“Saying that if elected we will remove our troops sets
our troops up for an exit resembling the last flights
out of Saigon. There would be nothing left to hold back
the Iraqi’s religious bloodletting.” -Broiler on 9/07

Check out the following under “Ear To The Ground”,
it would appear the violence is escalating prior
to our withdrawal. This would be the type of
evidence that I would say backs my premise.

“Baghdad 9/13 Death Toll Nears 100
UPDATE: The numbers keep rising.”

Thanks Saul,

For putting me on to Thomas G. Donlan and Barrons.
Donlan has been excerpted many times on the net.
I will look to pick up the current issue.

There is such a wealth of criticism of the administration
from the left. Despite the bias I have been impressed and
persuaded by nearly all of it. I look forward to finding
some guts and clear thinking on the right. Change in these
matters demands enlightenment of the majority. Let’s
hope that Donlan is one of many.

Broiler

You want an alternative based on History , try this

In today’s Barrons, Thomas Donlan as Conservative and right wing as they come , although maybe a Libertarian gives a history lesson every troll on this board that still backs Bush should be made to read. he points out that might has never lasted for long and while he thinks we must eradicate the Muslim fanatic terrorists, he doesn’t think we can succeed following the inept leaders and their plans.
He does offer suggestions.
One thing though- one definition of a fool is a person that keeps doing the same thing expecting different results

“Some less then bright person claimed we have to remain
in Iraq or there will be a slaughter there. Says WHO?
Where do people get such idiot ideas that they present
without any evidence or logic.” - Spinoza

Spinoza, were you referring to my “idiotic” comment:
“There would be nothing left to hold back the
Iraqi’s religious bloodletting.”? If so, then says me.

From what little I’m shown in the media the
bloodletting is at a constant level now and
the only thing that has any moderating influence
is the presence and vigilance of our troops.
My opinion only.

I’m not arguing whether our presence in Iraq is right or
wrong, I’m simply stating what I believe it has become.
I believe there is a slaughter there now based on the evidence
available to me without traveling there. I have only logic as
a basis to believe it will escalate once the only viable policing
force has been removed. I’d love to hear why you think it wont.

Do you believe the warring of the religious factions reported
by the media is fictitious? What do you think?

My statement: “Trapped in the middle-east and trapped
by our dependence on the middle-east.” is meant to
recap the dilemma examined in my previous statements.
I’m not stating I believe we should stay.

“There is a lot of nonsense posted here which is disconcerting.” – Spinoza

Are you capable of responding with an alternative to any of the
nonsense or do you simply prefer slamming the posters? There
are a few right wing media types (Hannity, Limbaugh, O’Reilly)
that make a good living from out shouting their opponents.
I find the folks posting here, left and right (there are a few) leaning,
are mostly capable of dialogue without diatribe.

If I am not your “Some less then bright person”, let’s just say I’m
a close friend of his/hers and we’ll go forward from there.

What’s so disconcerting, to say the least, is this thing called nationalism, which somehow renders so many of us incapable of rationally evaluating the actions of our leaders.  President George Bush, for example, takes us into this Iraq war and, initially at least, most of us back him, no matter the war is illegal and immoral.  The same president goes after Venezuela’s Hugo Chavez and, lo and behold, we’re shaking our fists at Chavez, even though, if we were to know more about what he’s doing for the Venesuelan people, especially the have-nots and the left-outs, we’d be telling our president “Hands off of Hugo Chavez.”

It’s as if America was a home team of sorts which we always cheer for, no matter what. Very likely the extreme popularity of sports in our country sets us up for this, with the do or die for old such and such tech turning out to have its counterpart in my country right or wrong, and, as with the chicken and the egg, it’s difficult to be sure which came first, nationalism or sports madness. 

What happens then is that this blind allegiance to one’s team (er, nation), tends to obscure what’s truly in the interest of oneself, one’s family, one’s friends and the general public as well.  Opposing these trade agreements, for example; the ones which are costing us our industrial base and millions of well-paying jobs. Yet, whenever Congress votes on one of these so-called free trade bills, what takes place is that the MSM plays it as if Congress’s passing these trade accords is the best thing that possibly could happen to America.  Except what the MSM leaves out is that it conflates America with the powers that be, not with the American people and, alas, invariably we get screwed.

Which is precisely whats wrong with nationalism, substituting as it does, cheering on the “home team” (ie the powers that be) for doing what’s best for self, family and the public.at large.  Surely it would be in our nation’s interest, as well as in the interest of most Americans, if each of us, instead of automatically rooting for the “home team”, based our decision about what’s good for America upon whether or not, after careful reflection, one believes that such and such would be good for oneself, one’s family, one’s friends and most everyone else too.  Putting it another way, if it’s not good for the people it can’t be good for the country

What’ll happen then is that “My country right or wrong” will become “My country if it’s right and if it’s wrong I’ll make it right.” And we’ll have a government that’s truly of, for and by the people.  Meaning that we the people will have changed the world and nice going in advance.

Interesting post on the part of Lee Driver. Unfortunately, Mr. Rove and Vice President Cheny might be as you say “laughing their asses off.” However, it would only be, if once more, too many Americans fall for their dishonest PR again.

By the way when you speak of the imagination of these two psudo patriots that produces defense weapons. Where was was that imaginative patriotism when the US Army refused to buy weapons that would knock out RPGs in Iraq (which could be purchased now) in favor of the system that it and RAYTHEON are developing that will be ready by 2011!?

The lack of imagination Ms. Goodman speaks of is very much in evidence here in this forum.  Mr. Rove and Mr. Cheney would be laughing their asses off if they read this, which they wouldn’t. We can’t imagine no NASCAR or ATV’s, or solar panels on every roof withoug getting all bummed out, like when that happens we would have lost the war. That’s the same sort of “inside the box” imagination that would conjour up no more MacDonalds as being a sad thing, or that porn and free speech are somehow related. The imagination that continually indulges in coming up with more and better weapons or with designing and building a wall at the border, or a star wars defense system to finally make us feel safe for all time, is imagination yes, but limited to say the least, and not the only way. If you imagine that Steve Earl was taunting that sting ray for the camera rather than it attacked him unprovoked, then now you’re getting somewhere. Fearing sting rays and then using your imagination to kill them is not your only choice. When you see that imagining Iran to be a danger actually has the effect of making them more dangerous, then now you’re getting somewhere with understanding how imagination works, and you could even imagine something else. Sting rays aren’t the problem, it’s the getting in their face. Imagine that.

“Yeah, we go after the assholes who did this [9/11].”

Ah, no. Not quite.

Yeah, we sent the CIA into Afghanistan, which was the correct thing to do, to get those “assholes.”

But, we stopped going after them at some point and veered off the invasion of a country that had nothing—proven again and again—nothing to do with 9/11.

What Al Qaeda did was a criminal act and all the world agrees with that. We went into Afghanistan because we had a right to do so. We had a right to bring Al Qaeda to justice—if that meant killing them in the process that would have been seen as okay by almost everybody too.

However, the U.S. invasion and occupation of Iraq was the worst thing that could ever have happened. That U.S. action has increased the number of “terrorists” one hundred fold.

Perhaps Bush truly believes that going into Iraq was to “pick a place to fight the terrorists on our terms” but as more and more data comes in it looks like the Bush Administration was filled with ideologues who really did not have a firm grasp of history, or perhaps even of reality.

See: THE ARCHITECTS OF WAR: WHERE ARE THEY NOW?
http://thinkprogress.org/the-architects-where-are-they-now/

“And a year from now, I’ll be very surprised if there is not some grand square in Baghdad that is named after President Bush. There is no doubt that, with the exception of a very small number of people close to a vicious regime, the people of Iraq have been liberated and they understand that they’ve been liberated. And it is getting easier every day for Iraqis to express that sense of liberation.”
-- Richard Perle, clearly insane

Most of Al Qaeda remains free. We have lost our way. Who shall lead us back? Certainly not the Republicans.

Reply to comment 22511 by rabblerowzer.

This is the third time I have read virtually this same comment by you today. You have posted it twice under the name Shangrilalad on Alternet, once in response to a piece to Howard Zinn and the second time in response to a piece by Matt Taibbi about Joe Biden. Both those postings were identical despite the content differences between the two articles. Now you have slightly rewritten your comments (not much though, as other readers can confirm by checking the Alternet postings) and posted them here. What do you do, get up every morning, write what you regard as a clever piece (the “wooden Indian” metaphor is as corny as they get and it borders on racism as well) and then see how many different places on the internet you can find to post it? At a certain point does this constitute plagiarizing yourself (especially when you change names from Shangrilalad to Rabblerowzer; do you have ohter names as well?)?

I’ve been reading through postings since my last.  It bothers me that there are so many insults that do not help the discussion.  I posted this on another group after there was some liberal bashing:

Liberal would be one who believes in Liberty.  This is akin to Freedom. 

It has been perverted to mean other things by those who choose to attempt to demonize Liberty.  Typically they believe that they are somehow superior, therefore they should be able to dictate to the inferrior how they should run their lives.

This practice has little regard for anything that would be akin to Freedom although they typically wrap themselves in the flag and wonder why anyone might be disrespectful to the flag that they have perverted.

The flag is a symbol and as I have demonstrated can mean very different things depending on the context.  Liberty and freedom should be sacred and if our flag is used to pervert their meaning then the flag represents the perversion not Liberty or Freedom.  In this instance Free Speach is guarenteed to protect any protest against the perverted Flag.  Especially, if that Flag is MADE IN CHINA!!!

It seems to me that the neo-cons implementation of the PNAC fascist policies are in danger. They are being exposed as just what they are a global attempt to deprive freedom and dictate to the world policy that benefits an elite global ruling class.  The only thing American about it is the use of our military to forcibly disable any and all opposing free thought at the expense of the American taxpayer.  “We The People” are on to the treacherous acts.

Freedom is not something that can be dictated, enforced, or purchased.  Corporatism (fascism) is the enemy of our freedom and blodshed rather in the U.S. or Iraq doesn’t bother its morrals because corporations have no souls.

If there’s one vital skill Democratic politicians have to learn, it’s gut punch retorts. Standing around mute like cigar store wooden Indians riddled with termites, just doesn’t cut it. Anyone too timid, dimwitted or inarticulate to refute the rabid right’s blitzkrieg of absurd lies or childish accusations of “weak on terrorism,” doesn’t belong in politics.

Voters didn’t elect them to be punching bags, we expect them to return punch for punch. If they can’t manage that, then retire, resign or commit suicide.

There is to me, no use in posting here at this website. Sorry but you have lost a reader by not posting my opinion. I read your opinions but you do not read mine...removing your site from my browser..sadly.

“Spinoza to the left of me”
“Hondo to to the right”
“Here I am: Stuck in the middle with you!”

I am fascinated that people like Spinoza and Hondo walk around, breathe the same air, see the same sun and moon, speak the same English, yet both seem to live in total fantasy worlds.

Actually, that’s not true. Both Hondo and Spinoza engage in reductionism--ignoring “inconvenient” facts and reshaping facts to fit their theories.

I live only 25 miles from the World Trade Center--it was our friends and neighbors who lost loved ones in the towers. A kid in my son’s elementary school lost his father. Our sitter lost two friends. My oldest friend escaped with his life. I could go on and on about all the losses because it was RIGHT HERE, where I live.

And the Taliban running Afghanistan gave aid and comfort, and sheltered the people who planned and carried out the attack.  Simple and elegant in execution, devilishly clever in planning.  Yeah, we go after the assholes who did this.  Spinoza can be damned for all I care.  They were in Afghanistan, not Iraq.

“...Congress has the ability to cut of(f) the funding for the war; No funds-no war...”

(a) the Iraq war was BEGUN with funds that the executive “stole” from Afghanistan appropriations.

(b) an inordinate amount of money appropriated by congress FOR the Iraq war seems either to have been lost or, as I believe, never got to Iraq in the first place BECAUSE WE DON’T HAVE THE MONEY to use no matter what congress says.

I don’t believe that congress knows what the treasury department is doing, and I don’t believe that the executive will care whether congress votes the money or not---they will spend it as they see fit, when they receive it from the lenders, and they will tell congress to piss up a rope if they don’t like it.

I also believe that the reason the Republicans in Congress do so little oversight is because they don’t dare have hearings where Democrats are able to ask questions. They have ceased swearing the witnesses so that they can’t be charged with a crime if they lie, and they turn off the lights on Democrats who try to have hearings of their own.

Your congress isn’t doing its job, and it doesn’t intend to do it. It defers to the Bushitter gang of thugs, and it has all but ceased to function. They have legislatures in Cuba and Iraq and China and even in Jordan . . . but none of them have any power . . .

Actually, democracy as we know it died in December of 2000 with the Supreme Court decision in Bush v Gore. That proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that the SC is in the pocket of the GOP, specifically the Bushitter gang of thugs. And if you think there is a way to fix that, who do you propose for the leaders, Frist and Horseturd? Maybe Snotorum and Inhofe? McConnell and Stevens? The only descriptive word I can think of that fits the leadership of the congress is “dysfunctional.”

Does anyone remember the Oil-For-Food program or the no-fly zones declared by the UN after Saddam was given his weapons back after the Gulf War?
Americans were in Saudi Arabia doing the world’s work for it monitoring the no-fly zones.  THAT was why we were attacked on 9/11.  We were in bigoted Islam’s “holy places”.  Never mind that we were nowhere near Mecca or Medina.  The Arabian peninsula could not tolerate non-Muslims on its soil.  To heck with them.  What if we threw the policy back at them? 
Talk about a failure of imagination!  Imagine if the US told the world that this country is too good to let Saudi Muslims into it EVER AGAIN.  For that matter, the recent London plot has convinced us that we cannot allow another Muslim from anywhere in the world to even enter the US. People who believe in violent jihad don’t deserve to know Americans, let alone come here and they certainly don’t have a right to live here.  Try to imagine the world’s reaction to such a policy.
Only after Saddam was deposed did the information come to light that oil-for-food was being manipulated by UN officials and by the three permanent members of the Security Council who were NOT doing the UN’s work in Iraq.
Granted, ending oil-for-food doesn’t come close to making up for the losses we suffered (and continue to suffer) in Iraq, but it has to make you wonder (if leftists still can) how many other ways the American taxpayer is being robbed.  If Kofi Annan has his way then American taxpayers will end up forever funding the world’s bureaucracy, not just our own.
As for being “the good guy”, 9/11 was not a price I was willing to pay to have the world like us.
Those who don’t like America are welcome to just stay home and resist the urge to ask the US for help whenever they have a natural disaster.  They can stop trying to emigrate here.  If our reputation is THAT low and they find us so objectionable, they should shun us.  I dare them.  Let them sell their goods to India and China. 
Oh, I forgot.  India and China are exporters, not importers, and their exports go to the US. 
Given how the world hates us so much, can they please put their money where their mouth is and find a new home for the UN?  It occupies prime real estate in Manhattan which can be put to much better use by New Yorkers.  Since the US is so despicable, surely they don’t want to have to travel to New York to meet one another.  I, for one, will not be upset when the president of the United States is not asked to address the General Assembly.  Only one thing would be better than getting the UN out of the US and that is getting the US out of the UN.

This site is a winner!  What intelligent, well-reasoned comments.

It’s tragic enough that America has become the country to hate, but it is FRIGHTENING that today we are stimulating many smaller countries to get the message that if they want to avoid invasion by the US, a bellicose and aggressive military power, then their only protection is to get a nuclear bomb.

This administration and its prostitutes in Congress want to build an entirely new generation of nuclear bombs.  In recent weeks it has been disclosed that the administration wishes to redesign every nuclear weapon in the US arsenal (which inevitably will require breaking the testing moratorium that has been in existence for a decade or so.)

So we’ve invited you to hate us, world, and now we’re inviting you to blow us to smithereens?

I doubt this will be posted since this seems to be a love-fest (hate-fest) for useful idoits. The good news is that you are not in power and I hope and pray the Amercian people have the sense to keep it that way. You seem as a group to be unable to comprehend evil and instead seek to find a way to blame it on ourselves. It is a predominately liberal disease, this guilt-ridden self hate. Evil must be defeated not appeased. The lesson of 911 is not “talk more and try to get along,” but never again let your guard down and by your weakness invite an attack. You liberals would be the first people wiped out by this fifth century types. Ellen is way off base as usual, but she is consistent with her naive worldview. Sorry to spoil your party. Failure of Imagination is a good name for this article and for your approach to life - it’s all based on imagination and devoid of fact. I shutter to think what the world would be like (or will be like) if you regain power!

If Ellen Goodman were a Palestinian and had endured all the hardship, terror, violence and suffering that Palestinians have had to endure because of our government’s support of Israel’s brutal occupation and colonization of the West Bank and Gaza, I wonder if she, too, would have been “dancing in the streets” at the news that their occupier’s enabler had been the victim of an act of violence? On the other hand, were Palestinians actually “dancing in the streets”? At the time, some knowledgeable persons alleged that the scenes shown on cable television were actually from another time and had nothing at all to do with the 9/11 events and that the original cable news network report (I think that it was on Fox) was intentionally deceptive. So there is at least some question about the authenticity of the “fact” that Ellen Goodman so confidently (and seemingly gratuitously) asserts that Palestinians were “dancing in the streets.”

As much as I thought the article was ridiculous, the comments that followed were down right funny. What a complete disaster it will be for this nation to have such a bunch of hot headed, rabid and common senseless group of people running America should the Democrats win the Congress. Thank God that Bush was our president after and during 911. If Clinton was still in office we would have already been successfully attacked several times by now. Like the numerous attacks prior to 911, Clinton would have talked a big line about being tough on terror and then forgot all about responding. He would have probably used 911 as an excuse to go after DOMESTIC terrorists, like the Branch Davidians.

As far as our popularity goes,its much more safe for America to be feared than loved in today’s world. It’s about time someone stood up for us instead of sucking up to every idiot in the world.Besides one of the main reasons for other countries disliking us is because the Dmocratic Party has gone around for six years telling the world how bad we are, that our president is a tyrant and crook and our military are cold blooded killers, that the president wants to pollute the air and on and on. Lie after lie after lie to damage President Bush by making the country look bad. If The Democrats had supported the president during this war like the republicans supported Clinton during Kosovo, America would still be popular and the Iraq war would be over by Now. But the democrats are so greedy and want power so bad they are willing to destroy our image and reduce our authority. The Democrats don’t care how many people get killed, they don’t care how much we are hated, all they care about it political power, even if it causes irreversable damage to our country.

How can you people honestly consider putting Charles Rangel as head of the Congressional finance committee or putting the convicted criminal Alcee Hastings in charge of the Intelligence Committee. What a disaster for the country.

Congress has the ability to cut of the funding for the war; No funds-no war.

There is a lot of nonsense posted here which is disconcerting.  Mad As Hell is wrong! There was no justification to kill poor Afghan peasants and there is still no justification for doing it. We should get the hell out of Afghanistan and Iraq as soon as possible.  Some less then bright person claimed we have to remain in Iraq or there will be a slaughter there. Says WHO?  Where do people get such idiot ideas that they present without any evidence or logic.  In fact, where logic would indicate the opposite to be true.

Shakes Head.

And the USA/Israel is preparing for war against all Muslims and Iran and Syria in particular.  This will more than likely lead to world war and yet the liberals are good with this policy.  Pathetic.  Insane.

You people elevate the word “idiot” to a new level.  As usual, all I see here is whining, sniveling, whimpering, and a bunch of wannabe intellectuals doing their best to sound intelligent.  As usual, there is no remedy, no solution, no feasible suggestion, no alternate strategy, no serious contribution forthcoming in any of your diatribes and delusional ravings.  Only your nose running, screeching liberal hate-mongering and political correctness, which is supposed to make people think that you have some semblance of honesty, morality, and decency.  You thrive on your own weakness, and feed off your own deluded mentality.  Do something meaningful and good for once, and shut up.

“When we went into Afghanistan in hot pursuit”
The dems were complaining that we could not win or thousands of troupes would be killed and after the successful elections in Afghanistan they are still saying that we are losing. 

I see the people against of victory in the war on terror getting so desperate that they will start succumbing to the idea that; “the enemy of my enemy is my friend”.  They will use this justification to help the terrorist to defeat Bush.

Just as in WWII some Americans went over to Germany to fight for the Nazi we will have people supporting the terrorist no mater how many Americans have to die

I don’t care one whit about Abu Ghraib. What I do care about is our soldiers being held in the brig in Camp Pendleton.  Where is outrage about that?

Sorry; I was not the first poster, but still I didin’t see your entry until now:

“...They are getting ready to take the first step: taking back Congress...”

Congress will make no difference; it is right now as toothless and powerless as an old man of ninety. Cuba has a legislature; so does Iraq; so does Pakistan, and so to does China, after a fashion. The powers have been separated and the Congress made nugatory. Some say that with a Democrat controlled Congress there will be oversight as a result of subpoena power, but they are forgetting that Congress has no ability to do anything but make laws . . . it doesn’t enforce those laws, and it doesn’t have any control over the FBI, the Homeland Security, the US Marshalls, the Secret Service, or any other enforcement agency; all of them are controlled by the executive, and if Congress passes any laws which might restore some of its lost powers, the judicial will declare them unconstitutional, just like it did Florida’s election when it didn’t like the results.

In fact, if the Bushitter gang of thugs want to declare martial law, they can suspend indefinitely all elections, including this one and the one which would replace the moron.

You are not going to get your government back; the GOP has won, and we now are governed by a totalitarian state as surely as was Soviet Russia fifty years ago and as Cuba and China are today.

As Joe Stalin said, “let them have their little elections; we count the votes, and we determine who is installed in office.”

And it really doesn’t matter: any electorate which is so stupid as to elect the likes of Ron Snotorum (or Tom DuhLay) can’t govern itself and doesn’t deserve even to try. I cringe every time I SEE legislators like Inhofe or Stevens.

No, we are not grown up enough to be trusted with the United States. We deserved to have it destroyed by the Bushitter gang of thugs.

I agree that 9/11/01 is a day that united us in a way that we allowed the enemies of freedom to strip our remaining freedoms for the sake of national security. 

It is sad that we believed that all blame should be focused on a man who lives in the caves between Afghanistan and Pakistan.  That man is certainly not blameless, but I tend to think the larger enemy pushed sweeping changes in policy that not only invades the privacy of citizens but it also collects this data and uses it for political purposes to constrain our middle class on all sides, then this enemy takes the children who cannot find gainful employment because it has outsourced everything and uses them to fight battles for the interrest of a few elite and foreign interrests.

Yes, there was considerable empathy for America after 9/l1, perpetrated as it was by Saudi religious terrorists. Not surprisingly, though, this empathy quickly dissipated as our fascist government seized upon the moment to whip up its own jihad against Islam in general and Iraq in particular. It was then that people outside America people remembered that it was the US sponsored sanctions on Iraq that had caused the death of a half-million Iraqi children, and that it was US backing of the Jewish settler-state Israel that had uprooted the Palestinians from their homeland. So the transitory nature, post-9/11, of worldwide empathy for America isn’t surprising. Only by a dramatic shift in our Middle East foreign policy, with justice for the Palestinians as its linchpin, together with calling off those deadly Iraq sanctions and not invading that nation, could America have held on to the boost in popularity brought about by 9/11.

What can our government do that’ll rekindle worldwide popular support for America? That’s easy. Troops out of Iraq now, justice for the Palestinians and an end to all of the US-sponsored terrorism that stokes the fear which underlies most of the violent messianic movements in the world, whether Islamic, Jewish, Christian or American.

And if our government stays the course, what then? The dead-end straight ahead, that’s what. Unless, that is, we the people take matters into our own hands and (by peaceful means) change the world.

“trapped by another failure of imagination.”
- Ellen Goodman

“Trapped” is an apt description of America right now.
We are trapped in this Iraqi civil war right now and there
is no clear way to pull out without carnage rivaling Somalia.
(It looks like it could get there without a pull out.) This war
is like a crying baby. While we’re in the nursery it whimpers
and cries but we’re certain should we leave the room it will scream.
The bastard we took out of power was the only thing holding
the place together. We could have rebuilt the towers and
compensated the victims tenfold with what we’re pissing
away in Iraq. Not to mention the troops we’ve lost.

The political opposition is stuck too. What can anyone offer
as an alternative. Saying that if elected we will remove our
troops sets our troops up for an exit resembling the last flights
out of Saigon. There would be nothing left to hold back the
Iraqi’s religious bloodletting. And then there’s oil, the 300 lb
gorilla in the corner of the room. The excrement will hit the
fan and hawk and dove alike will be thrashed due to the oil
shortage and price gouging that will eventually strike us.
Trapped in the middle-east and trapped by our dependence
on the middle-east.

To prod the American people to cut back on consumption is
a farce. How can our economy survive when it is built on
petroleum for both production and transportation. How many
of us would have to sell our homes, move closer to work, stop
flying, not vacation, stop using plastic, sell our cars, buy new cars
(the list is endless) in order to make a substantial dent in our petroleum
usage? IF we do all these things, the growing oil usage by India
and China will increase the demand and cost of any remaining oil
putting us back in the same boat we were in before conservation.

I’m not saying conservation is bad, just impractical. What percentage
of our population would be out of work if we simply eliminated
leisure use of autos and planes? Las Vegas, Orlando, Miami,
Vail, New Orleans (ouch!), Atlantic City, Branson, to name a few,
would be ghost towns.

Our “failure of imagination” is many fold. Our nation gathered
the world’s greatest minds, spent untold dollars and created the
“bomb”. Why couldn’t this same tactic be used now? Gather the
minds, spend some money and solve the energy crisis. We spend
billions on wars and exploring Mars why not this? My “imagination”
tells me big business controls energy and that’s why we don’t but
that’s just me.

Every home should have solar panels, every municipality should
have wind turbines, every household should own electric cars and
every representative in our government should be working to make
those things a reality. The tax incentives should be mind boggling!
Taxpayers should be seeking these things instead of tax “loopholes”.
What little incentives are in place now are not enough. Individuals
and companies creating these products should receive mind boggling
incentives too. Would the auto makers and oil companies cry foul?
Who gives a crap! We just might see the innovations they’ve been
hiding too. “Imagine” that!

Thank you Ellen!

Much food for thought:

http://www.tomdispatch.com/index.mhtml?emx=x&pid=1 18775So here was my what-if thought. What if the two hijacked planes, American Flight 11 and United 175, had plunged into those north and south towers at 8:46 and 9:03, killing all aboard, causing extensive damage and significant death tolls, but neither tower had come down? What if, as a Tribune columnist called it, photogenic “scenes of apocalypse” had not been produced? What if, despite two gaping holes and the smoke and flames pouring out of the towers, the imagery had been closer to that of 1993? What if there had been no giant cloud of destruction capable of bringing to mind the look of “the day after,” no images of crumbling towers worthy of Independence Day?

We would surely have had blazing headlines, but would they have commonly had “war” or “infamy” in them, as if we had been attacked by another state? Would the last superpower have gone from “invincible” to “vulnerable” in a split second? Would our newspapers instantly have been writing “before” and “after” editorials, or insisting that this moment was the ultimate “test” of George W. Bush’s until-then languishing presidency? Would we instantaneously have been considering taking what CIA Director George Tenet would soon call “the shackles” off our intelligence agencies and the military? Would we have been reconsidering, as Florida’s Democratic Senator Bob Graham suggested that first day, rescinding the Congressional ban on the assassination of foreign officials and heads of state? Would a Washington Post journalist have been trying within hours to name the kind of “war” we were in? (He provisionally labeled it “the Gray War.") Would New York Times columnist Tom Friedman on the third day have had us deep into “World War III”? Would the Times have been headlining and quoting Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz on its front page on September 14, insisting that “it’s not simply a matter of capturing people and holding them accountable, but removing the sanctuaries, removing the support systems, ending states who sponsor terrorism.” (The Times editorial writers certainly noticed that ominous “s” on “states” and wrote the next day: “but we trust [Wolfowitz] does not have in mind invading Iraq, Iran, Syria and Sudan as well as Afghanistan.")~TomDispatch

The war in Iraq might never end if Bushco has its way. What will it take to get people into the streets? The 4th estate has failed us. As long as corporations can make money off the suffering nothing will change. There are two paths to choose revolution or world war, but only one can be non-violent.

Great column! Thanks!
My prayer is that the GOP will decide that our nation is more important than the party.

in the meantime, the democrats,afraid too say anything, sit on their hands and will kiss the election goodbye. unbelievable. i think they all suffer from klinefelters syndrome.

May be its time the war president should be called on active military duty..a service he feverishly avoided in the past by using his family connections.

Back in the day, when minority rights could coexist with majority rule and freedom of speech was taught in every civics lesson, we tended to associate the word “ideology” with oppressive regimes, such as those of Stalin, Hitler, and Mussolini.  The word seemed to have a close kinship to “propaganda;” so we were supicious of it.  Now we have a President talking about “the decisive ideological struggle of the 21st century;” and his supporters have cooked up a blatantly propaganda-laden version of the 9/11 story for television (and, apparently, subsequent distribution to the nation’s classrooms).  Imagine that!

A couple of nits:

(1) no one has connected bin Laden to nine eleven or to Mo Atta.

(2) no one has proof positive that bin Laden was alive on nine eleven or is alive today.

(3) there are 300 million Americans; all but a few thousand of us will live and die without ever seeing, hearing, or being affected by a terrorist in a substantive way, though I admit that you and the rest of the fear mongers have ordinary Americans wetting their pants daily over non-existent threats to their safety.

(4) there is no war on terrorism; there probably is no need for one, because there is no protection one can develop against random violence such as perpetrated by Atta, McVeigh, the unabomber, the Olympic bomber, etc., and perhaps by bin Laden in Africa or the Yemeni against the USS Cole.

Eventually some idiot religious nut like Bush or one of the Iranians or perhaps a Baptist will detonate a nuke and blow away a big part of the world, and no “war on terror” will stop it. If men can do something stupid, they will.

Oh, and you really ought to get rid of the notion that we ever were “the good guys.” That was always our propaganda, but it was never the truth. We’ve always and forever been about stealing oil, either legally or by using force and calling it something else.

Elllen,
Thank your for stating again what is so BLINDINGLY obvious, yet totally invisible to 40% of Americans, and to Mad King George and his flunkies.

I have argued again and again that the war in Afghanistan was justified and necessary--and UNFINISHED so that Mad King George could get us into the war he wanted even before he was inaugurated.  Even then he wanted to find a way to attack Iraq.  Rumsfeld talked about Iraq having “better hard targets” than Afghanistan.  Now we are fighting the re-arising Taliban--AGAIN!  We were the first nation that could have won in Afghanistan, and won easily, but Mad King George has squandered the chance, and as you said, the world’s good will for his imperial Iraq adventure.

Make no mistake: Even if Hans Blix had found hard, solid, take-it-to-the-bank evidence that the WMDs were gone, “Shock and Awe” would have started in March 2003.  The “wag the dog” evidence is pretty compelling.  To effectively fight a ground war in Iraq, it needs to begin in the early spring, just after winter ends, to make major in-roads before the blistering summer heat, and be entrenched before the winter slams in again.  So if it wasn’t March 2003, it would have to wait til March 2004--a full year later when the drummers for war would have gotten tired, when Hans Blix would have had a chance to THOROUGHLY finish his job, and in an election year.

Politically, Karl Rove realized it was absolutely necessary for the war to begin in March 2003.  So no matter the evidence, no matter the lies, no matter the warnings (like Gen. Shinseki’s) the attack was launched.

Now, thousands of squandered and ruined lives later, most Americans have figured out that they were lied to.  They are getting ready to take the first step: taking back Congress.

But the fascists don’t go easily--Just prior to the election, Disney and ABC are planning to air their scurrilous propaganda attempting to blame 9/11 totally on Clinton, rather than Mad King George’s TOTAL negligence, negligence that went right up to 9/10--when Ashcroft cut anti-terrorism funding to the FBI.

Again, thanks, Ellen.