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Ear to the Ground

Obama Wins Nobel Peace Prize

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Posted on Oct 9, 2009
Barack Obama
White House / Pete Souza

The Nobel Committee has interrupted the president’s meditations on whether to escalate the war in Afghanistan by awarding him the Peace Prize. The committee cited Obama’s “extraordinary efforts to strengthen international diplomacy and cooperation between peoples” and especially his “vision of and work for a world without nuclear weapons.”  —PZS

Nobel Peace Prize Citation via Reuters:

The Norwegian Nobel Committee has decided that the Nobel Peace Prize for 2009 is to be awarded to President Barack Obama for his extraordinary efforts to strengthen international diplomacy and cooperation between peoples. The Committee has attached special importance to Obama’s vision of and work for a world without nuclear weapons.

Obama has as president created a new climate in international politics. Multilateral diplomacy has regained a central position, with emphasis on the role that the United Nations and other international institutions can play. Dialogue and negotiations are preferred as instruments for resolving even the most difficult international conflicts. The vision of a world free from nuclear arms has powerfully stimulated disarmament and arms control negotiations. Thanks to Obama’s initiative, the USA is now playing a more constructive role in meeting the great climatic challenges the world is confronting. Democracy and human rights are to be strengthened.

Only very rarely has a person to the same extent as Obama captured the world’s attention and given its people hope for a better future. His diplomacy is founded in the concept that those who are to lead the world must do so on the basis of values and attitudes that are shared by the majority of the world’s population.

For 108 years, the Norwegian Nobel Committee has sought to stimulate precisely that international policy and those attitudes for which Obama is now the world’s leading spokesman. The Committee endorses Obama’s appeal that “Now is the time for all of us to take our share of responsibility for a global response to global challenges.

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By stcfarms, October 15, 2009 at 3:51 pm Link to this comment

Yes, I see clearly now. You will note that I did not respond.

Report this

By ardee, October 15, 2009 at 3:19 pm Link to this comment

stcfarms

See…..

Report this
ThomasG's avatar

By ThomasG, October 15, 2009 at 11:18 am Link to this comment

stcfarms, October 14 at 11:03pm,

That is quite an admission that YOU made there; I suggest repeated posting and explaining that YOUR admission, as YOU see it, is the agenda of the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Movement and has been the agenda of the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Movement from Goldwater through Reagan, Bush I and Bush II.

You are indeed a proud Right-Winger and proud of the Right-Wing Agenda as you perceive it.  Now YOU should run like “chicken little” and tell the world. 

Most Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS try to hide the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Agenda, YOU are a refreshing change from “run of the mill” deceptive, deceitful Right-Wingers; good for you, “chicken little”; now, go forth and spread your message to the world.

While you are owning up, here are some links that I’m certain you are also proud of, that you will be glad to own up to for the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Movement, since you are obviously truly repentant for the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Movements Agenda:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grover_Norquist

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20010514/dreyfuss

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=ResistNet  (sophism)

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Grassfire.org_Alliance

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Freedomworks

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125469984687962987.html

http://thinkprogress.org/2009/04/14/lobbying-clients-teaparties/

The above links are just a few of the abominations that an obviously repentant fellow like you can own up to as the AGENDA of the Right-Wing Conservative Movement; when you have finished owning up to the information in these links, let me know and I will provide additional information that I am certain that a truly repentant Right-Winger like you will want to admit to as being the agenda of the Right-Wing Conservative Movement.

Report this

By stcfarms, October 15, 2009 at 6:09 am Link to this comment

Mea culpa, I just thought that he/she was just industrial grade stupid. It never
occurred to me that he/she was insane. As it is not my policy too make fun of
the disabled I will refrain from
attacking him/her. Thank you for the heads up.

By ardee, October 15 at 6:43 am #

Now this is unfair and, in my opinion, incorrect. Mental illness should never be
conflated with ignorance. The entity known as MarthaA/ThomasG is obviously
smart, and just as obviously seriously disturbed.

Report this

By ardee, October 15, 2009 at 3:43 am Link to this comment

stcfarms, October 14 at 10:09 pm #

You are, without a doubt, the dumbest son of a bitch in the universe.

Now this is unfair and, in my opinion, incorrect. Mental illness should never be conflated with ignorance. The entity known as MarthaA/ThomasG is obviously smart, and just as obviously seriously disturbed.

There is simply no way to dialogue with one( or two) who believe, as she/he does, that any and all opposition to , mostly crackpot, notions of governance and the road to success brands that opposition as members of some “cabal” or as sinister and undercover agents of the GOP or some such.

I think this poster has a Dudley Doright complex. To him/her we are all Snidely Whiplash and our nation Little Nell.

In the interest of moving along the dialogue I will post Martha/Thomas’ response, erudite and well constructed as ever:

blah

Report this

By stcfarms, October 14, 2009 at 8:03 pm Link to this comment

You have uncovered us, we are a deep cover covert operation known as truth.
We intend to kill your god, your pre conceived notions and deliver you to the
prince of darkness. We have included many ‘liberal’ stooges in the Truthdig
forum so you cannot trust anyone. Obama is our greatest coup, getting him
into office was almost impossible, you and Martha (one person? tranny
perhaps?) put him over the top. We have cloned Hitler but he will not be ready
for a few more years so Bush Lite Obama was the best we could do. We have
bought both parties, the administration, congress and the supreme court and
are just waiting for the Hitler clone to mature before implementing the police
state.

By ThomasG, October 14 at 9:51 pm #

I have been trying to get Leefeller, NightGaunt, Shenonymous and ardee to tell
me about theRight-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST “Boiler Room Operation” that
“you people” are a part of, and for some reason they are not proud enough of
their “Boiler Room Operation” and the use of “Mein Kampf” by Adolph Hitler as
a Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Playbook to share any information with
me about these Right-Wing Operations; would you care to share some of the
details of these Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Operations?

Report this
ThomasG's avatar

By ThomasG, October 14, 2009 at 7:20 pm Link to this comment

stcfarms,

Blah.

Report this

By stcfarms, October 14, 2009 at 7:09 pm Link to this comment

You are, without a doubt, the dumbest son of a bitch in the universe.

By ThomasG, October 14 at 9:51 pm #

Report this
ThomasG's avatar

By ThomasG, October 14, 2009 at 6:51 pm Link to this comment

stcfarms, October 14 at 8:52pm,

Your post sounds to me like you are admitting to being either a Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST, or a toady to the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS——Which is it?  Are you speaking for Leefeller and NightGaunt?

I have been trying to get Leefeller, NightGaunt, Shenonymous and ardee to tell me about the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST “Boiler Room Operation” that “you people” are a part of, and for some reason they are not proud enough of their “Boiler Room Operation” and the use of “Mein Kampf” by Adolph Hitler as a Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Playbook to share any information with me about these Right-Wing Operations; would you care to share some of the details of these Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Operations?

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, October 14, 2009 at 6:26 pm Link to this comment

If one believes in reincarnation, I do believe McCarthy has returned as the AntiMcCarthy, but with more enhanced mental short comings, a masters in stupidly and working for a PhD in imprecision, plus having the comprehension of a rock!

Report this

By stcfarms, October 14, 2009 at 5:52 pm Link to this comment

Since the ‘left’ has now taken back the power can we expect mass shootings of
people like Leefeller and Night-Gaunt? Perhaps you could start camps where
they can be used as slave labor. It is good to tattoo a number on their arms in
case they escape. Yeah, things will be better now…

By ThomasG, October 14 at 7:58 pm #

Those who appease, collaborate and cooperate with the Right-Wing
Conservative EXTREMIST Movement and make compromises and concessions
as toadies can not and should not be exemptfrom the consequences of their
behavior and should suffer the same fate as the Vichy French did after the Free
French took back power.

Report this
ThomasG's avatar

By ThomasG, October 14, 2009 at 4:58 pm Link to this comment

Sodium, October 14 at 12:29am,

Toadies, appeasers, collaborators, and cooperators with the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Movement are not exempt from the consequences of their own behavior.

It was toadies, appeasers, collaborators and cooperators within the Democratic Party that went along to get along and enabled the so called Republican Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Revolution that accused, condemned, denounced and is still trying to politically exterminate the Left and Liberals.

So long as Leefeller and Night-Gaunt demonstrate that they are toadies, appeasers, collaborators and cooperators with the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS they will be treated as Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS, they are in this respect no better than the Vichy French and must be responsible for the consequences of their behavior.  The following quote is from World Book Encyclopedia:

“During the months that France was under German occupation, the name Vichy came to stand for collaboration with the Germans.  The name took on this meaning because French government officials at Vichy made compromises and concessions to meet German demands.” 

Those who appease, collaborate and cooperate with the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Movement and make compromises and concessions as toadies can not and should not be exempt from the consequences of their behavior and should suffer the same fate as the Vichy French did after the Free French took back power.

You say Leefeller and Night-Gaunt are “good men”, Hitler, Mussolini, Stalin, Madoff, and Louis XVI and etc. were all “good men” to their friends and family. Hitler, Mussolini, Madoff, and Louis XVI, although “good men” to their friends and families were just the opposite to those who were not their friends and families.

I do not doubt that Leefeller and Night-Gaunt are “good men” to their friends and families, it is the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST politics that they advocate on this blog that others are subjected to that are not a part of their friends and families that is at issue, not whether or not Leefeller and Night-Gaunt are “good men”.

Report this

By KDelphi, October 14, 2009 at 2:58 pm Link to this comment

Leefeller—No, your point is well taken. It is a waste of time and my comments became stupider as I pissed around with it. I wasnt offended—its a silly thing to do.

Some people just seem to bring it out in others and enjoy doing so. Rewarding them is nonsensical.

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By Leefeller, October 14, 2009 at 2:50 pm Link to this comment

My comment on the tea naggers was for effect, the closing gap of differences between them and people who seem capable of having much more thought behind their opinions, such as Kadelphi,  Beerdocter and others was my address, though I guess not effectively, I did not like seeing myself falling into the same trap so I try to step back and take a breath.

“Everyone knows”  as the Leonard Cohen song goes the “rich keep getting richer and old black Joe is still picking cotton”

By the way, pissing contests seem such a wast of energy, and the wind is always changing just not as fast as some hope.

Report this

By stcfarms, October 14, 2009 at 2:47 pm Link to this comment

IQ is merely a measure of problem solving ability. My IQ has allowed me to be
a very successful jack of all trades and an inventor. What have you done with
yours?

By KDelphi, October 14 at 4:40 pm #

stcfarms—I used to give IQ tests and dont believe in them anymore. Anyone
who quotes their IQ online must not have much else going for them. It matters
what you DO with it, got that?

Report this

By KDelphi, October 14, 2009 at 2:30 pm Link to this comment

Leefeller—I dont know about delusions of grandeur, but I think you have something there.

It has occurred to me that the person I am responding to, I have alot of agreemetn with, but theyve just told me how little I know, that i must be red state, blah, blabh, blah and that I must be a teabagger if I dont support Obaam. So, yeah, I get defensive.

Sorry for having been drawn into a pissing contest again.

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Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, October 14, 2009 at 2:01 pm Link to this comment

It seems to me, most here on TD agree more than they disagree, it comes down to how one displays and intensifies their disagreement.  What is seen as agreement in the beginning, down the road differences becoming insurmountable create loosing or jettisoning many by the wayside and in the end was not the beginning, such is power and Jockeying for first place.  Taking the prize leaving the less fortunate behind.

This observation seems a standard scheme of things in politics and other places in life,  what am I missing, delusions of grandeur?

Report this

By KDelphi, October 14, 2009 at 1:40 pm Link to this comment

stcfarms—I used to give IQ tests and dont believe in them anymore. Anyone who quotes their IQ online must not have much else going for them. It matters what you DO with it, got that?

diamond, apparently it is beyond you in the Dem Party to realize that you are losing true liberal You will get the message in 2010. I’ll give you a hint, though—nobody thinks Clinton realy left a “surplus” anymore. He was just fine , as a person.That is not my problem with him. You have your head so far up Dems ass, that you wont see it until you lose again. Its sad for true (NOT NEO) liberals that you guys have to keep doing this and sad for out country. But some people never learn.

Both parties suck.

I know you wont listen—ever..Peopple are fed up with both parties. You guys might even get another Nader coup.

Report this

By stcfarms, October 14, 2009 at 9:19 am Link to this comment

You can always spot an honest politician, six feet above his
head is a large granite stone with his name on it

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Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, October 14, 2009 at 6:47 am Link to this comment

Hey, Patients first, add up above seems nice enough, maybe we should all sign the petition to stop Government running Health Care like they are doing in Canada, so both unrepublicanism and anti Americanism? Which country is the add talking about?

Report this

By ardee, October 14, 2009 at 3:04 am Link to this comment

Don’t let anyone tell you they’re all the same (politicians): they’re not.

No but as long as they all toil under a sick and perverted system the decisions and the outcomes will be the same.

Report this

By diamond, October 14, 2009 at 12:23 am Link to this comment

Thank you inherit and leefeller. It’s always nice to be appreciated. The fact that it happens so rarely makes it all the sweeter! Don’t let anyone tell you they’re all the same (politicians): they’re not.

Report this

By stcfarms, October 14, 2009 at 12:03 am Link to this comment

Thank you. I like your version. 


By Sodium, October 14 at 12:29 am #
(Unregistered commenter)

“If you cannot get together with people you do not like,to protect yourself
from the people that want to hurt you,then you are LOST.”

Report this

By Sodium, October 13, 2009 at 9:29 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Re: stcfarms,October 13,at 9:57 pm.

“If you cannot get together with people you do not like,to protect yourself from people that want to hurt you,then you are stupid.”

stcfarms,

If I have held back and have refrained from telling you that the above comment of yours is one of the WISEST comments I have read,sofar,on this thread,I would have been less than an honest man. With your permission,I wish to make it even more so. How about changing one single word in your above comment and make it reads as follows:

“If you cannot get together with people you do not like,to protect yourself from the people that want to hurt you,then you are LOST.”

Why using a negative adjuctive like,“STUPID”,when you really do not know those people and have no idea what stand they would take when the chips are really down on the issues that are most dear to your heart.

The word “LOST” is more digestable-at least to me.

stcfarms,

Please be advised that it is against my selfdiscipline to respond or make a comment on posts or comments that deviate from the essence of the topic at hand. However,I have been impressed by the sense of wisdom in your above comment to a point that has compelled me to violate my own rules and respond favorably.

I do hope that you will continue posting on issues that matter to you. Disagreement is a natural thing among matured adults,as long as they take it in strides.


Notes to ThomasG and MarthaA:
=============================

Whether you are one person or two seperate human-beings does not really matter to me. What matters is the relentless war you are waging against the fanatical/extreme right wingers. I am with you on that,as long as your war hits its targets: those who have done so much damages to our lives and the lives of our children and grandchildren. I can detect intelligence in your posts,but unfortunately your wrath is directed,sometimes,at some posters like Leefeller and Night Gaunt who are really are NOT fanatical extreme right wingers. I say this out of a rather lengthy follow-up of what they have posted so far. In fact,I have exchanged views with Leefeller,on occasions,for the last three years,while with Night Gaunt for about a year. I do respect their views just as much as I admire your relentless war. Please hit the real extremist right wingers with your war of words and ideas,but not those two gentlemen. They can be your allies when the chips are really down against your cause.

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Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, October 13, 2009 at 7:00 pm Link to this comment

Diamond, very well put, though I attempt my darn
best to refrain from stereotyping, though an exception may be acceptable in this case, regurgitating (an apt word)  the Republicans,  actually explains many things. It is my opinion, Republicans are born that way, you have just added to what “that way” means, thanks!

Report this

By stcfarms, October 13, 2009 at 6:57 pm Link to this comment

I am glad to see that you folks can learn, it will get easier as you go. Now that
you can finally agree on something you might want to expand your base and
agree that both parties are criminal organizations and that you have a
common enemy. It is hard to lose pre conceived notions but it will make you
stronger in the end. My job is done here.

If you cannot get together with people that you do not like, to protect yourself
from people that want to hurt you, then you are stupid.

Report this

By stcfarms, October 13, 2009 at 5:32 pm Link to this comment

You are welcome.

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, October 13, 2009 at 5:23 pm Link to this comment

stcfarms, October 13 at 2:52 pm #

It is said that you cannot understand people whose IQ differs from yours by 30
points. I doubt that your IQ is 192 or more so you must be at the other end of
the scale. You are correct, talking with you is like talking with a monkey.

By KDelphi, October 13 at 2:27 pm #

stcfarms—I dont believe that you are insane, but I think that you are self-
centered, self-righteous and an egomaniac who judges others because he has
trouble understanding them.

**************************************************

Oh, STC, you MUST be a genius, a serious genius!

After all you’ve got to be truly BRILLIANT to get me on the same side as KDelphi and even defend her!

But you’ve done it!

Report this

By Inherit The Wind, October 13, 2009 at 5:20 pm Link to this comment

diamond, October 13 at 5:01 pm #

Kdelphi I know what a conservative is -it’s why I loathe them. They are people who believe that there is a pre-ordained, God given order to the world which must never be changed. They believe the rich are chosen by God, they believe the poor are sinful and evil and must be punished for being poor. They believe human beings are intrinsically evil and can only be kept under control by scaring the shit out of them either with law and order or hellfire and damnation. When Clinton was President America was not at war, America was not bankrupt and people didn’t sneer and jeer when they said the word America.

What the conservatives did under Bush and Cheney was actually carry out a coup the purpose of which was to create a military dictatorship which would use its military might and free market ideology to conquer the world, beginning in the Middle East. It was essentially Chile on steroids. They seem to have decided that the military in Chile were amateurs and didn’t get it right and they were going to do it how it should have been done. You can see the military and economic wreckage of their plans from one side of the world to the other. Clinton left a huge surplus when he left office and he left a country that was at peace, he also tried to bring in a sensible health care system for America. But the conservatives hated Clinton no matter what he did because he was from a poor family and grew up without a father. He was white trash and should never have been president at all according to them. He also disproved their theory that the poor are poor because they’re lazy and stupid and evil so they decided to use the mainstream media to portray him that way anyhow. You’re just mouthing conservative dogma re Clinton: whether you know it or not is another question. And now you’ve transferred your hate to Obama. I have to wonder what kind of a lefty would do that. A lefty that doesn’t understand history or political theory and thinks that emotion is reason perhaps.
*******************************************

I never thought the day would come when I agree with the Zircon at all, much less a perfect post like this where I agree 100%.  Live long enough and you’ll see everything.

BTW, nice job, a real gem, Diamond (not a Zircon today!)

Report this

By diamond, October 13, 2009 at 2:01 pm Link to this comment

Kdelphi I know what a conservative is -it’s why I loathe them. They are people who believe that there is a pre-ordained, God given order to the world which must never be changed. They believe the rich are chosen by God, they believe the poor are sinful and evil and must be punished for being poor. They believe human beings are intrinsically evil and can only be kept under control by scaring the shit out of them either with law and order or hellfire and damnation. When Clinton was President America was not at war, America was not bankrupt and people didn’t sneer and jeer when they said the word America.

What the conservatives did under Bush and Cheney was actually carry out a coup the purpose of which was to create a military dictatorship which would use its military might and free market ideology to conquer the world, beginning in the Middle East. It was essentially Chile on steroids. They seem to have decided that the military in Chile were amateurs and didn’t get it right and they were going to do it how it should have been done. You can see the military and economic wreckage of their plans from one side of the world to the other. Clinton left a huge surplus when he left office and he left a country that was at peace, he also tried to bring in a sensible health care system for America. But the conservatives hated Clinton no matter what he did because he was from a poor family and grew up without a father. He was white trash and should never have been president at all according to them. He also disproved their theory that the poor are poor because they’re lazy and stupid and evil so they decided to use the mainstream media to portray him that way anyhow. You’re just mouthing conservative dogma re Clinton: whether you know it or not is another question. And now you’ve transferred your hate to Obama. I have to wonder what kind of a lefty would do that. A lefty that doesn’t understand history or political theory and thinks that emotion is reason perhaps.

Report this

By stcfarms, October 13, 2009 at 11:52 am Link to this comment

It is said that you cannot understand people whose IQ differs from yours by 30
points. I doubt that your IQ is 192 or more so you must be at the other end of
the scale. You are correct, talking with you is like talking with a monkey.

By KDelphi, October 13 at 2:27 pm #

stcfarms—I dont believe that you are insane, but I think that you are self-
centered, self-righteous and an egomaniac who judges others because he has
trouble understanding them.

Report this

By KDelphi, October 13, 2009 at 11:27 am Link to this comment

Thomas and Martha-wtf are you talking about…I hope that the Dem Party is paying you well..if you are doing this for free, you are being duped.

stcfarms—I dont believe that you are insane, but I think that you are self-centered, self-righteous and an egomaniac who judges others because he has trouble understanding them.

You have a right to be all of those things.

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Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, October 13, 2009 at 10:57 am Link to this comment

Yes Thomas G, point taken, that is besides the one on your head!

Fetish’s such as yours deserve what they receive, maybe some other people (besides ThomasG) do not find the same constant presentation of an obscure message providing the same inane repetition. repetition which becomes less and less amusing,  like those male sex performance enhancer advertisements saturating Television!

Yes, ThomasG point well seen.

Report this

By stcfarms, October 13, 2009 at 9:17 am Link to this comment

Point taken.

By ThomasG, October 13 at 12:09 pm #

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, October 13, 2009 at 9:16 am Link to this comment

Talk about spawning, have you seen the movie?

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ThomasG's avatar

By ThomasG, October 13, 2009 at 9:09 am Link to this comment

KDelphi, stcfarms and Leefeller,

How the Hell does all of your self-involved chatter on this thread relate to Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS disingenuously berating President Obama’s Nobel Peace Prize???????

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, October 13, 2009 at 8:54 am Link to this comment

Spawning in the woods does provide an amusing vision, hopefully with another human, depending on ones proclivity’s! 

If one makes life’s decisions from either horse races or throwing darts, what is the difference, both seem redundant or that was the point?

Report this

By stcfarms, October 13, 2009 at 8:43 am Link to this comment

You believe me to be insane, asking for my help would make you insane.

By KDelphi, October 13 at 11:39 am #

So sayeth the Church of Plastic islands—so much easier to dream about then
to acutally try to do something to fix the land we are on now…

Report this

By stcfarms, October 13, 2009 at 8:40 am Link to this comment

You put your money down on the horse that you think will win and go with it.
No one knows what will happen but an educated guess is better than throwing
a dart at the board and going with the results.

By Leefeller, October 13 at 11:28 am #

Why do I perceived the above statement not as opinion, but instead a belief
proclaimed with many assumptions!

Report this

By KDelphi, October 13, 2009 at 8:39 am Link to this comment

So sayeth the Church of Plastic islands—so much easier to dream about then to acutally try to do something to fix the land we are on now…

Report this

By stcfarms, October 13, 2009 at 8:31 am Link to this comment

I will concede that you need and deserve a government. Your decision not to
breed is logical and admirable.

By KDelphi, October 13 at 11:04 am #

BTW—I disagree that every form of govt is “the enemy”(move to Somalia)—I
would agree that the one we have now is antithetical to the people. But no
govt at all is absurd.

Report this
Leefeller's avatar

By Leefeller, October 13, 2009 at 8:28 am Link to this comment

“if you decide that you want to pass on your genes then get away from
population centers, become self sufficient and pay attention to the natural
world around you.”

When opinion becomes belief, it is no longer opinion!

So opinion, becomes reality and this reality becomes a belief, then it becomes unyielding in it’s self proclaimed absolutism’s which discount any others opinions. Why does this seem most pretentious and in some degree fanatical as any religion or any other cause proclaimed in self righteous platitude?

I believe this for therefore I am right, seems so common, (especially here from many posters on TD)  One has many choices om absolutism’s to choose from, for instance one could become a Mormon, become a republican or wonder the wood passing on their genes?

Why do I perceived the above statement not as opinion, but instead a belief proclaimed with many assumptions!

Report this

By KDelphi, October 13, 2009 at 8:04 am Link to this comment

stcfarms—I thought about how badly you piss me off and I wondered if I reacted badly. Then, I remembered that that was not the first time that I had wondered that… I have to conclude that you bring out the worst in me. I believe it is your self-righteousness—I just HATE that. Now, I see your santamonious reply and dont care at all.

Thinking of going into eugencis?

I have wisely chosen not to “breed” (as have all the women in my family) due to a genetic predisposition which we were afraid of passing on. The children in my family who are genetic are none of your business, but are all genetically(?) loving, attractive and smart enough to join MRNSA but too smart to do it! (Heil!)

The “queem of socialism”—I have no idea what that would be, but since you seem to be the kind of geek who lives by looking at factoids like that, maybe you can tell us.

Id rather be anything on eareth than “queen” of a plastic island.

I remember you mentioning you and your breeding partner (is that the same thing as a wife, or did you check her genes first?)choosing each other for “intellect”—i believe that there is somethngn to be said for “heart” , concern for others, (what you do with your intellect—which you seem to care about not at all) as well as looks—I dont care how you measure up there, but I can see why you want to go off alone.

BTW—I disagree that every form of govt is “the enemy”(move to Somalia)—I would agree that the one we have now is antithetical to the people. But no govt at all is absurd.

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By stcfarms, October 13, 2009 at 7:25 am Link to this comment

Nature decides, the winners get to pass on their genes. Blue bloods with
swastikas have no say in the long run. The ability to pass on your genes has
more to do with your ability to adapt to changing conditions than your station
in life. I did not write the laws of nature but at least I had the good sense to
pay attention to the world around me. Thomas Malthus was right about
population and there is a high mathematical probability that only one genetic
line in 200 will be around in 20 years. I realize that you are being facetious but
if you decide that you want to pass on your genes then get away from
population centers, become self sufficient and pay attention to the natural
world around you.

By Leefeller, October 13 at 9:41 am #

Who decides what breeding successfully means, blue bloods with a swastiqa? 
STfarms, are you pulling Kdelphi’s good typing leg, her right one? Do you have
two tongues in four cheeks?  I find your comments most humorous, but on the
other hand maybe you believe what you are saying, in which case where does
one sign up?

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By Leefeller, October 13, 2009 at 6:41 am Link to this comment

King Henry, never was able to breed successfully in his womanizing mind, because the Queens never gave him a son. Some of us know what happened to them!

Who decides what breeding successfully means, blue bloods with a swastiqa?  STfarms, are you pulling Kdelphi’s good typing leg, her right one? Do you have two tongues in four cheeks?  I find your comments most humorous, but on the other hand maybe you believe what you are saying, in which case where does one sign up?

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By stcfarms, October 13, 2009 at 12:45 am Link to this comment

There was a word after breed, successfully, have you done that? Successfully
means that they have a good chance to pass on the genes. Revolution,
armageddon, population et cetera limit the probability that your genetic lines
continue.

Socialism is a form of government, government is the enemy, did you not
comprehend that?

Thank you, will you be setting anyone else free today? Must be nice to be
queen in a socialist world…

By KDelphi, October 13 at 2:11 am #

stcfarms—wtf makes you think it takes ‘brains” to “breed”? Ive sure seen alot
of stupid people reproduce and in very large numbers.

I AM A SOCIALIST!!

stcfarms—fancy yourself a ron paul libertarian? If I was building a plastic
island to live on, I would be more careful about how I judged others.YOU are
the one who sees people in black and white, GOP or Democrat. But, YOU, no
you are FREE!

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By KDelphi, October 12, 2009 at 11:11 pm Link to this comment

stcfarms—wtf makes you think it takes ‘brains” to “breed”? Ive sure seen alot of stupid people reproduce and in very large numbers.

Or do you breed with your brain only

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By KDelphi, October 12, 2009 at 11:06 pm Link to this comment

I AM A SOCIALIST!! OK?! I am NOT a Democrat NOR a fricking GOP!! Frick off!!

If I criticize Obama I am attacked from the L\Dems. If I reply in a way that criticizes Dems (all of them) I get hate from so-called Libertarians. I AM NEITHER. I am for progressive, socialist policies that afflict the comfortable and comfort the afflicted! On election day, I got banned from a bunch of so-called left leaning websites snd hate email from a gd rightwing nuts site with a bunch of police blotter and Klan photos—you guys are ignorant.

Here is an email from the Pen that you might want to take heed of stcfarms and diamond and all of you dupopoly ass kissers out there that just cannot seem to concieve of someone swho is neither dem nor gOp but thinks for themselves.

If you knew me, you would know that I dont mention GOP much because they are not worth mentioning. I criticize Dems because I used to be one and I see them driving us off of a cliff.

“Before we begin with tonight’s alert. Is there anybody on our
participant list who is not clear on the fact that WE are the
PROGRESSIVES?? Is there anybody out there who is not clear on the
concept that we are NOT the extreme right wing racist Republicans??

We have to wonder ... after we finished wading through all the
viciously mean spirited and obscenity laced hate mail we got from
OTHER progressives and liberals, all because we DARED to criticize
President Obama last month for not standing up stronger for
progressive policy initiatives in health care reform. So if there is
anybody else who wants to accuse us of wearing white robes and hoods,
just because we called our new president to account for veering too
far to the RIGHT, there is a perfectly good PERMANENT remove link at
the bottom of every alert, because we will CONTINUE to call them as
we see them. Otherwise please read on, and speaking of which ... “

http://www.peaceteam.net/action/pnum1004.php

If you want to know what other parties are out there, let me know.

stcfarms—fancy yourself a ron paul libertarian? If I was building a plastic island to live on, I would be more careful about how I judged others.YOU are the one who sees people in black and white, GOP or Democrat. But, YOU, no you are FREE!


You both have read my other posts and should know better by now. Youre just reflexive and youre both losing the Independents and Left..but, then youll have a better excuse to do nothing—-except for your own group, whatever that is.

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By stcfarms, October 12, 2009 at 10:43 pm Link to this comment

Your oppressor is laughing at both of you. You each pray to a different face of
your government, Liberal, conservative, commie, patriot, god, traitor et cetera
are just words used by your leaders to keep you divided. As long as you attack
each other the parties get stronger. Of course, their strength is bad for both of
you, they just take turns shearing you. You can continue to fight each other or
you can fight the common enemy.

We are far more knowledgeable, but, sadly, not brighter, than our ancestors.
Some of my ancestors forged the Iroquois confederacy, some of your
ancestors may have written the Magna Carta. Do we really need politicians to
take half our wealth and give back one percent? We have the right to decide
our fate, do we not have the grit?

Hanging the criminals would bring us down to their level. We should just give
them all of the fiat money and send them out to the world to pay the debt. It
matters not to me, I am leaving anyway, I have always wanted a tropical island.
Many of you do not have, or do not want, that option.

A successful organism is one that places viable offspring into the gene pool.
This goes for humans as much as it does for any other creature. If you cannot
get together with people that you do not like, to protect yourself from people
that want to hurt you, then you are too stupid to breed successfully anyway.

By diamond, October 13 at 12:41 am #

Kdelphi I admire all three of the people you despise so I have a very different
perspective on the Peace Prize. As far as I’m concerned the only good
conservative politician is one who is unemployed.

By KDelphi, October 12 at 10:54 pm #

Yes, lets keep voting against things, diamond, because the Dem Party never
gives us anything to vote FOR. Hence Clinton, Kerry and Obama.

Corporate as they come.

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By KDelphi, October 12, 2009 at 10:35 pm Link to this comment

sorry my sp is bad—cant help it.But the Dems could stop being so ball free.

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By KDelphi, October 12, 2009 at 10:32 pm Link to this comment

diamng—wtf does “conservative” have to do with it? You mean Onama, Clinton and kerry?

You can have any type of view you want, but these guys are conservative by anyone but a neo-liberal’s viewpoint.

Do you mean, like, compared to Rush Limbaugh or something?

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By diamond, October 12, 2009 at 9:41 pm Link to this comment

Kdelphi I admire all three of the people you despise so I have a very different perspective on the Peace Prize. As far as I’m concerned the only good conservative politician is one who is unemployed.

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By KDelphi, October 12, 2009 at 7:54 pm Link to this comment

Yes, lets keep voting against things, diamond, because the Dem Party never gives us anything to vote FOR. Hence Clinton, Kerry and Obama.

Corporate as they come.

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By stcfarms, October 12, 2009 at 6:46 pm Link to this comment

What is your problem? Do you read at a third grade level? Most of us hated
Bush and are just waiting for Obama to do something, anything. The bad news
is that we judge politicians by who supports them and Obama has the dullest
witted supporters in the universe. When he became president we gave him a
chance but he is nearing the end of his grace period and posters like you will
ensure that no one with a cerebral cortex extends his grace period.

By ThomasG, October 12 at 8:46 pm #

stcfarms, October 12 at 12:40pm,

ThomasG’s answer  After having listened to the Right-Wing Conservative
EXTREMIST garbage of Rush Limbaugh and Newt Gingrich for all of the years
that led to the FAILED Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Revolution, who do
you expect to take that kind of a putrid frame for anything more than the
regurgitated bile that it is?

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By ThomasG, October 12, 2009 at 5:46 pm Link to this comment

stcfarms, October 12 at 12:40pm,

stcfarms said:  “you will
alienate every one that does not pray at the Obama shrine.”

ThomasG’s answer  After having listened to the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST garbage of Rush Limbaugh and Newt Gingrich for all of the years that led to the FAILED Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Revolution, who do you expect to take that kind of a putrid frame for anything more than the regurgitated bile that it is?

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By ThomasG, October 12, 2009 at 5:31 pm Link to this comment

diamond, October 12 at 5:38pm,

diamond said: ThomasG I hope you realize that flatworms will be outraged at being compared to something as disgusting and evil as Newt Gingrich and will make tiny little signs for a protest march that read I AM NOT NEWT GINGRICH and FLATWORMS ARE PEOPLE TOO. I’m glad Obama won the peace prize because it will make the halfwits who claim he’s not an American citizen implode in their living rooms all over the country. Couldn’t happen to nicer people.

ThomasG’s answer:  I agree.

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By ThomasG, October 12, 2009 at 5:21 pm Link to this comment

hopeychangey, October 12 at 6:23pm,

hopeychangey says: “unveiled to be a sham.”

ThomasG answers: False Frame.

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By ThomasG, October 12, 2009 at 5:20 pm Link to this comment

hopeychangey, October 12 at 6:23pm,

hopeychangey says: <i> “unveiled to be a sham.”

ThomasG answers:<b> False Frame.

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By KDelphi, October 12, 2009 at 5:07 pm Link to this comment

State Medicasid programs are run, in most states, by private insurance industry. They do not save money.

The Estate Benefits Recovery isnt just about when people on Medicaid die—it is the fact that you must maintain resources under $1500, minus house (which allows McMansions in) and that any family member or friend who helps you on any regular basis can lose their assets also.

It prevents many from working and prevents them from saving assets to go to school or making any plan to become ‘not indigent’ in the future (Unless you get a PASS—Plan for Achieving Self Support) and those are few and limited. It prevents those on Mediciad from marrying anyone who has any assets above indigent levels. It prevents them from moving from state to state.

Medicaid is shameful in that it exists. The US is the only industrialized country that forces the poor and disabled onto an inferior system and the “public option” will do the same thing.

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By hopeychangey, October 12, 2009 at 3:23 pm Link to this comment

Apparently ThomasG is upset, and rightly so, that his hero has been unveiled to be a sham.  It is certainly understandable and so he should not be vilified on this board for being defensive.

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By ardee, October 12, 2009 at 3:16 pm Link to this comment

@CT, October 12 at 10:18 am #

Again I fail to understand the criticism. If the States administer the program then it is the states that decide eligibility. Is it the savings to which you object? Are you a CFO for an Insurer?

As to the statement:

Note that Medicaid’s Estate Benefits Recovery provisions for people 55-65 is on the federal end, and that “administration” by the states means that Medicaid in, say, Vermont is likely less lethal and corrupt than it is in, say, California (whose legislature TWICE, incidentally, passed Single Payer, only to have it vetoed by Schwarzenegger).

Interesting, so you think single payer the devils invention? By the by, the “corrupt California’ is exempt from the Estates Benefit Recovery clause of the OBRA bill passed in ‘93, as are Connecticut, Indiana, Iowa and New York. The fault, Horatio, lies with OBRA and not Medicaid. One might consider working to repeal said bill.

The blackout of information about what the so-called Democrats intend to decree about “health care”—or not—for the poor (and the millions more who are likely to become poor before any “reform” hahaha takes effect) should be sufficient to inspire, at least, curiosity beyond wikipedia.

What you call a blackout I call a work in progress. There are reams of reports about this health care reform business, which, by the by, I think will end badly for most. But I think my reasons differ from yours.

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By diamond, October 12, 2009 at 2:38 pm Link to this comment

ThomasG I hope you realize that flatworms will be outraged at being compared to something as disgusting and evil as Newt Gingrich and will make tiny little signs for a protest march that read I AM NOT NEWT GINGRICH and FLATWORMS ARE PEOPLE TOO. I’m glad Obama won the peace prize because it will make the halfwits who claim he’s not an American citizen implode in their living rooms all over the country. Couldn’t happen to nicer people.

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By stcfarms, October 12, 2009 at 9:40 am Link to this comment

As a left wing extremist you would be the one to know about extremists. Most
of the posters seem to be more centered and sticking to the facts. As a rabid
Obamatron you see only attacks instead of the legitimate questions posed by
others. It is ‘people like you’ that will hurt Obama the most because you will
alienate every one that does not pray at the Obama shrine. If someone like you
supports Obama…

By ThomasG, October 12 at 12:15 pm #

You people, Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS, are pathetic.  You would be
singing a different tune in the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Echo-
Chamber if Newt Gingrich had got the Nobel Peace Prize and that would have
been like giving the prize to a flatworm.

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By ThomasG, October 12, 2009 at 9:15 am Link to this comment

You people, Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS, are pathetic.  You would be singing a different tune in the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Echo-Chamber if Newt Gingrich had got the Nobel Peace Prize and that would have been like giving the prize to a flatworm.

President Obama deserves the Nobel Peace Prize because he has demonstrated to the world that he is leading the United States out of the dark age of Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISM that started with Goldwater, then Reagan, Bush I and Bush II that has been so destructive not only to the United States, but to the World as a whole.

The World recognizes through the giving of the Nobel Peace Prize that cleaning up the mess in the World created by the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Movement from Goldwater through Reagan, Bush I and Bush II is a Herculean Task, and to bestow the prize upon President Obama to show their gratitude for his actions in both the best interest of the United States and the World.

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By ThomasG, October 12, 2009 at 9:14 am Link to this comment

You people, Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISTS, are pathetic.  You would be singing a different tune in the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Echo-Chamber if Newt Gingrich had got the Nobel Peace Prize and that would have been like giving the prize to a flatworm.

President Obama deserves the Nobel Peace Prize because he has demonstrated to the World that he is leading the United States out of the dark age of Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMISM that started with Goldwater, then Reagan, Bush I and Bush II that has been so destructive not only to the United States, but to the World as a whole.

The World recognizes through the giving of the Nobel Peace Prize that cleaning up the mess in the World created by the Right-Wing Conservative EXTREMIST Movement from Goldwater through Reagan, Bush I and Bush II is a Herculean Task, and bestowed the Nobel Peace Prize upon President Obama to show their gratitude for his actions in both the best interest of the United States and the World.

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By @CT, October 12, 2009 at 7:18 am Link to this comment

ardee writes:
1. “Wiki notes that medicaid is administered by the states, not the feds, that it is a voluntary program though all the states participate, Arizona being the last to join. Further some states use private insurers and some pay directly.”

2. Thank you for the follow through,@CT though your criticisms of Medicaid are hardly justified by that link. I will do my due diligence and research your criticisms of that program [Medicaid] …...

—> The single paragraph in the linked article is cited only for what it says:

“Officials said one of the options under review would add as many as 7 million lower-income individuals to Medicaid, the federal-state health care program for the poor. It would be cheaper for the government to cover costs under that program than to pay subsidies designed to make private insurance affordable for the same group. Aides put the savings at about $25 billion over 10 years.”

Note that Medicaid’s Estate Benefits Recovery provisions for people 55-65 is on the federal end, and that “administration” by the states means that Medicaid in, say, Vermont is likely less lethal and corrupt than it is in, say, California (whose legislature TWICE, incidentally, passed Single Payer, only to have it vetoed by Schwarzenegger).

The blackout of information about what the so-called Democrats intend to decree about “health care”—or not—for the poor (and the millions more who are likely to become poor before any “reform” hahaha takes effect) should be sufficient to inspire, at least, curiosity beyond wikipedia.

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By ardee, October 12, 2009 at 4:55 am Link to this comment

Well, my first excursion into the claims of @CT re: medicaid certainly fails to support his claims.

Wiki notes that medicaid is administered by the states, not the feds, that it is a voluntary program though all the states participate, Arizona being the last to join. Further some states use private insurers and some pay directly.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicaid

So far I am with Clara Peller in failing to find the beef…..my search will continue.

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By ardee, October 12, 2009 at 3:02 am Link to this comment

Thank you for the follow through,@CT though your criticisms of Medicaid are hardly justified by that link. I will do my due diligence and research your criticisms of that program…...

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By Sodium, October 11, 2009 at 10:26 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Re: Leefeller October 12,at 12:09 am

” As they said on SNL,they gave Obama the Peace Prize for not being Bush!”

Leefeller,

THAT IS THE BEST BADGE OF HONOR PRESIDENT OBAMA CAN USE.

I hope that the inventors of the claim,“for not being Bush”,keep publicizing it until it becomes an integral part of Obama’s legacy after he is no longer President.

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By Sodium, October 11, 2009 at 9:25 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

R: thebeerdoctor,October 10,at 8:49 pm.

thebeerdoctor,

All the shortcomings you raised in your above Re are well known to me. In fact,I have assigned,during the election campaigns,a notebook,especially to record the candidates positions on different issues. I have it all about candidate McCain and candidate Obama ranging from bomb,bomb Iran by McCain to the necessity of waging the war in Afghanistan/Pakistan,to capture or kill Osama bin Laden,by Obama,to their competing homages to AIPAC’s annual convention which had taken place in Washington DC,sometimes in May or June of 2009,to,to,to,to etc….However,I refrain from bringing up his shortcomings,at this time,for a simple reason: I wish to hold any negative comment about him until January 22,2011. In other words,he should be given the first two years of his presidency
to show what he could accomplish. There will remain another two years to try to defeat him in November of
2012 election,if he does not deliver,at least,some of his promises or agenda. Please remember that he inherited almost a totally broken system at various levels of our social,economic,financial,political and diplomatic orders of our society,way of life and America’s standing in the eyes of our friends and adversaries alike. In short,he has inherited an ENTROPC DISASTER,CHAOS,requiring more than one generation of Americans to fix. In addition,he has to navigate very carefully in a sea infested by hatred and bigotry from the Right as well as the Left,each with hopelessly conflecting interests. You figure!

I find myself getting out of the topic at hand,just to provide you with a small part of much much bigger whole. I apologize for falling in the trap I despise so much. Back to the Noble Peace Prize.

The intent of my post of October 10,at 5:57 am consists of two folds:

(1) To show that awarding the Nobel Peace Prize to a leader like Obama is NOT UN-PRECEDENTED. It has,at least,one precedent. That awardee was Mikhail Gorbachev whose Soviet Union was crumpling,under his watch,as a superpower.

(2) To show that a degree of consistancy does exist in the way the Nobel Committee makes its selection. That can be more evident if one has the time to examine carefully the citations provided by the Nobel Committee in order to give support to its way of decision-making.

Indeed,the similarities between the two citations, provided by the Noble Committee,for Gorbachev’s and Obama’s award are striking in words and tone.

Therefore,the meanspirited and vicious attacks generated by certain quarters of the political spectrum against President Obama and the Noble Committee just did not make sense to me. May their God bless them all;and guide them how to cool it.

That is about it,thebeerdoctor.

Before closing,I feel that I must tell you that I appreciate reading your posts whenever time and familly obligations allow me to do so. And thank you for taking your time to let me know your views about issues of mutual interest.

GIVE HUMANITY JUSTICE,PEACE WILL FOLLOW.

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By Leefeller, October 11, 2009 at 9:09 pm Link to this comment

Obama seems disappointing to many people only because they were explicating musicals, at least the bigots were, my dissapointment is in most people here, Obama is working against the tide, the wind and opportunists up the ying yang. How many presidents have made major changes in only 9 months against all odds, a nation full of bigots and a Congress full of divisive opportunists?

Obama was disappointing to me when he was running, for he seemed more hawk then not, but I still voted for him knowing this because he seemed to care about people.  Seems for some people the honeymoon is over, so be it.

Seems I am in the minority for my willing to back off and give Obama some free board in these choppy waters.
Like they said on SNL, They gave Obama the Peace Prize for not being Bush!

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By Inherit The Wind, October 11, 2009 at 7:59 pm Link to this comment

stcfarms, October 10 at 6:01 pm #

I see that it only took you 5 hours to come up with that brilliant response.
************************************

Or maybe she was off having a life.

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By @CT, October 11, 2009 at 5:31 pm Link to this comment

ardee writes:
“Link please”

A link for  
“CBO: Baucus Bill Reduces Deficit By $81 Billion, Costs $829 Billion Over A Decade”, the 7 October piece by David Espo (with, depending on where you find it, others) is http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/10/07/cbo-baucus-bill-reduces-d_n_313017.html

NOTE that the paragraph quoted is the LAST paragraph of his/their piece. It’s a wonder the paragraph wasn’t cut: NOBODY in the government, in the press, or anywhere else wants to talk about Medicaid—in which the WORST abuses laid to insurance companies et al. (as in Keith Olberman’s “Special Comment”, for example) constitute the regular “medical” menu available to the poor—any one of whome can wait a year to see a Medicaid-affiliated “specialist” (say a neurologist), then ANOTHER year to see, say, a Medicaid-affiliated orthopedist in some clinic somewhere.

It’s a waiting game ... playing bureaucratic “health care” until the Medicaid funding unit—not uncommonly having consumed, during his/her years-long runaround, liver-killing quantities of dubious prescribed pharmaceuticals (psycho-meds and expensive experimental analgesics, most likely)— dies. (Then, if he/she received hahaha “treatment” while between the ages of 55 and 65, his/her survivors will be socked with Estate Benefits Recovery collection for the charges, in an amount which is unknowable for the Medicaid funding unit during his/her life.)

Seems like there ought to be a Pulitzer in this, for somebody with the backbone to expose it. Seems like some member of the accursed Congress, whose constituents cry out about this crap all the time, would demur. Seems like some defrocked Medicaid doc would blow the blasted whistle on this semi-final solution. But noooo.

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By Sodium, October 11, 2009 at 5:06 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

This is to respectfully remind everyone that the topic of this thread is about President Obama winning the Noble Peace Prize in 2009. The topic of this forum is not about health care,Medicare or Medicaid. Please respect that.

Anyone who wishes to talk about health care, Medicare or Medicaid,he/she can do so on Truthdig’s section labeled as ” A/V BOOTH ” and look for the headline entitled ” Keith Olbermann: Saving American Lives “. It is the right forum to do so.

I have LIMITED TIME to review some articles and some posts because of demanding family obligations.

Thank you for your co-operation.

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By ardee, October 11, 2009 at 4:33 pm Link to this comment

@CT, October 11 at 2:58 pm

Link please

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By @CT, October 11, 2009 at 11:58 am Link to this comment

ardee writes:
“I find this characterization of Medicare inaccurate and unfair ... “

That’d be because you’ve read “Medicare” for “MEDICAID”. Here’s the paragraph again, with emphasis added:

“Meanwhile, the hijacked former Democrats are about to mandate millions of the poor into the rolling Death Panel of MEDICAID, presumably with the aim of killing off the unrich among the Baby Boomers—for whom Der One expressed such hostility during the primaries—before they reach MEDICARE age.”

—> Try to concentrate on the following:

There’s a widespread misconception, I think, that Medicaid is more or less like Single Payer for poor people. NOTHING could be farther from the truth, and somebody should be examining both Medicaid and the “community clinics” about which politicians are given to waxing ecstatic.

David Espo writes:
“Officials said one of the options under review would add as many as 7 million lower-income individuals to Medicaid, the federal-state health care program for the poor. It would be cheaper for the government to cover costs under that program than to pay subsidies designed to make private insurance affordable for the same group. Aides put the savings at about $25 billion over 10 years.”

—> One reason it would be “cheaper”: people 55 to 65 are subject to Estate Benefits Recovery Act provisions that collect any assets after they die—of crap “care” in some non-profit pill-mill clinic—for charges which are unknowable during Medicaid “beneficiaries”’ lifetime (and can’t be paid back should the person wins the lottery or whatever).

Medicaid SEVERELY limits procedures and medications. It is a rolling Death Panel which is most useful as a funding mechanism for non-profit medical corporations of one kind and another, including hospitals. Those on Medicaid can’t seek second opinions, are barred from obtaining ANY private care outside the Medicaid system—such as an actual diagnosis for serious illnesses such as heart disease or cancer, which are apt to be “treated” with psycho-meds and/or pain pills.

MANDATING the poor, near poor, and the about-to-be-poor into Medicaid amounts to extending the reach of what amounts to deliberate class genocide—and impoverishes the poor from generation to generation when any of them becomes ill between 55 and 65 (the age of prostate problems for men, menopause-associated cancers and other problems for women).

SOMEbody should FINALLY expose this, and STOP mandatory Medicaid—once it’s mandatory, there will be NO escape from it. And more people will die from being ghettoized as funding units for over-priced “community clinics” which have scant real “health care” function—other than paying executive salaries to non-profit hustlers in every little town and neighborhood—beyond churning Medicaid accounts, while literally torturing the sick into early graves.

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By ardee, October 11, 2009 at 11:19 am Link to this comment

@CT, October 11 at 12:18 pm #

I find this characterization of Medicare inaccurate and unfair, also typical of right wing zealots, whether or not you are one is moot.

Despite the attempts to murder that program it thrives, despite the attempts of a few to loot it, it survives. It is th eonly option for many seeking health care and should be a role model and not a target.

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By @CT, October 11, 2009 at 9:18 am Link to this comment

thebeerdoctor writes:
“Maybe like a newly purchased auto, there should be some kind of an equivalent to the lemon law.”

Apparently, however, Cash-4-Clunkers is more up Der Won’s “peace” alley:

Barack Obama ready to pay Afghan fighters to ditch the Taliban
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/Afghanistan/article6869503.ece

It’s the Chicago Way. And it sooo sucks. Meanwhile, the hijacked former Democrats are about to mandate millions of the poor into the rolling Death Panel of Medicaid, presumably with the aim of killing off the unrich among the Baby Boomers—for whom Der One expressed such hostility during the primaries—before they reach Medicare age.

Rich liberals apparently have NO idea about the sadistic hell of Medicaid—but if Obama-boosters don’t want to be complicit in class genocide, they’d uh better find out FAST.

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By Leefeller, October 11, 2009 at 8:28 am Link to this comment

Anticipations as planned expectations seems most naive and a program for disappointments. Proclaiming in ones mind anticipations as absolutism’s seems highly subjective.  In Obama’s case these expectations were set in place like Obama was going to be the best gift ever.

A gift after eight years of long hardship, so now finally the anticipated, most deserved gift ever is sitting under the Christmas tree.  On the special morning,  the gift is still in place, so no one had taken it away, it was not gone like the gifts over the last eight years.  Upon opening, anticipation is fulfilled at last, the well deserved gift, oh so satisfied and happy, happy, at least for now, then unexpectedly the the gift looses some of it’s glimmer, the newness seems gone, what happened to the giddy feeling, it does not quite seem to do what one wants?

Seems anticipation has lead to disappointments. What is going on?  No happy, happy, this feeling sucks!

The new bestest gift ever has turned into a tiring old gift and the damn thing doesn’t work anyway. This requires a need for a replacement or an upgrade.  Damn it starts all over again, now more waiting for the newer better gift?  the Anticipation begins, this time for the best gift ever!

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By Virginia777, October 11, 2009 at 8:16 am Link to this comment

to KDelphi:

Its not hopeless. There is always hope.

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By thebeerdoctor, October 11, 2009 at 6:51 am Link to this comment

So I gather that if you advocate for peace and military disengagement you are now considered a tea bagger? Even Michael Moore for all his laudable outrage at the disparity of wealth distribution, reveals that when it comes to President Obama, he is perfectly happy to be a silly spin doctor.
Come on, as KDelphi pointed out, reality needs to leak out from somewhere.
If this tea bag analogy is correct, then writers such as Matt Taibi and Jeremy Scahill must be card carrying members of this hateful group?
The people who actually voted for Obama who never believed his hope and change rhetoric,but thought he might be reasonable enough to stand up to the injustices that his office could stop, via executive orders… have every right to complain about his sorry performance. Maybe like a newly purchased auto, there should be some kind of an equivalent to the lemon law

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By KDelphi, October 10, 2009 at 11:34 pm Link to this comment

So, Im sure all of you were thinking of suggesting Obama for the Nobel prize weeks ago…right.


So criticizing Obama is “teabagging” now?

You Dems really believe all of this shit dont you? I am finding it so hard to listen to this shit and see the pages and pages of pics of dead Pakistni and Afghan civilians…wtf has happened to you guys? You sure lost me along time ago, but youre gonna lose 2010, and, maybe 2012, if you keep it up.

Obama is not a child. Expect him to do his job and fulfill his promises. Otherwise you will get what you accept—but so does everyone else. Apparently, you do not care. Just so you have the guy you like and that makes you feel self-righteous.

I can just hear the whining when Dems lose the House, but nobody else will notice any difference. Nancy will be so relieved not to have to make up excuses anymore—she can just go back to “we need a majority in the…”

Its hopeless.

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By Leefeller, October 10, 2009 at 8:13 pm Link to this comment

Sodium, nice to see your post, seems my information on Hitler was not very accurate, I made the mistake of believing information from another poster here on TD, which one should never do with out checking sources for accuracy, guess I could be working for the media instead of posting? 

Nobel it is, sometimes I use more than two fingers typing on the keyboard and I when I really get going I type over 95 words a minute, but not accurately, this seems appropriate in keeping me even with some posters who cannot think! One should read their posts backwards for errors, old trick I learned from reading newspaper comics. 

People on TD, expecting Obama to remove the eight year world wide pile of horse manure Bush left behind in several months seems most unfair, especially when he has to work with a congress super majority who couldn’t find blackberry seeds in racoon shit.

Instead of Truthdig, after reading most posters comment here,  I feel like this should be called Teabag!

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By thebeerdoctor, October 10, 2009 at 5:49 pm Link to this comment

Sodium quoting the Nobel committee’s reasons for awarding the Peace Prize to President Obam sounds reasonable enough, except when you examine the actual record of what his fledgling administration has not done. The attack on Gaza where the silence of any criticism became tacit approval, along with the failure to prevent Israel from illegally taking even more land. Then there is the failure to stop funding mercenary contractor armies, such as the murderous entity formerly known as Blackwater. Along with the failure to end the insane war in Iraq, but instead, “to get the job done” (whatever that means), they choose to transfer that lunacy in to something called the AfPak war. I guess it is a new kind of diplomacy, which prompts the pro-Zionist members found at the highest levels of the U.S. government, to seek to provoke a war with Iran, a country that has not invaded anyone. But according to President Obama and the AIPAC experts he seeks counsel from, Iran is a threat to us all.
And lastly, there is the war on terror, a term no longer in fashionable use, but nevertheless always becomes the ultimate alibi for military escalation, such as when President Obama announced that the war in Afghanistan is “a war of necessity”.
Instead of using the same old tired political prisms, it might be wise for true advocates of world peace to expose some reality about all of this. The old aphorism, “it’s not what you say, but what you do” certainly applies here.

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By MarthaA, October 10, 2009 at 5:27 pm Link to this comment

ardee,

Blah, blah.

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By ardee, October 10, 2009 at 4:35 pm Link to this comment

By the way,the correct spelling is Nobel,not Noble. Nobel was the last name of Alfred Nobel,a chemist after whom the prize was named,in accordance to a will he left behind after his death.

Yup and he invented dynamite, and owned Bofors, a weapons manufacturing firm.Guess he had an epiphany late in life.

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By ardee, October 10, 2009 at 4:31 pm Link to this comment

MarthaA, October 10 at 5:37 pm #

stcfarms, October 10 at 12:37pm,

Blah.

..................

Ooops , Martha ,you seem to have slipped. When posting as Thomas you use, “blah” when posting as Martha you use the term,“sophist”.

Please try and keep your various personalities straight or you will further give the game away.

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By stcfarms, October 10, 2009 at 3:01 pm Link to this comment

I see that it only took you 5 hours to come up with that brilliant response.

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By MarthaA, October 10, 2009 at 2:37 pm Link to this comment

stcfarms, October 10 at 12:37pm,

Blah.

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By stcfarms, October 10, 2009 at 9:37 am Link to this comment

Obamatron, one who believes that Obama can do no wrong. Obamatons are
impervious to facts and denigrate anyone that uses them. One Obamatron on
another list called me a racict when I put forth the theory that Neil DeGrasse
Tyson would have made a far better president because he actually had a brain
and was honest. The Obamatron in question had no clue that Neil DeGrasse
Tyson was also black. Obamatrons are quick to judge in the name of their
lord, the real one in the white house or the imaginary one in the sky.

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By Sodium, October 10, 2009 at 9:23 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Re: Leefeller,October 10 at 8:27 am.

“From what I understand Yasser Arafat and Hitler both won the Noble Peace Prize.”

Leefeller,

~ Hitler did not win the Nobel Peace Prize. He was nominated,but later on his nomination was withdrawn.

~ Yasser Arafat did win the Nobel Peace Prize in 1994. He shared it with Itzhak Rabin and Shimon Peres of Israel.

~ Bill Kristal,Glen Beck,Rush Limbauh and the rest of their ilk can rant as long as they want against President Obama and the Committe of the Nobel Peace Prize. Can the barking dogs way way below affect the moving majesty of the clouds way way above? Let them bark until they explode to death by their envy and hatred.

By the way,the correct spelling is Nobel,not Noble. Nobel was the last name of Alfred Nobel,a chemist after whom the prize was named,in accordance to a will he left behind after his death.

Hope the above information will prove helpful to your general knowledge.

GIVE HUMANITY JUSTICE,PEACE WILL FOLLOW….

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By Louise, October 10, 2009 at 8:29 am Link to this comment

@CT,

Ya know, it’s a nice thing when people decide to elevate someone dead to the rightful position of honor the living have decided God should elevate that dead person to.

Would be even nicer if in our invinite narrowness, we had the capacity to honor and recognise greatness while the dead person is still alive. But we don’t which is when being able to decide what God wants comes in handy. And of course the president sending his prayers along makes a lot of people feel better, maybe even the president, who knows?

I do know had he chosen to ignore the whole thing, he would have been in even deeper doo-doo. Such is the nature of being president. You are damned if you do and damed if you don’t so maybe the real lesson here is, it’s damn near impossible to please all the people all the time. Especially when the source of contention is something somebody else did. But just like when Obama jumped into the pile of shit we call the Bush legacy, I suspect he’ll continue on trying to wade through the shit and try not to allow it to pull him down to the level so many shit-makers and hate-mongers love to wallow in. Such is the nature of service.

And it’s nice when a nations leader decides, as a matter of courtesy and respect to recognise the aforementioned elevation, even if it did come from man, not God. And what’s all that got to do with the price of ham on Saturday anyway?

Possibly another question falling on deaf ears. So I guess the really big issue here, isn’t whether or not honoring Obama was nobel, but rather how infuriating it can be when people get their ears plugged up with shit. Or maybe it’s simpler than that. Maybe all the Johny-One-Notes, running screaming down their narrow alleys are actually expressing the level of frustration they feel because nobody ever honored them!

Hmmm. Well I suppose they can always lobby some Church or other ... after they’re are dead.

~~~

TheHandyman,
“First of all LOUISE, your a fruitcake.”

~~~

Geez thanks! That’s the sweetest thing I’ve ever been called. Makes the sun shine up here in patootey land. Maybe you have to work where the sun don’t shine. Sorry about that.

Maybe you could stop banging on the plumbing and start replacing exterior shingles.

Course you’ll get a little wind and rain along with that sunshine, but that as they say, is life smile

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By Leefeller, October 10, 2009 at 5:27 am Link to this comment

It has been interesting watching the pent up frustrations urinating on Obama’s day, From what I understand Yasser Afat and Hitler both won the Nobie Peace Prize.

Republicans after stuffing flags up their arses and waving tea bags over their heads had a nice time cheering when Rio was selected for the Olympics. Now they are having a hissy fit which seems mighty low key compared to what has been posted on this thread.

“Bill Kristol suggests that Obama will be kicked out in 2012, based on the fact that the Soviet Union collapsed a year after Mikhail Gorbachev won a Nobel Peace Prize.”

“Glenn Beck says Obama doesn’t deserve the prize, but the Tea Party protesters do. He credited an “extraordinarily powerful” global progressive network for bagging Obama the win.”

“Limbaugh just comes out and sides with the enemy: “Something has happened here that we all agree with the Taliban and Iran about and that is he doesn’t deserve the award.”

Ann Colter, I didn’t find anything, but if she is smart she will glean some ideas from Truth Dig posters.

Seems togetherness has new meaning, every man women and child, see you at the tea bags.

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By thebeerdoctor, October 10, 2009 at 3:17 am Link to this comment

Perhaps I missed a meeting, but increasing the military budget to the highest level it has ever been in the United States, using drone bomb attacks on hapless wedding parties in Afghanistan and Pakistan, while being unable to stop the land grab in the middle east… how does that qualify for the Nobel Peace Prize?
You got to love Barry’s “fought for justice and peace” comment. I guess that is what is meant when retired General Wesley Clarke said that cluster bombs are “a compassionate weapon”. Fighting for peace? Didn’t George Orwell have something to say about that?

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By Sodium, October 10, 2009 at 2:57 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Subject: From Mikhail Gorbachev to Barack Obama.

In 1990,the Nobel Peace Prize was awarded to Mikhail Gorbachev,the President of the Soviet Union then. The awarding committee had supported its decision by the following citation:

Quote for the Committee’s 1990 Prize Citation,for Gorbacheve:
=================================================

During the last few years dramatic changes have taen place in the relationship between East and West. Confrontation has been replaced by negotiations. Old European nation-states have regained their freedom.

The arms race is slowing down,and we see a definite and active process in the direction of arms control and disarmament. Several regional conflicts have been solved or have at least come close to a solution. The U.N. is beginning to play the role which was originally planned for it in an international community governed by law.

These historic changes spring from several factors,but in 1990 the Nobel Committee wants to honor Mikhail Gorbachev for his many and decisive contributions. The greater openness he has brought about in Soviet society has also helped promote international trust.

Unquote
========

As for the 2009 Noble Peace Prize,the Nobel Committee supported its decision by the following citation:

Quote for the Committee’s 2009 Prize citation,for Obama:
===============================================

The Norwegian Nobel Committee has decided that the Noble Peace Prize 2009 is to be awarded to President Barack Obama for his extraordinary efforts to strenthen international diplomacy and co-operation between peoples. The committee has attached special importance to Obama’s vision of and work for a world without nuclear weapons.

Obama has,as a President,created a new climate in international politics. Multilateral diplomacy has regained a central position,with emphasis on the role that the United Nations and other international institutions can play. Dialogue and negotiations are preferred as instruments for resolving even the most difficult international conflicts. The vision of a world frea from nuclear arms has powerfully stimulated disarmament and arms control negotiations. Thanks to Obama’s initiative,the U.S.A. is now playing a more constructive role in meeting the great climatic challenges the world is confronting. Democracy and human rights to be strengthened.

Only very rarely has a person to the same extent as Obama captured the world’s attention and given its people hope for a better future. His diplomacy is founded in the concept that those who are to lead the world must do so on the basis of values and attitudes that are shared by the majority of the world’s population.

For 108 years,the Norwegian Nobel committee has sought to stimulate precisely that international policy and those attitudes for which Obama is now the world’s leading spokesman. The committe endorses Obama’s appeal that “now is the time for all of us to take our share of responsibility for a global respons to global challenges.”

Unquote
========

It is interesting to note that there is a common denominator in both citations. The common denominator
is expressed in the following OPERATIVE words:

* Dramatic Changes. Historic Changes.

* Arms Control. A World Without Nuclear Weapons.

* The Role of the United Nations and International Law.

* Diplomacy.

There are other OPERATIVE words,but space here does not allow to elaborate further.

I am no fan of President Obama. I follow no man or a woman. I am not a Democrat,nor am I a Repuplican. I am my own man,strive to act and think independently. However,if President Obama overcomes just some of the huge burdens he inherited from Bush/Cheney,I will vote for him again in 2012,if he runs again,regardless of what I may hear or read against him from the Far Left or Far Right. My conscience is my guide.Period.

GIVE HUMNITY JUSTICE,PEACE WILL FOLLOW….

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By LostHills, October 10, 2009 at 12:54 am Link to this comment

Obama is a warmonger in the same vein as Bush and is continuing Bush’s wars. There is no way that he deserves a peace prize when he is sending armies to kill people and control their countries by military force. The longer I think about this travesty the more disgusting it becomes. These wars need to end. They need to end today, and they should have ended in January. Those who gave this man a peace prize have blood on their hands and those who are defending it have blood on their hands.

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By Outraged, October 9, 2009 at 11:38 pm Link to this comment

It is incredibly wonderful that President Obama has been given the Nobel Peace Prize.  He does indeed deserve it.  He has INSPIRED not only his own nation, but the world….. to be better, to do better and to fight for that which is real.  His comment regarding the matter:

This award—and the call to action that comes with it—does not belong simply to me or my administration; it belongs to all people around the world who have fought for justice and for peace. And most of all, it belongs to you, the men and women of America, who have dared to hope and have worked so hard to make our world a little better.

So today we humbly recommit to the important work that we’ve begun together. I’m grateful that you’ve stood with me thus far, and I’m honored to continue our vital work in the years to come.” (Thank you MarthaA)

Thank you, Mr. President.  I feel just a whole lot better for any travesties I’ve incurred regarding the necessary fight for justice.

The people of the world, the people of my country, the people of my state and the people of my community, all the decent ones that is… congratulate you.  You DO inspire so many….. you betcha.  Additionally, we NEED to continue this “vital work” in the years to come.  Absolutely…. I agree.

Communism and Fascism are BOTH dicatorial.  Several commenters here, it appears…, lack the wherewithall to differenciate between the two.  Understandably, all mantras are painted as the “greatest thing since sliced bread”.  However, my grandfather immigrated here from the Ukraine, he (now deceased) hadn’t a kind word for the Bolsheviks (communists).  In this same vein, my father was on duty at Hickam field when the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbor, yet his story was one of the diabolicalness of Fascism… but not one of Japanese hatred.  He had no kind words for Hitler.

This has always been memorable for me.  It has shown me that EXTREMISM, no matter the supposed utopia claimed….. is wrong.  It has also shown me that, tolerance, goodwill and kindness can rule the day.  Additionally, I’ve understood that some will come against you…. But I’ve KNOWN also that MANY ARE AGAINST EXTREMISM, truthfully… “this “some” I speak of, are very realistically NOT the majority population of the world…. nor does this same “some” exhibit any local, state nor national community sentiment when the conscience of such is allowed to be HEARD.

The BS’ers will not win, they will not prevail and not only I, nor my community, nor my state, nor my country is the supposed “last word”.  The world is speaking…. they have taken note….. and they like what they see in Pres. Obama.

What they see…. are each other.  And they see Pres. Obama as a conduit for that, rightfully so.  He deserves his Peace Prize, you bet…. from my vantage point, it is apparent that I’m not the only one “gets it”.

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By KDelphi, October 9, 2009 at 9:04 pm Link to this comment

We will be paying the price for Dubya forever in the form of lowered world expectations and Democratic party expectations lower then—-CLINTON!!

People die everyday for things that Obama could stop with the stroke of a pen. he might be a one term, but he could do it. If you people dont raise your expectations, you are going to get just what you deserve. unfortunately so will everyone else.

I try to ignore you MarthaA, but your one sentence, that, only 4-5 people on this blog think he didnt deserve it?? Did you hear the announcment, in noraway, ?? The crowd?? Lol…I am not trashing Obama for the peace prize—its not his fault and it wilo probably do him harm in the long run. He’s done alot worse things than that, like bombimg the f*ck out of pakistan. peace prize’s ass…

The whole thing is absurd.

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By Leefeller, October 9, 2009 at 8:12 pm Link to this comment

The world has a different view than most of the posters here on TD, they are happy Obama is reaching out to Muslims and hope he will obtain peace in the Palestine Israel conflict, after Bush and Cheney, a stick in the eye of the world looks comforting.

On the other hand, the Republicans make you guys sound like cheer leaders for Obama, I only hope we can hope with Obama!

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By rob, October 9, 2009 at 8:10 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

this is not a question of wether he deserves it or not. His administration 4 years from now will look like lyndon johnsons. The wars in the mid-east will be expanded. people like gone with the wind are wearing rose colored glasses. i will tell you where bush went wrong. He did do anything about the visa process. we should of deported everyone with an expired visa. we should of controlled are borders,we should of had better intelligence and not got into nation blding. surgical military strikes would work better. obama looks like a bush 3rd term

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