#106970 by Together we stand…

Together we stand…

This is like the best thing I’ve read in a while. Scary, but it is the absolute truth. One that…well, more folks may be getting to understand, and others that absolutely never will.

On this….

• I find it mildly amusing that the shills and tools of those pushing inhumane agendas will themselves never enjoy the “rewards” of their treason against humanity.

Nope, they’re never gonna see those rewards, but….millions have already been brainwashed into accepting it, because they’ve been promised those ‘rewards’ in heaven. (kind of like the preparation for no health care, and no food, and no housing, etc. Getting everybody ‘ready’)

• All those sheeple with the “W” stickers on their gas-guzzlers and the rednecks who slandered a woman who just wanted to know why her son got killed on someone else’s business trip (Cindy Sheehan) are going to be rotting in the same “Superdome” as the rest of us, abandoned by those they chose to serve in a beautiful but agonizing display of cosmic irony.

All of these folks are sure that God is going to take care of them. Matter of fact, there are about 40 million of them who are trying to hasten the whole thing along. “The Near Enders”. They don’t have to work hard.

I think the worst of it is though, that the majority of the sheeple who have already started down the slop, or are already over the cliff, were the ones who were most smug to begin with. And, even as they fall, they still don’t get it.

Thanks for this. I’m sending it around, (though admittedly, I’ve been trying to get this message across for nearly 8 years. Nobody wants to hear it.)

#107028 by ‘fredo

Fredo,

I agree with you 100%. And, I’m a victim of more medical malpractice than I can begin to describe. (or even want to). But, they’ve been SERIOUS medical mistakes, done in callousness more than ‘inefficiency’ which makes it even worse. The worst was my daughter, whom I lost in her infancy, so I know exactly what you’re saying.

Thing, is...the situations with hospitals and their staffs has EVERYTHING to do with where one lives, the demographics, and the economy and the politics. So, I understand why otherwise healthy people don’t go. That wasn’t the case with my dad, but I still understand.

Those relatives that I have in the health care field are still from the ‘old school’ I suppose, and so they take their work very seriously. My brother sees patients at probably 3, maybe 4 hospitals, when they have to be admitted, and he has complained frequently, about the bureaucracy and the inefficiency that he sees. I think he even had a chief removed one time. It was politics, and nobody else would have spoken up. He did. Unfortunately, not many these days do.

Still, there are some good and committed professionals still out there. And, if we can ever fix the system, and do away with the politics and the greed, we’d all have far better access to far better health care.

There’s something almost obscene about the US being number 37 down the list of nations for health care in general, and things like infant mortality. In the Southern states, Mississippi, Alabama, places like that, our infant mortality rates are higher than most 3rd world countries.

There again, it’s the politics, and the money. You wouldn’t believe the difference in the hospitals in my community where I live now, (Santa Barabara County) and where I lived in Tx...supposedly one of the more ‘urban’ and progressive areas.

The difference is criminal.

It hasn’t always been that way. It is now.

That’s why the MLK Hospital

Leefeller writes:

..."Back then the differences were minor.  My take, the neoconservatives have influence on both parties.  Hope I am wrong."…

Leefeller, I wish you were wrong too, but I’m afraid you are absolutely CORRECT. The neoconns have gained, overwhelming influence over both parties. (by various means). Even people who don’t KNOW that they’ve been influenced, are influenced.

I don’t have any answers, but I think we should all at least be aware of this.

Differences between the political parties may be much smaller than we believe. 

Must always remember the story by Abe Lincoln: He said the two parties are like two drunks fighting without hurting each other, when the fight was over they had each other’s coat on.

Back then the differences were minor.  My take, the neoconservatives have influence on both parties.  Hope I am wrong.

Ah yes, Republicans. Well, they ran out of meanie things to say and do to the Democrats, so they decided to pick on a kid now. Why not? Kids are known for crying, and Republicans are known for invoking tears. Maybe the conservvies wanna make a child cry-by forcing his entire family into poverty.

I for one will be shocked if the Republicans manage to get anywhere NEAR office for the next bunch of years with this sort of moronic policy.

Part 1 of 2 reply to#106897 by T.R.

With all due respect TR, you’re preaching to the choir here. My family has been involved in, (as providers and as patients) in the health care industry for many years. So, I AM in fact aware of all of these ‘factors.

And, I’ll even go you one better, to support your argument about greedy docs, and greedy facilities. This is a true story….

My father (my biological father) died about 17 years ago. He had (as a result of his employer paid insurance benefits, to which he had contributed) what was then called “excellent insurance”. However, he was the ‘perfect’ patient, BECAUSE…he NEVER went to the doctor. (this is not unusual at all, even for what might seem to be ‘reasonable’ or responsible people.) For whatever the reason, (personal fears that there might be something seriously wrong, and they don’t wanna know, or just laziness, or whatever…he had insurance, he didn’t use it).

Then, he got sick. He had (by then) developed meningitis of the brain, and although he had been exhibiting signs of this deterioration, I wasn’t around to observe it myself, and try to convince him to seek and or utilize the medical care that would have been easily within his reach, because of this ‘excellent’ insurance that he had.

After a harrowing experience (that I won’t bother going into) he was finally –forced- to the hospital. His sister called an ambulance, and he fought it tooth and nail, (even through the delirium) for whatever reason(s). My aunt of course felt terrible, because she knew he didn’t want to go. At the same time, we knew that he needed medical care.

He slipped into unconsciousness (actually, he was in and out even before that), once he got to the hospital. Within a day or so, the staff KNEW that he was effectively –brain dead-. I spoke with them, his nurses at least, because of course we wanted (or at least I did) a true evaluation of his prognosis. It wasn’t good. Matter of fact, they didn’t believe that he stood much of a chance to ever leave that hospital, or even recover from the coma that he was in.

AND YET, they kept my dad there, for nearly 10 days…and…USED HIM AS A GUINEA PIG!! They (the docs) performed countless procedures on him, (I can’t even count the number of brain scans and other various things) even though he was in a coma the entire time, even though his brain was quite swollen, and even though there was no way that he would have continued breathing, if not for the machines. I even got into an altercation with one of the physicians who was insisting that my stepmother sign/approve yet another procedure, that based on the doctors’ own explanation, was NOT going to help him!!!So, I talked my stepmother out of agreeing to sign for permission. The doctor did it anyway, after accusing me of some mercenary intentions, or not wanting my father to receive the best care available.

Finally, after about 10 days, (and after they’d used up ½ million of ‘insurance’ benefits) they decided that he wasn’t going to ‘improve’. (which we knew from day one) and so they removed the machines that kept him breathing…in his coma. Of course he passed shortly after that. One might say it was a ‘good thing’ since they had managed to bill the insurance company to the maximum that his policy allowed. The doc that insisted on performing that procedure, (whichever one it was, since they did countless ones) surely paid off his yacht. I wasn’t happy. And, thinking about it again, this many years later, pisses me off all over again.

TBC

Part 2 of 2 reply to#106897 T.R

As for ‘what do I know’ about the billing process? I think I already explained that to you, so I’m not gonna go into again, other than to say that while YOU worked in the industry for 5 years, my own family has been in it for far, far, longer than that, from both the ‘private’ and the ‘public’ sides of the health care industry, and that includes all of the billing. They STILL are. That’s why I was able to provide the very long explanation of the ‘other side’ of it, that you obviously DO NOT know. (and that’s OK, I’m sure you’re much younger than I am, with far less time in it).

So, I certainly do acknowledge the fact that it is a racket, and that there is enormous greed involved. It enriches a small percentage of people, and the insurance industry are the largest collectors of those riches, generally at the expense of those who need the health care. You don’t seem to be able to ‘comprehend’ that, and so it is.

I still recommend that you see the documentary SiCko, just to put yourself into a more balanced sense of reality.

reply to rowman
• Some will say no, this is Bush’s fault but I say no- Bush is not out on the international stage telling everyone how bad we are, what a failure the USA is and what criminals we are.

Outraged, just in case rowman didn’t pick up on your explanation, I just want to add something to it in language that is ‘simpler’ so he may understand.

NO, Bush is NOT on the int’l stage, telling everyone how ‘bad’ we are, and what a failure the US is, and what criminals we are. He’s not ‘saying it’, he’s PROVING IT!! The int’l stage wasn’t ‘saying’ this before we became a failure and representative of criminals. Because, until the Criminals highjacked our government, and began breaking all the laws of all the lands, we WEREN’T criminals, and we weren’t a failure as a nation. We were, (according the world view) the most powerful nation in the world.

So, rowman, seeing as how it IS George Bush, and the Criminal Cable for which he is the designated mascot, that have turned us into this failed state of criminal perpetrators, he doesn’t really have to SAY that. Actions speak for themselves.

And rowman, you just really don’t get it. You don’t seem to get the basic concept of ‘politics’ as opposed to ‘partisan politics’, and that’s unfortunate. That’s why you would say something stupid like this site is just a mouthpiece for the Democratic party. It’s not. It’s a mouth-piece for ‘we the people’ to learn the TRUTH, wherever it may lie. If you don’t get that, then you’re wasting your time and everyone else’s.

Last but most importantly, you are NOT a ‘progressive’ rowman. You’re just a tunnel vision ideologue looking to throw your partisan ideology on anyone who might swallow it. For people like you, (and the Cabal in power) the only way to make themselves ‘look good’ is to make the perceived ‘opposition’ look bad. So, they do the same smearing and all the rest that you have indulged in here. Most ‘progressives’ have figured you out for what you are. An ‘apologist’ for a criminal enterprise.

RE: #106863 by rowman on 10/13

“Nope, not about a child.”

Yes it is. It was about legislation and therefore politics would obviously come into play but Bush vetoed it because Bush protects the rich and big business interests and calls himself conservative and moral. Go figure…
-----

“They backed Bush into a corner knowing he would have to veto it. This is just what they wanted because they get to convince people like you that he does not care about children.”

“They” (who ever they are) don’t have to CONVINCE me Bush doesn’t care about children, I already know that!  Bush doesn’t care about children, he doesn’t care about the elderly, he doesn’t care about the environment, he doesn’t care about the sick, he cares only for money and power.  Everything he has done since he stole the election proves it.  BTW, Bush did not HAVE to veto the SCHIP legislation...why would you say that?
-----

“they knew this would happen to the child and his family. They sacrificed them anyway.”

I can’t even comment on this, but I thought I would quote it in the hope that you would see how silly it sounds.  Your logic is akin to saying it’s the woman’s fault if she’s raped, if she “looks” hot.
-----

“Some will say no, this is Bush’s fault but I say no- Bush is not out on the international stage telling everyone how bad we are, what a failure the USA is and what criminals we are.”

First of all, the world KNOWS what a gaggle of thugs Bush and his Junta are!  Do you think that the other world leaders were born yesterday?  Do you really believe that we have to “let them know”?  Then you say you’re progressive?… Why?… Did you finally address the fact that almost all of our republican leaders were lying, cheating and stealing?  Let me guess, you went from repub. to progressive...that’s quite the jump, do you have long legs?  Since dems are “bad”, they’re socialists, commies for christs sake! (those are lies, really, they are...) Everyone knows that there are dems that are crooked too.  They’ll get the message come election time.

There are progressive dems in office and many more to come.  While a third party would be great, we don’t have a strong one RIGHT NOW, so progressives are running and holding office as dems. 
-----
“I do not trust either party and we should be talking about how “we the people” will fix the mess they made.”

That IS what we are doing.  In America, because of the structure of our politics, we vote, write letters, form committees, support progressive candidates and if we’re real lucky we organize a PAC.  What else is it you think “we the people” can do?

RE: #106542 by Outraged on 10/12 at 9:05 am
Nope, not about a child. Its politics. Pure good old fashion politics. Nothing more, Nothing less.

They backed Bush into a corner knowing he would have to veto it. This is just what they wanted because they get to convince people like you that he does not care about children. They threw this poor kid on the international stage for what? An example? If they really cared about the welfare of this child they would not have put him in such a position to be humiliated like this. Just as they knew Bush would veto, they knew this would happen to the child and his family. They sacrificed them anyway.

This is the games our politicians play and it is not what we pay them to do. Democrats and Republicans are guilty of this.

You ask why I comment here. I am a progressive. Something this site claims to be but I find it to be nothing more than a mouth piece for the Democratic Party.  There is nothing progressive about the dem party. It’s the same old political crap for the last 215 yrs and it will continue to be. They pull crap like this to manipulate their constituents, spin and twist. They have caused world opinion of us to suffer greatly. Some will say no, this is Bush’s fault but I say no- Bush is not out on the international stage telling everyone how bad we are, what a failure the USA is and what criminals we are. They have done all of this for political points – to regain power at any cost. Lie, cheat, steal.

When I see the authors of truthdig writing articles for the dem party – I call foul. They are regurgitating political spin, talking points if you will. There is no truth in this! They have their hand in the $ cookie jar. You too should be outraged about this. I do not trust either party and we should be talking about how “we the people” will fix the mess they made. Instead, these authors just want to pimp their party.

It’s time for a real political party. One that is truly progressive and ready to make real changes.

Great comments!
I started to list you all and realized if I did, my comment would be too long. So, you all know who you are and thanks to all!

And those of you who have no clue, maybe you need to go see SiCKO.

#106635 by thomas billis
I disagree. Having raised my own kids, and homeless foster kids, I think what they have to say is often more insightful than what the adults around them say. Kids should be encouraged to think and speak up. And they should be listened too!

#106500 by rowman
Ditto!

#106486 by PatP
It’s a class thing, I suppose.

As long as the sun comes up and people have problems, you can bet someone out there [usually a so-called conservative] will find a way to make a profit off those peoples problems. So please don’t make the mistake of thinking anyone and everyone jumping onto the “private” versus “public” bandwagon does it because they care.

Golly gee whiz!
Pay attention!

Look at the most excellent example in today’s news of “private” [Blackwater] versus “public” [the military] in Iraq!

Does anyone really believe Prince and his band of gun-happy thugs live to serve for the good of all concerned?

No sir, they live for profit ... any way they can get it!

That fact applies to private for profit prisons.
Private for profit schools.
Private for profit HMO’s and their drug suppliers.
And private for profit health care insurers!

Given the HUGE shortfall between alleged coverage and actual payout that most people discover at a time they are most in need, it’s little wonder that people go bankrupt, or commit suicide when a serious illness or accident comes out of the blue!

But you can bet those HMO’s and drug manufacturers and insurance providers keep their bottom line attractive to investors!

If you have never had to seek emergency medical care, you probably don’t know yet how deficient your coverage is.

Count your blessings. And for goodness sake ... don’t get sick!

Given our current system, that really is the best advice anyone can give.
DON’T GET SICK!

As far as attacking the child goes ... what else can we expect from people who will weep and wail in front of an abortion clinic, but wouldn’t spend five minutes or five cents helping a homeless, hungry real live child! Oh no. In fact they’ll lobby for the city or county or state to drive these kids out of their line of vision.

A friend of mine who made a determined effort to help the homeless kid sleeping in the phone booth on the corner [putting him to work ... helping him restore his self respect] was asked by a customer why he bothered. He responded with a question. “What do you do when you see a homeless person?” The answer, “I cross the street.” Didn’t surprise him.

Now was that customer conservative? I don’t know.
Do all conservatives turn their backs on real live kids in need, the homeless, the sick and the poor? Probably not.

It just looks that way.

So it seems to me a true conservative might want to do something positive to try and restore a decent image. Like recognizing society’s obligation to help the less fortunate. And as far as the kid who spoke out is concerned, his wisdom shines a light on the hypocrisy of those who condemn him, who by their own words condemn themselves.

Deception is a very import tool maybe the main tool for hiding the truth, in this case it seems to be a tactic to take the focus off of Bush. Usually they use Ann Coulter or one of the other dogs to create flack to never ever discuss the issue but instead attack dog someone.

TR writes:Give me a break, about the real issue here?
Like why does it cost so much for these MEDICAL
SERVICES?

One reason for high billing for medical services goes directly to the fact that hospitals provide care to the uninsured, either in emergency rooms or as inpatients.  Providers pay high insurance rates and also for more and more office staff to grapple with the many different forms to be submitted to insurers.  The turnaround on payment by insurers runs from 6 weeks to 3 months on an average which means the provider is giving a float to the insurer who can collect interest on the amount while the provider may need to borrow and pay interest to stay afloat.
There is also the fact that the payment by insurers and government programs such as Medicare is somewhere around 1/3 of the amount or less than the amount billed.
Long gone are the days when a doctor had his office in his house and a single “girl” acted as receptionist, nurse, and biller, handling all of the insurance forms and the insurance company paid the billed amount.

Part 1 of 2 for #106697 by T.R – Naïve

• Give me a break, about the real issue here? 
Like why does it cost so much for these MEDICAL
SERVICES?  While I understand equipment can
be expensive, the services and facilities
shouldn’t be as GREEDILY EXPENSIVE as they are!
I’ve worked for a health insurance TPA, and I’ve
seen what was billed, Unbelievable!
Unbelievable is RIGHT. The insurance companies now pay less than a 3rd of what a procedure cost 12 years ago. Check your HMO’s. (who’s getting the money? Not the docs)
• The Problem is that the Medical Field has become
Mainly BIG BUSINESS, instead of medical practitioners,
in it for the healing of their fellow man.
I think that’s it in the oath, isn’t it?
Or have they added Take as much money as you
can from your patient!  The Billing Services
for these Guys ARE SHARKS!!!! Actually T.R…you don’t know. But, where do you think YOUR salary is coming from. (the INSURANCE INDUSTRY is MILKING EVERYBODY – including when YOU worked for them.)
TR,

One might gather that you haven’t been working too long. One might also gather that you haven’t lived in a lot of places. One might also gather that you’re really naïve.  So, I’m gonna clue you in to some stuff. Every inch of these Continental US is not created equal. Your 25K a year is gonna go a lot further in Arkansas or Texas, than it will in California or New York. You also don’t appear to have any kids. You also have admitted that your employer subsidizes your health care insurance. You are obviously young enough to HAVE coverage, and probably not even NEED it yet.

So, here’s a story. I worked for 25 plus years at a decent paying job, that did in fact provide health care insurance, at relatively low contributions from the employee. Over the years, the employer contributions grew smaller and small, (along with cuts in salaries and other benefits) and the employee contributions grew larger and larger.

Now, at the beginning, say maybe 20 or so years ago, I switched from one of the employer provided plans, (I think is was Prudential, but I couldn’t swear to it) to an HMO. I did it because I couldn’t properly budget for the deductibles and the 20% that was not covered. ALSO, the HMO plan, didn’t require an employee contribution. (It was ‘free”) So, I thought that was better for me. It meant that all of my records would be with the same ‘facility’, and it prevented me from having to hassle with insurance forms. I’d make my co-pays when I needed to see the doc, and the meds were all one price. Within reason for my own budget.

At this same time, a sibling had begun a medical practice, (after devoting a number of years to the County health system in a large urban area). They didn’t get ‘rich’ but were able to work (both of them) to acquire a home, and have some kids, and all of that. Well…here we are nearly 30 years down the road. I was SHITCANNED from my job of 25 plus years, and by the time I was, the coverage for my HMO premiums had gone from zero employee contributions, to being THE MOST EXPENSIVE that the company offered. Meantime, my physician sibling earned the exact same amount last year, as he earned in 1991. That is despite the fact that he saw more patients, and put in tons more hours than he had prior to 2002.

TBC

Part 2 of 2 for Naïve TR #106697

Here’s why. He has continued to treat patients that can no longer afford to pay him, (the OATH) and the INSURANCE COMPANIES, have paid less, and less, and less on each procedure, over the past decade plus. So, what used to be say a $300.00 procedure that they might get $222.00 on, now pays less that $100.00 If the patient can’t make up the difference, who do you think takes up the slack? Well, if you’re a greed doc, I guess you just refuse to see those patients. Otherwise, you are like him…BECAUSE OF THAT OATH.

(which makes you a pompous moron, for painting everything with a broad stroke, when you don’t have a clue)

TBC

And then, there’s me. 27 years plus of corporate slave labor, and I was dismissed just before I would have been eligible for early retirement. No pension, NO health coverage. NO anything. Now of course that happened right about the time that I actually NEEDED the coverage. Now, I finally qualified for medicare. (NOT medicade they say I earn “too much” on my SS income for that) So, we’re talking ‘government provided’ health care, for which I pay $100.00 a month from my ‘too much SS less than 18K, and that’s after paying into the system for 30 plus years) – medicare And, I suspect that because I live in California, my rent might be double or triple what yours is as well. (lost the house/car/etc with the shitcanning) So, I think you need to get a little ‘perspective” here TR.

I am not alone in this instance, nor are my siblings. There are now approximately 47 million uninsured ADULTS and young adults, without ANY insurance coverage at all. So, we’re not gonna blame it on the docs (even though I agree that some of them are greedy). We’re gonna put it right were it is. THE INSURANCE INDUSTRY. (including your government)That would be the HMO’s (since they are now one and the same, the health care provider as well as the insurer, always covering their own profits, above all else) That will include all of the BIG medical insurers, (you probably worked for one yourself) and of course there’s Big PHARMA too.

So, just as soon as we CUT OUT the middle man, (the Insurance industry – which could leave a bunch of folks out of work) we will have more than enough money to provide health care for each and every person, and the docs who provide the service can make –reasonable- incomes, based on the skills that they have trained to provide. As it is now, even MEDICARE pays less than a 3rd of the base price on any medical service, and that’s with me paying over $1,200 annually, just in premiums.

I think you should take a look at Michael Moore’s film, SiCKO, so you can get some exposure to reality. Just because a family was able to own a home 15 years ago, DOESN”T mean that they don’t need heath care. Like, say you just take away their house of some 15 or more years. (to pay their own insurance premiums) Do you have any idea where they might be able to PAY RENT, that wouldn’t be 5 times more than the mortgage on their home?

And, how about those who ABSOLUTELY cannot afford it? What would you call those people. Only the homeless? Do you think the HOMELESS have insurance? I think NOT. And, neither do the folks I know who work 2 or 3 jobs at a time, none of whom have employer provided health care.

Meantime, lets not forget that we drop a few billion a week in Iraq and various other places. Those would be OUR tax dollars, that the government collects quite vigorously.

Wise up about the real deal, and don’t have any kids until you do. They require more money than you can afford.

For those who think the dems are “using” the children.  There may be those whose hearts are “not in the right place”.  BUT, I believe most (dems and some repubs) are NOT grandstanding on this issue, but in fact think it the best and most viable thing to do, all things considered.

I have children (several in fact) and I care very deeply and work very hard so that my children are OK.  If some ass, who also has children “claims” to be “parent of the year” but none of they’re actions support it, disses me....well, I’ll leave it to your imagination, the ensuing dialogue.  Irregardless, the point is; I do care and support my children, so if I say look...this is a good thing to do, I say it’s valid.  However, if “the ass” says; well..I’m a parent too..don’t I deserve the same respect, I say, NO, your ACTIONS have proved otherwise, take a purge!

Republicans, historically, do not support the people when they need help, children are NOT an exception.  In this regard, YES..I think it fair for democrats to show the example.

I think it abhorrent to ATTACK the child and his family.  Excuse me...truth be told, I think people who engage in this type of tactic are sick little low life bastards.

Using children can be viewed as theatrics.  It does seem a bit hypocritical to attack the
Frosts and applaud the “snowflake” children appearing with the President. 

Evidently there are theatrics and then there are theatrics.

“...So why in the world are so many on the right attacking the family of Graeme Frost?...”

It is what they do. It is what they always have done. It is the only way they can win.

They cannot win on the issues ever unless you are involved in a major corporation in one way or another, in which case they are so bent on making you money that they will satisfy your needs and you will vote for them no matter how many innocent people they kill.

It was the same with Cindy Sheehan, it was the same with war hero John Kerry, it was the same with Bill Clinton, it was the same with Al Gore, it was the same with Janet Reno, it was the same with Max Cleland, it was the same with poor pusillanimous John McCain. When some slacker with a boil on his butt can disparage the heroism of a purple heart hero and not draw the scorn of ALL Americans, can instead be applauded by Republicans for attacking the hero, you know that in their topsy turvy world there is no shame and no decency.

The reason they have to attack is because of one simple fact: they have not and will not ever do one single thing to the benefit of an average American. Not one. Oh, they will promise things which they never deliver, but they have no intention of satisfying any but the corporate masters of their governing processes, and strangely they have not been called on this simple fact. Why haven’t you asked them what they have EVER done to benefit ordinary Americans?

The answer is simple and quite devastating, and it is that they have not done one thing, don’t intend to do one thing, and likely will never even CONSIDER doing one thing to the benefit of ordinary Americans, never mind middle or lower class categories. Everything they do is for moneyed people or corporations, and you don’t seem to notice. I guess that might be because you work for a corporation and might get a can tied to your tail if you bring this up---in the same way that Scheer got one tied to his tail for talking about oil in his columns paid for by the LA Times.

How Did a 12-Year-Old Become No. 1 Enemy of Conservatives?

Because being stupid, lazy, hypocritical so called Christians who love to HATE in the name of love ... they do EXACTLY AS THEY ARE TOLD.

These are the people who, had they been standing in the Courtyard when pilot asked “Who shall I crucify, the criminal or this man called Jesus?” Would have screamed, “Kill Jesus!”

They stand naked and exposed. And those who do not see that, will soon enough fall victim to their hate.
Thanks to the ranting’s of these folks the majority of republicans I know now swallow hard and hesitate before identifying themselves as such. And just as many crossed over in the last election and voted for a democrat, many more will again.

For decent thoughtful people, nothing smarts more than being seen as double-dealing scum.

Aside from the easily recognizable “taint” they emit, this behavior indicates how close to desperation they are sliding. History is full of leaders and their supporters who went quite mad when their power was threatened. This is the thing they fear the most.

Too many years have passed since they did things the right way, through hard work and honesty. They don’t remember how. Attack and lie. Vilify and destroy. That’s all they remember now. So as offensive as this is, when we remember how they and their predecessors turned the people against the grieving families, and how they turned the troops in on themselves in order to keep their blood letting going in Vietnam, nothing should surprise us. In fact, it will get much worse before it gets better.
You can count on that.

#106542 by Outraged

How is that neocon sources can lie and even major networks (not Fox) can help to spread the lie. How is this allowed?

A reference to CNN not bothering to get the facts:
In fact, however, Republicans had already made their first move: an e-mail message from the office of Mitch McConnell, the Senate minority leader, sent to reporters and obtained by the Web site Think Progress, repeated the smears against the Frosts and asked: “Could the Dems really have done that bad of a job vetting this family?”
And the attempt to spin the media worked, to some extent: despite reporting that has thoroughly debunked the smears, a CNN report yesterday suggested that the Democrats had made “a tactical error in holding up Graeme as their poster child,” and closely echoed the language of the e-mail from Mr. McConnell’s office.

Neocons are reprehensible because there never was room for heart or mind in their strategies. They have strict goals and absolutely no moral standards to apply to their methods for reaching these goals. It is absolutely Machiavellian. They are extremists who would run over their own mother to squeeze out more profit for or more acclaim from their handlers

Well the conservative posters have certainly validated the nastiness attributed to them. They are a hostile bunch for sure. To pick on a child because the Democrats wanted to put a human face to a real problem, was just too much for them. They attacked with a vengence. The article pointed out the absurdity of their postion, which is protect the wealthy at all costs, and let the less well off fend for themselves. They get all worked up about SCHIP costing too much, but of course there is plenty of money available to allow the elimination of the estate tax which only applies to about 12,000 of our wealthiest citizens each year. The conservatives will trash anybody who get’s in the way of their 19th century view of the U.S. Let’s remember this when we go to the polls in November 2008.

Republicans fear the health care crisis because it keeps getting worse.  It will be an ongoing losing issue for them—hence the viciousness of their attack on the kid’s family.  If the GOP wants to try to take the issue off the table, it needs to come up with viable plans of its own.  It can hardly blame Democrats for making an issue of it.  That’s what politics is about:  choices.

Re: #106500 by rowman on 10/12

“This is not about a child.”

Sorry, rowman but this is exactly about a child.  This legislation was introduced precisely to help CHILDREN.  So everything about this was about a child.  YOU are the one attempting to make it about something else, much like Bill O’Really you spew rhetoric and make up issues because you feel the need to qualify a perverse debasement of poor children.

President Bush wanted a photo op with the young black adult who helped to save the children on the school bus when the bridge collapsed in Minneapolis. Of all people, the man who continues to let the infastrucure of the country deteriorate, repeatedly denies poor children needed services, axes their education dollars..etc...etc.  Suddenly wants a photo op with them.  Kudos, to that young man who had the good sense to say NO.

Your hatefulness toward every issue and everyone who comments on truthdig is apparent.  If you don’t like truthdig, don’t come on the site.  Why don’t you just go to a site where you’ll be in agreement with the issues?  Since it seems that that is what you are looking for.  What is your point?

Contemplate this: Why would an intelligent person take the advice of someone of obviously lesser intelligence, spewing hate?

It seems to me that you come on truthdig for the intelligent conversation so lacking everywhere else and then try to convince us all that we’re stupid or wrong.  An intelligent person would have already understood that that in fact is a suckers bet.  Are you hav