Dave, I find my previous post a bit sharper biting then I would have preferred, may have been an early emotional response to the tradgidy. 

Grabbing the minds of men seems part of the plan, it may all be connected to the human only ability of oneupmanship, and a desire to feel important,... we have all seen it and I have even entertained it myself on more than one occasion. Though, I am trying to give it up!

RE: “You have not answered my question.”

of course not - no opportunity provided - besides there was no intention
of an answer - not wanted - not expected…

RE: “How do you know what is the truth and what is the lie from today’s
media and sources of information?”

don’t presume to know any better than any other critical thinker, but that’s the point - thinking critically and not just taking a party line, i.e. voting for a Wall St. puppet, just because he’s the lesser of evils

of course, media lies are given - one follows their own instincts, based on education
and experience, accepts or rejects analysis from others on that alone

as for the “...terrible tyranny that’s planning our destruction…”, you mean
something like the Muslim Brotherhood… the group formed by MI6 to counter
Nassar;... and you think they really represent the ‘Arab Street’?

time for some ‘critical thinking’ - something to cut through the some and mirrors - something beyond dogmatic postions

By Leefeller, July 26 at 11:38 am

“Separation of Church and state is being compromised by what seem fanatics to me, one need only look and Iran for example and see our potential future under the religious self righteous!”
———————————-

Your comments are no different from the nationalists who whine about being taken over by the Islamists.  No different from the Christians who whine about being taken over by Atheists.  No different from the Capitalists who whine about being taken over by communists.  No different from the Democrats who whine about being taken over by Republicans and vice versa.  ad infinitum.

The Atheists, who are no less self-righteous than any other ideology, are in fact no different than any other ideology.  None of them have any scientific proof.  None of them are infallible, in spite of what their proponents say about them.  And all seek converts, whether they admit it or not. 

In the battle for the minds and hearts of men, all ideologies compete.  This is not evil by itself, but if any commit some atrocity in this process, it is definitely evil.  At that point, you can look to see if the ideology is evil or just a few so-called adherents became evil. 

Otherwise, there is nothing to whine about.  The ideologies will be followed based on whatever causes men to follow anything or any idea.  I guess it is a mystery of the mind to some extent.

To speak disparingly, to suppress or to ridicule a competing ideology is an inferior position.  It shows that your ideology cannot stand on its own merits.

We are fortunate, some may say, that the overwhelming majority of those who ascribe to any ideology, do not really follow it literally, but resort to popular local culture, which is the true dominating ideology of all people, and what keeps us from murdering each other daily. 

Fundamentalists apparently deviate from popular culture and actually attempt to throw off their hypocrisy and follow their ideology.  If this causes them to commit crimes, they must be held individually accountable, but don’t judge the ideology based on the actions of a few, unless the ideology literally calls people to cause crimes.  And don’t judge all ideologies based upon what one is doing. 

Until one ideology or another is proven scientifically, they are all valid within the world of the ideas of men and women.  This is the fundamentalism of freedom and tolerance.

By blogdog, July 25 at 4:17 pm

Indeed, let’s all, people of good will, lay aside petty differences and focus on our common nemesis: the gobalist oligarchs, advancing their hegemonic agenda, at any cost, by any means…

How exactly do you propose uniting everyone? Have you any idea of just what the hell you’re dealing with?

The Ruling Elite blogdog, is in a constant state of flux. The Ruling Elite is not just a group of easily identifiable super wealthy individuals. It consists of humans AND the institutions through which they exercise and maintain their power. The groups of people are never the same due to mortality, fortunes won and lost, etc. Institutions aren’t stagnant either, they are modified, they morph, old ones are sometimes discarded and new ones created. Then there’s the henchmen class who do the dirty work because of the privileged lives they can lead. The military is an extremely powerful part of both the Ruling Elite and the henchman class. How do you propose to identify and eliminate all of them?

By blogdog, July 25 at 4:17 pm

now 6-and-counting ME wars of attrition

Have you considered the possibility that those actions are taking place on behalf of the Arab League?

By blogdog, July 25 at 4:17 pm

Dr. Henry ‘strange-
love’ Kissinger

As a Vietnam era vet ... if you’ve the power ... please…

By blogdog, July 25 at 4:17 pm

you want to keep fighting over bibles and korans?  go ahead, nothing better pleases the oligarchs - flare-ups of the seemingly endless, great Abrahamic family feud leaves them feeling safely and comfortably ignored

No, I never said to fight over any book. I urged that Christians and non-multiculturalists—native majorities—UNITE against a terrible tyranny that is planning our destruction.

Can you name for me a time in human history where humanity has not been cursed with oligarchs? How do you propose to rid the world of oligarchs? As soon as you’d stamp one set of oligarchs out a new bunch will arise from the ruins.

The Left vs. Right dichotomy is a ruse. There is only the Ruling Elite and its henchmen class working toward whatever aims are determined by the Power Elite to maintain the status quo and keep the masses confused and fighting each other. In the U.S. there is but one political party…The Party…and it marches to the beat of the Ruling Elite.

You have not answered my question.

How do you know what is the truth and what is the lie from today’s media and sources of information?

Separation of Church and state is being compromised by what seem fanatics to me, one need only look and Iran for example and see our potential future under the religious self righteous!

Accordingly to the some, we are a Christian Nation!

What is the difference between the Christian Inquisition or an Islamic Fatwa? Similarities seem to be in the absolutism’s and the silencing of disagreement.

Ignorance is a virtue for thous who embrace it as religion.

I could care less of other peoples proclivities,  religion or sexual preferences, it would be nice if they kept it to themselves. Maybe sexual proclivities should be tax free like Churchs?

When someone flaunts their proclivity as if everyone should embrace and accept it such as religious dogmas. In all fairness maybe like Fox News, I would also support the separation of buggering and state!

Here we go again.  Fanatical anti-fanatics, fanatically lumping everybody into the same boat while showing their ignorance, bigotry and prejudiced attitudes in a most un-enlightened way.

Obviously, non-belief in God seems to be a big issue with some of them.  Like maybe they should go in their closet and work out their anger and hate.  If you don’t believe in God, that’s fine.  Nobody is making you.  Even the Jehovah’s Witnesses leave immediately when I tell them politely that I am all set, thank you.  American religion has a few fanatics, but millions and millions are just peace loving regular people, who do not deserve ridicule and prejudice. 

Really, it is hard to believe someone spits out that kind of nasty rhetoric and expects others to see him as enlightened. 

Hate is not acceptable anymore.  People who act with hate need to be called out for their specific words of hate and derision against others.  It cannot be accepted anymore, because it leads to this Norwegian tragedy.

Observing the likes of Bachman or Perry from Texas, (though Gov Perry is pulling in his godly Evangelical horns right now) are two examples of fundamental christian dogmas,  so very close in their dogmas, making them similar to the self righteous fundamental Islamist, little different from what the Talaban seem like? 

From Religion we see, Women treated as sub human, anyone in disagreement or differences appear as infidels or sinners.  Similarities off the top of my head;  gays portrayed as s abomination or barbarians, enlightenment attacked in the name of ignorance. 

Hell, lets throw Palin into the fundamental mix, she appears as another person riding high on the dogmas of ignorance via religion. People who would make decisions affecting everyone in society, especially those who would dare to show disagreeableness.

Seems to me to be the fundamental or orthodox myopic view of things is nothing new, but it seems to be rearing its ugly ignorant head again. ... So one hears things like; The Japanese Emperor had sex with a Demon is why Japans stock market fell? How about the concept, non Christians are really not helping the poor, because they are not Christians? (May be wrong from the original stated ignorant concept, but the jist is the same).  I remember this one; ‘Barny the dinosaur is gay’! so recently we have again heard the same ignorance expressed hearing; ‘Spongebob squarepants is gay”!

Just a few obsessions displaying copious amounts of ignorance letting loose ignorance and Dogmas

Sometimes ignorance is bliss, apparently in the case of Fundamental dogmas it is a comfort zone of “oneupsmansship” or propping of self-aggrandizement!

Expecting reason from fundamentalism is not likely forthcoming, it seems blindness is the key, for the fanatic has no use for facts or truth, but instead only his insane obsessive cause!

@christian96:
I shouldn’t throw out adjectives like that without reasoning. The omission to deal with the word “fundamentalist” is the key to your question:  “What is a right-wing Christian
Fundamentalist?”. It is taking the scriptures of the Bible at face value, without cherry-picking or loose interpretations, and following it through to its logical conclusion. A satirical group (Landover Baptist Church) does exactly that:

http://www.landoverbaptist.net/

You can draw your own opinions and adjectives.

@christian96:
I don’t have an exact answer for you, but those definitions can only loosely be considered in this game of semantics. No Right Wing Christian that I know of emodies any of the empathy that Jesus supposedly had, but they do however have no problem living out passages of the Bible that treat women or homosexuals so poorly.
My answer (and opinion) of what it means is a facist, xenophobic, racist, cheuvanist, victim that blames tolerance and acceptance for his country’s problems. The female version of this would be one of submission.

regarding this: “...wrest Western culture and civilization from the hands of those that would destroy it.”

Indeed, let’s all, people of good will, lay aside petty differences and focus on our common nemesis: the
gobalist oligarchs, advancing their hegemonic agenda, at any cost, by any means…

those responsible for the now 6-and-counting ME wars of attrition - absolute attrition, as witnessed by the
wholesale use of Depleted Uranium munitions, even on forces fielding zero armored vehicles, which DU
projectiles were designed to penetrate and destroy - now they burn out house and home, then contaminate in
every direction

all DU battlefield regions show spikes in cancers and Gulf War Syndrome is a confirmed cause of DU poisoning
in concert with other battlefield toxins

looking more and more like systematic Population Reduction - ridding the planet of what Dr. Henry ‘strange-
love’ Kissinger infamously called “...useless eaters”

and as for US. soldiers and allies… again, quoting Dr. K: “The military man is a dumb animal useful only for
advancing political agendas.”

you want to keep fighting over bibles and korans?  go ahead, nothing better pleases the oligarchs - flare-ups
of the seemingly endless, great Abrahamic family feud leaves them feeling safely and comfortably ignored

By blogdog, July 25 at 1:37 pm

Eventually, around 35,000 Muslim radicals from 43 Islamic countries will fight
with the Afghan mujaheddin. Tens of thousands more will study in the
hundreds of new madrassas funded by the ISI and CIA in Pakistan.
[Washington Post, 7/19/92, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, 9/23/01, Honolulu Star-
Bulletin, 9/23/01, The Hindu, 9/27/01, Taliban: Militant Islam, Oil and
Fundamentalism in Central Asia, Ahmed Rashid, 3/01]

Thanks! I appreciate you taking the time to come here and watch my back.

Since you’re here I want to ask a question or two hoping you might clear up some doubts that I have. As one about to embark on his 7th decade on the surface of this rock and in ill health, cancer, I have read many articles, comments, and just plain stupid dribble here as well as on other sites. There’s not much else I’m physically able to do.

One of the common themes from both the so-called Left and the so-called Right is about the so-called ‘corporate media complex’ and the so-called ‘main stream media.’ My problem is: With so much misinformation how does one know which part is the truth and which part is the lie?

If all that you are claiming here is true, you’ve just verified that there is most certainly siegecraft taking place against Christians, Christianity, and native majorities of Western nations. So Christians and non-multiculturalists—those usually labeled right-wing, Reich-wing, evangelicals, fundamentalists, and conservatives, etc.—of Western society had better set aside their differences and unite under a common banner and wrest Western culture and civilization from the hands of those that would destroy it.

You’ve also confirmed that despite the rhetoric with regards to the invented term ‘Islamophobia’ (of course no such phobia exists) there really is reason to be concerned with the Left/Islam alliance. In short there can be no Islamophobia if they’re really trying to kill us. Insanity would be not preparing to defend one’s self, one’s family, one’s culture, and one’s society.

Please allow me to touch upon another topic: Governments making decisions for reasons of political expediency that come back to bite the citizenry in the arse.

December 7th, 1941, the Japanese Empire attacked the U.S. at Pearl Harbor. They destroyed mostly old, inferior naval vessels that probably wouldn’t have stood a chance in sea battles against the much more modern and efficient Imperial Japanese Navy. The U.S. fighting in the Pacific theatre with one hand tied behind its back—because it was fighting the Hun also—faced a modern, determined and exceptionally well-trained Japanese navy. Do you know who built those modern ships and trained that well-trained Navy? Our allies: The British.

The moral of the story is this: Try as you might, no one can predict exactly what will happen in the future. In attempting to assuage Japanese fears and anxieties the U.S., Britain, and Japan entered agreements that they thought would prevent war. It, like so many good intentions of apes, accomplished exactly the opposite. Today, because of having been caught with its pants down and hardly any modern military capability in 1941, the U.S. has become an out-of-control Military Industrial Complex. Neither extreme serves liberty and the people well.

Life is all about survival.

one more for the list

Q: Where can poor young muslims train to become Jihadists?
A: In CIA-funded madrassas

Samual Huntington’s ‘Clash of Civilizations’ is a manufactured thesis, seized
upon to drive a suicidal endeavor we now call ‘The Globl War OF Terror’

e.g. “March 1985: The US decides to escalate the war in Afghanistan. The CIA,
British MI6 and the ISI agree to launch guerrilla attacks from Afghanistan into
then Soviet-controlled Tajikistan and Uzbekistan, attacking military
installations, factories and storage depots within Soviet territory until the end
of the war.

The CIA also begins supporting the ISI in recruiting radical Muslims from
around the world to come to Pakistan and fight with the Afghan mujaheddin.

The CIA gives subversive literature and Korans to the ISI, who carry them
into the Soviet Union.

Eventually, around 35,000 Muslim radicals from 43 Islamic countries will fight
with the Afghan mujaheddin. Tens of thousands more will study in the
hundreds of new madrassas funded by the ISI and CIA in Pakistan.
[Washington Post, 7/19/92, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette, 9/23/01, Honolulu Star-
Bulletin, 9/23/01, The Hindu, 9/27/01, Taliban: Militant Islam, Oil and
Fundamentalism in Central Asia, Ahmed Rashid, 3/01]

In the late 1980’s, Pakistan’s President Benazir Bhutto, feeling the mujaheddin
network has grown too strong, tells President George Bush Sr., “You are
creating a Frankenstein.” But the warning goes unheeded. [Newsweek,
9/24/01]”

http://www.fromthewilderness.com/timeline/timelinecomplete1.html

Son of Palestine, July 25 at 8:37 am

A fifth-grade Muslim child knows by now that the cartoon thing you mention in your diatribe was created and publicized in Denmark, not in Norway.When you get your basic facts of history and geography correct, then I might dignify any of your future posts with a passing glance!!!

If you had bothered to give more than a passing glance you wouldn’t be looking like the ignorant equus asinus you appear to be after that comment. I corrected my mistake which was a different cartoon—Mohammed as a pig reading the quran. I’ve provided a link if you can tolerate looking at it without going berserk.

http://barenakedislam.wordpress.com/2010/02/15/norway-muslims-threaten-another-911-over-muhammad-the-pig-cartoon/

Also ... a cartoon originated in Denmark can be published in other areas; as was the cartoon from Denmark. It can also be reprinted in a later run. DUH!

You didn’t answer my question. Why do Muslims living in Islamic paradises emigrate to Great Satan nations?

Here are a few more for you:

1. What does Sharia law say about women?

2. Can women hold positions over men?

3. How many lesbian Mullahs do you know or can name?

4. What does Allah—in the Quran—have to say about sodomy and boys loving up other boys? How about girls loving up other girls?

5. Can women dress in any mode of dress they choose?

6. Can women see male gynecologist?

7. Under Sharia can women decline to have sex with their husbands?

8. Can gays attend Islamic religious services without being arrested and cured of homosexuality by hanging or removal of their heads from their shoulders?

9. Where might I attend Islamic religious services with a female mullah conducting the service.

10. Should men beat their wives if they are not behaving correctly? I believe the answer is in Surah 4:34

That should hold you for a while.

a call has gone out for more “originality” in the analysis of this tragedy

originality is the province of creative artists and inventors - those who design false flag
provocations tend to stick to tried and true scenarios:  well-oiled conspiracies by mythical cave-
dwellers, achieving far above their capacity; or, lone gunmen, mysteriously capable of super-
human marksmanship, or of packing enough ammo to waste an entire company; of course, all
bearing legends as raving fanatics

curiously, it’s already come to light that sections of Breivik’s so-called ‘manifesto’ are lifted
whole-cloth from the Uni Bomber’s ‘manifesto’ - will we learn that the ‘fanatic’ Breivik was a
Kazinsky devoté, or that the authors of the ‘operation’ are not only not ‘original’, but lazy too?

MSM’s initial prognostication, that ‘al CIA-duh’ strikes again, quickly fell away and our on-site
myth-buster doesn’t challenge the lack of ‘originality’ in that - so, go ahead, buy into the
‘religious, racist, fanatic line’ - that’s what the Norwegians are supposed to do and everyone else
too

Lew Ciefer, July 24 at 2:36 pm Link to this comment

“And of course there were the other threats made by other Islamists because the Norwegian media dared to commit blasphemy by reprinting the cartoon of grenade-head Mohammed.”
=====================================================
A fifth-grade Muslim child knows by now that the cartoon thing you mention in your diatribe was created and publicized in Denmark, not in Norway.

When you get your basic facts of history and geography correct, then I might dignify any of your future posts with a passing glance!!!

@ Leefeller, July 24 at 2:45 pm
I thought it was Denmark which posted the bomb head Mohamed cartoon thing? Had not heard it was the Norwegians.

I mentioned the wrong cartoon. In February 2010, the Dagbladet daily ran a Mohammed the pig cartoon. To me it’s no more offensive than the accompanying M16 toting Jesus drawing on Mike Farrell’s Christian-phobic article posted here on Truthdig. Muslims threatened another 9/11 for the blasphemy. Blasphemy in the 21st century. What’s next, we return to witch burning and outhouses?

Have you noticed that Muslims never seem to get offended enough to return to whatever Islamic paradise from whence the came? Also, have you noticed that every where they go they have problems with the host nations’ native majorities and their culture and traditions? Do you think it’s possible, at least possible, that the problem lies with Muslims and not the native majorities?

Gosh this Right-wing neo-Christian crazoid could have been a Bachman disciple.

I posted this elsewhere but think it is appropriate
here also:

I would like to thank the folks who responded to
my question, “What is a right-wing Christian
Fundamentalist?”  I decided to approach the
phrase word by word using my small Webster’s
Dictionary.  For “right-wing” Webster uses the
following words, “The more conservative or reactionary section of a political party or
group.”  Well, I was stumped right out of the gate.
What does “conservative” mean? So, it’s back to
Webster’s Dictionary. Conservative means, (1)
“tending to conserve,” (2) “tending to preserve
established institutions; opposed to change.”
Webster deines “Christian” as “having the qualities
taught by Jesus Christ, as love, kindness, humility, etc.” So, a right-wing Christian must be someone
who wants to conserve the qualities taught by Jesus
Christ.  That leaves out the Catholics and the
majority of Protestants.  Jesus kept and taught
the Sabbath was from dusk Friday until dusk Saturday.  In the 4th century AD the Catholic leaders got together and changed the Sabbath to
Sunday.  They also added Christmas and Easter.
No where in the Bible does it say to worship the
day of someone’s birth.  However, the Bible does
mention the heathen keeping a birthday.  It was
King Herod’s birthday.  His wife hated John the
Baptist because John had been getting on her nerves. She left Herod’s brother Philip and married Herod.
John the Baptist kept telling them they had committed adultry and many other sins.  Herod’s
wife ask him to have John arrested.  Herod did so.
Herod not only married his brother’s wife but he
had the hots for his teenage daughter-in-law.  During his birthday party Herod ask the girl to
dance for him.  He promised to give the girl anything she wanted.  It’s amazing what alcohol and
lust will do to a man.  Herod’s wife’s called her
daughter aside and informed her to ask for the head
of John the Baptist when she was through dancing.
That’s exactly what happened.  There is another place in the Bible where a birthday is mentioned.
I think it had to do with a Pharoah in Egypt.  But
if the Bible does not mention keeping birthdays
it does have something to say about death.  Ecclesiastes 7:1 reads, “the day of one’s death
is better than the day of one’s birth.”  The word
“Easter” is only mentioned once in the Bible but
it was a mistranslation.  The word was acutally
“passover.”  So, the Catholic Church changed the
Sabbath and added Christmas and Easter. When Martin Luther broke away from the Catholic Church he still kept the Sunday Sabbath.  He also kept Christmas
and Easter as did the multidtude of protestants
that followed him.  Since the Catholic Church and
majority of Protestants have failed to keep the
principles taught by Jesus it would be safe, according to Webster, to say they are not conservative Christians.  Since Jesus also taught
people not to kill one another it is fair to conclude the fellow in Norway who killed the people is NOT a “right-wing Christian.”  I’m not even going to deal with the word “Fundamentalist.”  I’m running out of words.  Now, I have a better idea of what a
“right-wing Christian” is and IS NOT! I could get
into the area of quantity of sins.  Do you have
to keep the principles of Jesus 100 per cent during a day to be a “conservative Christian?”  How about 95 or 90 per cent?  I’ll get into quantities later.

By christian96, July 24 at 2:40 pm Link to this comment

“What is a “right-wing Christian fundamentalist?”

I am not sure if that is a political thing or a religious thing.  Maybe there are right-wing Christians and left-wing Christians, and the right-wing ones are bad, because they are not left-wing ones. 

I have never heard of anyone refer to a left-wing Christian fundamentalist.  I wonder if that is because there are no left-wing Christians or there are no left-wing Christians who follow the fundamentals of Christianity. 

Or maybe what is bad is following the fundamentals of Christianity at all, like following Christ’s commandments:  Love your Enemies, Do unto others as you would they do unto you, Take care of the widows and the orphans, Pray one for another, etc, etc, etc. 

It used to be considered a good thing to get back to fundamentals, but not for Christians, I guess.

 
“Was Jesus a “right-wing Christian fundamentalist”

He was definitely not political, so not right or left wing.  Although, he did indicate he was a King, so he would have been above partisan politics anyway, like a monarchist.  But I think you would have to say he was a fundamentalist.

Hope this helps, because it confuses the hell out of me.

You can label him anything you want. Terrorist, assassin, mass murderer, etc. they all mean the same thing but apparently it’s the handiwork of a lone madman, a lone assassin. And much to the chagrin of the Left and their Islamic BFF, at this time, there’s nothing to indicate he’s part of a vast right-wing conspiracy.

Difference here is that if he is officially labelled a terrorist, he could be sent to a military trial held privately instead of publicly where he can get his propaganda out there (which is all he really wants). He may have acted alone, but he is not alone. The NY Times reported the meetings held, and this entry from his manifesto shows this may be much bigger than you are implying (not saying it’s a vast conspiracy- I wouldn’t know, although it wouldn’t surprise me):

I believe this will be my last entry. It is now Fri July 22nd, 12.51.

Sincere regards,

Andrew Berwick
Justiciar Knight Commander
Knights Templar Europe
Knights Templar Norway

He’s Christian, he performed a terrorist act; that
makes him a Christo-fascist terrorist.
End of discussion.

There is no nuance here. If the Fundies want their
Islamo-fascist terrorists called out th they have to
accept the same moniker when it is deserved on their
side.

Lew Ciefer,

I thought it was Denmark which posted the bomb head Mohamed cartoon thing? Had not heard it was the Norwegians.

There was nothing the Oslo shooter hated more than the thought of having to
share his living space with a person of color. His worse thoughts are going to
become a reality as prison authorities force him to share a mattress with a dark-
skinned sexual outlaw.  Both will be released after 21 years including the
mattress.

What is a “right-wing Christian fundamentalist?”
Was Jesus a “right-wing Christian fundamentalist?”

Okay, more rumor or fact, you decide!

FYI: from Daily Kos

“Koch-Funded Tea Party Heavyweight Tim Phillips Spoke at Norweigan Killer’s Political Party Event+*”

“by xxdr zombiexxFollow”

“Short and sweet, just to post the info, The “Norway McVeigh” has links to an ‘anti-government political group’  the Progress Party. And he is described as a ‘disgruntled ex-member.

Here’s the kicker:

  As if turns out, Tim Phillips, President of the Tea Party group Americans for Prosperity, spoke at a Progress Party event in 2010. According to an article published in the Norweigen paper Aftenposten on April 24th, 2010:

      Phillips was invited by the Progress Party leadership to talk about grassroots organizing. But he talked mostly about how his organization is fighting for a weaker central government and lower taxes, to health reform and climate change.

      Moreover, he spoke regularly Democrats in the U.S. as the “left side”.

The Alternet piece has this link which is to a Norwegian paper, translated by a google thingy.

The title is impressive

  Tea Party missionary lit Progress Party congress

Go read the whole thing - it’s short.”

So guy was a Tea Bag wanna be? The facts are not facts on why this guy did what he did, only Speculation on what he may have gotten from the meeting! This may turn out like the Murdoch abuses and uncover much more down the road, if you guys are going to make shit up, I will call you on it. The could of and would of routine is pure knee jerk stuff and BS!

@ Son of Palestine, July 24 at 4:09
As I expected and expressed in a previous post, there is the fanatic Christian fundamentalist DaveZx3 already rushing to find excuses…

You can label him anything you want. Terrorist, assassin, mass murderer, etc. they all mean the same thing but apparently it’s the handiwork of a lone madman, a lone assassin. And much to the chagrin of the Left and their Islamic BFF, at this time, there’s nothing to indicate he’s part of a vast right-wing conspiracy. He appears to be nothing more than a Ted Kaczynski, the Unabomber, who also had a manifesto or a Charles Manson who claimed to be a believer of sorts but is stark-raving mad.

It’s funny that you condemn DaveZx3 through quilt by association and fail to realize that the same illogic can be applied to you. People in the West are starting to push back against all this kowtowing to Islamists by politicians, in the name of multiculturalism and political correctness. Europeans, especially, have quite a history of pushing back—from both the left and right. I hope that when they do start pushing back that they push first against the enablers ... the Quislings of Western society.

Do you know why most thought: “Another Islamist terror attack”? Do you think it might have something to do with Mullah Krekar’s threats to KILL PEOPLE if he were deported back to his Islamic paradise, Iraq? And of course there were the other threats made by other Islamists because the Norwegian media dared to commit blasphemy by reprinting the cartoon of grenade-head Mohammed. ‘Do what I want or I’ll kill you’ diplomacy gets tiresome fast and tends to reflect badly on you and your ilk. Go figure!

Perhaps you can explain something to me. Why would a true believer in Allah immigrate to a Great Satan nation from an Islamic paradise where Sharia is long established, women know there place, etc.? I can’t get my head around that one, unless there is a hidden cause; a subversive goal ... Know watta mean?

I do not know if this ass was a Christian or a Mormon, but I know he is despicable what ever he is. It seems Dave has inside information.  It seems some people making shit up is inside information!

blogdog, I heard the same story about 911, a little more originality….Please!

Rumor control is alive and well! Jim Shorts PHD from Soggy Mist U. believes it was space aliens, because their alien anal probe experts where on holiday! Could of been something else though,... like Tea Party want to bee’s sans the tea bags! But I suspect it was really a few real crazy ass holes!

I love speculations they are so with it!

There is no place for a White racist to hide in the Norwegian prison system. Ninety
percent of the inmates and guards are people of color. The Oslo shooter will learn
how to accept Multiculturalism or be beaten like a bad dog. When he finally is
released, no longer will he badmouth minorities but will be an advocate for
prisoners rights.

Religion - one of the most useful wedges used to divide the under classes
- and very likely the purposeful intent of this atrocity, in manipulating the
Norwegian citizenry over their NATO commitment

see: http://tarpley.net/

Norway Terror Attacks a False Flag: More Than One Shooter on Island; Oslo
Bomb Drill Just Concluded; Was It NATO’s Revenge for Norway’s Decision to
Stop Bombing Libya?
[Translate]
by Webster G. Tarpley, Ph.D.
TARPLEY.net

Washington DC, July 24, 2011 – The tragic terror attacks in Norway display a
number of the telltale signs of a false flag provocation. It is reported that,
although the world media are attempting to focus on Anders Behring Breivik as
a lone assassin in the tradition of Lee Harvey Oswald, many eyewitnesses agree
that a second shooter was active in the massacre at the Utøya summer youth
camp outside of Oslo. It has also come to light that a special police unit had
been conducting a drill or exercise in downtown Oslo which involved the
detonation of bombs – exactly what caused the bloodshed a few hundred
meters away little more than 48 hours later. Further research reveals that United
States intelligence agencies had been conducting a large-scale program of
recruiting retired Norwegian police officers with the alleged purpose of
conducting surveillance inside the country. This program, known as SIMAS
Surveillance Detection Units, provided a perfect vehicle for the penetration and
subversion of the Norwegian police by NATO.

A motive for the attack is also present: as part of its attempt to mount an
independent foreign policy, including the imminent diplomatic recognition of a
Palestinian state as part of a general rapprochement with the Arab world,
Norway was leading the smaller NATO states in dropping out of the imperialist
aggressor coalition currently bombing Libya. Norway was scheduled to stop all
bombing and other sorties against the Gaddafi forces as out of August 1 at the
latest.

Finally, the CIA limited hangout operation known as Wikileaks has already
furnished a prefabricated off-the-shelf case for incompetence and malfeasance
against the current Norwegian government that is doing all these things – in
the form of a series of real or doctored dispatches which document the alleged
negligence of this government in dealing with the terrorist threat, all in the
view of US State Department officials.

Wolves donning the skin of a sheep are still wolves.  Sinners that are guilty of all of
the seven deadly sins attempt to fool others by wearing the mask of Christianity,
but their evil scent cannot be hidden.

Leefeller,

I forgot one other thing.  I made the comment that I did not think Christian ideology was behind it, because I knew this guy could not have been Christian in his ideology.  I had seen where he called himself a cultural Christian.  I also saw that he was a Freemason.  In addition to other things.

These things are incompatible with pure Christian ideology, and are more in line with Nazi-occult pseudo-Christianity.  The guy is a racist and a fascist, and murderer.  Not one who Loves his enemy, does unto others as they would have them do to him, feeds the children and widows, etc.

You may disagree with this, but in the words of Christ, he said that those who call themselves Christians may be in for a big surprise in the last days.  They will say, “we did miracles in your name, Jesus”  But he will say, “get away from me, I knew you not”  Because they are the ones who only used Christianity to further their own goals. 

There are parallels in Islam to these same principles, and I am sure Son of Palestine will agree with me on this.  The real Muslim is the one who walks the walk and talks the talk, not the one who uses it for his own advantage or agenda. 

You need to be more tolerant, and not judge the whole by the actions of the few.

Leefeller,

Pure Christian ideology is just this:  “love your enemy, do good to them who persecute you, do unto others, take care of the widows and orphans”

There is not one mean word in pure Christian ideology.  Your problem, is you are bigoted towards Christians, judging according to the minority who do evil things, like this nut case here. 

Just like we should not judge Muslims by the minority terrorists, you should not judge Christians by the minority terrorists.

Christianity has to be evaluated on the words of Christ himself, not the words of men, who hijack all they can in in an effort to deceive for the purposes of enriching themselves or carrying out an evil agenda. 

Islam has to be evaluated on the words of Mohammed himself, not on the words of men, who hijack all they can in their efforts to carry out an evil agenda or enrich themselves. 

I really shouldn’t have to tell you this.  It is common sense.  You can’t judge all people of a race, creed, nationality or religion, based on the actions of a few.

To make a statment that all are evil based on a few, without personal knowledge and experience of the all, is a very bigoted position.

Apparently, Norway got hit with Manson-style “Helter Skelter”—another idiot hoping to start a revolution by murdering a lot of innocent people.

“Hard to blame it on Christian ideology, since Norway seems to have an extremely weak Christian population, only about 2% going to church weekly.”

Yeah Dave; with urlogic like this; It is hard to blame it on racism ideology,...I will argue since the USA seems to have a weak racist population, only about one percent attend KKK rallies!

So he was not pro right, not religious and is pro gay what ever Dave can conjure up from, the Dave archives of assumptions and fantasy’s.

I recall spending a lot of time here on TD, hearing all the good points of religion from Dave, who said he was not proselytizing Christianity; It has been awhile, but I recall Dave saying he has been doing this for many ears ....I’am still not buying the Church of Dave; Dave!

The voice of Racism at Oslo was loud and clear. But that voice will be quieted as
the killer spends years in his prison cell. The only sound will be the sound of his
voice asking the guard to open the gate, so he can spend some time in the prison
yard. He would gladly accept Multiculturalism if given a few less years of prison
time.

By Son of Palestine, July 24 at 4:09 am

“As I expected and expressed in a previous post, there is the fanatic Christian fundamentalist DaveZx3 already rushing to find excuses for Anders Behring Breivik calling him a “nut case” instead the terrorist murderer that he is.”

——————————-

Calm down man.  I wasn’t making excuses for this evil nut case. (I always use the words nut case)  He is a murderer of the worst kind, he killed innocent children.  If it was up to me, he would get the death penalty.

I was only holding back judgement on Norwegian society, as I was not in any way aware that there was this extreme anti-immigration element in Norway. 

I so far don’t buy any religious connection, as Norwegians are the most watered down church that I have ever seen.  Besides, he was a Freemason, and was pro-homosexual, which is totally incompatible with Jerry Falwell Christianity. 

The guy was extremely complex, plus he was obviously deceptive, so it is hard to pinpoint still where his real alliances are.  I still don’t know that much, and I am not going to jump in and read the whole 1500 page manifesto yet.  I’ll do that next week, when I have more time. 

As far as use of the word, “fundamentalist” I thought that was one of those generic words which has pretty much lost its meaning, hasn’t it?  I never use it, as I am not sure why it even is a bad word.  In any discipline, it is usually considered a compliment to get back to the fundamentals.  So I don’t get the use of that word, nor do I use it.  Sorry.

As far as me being a fanatic Christian fundamentalist, that also is very, very unlikely, as I go to church even less than the Norwegians.  I haven’t been in a church in over ten years, and don’t belong to any.  I don’t belong to any group, NONE.  No political party, no church, no Lions club, No poker clubs, nothing.  Wait, I am a member of BJ’s stores.  But basically, I’m not a joiner, but more of a recluse. 
 
I think if I was a fanatical Christian fundamentalist, I would be shouting for Christians to “love your enemy as yourself” because that is what Christ was fundamentally all about.  I do believe in Christ, and I attempt to follow his teachings, because the pure teachings, like the Sermon on the Mount, are very valid, I believe. 

So, I am not sure why you think that you know me based on reading a couple of posts that I probably typed while I was half asleep.  We sure are quick to judge these days.

I am starting to see this guy as part of an extremist political anti-immigration, nationalist organization which is willing to commit extreme violence and terrorism against children for political goals.  It is the ultimate evil, in my mind, no matter what. 

But as I wrote on another thread, this type of activity will become more and more common.  The wacko’s of every organization seem to be becoming empowered to carry out their obscene fantasies and terrors.  All groups have their extreme members, and they are all becoming active.  And they all hate somone else, or have some reason to want to destroy them. 

But the 99.5% of the rest of us are content to live our little lives, just struggling to make ends meet and put food on the table.  So, please don’t confuse me with someone who has anything to do with this kind of stuff, because I don’t.

Forgot to mention, youtube has taken down the video (can always count on censorship in the USA).

About the MSM blaming video games, here’s another excerpt from his manifesto to give you an idea of how calculating this guy was:

3.26 Avoiding suspicion from relatives, neighbours and friends

Present a ”credible project/alibi” to your friends, co-workers and family. Announce to your closest friends, co-workers and family that you are pursuing a ”project” that can at least partly justify your ”new pattern of activities” (isolation/travel) while in the planning phase.

F example, tell them that you have started to play World of Warcraft or any other online MMO game and that you wish to focus on this for the next months/year. This ”new project” can justify isolation and people will understand somewhat why you are not answering your phone over long periods. Tell them that you are completely hooked on the game (raiding dungeons etc). Emphasise to them that this is a dream you have had since you were a kid. If they stress you, insist and ask them to respect your decision. You will be amazed on how much you can do undetected while blaming this game. If your planning requires you to travel, say that you are visiting one of your WoW friends, or better yet, a girl from your ”guild” (who lives in another country). No further questions will be raised if you present these arguments.

Blaming WoW is also quite strategic due to another factor. It is usually considered ”tabu” or even shameful in our society today to be hooked on an MMO. By revealing ”this secret” to your close ones you are therefore (to them at least) entrusting them with your innermost secret. Usually they will ”contribute” to keeping this secret for you which can be very beneficial. (If people from your ”secondary” social circle ask them they will even usually ”lie” on your behalf (giving you alibi), in order to keep your MMO project a secret.

BTW, his gaming character’s name was (yep you guessed it) “Conservatism”.

The interesting thing about this post is what is does NOT say.  It never mentions TEA PARTY.  I read this guys web page and he specifically called for a Euro-Tea Party, and yet this post does not mention it at all.  Why?

Maybe it would make apparent the similiarites of viewpoints between the hatred of multiculturism, fundamentalism, and Muslim bashing implicit in our dominant right wing.

Is the omission an attempt to not insult the US?

As I expected and expressed in a previous post, there is the fanatic Christian fundamentalist DaveZx3 already rushing to find excuses for Anders Behring Breivik calling him a “nut case” instead the terrorist murderer that he is.

DaveZx3 might be as dangerous as Breivik as he uses lame logic to exclude the label of “terrorist” and “terrorism” from the man and the fundamentalist ideology that motivated him.

DaveZx3, you stand exposed as a dangerous fanatic Christian who might go the way your fellow Christian went! Your extreme bigotry against Islam and Muslims as well as liberals who don’t adhere to your ideology are all indicators of the type of dangerous Christan fundamentalism you follow.

screamingpalm, thanks for the updated information. Fanatics need a cause and the cause becomes all they have.

Part 3

Lastly, and most importantly, through all of this the Norweigians remain determined not to let this dastardly act change their views on Humanity, their Judicial system, or their views on the death penalty (doesn’t exist). They truly believe that Justice does not equal vengeance.

Part 2

Here is just one excerpt from his manifesto:

3.23 The cruel nature of our operations

“We do not want to do this, but we are left no choice.”

The 3-phase-process of destroying and replacing the current cultural Marxist/ multiculturalist regimes of Western Europe will not be easy or painless. Keep in mind that these regimes we are fighting have and are still committing genocide against the indigenous peoples of Europe by exposing them to more than 25 million Muslims. They have indirectly killed more than 15 000 Europeans, raped more than 500 000 European women, robbed and terrorised more than 4,5 million Europeans, fired more than 37 000 cultural conservatives from their jobs and incarcerated more than 150 000 brothers and sisters for opposing their policies.

As a Justiciar Knight you are operating as a jury, judge and executioner on behalf of all free Europeans. Never forget that it is not only your right to act against the tyranny of the cultural Marxist/multiculturalist elites of Europe, it is your duty to do so.

There are situations in which cruelty is necessary, and refusing to apply necessary cruelty is a betrayal of the people whom you wish to protect.

The preferred method is to attack in a violent and deceptive form (shock attack), usually with limited forces (1-2 individuals).

Once you decide to strike, it is better to kill too many than not enough, or you risk reducing the desired ideological impact of the strike. Explain what you have done (in an announcement distributed prior to operation) and make certain that everyone understands that we, the free peoples of Europe, are going to strike again and again. Do not apologise, make excuses or express regret for you are acting in self-defence or in a preemptive manner. In many ways, morality has lost its meaning in our struggle. The question of good and evil is reduced to one simple choice. For every free patriotic European, only one choice remains: Survive or perish. Some innocent will die in our operations as they are simply at the wrong place at the wrong time. Get used the idea. The needs of the many will always surpass the needs of the few.

Part 1

I’m surprised this happened in Norway instead of here in the USA.

@DaveZx3 I have been reading comments from Norwegian posters on another forum, and they have read his manifesto (it’s apparently viral- I’ve not read it yet). So far the reaction has been that it is well written, but very disturbing. I have seen some quotes frm it, indeed disturbing, and planned out to every last detail. I find some conflicting information and wonder about the validity of your claims about his anti-nazi and pro-homosexual views. He was in fact a member of the EDL (English Defense League), which is supposedly an anti-extremist, right wing activist group speaking out against immigration, however- perusing the killer’s manifesto shows that this may indeed just be a PR front for the group. As was recounted by the person from the UK, this group’s dealings almost always involve violence despite their “anti-extremist” PR image. His quote:

Recently in my area of London they disrupted a council meeting involving youth engagement by threatening, assaulting and throwing stones at delegates.

Members activities usually fall foul of the group’s official line however, where incitement of racial or religious hatred is clearly the order of the day.

Personally, the organistion bears a striking resemblance to certain mens unions/clubs of the 1930s in German that were galvanized and later went on to form the SA and later still the SS in Nazi Germany.

The Freemasonary part of this story, is apparently his trying to recreate the Knights Templar in some form. This was the video version of his manifesto (from what I hear):  http://www.veoh.com/watch/v21123164bZCBQeZ8

re: video games This is the usual target for the MSM to deflect attention away from the common denominator (elephant in the room) or in other words: Right Wing Christian Fundamentalist. There’s no denying it. According to his manifesto, his participation in those video games were a front- a distraction (yes he went into that much detail).

There is no doubt that evil is found in every quarter, even in peaceful Norway.  And this guy is evil, because evil is what it takes to murder innocent people arbitrarily such as what he apparently did. 

Hard to blame it on Christian ideology, since Norway seems to have an extremely weak Christian population, only about 2% going to church weekly.  I think they have a watered down state-sponsored, protestant-type religion, which hardly has any inflammatory elements to it.  This guy ascribed to ‘cultural Christianity’, which is like saying, he liked the perceived results of Christianity, but could not be bothered with following the tenets.  He may have called himself Christian, but he did not murder because of of a commitment to Christ.

Hard to blame it on right-wing extremism, since he was a member of the Progress Party, right-center at best.  He wrote anti-nazi views, pro-homosexual views, and had many other non-hard right positions based on his own words.  He did like guns and the types of video games glorifying violence.  He seemed to be all over the place with his thoughts. 

He used to be, apparently, a member of Freemasonry, and I am not sure what that means, since the Masons that I know are very culturally diverse, not known for any extremist terrorism. 

He did have, as did his political party, an anti-immigration view, believing that uncontrolled immigration was putting extreme financial pressures on the very generous liberal policies of little Norway. 

This anti-immigrationism is becoming a growing phenomenon in Europe, and is a viewpoint shared by a wide spectrum of the political landscape.  It is not uncommon to see these views coming out of liberal, labor, conservative and socialist orientated parties.  The major issues seem to be that recent immigrants are not integrating into their various societies, as well as economic considertions as well.

There is no need to mitigate the evil of this latest nut case.  Nor is there any need to blame it on any political or cultural extremism, as there was nothing really extreme about his politics, only his personal thoughts. 

The blame here goes mostly on the individual, who, unable to discern acceptable limits for expression of not uncommon views, takes such purely evil actions as that which we see. 

He was an individual Norweigan nut case, but not a nut case anything Norweigan politics or Norweigan religion can be blamed for. 

That said, authorities will obviously investigate the rhetoric of the groups this nut belonged to in an effort to see if there are any inflammatory elements which could motivate others to commit the same types of crimes.

The scary thing is that if the violent video games this guy seemed to like caused his crime, then America is going to be in big, big trouble very soon, as millions share that affliction.

This is the kind of horrible atrocity that was bound to happen as a result of the neofascist, racist movements gaining ground in Europe with leaders like Geert Wilders.

“If you cannot convince a Fascist, acquaint his head with the pavement.”

- Leon Trotsky.

See, Hitchens IS right! Religion ruins everything!!!!

CrazyChristian EvangelicalFundamentalist BornAgainBoobs are just faithfully doing ‘god’s’ work, as they constantly tell us. And, as it is often said, ‘‘he’ do do his work in mysterious ways’.

So let us heathens not try to reason why, let’s just accept that the Norwegian tragedy must have had a ‘godly’ purpose, and that the justification for it is undoubtedly written somewhere in the ‘good book’.

Which we will all plainly see once the appropriate passage is properly translated for us by one or more of the multitude of self-appointed priests/ministers/representatives of ‘god’.

If Anders Behring Breivik turned out to be say Muhammad Something, then the airwaves will be inundated with hateful speech about Islam and all Muslims as being bloody-thirsty terrorists who should be eliminated from existance!

However, because Breivik turned out to be a right-wing Christian fundamentalist, you can rest assured that the label of “terrorist” will not apply to him. Excuses will be found for him, such as being a “sociopath” or of coming from a “sexually abused upbringing.”

This terrorist act that killed over a hundred in a small country like Norway, exeeds in the scale of population comparison the horrors of the 9/11 event in the U.S.

Now the question is: Is Norway going to forge an alliance with all Christian Western countries to start a war against all right-wing Christian fundamentalists and their allies the Zionist Christian fundamentalists who are preparing the ground for what they call the “Rapture” by help killing the Palestinians in their homeland?!

There was no need to leave a note explaining his political motives. He selflessly
murdered 100 children to experience the glory of fame. His childhood will show
that he was sexually abused and otherwise unloved.

Question:  How can anyone presume to know beyond doubt the motive or motives of this crazed killer?
And how, at this stage, can anyone presume to go even farther and judge among a mad confusion of “desires” what “desire” was stronger?  Here morristhewise is demonstrating anything but wisdom, in my opinion.

Many want fame and fortune but fortune is difficult to come by. The sociopath at
Oslo had no other motive except to become famous and he was successful. His
political views were strong but his desire to obtain fame was stronger.