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Why They Hate Us, Part 2

Posted on Dec 2, 2009
U.S. Marine Corps / Gunnery Sgt. Scott Dunn

Stephen M. Walt takes the “especially fatuous” Tom Friedman to task for one of his obstinate screeds. By the most conservative estimates, Walt explains, the U.S. has killed 30 Muslims for every American killed by Muslims, extremist or otherwise.

It’s more complicated than that, as Walt himself acknowledges, but what nerve for Friedman, who by cheerleading the U.S. into war has himself contributed to the death toll, to claim that the reason Muslims hate us is because they just don’t get that “U.S. foreign policy has been largely dedicated to rescuing Muslims or trying to help free them from tyranny.”  —PZS

Foreign Policy:

Contrary to what Friedman thinks, our real problem isn’t a fictitious Muslim “narrative” about America’s role in the region; it is mostly the actual things we have been doing in recent years. To say that in no way justifies anti-American terrorism or absolves other societies of responsibility for their own mistakes or misdeeds. But the self-righteousness on display in Friedman’s op-ed isn’t just simplistic; it is actively harmful. Why? Because whitewashing our own misconduct makes it harder for Americans to figure out why their country is so unpopular and makes us less likely to consider different (and more effective) approaches.

Some degree of anti-Americanism may reflect ideology, distorted history, or a foreign government’s attempt to shift blame onto others (a practice that all governments indulge in), but a lot of it is the inevitable result of policies that the American people have supported in the past. When you kill tens of thousands of people in other countries—and sometimes for no good reason—you shouldn’t be surprised when people in those countries are enraged by this behavior and interested in revenge. After all, how did we react after September 11? 

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By Muscleboy, December 4, 2009 at 9:09 pm Link to this comment

Wrong.  According to very well validated conservative estimates of death of what are mostly civilian Iraqis is from 288 to OVER 300 ***TIMES*** THE NUMBER OF AMERICAN AND OTHER “COALITION” FORCES KILLED! 


Get your facts straight.  You actually have to read, study and do calculations.

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By gerard, December 3, 2009 at 6:28 pm Link to this comment

“Voice of Truth”

N O T   H A R D L Y !  You said it, not me!! It’s an invitatioin for us to take a look and see ourselves as others see us—not always, but all too often.

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By melpol, December 3, 2009 at 11:03 am Link to this comment

A literal interpretation of the Koran can be dangerous if followed by violence. It is
wrong to behead an Infidel or Kafir even if they do not submit to the will of Allah.
Violent extremists must face the fact that others have a right to follow their own

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By voice of truth, December 3, 2009 at 10:55 am Link to this comment

So Gerard, that is an invite for others to come blow us up?

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By samosamo, December 3, 2009 at 8:21 am Link to this comment


I agree there is no 18 month time frame but the 2011 ‘pull out’ or ‘start bringin
em home’ is certainly created to make it appear o is ‘startin’ to live up to his
campaign promises and caviar dreams so people WON’T pay attention to the polls
during election day in 2012 when o hopes to be retained as president, but just
remember ohio 2004 or florida 2000, it will be a time be extra observant cause
the voter fraud is about the only history these crooks can remember and put to
use again.

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By The Mad Loon, December 3, 2009 at 7:09 am Link to this comment

Missing from the numbers in this piece are the Muslims who have died as a result or the US governments support for the Shah in Iran,Saddam,Israel,the Saudi and Kuwaiti royals etc. etc.

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By glider, December 3, 2009 at 1:52 am Link to this comment

>>I fear the same will happen in Afghanistan and may be the reason for Obama’s 18 month time frame<<

There is no 18 month time frame!  That is oratorical posturing plain and simple!  Obama can begin to bring the troops home by 1% and yet replace them with even more mercenaries to keep this “promise”.  Or he can blow it off completely later as he did with little cost regarding his campaign promises.  This has absolutely nothing to do with protecting America and everything to do with enriching the MIC and giving a us a little short term economic stimulation.  Please look at what the man does and not what his silver tongue speaks.  Learn that now if you learn nothing else.

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By the tshirt doctor, December 2, 2009 at 9:37 pm Link to this comment

this is one president who would not get nominated by either party.  he would be called a traitor for weakening our country.

America does not go abroad in search of monsters to destroy. ~ John Quincy Adams

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By Blackspeare, December 2, 2009 at 8:51 pm Link to this comment

Very quickly soldiers in foreign uniforms go from saviors to occupiers.  I remember in Nam being told that the only Vietnamese who like the US are those being kept in power by US forces——in other words the ARVN and the general public could not be trusted.  I fear the same will happen in Afghanistan and may be the reason for Obama’s 18 month time frame.  In Iraq, already the US forces were perceived as occupiers, but have withdrawn to enclaves outside the view of the general public.

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By Ed Harges, December 2, 2009 at 7:48 pm Link to this comment

It would be bad enough if the US were pursuing a crassly self-interested foreign
policy. But it’s worse than that. The most dangerous aspects of US foreign policy -
such as the threatened war against Iran - are being pursued in the interests only
of Israel, and diametrically against US interests, conceived from any ideological or
material vantage point whatsoever.

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By ChaoticGood, December 2, 2009 at 7:42 pm Link to this comment

It’s hard to be a moderate, centrist when someone has their foot on the back of your neck and is pushing your face in the mud.

One of the funniest scenes (in my opinion) in the “Time Bandits” is the one where the time travelers meet Robin Hood.  They call the “poor” and give them alms, then a big guy knocks them down on the ground.  After a few punches, Robin asks “was it really necessary to hit him”, the brute answers “Yes Boss” and Robin shrugs his shoulders and says “Ok”

Welcome to American foreign policy….

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By Paolo, December 2, 2009 at 7:20 pm Link to this comment

As a libertarian, I often observe that Republicans and Democrats are just two sides of the same tarnished coin.

How is Obama’s policy in any way different from Bush’s? Bush focused on an unjust conquest and occupation of Iraq; Obama focuses on an unjust conquest and occupation of Afghanistan.

Ron Paul has been right all along about the dangers of interventionist foreign policy. Mainstream Republicans and Democrats have been wrong all along.

It’s time for a big shift in the way we look at things, especially our alleged right to smash the rest of the world and remake it in our own perfect image.

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By liecatcher, December 2, 2009 at 6:19 pm Link to this comment

Tom Friedman is just doing his job of providing
misinformation,red herrings & fecal vomiting to keep
the public from understanding how the MSM are co-
conspirators with the MASTERS OF THE UNIVERSE in
achieving their goal of world domination. Bush 3 is
accelerating the pace, pushing America beyond
bankrupt in an abyss of debt from which it’s
impossible to escape. Plans to increase ethanol
content to 15% will
increase the number of people currently starving to
over one billion/year & continue to drive food prices
higher. They control the money & food supplies &
there is nothing we can do about it.

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By samosamo, December 2, 2009 at 5:12 pm Link to this comment

““But the self-righteousness on display in Friedman’s op-ed isn’t just
simplistic; it is actively harmful. Why? Because whitewashing our own
misconduct makes it harder for Americans to figure out why their country is so
unpopular and makes us less likely to consider different (and more effective)

Testament of how corrupted our mainstream media is which is why the only
emphasis is always placed on others that always hate, and for far too long and far too many times, that have convinced the msm controlled portion of our country really have become to believe the lie ‘Why do the muslims hate us so much?’.

And though there are muslims who hate,  it has basically been the
‘fundamentalist’ part of that religion and for the differences in the different
beliefs from all over the planet BUT, now we are looking at those muslims who
are NOT of the fundamentalist extremism who are beginning to hate us
because the u.s. ‘leaders’ just keep on killing and destroying those people and
for economic and trumped up security reasons, which the msm controlled
vegetables in america still believe we are at risk.

I’ll say this again, though it may not reach anyone’s notice, why is it that
something so vague such as the ‘war on terror’ is made to make the americans
think that america cannot defend itself from being attacked?

And what was once a part of religious differences of ‘hate’ is now a realization
that now the question is for the muslims ‘why do americans hate us so
much?’ because of the billion plus muslims on the planet, no where near all of
those billion+ hate americans.

And americans(the msm variety) would only be able to get a glimpse of their
answer if some nation blowing hubristic baloney about how ‘divine’ they were
came in and started killing and destroying our country.

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By gerard, December 2, 2009 at 4:38 pm Link to this comment

1. By our noisy, unreserved public behavior we have annoyed many people as tourists in foreign countries. And by our general lack of interest in and knowledge of their cultures and languages.

2.  By our seeming to flaunt money—far more money that they have—we have aroused envy and jealousy.

3.  By national bragging, in advertising, in public statements and private conversations we have aroused scorn, envy, disgust, shock and disbelief.

4.  By military aggressions, maintenance of bases, unilateral assumptions of righteous power etc. we have caused pain and loss which we refuse to admit or apologize for.

5. By assumptions of superiority in culture, religion, freedom, wealth, power, modernity, corporate power, and domination of media we have aroused a lot of free-floating scorn, envy and fear.

6. By insensitivity to the needs of others we have inspired hatred.

That’s enough for now. My experience is that, as individuals we are often well-liked, but as a class we are not admired.

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