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Ear to the Ground

Holocaust-Denying Bishop’s Apology Falls Flat at Vatican

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Posted on Feb 27, 2009
Williamson
topnews.in

No dice: Saying the bishop did not go far enough, the Vatican won’t buy Williamson’s mea culpa.

The powers that be at the Vatican (at least the earthly variety) are even more upset with Bishop Richard Williamson now that he has apologized. After drawing outrage last month when he claimed that no Jews died in gas chambers during the Holocaust, he made an apology this week. The papacy found it inadequate, to say the least.

AFP via Google News:

Vatican spokesman Federico Lombardi said a letter of apology from Williamson “doesn’t seem to have respected the conditions” set by the Vatican on February 4, under which the bishop was to “distance himself absolutely and publicly” from his positions concerning the Holocaust.

In a letter to the Vatican released Thursday, Williamson apologised to those he offended with his remarks but stopped short of withdrawing them.

Outraged religious groups said Williamson had not retracted claims that no Jews perished in the gas chambers.

Leading German religious groups, including the influential Catholic Church, sharply rejected the apology and a prominent Jewish organisation accused him of continuing to hold his controversial views.

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By Allan Gurfinkle, March 6, 2009 at 5:06 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

By Folktruther, March 5 at 3:46 pm #

.....I should add that the usual argument against the gas chambers is that the external windows and doors were of the normal kind. All this indicates is that there must have been a sealed room inside.  Was there?  This is the crucial question.

A crucial question indeed.  Thanks for asking. It shows you are awake.  Of course the answer is no.  The revisionist arguments are not silly or trivial.  The scrapbookpages.com website has lots of photos and descriptions of the gas chambers at Auschwitz and Majdanek, as well as the shower rooms at Dachau and Mauthausen.

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By Folktruther, March 5, 2009 at 11:46 am Link to this comment

I should add that the usual argument against the gas chambers is that the external windows and doors were of the normal kind. All this indicates is that there must have been a sealed room inside.  Was there?  This is the crucial question.

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By Folktruther, March 5, 2009 at 11:31 am Link to this comment

Williamson belongs to the Mel Gibson wing of traditional Catholocism, which was anti-Semitic.  As was Martin Luther, the original founder of Protestantism.  Zionists confliate anti-Zioionism, the argument against Jewish power, particularly Israeli power, with anti-Semitism, bigotry against the Jewish people.

In the extreme cas, Zionists like Inherit maintain that any ideological tradition that is not Zionist, like socialism,  is anti-Semetic.  They are infected by Aipac drivel.


This confusion between anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism is also rampant among anti-Semites, inflected with the religous tradition, who ignore the distinction.  Conseqauently there is an honest ideological confusion in the American population.

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By Allan Gurfinkle, March 2, 2009 at 6:49 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

By Folktruther, February 28 at 11:41 pm #

......Anti-Semites are increasingly dingbats of one kind or another.  However that doesn’t maean that some of the things that they say are not true.  As I’ve said before, present your case.

TD* does not allow me to make a cogent argument in support of Williamson (and Leuchter), that is why I referred you to his youtube statement.  You called him an anti-semite and a dingbat without even hearing what he has to say?  Perhaps you’re more of a Zionist than you think.

*-ADL approved

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By Allan Gurfinkle, March 1, 2009 at 2:29 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

By dihey, March 1 at 1:27 pm #

..... His younger brother was “shot while trying to flee”. Was his deliberate murder any less atrocious than that of Anne Frank?

Anne Frank was not murdered. She died of typhus at Belsen at the end of the war (wiki).  She had been transferred from Auschwitz to Belsen in anticipation of the Soviet capture of the camp.  Her father was sick when they had arrived at Auschwitz and was not transferred, he was in the Auschwitz camp hospital when the Soviets took the camp and he was released at that time.

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By Folktruther, March 1, 2009 at 10:33 am Link to this comment

Wow, Dihey, your dad must have been one tough mother.

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By dihey, March 1, 2009 at 9:27 am Link to this comment

Thanks Folktruther

Other groups of victims of the Nazi murders were political opponents: Communists, Socialists, Jehova Witnesses and others. Also homosexuals.

It is true that their numbers were considerably smaller than those of Jews murdered and that they were not gassed en masse. However Communists and Socialists were murdered long before any Jew was murdered for being a Jew. The first camp where such opponents were either shot or worked to death was the infamous “Moor Camp” on the Lueneburger Heide in Germany which was started in 1933 already.

For the Nazis there was not much of a difference between a Jew and a political opponent. Both were deemed to be varmint that needed to be eradicated. That is simply forgotten/ignored in the Jewish community which I resent.

I know because my dad was in this group (and a Jew too). He was arrested in 1933, survived prison, and then from 1936 Dachau, Buchenwald, Auschwitz-Monowitz, and Buchenwald again where he was liberated in April 1945.

His younger brother was “shot while trying to flee”. Was his deliberate murder any less atrocious than that of Anne Frank?

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By freeyourmind, March 1, 2009 at 8:48 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I believe in one God, and no more; and I hope for happiness beyond this life.

I believe the equality of man, and I believe that religious duties consist in doing justice, loving mercy, and endeavoring to make our fellow-creatures happy.

But, lest it should be supposed that I believe many other things in addition to these, I shall, in the progress of this work, declare the things I do not believe, and my reasons for not believing them.

I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Turkish church, by the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of. My own mind is my own church.

All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian, or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit.

I do not mean by this declaration to condemn those who believe otherwise; they have the same right to their belief as I have to mine. But it is necessary to the happiness of man, that he be mentally faithful to himself. Infidelity does not consist in believing, or in disbelieving; it consists in professing to believe what he does not believe.

It is impossible to calculate the moral mischief, if I may so express it, that mental lying has produced in society. When a man has so far corrupted and prostituted the chastity of his mind, as to subscribe his professional belief to things he does not believe, he has prepared himself for the commission of every other crime. He takes up the trade of a priest for the sake of gain, and, in order to qualify himself for that trade, he begins with a perjury. Can we conceive anything more destructive to morality than this?  Thomas Paine

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By Eso, March 1, 2009 at 6:20 am Link to this comment

Frankly, I do not believe in history as it has been handed down to us. It is a gargantuan mess. Hitler, Stalin, Roosevelt, Churchill, Bush et all tried to change it. The rulers before them did it. And the rulers before them did it. And the “Church” did it, when it replaced John with Jesus, and most of us who are Christians take the word of the church for God’s truth, even though most of us were baptized before we could speak. Which is to say, I am not with the bishop because he is necessarily right, but because since its inception the state of Israel has tried to change history against the Palestinians, and I do not feel secure that the Jewish version of history is trustworthy. Perhaps a true version of history has to wait for a history written post-B.C.

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By Folktruther, February 28, 2009 at 7:41 pm Link to this comment

Yeah, you’e right, Dihey, there were an estimated half million Roma killed by the Nazis.  Gore Vidal relates that when an actor pointed this out to a Zionist director,  the director replied, “ah, but there were sic milliion Jews.”  The actor responded, “what are you, in real estate.” 

Gore, it is not incidentally to note, who has been attacked by Zionists for being anti-Semitic, had a life partner for half a century who was Jewish.  He has consistenly been anti-racism his whole life.

Allen Gurfunckle—I don’t lie and I am anti-Zionist.  However proving you wrong is not one of my life’s goals. And I don’t watch TV, film, or listen to speeches, or even have the pacience to edit my comments.

There is indeed anti-semistism in the world and historically in the Church, as Purplegirl has pointed out.  The right wing, the wing that the anti-semitic Mel Gibson and his father belong to, in addition to being anti-Zionist, is also anti-Semtitic.

Anti-Semites are increasingly dingbats of one kind or another.  However that doesn’t maean that some of the things that they say are not true.  As I’ve said before, present your case.  It would be sstronger if you observed the distinction between anti-Zionism and anti-Ssemitism.

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By dihey, February 28, 2009 at 2:23 pm Link to this comment

In discussions about the holocaust it is almost never pointed out that the Nazis also got busy killing all Rom (a.k.a. Gypsies). The Western world teems with monuments about the Jewish holocaust. To the best of my knowledge there is only one monument for the plight of the Gypsies anywhere in the world. It is on the Museumplein in Amsterdam/Netherlands. My kudos to the Dutch.

The Germans have no monuments for the killed Gypsies but a gigantic one for the Jewish holocaust in Berlin. That is hypocritical.

There is also no monument for the gassed Gypsies in our country so let’s stop getting all worked up about a rotten priest and take a good look at our own shortcomings.

Has the world succumbed to holocaust propaganda? I think it has.

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By niloroth, February 28, 2009 at 1:14 pm Link to this comment

Fred Leuchter’s technique in gathering his samples was wrong, and as such, produced poor data.  The rest of his issues regarding Auschwitz were just as bad. 

But honestly, if you are actually swayed by the holocaust deniers, you are most likely not the brightest bulb to start with.

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By Purple Girl, February 28, 2009 at 10:07 am Link to this comment

“Sorry You Feel that Way” Is NEVER an Apology!
having been Raised Catholic I can attest it was always the View (teachings) that the Jews Killed Christ Not the Romans. Gee I wonder why the ROMAN Catholic Church would Choose to point the finger at the very Community Jesus was born into. They Never Emphasized Jesus was a Jew, they preferred to make him the first of the ‘New’ Faith, Focused on his Rampage against the moneychangers in the Temple Square, instead of his numerous adherences to Jewish law.Jesus never denied his Faith, he only rebelled against the hypocrisy of it’s Religious leaders who had appeased the ‘peagan’ Roman Empire.
Jesus was born a Jew and Died a Jew! If Mary was Virgin, and Jesus was the Son of God- God chose a Jewish Woman to bless with His ‘seed’.He ‘anointed’ the Jewish Religion with this Messenger, as He apparently had every other time.
The Catholics and all the other sects bore out of it are Just as Guilty of Persecuting the Jewish Community as the Roamn Pagans and the later Muslims.How can You Accept Jesus ‘into Your Heart’ when you deny his real faith?
The ROMAN Catholic Chruch has Far more to Apologize fro than this One Holocaust Denier.Besides Wheres “Pope” Ratz Apology for being a Nazi Youth? Nothing more than Deceivers and Deniers with diamonds on the Soles of their Shoes

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By Allan Gurfinkle, February 28, 2009 at 6:33 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

By Folktruther, February 28 at 3:47 am #

...  the good Bishop belongs to the anti-Semitic Mel Gibson wing ...

....  But of course no one has to listen.

...  But I would.  I’m a sucker for this kind of thing.

You’re lying, you’re just indulging in the usual Zionist namecalling, which is an effort to stifle discussion.  But, you can prove me wrong.  Listen to the Bishop’s youtube statement, try to understand it (this will take a little effort) and, refute it if you can.

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By godistwaddle, February 28, 2009 at 4:26 am Link to this comment

Every religious institution in Germany supported Hitler, and the Roman Catholic church in particular gave him a free pass.

As Phil Sheridan said,“The only good christian I ever saw was dead.”

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By Folktruther, February 27, 2009 at 11:47 pm Link to this comment

the good Bishop belongs to the anti-Semitic Mel Gibson wing of the church, for all I know he may be a child raping pediophile, but he has the right to argue any fucking truth position he wishes, as long as he wants and as loud as he wants.

My grandparents were killed by the Nazies but, who knows, maybe not by gas chambers for all I know.  I wasn’t there.  It’s hard to know who is worse in this situation, the Zionists, the pope or the Bishop.  But they all can argue whatever historical position they want, AND CAN’T SHUT EACH OTHER UP.  But of course no one has to listen.

But I would.  I’m a sucker for this kind of thing.

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By octopus, February 27, 2009 at 8:37 pm Link to this comment

There are other tragic narratives of eternal victimization than the Hebraic one….
How many millenia must I endure this one ?

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By paul bass, February 27, 2009 at 8:37 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

“The catholics, as well as all other christian derivatives, should thank the jews for killing Jesus. After all, without the image of the agonizing death of Jesus, and all the guilt laden mumbo-jumbo that surrounds it, none of us “good christians” would have church to go to on sunday.”

there is no historical evidence of what you call “jesus” and the religion you call judaism today has little in common with the practices of the same name at that time.
ps from a former orthodox jew (20 years of biblical studies)turned anti-theist

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By octopus, February 27, 2009 at 8:16 pm Link to this comment

Religions are here to keep us from having a religious experience.
Jung

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By paul bass, February 27, 2009 at 6:14 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

maybe its time to just stop paying attention to the theocratic autocracy known as the catholic church and maybe stop giving them tax free land around the world and maybe we should have them apologize for raping children in there care.
does it real matter if the people who say condoms are evil and AIDs ravaged people,s should be taught to fear condoms, are getting some history wrong.

besides about half of active nazis where confessing Catholics so they fully aware of what really happened.
and maybe

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By Big B, February 27, 2009 at 6:06 pm Link to this comment

The catholics, as well as all other christian derivatives, should thank the jews for killing Jesus. After all, without the image of the agonizing death of Jesus, and all the guilt laden mumbo-jumbo that surrounds it, none of us “good christians” would have church to go to on sunday.

Besides, the catholic church is singularly responsible for the on going holocost on the African continent, as well as the abject poverty that most central and south americans live in every day. Instead of preaching that “be fruitful and multiply” bullshit to poor nations without an infrastucture or educational system, they should have been teaching birth control, farming, and the concept of taking responsibility for your actions. But that’s not how catholics work. They are as bad as the muslims. Keep opressing your women and pumping out rugrats so you will always outnumber the other religions. Who cares if overpopulation eventually causes famine in these stupidity ridden shit hole countries.

Because a dead catholic baby is better than no baby at all.

Why do people still listen to this bullshit?

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By Allan Gurfinkle, February 27, 2009 at 5:12 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

According to the article, “Outraged religious groups said Williamson had not retracted claims that no Jews perished in the gas chambers.”

Williamson’s statement, which can be seen on youtube, on why he believes that there are no gas chambers is precise and well thought out.  He says that the gas chamber shown to visitors at Auschwitz has an unsealed wooden door.  He argues that for that reason the room could not have been used as a gas chamber.  The argument is convincing to me.  Williamson also cites the research of Fred Leuchter.  Leuchter looked for cyanide residues that would have been present had the room been used as a gas chamber, and found none.  This argument also is convincing to me.

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