Now here is an event worth following closely.  A chance to actually learn from others!  A chance to transcend our deeply ingrained perceptions, and laser-like focus on the United States and how Americans “feel” emotionally effected, and learn first hand how others view events that have nothing, whatsoever, to do with American’s daily lives or the U.S. government.

-

Radical reading at the Israeli-Arab book club

A groundbreaking new literary event offers new paths to understanding in what often seems an intractable conflict….

The Middle East generates huge amounts of news coverage, but as the New Yorker pointed out last month, only recently has literature documenting people’s daily lives in the region started winning western readers.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/booksblog/2010/feb/08/radical-reading-israeli-arab-book-club

One of the sad characteristics of contemporary Western society is the tendency to embrace noble lies. These are assertions and acts that don’t square with reality, with what we see and hear — and are voiced for apparently noble social purposes. Here are a few politically-incorrect examples.

Israel. We are inundated with constant talk of the “Middle East crisis” and “the need to restart the peace process.”

Why? Is there a new Goldstone report on Tibet? Are the American people sleepless over the divided city of Nicosia? The brutal Turkish occupation of Greek Cyprus? The rough Russian annexation of Ossetia? The callous treatment of Muslims by the Chinese?

Of course not. A noble lie is that there is a “Mideast crisis” at all. “Occupied land” is not unusual. Palestinians are no more refugees than Cypriots or Tibetans. The IDF is far more moral a military force than the Russian or Chinese or Turkish army.

The reality? Hating Israel as a unique aggressor is simply predicated on five unspoken truths: 1) rampant anti-Semitism (one can hate Jews by the loftier notion of being “anti-Zionist”; 2) fear of radical Islamic terrorists; there are apparently no radical Tibetans hijacking planes or blowing up Madrid train stations due to Spanish ties with communist China; 3) oil, oil, oil. The Cypriots cannot enlist the Greeks to withhold 500 billion barrels of oil in the Aegean from world markets. If such a fantasy were true, Nicosia would be on the front pages; 4) Israel is Western, like the U.S., and in a most un-Western neighborhood, so hating Israel is a mechanism of hating the U.S. on the cheap; 5) demography. If there were a billion-person Orthodox community energized by a half-billion Greek-speakers, we most certainly would wish to solve the “Cyprus crisis.”

The truth? Money, fear, and age-old hatreds all are masked by “principles” and “morality.”

BR549,

“..... most Iranians under the age of 30 look toward the United States to help them topple the current form of government.  You will not allow yourself to believe that and it colors your perspective.”

Where do I get this crap?  Living in Iran for over six years.  Visiting, eating, and playing inside several dozen Iranian homes.  I got my “crap” from spending hundreds of hours saying little, asking much, and authentically listening.

Where do you get your “crap”?  Is it derived from the real world or does your crap originate from television, books and the Internet?

It is certain that you will not allow yourself to believe anything I’ve written on this subject.  You have arrived at your conclusions after many years of, seemingly, seeing things all together differently.  What you have not done, however, is listen to Iranians.

This is a good space to point out that your grievances on U.S./Iranian relations mimic those of the governing Mullahs (the great Satan narrative).  Not those amongst the tens of millions who make up the Iranian working and university class (America as a place freedom and individual liberties are practiced narrative).

-

I have not ignored, nor am I oblivious to, the things you’ve opined.  I simply haven’t learned anything from you.  You hold every common Western misconception I have ever heard.

I told you exactly what I’m interested in.  You seem unable or unwilling to participate.  That’s quite alright with me, however, if you do know anything regarding Iran’s foreign policies (not what you believe in regards to U.S. foreign policy) I will engage you in an honest and open discourse.

If, on the other hand, you wish only to convince me that the world revolves around the U.S., that the ills of the world are caused by the U.S. and that every policy intricacy of every nation on the globe involves the U.S. you will find me disinterested.

BR549,

So far your context is in regards to how the entire globe revolves around the evil United States.

Your narrative concerning Iran revolves around the United States and the Persian’s noble struggle to avoid being subjugated by evil corporate Americans. - I understood that the first time you wrote on the subject.

I asked about Egypt and Iran and you turned it right back to your feelings regarding the United States.  You wrote nothing on the relationship between Iran and Egypt.

I asked about the relationship between Iran and Syria and, again, you turned it right back to your feelings regarding the United States.

I asked about the relationship between Iran and Saudi Arabia.  Iran and Jordan.  Iran and India/Pakistan.

I asked if it might be possible to have a conversation on Iranian foreign policy.  So far you seem unable or unwilling.

-

You Write: “It appears that you want to discuss the issues of the current moment”

It’s interesting that you assumed so much into what little I wrote.  Particularly, from my perspective, when I had quite the opposite in mind.

-

The bulk of the Iranian population is male, single, unemployed and under the age of 30.  They do not recall, nor do they care, about the Iranian revolution of 1979.

I can convey to you by way of first hand experience that most Iranians under the age of 30 look toward the United States to help them topple the current form of government.  You will not allow yourself to believe that and it colors your perspective.  You are not seeing or listening to Iranians.  You simply apply your own Western perspective onto them.  They would think this highly arrogant.

Most want to listen to Western music (which they love), they desire Western out-sourced jobs, they desire a good education and wish the liberty to hold hands on public.  Those are their root concerns.  Believe it or not.

Most Iranians are oblivious to the world as you see it.  The majority of Iranians hold the United States in very high regard and would condemn you for speaking so ill of a system they would like to emulate while, at the same time, keeping to their Persian identity and traditions. 

Frankly you would be hard pressed to find an Iranian who would agree with you on the subjects of the United States or the current state of affairs in Iran.

-

You wrote something concerning how most Americans know so little of Iran.  How what Americans do know of Iran shines through the lens of American media.

My years in Iran taught me that the Iranian government concerns itself a great deal more with her immediate neighbors and the region than they do the United States.  It’s actually you who puts a tremendous amount of focus on the U.S. and it’s actions.  You hold a very Western-centric knowledge of Iran.  You believe the world orbits the U.S..  It does not.

Go Right Young Man, February 7 at 10:45 am

“You claim that I am dead wrong in regards to Iran.  So my obvious questions
are fundemental if we are to continue the conversation.”

Well, let me correct myself. I think your personal experience living in Iran has
surely given you a perspective that most Americans are totally ignorant about.
I’ll give you that. On the same token, though, a foreigner could ask Americans
about the effect of US influence peddling, and get ten different answers from
ten different people. The sad part of those responses, however, is that those
responses are all based on personal interpretations that were generated by the
media those people elected to view in order to support their own unique
version of the way the world works, etc. Everyone, it seems, is an armchair
expert on foreign policy.

“What is the relationship between Iran and Egypt, Iran and Saudi Arabia and Iran
and Syria?  How many times did Iran threaten the globe by mining the Strait of
Hormuz?”

I was just reviewing a March ‘09 article in the LA Times that all but said that
the US is open to diplomacy on the nuclear issue ..... so long as Iran does it our
way, which discounts entirely Iran’s feeling the need to protect itself from
western cultural invasion. As surrounding countries have either been occupied
by the US or adopted centrist viewpoints, such as Egypt, one would almost
expect Iran to mine the strait if it thought it still retained sovereignty over that
area, which it had in the past. So, why is this even up for discussion? Still,
Hilary struts her ass in there with her “Our Way or the Highway” approach and
it’s no wonder why we have a stand-off.

While Mubarak is trying to be all things to all people in his call for diplomacy, it
still comes down to the fact the US and its corporate interests will use any
diplomatic opportunity to buy time to figure out a way to do an end run around
Iran’s power structure, ultimately turning Iran into another Iraq or Afghanistan
........ and everyone knows this. It’s all the same lame-ass US bullshit and
politics because the US doesn’t really respect any country’s boundaries anyway,
and certainly if it feels we can get away with overtaking it. Look at Diego
Garcia.

“To be frank; it’s impossible to discuss Iran if we cannot discuss the above
issues.”

I doubt that. It appears that you want to discuss the issues of the current
moment, but that moment can change from day to day, while I’m trying to
address the long term trends that the US has continually shown to be its policy
..... and it isn’t a pretty picture. US corporate interests covet Iran and that is
still the problem.

And if Syria chooses to align itself philosophically with Iran, I don’t have a
problem with that. I think a lot of tensions would have been alleviated if the US
just helped the Middle East be the Middle East it needs to be, rather than
continually set the stage for a NWO takeover of all the countries in the region.
The problem is that the US has a problem with the word autonomy, unless it’s
talking about its own.

BR549,

You claim that I am dead wrong in regards to Iran.  So my obvious questions are fundemental if we are to continue the conversation. 

What is the relationship between Iran and Egypt, Iran and Saudi Arabia and Iran and Syria?  How many times did Iran threaten the globe by mining the Strait of Hormuz?

To be frank; it’s impossible to discuss Iran if we cannot discuss the above issues.

Go Right Young Man, February 6 at 7:54 pm

“What can you tell me about Iran’s diplomatic relationship with Israel and Saudi
Arabia, Egypt and Jordan, Afghanistan and Pakistan?  What is Iran’s foreign
policy regarding Syria, Lebanon and Hezbollah?  How many times has Iran
threatened the world by mining the Strait of Hormuz? What’s Iran’s position on
the disputed borders of Kashmir?  How many times has Qatar accused the
Iranian government of espionage and political assassination? What has Iran
stated to be her long term regional goals?”

If you’re testing to see how fast I can get up to speed on the issues, forget it.
It’s irrelevant. Iran is currently enjoying some decent relations with those
European countries that continue to respect its existence. We would do wise to
do the same.

“Is it possible to hold a discourse on Iran while never mentioning how you
personally feel about the United States and/or Israel?”

With me? No. You seem to ignore the vacillations in Iranian ideology that have
occurred over the years, and that the US has done exactly the same. One
minute Iran is our best buddy (as long as WE think they want to sell us oil) and
the next minute, when we think they won’t, they are now a terrorist state.

“What can you teach me about Iranian foreign policy?”

Well, I kinda liked the issue over the Tunbs (Greater and Lesser), myself. There
are a slew of other island in question, but they ALL used to be under Persian
rule, period. Now, for some reason (mostly because of modern western
interpretations of boundaries that would better favor British, and now US,
interests) all these newer delineations seem to work against any country that
doesn’t happen to to agree with US foreign policy.

Because of the interference, primarily of Britain, over the two World Wars,
Britain seems somehow qualified to keep sticking its goddamn foot in the door
and either control or dole out parcels of other peoples’ lands as it sees fit (i.e.
1971). Same thing happened with the Hussein-McMahon, Sykes-Picot, and
Balfour Agreements with respect to Palestine and Israel leading up to WWI.

You want to pigeon-hole this issue for some reason. I don’t know why that is,
but the fact remains that we (US and Britain) always seem to have a problem
respecting other countries’ boundaries.

Assassinations? All the UAE fingers are pointing to Iran, even though Iran is
being claimed by 22 regional nations to still be working in a cooperative
economic tone. Why do you think those other countries can seemingly stay so
squeaky clean when they can rely on our CIA to do all their dirty work for them
with respect to Iran?

BR549, February 6 at 6:29 pm

Interesting points of view.  But I’m interested to know if I can learn anything in a conversation regarding Iranian foreign policy.

What can you tell me about Iran’s diplomatic relationship with Israel and Saudi Arabia, Egypt and Jordan, Afghanistan and Pakistan?  What is Iran’s foreign policy regarding Syria, Lebanon and Hezbollah?  How many times has Iran threatened the world by mining the Strait of Hormuz? What’s Iran’s position on the disputed borders of Kashmir?  How many times has Qatar accused the Iranian government of espionage and political assassination? What has Iran stated to be her long term regional goals?

Is it possible to hold a discourse on Iran while never mentioning how you personally feel about the United States and/or Israel?

What can you teach me about Iranian foreign policy?

I had gone to school with a number of Iranians and had lived with a women for
several years who grow up outside of Shiraz. After that, we went in two different
directions; she, to graduate school in engineering.

One could say that they have been able to ward off, to a great degree, much of
the oppressive onslaughts of western civilization, as so many other sorvereign
nations have not been as able to do. They’ve retained some western standards
and discarded others that didn’t allow for the retention of their culture. I can’t
argue with that. Sure, Khatami’s influence was more modern, by western
thinking, but then, Ahmadinejad’s reign is not unlike that of Bush43.
Personally, I think either one of them (Ahmadinejad and Bush) would throw
their own culture under a bus if they thought they could get any political
mileage from it. Same with Obama. The world is producing political prostitutes
in every country, or I might better put it that the current global stressors are
forcing these opportunistic individuals to more quickly ram their twisted
philosophies down their countrymen’s throats.

As far as the Iranian people, though, how are they really any different from
anyone else you know? They aren’t. They are decent, hard working people.
They don’t have any grand illusions of overthrowing Christianity or democracy,
unless they are having to remotely consider doing so, preemptively, to save
their own culture. Was the Native American Indian response any less valid, or
was manifest destiny something that the white man was solely entitled to?

I lived in Korea for a couple years and found that country under the same
constraints that we have, as well as Iran; ruled occasionally by a plethora of
hypervigilant whackos presiding over a population that merely wants to retain
its own values and identity. But the problem comes into the picture when
OUTSIDERS try to evaluate the workings of OTHER countries and they do so
with their own limited understanding. They don’t really understand the other
way of thinking, so it must be crushed.

I’m not saying that Ahmadinejad is a nice guy or that Khatami was perfect, or
that all Iranians are peace loving and there isn’t a single terrorist in the
country, but when you look at the lunatic ravings of of some of our own saber-
rattling politicians and couple them with our near out of control CIA and the
constant pressure of corporations to continually try to swindle resources from
isolationist countries, who are we to judge anyone, let alone Iran, who has only
really become a problem after the Iraqi and Afghani dominos had fallen?

I’m sorry, but I think our own heavily influenced and paid for politicians spend
too much time actually creating the terrorist responses that we, the American
people, are having to pay to ward off. For whatever mistakes Iran may have
made in the past, we, as Americans, are certainly in no position to judge them.
I still believe that Israel is the single greatest obstacle to world peace and will
be for some time. I’m not speaking for the peace minded within the Israeli or
Jewish population, but the Zionist mindset just has no tolerance for anything
that it perceives to be a threat. Rather than negotiate, they just take it all. The
Israelis have been infiltrating our own nuclear program since the early ‘50s and
yet they have the temerity to insist on Iran not having nuclear weapons. If they
are so insistent on a soultion, let them dispose of all their nuclear weapons first, with
the promise of US and UN protection from Iran ..... which, realistically, would not be needed,
but Israel doesn’t trust ANYONE. It only takes care of its own interests.

BR549 - “There is so such more about the Iran issue that you didn’t bring up.”

You’re absolutely correct.  It was not my intention to go on at length about my six-plus years spent living in Iran.  It was enough for you to know my mind.

“we can always expect to justify our vilification of anything (Iran) does that flies in the face of our perverted foreign policy.”

Now I know your mind on the foreign policy of, I assume, the United States.  I’m a great deal more interested in what you know of Iran’s foreign policy.

Go Right Young Man, February 5 at 1:47 pm

“And I’ll disagree with you on Iran.  There is no clearer example of a threat
today.  Iran is a self-described and openly active enemy of the United States
and most of her allies.  Iran is a clear threat to her neighbors and has rightfully
been isolated in the region.  Iran has been active in acts of terrorism for over
two decades and can never allowed to obtain nuclear weapons.  Iran is the
protectorate of Hezbollah and another self-described enemy of the West,
Hassan Nasrallah.”

There is so such more about the Iran issue that you didn’t bring up. Unfortunately, I don’t have time to get into it here right now. We reap what we sow and right now the US is marching deeper into the Middle East with an intentional chip on its shoulder.

You’re dead wrong about Iran, but only time will tell. Of course, if we keep instigating a confrontation along with Israel, we can always expect to justify our vilification of anything it does that flies in the face of our perverted foreign policy.

BR549, - “I’ll guarantee you that by this time next year, you’ll be singing a much different
tune.”

Please do tell now.  Anyone supportive of Ron Paul can’t be half bad.

“He’s (Beck) continually a day late and a dollar short.”

Truth be told I rarely listen to or watch Beck.  But I’ll give him kudos for predicting the down-turn of the economy a full eighteen months before it happened.  Surprised by that?

And I’ll disagree with you on Iran.  There is no clearer example of a threat today.  Iran is a self-described and openly active enemy of the United States and most of her allies.  Iran is a clear threat to her neighbors and has rightfully been isolated in the region.  Iran has been active in acts of terrorism for over two decades and can never allowed to obtain nuclear weapons.  Iran is the protectorate of Hezbollah and another self-described enemy of the West, Hassan Nasrallah.

BR549, February 4 at 10:02 pm   (I’ll respond to what I had said earlier)

“So, keep making your psuedo-intellectual dismissive cheap-shots. I’ll
guarantee you that by this time next year, you’ll be singing a much different
tune.”

Look, GRYM, it is far to easy for any of us to sit behind our keyboards and
anonymously unleash our frustrations on people we don’t know. For my part, I
apologize for that. The fact remains that the actual NEWS of what is REALLY
going on in this country and the world is reaching more and more people, and
they are coming to realize the futility of these wars we started, the occupations
we, the citizens, are having to pay for, the continuation of our hegemonic
surge through “deals” with countries like Ecuador, and the totally unnecessary
saber rattling with Iran.

We have seen the enemy and it is us. I served my country many years ago
overseas amid the filth of a third world country, yet when I came home and up
to this day I found many fellow citizens here who feel somehow competent to
comment on people in other countries. They have   N O   I D E A !!!

I don’t mean to sit and exchange epithets with you (GRYM) or anyone else, but
our population is being forced onto a rather steep learning curve, as many
people are quickly finding out. I spoke with one receptionist in the Midwest on
the phone yesterday and it soon became apparent that she had been having
doubts, herself. While husband was listening to Glen Beck, she had decided to
seek the truth elsewhere and was actively pursuing it. The lady was becoming
conscious.

I’m not saying Beck is a “bad” person, but he airs a fear and emotion driven
entertainment show. He’s continually a day late and a dollar short. His
audience, like Limbaugh’s is slowly coming to grips with the fact the population
has been lied to and stolen from for years; at least so much so that now they
can’t ignore it anymore by watching inane shows like American Idol, because
too many people are defaulting on their mortgages or losing their jobs.

It was the conspiratorial efforts of the Bushes and the Clintons, and the
legislative power brokers who authorized the breakdown of our manufacturing
base. Though Reagan was the one who made most of the guilty politicians
realize the true potential of the plan, Obama is now carrying the same ball.
This is why he continually refused to comment on NAFTA, etc. during the
election; because too many in his voting base would have started to question
his motives. So, the Republicans have been lied to by their own politicians and
the Democrats have been lied to by their own politicians, and NOW, many of
them are beginning to say, “Once burnt, twice shy.” The problem with this is the
old scenario where you put the frog in the pot of water and THEN turn the heat
up, and then he’ll just get used to it as it kills him vs. if he was thrown into a
pot of hot water, he’d leap right out. Americans have been slowly conditioned
to avoid in internal confrontation and to blame everyone else around us for
problems that are in-house. That is our problem and why we have the diversity
in TV and radio hosts. Most people stubbornly continue to believe that it just
can’t happen here; that’s as the bills are piling up, the BMW gets towed away
over the horizon, and the husband just lost his job ...... again.

Hannity, Limbaugh, and Beck are doing a great job of keeping their listening
audience mesmerized; meanwhile, the heat continues to rise.

BR549, February 4 at 10:02 pm

You waste your time attempting sanity and honesty with this one. Never mind his overwhelming arrogance, never mind his penchant for lying through his teeth ( for example I cannot remember ever having defended Keith Olbermann, though, in fairness, I might have in some offhand way once. Nnor do I even watch his show) and even disregarding his egotistical perversions of truth. Even disregarding the way he whines for links when he has never in my memory provided any of his own despite citing fact and figure ,apparently from memory.

Simply the way he is continually skewered continually by [b[DBM in their rather lengthy exchanges yet posts as if he represented himself with any honesty or integrity, or isnt a laughing stock or caricature here, which I offer, he certainly has become.

Go Right Young Man, February 4 at 11:30 am

“I like to consider facts over blinding emotion.”  (Oh, please.)
” I don’t know, I’m just odd that way.” (I’m not even going to touch THAT one.) 

“Glenn Beck’s cable program, the fastest growing cable program in history, is
on at 5p drive time when many people are still shuttling their children about
and cooking dinner.  When the East Coast is still at work.  Yet his last Tuesday
program clocked a little over 4 MILLION viewers (ouch).  Contrast that with
Manchild’s hero, the sick and bigoted Keith Olbermann, and his PRIME TIME 8P
slot which clocked a minuscule 800,000 viewers.  Add to that the horrible
realization that Becks 2A reruns enjoy a larger viewership than Olbermann
live!”

...... and because 300,000,000 Americans plus others around the world are still
spending money every Xmas season on little red and white fat guys driving a
sleigh, you’d interpret that Santa Claus was real. Glen Beck’s ratings may be
4Million, which I wonder about, but he’s just emotional entertainment for
retards who will be turning on a football game or American Idol right after his
hour of misinformed drivel is over.

I actually do turn to other news sources on a weekly basis, if only to
understand what some people are choosing to listen to in order to support
their myopic understanding of the universe. For instance, while I voted for
Obama by default (since Ron Paul was no longer in the race) I did turn to Fox
News on election night to see how the other side was handling it. Well, we can
forget any semblance of professional journalism here. No longer are we graced
with the objective styles of Huntley and Brinkley or Walter Cronkite. No,
instead, I have to watch Brit Hume turn ashen white as he looked like a 5 year
old whose pet puppy had just been run over in front of the house. Then, to top
it off we had conspiratorial Karl Rove throwing cheap potshots at Obama.

In past elections, more professional journalists would have discussed the
potential future strategies of the losing party and what might happen politically
over the next four years, but no, the American public had to endure the
pathetic drivel of these two idiots as all they could do was express sour grapes.

As for Keith Olbermann, I stopped listening to him. His ratings were headed
downhill long ago, not because of the material, but because he would get too
wrapped up in personal interpretations. That does not mean for for one minute
that what he had started out saying during his popularity was not valid. He just
kind of reverse-Limbaughed himself out of the popularity picture. The best
thing Olbermann did do was to call for Bush’s resignation, which few at the
time could understand. Now, we know why.

So, keep making your psuedo-intellectual dismissive cheap-shots. I’ll
guarantee you that by this time next year, you’ll be singing a much different
tune.

Manchild,

You still have horrible reading comprehension issues.  I didn’t offer to sit down with you for a meal.  I offered to pay for the meal if, at any time, you are able to actually prove anything you claim.

The offer still stands.

-

Still waiting on those poll numbers you claimed were “everywhere”.

BR549, February 4 at 10:24 am

More overly emotional vomit.  Good grief.

-

Your last post seems to indicate that you see eye to eye with Manchild quite a bit.  If that be the case then I can imagine how difficult it is to realize that he was unable to locate a single national poll which indicates anything but a minority status in his opinions and beliefs.

If Manchild succeeds in locating a garbage poll, such as the Daily Kos, I will then submit several highly regarded national polls which clearly illustrates that his particular brand of views are shared by roughly 8% of the nation.  A minuscule minority that few pay heed to.

It’s difficult to realize that next to no one takes you seriously.  I sincerely sympathies with your pain.

-

I like to consider facts over blinding emotion.  I don’t know, I’m just odd that way.  So here’s an illustrative fact for you both to chew on.

Glenn Beck’s cable program, the fastest growing cable program in history, is on at 5p drive time when many people are still shuttling their children about and cooking dinner.  When the East Coast is still at work.  Yet his last Tuesday program clocked a little over 4 MILLION viewers (ouch).  Contrast that with Manchild’s hero, the sick and bigoted Keith Olbermann, and his PRIME TIME 8P slot which clocked a minuscule 800,000 viewers.  Add to that the horrible realization that Becks 2A reruns enjoy a larger viewership than Olbermann live!

You two are the fringe almost everyone makes sport of.  That must hurt TREMENDOUSLY!

Go Right Young Man, February 3 at 12:12 pm

“For the time being it’s safe to say you live in a fantasy world of your own making. 
The United States, taken on the whole, is Right of Center, however, mostly Center. 
Your views represent a minuscule minority (roughly 8%) on the extreme Left.”

Then, sleep well, tonight. With enough people thinking like that, we’ll be erecting
pictures of our next Commisar in a few short years. You really need to get out
more often and find some other viewpoints beside Glenn Beck’s or that idiot
Hannity. You’ll probably find that the yardstick you are using to measure that “8%”
has shrunk over time, .......  A LOT ........ not unlike with Alzheimer’s.

The day you actually prove a single opinion you hold I will buy you and one of your family members a complete steak dinner.  You can hold me to that.

Do you honestly believe I would break bread with an ass like you?

Manchild,

Obviously you have failed to locate even a single poll in support of your asinine claim!

The day you actually prove a single opinion you hold I will buy you and one of your family members a complete steak dinner.  You can hold me to that.

-

For the time being it’s safe to say you live in a fantasy world of your own making.  The United States, taken on the whole, is Right of Center, however, mostly Center.  Your views represent a minuscule minority (roughly 8%) on the extreme Left.

Still waiting on those poll numbers you proffered, Little One.

The Manchild moniker is reserved just for you, Little one.

Still waiting on those poll numbers you attempted to pull out of your odorous and thunderous dark hole.

Call me petty, however, I do so love your posts.  You go far to make me look good. LMAO….... thank you!

BR549, January 9 at 11:19 am

You have almost arrived, GRYM descending into the personal means you are one the right(figuratively) track. You may even succeed in being called “manchild” if you expose to much about this guys silly world view.

BR549 - “This isn’t about Republican or Democratic ideals.”

-

Now, for the first time in the last few hours, you’ve said something worth reading.  The rest was overly emotional crap.  Good grief!

By Go Right Young Man, January 9 at 11:03 am #

“I admit that I’m now confused.  Did President Obama once have the world to
do his bidding or he never had the world to do his bidding?”

I’m afraid you’re just going to have to take some extra Sominex tonight. I said
what I said. I stand by what I said within the original context. It doesn’t have to
be taken literally in order for it to fit the situation under discussion; that is, of
course, unless someone is anally trying to focus on issues that have no
relevance whatsoever.

This isn’t about Republican or Democratic ideals. This is about fear stricken
voters not being able step out of the house they built with six deadbolts on the
doors and bars across the windows. Like I said, you need to get out more.

BR549, January 9 at 10:54 am

I admit that I’m now confused.  Did President Obama once have the world to do his bidding or he never had the world to do his bidding?

Go Right Young Man, January 9 at 10:07 am
“So you’re now being very clear that Obama never did damn near have the entire world at his bidding?  That, in your literary license, you mis-characterized the mood of the globe?”

Why is it that people over-focus on their own misinterpretation of surrounding events ....... and then they hold a grudge against everyone who can’t support their deluded sense of reality. THAT’S why I left the Republican Party after so long. I didn’t shift to the left. I realized that BOTH parties were heading over the falls, which points out another issue.

The myopic constituents at both ends of our current political spectrum can’t seem to sleep at night knowing that other people out there refuse to see political leanings in a linear fashion, those who might instead employ two or three dimensional thinking for their rationale. The myopians’ frustration is their own personal baggage they bring into the discussion forum because they can’t see any other possibilities beside their own.

Thank you Ardee, January 9 at 10:01 am, for providing such timely and accurate research.

BR549 - ” I was using literary license and well under the speed limit.”

-

So you’re now being very clear that Obama never did damn near have the entire world at his bidding?  That, in your literary license, you mis-characterized the mood of the globe?

I understand the need of the far right to run from truth, after all, what else can they do to support or prop a ridiculous ideological position both extreme and extremely stupid in nature, having as its real substance only negativity, no real plan other than tearing down the other guys plans.

I am no Obama supporter by any means, but when I see an implication that Obama was not popular abroad, a typical rightie strategy, never mind how dumb it makes them seem, I simply gotta respond.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/09/19/AR2009091902553.html

Obama’s Worldwide Star Power Finds Limits
Skepticism Abroad Echoes Doubt at Home
(By Mahesh Kumar—Associated Press)
 

Eight months into his presidency, Barack Obama has become a global celebrity, far more popular abroad than he is at home and sometimes eclipsing foreign leaders among their own people

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/04/06/opinion/polls/main4923710.shtml
As President Obama concludes his well-publicized trip to Europe, Americans are more positive about the respect accorded to a U.S. president than they have been in years, according to a new CBS News/New York Times poll.

Sixty-seven percent say world leaders respect Mr. Obama, while 18 percent say they do not respect the president. That’s a sharp contrast to the response when this question was asked about Mr. Obama’s predecessor, George W. Bush, in July 2006: Just 30 percent then said the president is respected by the leaders of other countries.

http://flowingdata.com/2009/05/26/worldwide-obama-buzz-visualized/

An analysis of world wide support during the inauguration from the geeks at MIT..Pretty cool stuff actually.

http://ngs.ics.uci.edu/blog/?p=1062
Comments concerning Obama popularity from abroad.

http://www.rnw.nl/fr/node/12910

Those darn liberal Dutch just love Barack to pieces….

Now obviously hopes and dreams begin to fade as the reality that Obama is just another right wing tool sets in, yet the point remains that, like Clinton before him, Obama entered office a very popular guy. He coulda and shoulda been able to capitalize on that.

Go Right Young Man, January 9 at 12:58 am

In other words it was too tough for you to simply say that, in your passion, you
misspoke?

Actually, no, I was using literary license and well under the speed limit. I suppose
you’ll take that phrase literally, too, and pick it apart. You need to get out more
often!!!!!

BR549, - “If someone told you to “Go jump in the lake” or “Go F—k yourself”.......

-

In other words it was too tough for you to simply say that, in your passion, you misspoke?

Go Right Young Man, January 8 at 8:58 am

“The attitude in your original statement -damn near the ENTIRE WORLD AT HIS
BIDDING- is simply incorrect.  Your original statement takes the entire globe
out of all context.”

——————————————

Do you take EVERYTHING so literally? Some comments are obviously made
rhetorically and were never meant to be anally dissected by someone with too much time on his hands.

If someone told you to “Go jump in the lake” or “Go F—k yourself”, would you
oblige them ....... or sit there and argue about the water being too cold or that
you hadn’t done your stretches today?

I’M OUTTA HERE, I’ve got other things to do. So should you.

BR549 - “Obama had damn near the entire world at his bidding”

If you look back you’ll see that my issue was with your original statement.  You have twice since revised your statement.

I’m not any kind of wizard.  I’ve simply paid attention to global information and attitudes.  The attitude in your original statement -damn near the ENTIRE WORLD AT HIS BIDDING- is simply incorrect.  Your original statement takes the entire globe out of all context.

Oh?

What makes you such a goddamn wizard that you can make a statement like
that?

Obama may have never been the world’s savior; I never tried to portray him as
such, but (and I’ll repeat this for you again) MANY PEOPLE AROUND THE
WORLD thought that that at least we had a chance to change the course that
had been set by the Bush Administration.

Personally, I had my doubts because the son of a bitch would never commit
himself to stating his position on the Trade Agreements. But when election
time came, I felt that this guy couldn’t let THAT MANY people down, but I
guess he did, and even worse than Bush.

If nothing else ....... those people could at least say, “Anybody but Bush (or
McCain).”

BR549, January 7 at 9:07 pm

-

You had first suggested that the new president’s popularity around the world was both universal and, in some ways, a global mandate on his perceived global agenda.

I am saying you have not been reading or following Central or South American, Far Eastern or Middle Eastern, and a great many Eastern European information and news.

wildflower,

You misunderstood the context of what I wrote on the issue of visa’s.  I was responding to the context in which Ms. Zegart outlined.  What she write was very narrowly defined.  No more.

I am aware of the rest of what you write.

Go Right Young Man, January 7 at 12:57 pm

At the time of the election, a good many people, both here AND abroad, were
HOPING to be able to breathe a sigh of relief, and that wasn’t just in this country,
alone. While there were probably many people either sitting on the fence or
reusing to believe anything was going to change, it does remain that, at least back
then, many people were hoping this soon-to-become traitor would stick to his
word. Such was not the case and people all over have realized that it’s back to
business as usual; wire-tapping, body scans, bank bailouts, scandals, military
expansion; take your pick.

RE GO RIGHT: “The issue of visa. . . is a matter for the diplomatic corp.”

No, Go Right, believe there is more to “visas” that what you suggest:

“. . . his father, a prominent Nigerian banker, had met with the CIA to warn that his son seemed to be embracing extremist ideology.

Although that information was noted in some intelligence reports and Abdulmutallab’s name was added to a larger terrorist database, the information was never processed in a way that caused Abdulmutallab’s visa to the United States to be revoked or his name to be placed on a “no-fly” list.

In a statement Thursday, the Department of Homeland Security said Abdulmutallab’s extremist views arose in a routine check of passengers traveling to the United States from overseas by the Customs and Border Protection agency.

Homeland Security officials said they flagged Abdulmutallab as someone who should go through additional security screening upon landing, but they emphasized that the available information was not enough to deny him access to the flight.

http://www.truthdig.com/eartotheground/item/white_house_releasing_details_of_security_issues_on_flight_253_20100107/

I still posit that until the attack of 9/11 is really investigated,
then everybody is relying on what the american msm, cia and
that absolutely a piece of crap of a president are telling the
people and all of these msms, cias and the previous president
will be found out when such an investigation happens, besides
the use of our military with extremely unrealistic budgets and
funding for trying to hunt down and fight a few fanatics that
other countries in the world seem capable of doing as police work and investigation and are actually making results is just to bazaar to think a necessity which pretty much puts the lie to what america’s government and military are doing besides wasting our money and needlessly scaring the hell out of folks which according to the news more americans are well aware of what to look for and how to react when some character begins to act suspiciously.

IMPEACH O!!!!

wildflower,

I’ve looked over the piece by Ms. Zegart and remain resolute in my opinion of the intelligence community.  The issue of visa’s, I believe, is a matter for the diplomatic corp.

I would still lean toward making all necessary changes in security and applications while allowing that mistakes will be made.  That “heads should roll” is, in most cases, unnecessary.

RE GO RIGHT’S COMMENT: “No heads need roll over the panty-bomber successfully getting through screening nets.  No one person is at fault.  That type of thinking is both childish and unhelpful.”

I dunno, Go Right.  You might want to go to The Reality-Based Community site to check out Amy Zegart’s comments on this:

“I have to say, when the President has to announce a new policy that suspected terrorists will now automatically have their visa status checked, I’m thinking we have a common sense problem on our hands. Somebody actually has to be told to do this as an official policy?”  http://www.samefacts.com/

BR549, - “Obama had damn near the entire world at his bidding before…...”

-

BR549, I hope you begin taking in “news and information” from around the globe and not just the American media.  This notion you hold that the world was Obama’s oyster is simply, demonstrably and unequivically incorrect.

ONLY the Western media played the 2008 election as if the world loved the new American President.  There are roughly four billion more people on the globe (the majority) that did not fall in love with Obama.

Put simply; believing that President Obama was universally revered the world over takes the entire globe out of context.

RE WaPo: “The administration has been criticized by Republicans and some Democrats for intelligence lapses that allowed Nigerian Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, allegedly carrying undetected explosives, to board the Amsterdam-to-Detroit flight”

Ever since Bush/Cheney instigated their War on Terror, I’ve felt that the majority of Republicans and some Democrats have demonstrated a rather cavalier attitude toward the 9/11 Commission’s recommendations, unscreened airline cargo, airport passenger security, and the issuing of foreign visas. Since foreign terrorists rely on visas to get into the U.S. and onto passenger airliners, one would think that visa policies, airport security, and the recommendations of the 9/11 Commission would have been firmly in place some time ago - long before Obama even thought about running for the Presidency.

Observer, January 6 at 5:32 am

Oh, please. Obama had damn near the entire world at his bidding before he systematically reneged on his promises and slid further to the right than Bush, if such a thing was possible.

If anyone is bringing down Obama, it’s Obama, himself, and I voted for the traitorous dipshit.

If you want to get a sense of what is REALLY going on here, connect the dots as to why Clinton completed Bush41’s NAFTA plan and then renegotiated the Paraguayan extradition treaty so BUSH43 could scoot out of the country to his new 99,980 acre estate, in case something went wrong under his watch. Is it any wonder why Ken Lay is currently hiding down there?

Clinton also initiated the illegal wiretapping intrusion, which Bush43 just took full advantage of. Then, when Bush43 couldn’t finish the Iraq/Afghanistan quagmire, but managed to bail out his Wall Street buddies, Obama still thought it necessary to continue chasing down bin Laden while virtually bankrupting the country, giving even MORE money to Wall Street. BTW, what do you think happened to the money that Wall Street stole in the first place? It went into countless Caribbean estates and Cayman and Swiss bank accounts.

This has intentionally been spread out over successive administrations so that the average idiot can’t point his finger at just one president as being the problem.

How, for God’s sake, do you see that as being part of a sour grapes GOP getting back at Obama? We have two democrats totally in bed with two Republicans, all conspiring to set up a NEW WORLD ORDER that is fundamentally high treason. They should all be hung for what they’ve done to this country.

So o gets to keep playing off this one incident from almost 3
weeks ago so that the people will hold on to this while
forgoing the turnaround of mccain trying to get legislation
passed to restore the glass-steagallman act to regulate the
financial terrorists again, but no o is trying to stop that from
happening; there is a whole piece on this site, truthdig, right
now about this so what o is doing is the classic scare tactic w
& dick pulled to keep attention away from how o is screwing
americans again for the benefit of his financial terrorists
handlers.

And the one thing I remember about that incident of 3 weeks
ago was that how alert and aggressive the other passengers
were to the danger the saw themselves in at that moment.

o can go to hell, he was and is just a financial terrorist plant
in our government that was easy to persuade a big enough
segment of americans to vote a ‘black’ man as president
negating the regular use of voting fraud as was done in 2000
and 2004 which I feel is back firing on o especially because it
sure sets him up as a miserable failure or down right
unpatriotic lackey to the financial terrorist for the first ‘black’
(really mulatto) president who has intentionally deceived not
just his own, but everyone who looked towards his campaign
promises as hope and relief from the previous w & dick.

2010 The Year Of Resistance

Actions You Can Be Involved In

                              “An eye for an eye would make the whole world blind.” - Mahatma Gandhi

By Cindy Sheehan

“January 05, 2009 “Information Clearing House”—Three events over the holidays have caused me great consternation and they proved to me that I am not so cynical and jaded that my government can’t still shock me.

Of course, the first event has to be the “Crotch Bomber.” The Crotch Bomber story poses more questions than answers and, of course, Muttalabad has already been tried, convicted and virtually executed by our media who have formulated an open and shut case against him without questioning any details except for “lax” security at airports and possible intelligence “failures.” Credible eye-witnesses have said from the beginning that Abdulmutallab was ushered through the system at Schilpol airport in Amsterdam (an airport I have flown through twice in the last month), by a “sharp dressed man”—but the problem is apparently that we have not been subjected to perverted full-body scans every time we fly. So what is the U.S. regime’s answer to this incident: give more military aid to the unstable regime of Yemen to fight “terrorism” in revenge for Abdulmutallabs’s failed attempt (which was apparent revenge for U.S. drones killing dozens of innocent Yemeni’s just days before) AND subject air travelers to either the full body scan, or full body search.

The next event that has me worried is the fact that eight CIA agents were just the victim of a suicide attacker in Knost Province, Afghanistan. The attacker was also an agent and one of the eight dead. What motivated this attack? Did he attack the CIA because it’s an agency that is the model of peace and democracy all over the world? No, despite what the toady media and Obama say—the CIA is a hated agency involved in assassinations and coups all over the world (giving us the map and blowback we see today) for decades and the CIA has also been drone-bombing the crap out of Pakistan.

A recent report stated that 700 civilians have been killed by those bombs, and only “five” suspected Al-Qaeda—if we can even believe that figure—the liars are the ones telling us this. So what’s the word about these killings coming from the Robber Class? The word is “revenge,” even though the assassinations were also revenge for something extra-legal and morally reprehensible that the CIA is doing.

The third incident is the U.S. military’s execution of eight school children in Kunar, Afghanistan. According to reports, the U.S. military flew in helicopters from Kabul to Kunar and entered a house, rousting out eight children (seven from the same family), handcuffing some, then dragging them out and summarily executing them. Have you heard of this “Haditha” or “My Lai” incident from your Robber Class “news” channels? I didn’t think so.

As far as I am concerned, each one of the people involved in this horrific incident must be punished to the fullest extent of the law: from the soldiers who flew the helicopters, to the shooters, to the one (McChrystal?) who authorized this atrocity!”

================

Click on link for the rest of article:

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article24330.htm

I see this whole “intelligence” situation as yet another institution that the U.S. has allowed to erode into mediocrity along with our roads, bridges, air traffic control system, schools, and infrastructure in general.

What did anyone expect from the systematic dismantling and discrediting of “government” over the last 30 years? Certainly, we have been able to come up with the financial and human capital when it comes to the military (we simply keep all that spending off the books), but when it comes to investment in systems that matter, Americans cry and whine like a bunch of spoiled brats: “Oh, we can’t afford that!”

So, now that we are being rewarded by all of this military spending and meddling in the rest of the world, the turkeys have come home to explode. We have a population that’s scared of its own shadow. Americans seem to be getting dumber as the years pass. It hardly seems as if we have a country worth “defending.” After all, is all of this worry really intended to protect regular folks like you and me, or to insulate the venal masters of our economy who have basically sold us down the river?

I know, mrfreeze is cranky today but I’m sick and tired of reading all the criticism of the President regarding this. It has taken years of incompetence and neglect to get us to this point. It didn’t happen overnight.

I’d like to add one more thing: The key to understanding why it is virtually impossible to stop “terrorism” is clearly illustrated in “The Godfather” part 2 when Michael is in Cuba and watches a man blow himself up in the street. He mentions later to his colleagues that people who are determined to kill themselves this way simply cannot be stopped. Perhaps art instructs life in this instance.

Olama doesn’t know the meaning of the word responsibility.  This is just one more episode whereby he blames someone else, looks all mad and crap, then walks away, most likely to go play golf again.  It’s really ironic that he seemed to be so worked up about this, 13 days after the fact, when he and “big sis” continue to play the see no evil, hear no evil monkeys.

Heads should roll?  People should be put on trial?  Treason?  The Intelligence agencies have failed?

-

The intelligence community (16 known agencies) is working at 110%.  These people are some of the hardest working individuals in the United States. 

Several dozen attempts on American soil have been foiled in the past five years alone.  NOT A SINGLE foreign born plot has been successful in over eight years!  It is not for a lack trying.

NO HEADS need roll over the panty-bomber successfully getting through screening nets.  No one person is at fault.  That type of thinking is both childish and unhelpful.

-

Anyone who believes these attacks are occurring due to U.S. policies or the occupation of “other nations” has never taken the time to listen to what individuals like Zawahiri, Nasrallah and bin Laden has been teaching.

When thousands if individuals make it their life’s goal to attack inside the U.S. common sense tells us we should and can expect some to get threw.

It’s impossible for me to believe that this was an actual terror event if the heads of Napolitano et al don’t roll.  If you hired a bodyguard and they fusterclucked the first assassination attempt on you, would you give them a second chance? 

The only things coming out of Washington that are believable are f*ckups and the screwing of the non-wealthy masses. 

At this point, I’d rather have Borat than Barack, at least there’d be some entertainment value.

Where there’s a will, there’s a way…....

“There is nothing that cannot be done if one is willing to die in the attempt.” Jesus Christ said that in so many words….

The root causes of terrorism are to be found in our occupation of nations, our installation of puppet governments that fail to carry out the will of their own people and our theft of the natural resources of others to inflate our own life styles.

The solutions to such acts of terror will not be found in military solutions, that only increases them. Obama simply is not a leader, has no clue how to lead and can only continue to make things worse on several fronts.

So here we are again, looking like fools..tearing each other to shreds for some political mileage, is this what we really need? 

I hate to break it to you, but the only one looking bad right now is you, because people believed in you, and you compromised all that belief away until it was worth less than nothing…

Taking responsibility, is the key here…

you can’t just talk tough, you’ve got to be tough, not just dreams and a romance with hope..

At this point I think it’s questionable that the Democratic party can even survive another election, hopefully what emerges from the ashes, will be free of the baggage that destroyed this one…

Can we please have a Revolution? I’m not talking about that Ron Paul crap, I’m talking about Paris 1792! Will it take some horrendous world war or total social collapse to finally get us to get serious?

Remember the Movie, “Total Recall” with the full body x-ray scanner.  Amazing how life imitates art!  What they should do is give each person who undergoes a full body scan a photo of it so they can show it to their physician who may spot some tumor or other affliction——this may actually prove to be a medical miracle.

Protest these disgusting body scanners!!!
http://www.prisonplanet.com/alex-jones-calls-for-mass-resistance-to-implementati
on-of-body-scanners.html
Airports Set To Become Primary Peddlers Of Child P0rn
http://www.infowars.com/airports-set-to-become-primary-peddlers-of-child-p0rn/ **Change 0 to o **
http://www.infowars.com/military-industrial-complex-set-to-make-a-killing-from-b
ody-scanners/
http://www.metronews.ca/halifax/live/article/413749—naked-airport-scanners-to-b
e-installed-in-11-airports-within-two-months

Blackspeare, January 5 at 10:40 pm

You pretty much covered all the bases. Now, if Obama is really that same
sincere guy we had elected a year ago, the one he passed himself off to be,
perhaps he’ll realize that forcing this perverted body scanner crap on U.S.
citizens is one sure way to get his whole party booted the f_ck out of
Washington. Maybe some of those lame ass politicians that either can’t or don’t read what they’ve been signing will listen then.

While he’s going about lambasting the intelligence agencies, perhaps he could
also elaborate on why we have shadow groups from the US choreographing
these false flag events in the first place.

The only thing I would add here, though, is that we would probably have a
much more favorable world opinion about us, and have much less need to even
have all this security, if we weren’t being continually haunted by the past and
present criminal behaviors of our large wealthy banking and political families.
Maybe they should be forced to be scanned as they get onto their private jets,
as well. That’d be a kicker.

Yes we need to increase security. No one is really denying that. What we should object to is the hysteria caused by this attempted terrorist act.

I’m appalled at Al-Queda being described as being evil geniuses. They are not COBRA to our GI JOE. They put explosives in their undies. These guys are more Dr. Evil than Professor Moriarty. Every single terrorist attack on US soil in recent history (including 911) could have been easily stopped if the intelligence systems in the US had worked at a 6th grade level.

The truth is, the enemy is not great. America’s intelligence weaknesses are. There is no excuse for anyone’s civil liberties to be squashed until the intelligence systems are working at 100%. All this baloney about air port security is a misdirection. We should be calling for the dismantlement of the intelligence systems of the US and a rebuilding of them so they actually work. People need to be fired. Systems need to be redesigned. This isn’t the time for blind patriotism. This is a time to recognize that the system isn’t working and it needs to be fixed.

And the first step in combating terrorism is to remove the terror from our reactions. Fear leads to politicians using such fears to promote their own agendas and create unnecessary wars.