rshall,

History is written by the victors, and unfortunately, not by the truthful.

Just scroll down to the link provided by Mr. East to see the futility of your position. Cheney and Bolton took turns going to Langley in order to bully intelligence analysts into falsifying that intel to reflect the links between Iraq and the devil, to say that mythic weapons of mass destruction were being built and aimed at this nation.

Every speech following 9/11 contained both ‘Iraq’ and ‘Sadaam Hussein’ in close proximty to ‘AlQaeda’ and ‘9/11’. Many administration figures, including Richard Clark, claim that the decision to invade Iraq was made immediately ,using 9/11 as an excuse.

When Cheney was a part of the Bush 41 White House the position paper by the infamous Vulcan Group was published speaking for a permanent military presence in the Middle East. James Baker quashed it immediately in the face of a storm of protest by our allies.

You may protest all you wish, you may try as hard as you can to proclaim your heroes innocence and rationality. They are warmongers of the first order and you are simply a quisling….

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDnu8WOcZBM

Atta also was suppose to have met with Rabbi Abramoff, the ripoff lobbyist who imported sniper rifles to Israel with the money he scammed from U.S. Indian leaders.  The meeting was on one of the Sun Cruz lines.

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/Abramoff_scandal.htm

http://www.bradblog.com/?p=1681

Pure coincidence?

Ardee - my comment about partisan websites was directed mainly at your first two links, though the Post’s reputation is certainly left-biased and the opinion piece is by a well known critic of the administration… which is fine - no problem with that, except that a) virtually none of his accusations against the administration has been confirmed despite the best efforts of independent councils and bipartisan commissions, and b) most all the policies he bashes Bush for have been adopted by Obama, except for waterboarding (which obama reserves for only ticking time-bomb cases).  This serves to further diminish Clarke’s lack of credibility as an objective source.

Cheney’s linkage of Iraq with AQ was based on meetings (as he stated) which either did take place, or which only later appeared to be based on faulty intelligence.  The 9/11 commission findings document these, and I’m curious about how you dispute it.  Bush himself stated in 2003 (WH press conference) that there was no evidence of a link between Saddam and 9/11, and the 9/11 Commission reiterated this in 2004.  In the lead up to Iraq, the intelligence backed up claims of meetings between AQ and Iraq.  If you believe Cheney intentionally misled the public in this regard, then that’s your opinion.  If you believe he misled congress, you’ll have to argue with the SIC, Silberman/Robb, Butler, and 9/11 commission reports and I don’t hear you or Clarke refuting them.

Don’t know why I’d attempt to inform you that Bush/Cheney never believed Saddam had WMD’s, when the NIE clearly stated they did.  But I am pleased to be on your good side and will do everything I can to remain there.

Correction of my last post. Atta was said to have met with Czech Intelligence. It’s the Czechs who still claim this meeting took place. Not the Hungarians.

I apologize.

George Bush in his letter to Congress on Iraq action - March 21, 2003:

http://edition.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/03/21/sprj.irq.letter/index.html

“I have reluctantly concluded, along with other coalition leaders, that only the use of armed force will accomplish these objectives and restore international peace and security in the area. I have also determined that the use of armed force against Iraq is consistent with the United States and other countries continuing to take the necessary actions against international terrorists and terrorist organizations, including those nations, organizations, or persons who planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001.”

Marshall, are you serious? Between the lies about weapons of mass destruction and the Al-Qaeda/9-11/Iraq connections, President George W. Bush and seven of his administration’s top officials, including Vice President Dick Cheney, National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice, and Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, made at least 935 false statements in the two years following September 11, 2001, about the national security threat posed by Saddam Hussein’s Iraq.

On at least 532 separate occasions (in speeches, briefings, interviews, testimony, and the like), Bush and these three key officials, along with Secretary of State Colin Powell, Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz, and White House press secretaries Ari Fleischer and Scott McClellan, stated unequivocally that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction (or was trying to produce or obtain them), links to Al Qaeda, or both.

This man is no patriot and certainly doesn’t deserve anyone even attempting to defend him, especially on a site called TRUTHdig…

(but he kept us safe, right? give me a break)

“Publicly, at least, Bush has not explicitly blamed the attacks on Saddam. In speech after speech, however, the president has strongly linked Saddam and al-Qaida, the terrorist organization of bin Laden”.

—-

This is actually a true statement. Bush never did link Saddam Hussein directly to the attacks of Sept. 11.

Cheney did repeat the Atta link on Meet The Press when it first came to light. But he backed off that charge after the FBI further investigated. - It seems Cheney jumped the gun! Interestingly enough, however, the Hungarian Government insists to this day that the Atta meeting with Iraqi Intelligence did occur as they originally reported. <—Perhaps the Hungarians were dead wrong and trying to save face by sticking to their original reporting?

I believe it suited the Bush Administration to keep open the public mind regarding links between Hussein and various Al Qaeda type organizations. It served a useful purpose for them. Especially while the CIA, NSA, and others around the world were reporting many known but little understood links.

President Clinton too talked about some of the same reported links between Saddam Hussein and al Qaeda (and al Qaeda affiliated groups) during his time in office. Clinton once said that “all international terrorism travels through Baghdad”.

Add to that Sen. Hillary Clinton’s speech on the Senate Floor in 2002:—“He (Saddam) has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including Al Qaeda members, though there is apparently no evidence of his involvement in the terrible events of September 11, 2001.”

The 9/11 Commission found such links. So too did the Robb/Silberman Report and the Lord Butler Report. There have also been a couple dozen news reports citing the new Iraq Government, reportedly, finding various documents from the old Republican Guard intelligence apparatus showing more links directly to Al Qaeda proper.

There was also a report that was made public sometime in the past 12 to 18 months. It was widely reported in the media that “there were no ties to Saddam and Al Qaeda”. But the media reports were misleading. On reading the actual report one found many known and documented links, however, and this is important, there were “no known ‘command and Control, operational’ ties”.

—-

However it got done it worked and worked well. Saddam is gone(thank Allah) and Al Qaeda was humiliated in Iraq after Usama bin Laden called for “all good brothers to take up the fight in Mesopotamia”. Where bin Laden claimed the “Central Front” had shifted after being routed in Afghanistan.

Taking down the Taliban and Saddam Hussein was both proportional and effective.

So Cheney disavows an “Iraq/911 connection” at long last. Anybody wonder why? He’s living the life of K in the Franz Kafka novel “The Trial”. He hasn’t been charged yet, but with every passing day he knows the event is looming larger. He has tried to make his case to the public but nobody listens but the servants, who are idiots, and have no real power. Therefore his hopes in influencing the opinions of the judges have failed utterly. K is becoming aware that he is now under the power of the Court and must wait upon their time, needs, and authority. He is no longer free.

Anyone, by the way, who claims Cheney wasn’t under the Regime’s umbrella of “WOMD/Al Qaeda/Iraq” is incredibly naive at best.

Marshall, June 2 at 5:15 pm #

Ardee - i thought we had an understanding about posting propaganda from private partisan sources? 
......

Puhleeeeze, Marshall I understand the enormity of your problem in attempting to deny fact and long disclosed truths but now you call the Washington Post a private partisan source?

Further, the other sources that you attempt to deflate, and who can blame you having nothing whatever to point to of your own, are not editorializing sans links to published statements and documents.

Marshall, you are far too smart not to understand how far out on that limb you currently hang. KDelphi and I , if not others here, are aware of your penchant for refutation of long proven facts in a forlorn and doomed attempt to paint a portrait of your guys as honestly deceived or abysmally ignorant.

To attempt to pass such a thing as Cheney never associated Iraq with 9/11 is simply impossible and shows such huge cajones as to be almost worthy of applause. In the days, weeks and months following that tragic September day it seemed almost impossible to say 9/11 without saying Saadam Hussein or Iraq immediately thereafter.

Next you will attempt to inform us that Bush/Cheney never really believed Hussein had those WMD’s. I like you Marshall, if only for your impossible ego.

Ardee - i thought we had an understanding about posting propaganda from private partisan sources?  Can we both work to make this a Rush-free, Common Dreams-free site?

There was plenty of confusion about Atta’s alleged meeting with AQ - a meeting which was indeed confirmed by Czech intelligence and only later discovered to be false:

http://www.radio.cz/en/article/57782/limit

But I think we also need to accept the fact that two bipartisan commissions (SIC and Silberman/Robb) as well as British Butler report found that the administration (including Cheney) did not mislead congress about the rational for going to war.

ardee—Unlike some here, I am very aware of Marshall’s views and didnt feel that it would be worth posting a bunch of links, as he will still believe what he will believe. He will just find a way to discount your links.

I dont think there are many here that are buying his crap. He’s not “confused” amd neither am I.

No link between Cheney saying Iraq and Sept11 belong together?

EVERY person who supports this war, this occupation, EVERY ONE, military and civilian, EACH AND EVERY ONE will tell you that we are in iraq, defending our freedom because “they” attacked us on Sept11.

NOT ONE supporter has ever said anything different.

Now the fact that there is no relationship between Iraq and Sept11, or any definition of what freedoms they are fighting for…..that’s an entirely different “deer in the headlights” response.

USMC, I gather you are not going to answer my questions. I can only conclude because YOU like all of the other grunts, cannot justify your actions, other than meely mouthing. “fighting for our freedom, or serving your country….....” mantra

Empty slogans are not worth dying for.

Marshall, June 2 at 2:31 pm

Unlike some here I am very familiar with your rather propagandized views on politics and your total willingness to spread manure on topics. I also understand that, when the proofs pile up you will exit stage left, so I post these , not for you, a certified and possibly certifiable devotee of Josef Goebbels and Karl Rove, but for anyone confused by your wilfull intent to dissemble:

All links to Bush and Cheney stating that Iraq and AlQaeda were connected and responsible for 9/11….

http://thinkprogress.org/2006/08/21/bush-on-911/

http://www.seattlepi.com/national/140133_bushiraq18.html

http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/foreign-policy/581

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/05/29/AR2009052901560.html?hpid=opinionsbox1

Marshall—There is ample evidence here on this thread, if one is inclined to believe it. HOw could I possibly give evidence when, as I stated, it is only very cleverly implied? Youre not “confused” youre just being disengenuous.

If not, keep fooling yourself.

Just for the record, I never believed any of it. And, I got arrested for it, too.

By KDelphi, June 2 at 2:08 pm #

You know - I hear about the supposed implications, but I *never* believed there was any link between Saddam and 9/11 so i’m still confused.  What exactly did the administration do to “imply” such a link, and why did so many people believe there was one when there existed no evidence to support it?

Marshall-The reason that there is no direct “quote” (ie Cheney and Iraq’s involvement in 9/11)is that war criminals just imply and manipulate.

Anyone who doubts that Bush et al, implied a link between Iraq and 9/11, are being intellectually dishonest.

And the Dems went right along with it, so there is no exhonerating them.

So I’m confused: I’ve found no record of Cheney ever claiming that Iraq had anything to do with 9/11; only that there was a meeting between AQ and Iraq, which was also confirmed by the 9/11 commission.  He also states in this article that he’s never seen evidence that Iraq had any connection to 9/11.

So what exactly is he “disavowing”?

“Why is this man laughing?”

—Esquire’s relentless rhetorical joke from their annual “Dubious Achievement Awards”...

When this Cheney thing hangs next to Bush,Rice, Powell, Rumsfeld, Feith, Perle, Wolfowitz, Gates, et. al., and several hundred members of congress at NUREMBERG, there will be justice.  A slap on the hand at the Hague.  I spit upon it.

“I thought it was strong at the time and I still feel so today,” Cheney said at a National Press Club lunch in Washington. “There was a relationship between al-Qaeda and Iraq that stretched back 10 years. That’s not something I made up.”

“a relationship between al-Qaeda and Iraq”.....?  There was a “relationship” between al Qaeda and the United States!  Weren’t we the ones arming and training these, now called, “terrorists”?  I thought they were on our side, I mean we were on their side, of course.  BTW, “that’s not something I MADE UP.

This guy never shuts up…..“If you’re going to be engaged in a world conflict such as we are in terms of global war on terrorism, if you don’t have a place where you can hold these people, your only other option is to kill them. We don’t operate that way.”

Unreal.  Yes, we DO operate that way, that’s why we’ve ALREADY killed many of our “past acquaintenances”.  Under your watch no less, Mr. Cheney.

“Cheney, 68, has said lives were saved by Bush administration actions, including authorizing the use of harsh interrogation techniques considered to be torture, such as waterboarding, a form of simulated drowning.”

Would that be the hundreds of thousands of dead Iraqi’s?  Or would that be those roughly 100 “used to be friends of ours” that we now call terrorists that have simply “gone missing” in our “detention centers”?  Maybe he’s talking about those 4,000 Am. soldiers who’ve died, or the 10-fold who’ve been injured…...

“Cheney said the U.S. will face “enormous pressure” to manage GM in a way that doesn’t cost jobs.”

And let’s face it, you wouldn’t find Cheney dickin’ around with JOBS, he doesn’t go in for that shit, this man is a former CEO, he runs A BUSINESS, not a damn works program.

So Cheney…., I was wondering…. do you need a shovel to dig your hole deeper more efficiently?

Paracelus:
My father never told me not to step in dogshit.

But I can imagine he’d say “Be careful not to step in any dogshit that looks like Dick Cheney.”

Funny thing—it all does.

Drag the war criminals - bush - cheney - obama to the Hague. Until that happens there is no justice and there will be no peace. Enough said

We always have imagined the face of evil to be that of some cleft-chinned, alpha male, the kind seen on all those “brown shirt” recruitment posters of days gone by.

But alas, it was as i have always thought it would be, the face of an embittered old nerd, transferring all his adolencent shortcomings and rememberances of teasings and tea-baggings to his views of life. Everyone must now pay for Dick’s social and physical detriments.

If it was not a lie, that would be news worthy.  But to say the bush administration lied about a war that killed and displaced millions destroying a peaceful nation.  Once he admits the bush administration part in 9/11, that will be news.

But I’m sure the American hating republican controlled MSM would be able to spin that so bushes administration is totally exonerated.  After all they admit to torture banned since 1215 A.D. and the MSM and the American people give them a pass.  They destroyed our economy and the MSM and American people give them a pass.  No news here.

“I think it’s going to be very difficult to close Guantanamo,” Cheney said. “It’s a good, well-run facility. If you’re going to be engaged in a world conflict such as we are in terms of global war on terrorism, if you don’t have a place where you can hold these people, your only other option is to kill them. We don’t operate that way.”

Are you sure Dick ,I am convinced that the Afghani newly weds would interpret your modus operendi in a different light.

“Several months after the Sept. 11 attacks, Cheney said it was “pretty well” confirmed that Mohamed Atta, one of the leaders of the attack, had met with a senior Iraqi intelligence official in Prague in April 2000, according to a Washington Post account. Cheney later said the meeting’s existence couldn’t be proven, the Post said. “

Well Dick you do realize that it was Arab terrorists that perpetrated 09 11.So why didn’t you invade Saudi Arabia instead .There’s a lot more oil over there with considerably less people.

“Cheney’s midday speech marked his latest salvo in a personal campaign to defend the Bush administration’s post-9/11 policies while suggesting that Obama’s actions have made the U.S. more vulnerable to terrorist attacks. “

Actually the US is a lot safer now that Big Brother is sealing off the Canada US border,but Dick ,it would be a good idea to build an Israeli style security fence along the 49 th parallel don’t you think and at the same time we could have Graffiti contests.

“In an interview before his speech, Cheney said the U.S. will face “enormous pressure” to manage GM in a way that doesn’t cost jobs.”

Come on Dick that’s a no brainer,are you trying to tell us that GM has not cut any jobs.

“Cheney, whose daughter, Mary, is gay, indicated that he supports same-sex marriages. “Freedom means freedom for everyone,” he said. “I think people ought to be free to enter into any kind of union they wish, any kind of arrangement they wish.”

Yup that about sums up US foreign policy during your tenure.

i don’t understand why truthdig is puffing and sanitizing Cheney.  Usually they boost the Dem neoliberals, pretending that there is a strong difference between them and the neoconservatives.  On the other hand there isn’t much difference from a dDm davocate and Gop advocate policywise, so the confusion is natural.

The Lies that led to war

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6815535985718796639&ei=5WUkSo-8LIK2rgKUjaHoBQ&q=lies+that+led+to+war

“Tens of thousands of Iraqi and American casualties later, we thank you, Dick.”

Lest we forget, let’s remember to thank the Dick for torturing people—whether “just” 3 or 300—over the “ticking time bomb” question attempting to link al Qaeda to the same Iraq he now acknowledges has no linkage. And remember that the Addington/Yoo/et al memos he had drafted said that torture would only be allowed in ticking time bomb situations (he broke the law even according to his very corruptions of those laws).

Yeah. Thanks. Dick.

The link between AlQaeda and Iraq is as spurious as was the supposed involvement of Iraq in 9/11. This guy will never give up. AlQaeda , a fundamentalist group is anathema to a socialist Ba’athist party.
wiki:
Ba’athist beliefs combine Arab Socialism, nationalism, and Pan-Arabism. The mostly secular ideology often contrasts with that of other Arab governments in the Arab world, which sometimes tend to have leanings towards Islamism and theocracy.

Inspired by the French Jacobin political doctrine linking national unity and social equity, the motto of the Party is “Unity, Freedom, Socialism” (in Arabic wahda, hurriya, ishtirakiya). Unity refers to Arab unity, freedom emphasizes freedom from foreign control and interference in particular, and socialism refers to what has been termed Arab Socialism rather than to Marxism.

Me:
As to Cheney’s assertion that the govt is now running GM, well, Dick, your usual BS is showing. Just today Obama made it absolutely clear that the Govt will make no further decisions on the future of that company.

Not that I wish to be seen supporting what Obama did , GM should have been allowed to die for its abysmal management. It would have been better to retrain the workers , provide seed money for start ups, green preferably , to create new jobs, at least in my opinion.

As Michigan will have lost a million jobs in total after GM makes its cuts I appreciate that it is a complicated decision…..

Can’t we just drop this ugly face, filthy mouth and evil soul from continued display on our computer screens?! Wasn’t eight years of having to put up with seeing this incarnation of Satan bad enough? Seeing this savage’s face or reading his speech makes me practically sick to my stomach and feeling like throwing up! I will seriously consider suing anyone or any entity that will continue to remind me of this incarnation of the ultimate evil!