GB I guess you would just have to be there and sit in their shoes so to speak.  Their hands, Dems, are still tied, unfortunately.  Yes Feinstein screwed up and so did some other Dems who are now labeled RepubliCrats, Lieberman led the pack.  Yes they need to be removed and replaced with Progressive minded officials, but until then we need to work with what we’ve got and thank goodness they aren’t as bad as those Rethugs who were removed from office, and are going through the court system, and those that resigned because the ship is sinking.

GB Says: This is our respected difference.

If you say so.
Dominick

GB and others interested here’s Hillarys voting record.  Pretty impressive if you ask me!
http://votesmart.org/voting_category.php?can_id=55463

Thanks for the link GB.  I did read it and I read several others also on the same subject from different sources. Funny thing, they all read the same way, some identical word for word.

Getting money from these folks doesn’t make her a bad person.  It makes her a smart person. Also I’m sorry if I implied you were making the stuff up, it’s the source & where you were getting the info from I was questioning- Huffington gets her sources from the media too.

I think somewhere in the article it said these companies have backed the GOP for decades and now they’re pumping their money into the Democrats ALL of them, oh, yes, and even some of that money went to Mitt. 

Ive looked at Clintons voting record as I have with quite a few others.  You do know she has a lot of constiuients to make happy, like they all do and they can’t always vote the way you would want them to.  I’ve been angry with the way Feinstein votes on several occasions too, but for the most part they do their very best. 

Like I said before Dennis is a great guy, but so was a couple of other Dems who once got the office but didn’t know what to do once they got there and after four years of them the vote went back to the GOP and we got stuck with some really bad people.  The baton should have passed to Gore after Bill Clinton, but we all know that didn’t happen.  And face reality, Dennis isn’t even close to being a choice, like Dodd.  Clinton is and maybe Obama has a shot at it. 

If Clinton is the Partys choice I will vote for Hillary I will be voting My concience and if Obama gets the nod, I iwll vote for him, And if another Rethuglican gets into office it won’t be Hillarys fault, or that of any Democrats, for the reason you claim, it’ll be your fault and of those who think like you, because you don’t like her, will rather pass on voting or will actually throw your vote away on some one else.

Well GB Can you really prove all of this or are you just reiterating what others have said, others like the rethuglicans.  Any way, we are all entitled to our opinon/s and as far as I’m concerned Hillary is the best candidate for the job.  Now if Dennis had a better showing I would be voting for him, as I’m sure a lot of others would,but so far the choices are Edwards UGH---Obama UGH---and Clinton and my vote is going to Clinton.  I surely don’t want any more years of some Fundamentalist GOP sitting in the White House listening and taking orders from the Religious Right…

Larry, Hillary had a goal and if getting to that goal was to seek the seat of a New York Senator, than by goolie she did it, that makes her working to further that goal.  She has made New Yorkers happy with her!
That makes her smart and someone to reckon with.  She’s the one I want sitting in the Oval Office representing me!

Rage, me thinks you should research her credentials before spouting off rabid remarks.  She has an impressive reume.  And more than likely worked harder getting to where she is, using her brains more then you have ever done, had the capabilites to do or dreamed of doing!

118597 by cyrena.
Thank you Cyrena!!  Well said and it should be reposted from time to time!!

I’m also happy he, Driving Bear, has health care he can be proud of.  I don’t and neither does my partner AND neither do thousands upon thousands of kids from working poor, to very poor along with their parents.  The health care system needs reformed to a universal one.  One for everybody in this country not just for those who can afford it!

to #118631 by Conservative Yankee on 12/07 at 6:11 am

I think you overlook one important thing about drivers lic. The full faith and credit clause of the US constitution. Let me share a personal story. In early 2003 I was transferred from Tennessee to Utah for 7 months. So I go to the Utah DMV to get a new drivers lic. I give them my TN drivers lic and they gave me a brand new Utah lic and registered me to vote in less that an hour ( about 15 minutes once I got to the first desk of the DMV ). All I had to show was my old TN lic and my very old SS card which after 20 years in my wallet was just legible. The DMV girl just looked at SS card for about 1/2 second .
So with a DL and less than $50 I was full citizen of the state of Utah and therefore the USA .
Illegal could use do the same if the had a NY state DL.

I almost forgot.  If you speak of election fraud, you must speak about ensuring proof for voting.  Driver’s licenses should be modified to show a person’s citizenship status (Citizen..Resident Alien..).  Passport, above mentioned modified license or birth certificate must be shown a time of voting.  Voting is and important privilege.  If it is important enough for a person, if their privilege to vote means so much, then that person will vote.  Either a relative may submit their ballot (with proof of relation of course) or absentee ballot may be mailed-in with a notarized copy of proof of citizenship.  This notary service would be free of charge at the local post office starting up to the day prior to the election.
Electronic stations should display a running tally of results where an observer/s would immediately confirm votes.

The worst thing to happen to the Democrat Party is Soros and Moveon.org.  What has happened to the party is a disgrace.

It seems that the media were not only in love with Bill Clinton but with Hillary as well.  On a daily basis they focus on her “experience” and “accomplishments”.
Most of which come by way of her being the wife of a former president.  Unless questions are planted and responses prepared, she is not a vibrant or knowledgeable candidate.  She may be marginally in the lead but that will eventually swing as many will see her true colors. 

It is a shame that the next choice is Obama (Edwards isn’t considered...he can’t even win his home state).  Obama doesn’t have anything to bring to the table.  No experience in executive office and his legislative record is meager and myopic.

A word of advice.  2000 and 2004 are gone. It happened.  Seriously do you think things would have been better with Gore or Kerry?  Instead of acting like whining babies who cry “cheater” after getting beaten, accept the facts..make changes to improve..and come back to do the beating. 

I am not a Democrat or Republican.  I am a true Moderate Independent.

It disturbs me that Hillary has been chosen by the media as the candidate that will win the primary. I have voted a complete democratic ticket since I became voting age but, unless it’s John Edwards I’m voting third-party for president.

I also plan to vote third-party for all other seats due to Ms. Pelosi’s blatant kowtowing to the Bush Regime. America is broken and the Democrats are unwilling to fix it. The most pressing issue in my opinion is Election Fraud and until that is fixed the American Experiment has failed miserably.

Two stolen elections and the Bush Debacle spit in the Spirit of the Founding of the (Previously) Freest Nation in history.

Always amazes me how people can get inside someone else’s head and know what their motives and thought processes are. Physic maybe? I also wonder why it is all right, in fact was encouraged in many corners, for Obama to attack Clinton but it’s dirty tricks when Hillary hits back. Seem like a double standard to anyone? Not that I care. I think both of them stink and hope they knock each other down and out so that the candidate I favor, John Edwards, can step into the breach. And all the whining about hits at Obama makes one wonder if his supporters think he’s got a glass jaw.

reply to#118597 by cyrena on 12/07 at 1:42 am
First off the American public including the citizens in New York state are opposed to issuing drivers lic to illegal aliens , Why do you think that the NY governor dropped the plan so fast. First off unlike you the majority of the American public is smart enough to realize that by issuing DL to illegals the state is condoning if not encouraging illegal aliens to come to the USA. Also every Illegal cost the US tax payer about $19 K. The American people know this and that the democrats are pro illegal aliens so look for the democrats to lost big in 2008.

As for the GOP and health care even if you believe the wild reports put out by the far left that 47M Americans have no health care do the math. American has over 300M people now and that means that 253M+ or 5/6 of Americans do have health care and don’t want the far left and the democrats to screw it up. Many American myself included are happy with the current health care system. Also the republican plan to save American money by introducing tort ( that lawsuit) reform is the best thing that could be done to help the current health care system .
FYI junk lawsuits cost the average American family about $5K per year

#118582 by driving bear

Driving bear,

Curious you would note that the health plans of Clinton and Obama are very similar. They are, (and he himself has said the same thing long ago) But, somehow, I’m not surprised that you would mention it. Just a bit late. I think we all know that. But, since you know so much about that, can you give me an idea of what the repug candidates have to offer on this same very critical issue? Or, do any of them even address it? I’m asking only because I’ve certainly not heard anything from any of them myself, but I could have missed it.

As for Clinton and the DL thing, you are not alone in your ignorance. Still, it’s another widespread and dangerous ignorance, that has folks confused and panicked about the wrong stuff. So, for the record, lets clarifiy it. Yes, there is a perceived problem with illegal immigration, and specifically from the south, since we don’t have any of those same concerns about our borders to the north.

Drivers’ Licences have NOTHING to do with that, because DRIVER’S LICENCES are NOT, (and this isn’t complicated at all) PROOF OF CITIZENSHIP. A Driver’s License is NOT sufficient documentation to allow for ANYONE to vote. Period. One needs to be REGISTERED to vote, in order to do that. And, as RESULT of a successful voter registration, the state will then issue that individual a VOTER REGISTRATION/ID card.

THAT is how we all vote. Got that DB? One must be a CITIZEN to register to vote. And one cannot vote, if one is not registered. Ergo, a DL has ZIP to do with it.

A DL is a different document, and the purpose of THAT document, is to allows the holder to legally operate a vehicle in the state where it was issued. (and most others) It does NOT verify national ‘citizenship’ nor can it be used to obtain benefits for which one is not entitled as a citizen.

It is for the purposes of legally operating a vehicle. In order to get one of these things, a person is required to pass an exam, so that they will know the ‘laws of the road’ since everybody should be on the same page with that stuff, if they’re going to drive on public roads with other people. Now of course this same process ALSO satisfies many other purposes, (whether we like it or not). It puts everybody who HAS one of these DL’s, into a GIGANTIC data base, which basically allows the gubbies to keep track of them. (as it does all of the rest of us).

Now, again. You don’t have to be a citizen to get a DL, and drive a car. You can even use your own state issued DL to drive all over Europe if you so choose, but it doesn’t allow you to VOTE in any of those European countries, or to apply for citizenship. It just allows you to DRIVE there, if they accept your license as valid for that. (most do).

To Recap: Illegal immigration and Drivers Licences and Clinton have NOTHING to do with each other. Whatever Clinton’s position may or may not be on ‘illegal immigration’ has less than nothing to do with the issuance of driver licenses. So, if you wanna just do the smear Clinton thing, there’s no doubt that you can find other venues. Just don’t try to use the drivers’ license thing, because, well…it makes you look like you don’t have a clue to what you’re talking about.

Also might be a good idea to tell your friends. This ignorance must be eradicated. It isn’t helpful.

From Bob Dylan:
“Politician got on her jogging shoes,
Must be running for office - got no time to lose.
Sucking the genius out of generosity.
You been rolling your eyes - you been teasing me”
Hoa binh

I think Clinton drop in the polls is a result of her shall we say less than clear position on illegal immigration remember her answer on the drivers lic question in one of the last debates. This in my opinion has cost her some support in the union section of the democratic party and some support with independent voters. As for the author claim that Clinton should go after Obama on the health care issue this would leave Clinton open to an Obama counterattack on the same issue their plans are very similar. Clinton has been trying to walk a tight rope on the illegal immigration issue and if you walk a tight rope long enough you will fall. Clinton “fell” from the illegal immigration during the MSNBC debate and the question of drivers lic fir illegals.
Her only chance is to take a clear stance hard on illegals FYI 78% of Americans support closing the border with Mexico