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Ear to the Ground

CIA ‘Lied’ to Congress

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Posted on Jul 9, 2009
cia.gov

House Intelligence Committee Chairman Silvestre Reyes wrote that his panel “has been misled, has not been provided full and complete notifications, and (in at least one occasion) was affirmatively lied to” by the CIA. The committee learned of the matter in the secret testimony of CIA Director Leon Panetta, who revealed that the agency he just inherited has been deceiving Congress since 2001.

New York Times:

The director of the Central Intelligence Agency, Leon E. Panetta, has told the House Intelligence Committee in closed-door testimony that the C.I.A. concealed “significant actions” from Congress from 2001 until late last month, seven Democratic committee members said.

In a June 26 letter to Mr. Panetta discussing his testimony, Democrats said that the agency had “misled members” of Congress for eight years about the classified matters, which the letter did not disclose. “This is similar to other deceptions of which we are aware from other recent periods,” said the letter, made public late Wednesday by Representative Rush D. Holt, Democrat of New Jersey, one of the signers.

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By rodney, July 15, 2009 at 12:32 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

CIA lied to congress, Bush lied to the American poeple

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By Folktruther, July 11, 2009 at 2:27 pm Link to this comment

I should have emphasized the distinction between the classical marxism of marx and engels and the modern marxist rank and file tradition.  Modern marxism goes beyond economic power resouces to others much more than classical marxism.

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By ardee, July 11, 2009 at 2:22 pm Link to this comment

Marxism has been criticized for a poor defintion of power, I do nto subscribe to that criticism however.

http://www.smirnov.demon.co.uk/socialism/overview/power.htm

The Marxist or Radical View of Power

Marxists and conflict theorists criticize this pluralist definition of power, and their methods of determining the distribution of power, for a number of reasons.

1. Non-decision making
2. Outcome of decisions
3. Shaping desires

Non-Decision Making

Marxists criticize the pluralist method/conception of power because it ignores non-decision making. Power is more than just the ability to make sure certain decisions reflect your own preferences. Power is also the ability to make sure that certain decisions are never reached, the ability to set the agenda. By controlling what is discussed, what issues and what solutions, you can control the eventual outcome of any decision making process. Marxists would argue that the fact that there has never been a genuine debate about the relative merits of the two systems, socialism and capitalism, as evidence that some can set the agenda.

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By Folktruther, July 11, 2009 at 11:25 am Link to this comment

Yes, Ardee, it is the kind of thing that Marx predicted.  What he could not see was the enormous growth of the learned and mass media and other truth organs to delude and derange our consciousness.  The rise of tv and mass marketing techniques to legitiamte the Educated and Informed truth of the Marketplace of Ideas has immoblized the population, allowing it to be more easily subjugated.

The truth system must thus be conceived along with the money and violence systems as crucial in this subjugation.  And this requires a more general conception of power than marxism provides.

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By ardee, July 11, 2009 at 6:19 am Link to this comment

Folktruther

I concur wholeheartedly with this assessment.

I would only add that all of this is a natural outgrowth of a system that actively seeks unregulated capitalism and thinks free markets a dandy idea. It wasn’t long before our corporations understood that the government was indeed for sale to the highest bidder. It remains sold, lock, stock and barrel to this very day.

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By Folktruther, July 10, 2009 at 2:20 pm Link to this comment

the major destruction of the US as a bourgeois Democracy has been conducted by increasing the power of the CIA and other intelligence and police agencies to implement the president’s policies, and sometimes their own opposed to the president, circumventing congress and the legal system.  the secret assassinations, torture, subversions, abductions, etc could not be done without secret orgnaizations to do them.

And they are increasingly being used against the American people to impose a neoliberal police state.  Obama is not only continuing the policies of Bush, he is expanding them, while disguising them with a liberal rhetoric.  While the mainstream learned and mass media remains silent during the political counter revolution.

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By sophrosyne, July 10, 2009 at 12:57 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

The real histroy and background to 9-11 will not to written for many eyars.  Secrets will be held closely and reputations protected.  Same old, same old.  The reality is Bush lied to Americans and Rove/Cheney/Rummy manipulated facts to get their way.  But in the end, they got away with it.  America is greatly diminished as an economic power.  We will neevr recover our former strengths and the military will gradually weaken as the underlying economics continue to deteriorate.

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By Daniel, July 10, 2009 at 8:25 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

The CIA has been known for some pretty big blunders (the Bay of Pigs may be the best-known). Did they deliberately lie to Congress? I’m not saying it couldn’t have happened. However, there’s also the fact that internal communication in the CIA leaves something to be desired.

According to the video at http://www.newsy.com/videos/congress_dems_take_on_cia, “the CIA says it’s not policy or practice to mislead Congress,” but that “The timing [of the announcement] seems really weird, the letter is dated June 26th, so it’s been out for a few weeks now, it’s just surfaced today…”

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By Outraged, July 9, 2009 at 11:31 pm Link to this comment

Certainly this happened, and we knew this for some time.  I disagree with the most of most of the comments.  It’s appears to me that many want a “simple answer” or a construct which they can “run with”.  This is not the case.  Life is complex and America moreso.

I do not see the entire CIA as corrupt, but more realistically, CERTAIN PORTIONS/PLAYERS as such.  There isn’t qualification to say otherwise.  As an example, is everyone who works for an insurance company a corrupt, uncaring degenerate…?  No, this is not the case, and is really a trial by implication…. are there those who work for insurance companies who are corrupt….. YES.  Be discerning…. shy away from blanket statements, they are the bane of humanity.

Regarding the “letting every member” of congress know about COVERT operations is stupid.  How long do you think a covert operation would remain COVERT if 535 people KNOW ABOUT IT!  That’s stupid.  I agree, Pres. Obama not only SHOULD…, but IS REQUIRED to veto something this incredulous.

Remember Valerie Plame (CIA).....  she was OUTTED, by factions in our own government.  What does this TELL you…?  They OUTTED a CIA agent!  NO. Covert activities SHOULD NOT BE KNOWN to 535 people, who can and most probably WILL leak this information.  That’s stupid.  Members of these committees should have been given accurate information…..YES, however it is foolish to say 535 people should be given this same information.  It doesn’t hold water, and is simply idealistic and ignorant to enamor as much.

Additionally, my thanks to Leon Panetta and others for bringing these facts to light.  It certainly makes ME wonder…. about the whole Nancy Pelosi conundrum….. certainly, without doubt, two and two were not equaling four, logic dictates it should…. it should.

This definitely needs to be addressed.

“Against all enemies, foreign and DOMESTIC.”

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By MarthaA, July 9, 2009 at 9:26 pm Link to this comment

ardee,

Participation and cooperation are entirely different.  What caused all the problems in Congress was the Left’s subservient cooperation with the RIGHT-WING, not just participation.  There was entirely too much cooperation, this “CIA Lied to Congress” may just be another tactic to cover for all their cooperation, because no one has actually mandated a thorough investigation.  Apparently, Congress will just talk about it for a while, change to something else more pertinent, and it will all blow over and be forgotten, as usual.  Pelosi was far more subservient to Bush than anyone representing the people should be.

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By rockinrobin, July 9, 2009 at 9:17 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

And THIS of course is to MISLEAD and DECEIVE the PUBLIC: it is known as PERCEPTION MANAGEMENT: MISLEAD, DECEIVE, DELIBERATELY TARGET & HARM is the WAY of the USA & has been since at least the 1900’s; Exploitation is a CRIME: and not the way ANY DEMOCRATIC GOV is RUN: not ANY Gov other than a CRIMINALLY OPERATED ONE!
Without remorse, feeling JUSTIFIED in ABUSING the PEOPLE who of course MUST PAY: and PAY and PAY and PAY and PAY! They ONLY EXIST to make them RICH: and like an addiction, getting a RUSH every single time they HARM us, it gets steadily worse and worse and worse. http://www.torturingdemocracy.org; http://www.billmoyersjournal.com I believe: who has faithfully reported on the CORRUPTION for 20 years & wonders if it is even doing any good. NOT democracy: CRIMINALLY RUN to harm EVERYONE: feeling that they have the RIGHT to CRACK the WHIP: worse than any dictatorship, these folks believe there “are no lines”; they can do whatever they want, however they want, whenever they want: and never be brought to justice; after all, AMERICANS will believe ANYTHING; they are so gullible & stupid, they say with sneering contempt; cuz they have NEVER done a THING to stop it. Indeed, they have gone to nation after nation to FORCE this SAME CORRUPTION on to them; SLAVERY to BIG BUSINESS: and the “politicians” OWN the MAJORITY of stock in each & every one; working together to HARM the PEOPLE, and the ENVIRONMENT; been so successful HERE, they are now going globally: carrying out Hitler’s agenda; everyone KNOWS this EXCEPT the PEOPLE of the USA, oops: make that United Corps of the WORLD: where EVERYONE can do whatever they want, whenever they want, however they want to the PEOPLE: and JUSTICE does not exist; except for “fabricated” and “unwarrented” prosecutions to make it APPEAR as if there WAS “laws”;
The great DECEPTION called “democracy”: a 1 party CRIMANALLY RUN GOV: polticians & judges bought & paid for by the SAME FOLKS who ran the LARGE PLANTATIONS; inflating prices: giving FALSE reports by so called “authority” figures; mislead, deceive, overbill; just “pretend” to care while in reality carrying out the long term plans and goals to further harm the people of the USA: with MALICIOUS INTENT of PREMEDITATED CRIMES of HATE.
They TOLD you and WHAT did you DO?

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By samosamo, July 9, 2009 at 7:27 pm Link to this comment

““House Intelligence Committee Chairman Silvestre Reyes wrote that his panel “has been misled, has not been provided full and complete notifications, and (in at least one occasion) was affirmatively lied to” by the CIA. The committee learned of the matter in the secret testimony of CIA Director Leon Panetta, who revealed that the agency he just inherited has been deceiving Congress since 2001.”“
****************************************************

Oh, wow, what a revelation.(Pure Sarcasm)
This statement verifies the criminal infestation of our government and that can be extended to most all other parts and sectors of our culture: education, religion, ‘security’, economics, military, corporate, law enforcement, judicial, hell it is all festering like the infected sore that it is, specifically to further repress the, what is it called now, the ‘working class(if they can find work)?

And obama ain’t even breaking a sweat compromizing his compaign promises to the same of the w & dick administratiton agendas so no matter how your political side is, it is surely corrupt and not working for you but against you and it means to totally wear you down as you wait for some magical moment when it ends and life returns to what you are addicted to for your ‘pursuit of happiness’.

The best I’ve seen and heard to contrafound these bastards is to begin setting up local communities that use as little of the national government and corporate euphemisms but that just creates an ‘interthird world’ in this country and does NOT get OUR country back and I am feeling that if obama gets a 2nd term he will have most likely completed that goal; as I have said, obama is just a black version of the previous administrations dating back to at least ronnie fuckface reagan.

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By RobertinWestbury, July 9, 2009 at 6:30 pm Link to this comment

Sort of vindicates Madam Pelosi….  I believed her to begin with.  I do not trust the CIA, and I especially would not trust it under Bush and Cheney.  Of course they manipulated and lied to members of Congress… 

Why anyone doubted her on it is a mystery to me.  They lied to the entire nation to dupe us all into supporting them going to war..

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By Susan Alexander Llauget, July 9, 2009 at 4:57 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I hope that they weren’t expecting us to be surprised by this revelation.

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By ardee, July 9, 2009 at 4:52 pm Link to this comment

In a June 26 letter to Mr. Panetta discussing his testimony, Democrats said that the agency had “misled members” of Congress for eight years about the classified matters, which the letter did not disclose.
...................

Wouldnt that be the Bush years? Would not it seem possible that the CIA, which lies for a living, was ordered to deceive Congress by Bush/Cheney? Wouldnt an investigation possibly find out this stuff?

We are so screwed, and, considering some of the stuff I read here we probably are getting what we deserve.

I’m no fan of Nancy Pelosi but one might reconsider her words of a short few weeks ago that she was NOT briefed as the CIA insisted she was.

It takes work to maintain a Democracy, it requires participation to remain a free nation. We stop participating and we become pawns.

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MarthaA's avatar

By MarthaA, July 9, 2009 at 4:44 pm Link to this comment

When the director of the CIA tells Congress that the CIA has been misleading Congress for years, since 2001, and possibly before, an investigation should be without question, it is appalling that any
member of Congress, much less the House Intelligence Committee
Chairman Silvestre Reyes (D-TX) would have to think about whether or
not to call an investigation, when the CIA Director states for fact
that misleading has been going on for years;  the Director of the CIA
would have no reason to make such a claim other than truth and his
word should be taken for truth.  A thorough investigation must be called right away to find out just how misled the Congress has been; I
suspect other organizations of government have also been misleading Congress.  The Left should not just follow right along with the RIGHT-WING.

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By Xntrk, July 9, 2009 at 4:07 pm Link to this comment

According to the NYT’s article, President Obama threatened to veto the “pending Intelligence Authorization Bill if it included a provision that would allow information about covert actions to be given to the entire House and Senate Intelligence Committees, rather than the so-called Gang of Eight — the Democratic and Republican leaders of both houses of Congress and the two Intelligence Committees.” It goes on to say that this administration is committed to truthful sharing, blah, blah blah.

Oh, I am certain they have the best intentions, but those are often used as road fill. It is much easier to deceive a small group than a larger one - something about being able to fool some of the people comes to mind. A true dedication to truthfulness and open government should have no problem with expanding the group with oversight.

Then, there is the problem of ‘this Administration’. Is there never to be another? Didn’t the GWB Administration break every rule and law with impunity? Even if Leon Panetta and BHO have the best of intentions, would that be guaranteed if the next President were Sarah Palin? Or Newt Gingrich? Or Hillary Clinton? Must we have unquestioning faith in all our Governmental Agencies?

Congress controls the membership of all the different committees. If we have to trust someone, I guess I’d as soon trust the People’s Representatives, as the Imperial Presidency and it’s appointed mouth-pieces.

Actually, they are a pair to draw to - neither inspires me with unalloyed confidence! If the people are to have confidence in the elected officials, then the more information we have, the better. Congress votes for unintelligible legislation without attempting to read or understand it. The President and his people operate on the ‘Trust me, I am your Buddy’ principle. And, the people get screwed by who ever is in power.

They may have banned smoking in most public spaces, but the deals cut in the back room have never gone out of style. At least with most deals, I have a chance to read the fine print. Whether I do or not is up to me. The Government denies us that opportunity whenever possible, especially if it is something important like covert activity in Latin America, plotting to over-thow democratically elected Presidents!

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