glider, I live in California too but do like many things about the South (and also places like Wyoming, Montana etc. that are usually pretty red).

Yes, I think the “Yellow Dog” syndrome is just as strong but not across the board, and isn’t against Northerners anymore—integration is far more common in the South—but against people they think do not understand them. Lately, unfortunately, evangelical and charismatic religion has become more of an influence and plays up morality issues as a sure way to make points with God. But Southerners who aren’t made comatose by religion are usually pretty tolerant of race and very tolerant of eccentricity.

Please do talk to your friend in Arkansas and see what his or her take is, and why. Would be quite interesting.

Have a good trip—Sepharad

Sepharad,

It really is amazing to me to.  I get the feeling the southern states are massively propagandized by talk radio and Fox News.  Although I do not understand if that is true why they would be voting Democrat.  Is the Yellow Dog effect still that strong?

At any rate I am a Californian and I happen to be traveling to Arkansas next week so I intend to do a little research and get the take of a friend who moved there recently.  Maybe I will post my thoughts here afterwards.

Inherit—It IS amazing, how poor most of the red states still are, and yet they continue to let their reps oppose a public health program that probably makes more difference to them than to the fatter states.

On the other hand, California, once a wealthy state now teetering on a robe across an abyss. even when wealthy came in 49th in terms of per capita expenditure on education. Maybe we really do deserve to slide in the sea. (An overbearing Turkish friend from Chicago teases us by saying he’s buying up land at the foot of the Sierra—the eastern side—which he is confident will one day be known as valuable beachfront property.)

On NPR, either McNeil or Lehrer (I keep forgetting which one of them died) asked Political Junkie Ken Rudin what he’d tell Obama to do to salvage the public option before Congress goes out to play during recess. Rudin said he would counsel Obama to lose his inner economist and seriously barnstorm the red states north and south, telling them how much pain they are going to live with if they don’t get their Blue Dogs and others in line. I’d suggest that on his junket he bring Michelle, Ophrah, Bill and Hillary Clinton, James Carville, Jimmy Carter ... and anyone with a genuine connection to the red hearts and minds. Willie Nelson would be pure gold, even in Texas.)

Ed Harges, July 29 at 10:44 pm #

Oh God, please. Of course he’s from Arkan-f—king-sas.  Can we just off-load the South already? We should have let them secede.
**********************************

It’s not too late.  There would be a MAJOR reduction in outlay to Red States that would be between 30% and 50% GREATER than the lost revenue from those states to the IRS coffers.  IOW, the red states pretty much all get MORE $$$ in Federal expenditures than they put in.  Arkansas gets $1.41 from the fedl govt for every $1 they send to DC. Mississippi gets $2.02

Source:
http://taxfoundation.org/research/show/266.html

glider, thanks! Interesting history.

Origin of term Blue Dogs;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_Dog_Coalition

In short;
“Blue Dog Democrat” is derived from the term “Yellow Dog Democrat.” Former Texas Democrat Rep. Pete Geren is credited for coining the term, explaining that the members had been “choked blue” by “extreme” Democrats from the left.[4] The term is also a reference to the “Blue Dog” paintings of Cajun artist George Rodrigue of Lafayette, Louisiana; the original members of the coalition would regularly meet in the offices of Louisiana representatives Billy Tauzin and Jimmy Hayes, both of whom had Rodrigue’s paintings on their walls.

Commencing in the late 19th century, the term Yellow Dog Democrats was applied to U.S. Southern voters who voted solely for Democratic candidates because Abraham Lincoln was the Republican president who led the Union against the Confederacy, and so implies that they would “vote for a yellow dog before they would vote for any Republican”. Currently, the term is now more generally applied to refer to any Democrat who will vote a straight Party ticket under any circumstances.

Well, the vote isn’t until September. Let’s get on the phones and emails and write letters to those newspapers that still exist. And organize another march on Washington when our so-called legislators reconvene.

I am so pissed. (Doesn’t help that Guv Arnold’s cuts are most extremely deep in the social sector—health care, shelters, if it’s good it’s on the way out. A friend who runs the local YMCA shelter for homeless people told me today they’ve decided to try to replace the cuts by raising private money, and what isn’t raised they will figure out how to do themselves with additional volunteers. She said that “We are NOT shutting our doors, period.” We’re organizing to find food growers and suppliers who will donate whatever purchasing power shortfall the Y shelter project ends up with, and local cooks, student cooks, chefs and home cooks with large-scale capacity who will cook the gratis on a rotating basis, at their place if need be. This won’t be that hard—unless some of the suppliers and cooks lose their jobs and can’t afford to be openhanded—but if our pols were not such asses it wouldn’t have to be done at all. There are already advocates for people needing medical care who can’t afford it, but this will have to be revved up too. 

This whole thing has also brought out a controlling side of my nature I didn’t know I had: if I had my way, we’d set specific bars for aspiring candidates to run for governor and all national elective offices and appointed posts, no exceptions. In writing, it will note that it does not matter at all how the live their private lives—they will never be called to account for hiring prostitutes or screwing around or getting drunk, but they have to SWEAR to do the right thing by the people at all times, sign a binding legal document that they will: 1) not accept money or travel or home remodels or corporate jets from anyone representing any industry or individual or group of individuals that might reasonably have issues before or something to sell the government or some objection to government plans that affects them in a financial way and 2) if pressured or tempted or blackmailed in any way by any such group or individual, the elected or appointed public servant will blow the whistle and the importuning party, whether the AMA or Martha Stewart, will be fined 25% of their total net worth which will be placed in a public fund for disbursement to food, medical and caretaking expenses for all who need and can’t pay for it.

The improperly importuning party will also serve one year in solitary then five years of community service—with a life-sentence of same for those who even try to wiggle out of it.

Does anyone know the origin of the term “Blue Dog”? (There is the excellent blue-tick hound, which is competent, loyal, useful and as such does not deserve to be confused with these sick f—-s.)

By ChaoticGood, July 30 at 4:44 pm #

Now that you cleared this up it’s apparent you haven’t been drinking the Kook-aid (thanks for the brand spelling correction…we must give them their due…) but you are certainly drinking something.

As far as smart, we have lot’s of smart asses running the government…they’re in charge…that’s the problem. Have fun watching…(seems that’s what we’ve become…powerless spectators…)

Max Shields
I remember the attempt by the Clinton administration to try to get universal healthcare.  It failed largely because there was no buy-in from the corporate masters and also because there was no political cover for the congressmen and senators.  I believe that Obama has correctly analyzed this problem and has decided to bribe the corporations with perks and scare them with public polling data.  This time, unlike Clinton, Obama has allowed the congressmen and senators to construct elaborate cover and defenses so that they can get re-elected by cleverly letting those from progressive districts say to their constituents that they tried to get more but they just could not get the lobbyists and paid-for congressmen out of the way.  They can blame the Republicans and “blue dogs” and they will get re-elected in 2010.  On the other hand, the congressmen from conservative districts can say to their constituents, we tried to save as much money as we could and keep your taxes down, but we were just overwhelmed by the socialist hordes and those San Francisco democrats.  They too, will get re-elected in 2010. 

Of course, this strategy depends on rabid and unthinking political posturing and demagoguery for it to work.  It depends on a populace that is unknowing and largely ignorant and bent on destruction of the opposing political faction, regardless of the merits of their arguments. The media will whip these stories into a political frenzy for ratings.

This is political ju-jitsu and it is fascinating to watch.

I really have not drunk any kool-aid as you suggested. I am looking at this with my official Machiavelli hat firmly on my head.  And yes, I do think that Rahm Emanuel is this smart.  Do you really believe they haven’t reasoned this out?

Max Shields
I remember the attempt by the Clinton administration to try to get universal healthcare.  It failed largely because there was no buy-in from the corporate masters and also because there was no political cover for the congressmen and senators.  I believe that Obama has correctly analyzed this problem and has decided to bribe the corporations with perks and scare them with public polling data.  This time, unlike Clinton, Obhas allowed the congressmen and senators to construct elaborate cover and defenses so that they can get re-elected by cleverly letting those from progressive districts say to their constituents that they tried to get more but they just could not get the lobbyists and paid-for congressmen out of the way.  They can blame the Republicans and “blue dogs” and they will get re-elected in 2010.  On the other hand, the congressmen from conservative districts can say to their constituents, we tried to save as much money as we could and keep your taxes down, but we were just overwhelmed by the socialist hordes and those San Francisco democrats.  They too, will get re-elected in 2010. 

Of course, this strategy depends on rabid and unthinking political posturing and demagoguery for it to work.  It depends on a populace that is unknowing and largely ignorant and bent on destruction of the opposing political faction, regardless of the merits of their arguments. The media will whip these stories into a political frenzy for ratings.

This is political ju-jitsu and it is fascinating to watch.

I really have not drunk any kool-aid as you suggested. I am looking at this with my official Machiavelli hat firmly on my head.  And yes, I do think that Rahm Emanuel is this smart.  Do you really believe they haven’t reasoned this out?

hello. why has this blue dog group been introduced to us as our heroes? these people are the same ones happy to spend $800billion for something we do not want, and that 85% will opt out of. these blue dog group are a different view of the same cloister of tax spending criminals trying to fervently bankrupt our economy with bigger government and bigger charity. do not think they will not compromise and pass the taxes along to us. they are just positioning themselves for political favors.

ChaoticGood,

What you’ve just posted is exactly why we have no single payer health care. You actually think Obama is providing an alternative. He’s handed it over to Congress…the plan that comes out is HIS.

He has made privatized health care insurance the centerpiece of whatever happens. Any kind of real healthcare for all was jettisoned when he took this on. He does it with everything: first he appeases the Corporate dynasties and powerful lobbists and then and toss out some happy talk speeches to keep your ilk “hoping”.

This has been going on for decades and decades. Don’t you get it? (blue dogs are NOT the problem they are just a symptom, and the faux progressive Dems use them as a way to escape the whole issue. and then there’s the war and more war and more war…all of which the Dems who run the friggin country just can’t get out of…you got to be a bloody idiot to buy and then drink this coolaid.)

I believe (hope) that this semi-destruction of the Obama healthcare plan by the “blue dogs” is just political cover by them.  They must be able to say that they cut the costs of the program to their rural conservative constituents.  This whole bi-partisan scam is the same thing.  It is to placate conservatives who will never vote for the program anyway.  We must realize that our representatives are owned by big corporations who contribute to their re-election campaigns.  If we want healthcare, we must go after the masters, not the slaves.  We have tried for years to have publicly funded elections so we can get representation for us, not the corporations.  That has failed, so we must resign ourselves to having a half baked healthcare system.  The Republicans will never vote for any healthcare system other than the private system and that is because they believe that every human endeavor is better accomplished in the private sector.  This ideology permeates all that they do and they have convinced a sizeable number of Americans that the “free market” is the savior of mankind.  Any movement away from this belief is anathema to insurance companies. That is why they are so afraid of any public plan.  If we were to have any choice other than them, we will take it and they know it.
The “blue dogs” are conservative free market believers that truly believe that the private sector is the best delivery system for healthcare for some of us, but of course, not all of us.
Government workers get a government system, so do retirees, as to veterans.  They get that system because “they deserve the best” and obviously we do not deserve the best.  We must struggle with the “Greatest Healthcare on Earth” as administered by the ever-loving and benificent health insurance industry.

Why are traitors who line their pockets with lobbyist bribes called Blue Dogs?

There will never be a better time to advocate for campaign and lobbyist reform than now. I say delay health care reform until that is accomplished. Use the travesty of the bankster bailouts juxtaposed next to this spectacle of health care reform as a last opportunity to reform our government.

This whole debacle perfectly highlights how dysfunctional the American system has become. Arianna Huffington recently had a great piece on how the essence of meaningful congressional bills are routinely gutted as opponents funded by special interests pile on provisions/modifications that render them meaningless. The problem is related to the most universal of lies told by politicians, “the american people are smart”. The truth is the american people act stupidly, not because they are not smart, but because they are too distracted by the necessity of making a living.  They don’t have time to pay attention to the all important details and are forced to leave that to their so called representatives.  Unfortunately, this limitation does not apply to professional lobbyists.  So in the end what we have is a government that caters to the knowledgable full time lobbyists and seeks only to sufficiently placate the ill informed public.  This is the systemic failing of our government.

Once you forgo Single Payer, there’s only one direction this things goes in - big insurance/pharma.

Obama, and what he represents, is not just naive in this “big tent” notion but is dangerous. Government is owned by corporate lobbiests.

Small businesses should not be saddled with full healthcare coverage. Single payer wouldn’t do that!! And that’s the point. But once private insurance is central to the “plan” you have these meaningless faux arguments.

The so-called Dem progressives lose as they always do. A few like Kucinich keep fighting the fight, but that’s the problem. Kucinich should have left that party long ago. He’s not effecting change; he’s become a “safety valve” for blue dogs and Corporate Dems.

We need a force that takes this conversation over and get’s it out of the hands of the Corporate/Dems.

Health care is controlled by for-profit companies wherein the profit motive compels them to pay as few claims as possible in order to keep the stockholders and CEO’s living like kings. A public option is the only means of breaking the stranglehold they have on all of us, but that means cutting into their profits, so they are spending billions to lobby against it.

Republicans and Blue Dogs are owned by Big Insurance and Big Pharma… we the people mean nothing to them.

If Obama is smart he will campaign hard against the true villians behind the opposition. If he can expose the lies about how seniors will be put to death by their government and other such scare tactics while shining the spotlight on Big Insurance and Big Pharma he might just get what we all want. He will have to employ similar tactics to those the conservatives are using, but instead of attacking them with lies and distortions he simply needs to forcefully debunk their rhetoric while painting Big Insurance, Big Pharma and all of the politicians on their payroll as the true “Axis of Evil”.

On a personal note, I recently moved from southern California to Memphis, TN and I can tell you honestly that conservatives own the media here. Rush, Beck, Hannity and a few local right-wing nutbags are pretty much the “font of knowledge” for most people I’ve met. It’s beyond disturbing to be constantly bombarded with the lies and hate.

My recommendation to the Progressive Caucus.

Organize yourselves as a group and vote no to any bill with a faux crippled public plan.  Simultaneously, announce another bill calling for broad public campaign finance and lobby reform citing the interference by lobbyist special interests in the proposed health care plan as making the case for your new bill.

Fight for it, and use this as a rallying call to get into the 2010 elections and allow the people to vote out these bastards.

Obviously this is the killer part that castrates the public plan and puts a smile on the Blue Dogs face.

“Payment rates to doctors and other medical providers would be negotiated with the secretary of Health and Human Services, instead of tied to Medicare rates as the bill now says. The Blue Dogs contend that change will lead to fairer payment rates”

To top it off they are diluting the public option further by adding state coops into the mix.  This allows the providers to flip the bird to the public plan if they don’t get a high payment rate and just offer any old coop instead.  Pretty smart!  As expected costs for medical care will be able to stay high.  Good job Blue Dogs, you and your families should be well rewarded by the insurance giants.  And don’t worry about all the poor and layed off middle class people in your state.  Who cares, f*ck em, they are idiots and easily fooled by some sleazy TV advertisements you be able to buy with all that bribery money!

Ya-hooo baby, sweet score!!

Seems like southern Democrats have been joining with Republicans in order to advance the interests of business and undermine workers since forever.

Congressman Mike Ross looks like the “What, me worry?” guy.

Ed, I agree we should have let the South secede as that was supposed to be the right of any state in the Union. (The Hartford Convention was about New England seceding because their precious slave and rum trade was being replaced by industrial development like it or not. Only Daniel Webster’s oratory genius carried the day.) And if the South had seceded the cotton gin and other industrial developments tumbling out by then would have eliminated slavery—but not as fast. Also, if they seceded, they would have had no one to blame but themselves—not Northern capitalist ruinous tariffs on cotton, not the abolitionists, not the blacks, not the snarky Northerners—if they found themselves in an economic trough, and they would today be no more racist and backward than Northerners (who are better at concealing their racism).

But the problem at the moment is the Blue Dogs sabotaging real health reform. What the Progressive Liberals—us, right?—have to do is get as skilled in human relations and communication as our good President. And we—especially any of us living in the South—have to convince the middle and working classes that their damned Blue Dogs are selling them out big time for big lobbyists and big medical lobbies. If Progressives had the brains to stop condescending to the Southerners and for that matter the rest of the middle and working class in the first place, there wouldn’t be any Blue Dogs wrecking their and their children’s chances for decent health care.

I hate pr, but we all are going to have to get on it. These Blue Dogs are elected, right? So we have to get them unelected. Huey Long would have eaten them alive and spit them out so fast their heads would spin. There have been other Southern populists and advocates for the less fortunate, there is the whole apparatus of the Southern Povery Law Center. How come these guys are still sitting in their catbird seats? What are we waiting for? Didn’t William Fulbright used to be the senator from Arkansas?

The South has a lot of middle, lower middle, working poor and poor poor people. If Hillary and Obama (who both have quite a following among the people Bush did NOT include as “his base”) would barnstorm with Oprah or whoever would draw the biggest crowds throughout the South during the elections or even right now, I think the good people would figure out really fast what to do with their Blue Dogs. A good enough populist agenda might even get significant recalls. Once people understand what is at stake. The Southern universities are full of idealistic and energetic students who would provide enough volunteers to get out their and get people up in arms. Ole Miss, believe it or not, has a Southern Culture Center largely financed by a lot of John Grisham novel potboilers as well as an activist journalism department. U. of Louisiana at Lafayette, LA more idealistic students and a large, socially active Cajun population. University of Arkansas at Lafayette, AK also has a lively journalism department. How hard can it be to get publicity and get organized?

We need social revolution in this country. If our neighbors down south can do it so can we!

They’re not blue dogs. They’re traitors to their own people. Clearly the money the taxpayers are forced to pay them as salaries is not enough to tempt them to do what they were elected to do - represent the interests of the taxpayers. The money they get from the health insurance lobbyists leaves that money for dead -just like the Americans who either don’t have health insurance or who can’t get treatments they need because the health insurance companies think health insurance is about treating the people who pay them all that money like shit. The executives from these health insurance companies and private hospitals, not to mention the drug corporations live like kings and have the best medical and dental treatment money can buy. The politicians have ditto. Big Insurance and Big Pharma are prepared to bribe a lot of politicians so that lifestyle can continue. Obama says he’s going to get this done and I believe he will but it will take more time than it should because of the obstruction of people like these corrupt canines. Time some sick people just don’t have.

Oh God, please. Of course he’s from Arkan-f—king-sas.  Can we just off-load the South already? We should have let them secede.