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Obama and the Jews

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Posted on Feb 28, 2008
Obama-kah
jewsforobama.blogspot.com

Introducing the “Obama-kah”: Volunteers from a New York City pro-Obama group created “Obama ‘08” yarmulkes, an “idea developed by a group of volunteers who believe in wearing their politics on their sleeve, or, in this case, keppe.”

By Bill Boyarsky

The bad side of being a new face in politics is that your enemies can treat you like a blank slate, to be filled in with lies and slurs. That’s what is happening to Sen. Barack Obama, who is being subjected to a secretive whispering and e-mail campaign that aims to alienate him from Jewish voters by linking him to Black Muslim leader Louis Farrakhan and the Muslim religion.

Farrakhan, a demagogic anti-Semite, is the leading character in a smear effort that is gaining in intensity as the Democratic presidential primary election between Obama and Sen. Hillary Clinton approaches in Ohio on Tuesday. Clinton and Obama face each other in Texas the same day in another close contest. Bill Clinton says his wife must win both to stay in the race.

Jews make up only 2 percent of the vote in Ohio, but they are committed to going to the polls and their numbers could tilt a close election. And polls indicate that Obama’s race against Clinton in Ohio is tight. But, just as important, the smears are racing through the nation on the Internet. In a milder form, they have made it to the pages of some conservative publications.

The situation was serious enough for Obama to meet with about 100 members of the Cleveland Jewish community on Sunday, Feb. 24. His campaign staff gave a transcript of the meeting to The New York Sun.

“Let’s just be very specific about what these e-mails have been,” Obama said. “And they have just been virulent and started very early ... they are clearly political in the sense that they go in waves. ... Suddenly they magically appear in great volume in whatever state it is we are campaigning. And the e-mails suggest that A. that I am Muslim, B. that I went to a madrassa [an Islamic religious school] C. that I used a Koran to swear myself into the Senate D. That I don’t pledge allegiance to the flag. There are all sorts of variations, but you get the general gist.

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“If anyone is still puzzled about the facts, in fact I have never been a Muslim ... the school that I attended in Indonesia ... was not a madrassa but was a secular school. ... My grandfather who was Kenyan converted to Christianity then converted to Islam, my father never practiced he was basically agnostic and so other than my name and the fact that I lived in a populous Muslim country for 4 years when I was a child I have very little connection to the Islamic religion. But these are the kind of things that you deal with in politics.”

Polifact, a political fact-finding Web site produced by the St. Petersburg Times and Congressional Quarterly, noted that Obama is a Christian and took his Senate oath of office on his own personal Bible.

The Jewish newspaper The Forward said the e-mails were directed at “frightened, angry Jews, thousands of them, determined to stop anyone they suspect is against them. Once they get going, no one can talk them out of it. They feel powerless and vulnerable before enemies great and small, and they have the clout to do something about it.  And they don’t always check the details before hitting the barricades.”

The campaign is so outrageous that in mid-January, The Forward said, top officials of nine national Jewish organizations condemned the “attempt to drive a wedge between our community and a presidential candidate based on despicable and false attacks and innuendo based on religion.” Seven Jewish U.S. senators issued a similar message.

Critics link Obama to Farrakhan through the senator’s minister, the Rev. Jeremiah A. Wright Jr. of Chicago’s Trinity United Church of Christ. The church’s Trumpet Newsmagazine, edited by Wright’s daughter, bestowed on Farrakhan its Dr. Jeremiah A. Wright Jr. Trumpeter award. Washington Post columnist Richard Cohen, noting the magazine said that Farrakhan “truly epitomized greatness,” asked of Obama, “Where is his sense of outrage?”

Farrakhan has endorsed Obama. On this week’s MSNBC television debate in Cleveland, the senator was asked about the endorsement.

“You know, I have been very clear in my denunciation of Minister Farrakhan’s anti-Semitic comments,” Obama said. “I think that they are unacceptable and reprehensible. I did not solicit this support.”

Sen. Clinton said, “There’s a difference between denouncing and rejecting. And I think when it comes to this ... we’ve got to be even stronger.” Obama replied, “I don’t see a difference between denouncing and rejecting. ... But if the word reject Senator Clinton feels is [stronger] than the word denounce, then I’m happy to concede the point. And I would reject and denounce.”

Arnold Steinberg, a Republican political consultant active in conservative and Jewish affairs, said that Obama, rather than “hem and haw,” should have quickly and instinctively used the word reject.

Obama’s foes also are trying to portray him as hostile to Israel, saying he is relying on advice from Zbigniew Brzezinski, President Jimmy Carter’s national security adviser. Some Israel supporters consider Carter and Brzezinski hostile to Israel. 

“I know Brzezinski,” Obama told the Jewish community members in Cleveland. “He’s not one of my key advisers. I’ve had lunch with him once, I’ve exchanged e-mails with him maybe three times. He came to Iowa to introduce me for a speech on Iraq. ... I do not share his views on Israel. I have said so clearly and unequivocally.”

A top Obama adviser, former Rep. Mel Levine of California, told me he has “very little doubt that some of Hillary’s supporters and even her campaign itself is perpetuating” the Brzezinski line of attack on Obama.

Levine, a former member of the board of the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC), said the attacks are “a problem. Some people are trying to define him [Obama] in a way that is completely innuendo. The Jewish community that know him best is the Jewish community of Chicago [Obama’s home], and they love him. That isn’t as well known outside of Chicago. ... As his record becomes more widely known, it will be less of a problem.”

Rob Eshman, editor of the Jewish Journal of Greater Los Angeles, said the fact that Obama is just coming under heavy scrutiny makes him susceptible to assaults on issues such as Israel.

“He’s an unknown on a lot of issues,” Eshman said. “He doesn’t have a long track record, and on Israel, a candidate’s position is put under a microscope.”

So far, Obama is capturing a substantial part of the Jewish vote. On Super Tuesday, exit polls showed him beating Clinton 49 percent to 47 percent in California among Jewish voters. He received 61 percent of the Jewish vote in Connecticut and 52 percent in Massachusetts. Clinton beat him among Jews in New Jersey, Arizona and her home state of New York.

Ohio will be another test of the power of the anti-Obama campaign among Jews. If he wins the nomination, the real test will come in the fall.


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By geronimo, March 1, 2008 at 9:20 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Goes To Show That Zionism Is The Jew’s Worst Enemy


Setting Jews up for the anti-Semitic backlash that very well could take place once public opinion finally forces President Bush to call off the Iraq war.  What’ll happen is that our president might try to cover his ass by saying something like “Yes, I lied and our troops died but I did it to protect Israel.” 

Oh he wouldn’t do that?  Yeh, and he wouldn’t lie us into a blood for oil war, would he?

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 9:11 pm Link to this comment

Maani, I’ve gotta hand it to you. You practice AUDACITY better than whomever invented the word.

So, I can’t do your work on Dershowitz. You’ll just have to google your little heart out, because there’s no way even YOU could have missed this, if you have in fact done any research on Dershie.

And, I’ve got my own work to do.

Sorry. I guess you just won’t get to be ‘in the know’ on this one.

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 9:07 pm Link to this comment

Did you say, GET READY for the crash?

troublesum, I think you’re indulging in some delusions of your own.

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 9:03 pm Link to this comment

It’s very depressing to admit it mackTN, but I have to stay attached to reality. So, I’m now feeling the same way about Obama.

I’m willing to indulge in one fragile hope, and that is that for the moment, this might be the only thing he can do…(nothing). To say anything at this point, would prevent him from getting to a position to do anything later.

Doesn’t excuse it, but that’s still my indulgence.

Then, I just thought of something else. Obama simply doesn’t have the power. He doesn’t have to keep approving funding for this, and he damn sure didn’t have to ‘add to’ his previous statement on the Palestinian suffering, as he apparently recently did.

But at the moment, he has no power to do anything. Hillary has far more leverage, at least according to what she claims as 35 years experience. But, he can’t do anything now while these thugs are in charge.

Meantime, here’s another shoe.

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By troublesum, March 1, 2008 at 8:34 pm Link to this comment

No, I did not make any of this up.  These are all positions which Obama has publicly taken.  Like many of his supporters you are not paying attention.  McCain, Clinton, and Obama all have similar positions on these issues.  The public is marginalized so much so that most people do not seem to realize that the major candidates have taken positions which are the oppose of what people say they want.  The campaign is entertainment meant to distract people from the knowledge that what they want doesn’t matter.

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By Maani, March 1, 2008 at 6:32 pm Link to this comment

Cyrena:

“Keep in mind that Alan Dershowitz is the foreign policy adviser for Hillary Clinton.”

I have provided substantial support for my claim that ZB is not only on Obama’s foreign policy team, but is, in fact, a “key” if not “top” advisor.  I have also done extensive research re Dershowitz, and have found nothing more than that he endorsed Hillary.

Thus, please provide substantiation of your claim that he is “the foreign policy advisor for Hillary Clinton” - or, since you think I play semantics, even “a” foreign policy advisor for Clinton.

Thank you.

Peace.

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By Leefeller, March 1, 2008 at 5:31 pm Link to this comment

My sentiments also.  Instead of crows, I would prefer to call them buzzards dividing up the carcas. Crows get what is left. Good points mackTN.

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By mackTN, March 1, 2008 at 5:18 pm Link to this comment

Why is it that whenever an article about the Jews is written a flock of crows begins cawing neverending comments? 

Obama is almost too moderate for me, and I guess I am now considered an old-time hippie leftwing radical progressive.  Both Obama and Clinton continue to give Bush outrageous cash for this war without a struggle and i still don’t get it.  At least ask for an accounting—to whom is this money going? 

Of course, Israel wants us to colonize Iraq and to be there forever with our guns at the ready should any A-Rabs get restless.  Thus Clinton & Obama’s response about protecting American interests and not putting up with any foolishness—cake accepted and consumed.  Take for instance that ridiculous base that was built over there for billions and billions—amazing that we can build a multibillion dollar base in Iraq but we can’t put New Orleans back together again. 

Off with my shoe!

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 5:09 pm Link to this comment

Maani,

I’ve just agreed with Non Credo in that Obama is backtracking, and yes…obviously for political expediency.

I say that ONLY in reference to his changed comments about the Palestinians, where he now seems willing to blame the Palestinians leaders, INSTEAD of the Israelis, for these never ending crimes against humanity.

So for that, I’m pissed at him. NOT as pissed as I am at the people who’ve revved up all this hate mongering, and I’m not even going to blame it on all Jews, since the secular Jews that I know, denounce this as strongly as anyone. Non, I think it’s the non-secular Christian crazies that are at the heart of this.

Meantime, I’m not even going to address the rest of your stuff. I’m delighted that Obama isn’t ‘lily-white’ and he’s never claimed to be ‘squeaky clean’ or without error. He’s also been honest in every other respect that I can think of, including the Rezko thing that you’ve mentioned a few million times. In short, he said he shouldn’t have purchased property from or in conjunction with the guy, or whatever it was that he did.

Meantime, Hillary shouldn’t have authorized a horrific and now 5 year old illegal war of aggression
against a sovereign nation of roughly 26 million innocent people, after more than a decade of debilitating sanctions against the very same nation.

If Hillary is so stupid or full of hubris that she didn’t know that her authorization was in violation of International Law, and that there was no way that Iraq was a threat to anyone, (again..I mention 8 years of war and 11 of horrific sanctions during her co-presidency that left Iraq crippled) or…she just didn’t CARE, then ya know…I don’t want her as a president. She’s already got her sights set on Iran, and now maybe even Russia.

So, I don’t have nearly the problem with Obama’s political expediency as I do with Hillary’s war on the world.

Seems like a no-brainer to me.

I AM glad that Obama has ZBig as AN advisor, and hopefully he’ll retain him for his cabinet or some other similar post when he’s elected in November.

Now I’ve gotta find my spectacles, which don’t happen to be Obama tinted. They actually have sort of a pink tinge to them.

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 4:50 pm Link to this comment

Leefeller,

I think it’s supposed to be for libertarian. (the lib).

She started out months ago as a Ron Paul cultie. Now of course she’s switched, since he doesn’t have a chance, being a crazo himself.

But you’re right, there are a bunch of these in Texas, and what they ARE, are RACISTS. Extremely IGNORANT RACISTS.

That’s how simple it is. And, I know exactly the spot she’s at, which isn’t even as rural as Texas can be. These people live in the suburbs of Dallas and the Ft. Worth areas, which are a cross between rural and suburban. But there’s no getting around the ignorant racist mentality.

So, while Obama can probably take the more progressive parts of the state, such as Austin, Houston, maybe even San Antonio, and possibly a few others, he may not have much of a showing elsewhere.

Actually, there are a few other liberals in Texas, and they’ve even produced some decent politicians in the past, though I wouldn’t call them ‘liberal’. I think center is about as close as it gets.

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 4:40 pm Link to this comment

J Nagarya…

Your substantiation is at the top….

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 4:37 pm Link to this comment

Non Credo,
You are SO CORRECT!
I only just read the article, and I almost wish I hadn’t. I’m really pissed at this, and partly at Obama.
Obama Walks a Difficult Path as He Courts Jewish Voters

•  “Mr. Obama has also faced criticism over remarks he made about the suffering of Palestinians — remarks he says were incorrectly reported — and about who is advising him on foreign affairs. And he has had to beat back false tales, spread in viral e-mail messages, that he is a Muslim who attended a madrassa in Indonesia as a boy and was sworn into office on the Koran. In fact, he is a Christian who was sworn in on a Bible.”

Because, he has changed his language; specifically in reference to the suffering of the Palestinians. Now he’s added that he blames their leaders!! THEIR LEADERS are responsible for 60 years worth of a Holocaust that’s been perpetrated against them by Israel?

Obama knows damn well better than that! Yes…he DOES. He knows that the Palestinians have in fact suffered more than anyone, and for longer than anyone, and their leaders sure as hell don’t have a major armed forces, with bombs on top of bombs, on top of bombs to drop all over the Palestinians who have been forced into open-air prisons. The Palestinians don’t have their own people locked up in prisons for years after years, and they aren’t torturing each other either.

So, Obama really has annoyed me this time.

For all the rest of it…the Muslim stuff, the alleged Madrassa, and the whole swearing on the bible thing, I blame the radical Christian right and their neocon supporters. They are one hell of an evil movement…more evil than anything there’s even been in my lifetime. These right-wing radical Judeo-Christian crazies are more dangerous than Hitler and his Nazis EVER were. There are allegedly somewhere around 40 million of these whackos, right here in the US. And no, I realize they aren’t all Jews, but they are surely behind the emails and all the rest of the tricks.

And, I don’t believe for a minute, that Hillary’s campaign hasn’t ‘cashed in’ on it. SHE damn sure knows that none of this shit is true about Obama, and she hasn’t made the slightest effort to squelch any of this.

I remember one of the very first debates, when John Edwards was still in the race, and he made it oh so abundantly clear, right there in front of whatever national audience was viewing, that if there was ANYONE who wouldn’t vote for Barack because he was black, or wouldn’t vote for Hillary because she is a woman, then HE DIDN’T WANT THEIR VOTE!

I thoroughly admire him for that, and we know we’d never, ever, in a million years, hear anything close to that from Hillary. (Obama has so far been impeccable himself on that end).

But, not on this. I’m more than a little bit disappointed that he changed his language on the statement about the Palestinians. I’m thoroughly pissed off that he thinks he has to do all of these contortions, to pay homage to 1.7 percent of the American population. (and not even that much really, because only a small percent of the actual JEWISH population is crazy enough to be threatened by this stuff).

Still, this title says that he walks a difficult path to court the Jewish vote. I appreciate that he’s willing to go through it, because I damn sure wouldn’t. On the other hand, unless he does, we don’t have a shot at anything that will check and eventually reverse (hopefully) the rapid decline of our country.

So, better him than me. I couldn’t do it. I’d be far too inclined to tell them all to just kiss my ass.

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By laughoutloud, March 1, 2008 at 3:49 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

i have to agree with troublesum.  the candidates who would have made a real impact on the dire situation in the US were intentionally excluded excluded from the large debates, forcing them to drop out because of lack of exposure.

whoever wins, wether its mccain, hillary or obama, they will keep the US on its current path, continually fighting for the elite. 

its not left or right, its rich and poor, or haves and have nots if you prefer.

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 3:41 pm Link to this comment

TO: JNagarya,

The text: “TORTURE A Collection”

Edited by Sanford Levinson
With a forward by Ariel Dorfman

Oxford University Press, 2004 ISBN 0-19-517289-2

Seventeen authors (scholars/lawyers) contributed to this collection, and there is a decision/judgment from the Supreme Court of Israel as well.

For the purposes of YOUR request for substantiation, you should access Part IV,
Reflections on the Post-September 11 Debate about Legalizing Torture.

When you get to that page, you should then reference the first article by ALAN DERSHOWITZ, entitled, “Tortured Reasoning”. Page 257.

When you finish that, you should read the next article, by Elaine Scarry, entitled “Five Errors in the Reasoning of Alan Dershowitz. page 281.

When you’ve finished those two, the statement that I made will have been substantiated.

At that point, you can choose to read the entire thing, so that you’ll have an idea what is going on in the legal field, regarding Torture Law and you’ll hopefully know not to throw accusations around because it makes you appear to be extremely stupid and uninformed. Like maybe a pseudo or wanna be legal scholar.

Keep in mind that Alan Dershowitz is the foreign policy adviser for Hillary Clinton.

As for me being a malevolent, you’re damn right I am, at least in respect to people who like to wage illegal wars of aggression, and attempt to LEGALIZE TORTURE in the process.

If the above reading hasn’t too much taxed your brain, you can read up some more on Hillary’s warmongering and aggressive tactics…

The Real Story Behind Kosovo’s Independence
  By Jeremy Scahill
  AlterNet
 
“All of a sudden, DC establishment figures care about “international law” when it suits their interests in Kosovo.”

  “ News Flash: The Bush administration acknowledges there is a such thing as international law.”

  “ But, predictably, it is not being invoked to address the US prison camps at Guantanamo, the wide use of torture, the invasion and occupation of sovereign countries, the extraordinary rendition program. No, it is being thrown out forcefully as a condemnation of the Serbian government in the wake of Thursday’s attack by protesters on the US embassy in Belgrade following the Bush administration’s swift recognition of the declaration of independence by the southern Serbian province of Kosovo. Some 1,000 protesters broke away from a largely non-violent mass demonstration in downtown Belgrade and targeted the embassy. Some protesters actually made it into the compound, setting a fire and tearing down the American flag.”

•  “I’m outraged by the mob attack against the U.S. embassy in Belgrade,” fumed Zalmay Khalilzad,the US Ambassador to the United Nations. “The embassy is sovereign US territory. The government of Serbia has a responsibility under international law to protect diplomatic facilities, particularly embassies.” His comments were echoed by a virtual who’s who of the Bill Clinton administration. People like Jamie Rubin, then-Secretary of State Madeleine Albright’s deputy, one of the main architects of US policy toward Serbia. “It is sovereign territory of the United States under international law,” Rubin declared. “For Serbia to allow these protesters to break windows, break into the American Embassy, is a pretty dramatic sign.” Hillary Clinton, whose husband orchestrated and ran the 78-day NATO bombing of Serbia in 1999, said, “I would be moving very aggressively to hold the Serbian government responsible with their security forces to protect our embassy. Under international law they should be doing that.”

PLEASE..make sure you read the rest, since it provides an excellent insight to what we could expect from the warmonger herself…who would be moving very aggressively, as she has with authorizing other aggressive acts of war and interference.


http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/022408Y.shtml

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By PatrickHenry, March 1, 2008 at 3:37 pm Link to this comment

Maybe we the people want a change of scenery in Washington.  Hillbillys have been in the spotlight for awhile and their strengths and weaknesses are well known.  They are as entrenched as their lobbys.

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By PatrickHenry, March 1, 2008 at 3:30 pm Link to this comment

No incumbents 08’

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By Maani, March 1, 2008 at 3:28 pm Link to this comment

JNagarya:

Did you catch that?  Cyrena says, “I’m perfectly well aware of points 2 thru 4 here…”

Except, there IS no “point 4!”  This just goes to show you how carefully Cyrena reads what she responds to, and the level of discourse you can expect.

Hysterical.

Peace.

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By Maani, March 1, 2008 at 3:26 pm Link to this comment

ttran:

Thank you for this.  I had noted something like this in another thread.

The Obama supporters like to claim that the GOP is more afraid of Obama than Hillary, and WANT to run against Hillary because they think she will be easier to beat, since they think it would galvanize the anti-Clinton GOP and independent votes, and give the GOP more to work with in its swift-boat and other smear tactics.

Yet, as you point out, that is not what is happening.  Rather, the GOP “makes nice” to Obama, sends Republicans out to the primaries to help Obama, and even a super-right-wing old buzzard like Rupert Murdoch endorses Obama over Hillary.

So tell me, who is the GOP actually more “scared” of: the candidate they are attempting to help get the nod, or the one they aren’t?

Obviously, the GOP sees Obama as the easier mark or they would not be spending so much time, money and energy helping Obama become the nominee.

Unfortunately, the Obamamaniacs here are too blind to see this very simply and obvious truth.

Too bad.

Peace.

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By Maani, March 1, 2008 at 3:17 pm Link to this comment

Cyrena:

“...because I know that Zbig has not been involved in his campaign from the beginning. THAT much I DO know. It’s been like 6 months, MAX. And yes, Obama DID have other advisors before Zbig came on board. So, that’s why I think it’s just more of the same spin shit.”

Excuse me?  Cyrena, the more you say, the deeper your foot goes down your throat.  You are hopeless. Now you are trying to play a “time on the team” game - as if this has ONE IOTA to do with whether Obama is lying (okay “backtracking”) re Brzesinski NOW.  He is.

“So, if Obama seems to be backtracking because of that, then he shouldn’t.”

Gee!  Was that actually an admission that Obama just might be doing something politically expedient?

“At the same time, if Brzezinski is NOT Obama’s ‘top advisor’ or his ‘key advisor’ (and he may well not be) then why does he have to be a liar for saying it?”

There is no “if”; Brzezinski has been at LEAST a “key” advisor if not Obama’s “top” foreign policy advisor for (by your reckoning) six months.  As noted, this has been confirmed by DOZENS of sources, including both MSM and AM outlets (none of whom have EVER been corrected by Obama or his staff when using that phrase), as well as members of Obama’s own team (including Samantha Power).

“So, I guess it’s in how one interprets the language. It doesn’t seem to me like Obama is distancing himself from Brzezinski, because there’s no doubt in the language that Brzezinski IS part of his team, and has been for 6 months. It must be that lawyer language.”

No, it must be that you are playing semantics here.  How can someone be part of a “team” and NOT be a key advisor?  If they are JUST “an advisor” they would NOT be considered part of a “team.”  If ZB is - as you yourself say there is “no doubt” - “part of his team,” then ipso facto he is a key advisor.

“I guess Maani would have felt better if Obama had just claimed Zbig as his TOP advisor, even if he isn’t. Take that back…he’d call him a liar for lying about that, and would come out with another name for who the ‘top/key’ adviser actually is.”

Insupportable accusations are neither helpful nor germane.  I do not want Obama to lie IN ANY CASE. Period.  Apparently, you have little or no problem with it. [N.B. You STILL haven’t responded re his even more BLATANT lie, told during an earlier debate, about his “only” connection to Tony Rezko being “5 hours” spent as a “junion attorney” on “one case,” when he had not only worked closely with Rezko for months on a real estate deal, but also accepted tens of thousands of dollars in campaign contributions from him.  Wheedle your way out of THAT one!]

“There’s just no way to satisfy an Obama hater.”

And there is equally no way to open the eyes of an Obama supporter wearing Barack-tinted spectacles.

Peace.

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 3:04 pm Link to this comment

JNagarya…

I’m perfectly well aware of points 2 thru 4 here, and in just a moment, I’ll substantiate what I just said about Dershie wanting to legalize it.

OF COURSE TORTURE IS PROHIBITED under at least a half dozen, (if not more) provisions of International Law.

So, save your lecture on it for the students, not the professors.

I didn’t say that torture ‘could be made legal’ but there are a whole HOST of legal prohibitions that have been ‘made legal’ under this gangster regime, in case you hadn’t noticed.

Now, I will check for the The title, the date, the copywrite, and the ISBN for you, so that you can read for yourself, what arguments Dershowitz has made, to bring torture into the legal system, at least the domestic legal system. Based on his argument, torture is going to be practiced anyway, (and unless you’ve been in a coma for the past 7 years, you’ll note that it HAS been practiced…specifically by the USA, in various locations) so, according to him, we might as well legalize it.

Now, I’ll get back to you with that, but if you don’t want to wait, why not try to google Dershowitz and the torture debate, and see if you can read it for yourself.

The ‘pseudo law’ isn’t from me, but rather folks like John Yoo, Alan Dershowitz, and all the rest of the folks that create these memo’s at the OLC.

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By troublesum, March 1, 2008 at 2:31 pm Link to this comment

Barak Obama is Herbert Hoover not FDR.  Get ready for the crash.

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By Leefeller, March 1, 2008 at 2:25 pm Link to this comment

I believe you really meant to say McCain, or you got your speeches mixed up. Or as your name implies, you make crap up for the hell of it.

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By troublesum, March 1, 2008 at 2:24 pm Link to this comment

FYI GAME PLAN was written after the fall of the Soviet Union and put forward a plan of action for the US to become the dominant, unquestioned and unnopposed power in the world.  The neo-cons loved it.

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By troublesum, March 1, 2008 at 2:18 pm Link to this comment

Obama supporters are hopeless.  If he really wanted to change things fundamentally he wouldn’t be the front runner.  The corporate media would have destroyed him long ago.  He wants to increase the defense budjet which is already at a record high; he was apologizing yesterday for once having referred to Palestinians as human beings in a speech; he says he will not change our policy in the Middle East; he will not take the country out of NAFTA or other trade agreements; he says he will never support single payer universal health care for all Americans even though that is what a majority wants; he does not support an immediate withdrawal of US forces from Iraq; he wants to maintain the military bases being built in Iraq for decades to come; he wants to go on using mercenary forces like Blackwater; he is opposed to the return to a more progressive tax policy.  What the hell is he going to change - the drapes, the carpeting, the furniture??

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By Leefeller, March 1, 2008 at 2:14 pm Link to this comment

Not sure but if Lib is short for liberation, your oxymoron is equal if not superior to Maani’s. He claims to be a liberal evangelical pastor or preacher.  Boy the Oxymoron’s seem to keep on coming,  if you mean enhanced by many or liberal hateful spews, just a different interpretation of liberal, I guess.  Do, you guys have cards printed?

In your case Lib in Texas, the only thing liberal that seems to be coming from behind your heavily padlocked closet door is plenty of liberal space between your ears. 

Just so happen to know one liberal in Texas and I am not talking about Hightower, even though he may be the only other one.

If Obama wins in Texas, I will be surprised.

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By PatrickHenry, March 1, 2008 at 2:09 pm Link to this comment

It explains to me why non-religious zionist jews act more like a cult than anything else.

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 1:41 pm Link to this comment

You could be right Non Credo. I guess it can be interpreted that way, but I figure if the guy says that he’s met with him, and spoken to him via e-mail, and had himself introduced by him at the very first caucus
in Iowa, it just doesn’t seem like he’s ‘distancing’ himself…in my own interpretation.

Now, that’s just my own, because I know that Zbig has not been involved in his campaign from the beginning. THAT much I DO know. It’s been like 6 months, MAX. And yes, Obama DID have other advisors before Zbig came on board.

So, that’s why I think it’s just more of the same spin shit. That’s not to say that the Israel Lobby hasn’t scared him, which is pretty amazing, since there is no ‘evidence’ of the other stupid subjective innuendo that Zbig is either ‘hostile’ or ‘cool’ toward Israel. I mean, as a foreign policy person, he’d certainly have REASON to be, just like all of the other Jews that I know, who happen to be foreign policy experts. For ANYBODY who simply studies international law/foreign policy/geopolitical relations, these past 60 years are pretty clear. And if a nation, ANY nation, practices a non-stop genocide, crimes against humanity, crimes against peace, etc, etc..THEY’RE GONNA GET NOTICED, and not in an especially good light!

Still, I’ve don’t know how and who decided that Brzezinski was ‘cool’ or ‘hostile’ toward Israel, but of course, it doesn’t take much.

Meantime, I’ve decided that AIPAC’s bullying gangster tactics might actually backfire this time. There are too many voters who don’t much care about who might be ‘cool’ to Israel, and who might not.

So, if Obama seems to be backtracking because of that, then he shouldn’t. At the same time, if Brzezinski is NOT Obama’s ‘top advisor’ or his ‘key advisor’ (and he may well not be) then why does he have to be a liar for saying it?

I think that’s the part that just continues to piss me off. First it was the Muslim thing, and everybody gets pissed off, because Obama says he’s NOT Muslim.

Ah! He must be a liar! Why is he denying it? Well, maybe because…HE’S NOT A MUSLIM!

You get my drift here, right?

So, I guess it’s in how one interprets the language. It doesn’t seem to me like Obama is distancing himself from Brzezinski, because there’s no doubt in the language that Brzezinski IS part of his team, and has been for 6 months. It must be that lawyer language.

I guess Maani would have felt better if Obama had just claimed Zbig as his TOP advisor, even if he isn’t. Take that back…he’d call him a liar for lying about that, and would come out with another name for who the ‘top/key’ adviser actually is.

There’s just no way to satisfy an Obama hater. So, hopefully they’ll start preparing for the move to Israel, (or wherever) since Obama will be elected by the other 95% of Americans who don’t have these issues with language, or Israel, or Zbig.

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By jackpine savage, March 1, 2008 at 12:32 pm Link to this comment

Don’t confuse the popular conception of the Carter Doctrine with its reality.  It did not state that we could do whatever we wanted; it stated that we would not allow an “outside” interest to meddle in the middle east.  That was an explicit warning to the Soviet Union. 

Brzezinski understood/stands the Greatest Game quite well.  On the other hand, most of what gets referenced about him is in relation to a threat that no longer exists.  Furthermore, if he had one serious fault, it was that he was a Pole.  Like Albright, he had a visceral and emotional hatred of the Soviet Union; it clearly clouded his judgment at times.

And the ideas in “Game Plan” et al, are not new.  The grand chessboard has been a playground for rulers and nations for a long time.

While not suggesting that you should like or admire Brzezinski, it should be noted that he’s one of the few foreign policy gurus to come right out and call the GWOT a sham.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article19437.htm

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By Douglas Chalmers, March 1, 2008 at 12:09 pm Link to this comment

By omop, March 1: ”...just vote as an American… Or is it time for the 50 to Balkanize themselves… tell those obsessed with their ethnicity/religion to emigrate to their ethnic country of choice…”

Then why is the USA supporting this Balkanization/ ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians by Israel???

Abbas: Gaza attacks ‘a holocaust’ - The latest attacks mark the fourth day of Israel’s bombardment of the Gaza Strip…

The Palestinian president has accused Israel of “international terrorism”, saying its assault on Gaza constitutes “more than a holocaust”.

Mahmoud Abbas’s comments on Saturday came as more Israeli air raids brought the total death toll over four days to 78 people, at least a third of which have been children, according to medical sources….


Children killed - Rana el-Hindi from Save the Children, speaking from inside the Gaza Strip, told Al Jazeera children were suffering greatly from the Israeli bombardment.

“In the last three days at least 19 children have been killed…. it’s a real concern for all organisations here,” she said.

“Most of the time, when we go into the field and talk to the children about their fears and concerns, they are always afraid of a new [Israeli] invasion to the Gaza Strip - and obviously the current situation is just ... what they fear.”

She said the number of children being hospitalised was increasing “day after day”.

Eissam Younis, director of the Al Mizan Centre for Human Rights in Gaza, told Al Jazeera that the Israeli army was “intentionally and systematically targeting civilians” and criticised world powers for their muted response.

“Israel puts itself above the law because the international community is always silent,” he said.

Missile attacks

ALSO:- Israel killed 46 Palestinians on Saturday….. At least 81 Palestinians have been killed since Wednesday in intense Israeli air strikes and ground raids in the tiny Hamas-controlled territory, home to 1.5 million people, bordering Israel, Egypt and the Mediterranean….

As many as two dozen civilians died in the fighting, including at least two babies and two other children…. Gaza Health Ministry official Dr. Moaiya Hassanain said 160 people were wounded and 14 were in critical condition…..

“We tell the world, watch and judge what’s happening, and judge who is committing ... terrorism,” said Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas….. The spike in violence came just days before Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice was to arrive in the region on her latest peacekeeping mission…....

Israel launched air and ground operations in northern Gaza on Wednesday…. The Israeli military said it targeted at least 23 armed Palestinians, but it could not confirm that the targeted people were actually killed.

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 11:08 am Link to this comment

Yo..troublesum

Fast forward…

We don’t do rock concerts anymore, and they went out at least as long ago as the book you mentioned..‘Game Plan”.

It’s 22 years old…try to catch up if you can. If you don’t like Obama, we get it. But this is sort of a pathetic way to try to diss him.

So, it’s actually only sad, (not even funny) to hear people like you so desperate as to grasp at straws from decades past.

And nope..appearances is by no means all we care about. What ‘appearances’ anyway? Everytime I hear one of you Obama haters use terms like rock concert, or ‘cult’ or ‘appearances’ it makes me think that Obama’s ‘appearance’ has made a far greater impression on you, than it has on his real supporters, who ARE looking beyond ‘appearances’.

Thou doest protest too much.

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By troublesum, March 1, 2008 at 10:28 am Link to this comment

Isn’t it quite funny how we seem to rediscover every four years that politicians are liars?  One thing I know about Brzezinski is that his book GAME PLAN became something of a bible for the neo-cons.  These people all share the same beliefs and values.  The only differences they have lie in how they think the empire ought to be run.  The left end -  Carter, Clinton, Brzezinski, Obama, want to keep the gulag out of sight.  You don’t put the damn thing in Guantanamo for the whole world to see.  Both sides agree that the US has a right to do anything it wants to do where ever and when ever it wants to do it.  Thirty years ago this was known as the Carter Doctrine.  The left end is more discreet about it.  They don’t like Bush’s roughshod, cowboy approach.  They are ladies and gentlemen.  It is funny and sad to hear people who know better joining the Obama rock concert.  The only thing Obama will change is appearences.  Close the gulag and keep it out of sight.  That’s the best he’s going to be able to do.  Nothing to get excited about unless all you care about is appearences.

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By JNagarya, March 1, 2008 at 9:37 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I hope “cyrena” hasn’t been calling others “hypocrite”—

“By cyrena, February 29 at 8:37 pm #

“. . . .  By the way, since we’re talking about the foreign policy advisors of presidential candidates, let’s have a look at Hillary’s…That would be (probably among others)
ALAN M. DERSHOWITZ.”

When will you be SUBSTANTIATING this assertion, “cyrena,” in keeping with your demand that those who “oppose” Obama do so?

“Are you familiar with him? Well, just a few things, and then you can look him up yourself for the rest. He has led the efforts to LEGALIZE TORTURE, because in his legal opinion, it’s going to be practiced anyway, so might as well bring it into the legal system.”

1.  SUBSTANTIATE that Dershowitz “has led the efforts to LEGALIZE TORTURE . . . .”  (In all instances, and all particulars, on the issue, as a defender or promoter of torture, Dershowitz is at minimum wrong: the Nazis used torture, primarily against Jews, and were ultimately executed for doing so: wrong for them, wrong for everyone.

(Japanese were also executed for using the war crime of torture—most prominently waterboarding.)

2.  When the US becomes signatory to a treaty, the treaty becomes part of the Constitution.  Thus the Constitution prohibits torture more than once.

The Constitution can only be amended by three-fourths of the states.  That has not been done, therefore torture remains illegal.

3.  There are international laws banning torture which apply as much to the US as to any other country, and which cannot be altered unilaterally by the US’s one vote against the majority.  Therefore torture cannot be made legal under any circumstances.

Before you presume to spew “law,” know how law and legal process work, and what the law is on the point.

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By ttran, March 1, 2008 at 9:20 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Carl Rowes’s trick against Democrats.

A large number of Diehard Republicans and Christian Fundamentalists voted for Sen.Obama in California, Oregon and for other big states like Texas…

By using the Democratic Party’s Primary Election Rule which allows all voters to vote for democratic candidates, the Republican would eliminate Sen.Hillary Clinton who would capture the votes from the white, hispanic and asian male republicans who are in dismay of Bush and the current republican policies.
While I have a lot of respect for Sen.Obama, I think he won’t survive an attack from the republican strategists by playing fear of his arabic heritage and threat of terrorism into american public mind. While his stance against starting the Iraq war was a bonus during the Democratic Primary, it would be a fatal blow when connecting to his cultural heritage.

I am disappointed of the head of Democratic party for not seeing this coming in order to have the best candidate for this election.

Thi Tran

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By JNagarya, March 1, 2008 at 9:19 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

More racist smear propaganda and falsification of reality:

“By lib in texas, March 1 at 7:34 am #

“Re: Obama was born a Muslim

“They lie about this also, but they have softened it a bit saying his father was a non practicing Muslim but they don’t quote Muslim law. according to Islamic law Obama was born a Muslim.”

1.  “Islamic law” is not the law in the US;

2.  Everyone in the US has the right to change his/her religion—or to reject religion altogether.

3.  I doubt you have the credentials to actually know what “Islamic law” is or requires; but we’ve heard a great many right-wing lunatic fringe white supremacists (and less racists) propound on it without regard for truth or reality.

Otherwise, were you correct, it would be irrelevant, as anyone in the US can choose whatever religion s/he wants—or choose none at all.  Even you can do it: you can choose to be not only a Christian but also a Christian who adheres to the rules required of Christians, such as: “Thou shalt not lie,” and “Thou shalt not lie against others.”

Last but not least: you are a liar by claiming to be a liberal; and to lie destroys your pretense to be against lying.

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By lib in texas, March 1, 2008 at 8:45 am Link to this comment

Its not the Muslim part it is the lying about it.  Obamaites must think it is a detriment since they keep denying it.

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By lilmamzer, March 1, 2008 at 8:44 am Link to this comment

S P A M Alert

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By lib in texas, March 1, 2008 at 8:34 am Link to this comment

They lie about this also, but they have softened it a bit saying his father was a non practicing Muslim but they don’t quote Muslim law. according to Islamic law Obama was born a Muslim.
Mika Brezenski on MSNBC also brags her father is a top or senior advisor.

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Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, March 1, 2008 at 8:25 am Link to this comment

Hate is a splendid thing, serves bigots well, actually their only food for thought.  The tower of babel served it purpose well and is alive here on this post.  Keep the division going folks for I have resolved myself to agree with the wisdom of Tao Walker.

“We are all Indians now”.

Thank you Tao Walker.

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By omop, March 1, 2008 at 8:19 am Link to this comment

When will just plain Americans in Ohio or for that matter in the other 49 just vote as an American?

Or is it time for the 50 to Balkanize themselvesinto Kosovos, North Ireland, Israel/Paletine, Kashmir/pakistan/India, etc,..

Its either that or for just plain Americans to tell those obsessed with their ethnicity/religion to emigrate to their ethnic country of choice.

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By Hammo, March 1, 2008 at 8:06 am Link to this comment

Jewish Ohioans will be part of the voting mix in Ohio’s primary. Other demographics of Ohio are more complex.

Obama faces a unique situation in the state of Ohio. The demographics and history of Ohio are interesting. What role will Obama’s mixed ethnicity have in Ohio?

These and other elements of the Dem primary and the upcoming general election in Ohio are explored in the article ...

“Obama faces Ohio hearts and minds”

AmericanChronicle.com
February 28, 2008

http://americanchronicle.com/articles/53747

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By Maani, March 1, 2008 at 7:58 am Link to this comment

It will certainly not surprise anyone here, but The New York Times is now wrapping itself into Obama’s lie about ZB, and the latter’s position on the Obama team.

In an article today, The Times says, “E-mail messages circulating about Mr. Obama’s untrustworthiness assert that the former national security adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski…[is a] top adviser to his campaign. Mr. Brzezinski has met with Mr. Obama, but he is not a top adviser.”

Talk about complicity in a lie!  Indeed, The Times has gone to INCREDIBLE lengths to support its latest statement: they have actually purged their system of at least two articles in which they themselves referred to ZB as a “top” advisor!  (I have a hard copy of at least one of those articles, but if you try to access it on the web, it has disappeared!)  But they made one mistake.  They left an Op-Ed by Roger Cohen which contains the following line: “Why does he have former National Security Adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski (viewed as cool toward Israel) on his foreign policy team?”

The Times is very careful about fact-checking, PARTICULARLY its Op-Ed contributors.  If they had any question that Cohen was making an untrue or exaggerated statement, they would have redacted or changed it.  They did not.  Meaning they accepted that ZB was “on” Obama’s “foreign policy team” - not just an occasional phone call or email betwen them.

Indeed, there is a BIG difference between Obama saying “I know Brzezinski,” “I’ve had lunch with him once,” “I’ve exchanged e-mails with him maybe three times,” and being on Obama’s “team” (as Cohen and many others assert) and an even BIGGER difference in Obama’s claims and ZB serving as a “key” (even “top”) advisor, as many MSM and AM outlets have continuously reported - without ANY correction from Obama or his campaign.

Ironically, I am betting that the Obamaphiles here are actually going to DEFEND the NYT in its LATEST claim, while gainsaying its earlier ones.  Hey kids, can you spell “hypocrite?”

Peace.

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By Maani, March 1, 2008 at 7:39 am Link to this comment

Cyrena:

NOW who is “spinning?”  Show me ONE place where I presented Brzezinski “as some sort of monster.”  I dare you.  I double dare you!  I TRIPLE DARE YOU!

My point was NEVER to make a judgment on ZB (though I certainly have my opinions, which I am happy to relate if asked) - but to point out that Obama is not as honest as he pretends to be, that he engages in the politically expedient lie when he needs to, that his character is not (you’ll pardon the expression) lily-white.

If you are unhappy with the strength of my language, I am happy to defer to Non Credo’s “kinder, gentler” language: “Obama is clearly backtracking and using language that falsely distances himself from Brzezinski and falsely minimizes Brzezinski’s role in the campaign since last September.”

There.  Is that better?

Peace.

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By thi tran, March 1, 2008 at 7:01 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Carl Rowes’s trick against Democrats.

A large number of Diehard Republicans and Christian Fundamentalists voted for Sen.Obama in California, Oregon and for other big states like Texas…

By using the Democratic Party’s Primary Election Rule which allows all voters to vote for democratic candidates, the Republican would eliminate Sen.Hillary Clinton who would capture the votes from the white, hispanic and asian male republicans who are in dismay of Bush and the current republican policies.
While I have a lot of respect for Sen.Obama, I think he won’t survive an attack from the republican strategists by playing fear of his arabic heritage and threat of terrorism into american puplic mind. While his stance agaisnt starting the Iraq war was a bonus during the Democratic Primary, it would be a fatal blow when connecting to his cultural heritage.

I am disapointed of the head of Democratic party for not seeing this coming in order to have the best candidate for this election.

Thi Tran

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 1:12 am Link to this comment

Zoe wonders…

“By Zoe, February 29 at 6:10 pm #

•  “All the discussions about Obama and Islam and his denials of being a Muslim make me wonder if being a Muslim disqualifies an American from running for the presidency of the United States?”

Can’t say I blame you for wondering Zoe. This reminds me of all the created hysteria when Keith Ellison, the first African-American Muslim, (or any kind of Muslim for that matter) was elected to Congress. He wanted to take his oath of office on the Qur’an, and the right-wing talk-radio zealots went into massive hissy fits. It was truly disgusting, to see all of the created hysteria and Islam-o-phobia.

Needless-to-say, a regular old NATIVE AMERICAN wouldn’t stand a chance, and ‘need not apply’ since we’re generally not attached to ANY religion! (spirituality, yes. Religious category or ‘book’ – NO!)

So, we’d have a really hard, if not impossible time. I don’t know WHAT Senator Bernie Sanders did when he was sworn into office, since he’s an atheist, (the only ‘out of the closet atheist that we know of in the public sphere). And, the big ‘tado’ about Keith Ellison, was that he was some sort of ‘devil worshipper’ if he didn’t agree to use the Bible. See what I mean?

On the other hand, we’re back to semantics again, with the suggestion that Barack Obama has ‘denied’ being a Muslim. In reality, if he is NOT a Muslim, then why the hell SHOULDN’T he DENY it?

If someone makes the erroneous assumption that I am Caucasian, I’m gonna…DENY IT. Simply because, I’m NOT! It wouldn’t be because there’s anything wrong with being a Caucasian, it would just be because… I’m NOT!

Meantime though, I do get your point. Like I said, in this whacked out culture of general hysteria, non-Christian Native Americans, (heaven forbid the additional drops of African type blood cells) need not apply.

Good thing I didn’t have my heart set on being the president,eh?

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 12:42 am Link to this comment

You’re right aegrus..

And…herein lies the point aegrus…about the twisting in Maani’s interpretation.

It’s all about how well one can manage to twist the semantics. In this case….

Obama says that he KNOWS Zbig. He says that he’s had lunch with him, (once) and that he’s exchanged emails with him, (3 times) and that Zbig introduced him at the Iowa caucus. All of this, and from what I can gather, he hasn’t known the guy (as having been formally introduced to him) for even a year.

If memory serves me, Tony Wincher mentioned here on this blog a few months ago, (not sure which thread or story) that he had arranged the introduction through his own Rabbi. (possibly Michael Lerner? Not sure). Additionally, Tony mentioned that he was PROUD to have arranged the introduction between Brzezinski and Obama. And, I’m glad he did TOO! Not because I know ANY of these guys –personally- but just because I’ve read enough of their work, and listened to them on their policies and positions, to know that Zbig is a smart guy. I believe Obama is as well. I think whatever he brings to the ‘advisory team’ can only be an advantage.

So, we’re back to the Maani’s twisting of the semantics. In short, he’s calling Obama a blatant liar, because he (Obama) said…in this very same exchange, that Zbig was not one of his ‘key’ advisors.

Never mind what ‘key’ advisors might mean to Obama, who actually said this. Never mind that we know for a fact, that Obama has MANY advisors, including several who have been advising him since long before he even MET Brzezinski. Never mind that Brzezinski is an advantage to the advisory team of any presidential candidate. As far as Maani is concerned, everything hinges on the ‘key advisor’ words.

So, never mind any of that, just like Maani says never mind to that lithium he should be taking several times a day.

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By Douglas Chalmers, March 1, 2008 at 12:37 am Link to this comment

An invention called ‘the Jewish people’

By PatrickHenry, February 29: “Who Invented Jews? http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/959229.html -”

Thanks for the link, PatrickHenry. Now that Inherit The Wind has blown his inappropriate and incorrect winbag opinions, we had better have a look at what a Jewish historian has to say…....

Quote Harretz + Shlomo Zand: “There never was a Jewish people, only a Jewish religion, and the exile also never happened - hence there was no return. Zand rejects most of the stories of national-identity formation in the Bible, including the exodus from Egypt .....all fiction and myth that served as an excuse for the establishment of the State of Israel…..

When the country was conquered by the Arabs, many of the Jews converted to Islam and were assimilated among the conquerors. It follows that the progenitors of the Palestinian Arabs were Jews…. If the majority of the Jews were not exiled….. they emigrated of their own volition or, if they were among those exiled to Babylon (Gk: “Mesopotamia” - now Iraq and Baghdad), remained there because they chose to…..

Contrary to conventional belief, the Jewish religion tried to induce members of other faiths to become Jews…. As the Book of Esther, for example, notes, “And many of the people of the land became Jews; for the fear of the Jews fell upon them.”


...1948, a meeting was held in Hiafa concerning the fate of the Bedouin of Arab al-Ghawarina in the Haifa area. “They must be removed from there, so that they, too, will not add to our troubles,” Yosef Weitz, of the Keren Kayemeth (Jewish National Fund), wrote in his personal diary. Two months later, Weitz reported to the organization’s director, “Our Haifa Bay has been evacuated completely and there is hardly a remnant of those who encroached our border.” They were probably expelled to Jordan…..


Who America belongs to - Two professors, Gabi Shefer and Avi Ben-Zvi, were guests this week on Yitzhak Noy’s “International Hour” current events program on Israel Radio. The anchor, sounding slightly concerned, asked whether the achievements of Barack Obama show that the United States no longer belongs to the white man…...


Prof. Zand teaches at Tel Aviv University. His book, “When and How Was the Jewish People Invented?” (published by Resling in Hebrew), is intended to promote the idea that Israel should be a “state of all its citizens” - Jews, Arabs and others - in contrast to its declared identity as a “Jewish and democratic” state…...

Zand quotes from many existing studies, some of which were written in Israel but shunted out of the central discourse. He also describes at length the Jewish kingdom of Himyar in the southern Arabian Peninsula and the Jewish Berbers in North Africa. The community of Jews in Spain sprang from Arabs who became Jews and arrived with the forces that captured Spain from the Christians, and from European-born individuals who had also become Jews…..

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By cyrena, March 1, 2008 at 12:19 am Link to this comment

Lefty…you’re my favorite bullshitter…EVER! smile

However, if McCain REALLY DID have all of these ‘accomplishments’ he might be worth looking at, just as a specimen in a sociology experiment.

There might also be some truth to the voodoo practitioner stuff. He’s just been endorsed by that guy from the Near-End, Apocalypse NOW’ers, and ya know those crazies have GOT to be dabbling in voodoo,  sex slavery and pretty much anything else that can be dubbed as perverted.

I don’t know about the Panamanian part though. I doubt that any of them are from Panama.

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By Douglas Chalmers, March 1, 2008 at 12:17 am Link to this comment

He’s quoting a Jewish historian and a Jewish newspaper, ITW, uhh…...

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By Douglas Chalmers, March 1, 2008 at 12:05 am Link to this comment

Quote Bill Boyarsky: “The Jewish newspaper The Forward said the e-mails were directed at “frightened, angry Jews, thousands of them, determined to stop anyone they suspect is against them…”

The only way to trip ourselves up today is to bury our heads in the sand and pretend that you-know-what isn’t happening…. all we need to do to make our dreams come true is believe that they are already true….. or to have AIPAC ‘fix’ things for you, uhh.

For more than half a century, the American Israel Public Affairs Committee has worked to help make Israel more secure by ensuring that American support remains strong regardless of the cost to the USA.  From a small pro-Israel public affairs covert operation in the 1950s, AIPAC has burgeoned into the world’s most dangerous para-military terrorist organization.

It has nothing to do with the AJC which is a valid Jewish community organization in the USA but has a declared manifesto aimed at the total control of Palestine, the removal of all non-Jewish peoples from the once tri-religious multi-cultural state and covertly expansion into and ultimately total control of the neighboring state of Lebanon.

AIPAC’s agenda in the USA already sounds like it has control of the US congress and the US senate, uhh. Legislation passed in the USA is referred to as AIPAC’s “achievements” as though it alone was worthy of congratulation. That shows how slef-righteously contemptuous and unappreciative its Jewsish supporters (mainly Israelis) really are http://www.aipac.org/about_AIPAC/default.asp

Some of AIPAC’s “achievements” - in its own words: Securing critical foreign aid to Israel; Prohibiting U.S. aid and contacts with the Hamas-led PA; Extending U.S.-backed loan guarantees to Israel; Condemning Iran; Passing the Iran Libya Sanctions Act; Passing the Syrian Accountability Act; Increasing military aid to Israel; Keeping world pressure on Hamas; Passing a House resolution congratulating Israel on the 40th anniversary of the Six-Day War, praising the Jewish state for ‘reunifying’ Jerusalem and protecting ‘religious freedom’ in the city…, etc etc

Hostile to Israel? Israel is the only nuclear power in the M.East; Israel is the only state in the M.East with WMD’s; Israel is a Jewish state which has recently bombed Christians in neighboring Lebanon (50% Christian population); Israel has repressed Christian and Moslem Arabs in Palestine and grabbed most of their land. Better wake up, America…....

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By Pete, February 29, 2008 at 10:09 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I just have to weigh in on this one, the latest in a series of meaningless and divisive attacks on Obama that seem to rely upon the most base and tribal natures of the electorate.
To Senator Obama’s opponents, it seems like this campaign is more about discrediting Obama, rather than highlighting the positive policies and positions of their own candidates. 
It’s absurd to even entertain the thought that Obama is any more or less than a center-left freshman senator.  He’s not the Muslim Manchurian candidate, and all of the lines of attack against him fall into this type of category, whether it’s dividing the latino vote from the african american vote, or exploiting false muslim rumormongering against a intolerant and possibly islamaphobic community. 
This won’t achieve universal healthcare, nor end the war, nor help fund education in this country.  If it works, we deserve the 100 years of war that McCain is hoping for…. for it would show that we are a simple, intolerant, and self-absorbed nation. 
For the record, I would have wanted Hillary Clinton to be president, but the last month of negative attacks—the Drudge Report picture of Obama in Kenyan tribal (but not muslim) clothing that the Clinton campaign staffers gave the website….  along with McCain’s vote for torture in the senate, and his posing DURING AN ENDORSEMENT with a pentecostal minister that is truly anti-semetic, anti-Catholic, and anti-Muslim on record, along with his recent introduction by a right wing radio host who repeated the “Hussein” in Obama’s middle name THREE times when introducing Senator McCain…

If people are already ruled by fear, they’ll get a ruler who rules WITH fear.

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By cyrena, February 29, 2008 at 9:37 pm Link to this comment

You missed the point entirely Maani, in all of your Zealotry, you missed the whole point.

I was NOT claiming that Zbig was NOT one of the advisors to Obama’s team. And, had you actually READ my post, you would have seen that it is obvious, that Zbig IS ‘associated’ with the advisory team that Obama has assembled.

The point is SO WHAT? I can’t think of a better person to BE on his advisory team for foreign affairs.

The ‘association’ to which I referred is the INNUENDO, that this is somehow a ‘bad thing’. And the obviously stated position that Zbrezinski is somehow “hostile to Israel”.

And, where do you make the ‘association’ that Obama blatantly LIED?!

Are you suggesting that Obama has blatantly claimed that Brzezinski is NOT a member of his advisory team? If Barack Obama has at some point, ANY point, made any sort of statement that makes the claim that Zbig is NOT associated with his team, then we might say that Obama was misrepresenting the truth. Or, you could even call him a liar.

Otherwise, I don’t have to get used to blatant lies and innuendo from anyone other than you and the rest of the Obama hate mongers, and I’m already used to that. I will however, keep calling you on it, every time you make these false associations.

In this case, you are presenting Brzezinski as some sort of monster, instead of the intelligent and knowledgeable person that he is…a boon to any presidential candidates’ advisory team. Then you further infer that Obama has somehow lied about having Zbig involved as one of his advisors.

That is blatant slander and smear, perfidy in action. YOU creating misinterpretations. Show me where Obama has DENIED Zbig’s involvement in his campaign. And, don’t make the shit up either Maani. Get direct quotes, as well as the source. Your standard twisting doesn’t cut it. It’s simply too transparent.

Until you can manage that, you’re still the most blatant around, and we’re ALL ‘used to it’.

By the way, since we’re talking about the foreign policy advisors of presidential candidates, let’s have a look at Hillary’s…That would be (probably among others)
ALAN M. DERSHOWITZ.

Are you familiar with him? Well, just a few things, and then you can look him up yourself for the rest. He has led the efforts to LEGALIZE TORTURE, because in his legal opinion, it’s going to be practiced anyway, so might as well bring it into the legal system.

Also fairly recently, he was at the head of the neocon pack to present “friend of the court’ briefs to the judge in the I. Lewis (Scooter) Libby, (used to be Liebowitz) case. This was to convince the judge that Scooter should NOT be required to serve any sentence, AFTER HE WAS TRIED, CONVICTED, and SENTENCED in a US court of law. Now of course the judge didn’t go for it, so it meant that GW had to just write off the sentence, since of course we couldn’t let Dick Cheney’s number one lacky go to jail.

Still, that gives you an idea of Dershowitz’ –accomplishments-  and yup…he’s Hillary’s counterpart to Zbig. 

Now try a new thought connection Maani. Consider what the connections would be, to you trying to piss up a rope.

Go ahead, try it…sometimes people need actual hands-on, or visual leaning aids, to connect the dots.

Meantime, to recap…ZBig IS at least one of the advisor’s to Obama’s campaign.

Last I heard, Hillary was pissed that SHE didn’t get him to help her out. Too bad she got Dershie instead.

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By PatrickHenry, February 29, 2008 at 9:03 pm Link to this comment

That was a very candid and true dissertation by Zbig.

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By Inherit The Wind, February 29, 2008 at 8:59 pm Link to this comment

Here come Truthdig’s nazis again…out from under the rocks.

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By Maani, February 29, 2008 at 8:48 pm Link to this comment

Cyrena:

“The larger point is the smear and slander via innuendo and ‘associations’. There are posters here, (like Maani) who make a habit of it, like it’s their stock in trade or something.”

Nice try.  Obama himself appointed Brzezinski as senior foreign policy advisor in mid-September of 2007.  I provided a number of mentions of this from around that time.  And Samantha Power - second only to ZB - has confirmed ZB’s presence on the team in more than one interview.

As well, The New York Times, The Washington Post, The L.A. Times, The Boston Globe, The Chicago Tribune, The Wall Street Journal, CNN, MSNBC and dozens of other MSM outlets have continously - for at least four to six months - referred to ZB as Obama’s “top” or “senior” foreign policy advisor.  Yet at NO time has Obama or any member of his team made ANY attempt to correct all of these media outlets.

There is no “innuendo” or false “association” here.  It is fact.  Confirmed by members of his own team, and uncorrected by him or anyone else.

Obama lied.  Blatantly.  Get used to it.

Peace.

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By omop, February 29, 2008 at 8:22 pm Link to this comment

Then Richard Nixon did “embrace” Mao Tse Tung and vice versa when they talked.

Given the emerging costs of 3 Trillion the number of human beings killed as well as the ongoing views and beliefs of John Hagee and acknowledgement of his support of John MCain an alien landing on this planet just before that fateful Tuesday in November 2008 will not be far from wrong in concluding that the American voter’s choice is either israel uber alles or Obama Faust.

And the Anglo-Americans still maintain that their mission is to bring democracy and the 21st. Century to the heathens in the Middle East and Asia.

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By cyrena, February 29, 2008 at 7:47 pm Link to this comment

Fadel, I’ve not yet been able to find a response from the Jewish Community in general, (at least nothing written) regarding this most recently revealed hoax.

I can and will check in with the local community, which includes quite a large number of Jewish Americans, as well as a large chunk of the intellectual and academic community as well, with major concentrations on Jewish studies. Needless to say, the studies of the Holocaust are nearly a department of their own. 

That said, I would certainly expect (and hope for) a response to this most recent revelation of this hoax, since it has been such a long-standing story, and so widely disbursed. So, I’ll pass along whatever I can, with the sources cited.

Meantime, for those in this discussion on Zbigniew Brzezinski, and his place in or around the Obama ‘team’, I’d like to point you to a couple of things, the first posted by ocjim. It is very insightful, and there is in fact a connection to this discussion on Zibig, and any other person presumably ‘associated’ with any one of these candidates.

Ocjim writes, (in part) in post #137136

•  “The propaganda techniques are beginning. Just like Bush/Rove, neocons will try to demonize Obama (the one they are convinced McCain will face) using propaganda techniques of association (ismlamo-fascist, terrorists) with anything fearful. You use images just like Rove did: associating W with a stalwart cowboy and any enemies with terrorists or traitors.”

This is, (IMO) so true, with so much of the ink being spilled these days…propaganda by association. I would only disagree that it’s just ‘beginning’ since the association-type smears for Obama began long ago, with the stupid tales some Islama-facist association. (a word created by the neocons) Even that may be a picky point of semantics.

The larger point is the smear and slander via innuendo and ‘associations’. There are posters here, (like Maani) who make a habit of it, like it’s their stock in trade or something. So, we’ve seen associations CREATED between Obama and whomever..Farrakhan, Wright, Brzezinski, and on and on. In the process, they’ve attributed certain ‘associations’ to these connections as well. In the case of Zbig, he is somehow portrayed as “Hostile to Israel”. This is yet another innuendo, created for WHAT purpose? I’d say the same smear and slander politics.

I don’t know a whole lot about Zbig’s attitude toward Israel, and I suspect it’s because he may not HAVE one, other than how Israel, like -any other- FOREIGN sovereign state, does or should fit into US policy. The fact that his position is somehow ‘hostile’ to Israel, is simply more innuendo and interpretation from fanatics.

What I find far more ‘connected’ and compelling to any advice he might lend to the Obama team, is what he has to say about issues concerning America. The link below is to a piece written by Zbig, nearly a year ago. It’s an excellent piece, and if I were planning to assemble an advisory team for a political office bid, I’d read this and wanna grab whomever had written it, for ADDITIONAL advice. It happens to have been written by Zbig.

I only came across this in research for my own project. Prior to this, I’d not even been aware of his book: “Second Chance: Three Presidents and the Crisis of American Superpower”.  So now, I’ll have to read that as well.

My point…STOP creating associations where they do not exist. Zbig is a scholar, and a smart guy, with a great deal of study on foreign policy, AMONG other things that should be of concern and/or issue with any leadership. That doesn’t extend to ‘Hostile to Israel’, except in the minds of propagandists.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/23/AR2007032301613_pf.html

As far as we can tell from credible information, Brzezinski IS ‘associated’ with Obama’s advisory team, though we don’t KNOW to what nature or extent. Regardless, he is an ADVANTAGE to ANY political leader.

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By Zoe, February 29, 2008 at 7:10 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

All the discussions about Obama and Islam and his denials of being a Muslim make me wonder if being a Muslim disqualifies an American from running for the presidency of the United States?

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By JNagarya, February 29, 2008 at 6:35 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

You intend with this, of course, to imply guilt by association, and to smear, rather than have the guts to straightforwardly admit your false belief that the Holocaust didn’t happen:

“By Fadel Abdallah, February 29 at 5:24 pm #

“Writer Admits Holocaust Memoir Is Fake
By MELISSA TRUJILLO,AP
Posted: 2008-02-29 18:39:48

“BOSTON (AP) - Almost nothing Misha Defonseca wrote about herself or her horrific childhood during the Holocaust was true.

“Misha Defonseca, a Belgian writer now living in Massachusetts, wrote a memoir describing how she escaped the Holocaust by living with wolves after the Nazis took away her parents. Now she admits it was all an elaborate fantasy.

“Defonseca, a Belgian writer now living in Massachusetts, admitted through her lawyers this week that her best-selling book, “Misha: A Memoir of the Holocaust Years,” was an elaborate fantasy she kept repeating, even as the book was translated into 18 languages and made into a feature film in France.
================================================
Since I did not read this book nor did I read any critical reviews about it, I am interested in learning how it was received among Jews when it first appeared. I would appreciate any educated comments (not personal opinions please!) on my inquiry.

Tell us, Fadel, how many Muslims believe the swill that the Holocaust didn’t happen as rationalization and excuse for their hating of the Semitic tribe of Jews.

Tell us where in the Koran it says that indulging hatred not only makes one different than all he other haters, but is a means to end hatred.

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By Fadel Abdallah, February 29, 2008 at 6:24 pm Link to this comment

Writer Admits Holocaust Memoir Is Fake
By MELISSA TRUJILLO,AP
Posted: 2008-02-29 18:39:48

BOSTON (AP) - Almost nothing Misha Defonseca wrote about herself or her horrific childhood during the Holocaust was true.

Misha Defonseca, a Belgian writer now living in Massachusetts, wrote a memoir describing how she escaped the Holocaust by living with wolves after the Nazis took away her parents. Now she admits it was all an elaborate fantasy.

Defonseca, a Belgian writer now living in Massachusetts, admitted through her lawyers this week that her best-selling book, “Misha: A Memoir of the Holocaust Years,” was an elaborate fantasy she kept repeating, even as the book was translated into 18 languages and made into a feature film in France.
================================================
Since I did not read this book nor did I read any critical reviews about it, I am interested in learning how it was received among Jews when it first appeared. I would appreciate any educated comments (not personal opinions please!) on my inquiry.

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By JNagarya, February 29, 2008 at 6:10 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

“By Non Credo, February 29 at 9:05 am #

“[Obama will] probably never will get their blessing, until like McCain he has a decades-long, viciously militarist and pro-Israel, anti-Arab political record to prove his devotion to the Jewish fascist state. Israel is a cancer unto the nations.”

I suggest you calculate the cost to McCain of accepting the endorsement of—“embracing”—and praising the “End Times/“Armageddon”/“Rature” bigot from TX who is not only rabidly hateful against Catholics (a constituency the GOP figures esential to its winning), especially as Jews understand that the “Rapture” crap results in the death of most Jews—those who refuse to convert to Christian.

McCain has, with that endorsement, “captured” the religioloony “base”; but he lost Catholics, Jews, and moderate Christians—anyone actually mainstream—in the process.

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By Rob Thair, February 29, 2008 at 5:51 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

These days, politicians are betting they can’t get anywhere without the Jews and their leverage.  It will be interesting to see if one day soon an honest politician stands up and admits he isn’t happy with Israel and could care less about AIPAC and their yank.  Wouldn’t it be ironic if that politician lost all the Jews, and some of the Evangelicals, but gained so many others who disagree with them, that it then became vogue to deny the “special” relationship and screw them to the floor?  I should live so long.

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By lastdaywatchers, February 29, 2008 at 4:25 pm Link to this comment

Regarding President Bush critizism of Sen.Obama

Here is something you who are spiritually wise need to ponder!; because this help explains and give a little bit more meaning to what the May 15th Prophecy have been saying all along about President Bush

In the Article “According to Bush, to ‘talk’ is to ‘embrace” http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/14740.html#comment-386623

We get more confirmation of the description used by God Prophet Habakkuk when he continues his description of President Bush that he began in the 5th verse and continues to this 10th verse

Habakkuk 2:10

Here is a list (from Blue Letter Bible of some of the different translations of this verse that perfectly describes President Bush the man and his policy)

But first let take a look at the key point in the “According to Bush, to ‘talk’ is to ‘embrace” “ “article

“When the reporter followed up, and suggested that a president could talk to a foreign leader without “embracing” him or her, Bush responded, “Well, talking to him is embracing.”

Now a look at Habakkuk 2:10 description with the many different translation
http://www.blueletterbible.org/cgi-bin/versions.pl?book=Hab&chapter=2&verse=10&version=KJV#10

Available Translations and Versions for Hab 2:10
KJV   Thou hast consulted shame to thy house by cutting off many people, and hast sinned [against] thy soul.. King James Version 1611, 1769

NKJV   You give shameful counsel to your house,Cutting off many peoples,And sin against your soul..New King James Version © 1982 Thomas Nelson

NLT   But by the murders you committed, you have shamed your name and forfeited your lives.. New Living Translation © 1996 Tyndale Charitable Trust

NIV   You have plotted the ruin of many peoples,shaming your own house and forfeiting your life..New International Version © 1973, 1978, 1984 International Bible Society

ESV   “You have devised shame for your houseby cutting off many peoples;you have forfeited your life..The Holy Bible, English Standard Version © 2001 Crossway Bibles

RVR   Tomaste consejo vergonzoso para tu casa, asolaste muchos pueblos, y has pecado contra tu vida.. Reina-Valera copyright © 1960 Sociedades Bíblicas en América Latina; copyright © renewed 1988 United Bible Societies.

NASB   “You have devised a shameful thing for your house By cutting off many peoples; So you are sinning against yourself.. New American Standard Bible © 1995 Lockman Foundation

RSV   You have devised shame to your house by cutting off many peoples; you have forfeited your life.. Revised Standard Version © 1947, 1952.

ASV   Thou hast devised shame to thy house, by cutting off many peoples, and hast sinned against thy soul.. American Standard Version 1901 Info

Young   Thou hast counselled a shameful thing to thy house, To cut off many peoples, and sinful [is] thy soul.. Robert Young Literal Translation 1862, 1887, 1898 Info

Darby   Thou hast devised shame to thy house, by cutting off many peoples, and hast sinned against thine own soul.. J.N.Darby Translation 1890 Info

Webster   Thou hast consulted shame to thy house by cutting off many people, and hast sinned [against] thy soul.. Noah Webster Version 1833 Info

HNV   You have devised shame to your house, by cutting off many peoples, and have sinned against your soul. Hebrew Names Version 2000 Info
 
For More about President Bush and the May 15th Prophecy go
http://lastdaywatchers.blogspot.com

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By Bboy, February 29, 2008 at 4:14 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Polititians submitting to special interest groups, instead of just getting their message out to the whole public. Taking the message out to the masses. Now you have to grovel to every special interest to get elected and beat down the adversary.

Politics as usual. Nothing at all has changed. Just the other party this time around. The other the next. Back and forth we go.

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By ocjim, February 29, 2008 at 3:42 pm Link to this comment

Conservative think tanks have been potent forces since before Ronald Reagan. Many of his programs came from a thousand page agenda disbursed to Reaganites, including trickle-down economics, cutting taxes for the rich, starving social welfare spending, a war on the poor, etc.

The unity of the neocon movement is still here as well, and in spite of McCain’s appearance as a principled Republican, we are beginning to see supporters use the same smear tactics as Karl Rove the Machiavellian used (maybe Rove is behind a bush).

Progressives have been so badly burnished by the neocon machine that they continue to be reactive intead of proactive. Note that none of the Democratic candidates ever talked seriously of tax increases, fighting poverty, a one-payer health care system, etc.

Neocon policy calculated the demise of any social contract for average Americans by cutting revenue, increasing military spending, and slowly gutting a social program, saying we can’t afford it. Cutting taxes started it.

This deep and sweeping tax cut not only meant a cumulative loss of $1 trillion to the Treasury Department by 1987, it also helped to create unprecedented federal deficits during the 1980s. The federal deficit was then used politically to justify “a frontal assault on the revenue base of the modern welfare state” by creating a zero-sum legislative environment, pitting individual programs against each other in the fight for revenues while rendering an expansion of federal social policy extremely difficult.

The propaganda techniques are beginning. Just like Bush/Rove, neocons will try to demonize Obama (the one they are convinced McCain will face) using propaganda techniques of association (ismlamo-fascist, terrorists) with anything fearful. You use images just like Rove did: associating W with a stalwart cowboy and any enemies with terrorists or traitors.

If the American people can be fooled again and again, it will prove that either democracy doesn’t work or that our education system is allowing a dumbing down of Americans or both.

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By Aegrus, February 29, 2008 at 2:16 pm Link to this comment

“Key advisors” He didn’t deny he was on his staff. You’re twisting his words.

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By Realitycheck, February 29, 2008 at 1:27 pm Link to this comment

It would seem we’re at that “whatever it takes to win” point.  I like the politicians who tell people what they need to hear rather than what they want to hear.  I know whomever I support I may not entirely agree with their positions.  I do hope however, that Barack Obama doesn’t become another President cowtowing to John Hagee and his ilk.  Israel’s future is not served well by its wall and policies of eternal vengeance.  The U.S. has not been served well either by our Zionist obligations.  True compromises with justice for each side will be necessary.  Some right of return would be wise.  The ethnic cleansings (by Haganah, Irgun, Stern Gang, et al) of the late 1940’s in Palestine cannot be swept away and hidden just because of sorrow over Hitler’s horrors.  Continuing to seize or pressure long residencies of Palestinians out, especially in east Jerusalem, are wrong.  The U.S. needs to address the status of Jerusalem as an international city and delay, not rush to, Armageddon.

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By Maani, February 29, 2008 at 12:38 pm Link to this comment

Aegrus:

“When has Obama denied Brzezinski was part of his campaign and an adviser?”

You apparently don’t read too good (LOL).  From the article above: “‘I know Brzezinski,’ Obama told the Jewish community members in Cleveland. ‘He’s not one of my key advisers. I’ve had lunch with him once, I’ve exchanged e-mails with him maybe three times. He came to Iowa to introduce me for a speech on Iraq.’

ZB originally endorsed Obama in August 2007.  About a month later, in mid-September, Obama chose ZB as his top foreign policy advisor, and ZB has been a clear and undisputed member of the Obama team since then.  Even Samantha Power, Obama’s other top foreign policy advisor, has continuously acknowledged ZB’s participation in the team.

Thus, Obama’s comments above are about as blatant a lie as one can find in print.

Compounded by his attempt to weasel out of public financing of the general election - something he both stated publicly and “signed” as a pledge, and something McCain has called his bluff on - and we start to see a VERY different picture of Obama’s character and principles.

Peace.

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By nrobi, February 29, 2008 at 12:33 pm Link to this comment

It is a laughable and ignoble thing that Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton did in the last debate.  Are we now to be subjected to lessons in semantics and language theory for the sole purpose of proving who is the stronger and more qualified candidate?  Ms. Clinton shows her lack of knowledge of the English language and the meaning of debate. Semantics should never play a part in the race for the nomination for the presidency of the US. It is not laudable that one point was scored by denying the “strength” of one word over another. 
The dictionary definitions of each word are quite specific and more to the point need explanation in the broader sense of the debate. To denounce:  To attack or condemn openly and vehemently; inveigh against.  2) To inform against; accuse.  3) To announce as a threat.  4) To give formal notice of the termination of (a treaty, etc.) [<OF <L <de-down
+nuntiare to announce],  Reject 1)To refuse to accept, recognize, believe, etc. 2)To refuse to grant; deny as a petition.  3)To refuse (a person) recognition, acceptance, etc.  4)To expel, as from the mouth, vomit.  5)To cast away as worthless; discard.  One who, or that which has been rejected.
[<L <re- back+jacere-to throw].  The very idea that each candidate must “throw back” each and every questionable contribution, unasked for and unwanted endorsement and to expel the person either literally or figuratively is without doubt the worst possible thing a candidate for office can do. Or, should Barack Obama, inveigh against the teachings of Rev. Louis Farrakhan, openly condemn the person of Rev. Louis Farrakhan for what he believes, I, think that as Sen. Obama has said, that the time has come for America to put away the differences that divide us, and unite around those things we can agree on. For a better America, we must change the way we think about the other and work to gain mutual understanding that all are one, there really are no divisions between us and we can make a difference in the world if we will put aside those things that are divisive and disruptive and work for the betterment of all mankind.  Sen. Clinton’s message, though is one of divisive and disruptive politics. Her message has shifted with the wind so many times that there is not one coherent and cogent policy that has come from her campaign.  I, personally feel sorry that Sen. Clinton has the staff that she does. Those people have not served her well and she has been misled about the shifting of the wind in regard to what the people of America want in the next election. 
I am also appalled that Sen. Clinton has reverted to politics as usual in the fight to win the nomination as the candidate for the Democratic Party.  In America we want and demand that our representatives in Congress and the White House be more attentive and listen to the voices of the people, for they-the people elected to office are our servants in the arena of government, and not the other way around. We, the American people are the bosses of the country and we are the ones who make the decisions to put someone in office. 
Make the right choice in the upcoming primaries, put your vote to work for the candidate of your choice and be aware that your vote counts. We must make this system of a democratic republic work, for if we don’t then we will be at the mercy of an autocrat, much like Vladimir Putin, who decides everything and gives up nothing in the way of power or money.

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By Aegrus, February 29, 2008 at 12:17 pm Link to this comment

When has Obama denied Brzezinski was part of his campaign and an adviser? It’s blatantly obvious Brzezinski has been involved, and been a credit to, the Barack Obama campaign for a long while now.

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By Aegrus, February 29, 2008 at 12:14 pm Link to this comment

Don’t fault us for being smart, Maani. };>

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By Greg, February 29, 2008 at 11:41 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I can’t comprehend why anyone would fall for the argument that Obama shares the same anti Israel sentiments or the same radical views as his mentor Jeremiah Wright. I would tend to believe that Obama has an affinity for Wright’s oratory style and the way in which he expresses his radical sentiments, rather than the actual views themselves. But the rabble rousers will do anything to distort the truth. Obama can not possibly reject every radical that he’s associated with. It’s humanely impossible.

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By omop, February 29, 2008 at 11:39 am Link to this comment

Why waste all this time and money when the whole charade could be had without all the phonyness of so-called political parties liberal, conservative, pro this and pro that and do it according to Hoyle.

Have all the Israelis in Israel vote for who should be the Cinc in Washington. Add those votes to all the Americans holding both Israeli and American passports. And voila. The next President of the USA certified “Kosher”.

The rest of the 300 million Americans who just hold one citizenship will just have to lump it or as Kilroy used to write “touch shitskY’.

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By jacksmith, February 29, 2008 at 10:56 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

YOU MIGHT BE AN IDIOT:-)

If you think Barack Obama with little or no experience would be better than Hillary Clinton with 35 years experience.

You Might Be An Idiot!

If you think that Obama with no experience can fix an economy on the verge of collapse better than Hillary Clinton. Whose wink husband (Bill Clinton) led the greatest economic expansion, and prosperity in American history.

You Might Be An Idiot!

If you think that Obama with no experience fighting for universal health care can get it for you better than Hillary Clinton. Who anticipated this current health care crisis back in 1993, and fought a pitched battle against overwhelming odds to get universal health care for all the American people.

You Might Be An Idiot!

If you think that Obama with no experience can manage, and get us out of two wars better than Hillary Clinton. Whose wink husband (Bill Clinton) went to war only when he was convinced that he absolutely had to. Then completed the mission in record time against a nuclear power. AND DID NOT LOSE THE LIFE OF A SINGLE AMERICAN SOLDIER. NOT ONE!

You Might Be An Idiot!

If you think that Obama with no experience saving the environment is better than Hillary Clinton. Whose wink husband (Bill Clinton) left office with the greatest amount of environmental cleanup, and protections in American history.

You Might Be An Idiot!

If you think that Obama with little or no education experience is better than Hillary Clinton. Whose wink husband (Bill Clinton) made higher education affordable for every American. And created higher job demand and starting salary’s than they had ever been before or since.

You Might Be An Idiot!

If you think that Obama with no experience will be better than Hillary Clinton who spent 8 years at the right hand of President Bill Clinton. Who is already on record as one of the greatest Presidents in American history.

You Might Be An Idiot!

If you think that you can change the way Washington works with pretty speeches from Obama, rather than with the experience, and political expertise of two master politicians ON YOUR SIDE like Hillary and Bill Clinton..

You Might Be An Idiot!

If you think all those Republicans voting for Obama in the Democratic primaries, and caucuses are doing so because they think he is a stronger Democratic candidate than Hillary Clinton. grin

Best regards

jacksmith…

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By Maani, February 29, 2008 at 10:19 am Link to this comment

Lefty:

“Please site an example of Obama pretending to be more of a saint than he is.”

I have actually attempted to do this on a number of occasions.  However, each time I do, my claims - no matter how well substantiated - are met with rationales, justifications and some weird notion of “plausible deniability” by the Obama supporters here.

Thus, offering examples - of which there are at least a handful if not more - is moot if the Obama supporters here are simply going to gainsay every single example with that same types of responses.

Peace.

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By dick, February 29, 2008 at 9:56 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

The neo-cons are in control, and will remain in control. All candidates and both partys are subservient to Israel.

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By Blackspeare, February 29, 2008 at 9:46 am Link to this comment

This is going to get real interesting when the RNC smear machine gets going after Obama is nominated.  There’s real trouble brewing between Israel and Hamas and those Jews that have a strong connection with the “Promised Land” will be very careful in how they vote——better the poison you know than the poison you don’t!  I suspect that many liberal Jews who would normally vote for Obama will side with McCain just because of Israel and McCain’s military posture in the Middle East.  Couple this with an inherent anti-black vote and McCain could possibly pull this off!

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By Maani, February 29, 2008 at 7:50 am Link to this comment

Obama: “I know Brzezinski…He’s not one of my key advisers.”

Obama is a liar.  Blatant and flagrant.  He personally tapped Bezezinski as his TOP foreign policy advisor in September 2007.  Here are some cites from a wide variety of sources, Both MSM and AM:

“Barack Obama has been criticized by pro-Israel forces…for naming Zbignew Brzezinski, Jimmy Carter’s National Security advisor, as one of his foreign policy gurus.”  (September 13, 2007, The Volokh Conspiracy)

“Let’s call Barack Obama what he is — a sock puppet for the ruling elite. Obama made this plainly obvious recently when he tapped Zbigniew Brzezinski as his top foreign policy adviser.”  (September 15, 2007, Moderate Observer)

“Senator Obama is standing by one of his top foreign policy advisers, Zbigniew Brzezinski, despite concerns that aligning with the former aide to President Carter will undermine Mr. Obama’s support with the pro-Israel community.”  (September 13, 2007, New York Sun)

As well, The New York Times, Washington Post, L.A. Times, Boston Globe and virtually every other major MSM publication has, since September, referred to Brzezinski as either Obama’s “top foreign policy advisor” or “foreign policy advisor.”

However, now that ZB’s presence is becoming politically inexpedient, Obama is not simply trying to (absurdly) “distance himself” from ZB, but to claim - completely dishonestly - that ZB is not one of his top foreign policy advisors.

So much for his claim that he would not engage in “politics as usual.”  So much for his vaunted principle.  So much for his honesty and integrity.

But, of course, the Obama supporters here will find a way to rationalize, justify and spin this so that Obama remains the Teflon candidate.  Good luck.

Peace.

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By Leefeller, February 29, 2008 at 6:55 am Link to this comment

Slur’s sponsored by Hillary, turned into attacks on Obama, do not make for arguments, except slurs.  Integrity something lacking from the low road, Hillary uses, is this what she means when she says she is a fighter?

Your comments show the degree of stink and hatred, that permeates from the Clinton tent very well.

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By Expat, February 29, 2008 at 6:38 am Link to this comment

^ and your astute comment.  I fear the worse is yet to come, but I think Obama is a tough cookie.

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By Expat, February 29, 2008 at 6:34 am Link to this comment

^ JPS; yes, everybody knows Brzezinski is an advisor of Obamas, so what.  Advisor is advisor, not director. 

“In fact, many of our problems stem, partially, from our unquestioning support for Israel…unquestioning is the operative word in that sentence, not support.”

Yes, I couldn’t agree more.

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By jackpine savage, February 29, 2008 at 5:32 am Link to this comment

But isn’t it true?  Several Clinton supporters on this site have hammered the Brzezinski connection repeatedly.  So if it is true, it cannot be a slur or a dirty trick.

Never mind the fact that it has become a presidential prerequisite to whole-heartedly support a nation that has consistently spied on us and used us to fight its proxy battles…a nation that gives us nothing in return for our military, financial, and moral support.  We do not hold Israel to the standards that we hold others to. 

I have nothing against Israel’s right to exist, and i refuse to get into the good Jew/bad Jew routine.  But to suggest that Israel is an indispensable friend - in terms of foreign policy - is A. untrue and B. has probably caused more problems than it has helped to solve.  In fact, many of our problems stem, partially, from our unquestioning support for Israel…unquestioning is the operative word in that sentence, not support.

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By cyrena, February 29, 2008 at 12:43 am Link to this comment

Thanks Bill Boyarsky!! You do good work!!

This is great, because you hit on what has been the most despicable and problematic…innuendo and slur, and outright lies spread like destructive fire. Terror via propaganda.

The trouble with it, is not only that it is directed at scaring the Jews, who are indeed an active voting bloc in the US. In fact, considering the relatively small proportional percentage of the Jewish American population, (approximately 2.4% based on a variety of different ways to ‘measure’) they exercise a great deal of political influence. But, that ‘trouble’ happens when those who have no genuine interest the Jewish Americans as an racial group or a religion, grab onto the slurs as a way to further their OWN racist objectives.

That is what I see happening, since these nefarious tactics are used by standard white racists, who have no more love for Jews than they do for the larger percentage of African Americans, or Hispanic Americans, or any OTHER non-white group.

It’s politics at it’s nastiest, and at this point, I wouldn’t put it past the repubs AS WELL AS, the Clintons to be the perpetrators. I don’t believe for an instant, that the Repugs (at least the neoconners) wouldn’t MUCH prefer to run against Hillary Clinton, whether they win or lose, than Barack Obama.

If they ‘lose’ to Hillary, it would NOT be the same measure of a ‘loss’ as losing to Obama, and that includes ALL of the far-right, ‘used-to-be-called’ conservatives, regardless of political party. I say ‘used to be called’ because the distinctions between liberal and conservative no longer have the same meaning as they once did.

Meantime, I LOVE these yarmulkes!! I’m gonna order a batch of them, and pass them out here in my own community, which happens to have a fairly large percentage of Jews..90% of whom are avid Obama supporters.

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By cwhipps, February 29, 2008 at 12:31 am Link to this comment

Obama’s opponents have bupkis. Worse, they’ve got bupkis mit kuduchas. (shivering shit balls)

The fake connections to Fharakan and the innuendi about Zbignew Bryzneski are so tennuous they require an almost complete lack of intelligence. Anyone who could believe these rumors would never be permitted to leave the asylum, much less vote. (even by absentee ballot.)

Today on CNN’s “The Situation Room”, Wolf Blitzer (formerly AIPAC, some say Mossad) interviewed Benjamin Netanyahu (conservative Likud party) specifically on Obama’s stance on withdrawing from Iraq.

Netanyahu, critisized Obama using the same mangled talking points that Bush 41, Bill Clinton, G.W. Bush, Cheney and John McCain have been using for the last twenty years: a thoroughly rationalized version of “Today Poland. Tomorrow the world.”

But, I’m not sure voters of any ethnic group are buying the old foreign policy fashions this year. This really does feel like a generational sea change in politics where the powers that be are being challenged in so many different ways.

What I find encouraging, is that there haven’t been any NEW voices on the right that seem to be picking up the old arguments. It’s all the same scary guys that sold us a bill of goods. They really have been called out, again and again as FAILURES.  The nice thing about the neo-cons failure is that it was so complete.

IRAQ really is the greatest foreign policy blunder in U.S. history.

American’s love underdogs, and they hate proven loosers. For all his heroic stature, McCain is so completely invested in Bush and his failure, I just can’t see anyone thinking it wise to give this old man and his even older ideas another chance.

Even if he calls me his friend, over and over, again.

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