![]() ![]() |
![]() |
| |
|
Rev. Wright RoundtablePosted on Mar 23, 2008
The Rev. Madison Shockley, who presides over a congregation of the same denomination as the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, joins a panel of Truthdiggers to investigate the controversy surrounding Barack Obama’s church. How can a predominantly black church be described as separatist and hateful, Shockley asks, when it is part of an overwhelmingly white denomination? Subscribe to Truthdig PodcastsIf you don't have iTunes, Visit the Podcast Archives Previous item: From Rebellious Republicans to Tasteless Tycoons Next item: The $3-Trillion War Elsewhere: . CommentsAre you a Truthdig member yet? Login now, or register with Truthdig. Add Your Comment |
By asmith1120, April 30 at 7:08 am #
(Unregistered commenter)
You go to the Library and read books like going to a church to celebrate god.
You pick a category of a book because it excites you.
like when you pick the denomination of the church.
You pick your favorite authors because they agree with your understanding, like picking your pastor to agree with your understanding.
I do not agree with Rev.Wrights sermons.
If he has a problem communicating so extreme that he does not care that he has hurt other individuals whom have done him no harm. He is a danger to his flock.
The more I listen the more I have to question what is going on in these churches that allows these behaviors to not be in question ?
Church is a beleif system that you take home and apply to your life.
It’s astonishing, The African American community would vote for a canidate because of his skin color and not his policys.
Then again we all know it was all about putting names into the history books when it came to condeneeza rice.
Is it more important to have a canidate of equal race and will falsly represent their possition or is it better to have a canidate that is oposite in race but can do the job you hired them to do ?
Obama is no DR.Martin Luther King nor does he have the understanding that DR.King had.
Obama’s speech had co-authors whom were not of the same race.
Had Obama been of Dr.Kings prodigy, race would have been over looked and not been Obamas ploy from the start.
Obama was the first to use race when his credentials were questioned.
Have a great day!!!!
Report thisBy Typical White Person, March 26 at 12:39 pm #
Not too long ago a jew was beaten to death in NY, by a gang of blacks, does that make it of for Jews to go out there and slam an entire race because of a few. Awhite man on a train was assulted by a gang of black kids, White guy had a gun, Jesse and Al went after the White guy for defending himself.thanks to the PC we could go on like this all day. Didnt the white people have a little to do with ending slavery.
Report thisBy yossarian100, March 26 at 3:44 am #
I support Rev. Dr. Jeremiah Wright’s free speech rights and Senator Obama’s right to attend whatever church he chooses. They can both say whatever the hell they want. Personally, as a white non-believer and a third party citizen, I don’t have a problem with anything I’ve heard Rev Wright say, although, in all honesty, I have no intention of digging deeper. I consider this a non-issue. The fact that so many people do consider this an issue, to me, is simply tabloid mentality. Who do we question next, the candidates’ third cousins? Wny not? One of them may have had an inflammatory thought at some point, may have said something, at some time, that someone, somewhere disagrees with. Let’s dig it up and discuss it until we all turn blue in the face.
Report thisBy Douglas Chalmers, March 25 at 6:18 pm #
So much for cyrena’s “cultual mind-set”, duh!
Report thisBy cyrena, March 25 at 4:09 pm #
Chalmers,
The TRUTH that I referenced in my post, was in the excellent piece written by Dr. Leon. It had NOTHING to do with all of this tripe you’re putting out here about spirituality and all of the rest.
Rather, it is the TRUTH, AS IT WAS CONTAINED IN THE US CONSTITUTION, and in recorded history since the original document.
It has NOTHING to do with ME being ‘HOLY’, because I’m clearly NOT. I don’t DO ‘religion’, and I’ve told you that about a jillion times.
But you’re a crackpot, so no matter what the topic, you start going on with all this religious stuff, as if it has anything to do with anything.
The article I posted put the cultual mind-set of the African-American community in historical context, with the CONSTITUTION as a reference.
So put down that crack pipe and read. You might learn something useful.
Then again, probably not. I think you’re too far gone. Fried brain cells maybe..or maybe you were born with this abnormal psychology.
Report thisBy Typical White Person, March 25 at 11:56 am #
Yes they are
Report thisBy Douglas Chalmers, March 25 at 9:17 am #
So nice to just agree with the followers of The Ring in this topic and to pander over their desires and their dreams and illusions....... just so that we can “move on” like grazing herd animals .....avoiding all the hard effort ourselves in actually bringing real change in a positive and meaningful way.
But, instead of merely criticizing Obama or Wright - or even the shortcomings of their faithful, lets look at some interesting comparisons as the Obama campaign has already become a kind of religion. With Tibetans and thus Tibetan Buddhism also in the news so controversially, here are some of the good things they have to offer as regards spiritual teachings.......
#By cyrena, March 24: “For those willing to mix a bit of TRUTH with their ‘religion’…”
#By Leefeller, March 25: “Corporate media plays to ignorance, using ignorance like a fine instrument, working on emotions and fears...”
Report thisBy Douglas Chalmers, March 25 at 8:04 am #
Exactly the same kind of thing has been happening with The Ring and Obama worshippers, even on Truthdig, uhh.
Hillary supporters are treated just like your Protestant friend........
Report thisBy Leefeller, March 25 at 5:04 am #
Corporate media plays to ignorance, using ignorance like a fine instrument, working on emotions and fears, Limbaugh and counter parts, taking Wrights comments and making them newspeak using the ignorant is the best and necessary tool used to keep the masses dumbed down.
Our schools seem to be going in the same direction. In order to control the teeming masses, they must be kept ignorant and not so teeming. Entertain them with pablum on the media, cut funds for schools. Education should be for the elite.
Keep the truth well hidden, let people live and think they should fear, fear itself, keep the anointed, religions as one part of the foundation, building on hate and differences. Unity of the people could take power and control from the special ones.
Wright is a great point to keep the necessary hate smoldering, keep it going, keep the difference front of everyones nose. Let the people vote against themselves again.
Report thisBy cyrena, March 24 at 10:24 pm #
For those willing to mix a bit of TRUTH with their ‘religion’… (something the Rev Jeremiah Wright committed..ALAS...it is a felony!)…
Have a read…
The Rev. Dr. Jeremiah Wright and the Audacity of Truth
By Dr. Wilmer J. Leon III
t r u t h o u t | Perspective
Saturday 22 March 2008
Over the past week or so, mainstream media have turned much of their attention to the fiery sermons of the Rev. Dr. Jeremiah Wright. Dr. Wright is pastor to Senator Barack Obama (D-Illinois) and his family. He was also, until recently, pastor of the Trinity United Church of Christ of Chicago.
Most of the discussion and commentary about Dr. Wright’s sermons have come from a predominantly white media. The points of discussion have centered on what they consider to be the “vile, racist and un-American things” said by Dr. Wright. Very few, if any, of the discussions have focused on the historical basis and accuracy of what Dr. Wright actually said.
The major problem with the discussions is they have been largely one-sided. The media have used the imagery of Dr. Wright, clad in African garb, shouting in the cadence of an old-time fire and brimstone minister and playing to the camera as a scare tactic. Has this become the “Willie Hortonization” of Senator Barack Obama?
The reporting and commentary on Dr. Wright’s words have been presented from the perspective of people who either have no appreciation for the African-American historical experience or a personal agenda when it comes to presenting these issues.
Read on...(it’s lengthy but educational)
http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/032208F.shtml
(FYI..posted elsewhere, just because it IS so educational)
Report thisBy G.Anderson, March 24 at 9:20 pm #
When I first became aware of this story, it was because of an in depth analysis by Rush Limbaugh.
Rush was playing the man’s sermons over and over again, and pointing out the juicy points. Taking great pains to examine them in detail. From his unique perspective.
Obviously, we can expect more of this if Obama is nominated, along with in depth interviews of every teacher he’s had from kindergarten forward, and specials on the life story of every one of his relatives to second cousin.
To the Neo-con’s hope must represent a very dangerous thing.
Report thisBy cyrena, March 24 at 8:32 pm #
Typical White Person:
Just so you don’t feel left out, as a Typical Person of Color, THIS VERY SAME THING HAPPENED TO ME,
back when I was a Catholic school kid…
THAT’S when I knew....
no more of this church stuff for me.
They hypocrisy is just too much…
The Indian Way is far better.
Report thisBy Douglas Chalmers, March 24 at 3:51 pm #
How can a predominantly black church be described as separatist and hateful, Shockley asks, when it is part of an overwhelmingly white denomination...?”
Interesting point for a change, Shockley, and perhaps you would like to consider something else that is happening too?
White people are currently exhorting a ‘separatist’ Tibet and expressing their endemic ‘hatred’ of all things Chinese and supposedly supporting Tibetan Buddhists by dishonest and biased media reports (USA + Germany), violent demonstration and malicious screaming or ignorant outbursts on the internet.
In the past, Tibetans have hopelessly confused religion and nationality. It now works to their disadvantage just as it has done with Israel and the Jews. The problem for Westerners is their own fantasies when confronting all of that and they in turn have become hopelessly confused by their wilfully ignoring the history.
With all things religious, they veil a deeply felt need to be part of a group and, sadly, to commune with the group but not the deity the ‘followers’ presume to worship. That is also a racial phenomenon and it was not by coincidence that the church manipulated or was manipulated to ever more un-Christian crusades.
But it is a mistake to think that Christianity is a “white denomination” or at least, religion. Palestine is West ASIA, not somewhere in Europe and that is where Jesus taught and was murdered for his troubles , according to the story. The wisdom he taught flowed from further East, not from the Jews.
But white people think of their religion as “white” and “European” despite all that. They have usurped Christianity and Jesus for their own ends. The latest “crusade” into Iraq and Afghanistan rather proves that Americans and Europeans have nor more regard for the real teachings of Jesus than they did 1,000 years ago.
So, finally, when ARE you going to free yourselves from a slavery religion, Shockley? You really do have to establish your own church and trace your chosen religion back to its real roots in Asia and East Africa in order to find the REAL Jesus. No white person will ever help you do that.
Report thisBy Typical White Person, March 24 at 2:29 pm #
When I was a kid, I tried to bring a Prot. friend of mine to my Cath. church. The nun said no way, and escorted him out the door. Now that’s a clic.
Report thisBy Margaret Currey, March 24 at 1:17 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
The government might have given the black people AIDS but the government surely let men with an uncurable disease have it and pass it on to their wives, is this some sort of racial control? After this government did give the Native Americans small pox after giving them blankets from people who had small pox, Rev. Wright is not far from the beaten path.
What Rev. Wright said might have scared some people but not all the people.
This government does have a control factor against woman, after all when you looked at all the people at Patterson’s swear in, most (if not all) of the politicans were male, this country has quite a way to go for equal justice for all.
Again Rev. Wright might have scared some people but certainly not all, ask those who remember history best.
A lot of people think that race is behind this country, but recently a man in Texas was draged to his death, not too many years ago, our past is not behind us, just forgotten by some.
Report thisBy Bill Blackolive, March 24 at 11:38 am #
(Unregistered commenter)
If we did not have such a tortured society we could get on with reality. Racism got going in the west, and particularly in the US, which was monetarily poor to start, because of money. Only money could have had cattle chained together in a ship, that those alive when landed be put to work. Obama is different in as he can explain in a soothing manner to weaker white people what this all might be about. The nugget of his speech is to say the most segregated day of the week is Sunday.
Report thisBy Bill Blackolive, March 24 at 11:30 am #
(Unregistered commenter)
If we did not have such a tortured society we could get on with reality. Racism got going in the west because of money. Only money could have had cattle chained together in a ship, that those alive when landed be put to work. Obama is different in as he can explain in an acceptable manner to weaker white people what this all might be about. The nugget of his speech is to say the most segregated day of the week is sunday.
Report thisBy Maani, March 24 at 8:29 am #
Leefeller:
“Church can be a nice place for mini power brokers, other organizations can have that happen also. Clicks, cronies etc.”
Farbeit for me to agree with you (LOL), but I do. Strongly. In fact, this is one of my bugaboos with the Catholic and fundamentalist Protestant capital-C Churches: many (if not most) have become havens for just such people and politics. They have become apostate if not heretical, serving mammon and involving themselves heavily in temporal “worldly” socio-politics in ways that give an even worse name to a Christianity that already has a bad one.
I am not suggesting that the Church (and the church) does not have a social responsibility, or that some of those social changes are not tied inextricably to political changes. But there are “ways to do things” and “ways to do things,” and some of them are not acceptable from people who self-identify as “Christian.”
Your comment is insightful.
Peace.
Report thisBy jmndodge, March 24 at 8:10 am #
Historically the prophetic tradition has been to call for repentance and change of direction. Fundamentalistic, revivalistic backgrounds are filled with prophetic style evangelistic messages, painting the reality of eternal salvation or damnation, and calling for personal repentance and commitment to Jesus Christ. A 2nd form of this prophetic tradition is to speak truth to power, and calls for changes in the direction not only of an individual but of a society and nation. The language is also couched in the judgment of blessing of God, but the timeframe for opportunity is shortened, and current events illustrate the call for repenetance. Dr. King combined the biblical and evangelistic style of preaching with a social prophetic style of speaking truth to power. The years following saw the social preachers, leaning less on the biblical prophetic language and drawing more on the language of politics and psychology, while the personal evangelistic style became increasingly focused on individual sins within society - abortion, sexcual immorality, preceived threats to family, and worst of all humanisn.
Dr. Wright, is that strange blend of pastor, who preaches evangelisticly a message of eternal consequense and personal responsibility, while also speaking prophetically within a social context. He offers grace and hope for the sinner, but a warning of judgment of sinful institutions and established practices. The sinner is welcomed, while powers enabeling poverty, racism, militarism, perverted patriotism, and global greed are attacked. After generations of having these messages separated into “liberal” and “Conservative” camps and being able to choose, Dr. Wright assalts our sensibilities with the reality of a both/and or neither.
Power brokers within the church will obviously be offended by Dr. Wright, as will political leaders. Barack even distancing himself from some of the language of prophetic warning. It’s a lot easier to preach prophetically, than to govern prophetically.
Thank you for the discussion. Hopefully local pastors who have easily repeated slogans in touch with their religious spokesman, will now seriously wrestle with real answers to local situations. They need to work to create a middle where truth and understanding sheds light and gives direction. We know both ends, left and right will harden their positions. Let’s be sure that in the middle there is a large enough core to offer hope and possibility.
Report thisBy Leefeller, March 24 at 5:31 am #
Past experience with the politics in a church, can be more ugly and hateful then out side in the real world. People in charge of a Church, with seemingly amounts of power, display the same ruthlessness we see in National Politics. When I look back their may have been money involved.
Church can be a nice place for mini power brokers, other organizations can have that happen also. Clicks, cronies etc.
As an artist and people watcher, I find this all amusing.
Report this