and that just one of them is the study of the Constitution. Most of us miss the reality of the language –BUILT INTO THAT DOCUMENT along the way- that has actually sanctioned and provided the foundation for what could only have resulted in the racism that we live with today.

That is of course only one element of it, but the history is foundational, and that’s the bottom line. We ignore it at our own peril, as we have for over two Centuries.

Meantime, I followed the piece to the link that published it, (counterpunch) though it was apparently originally published at LIP. (I was unfamiliar with that site). That made it easier for me to just zap the entire piece with my nifty little ‘adobe acrobat’ tool. (I do so love that little helper). So, for anyone else who would like to access it in its entirety, (one piece) I’ve put the link below.

Thanks again.

http://www.counterpunch.org/wise03182008.html

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By Fadel Abdallah, March 30 at 3:24 pm #
(382 comments total)

Here’s Part 5 of Tim Wise’s Article!
====================================
Most white people desire, or perhaps even require the propagation of lies when it comes to our history. Surely we prefer the lies to anything resembling, even remotely, the truth. Our version of history, of our national past, simply cannot allow for the intrusion of fact into a worldview so thoroughly identified with fiction. But that white version of America is not only extraordinarily incomplete, in that it so favors the white experience to the exclusion of others; it is more than that; it is actually a slap in the face to people of color, a re-injury, a reminder that they are essentially irrelevant, their concerns trivial, their lives unworthy of being taken seriously. In that sense, and what few if any white Americans appear capable of grasping at present, is that “Leave it Beaver” and “Father Knows Best,” portray an America so divorced from the reality of the times in which they were produced, as to raise serious questions about the sanity of those who found them so moving, so accurate, so real. These iconographic representations of life in the U.S. are worse than selective, worse than false, they are assaults to the humanity and memory of black people, who were being savagely oppressed even as June Cleaver did housework in heels and laughed about the hilarious hijinks of Beaver and Larry Mondello.
These portraits of America are certifiable evidence of how disconnected white folks were--and to the extent we still love them and view them as representations of the “good old days” to which we wish we could return, still are--from those men and women of color with whom we have long shared a nation. Just two months before “Leave it to Beaver” debuted, proposed civil rights legislation was killed thanks to Strom Thurmond’s 24-hour filibuster speech on the floor of the U.S. Senate. One month prior, Arkansas Governor Orville Faubus called out the National Guard to block black students from entering Little Rock Central High; and nine days before America was introduced to the Cleavers, and the comforting image of national life they represented, those black students were finally allowed to enter, amid the screams of enraged, unhinged, viciously bigoted white people, who saw nothing wrong with calling children niggers in front of cameras. That was America of the 1950s: not the sanitized version into which so many escape thanks to the miracle of syndication, which merely allows white people to relive a lie, year after year after year.
No, it is not the pastor who distorts history; Nick at Nite and your teenager’s textbooks do that. It is not he who casts aspersions upon “this great country” as Barack Obama put it in his public denunciations of him; it is the historic leadership of the nation that has cast aspersions upon it; it is they who have cheapened it, who have made gaudy and vile the promise of American democracy by defiling it with lies. They engage in a patriotism that is pathological in its implications, that asks of those who adhere to it not merely a love of country but the turning of one’s nation into an idol to be worshipped, it not literally, then at least in terms of consequence.
It is they--the flag-lapel-pin wearing leaders of this land--who bring shame to the country with their nonsensical suggestions that we are always noble in warfare, always well-intended, and although we occasionally make mistakes, we are never the ones to blame for anything. Nothing that happens to us has anything to do with us at all. It is always about them. They are evil, crazy, fanatical, hate our freedoms, and are jealous of our prosperity. When individuals prattle on in this manner we diagnose them as narcissistic, as deluded. When nations do it--when our nation does--we celebrate it as though it were the very model of rational and informed citizenship.

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By Fadel Abdallah, March 30 at 3:22 pm #
(382 comments total)

Here’s Part 4 of Tim Wise’s Article!
=======================================
And so we were shocked in 1987, when Supreme Court Justice Thurgood Marshall declined to celebrate the bicentennial of the Constitution, because, as he noted, most of that history had been one of overt racism and injustice, and to his way of thinking, the only history worth celebrating had been that of the past three or four decades.
We were shocked to learn that black people actually believed that a white cop who was a documented racist might frame a black man; and we’re shocked to learn that lots of black folks still perceive the U.S. as a racist nation--we’re literally stunned that people who say they experience discrimination regularly (and who have the social science research to back them up) actually think that those experiences and that data might actually say something about the nation in which they reside. Imagine.
Whites are easily shocked by what we see and hear from Pastor Wright and Trinity Church, because what we see and hear so thoroughly challenges our understanding of who we are as a nation. But black people have never, for the most part, believed in the imagery of the “shining city on a hill,” for they have never had the option of looking at their nation and ignoring the mountain-sized warts still dotting its face when it comes to race. Black people do not, in the main, get misty eyed at the sight of the flag the way white people do--and this is true even for millions of black veterans--for they understand that the nation for whom that flag waves is still not fully committed to their own equality. They have a harder time singing those tunes that white people seem so eager to belt out, like “God Bless America,” for they know that whites sang those words loudly and proudly even as they were enforcing Jim Crow segregation, rioting against blacks who dared move into previously white neighborhoods, throwing rocks at Dr. King and then cheering, as so many did, when they heard the news that he had been assassinated.
Whites refuse to remember (or perhaps have never learned) that which black folks cannot afford to forget. I’ve seen white people stunned to the point of paralysis when they learn the truth about lynchings in this country--when they discover that such events were not just a couple of good old boys with a truck and a rope hauling some black guy out to the tree, hanging him, and letting him swing there. They were never told the truth: that lynchings were often community events, advertised in papers as “Negro Barbecues,” involving hundreds or even thousands of whites, who would join in the fun, eat chicken salad and drink sweet tea, all while the black victims of their depravity were being hung, then shot, then burned, and then having their body parts cut off, to be handed out to onlookers. They are stunned to learn that postcards of the events were traded as souvenirs, and that very few whites, including members of their own families did or said anything to stop it.
Rather than knowing about and confronting the ugliness of our past, whites take steps to excise the less flattering aspects of our history so that we need not be bothered with them. So, in Tulsa, Oklahoma, for example, site of an orgy of violence against the black community in 1921, city officials literally went into the town library and removed all reference to the mass killings in the Greenwood district from the papers with a razor blade--an excising of truth and an assault on memory that would remain unchanged for over seventy years.

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By Fadel Abdallah, March 30 at 3:19 pm #
(382 comments total)

Here’s part 3 of Tim Wise’s Article!
=======================================
So that’s the truth of the matter: Wright made one comment that is highly arguable, but which has also been voiced by white America’s favorite black man, another that was horribly misinterpreted and stripped of all context, and then another that was demonstrably accurate. And for this, he is pilloried and made into a virtual enemy of the state; for this, Barack Obama may lose the support of just enough white folks to cost him the Democratic nomination, and/or the Presidency; all of it, because Jeremiah Wright, unlike most preachers opted for truth. If he had been one of those “prosperity ministers” who says Jesus wants nothing so much as for you to be rich, like Joel Osteen, that would have been fine. Had he been a retread bigot like Falwell was, or Pat Robertson is, he might have been criticized, but he would have remained in good standing and surely not have damaged a Presidential candidate in this way. But unlike Osteen, and Falwell, and Robertson, Jeremiah Wright refused to feed his parishioners lies.
What Jeremiah Wright knows, and told his flock--though make no mistake, they already knew it--is that 9/11 was neither the first, nor worst act of terrorism on American soil. The history of this nation for folks of color, was for generations, nothing less than an intergenerational hate crime, one in which 9/11s were woven into the fabric of everyday life: hundreds of thousands of the enslaved who died from the conditions of their bondage; thousands more who were lynched (as many as 10,000 in the first few years after the Civil War, according to testimony in the Congressional Record at the time); millions of indigenous persons wiped off the face of the Earth. No, to some, the horror of 9/11 was not new. To some it was not on that day that “everything changed.” To some, everything changed four hundred years ago, when that first ship landed at what would become Jamestown. To some, everything changed when their ancestors were forced into the hulls of slave ships at Goree Island and brought to a strange land as chattel. To some, everything changed when they were run out of Northern Mexico, only to watch it become the Southwest United States, thanks to a war of annihilation initiated by the U.S. government. To some, being on the receiving end of terrorism has been a way of life. Until recently it was absolutely normal in fact.
But white folks have a hard time hearing these simple truths. We find it almost impossible to listen to an alternative version of reality. Indeed, what seems to bother white people more than anything, whether in the recent episode, or at any other time, is being confronted with the recognition that black people do not, by and large, see the world like we do; that black people, by and large, do not view America as white people view it. We are, in fact, shocked that this should be so, having come to believe, apparently, that the falsehoods to which we cling like a kidney patient clings to a dialysis machine, are equally shared by our darker-skinned compatriots.
This is what James Baldwin was talking about in his classic 1972 work, No Name in the Street, wherein he noted:
“White children, in the main, and whether they are rich or poor, grow up with a grasp of reality so feeble that they can very accurately be described as deluded--about themselves and the world they live in. White people have managed to get through their entire lifetimes in this euphoric state, but black people have not been so lucky: a black man who sees the world the way John Wayne, for example, sees it would not be an eccentric patriot, but a raving maniac.”

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By Fadel Abdallah, March 30 at 3:16 pm #
(382 comments total)

Here’s part 2 of Tim Wise article!
====================================
He noted that we killed far more people, far more innocent civilians in Hiroshima and Nagasaki than were killed on 9/11 and “never batted an eye.” That this statement is true is inarguable, at least amongst sane people. He is correct on the math, he is correct on the innocence of the dead (neither city was a military target), and he is most definitely correct on the lack of remorse or even self-doubt about the act: sixty-plus years later most Americans still believe those attacks were justified, that they were needed to end the war and “save American lives.”
But not only does such a calculus suggest that American lives are inherently worth more than the lives of Japanese civilians (or, one supposes, Vietnamese, Iraqi or Afghan civilians too), but it also ignores the long-declassified documents, and President Truman’s own war diaries, all of which indicate clearly that Japan had already signaled its desire to end the war, and that we knew they were going to surrender, even without the dropping of atomic weapons. The conclusion to which these truths then attest is simple, both in its basic veracity and it monstrousness: namely, that in those places we committed premeditated and deliberate mass murder, with no justification whatsoever; and yet for saying that I will receive more hate mail, more hostility, more dismissive and contemptuous responses than will those who suggest that no body count is too high when we’re the ones doing the killing. Jeremiah Wright becomes a pariah, because, you see, we much prefer the logic of George Bush the First, who once said that as President he would “never apologize for the United States of America. I don’t care what the facts are.”
And Wright didn’t say blacks should be singing “God Damn America.” He was suggesting that blacks owe little moral allegiance to a nation that has treated so many of them for so long as animals, as persons undeserving of dignity and respect, and which even now locks up hundreds of thousands of non-violent offenders (especially for drug possession), even while whites who do the same crimes (and according to the data, when it comes to drugs, more often in fact), are walking around free. His reference to God in that sermon was more about what God will do to such a nation, than it was about what should or shouldn’t happen. It was a comment derived from, and fully in keeping with, the black prophetic tradition, and although one can surely disagree with the theology (I do, actually, and don’t believe that any God either blesses or condemns nation states for their actions), the statement itself was no call for blacks to turn on America. If anything, it was a demand that America earn the respect of black people, something the evidence and history suggests it has yet to do.
Finally, although one can certainly disagree with Wright about his suggestion that the government created AIDS to get rid of black folks--and I do, for instance--it is worth pointing out that Wright isn’t the only one who has said this. In fact, none other than Bill Cosby (oh yes, that Bill Cosby, the one white folks love because of his recent moral crusade against the black poor) proffered his belief in the very same thing back in the early ‘90s in an interview on CNN, when he said that AIDS may well have been created to get rid of people whom the government deemed “undesirable” including gays and racial minorities.

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By Fadel Abdallah, March 30 at 3:14 pm #
(382 comments total)

This long piece, by Tim Wise, belongs squarely under this thread. Only people with strong minds and a strong attachment to truth will be able to read read all of it. Here’s part 1:
================================
March 18, 2008
Jeremiah Wright, Barack Obama and the Unacceptability of Truth
Of National Lies and Racial America
By TIM WISE

For most white folks, indignation just doesn’t wear well. Once affected or conjured up, it reminds one of a pudgy man, wearing a tie that may well have fit him when he was fifty pounds lighter, but which now cuts off somewhere above his navel and makes him look like an idiot.
Indignation doesn’t work for most whites, because having remained sanguine about, silent during, indeed often supportive of so much injustice over the years in this country--the theft of native land and genocide of indigenous persons, and the enslavement of Africans being only two of the best examples--we are just a bit late to get into the game of moral rectitude. And once we enter it, our efforts at righteousness tend to fail the test of sincerity.
But here we are, in 2008, fuming at the words of Pastor Jeremiah Wright, of Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago--occasionally Barack Obama’s pastor, and the man whom Obama credits with having brought him to Christianity--for merely reminding us of those evils about which we have remained so quiet, so dismissive, so unconcerned. It is not the crime that bothers us, but the remembrance of it, the unwillingness to let it go--these last words being the first ones uttered by most whites it seems whenever anyone, least of all an “angry black man” like Jeremiah Wright, foists upon us the bill of particulars for several centuries of white supremacy.
But our collective indignation, no matter how loudly we announce it, cannot drown out the truth. And as much as white America may not be able to hear it (and as much as politics may require Obama to condemn it) let us be clear, Jeremiah Wright fundamentally told the truth.
Oh I know that for some such a comment will seem shocking. After all, didn’t he say that America “got what it deserved” on 9/11? And didn’t he say that black people should be singing “God Damn America” because of its treatment of the African American community throughout the years?
Well actually, no he didn’t.
Wright said not that the attacks of September 11th were justified, but that they were, in effect, predictable. Deploying the imagery of chickens coming home to roost is not to give thanks for the return of the poultry or to endorse such feathered homecoming as a positive good; rather, it is merely to note two things: first, that what goes around, indeed, comes around--a notion with longstanding theological grounding--and secondly, that the U.S. has indeed engaged in more than enough violence against innocent people to make it just a tad bit hypocritical for us to then evince shock and outrage about an attack on ourselves, as if the latter were unprecedented.

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By Leefeller, March 30 at 10:38 am #
(1232 comments total)

Lincoln's story of two dunks fighting

Abraham Lincolin, a Republican said the difference between the two political parties is very subtle, he equated both parties as two drunks fighting in the street and when the fight was over they had each others coats on.

Interesting thought, forms a picture in the minds eye.

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By Thomas Richards, March 30 at 12:27 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)

Obama’s Bible Study Class

James Meeks – an Illinois state senator, pastor of one of the largest churches in the state and a declared Spiritual Adviser for Obama – came under fire for comments rebroadcast last week calling white American mayors “slave masters” and referring to black preachers and politicians who “protect” the “white man” as “house n-ggers.”

“We don’t have slave masters, we got mayors,” Meeks said in an August 2006 sermon broadcast on a Chicago community television channel.
Aside from his senatorial duties, Meeks is an Illinois Superdelegate pledged to Obama and also presides over Salem Baptist Church, described as the largest church in Illinois.

In 2006, Meeks informed his church during a sermon he may run for Illinois governor. He was recorded telling the mostly black congregation any “white Christian” who doesn’t vote for him is a “racist.” Speaking from his pulpit Meeks said, “if I don’t have every white Christian vote in the state of Illinois, I will stand on top of the Sears Tower and call every one of y’all racist.”

Meeks is also notorious for his strong anti-homosexual platform, although Obama is campaigning for the “gay” vote. Meeks has routinely voted against pro-homosexual legislation and has been quoted during sermons referring to same-sex attraction “an evil sickness.”

Obama told the Sun-Times that he is an attendee of Meeks’ Salem Baptist Church for Wednesday night Bible Study.

According to Illinois State Board of Elections records, Rezko’s businesses, Rezmar Corp. and Rezko Concession, contributed to Meeks’ campaign funds.

A recent Meeks endorsement is touted on Obama’s campaign website.

Here is how James Meeks and his relationship with Obama were described in a 2004 Men’s News Daily report during Obama’s 2004 US Senate campaign:
Obama’s closest religious advisers—Fr. (Michael) Pfleger, the Rev. Jeremiah Wright of Chicago’s Trinity United Church of Christ, and Illinois State Sen. James Meeks, who moonlights as the pastor of Chicago’s Salem Baptist Church – may have quotes from Scripture always handy, but are theologically closer to Karl Marx and black nationalism, than to Christianity.

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By bert, March 30 at 7:29 am #
(686 comments total)

Sickness that is U.S.

Reply to Leefeller et al.

Republicans run campaigns as a business with the intent to win.  Democrats run campaigns as a crusade, with the intent to purge the party of the non-believers or right past wrongs or to convert people to Democratic values.

Proof: Since 1891
Republican presidents: McKinley, T Roosevelt, Taft, Harding, Coolidge, Hoover, Eisenhower, Nixon, Reagan, Bush 1, Bush 2

Democratic Presidents: Wilson, F. Roosevelt, Truman, JFK, LBJ, Carter, Clinton

60% Republican VS 40% Democratic

“As Joe in Maine so eloquently wrote on a different thread:

cyrena writes, “Your post has me bragging again, on how smart we all are. I love it when folks know the truth and acknowledge it, no matter how ugly it may be.”

That’s not the attitude of a winner. It stinks like the liberal elitist you are. That very attitude is going to do more to defeat Obama than any 527 group ad showing Obama without his hand over his heart or any 30-second clip of Rev. Wright pleading for God to Damn America. (What makes us think he hasn’t?)

That attitude does far more harm than you realize. Want to know why Obama does poorly with voters that make less than $50,000 a year? Just get a few ‘real people’ in a room and give them your best cyrena rant. Tell THEM how smart you Obamabots are and how they just don’t get it.

It’s the belief in something too big for you to really understand. Give them a 37-minute lecture in your best constitutional law professor language about how we need to come together so as to distract you from the fact that I never answer any tough questions, how I’ve never been tested against a strong republican opponent. See how many of them stand up inspired with hope and ready to vote for change.”

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By cyrena, March 30 at 8:05 pm #
(4155 comments total)

Re: Sickness that is U.S.

Bert,

I think you pointed out the ideological gulf in your suggestion (again) of what a ‘winner’ is, or even in what a ‘winning’ mentality is, and Leefeller made that clear enough in his own response.

These ARE in fact all opinions, (from all of us) and have everything to do with our individual ideologies, most often framed by our individual life experiences, our social experiences, and our own genetic (primarily our psychological) make-up.

But the real ‘difference’ here, (one of them) is in how one defines ‘winner’. You have (as many people represented here, and even more that I’ve known in my own life time) a ME/I conception of ‘win’ and what it means to ‘win’ rather than a ‘we/us’ conception of what a win actually means, conceptually/theoretically.

As a result, you are very much into the ‘ends justify the means’ mentality, EVEN WHEN THE ‘ENDS’ HAVEN’T PROVEN TO BE A GENUINE ‘WIN’. So, for you, (as with the large ‘other’ that represents the current far right radical movement of the Cheney regime,) it becomes a ‘whatever it takes’ to ‘win’. But even as you promote the movement, (and the means) you don’t have a correlated or otherwise integrated conception of what that ‘win’ actually is. At the very least, it’s throwing the baby out with the bathwater, and at worst, it leads to the destruction of the whole.

So, you rant and rave at me, call me a Social Elitist, (which is a joke that anyone who knows me would find overwhelmingly amusing in a sardonic sort of a way, since my own ideology is the very antithesis of anything that smells of ‘elitist’). And yet, you have no conception or comprehension of what a ‘winning’ mentality is in my own ideology.

That’s why you weren’t able to comprehend my comment of appreciation for the intelligence displayed by my fellow citizens, in being able to utilize their intellects for the greater good. In other words, our growing COLLECTIVE ability to see through the bullshit, and to exercise good sense for…the greater good.

This is, and I would say unarguably, a huge improvement over a collective society that at least ostensibly, elected a gangster regime that has high-jacked our nation, and taken us all hostage. (or maybe just 99% of us). And, we’ve been held hostage for damn year 8 years now, with none of the standard rescue tools (always available from the beginning of this experiment) having been put to use. (IMPEACHMENT).

So, even while we can (and should) accept and acknowledge that these gangsters were never actually ‘elected’ or appointed –by the people- we also have to accept and acknowledge that ENOUGH of us DID succumb to what can only be considered a lack of knowledge or other information in respect to what is best for our individual and collective interests.

MY comment was to say (though I wouldn’t have expected you to ‘get’ that perspective) that I’m hopefully encouraged and PROUD of the fact that more and more of us ARE ‘getting’ it. And that a ‘winning attitude’ in my opinion, means a unified and appropriately INFORMED populace. I see that developing, and I’m smart enough myself, to know that my OWN prosperity and ‘salvation’ along with that of my loved ones/friends/family/neighbors/etc, is 100% dependant on the welfare of every single other citizen. It does NOT help any one or few of us to ‘be smart’ or to ‘be educated’ or to have health care, or to have housing, or any of the rest of it, if we don’t ALL have it, at least to the measure that allows us to all thrive.

So for me, THAT’S the winning attitude.

End of rant.

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By bert, March 31 at 3:30 pm #
(686 comments total)

Re: Re: Sickness that is U.S.

EVEN WHEN THE ‘ENDS’ HAVEN’T PROVEN TO BE A GENUINE ‘WIN’.

Let me try and understand what you are saying. Is this statement a kin with Donald Rumsfeld’s , know unknowns and unknown knows? Kinda sounds like it.

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By jimmyjam, March 30 at 10:18 am #
(140 comments total)

Re: Sickness that is U.S.

Great post

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By Leefeller, March 30 at 9:36 am #
(1232 comments total)

Re: Sickness that is U.S.

Defining the attitude of a winner?  Sure you could conjure up your definition for me.
Using the cyrena post has little meaning in the reality of anyone else’s opinion except hers, you should know that.  Everyone of our posted opinions are just that, opinions to agree or disagree with as we please.  By the way that includes your opinions also. 

Just like the Wright blitz, now your association of opinion has become an argument in your mind, of course the Hillary side is not devisive and right not just Wright. 

If indeed you premise is correct about the blue-collar folks, our country is worthy in degrees of Wright’s blunt truths. My opinion even if Obama wins.

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By Bill Blackolive, March 30 at 7:28 am #
(Unregistered commenter)

I'm with Cyrena

on this one, because organised religion is this idiotic attempt by caged humans to believe Spirit can be organized, like Earth’s Ocean or space or eternity or infinity of dimension.

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By Leefeller, March 30 at 7:10 am #
(1232 comments total)

Simple minds think not

Just a reminder, Wright is not running for president.  If he is given a house for some reason by his church, you feel the crushing need to mention in a white neighborhood, has anything to do with the presidential campaign. Please enlighten me.

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By bert, March 30 at 9:09 am #
(686 comments total)

Re: Simple minds think not

Geez Leefeller. I thought you would get that.

Rev. Wright says gd white America and the chickens came home to roost for white America and he preaches and his church supports black liberation theology.

Don’t you think its just a little itsy-bitsy teenie weenie hypocritical to then build a white elite style mansion and go live among the dirty rich white elite rich man neighborhood that you ranted about for so long?

Especially when all those poor people living in run down houses in Obama’s old IL state senate district, and I might add, much of Rev. Wright’s church neighborhood are still living in the slums that Obama friend Rezko took millons of tax payer dollars to upgrade and didn’t. Gee, think he could help those people who REALLY need it instead of lining his pockets and living in wealth after ranting about American not helping AA.

By their actions shall you know them.

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By Leefeller, March 30 at 10:43 am #
(1232 comments total)

Re: Re: Simple minds think not

Religion and money go hand in hand, why do you find that surprising? 

Your association with Obama to Rezko, may be similar to your connection him to Wright, not accurate and out of context.

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By Lee, March 30 at 7:38 am #
(118 comments total)

Re: Simple minds think not

In response to your request for enlightenment ...

We are not electing the president of the local Chamber of Commerce here ... we’re electing the next President of the United States of America! A person who could determine the future of this planet, and everyone on it! Therefore, any long-standing, important associations, or beliefs held by the nominee, or his self proclaimed advisors, mentors, etc. are crucial.

Obama’s 20 year association, and his family’s association with Pastor Wright, who has preached anti-American, racist beliefs, and honored one of the worst racists in America, has consistently talked against whites, the middle class value system, mixing with whites, materialism, as well as individuals getting special treatment, while the rest of their community struggles.

Well, guess what? For Pastor Wright to act in a way which goes against what he’s preached for 20 years, puts his credibility in question. And for Obama to embrace Wright and his values for 20 years, puts Obama’s credibility in question.

We don’t know a whole lot about Obama, except what HE tells us about who he is. One of the biggest thing he’s told us is that Wright was not only his Pastor for 20 years ... but also his mentor, advisor, source of his books title ... etc..
Just because it’s now politically expedient to disavow Wright, doesn’t mean his relationship with Wright, and what Wright stands for, isn’t still an extremely important consideration. So far, who Obama is ... who Wright is ... and the extent of their relationship has not been answered to the satisfaction of the majority of American people ... that’s why this issue is not simply going away.

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By lib in texas, March 30 at 7:20 am #
(293 comments total)

Re: Simple minds think not/ Leefeller

No Wright is not running for pres but someone whom Wright is a MENTOR to, is running.  There in lies the PROBLEM which I know your blinded eyes and simple mind can’t see.

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By bert, March 30 at 6:54 am #
(686 comments total)

Reply to: jimmyjam

Re: WHO’S THE RACIST?
“Well and good but he should practice what he preaches,Disavowal of the Pursuit of “Middleclassness.”

No “Disavowal of the Pursuit of “Middleclassness.” in that million dollar home in a classy white neighborhood that his church some how paid for.

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By jimmyjam, March 30 at 7:14 am #
(140 comments total)

Re: Reply to: jimmyjam

Actually it is a 50 50 split on the ethnicity’s of the Odyssey country club, he does have 2 lots and no one else on the street

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By bert, March 30 at 6:48 am #
(686 comments total)

Reply to jimmyjam

Thank you for talking about Anthony Bradley. I have never mentioned him here at TD, but I have wanted to.

OBTW - wonderful, great even, comeback to Cyrena. I love to hear the soind of hammer meeting head of a nail.

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By AnAmericaninGermany, March 30 at 6:45 am #
(9 comments total)

scared...

Seems to me.. you are ALL scared of whichever person has an opposite opinion or experience than your own.
To classify the “white” or “black” or “gay” or whatever experience as a general path that all people of that group have taken is not only ludicrous, it is self defeting.

Get it together people…

united we stand, divided we fall… and boy… are we divided

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By Leefeller, March 30 at 6:51 am #
(1232 comments total)

Re: scared...

Bigotry, from hate to scared, is one division that so supports status quo.

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By Fadel Abdallah, March 30 at 6:19 am #
(382 comments total)

Here’s a consciousness white American telling the truth about racism in America! Just a few paragraphs from an article by Tim Wise entitled, “Whites Like Me: Reflections on Race from a Privileged Son.” This article originally appeared in “lip”.
========================================
Of National Lies and Racial America
By TIM WISE

For most white folks, indignation just doesn’t wear well. Once affected or conjured up, it reminds one of a pudgy man, wearing a tie that may well have fit him when he was fifty pounds lighter, but which now cuts off somewhere above his navel and makes him look like an idiot.
Indignation doesn’t work for most whites, because having remained sanguine about, silent during, indeed often supportive of so much injustice over the years in this country--the theft of native land and genocide of indigenous persons, and the enslavement of Africans being only two of the best examples--we are just a bit late to get into the game of moral rectitude. And once we enter it, our efforts at righteousness tend to fail the test of sincerity.
But here we are, in 2008, fuming at the words of Pastor Jeremiah Wright, of Trinity United Church of Christ in Chicago--occasionally Barack Obama’s pastor, and the man whom Obama credits with having brought him to Christianity--for merely reminding us of those evils about which we have remained so quiet, so dismissive, so unconcerned. It is not the crime that bothers us, but the remembrance of it, the unwillingness to let it go--these last words being the first ones uttered by most whites it seems whenever anyone, least of all an “angry black man” like Jeremiah Wright, foists upon us the bill of particulars for several centuries of white supremacy.
But our collective indignation, no matter how loudly we announce it, cannot drown out the truth. And as much as white America may not be able to hear it (and as much as politics may require Obama to condemn it) let us be clear, Jeremiah Wright fundamentally told the truth.
Oh I know that for some such a comment will seem shocking. After all, didn’t he say that America “got what it deserved” on 9/11? And didn’t he say that black people should be singing “God Damn America” because of its treatment of the African American community throughout the years?
Well actually, no he didn’t.
Wright said not that the attacks of September 11th were justified, but that they were, in effect, predictable. Deploying the imagery of chickens coming home to roost is not to give thanks for the return of the poultry or to endorse such feathered homecoming as a positive good; rather, it is merely to note two things: first, that what goes around, indeed, comes around--a notion with longstanding theological....

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By Leefeller, March 30 at 6:41 am #
(1232 comments total)

Indignations and lies

Great post Fadel Abdallah,

It is even more than ignorance, indignations covered in lies is a large part of U.S.  At home and around the world. 

What astounds me, is controlled and manipulated people of U.S. constantly vote against themselves, being fed a constant diet of lies, enhancing ignorance boosted by indignation. 

So we have the “pudgy man, wearing a tie that may well have fit him when he was fifty pounds lighter”

Astuteness requires comprehension, sadly most are incapable of either.

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By Jack, March 30 at 5:49 am #
(Unregistered commenter)

In the USA if you are half -black you are considered Black.  Every African-American has a percentage of European ancestry due the the sexual exploitation of Black women during and after slavery. S0me Blacks have a small percentage of Native- American and European ancestry.  The recent PBS series African -American lives showed this.  The show demonstrated that nearly all Blacks have 15-40 percent European ancestry.  Due to this rule (one drop) there are no white people named Washington or Jefferson. These two presidents had children with their slave women and whites back in those days did not want to be mistaken for one of his Black children which would have open them up to racism, loss of income, rejection , lynchings etc. This tradition of white men impregnating/raping Black women continued till modern times (Strom Thurmon). It is interesting and surprising that he actually kept in touch with her but white men having such superior status would never be questioned by society.

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By cyrena, March 30 at 7:26 pm #
(4155 comments total)

Re:

Thanks Jack, for this mention of the PBS special. I’d missed it. Sounds very helpful to some of my own on-going research.

As for what you’ve posted here..yep..it’s all true.

If we can eventually divorce ourselves from the emotional rhetoric of the hate (and ignorance) that creates the problem, and just approach the HOW and WHY from an established collection of FACTS, then it would be a start.

I don’t know if that’s possible.

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By omop, March 30 at 5:06 am #
(120 comments total)

The old adage attributed to a native - american is the most oertinent and appropriate way to communicate the point that anyone who has never been judged or considered or treated habitually in a manner reflecting a bias, prejudice or the petultimate state of being a slave or the equivalent a pet of the white race… will never really know what racism is all about.

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By Leefeller, March 29 at 7:59 pm #
(1232 comments total)

Ammo clerks wanted

While you guys are applying for jobs with the military complex, we have Wright running for president, at least according to the Hillary crowd. 

My only hope is the Clintons will run for governor of New York, and promote the spritzer whore houses, with as little class, as as the Clinton’s can muster, well then the red phone could become an icon of prestigious ill-repute.

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By lib in texas, March 30 at 5:50 am #
(293 comments total)

Re: Ammo clerks wanted/Leefeller

Where does such hate come from?  Have the Clinton’s personally done something to you ?  The ones you need to get after is the Bush regime!!!

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By bert, March 30 at 6:40 am #
(686 comments total)

Reply to lininTX and jimmyjam

Both excellent and true points. Right on.

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By jimmyjam, March 30 at 6:08 am #
(140 comments total)

Re: Re: Ammo clerks wanted/Leefeller

Libs can’t go after Bush. They call him the dumb one ,,hahahaha he has beaten every liberal item since he got in. Who is the idiot.

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By ocjim, March 29 at 7:58 pm #
(356 comments total)

Racism Still Here

Reagan used the resentment against civil rights and affirmative action to paint blacks as welfare queens, etc. Bush II just neglected and ignored all of the poor and vulnerable. The radical right exploits the vestiges still there.

The radical right media has strafed the Obama campaign, including Fox TV News (Noise, according to Keith Olberman) and those of the Rush Limbaugh stripe. Their spurious and racist comments and images are designed to ambush their willing audiences with a fear/resentment-inspired negative image of Obama and his campaign.

Youtube has compiled a sample of the most recent Fox News videos and quotes from commentators like O’Reilly, Hannity, and a number of minion FoxNoiseians, giving real statements and the fear or stereotype.

Examples: 1) The reason he (Obama) is considered such a big deal is because he is a black candidate, obviously using resentment against affirmative action. 2)Half of the kids under five years old are minorities. Black folks having babies without being married.It suggests indiscriminate breeding of Blacks and relates to the underlying engenics issue of spreading inferior genes. 3)Look what they did with the Dome. They turned it into a ghetto. This excuses Katrina neglect of black victims. Blacks seen as a culpable destructive, even criminal element, maybe even deserving. 4)They will get up every day and kill someone and have chicken at KFC. Lawlessness of Blacks and favorite food stereotype. 5)Obama’s middle name is Hussein. He is a Muslim. Association with al Quaeda and extremists. 6)Trinity Church in Chicago is where Obama calls home. Are they worshipping Christ? They are cultish. Involves association with unfamiliar religion, including Islam.

The stereotypes and the fears associated with them have been real in American culture for many years. Many feel that the Republican party has bet its ascendency on utilizing stereotypes, resentment and fear, especially in capturing southern states. Resentment of LBJ’s Great Society and the civil rights movement of the 1960’s gave the new conservative movement a common cause and a rallying cry.

People have become weary with cries of racism, but vestiges have always been there. The adjectives to describe Black people have not changed too much since the 1930s, including lazy, superstitious, ignorant, loud, poor and criminal. Mocking black language is also a favorite demonization method, something already used by Karl Rove in the Wall Street Journal, relating Obama to rap, trash-talk, basketball, and laziness.

Media’s contribution includes television depicting blacks as poor nearly twice as often as the true incidence: actually account for 29 percent of poor but are depicted as poor in excess of 50 percent of cases, and lawlessness is often associated with blacks in cop shows. According to Lawrence Grossman, former president of CBS News and PBS, TV newscasts “disproportionately show African-Americans under arrest, living in slums, on welfare, and in need of help from the community.”

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By cyrena, March 29 at 10:39 pm #
(4155 comments total)

Re: Racism Still Here

• “Many feel that the Republican party has bet its ascendency on utilizing stereotypes, resentment and fear, especially in capturing southern states.”

It’s true ocjim. And thanks for the entire post. (I had to gag through the part from Foxnoisians, but hey…it was better than having to watch it first hand).

Still, this tactic of employing the stereotypes and the fears associated with them is of course, (as you say) NOT NEW. And, while it may ‘especially’ effect the southern states, it’s also gonna grab ANY OTHER individual or group of society, that has been rendered ignorant by the way our society has intentionally (or unintentionally) been structured from the beginning.

In other words, anybody who has been left uneducated and/or otherwise unexposed to the realities that would DISPEL these stereotypes, (and prevent them from being perpetrated) can and will likely fall victim to the tactics.

They ONLY see, hear, experience what the media puts out there. OR, they have (as Obama mentioned) SOME legitimate fears. Such as crime ridden neighborhoods that often include black people. They don’t know or understand WHY these neighborhoods that suffer high crime rates might involve more black folks, and they don’t have the opportunities to compare or otherwise recognize that the same crimes, (or worse) are perpetrated by an equal or larger number of whites.

The fact is that far too many Americans simply live out their days without ever really experiencing the realities, and so they have nothing more to base anything on, aside from the stereotypes that these media hate mongers stir up.

Still, these tactics of the FOXES remain dangerous. What they actually amount to, is the 21st Century version of what creates a lynch mob, OR WORSE. It’s a matter of hysteria building, playing on and off of visceral human gut emotion that is totally divorced from reason and logic.

Far too many examples of this can be found in the many occasions of lynchings and race riots of history. M