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 Ahmadinejad’s Christmas Speech Raises RuckusPosted on Dec 25, 2008
Britain’s Channel 4 has a tradition of featuring an alternative Christmas message as a kind of counterpoint to Queen Elizabeth’s customary speech, and this year’s speaker—Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad—is sparking outrage.
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By Folktruther, January 1 at 11:11 pm #
Thank you for the Sand’s argument, Kellina. Everyone once in a while you get a courageous and honest historian. One can argue against his position, arguing that the Jewish people are a ‘modern nation’, but he manages to dispell a lot of Zionist bullshit along the way.
Report thisBy PatrickHenry, December 28, 2008 at 12:29 pm #
By Peace, December 27 at 2:24 pm
Your pro-Israeli position cannot be further from the truth.
Israel demonizes and threatens its neighbors daily by force of arms and nuclear blackmail.
There are other schools of thought on who started the 67’ war. Isn’t that the year the USS Liberty was intentionally attacked by our good ally Israel?
Report thisBy Fellowdigger, December 28, 2008 at 12:11 am #
All Abrahamic faiths are insane - insane - insane - look at these stories from the bible and the front page - still acting like a bunch of barbarians -which is excatly where they came from
Report thisBy Fellowdigger, December 27, 2008 at 11:58 pm #
wow - you people are long winded
Report thisBy Fellowdigger, December 27, 2008 at 11:54 pm #
TD is full of religious zealots - every blog you go to the conversation turns to the mythical bible - whta’s up with you people - Europe is about to under go another Muslim invasion - at least with Hitler they didn’t invite him in, they just ignored him. Also, America is in no position to other countries how to deal wiht there affaris when we are still in Iraq and have 10,000 Nuclear weapons - Bush gave away any moral high ground that we thought we had
Report thisBy Peace, December 27, 2008 at 7:24 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
Crimes of the State Blog writes:
“Quite sick of the endless Zionist lies. You stole the country. You demonized the natives and pretended they had no claim to their own land, despite UN resolutions to the contrary. You commit egregious acts of war against Palestinian civilians, daily, in the hopes of driving them away and stealing more of their land.”
Israel does not demonize the people who live in any part of the lands on which it was established in 1948. In fact - Israeli Arabs are respected as full citizens and enjoy freedoms of democracy that fellow arabs living in other countries can not even dream of - the right to vote, freedom of speech, freedom of language and education. Jews and Arabs, as well as other religeous populations, like the Druze, live in a prolific and positive co-exsistence within Israel. This co-existence is disrupted only when external events stir excitement in either side.
The country was not stolen. Jewish populations lived in parts of the Land of Israel through all the centuries after the nation of Israel was exiled. In recent centuries a broader movement to return was supported by legitimate land purcahses and driven by diplomatic efforts that won international recognition for the state of Israel.
Israel’s occupation of Plestinian population, in the lands conquered in 1967, is a different story. These lands were taken in a defensive war. Their continued occupation is, however, more difficult to justify. The great majority of the population in Israel is fully in favour of establishing an independent Palestinian state in these territories, which will peacefully live and prosper side by side with Israel. The main reason for the impracticality of this solution to the conflict is the violence and hate that dominate the policy of Hamas and of other Arab regimes supported by Iran. The Assad regime, terrorizing and abusing Lebanon and its people, is thriving on the continued conflict. The people of Israel will continue to hold these lands until they can be absolutely sure that they can trust their neighbors to invest in prosperity and not in wars and weapons designed to destroy Israel and to commit genocide against its Jews and Zionist inhabitants. This is why Israel, in the current situation, can not agree to a quick implementation of the two states solution, as outlined by Rabin, Peres and Arafat. Israel’s full withdrawal from the Gaza Strip was met by Hamas missile assaults targeted against civilian populations. The hate speech exemplified in Nahida’s comments is further proof to the defensive necessity of the depth of conviction Israel has in defending itself.
Wishing all mankind a more peaceful 2009.
Report thisBy PatrickHenry, December 27, 2008 at 1:09 pm #
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad made some quite eloquent remarks regarding Christianity and all of them true.
How would Jesus describe things today if he could only be heard over zionist controlled media?
I have faith that all the manevolence perpetrated by Israel will be heaped back on it soon.
Report thisBy Kellina, December 27, 2008 at 12:15 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
Shattering a ‘national mythology’
By Ofri Ilani
Tags: Palestinians
Of all the national heroes who have arisen from among the Jewish people over the generations, fate has not been kind to Dahia al-Kahina, a leader of the Berbers in the Aures Mountains. Although she was a proud Jewess, few Israelis have ever heard the name of this warrior-queen who, in the seventh century C.E., united a number of Berber tribes and pushed back the Muslim army that invaded North Africa. It is possible that the reason for this is that al-Kahina was the daughter of a Berber tribe that had converted to Judaism, apparently several generations before she was born, sometime around the 6th century C.E.
According to the Tel Aviv University historian, Prof. Shlomo Sand, author of “Matai ve’ech humtza ha’am hayehudi?” (“When and How the Jewish People Was Invented?”; Resling, in Hebrew), the queen’s tribe and other local tribes that converted to Judaism are the main sources from which Spanish Jewry sprang. This claim that the Jews of North Africa originated in indigenous tribes that became Jewish - and not in communities exiled from Jerusalem - is just one element of the far- reaching argument set forth in Sand’s new book.
In this work, the author attempts to prove that the Jews now living in Israel and other places in the world are not at all descendants of the ancient people who inhabited the Kingdom of Judea during the First and Second Temple period. Their origins, according to him, are in varied peoples that converted to Judaism during the course of history, in different corners of the Mediterranean Basin and the adjacent regions. Not only are the North African Jews for the most part descendants of pagans who converted to Judaism, but so are the Jews of Yemen (remnants of the Himyar Kingdom in the Arab Peninsula, who converted to Judaism in the fourth century) and the Ashkenazi Jews of Eastern Europe (refugees from the Kingdom of the Khazars, who converted in the eighth century).
Unlike other “new historians” who have tried to undermine the assumptions of Zionist historiography, Sand does not content himself with going back to 1948 or to the beginnings of Zionism, but rather goes back thousands of years. He tries to prove that the Jewish people never existed as a “nation-race” with a common
Report thisBy kellina, December 27, 2008 at 12:14 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
origin, but rather is a colorful mix of groups that at various stages in history adopted the Jewish religion. He argues that for a number of Zionist ideologues, the mythical perception of the Jews as an ancient people led to truly racist thinking: “There were times when if anyone argued that the Jews belong to a people that has gentile origins, he would be classified as an anti-Semite on the spot. Today, if anyone dares to suggest that those who are considered Jews in the world ... have never constituted and still do not constitute a people or a nation - he is immediately condemned as a hater of Israel.”
According to Sand, the description of the Jews as a wandering and self-isolating nation of exiles, “who wandered across seas and continents, reached the ends of the earth and finally, with the advent of Zionism, made a U-turn and returned en masse to their orphaned homeland,” is nothing but “national mythology.” Like other national movements in Europe, which sought out a splendid Golden Age, through which they invented a heroic past - for example, classical Greece or the Teutonic tribes - to prove they have existed since the beginnings of history, “so, too, the first buds of Jewish nationalism blossomed in the direction of the strong light that has its source in the mythical Kingdom of David.”
So when, in fact, was the Jewish people invented, in Sand’s view? At a certain stage in the 19th century, intellectuals of Jewish origin in Germany, influenced by the folk character of German nationalism, took upon themselves the task of inventing a people “retrospectively,” out of a thirst to create a modern Jewish people. From historian Heinrich Graetz on, Jewish historians began to draw the history of Judaism as the history of a nation that had been a kingdom, became a wandering people and ultimately turned around and went back to its birthplace.
Actually, most of your book does not deal with the invention of the Jewish people by modern Jewish nationalism, but rather with the question of where the Jews come from.
Sand: “My initial intention was to take certain kinds of modern historiographic materials and examine how they invented the ‘figment’ of the Jewish people. But when I began to confront the historiographic sources, I suddenly found contradictions. And then that urged me on: I started to work, without knowing where I would
Report thisBy kellina, December 27, 2008 at 12:13 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
end up. I took primary sources and I tried to examine authors’ references in the ancient period - what they wrote about conversion.”
Sand, an expert on 20th-century history, has until now researched the intellectual history of modern France (in “Ha’intelektual, ha’emet vehakoah: miparashat dreyfus ve’ad milhemet hamifrats” - “Intellectuals, Truth and Power, From the Dreyfus Affair to the Gulf War”; Am Oved, in Hebrew). Unusually, for a professional historian, in his new book he deals with periods that he had never researched before, usually relying on studies that present unorthodox views of the origins of the Jews.
Experts on the history of the Jewish people say you are dealing with subjects about which you have no understanding and are basing yourself on works that you can’t read in the original.
“It is true that I am an historian of France and Europe, and not of the ancient period. I knew that the moment I would start dealing with early periods like these, I would be exposed to scathing criticism by historians who specialize in those areas. But I said to myself that I can’t stay just with modern historiographic material without examining the facts it describes. Had I not done this myself, it would have been necessary to have waited for an entire generation. Had I continued to deal with France, perhaps I would have been given chairs at the university and provincial glory. But I decided to relinquish the glory.”
Inventing the Diaspora
“After being forcibly exiled from their land, the people remained faithful to it throughout their Dispersion and never ceased to pray and hope for their return to it and for the restoration in it of their political freedom” - thus states the preamble to the Israeli Declaration of Independence. This is also the quotation that opens the third chapter of Sand’s book, entitled “The Invention of the Diaspora.” Sand argues that the Jewish people’s exile from its land never happened.
“The supreme paradigm of exile was needed in order to construct a long-range memory in which an imagined and exiled nation-race was posited as the direct continuation of ‘the people of the Bible’
Report thisBy Kellina, December 27, 2008 at 12:12 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
that preceded it,” Sand explains. Under the influence of other historians who have dealt with the same issue in recent years, he argues that the exile of the Jewish people is originally a Christian myth that depicted that event as divine punishment imposed on the Jews for having rejected the Christian gospel.
“I started looking in research studies about the exile from the land - a constitutive event in Jewish history, almost like the Holocaust. But to my astonishment I discovered that it has no literature. The reason is that no one exiled the people of the country. The Romans did not exile peoples and they could not have done so even if they had wanted to. They did not have trains and trucks to deport entire populations. That kind of logistics did not exist until the 20th century. From this, in effect, the whole book was born: in the realization that Judaic society was not dispersed and was not exiled.”
If the people was not exiled, are you saying that in fact the real descendants of the inhabitants of the Kingdom of Judah are the Palestinians?
“No population remains pure over a period of thousands of years. But the chances that the Palestinians are descendants of the ancient Judaic people are much greater than the chances that you or I are its descendents. The first Zionists, up until the Arab Revolt [1936-9], knew that there had been no exiling, and that the Palestinians were descended from the inhabitants of the land. They knew that farmers don’t leave until they are expelled. Even Yitzhak Ben-Zvi, the second president of the State of Israel, wrote in 1929 that, ‘the vast majority of the peasant farmers do not have their origins in the Arab conquerors, but rather, before then, in the Jewish farmers who were numerous and a majority in the building of the land.’”
And how did millions of Jews appear around the Mediterranean Sea?
“The people did not spread, but the Jewish religion spread. Judaism was a converting religion. Contrary to popular opinion, in early Judaism there was a great thirst to convert others. The Hasmoneans were the first to begin to produce large numbers of Jews through mass conversion, under the influence of Hellenism. The conversions between the Hasmonean Revolt and Bar Kochba’s rebellion are what prepared the ground for the subsequent, wide-spread
Report thisBy kellina, December 27, 2008 at 12:11 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
dissemination of Christianity. After the victory of Christianity in the fourth century, the momentum of conversion was stopped in the Christian world, and there was a steep drop in the number of Jews. Presumably many of the Jews who appeared around the Mediterranean became Christians. But then Judaism started to permeate other regions - pagan regions, for example, such as Yemen and North Africa. Had Judaism not continued to advance at that stage and had it not continued to convert people in the pagan world, we would have remained a completely marginal religion, if we survived at all.”
How did you come to the conclusion that the Jews of North Africa were originally Berbers who converted?
“I asked myself how such large Jewish communities appeared in Spain. And then I saw that Tariq ibn Ziyad, the supreme commander of the Muslims who conquered Spain, was a Berber, and most of his soldiers were Berbers. Dahia al-Kahina’s Jewish Berber kingdom had been defeated only 15 years earlier. And the truth is there are a number of Christian sources that say many of the conquerors of Spain were Jewish converts. The deep-rooted source of the large Jewish community in Spain was those Berber soldiers who converted to Judaism.”
Sand argues that the most crucial demographic addition to the Jewish population of the world came in the wake of the conversion of the kingdom of Khazaria - a huge empire that arose in the Middle Ages on the steppes along the Volga River, which at its height ruled over an area that stretched from the Georgia of today to Kiev. In the eighth century, the kings of the Khazars adopted the Jewish religion and made Hebrew the written language of the kingdom. From the 10th century the kingdom weakened; in the 13th century is was utterly defeated by Mongol invaders, and the fate of its Jewish inhabitants remains unclear.
Sand revives the hypothesis, which was already suggested by historians in the 19th and 20th centuries, according to which the Judaized Khazars constituted the main origins of the Jewish communities in Eastern Europe.
“At the beginning of the 20th century there is a tremendous concentration of Jews in Eastern Europe - three million Jews in
Report thisBy Kellina, December 27, 2008 at 12:10 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
Poland alone,” he says. “The Zionist historiography claims that their origins are in the earlier Jewish community in Germany, but they do not succeed in explaining how a small number of Jews who came from Mainz and Worms could have founded the Yiddish people of Eastern Europe. The Jews of Eastern Europe are a mixture of Khazars and Slavs who were pushed eastward.”
‘Degree of perversion’
If the Jews of Eastern Europe did not come from Germany, why did they speak Yiddish, which is a Germanic language?
“The Jews were a class of people dependent on the German bourgeoisie in the East, and thus they adopted German words. Here I base myself on the research of linguist Paul Wechsler of Tel Aviv University, who has demonstrated that there is no etymological connection between the German Jewish language of the Middle Ages and Yiddish. As far back as 1828, the Ribal (Rabbi Isaac Ber Levinson) said that the ancient language of the Jews was not Yiddish. Even Ben Zion Dinur, the father of Israeli historiography, was not hesitant about describing the Khazars as the origin of the Jews in Eastern Europe, and describes Khazaria as ‘the mother of the diasporas’ in Eastern Europe. But more or less since 1967, anyone who talks about the Khazars as the ancestors of the Jews of Eastern Europe is considered naive and moonstruck.”
Why do you think the idea of the Khazar origins is so threatening?
“It is clear that the fear is of an undermining of the historic right to the land. The revelation that the Jews are not from Judea would ostensibly knock the legitimacy for our being here out from under us. Since the beginning of the period of decolonization, settlers have no longer been able to say simply: ‘We came, we won and now we are here’ the way the Americans, the whites in South Africa and the Australians said. There is a very deep fear that doubt will be cast on our right to exist.”
Is there no justification for this fear?
“No. I don’t think that the historical myth of the exile and the wanderings is the source of the legitimization for me being here, and therefore I don’t mind believing that I am Khazar in my origins.
Report thisBy Kellina, December 27, 2008 at 12:08 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
I am not afraid of the undermining of our existence, because I think that the character of the State of Israel undermines it in a much more serious way. What would constitute the basis for our existence here is not mythological historical right, but rather would be for us to start to establish an open society here of all Israeli citizens.”
In effect you are saying that there is no such thing as a Jewish people.
“I don’t recognize an international people. I recognize ‘the Yiddish people’ that existed in Eastern Europe, which though it is not a nation can be seen as a Yiddishist civilization with a modern popular culture. I think that Jewish nationalism grew up in the context of this ‘Yiddish people.’ I also recognize the existence of an Israeli people, and do not deny its right to sovereignty. But Zionism and also Arab nationalism over the years are not prepared to recognize it.
“From the perspective of Zionism, this country does not belong to its citizens, but rather to the Jewish people. I recognize one definition of a nation: a group of people that wants to live in sovereignty over itself. But most of the Jews in the world have no desire to live in the State of Israel, even though nothing is preventing them from doing so. Therefore, they cannot be seen as a nation.”
What is so dangerous about Jews imagining that they belong to one people? Why is this bad?
“In the Israeli discourse about roots there is a degree of perversion. This is an ethnocentric, biological, genetic discourse. But Israel has no existence as a Jewish state: If Israel does not develop and become an open, multicultural society we will have a Kosovo in the Galilee. The consciousness concerning the right to this place must be more flexible and varied, and if I have contributed with my book to the likelihood that I and my children will be able to live with the others here in this country in a more egalitarian situation - I will have done my bit.
“We must begin to work hard to transform our place into an Israeli republic where ethnic origin, as well as faith, will not be relevant in the eyes of the law. Anyone who is acquainted with the young elites of the Israeli Arab community can see that they will not agree to live in a country that declares it is not theirs. If I were a Palestinian I would rebel against a state like that, but even as an Israeli I am rebelling against it.”
The question is whether for those conclusions you had to go as far as the Kingdom of the Khazars.
“I am not hiding the fact that it is very distressing for me to live in a society in which the nationalist principles that guide it are dangerous, and that this distress has served as a motive in my work. I am a citizen of this country, but I am also a historian and as a historian it is my duty to write history and examine texts. This is what I have done.”
If the myth of Zionism is one of the Jewish people that returned to its land from exile, what will be the myth of the country you envision?
“To my mind, a myth about the future is better than introverted mythologies of the past. For the Americans, and today for the Europeans as well, what justifies the existence of the nation is a future promise of an open, progressive and prosperous society. The Israeli materials do exist, but it is necessary to add, for example, pan-Israeli holidays. To decrease the number of memorial days a bit and to add days that are dedicated to the future. But also, for example, to add an hour in memory of the Nakba [literally, the “catastrophe” - the Palestinian term for what happened when Israel was established], between Memorial Day and Independence Day.”
Report thisBy nahida, December 27, 2008 at 8:27 am #
BREAKING NEWS
the blood-thirsty zionists launche massive strike on Gaza
Sat, 27 Dec 2008 09:55:33 GMT
israeli warplanes have carried out a massive airstrike on Hamas security compounds inside the Gaza Strip, killing at least 180 and wounding 800 others.
The number of casualties are escalating by the minute
http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=79641§ionid=35102
Report thisBy nahida, December 27, 2008 at 8:09 am #
Deuteronomy 2:34-35; 3:6-7; Josh. 6:17; 8:2, 24-28; 10:28-40; 11:14, 13:12-18; 20:10-18 all call for the total annihilation of the enemy - men, women, and children.
Judaism REQUIRE a death sentence for the following “crimes”: -
- working on the Sabbath (Exodus 31:15)
- cursing one’s parents (Leviticus 20:9)
- being rebellious towards parents (Deuteronomy 21)
- worshiping other gods (Deuteronomy 17:2-5 and 32:23-25)
- enticing a friend or family member to worship other gods (Deuteronomy 13:6-10)
- being a witch, medium, or wizard (Exodus 22:18; Leviticus 20:27)
- engaging in homosexual acts (Leviticus 20:13)
- not being a virgin on one’s wedding night (Deuteronomy 22:20-21)
- having sex outside of marriage (Leviticus 20:10-13,1 Corinthians 5:5)
- violating the Sabbath (Numbers 15:35, 15:36)
- marrying a foreigner (Numbers 25:6-9)
Report this- becoming apostate or a heretic who dissents (1 Timothy 1:20)
.
By nahida, December 27, 2008 at 8:04 am #
In Samuel 15:3, “Now therefore go, and smite Amalec, and utterly destroy all that he hath; spare him not, nor covet any thing that is his; but slay both man and woman, child and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.”
In Numbers 31:1-35, “.the Lord spoke to Moses saying: Revenge first the children of Israel on the Madianites. when they fought against the Madianites and had overcome them, they slew all the men. Therefore kill all that are of the male sex, even of the children: and put to death the women that have carnally known men. But the girls, and all the women that are virgins save for yourselves .and the spoils which the army had taken, was. thirty two thousand persons of the female sex that had not known men.”
In Numbers 33:50-52, “.the Lord said to Moses: Command the children of Israel. When you shall have passed over to Jordan, entering into the land of Chanaan, Destroy all the inhabitants of that land: beat down their pillars and break in pieces their statues, and waste all their high places.”
In Samuel 27:8-9, “And David and his men went up, and pillaged Gessuri, and Gerzi, and the Amalecites; for these were of old the inhabitants of the countries. David wasted all the land, and left neither man nor woman live.”
In Isaiah 13:15-18, “Every one that shall be found shall be slain; and every one that shall come to their aid, shall fall by the sword. Their infants shall be dashed in pieces before their eyes: their houses shall be pillaged, and their wives ravaged. with their arrows they shall kill the children, and shall have no pity upon the sucklings of the womb, and their eye shall not spare their sons.”
“If there is found among you, in one of your towns that the Lord your God is giving you, a man or woman who does what is evil in the sight of the Lord your God, and transgresses his covenant by going to serve other gods and worshipping them-whether the sun or the moon or any of the host of heaven, which I have forbidden-and if it is reported to you or you hear of it, and you make a thorough inquiry, and the charge is proved true that such an abhorrent thing has occurred in Israel, then you shall bring out to your gates that man or woman who has committed this crime and you shall stone the man or woman to death.” (Deuteronomy 17:17)
And when the LORD thy God shall deliver them before thee; <b>thou shalt smite them, and utterly destroy them; thou shalt make no covenant with them, nor show mercy unto them: 3 Neither shalt thou make marriages with them; thy daughter thou shalt not give unto his son, nor his daughter shalt thou take unto thy son.<b>” (Deuteronomy 7:2-3)
Report thisBy nahida, December 27, 2008 at 7:58 am #
and more:
“When the LORD your God brings you into the land where you are entering to possess it, and clears away many nations before you, the Hittites and the Girgashites and the Amorites and the Canaanites and the Perizzites and the Hivites and the Jebusites, seven nations greater and stronger than you. And when the LORD your God delivers them before you and you defeat them, then you shall utterly destroy them. You shall make no covenant with them and show no favor to them.” (Deuteronomy 7:1-2)
“I will send my fear before thee, and will destroy all the people to whom thou shalt come, and I will make all thine enemies turn their backs unto thee.” (Exodus 23:27)
And the LORD our God delivered him before us; and we smote him, and his sons, and all his people. At God’s instructions, the Israelites “utterly destroyed the men, women, and the little ones” leaving “none to remain.” 2:34 And we took all his cities at that time, and utterly destroyed the men, and the women, and the little ones, of every city, we left none to remain. (Deuteronomy 2:33-36)
Joshua said to the people of Israel, “The Lord has given you the city of the all silver, and gold, and vessels of brass and iron, are consecrated unto the Lord: They shall come into the treasury of the Lord. The people utterly DESTROYED ALL THAT WAS IN THE CITY, BOTH MAN AND WOMAN,YOUNG AND OLD, AND OX AND SHEEP, AND ASS, WITH THE EDGE OF THE SWORD. (Joshua 6:21,23)
“And he should go and worship other gods and bow down to them or to the sun or the moon or all the army of the heavens, .....and you must stone such one with stones and such one must die.” Deuteronomy 17:3-5
“Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man intimately. But all the girls who have not known man intimately, spare for yourselves.” (Numbers 31:17-18)
“In Deuteronomy 7:1-36, “.the Lord thy God shall have destroyed many nations before thee, the Hethite, and the Gergezite, and the Amorrite, and the Chanaanite, and the Pherezite, and Hevite, and the Jebusite, seven nations much more numerous than thou art,…thou shalt utterly destroy them. Thou shalt make no league with them, nor show mercy to them: and shall slay them until they are utterly destroyed.and thou shalt destroy their names under heaven: no man shall be able to resist thee, until thou destroy them.”
Report thisBy nahida, December 27, 2008 at 7:57 am #
To those ignorant who condemn Islam; my advice:
“ And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but perceivest not the beam that is in thine own eye?” 6:41
why not have a look at some verses from the Bible before jumping to denounce and criticise others:
What shall we call this genocide, ethnic cleansing, holocaust or what??
“And to the others he said in mine hearing, Go ye after him through the city, and smite: let not your eye spare, neither have ye pity: Slay utterly old and young, both maids, and little children, and woman: but come not near any man upon whom is the mark; and begin at my sanctuary. Then they began at the ancient men which were before the house.” (Ezekiel 9:5-6)
“And we took all his cities at that time, and utterly destroyed the men, and the women, and the little ones, of every city, we left none to remain.” (Deuteronomy 2:34)
When you approach a city to fight against it, you shall offer it terms of peace. If it agrees to make peace with you and opens to you, then all the people who are found in it shall become your forced labor (aka slaves) and shall serve you. However, if it does not make peace with you, but makes war against you, then you shall besiege it. When the LORD your God gives it into your hand, you shall strike all the men in it with the edge of the sword. Only the women and the children and the animals and all that is in the city, all its spoil, you shall take as booty for yourself; and you shall use the spoil of your enemies which the LORD your God has given you. Only in the cities of these peoples that the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, you shall not leave alive anything that breathes” (Deuteronomy 20:10-17)
“This day the LORD will deliver you into my hand, and I will strike you down, and cut off your head; and I will give the dead bodies of the host of the Philistines this day to the birds of the air and to the wild beasts of the earth; that all the earth may know that there is a God in Israel, Then David ran and stood over the Philistine, and took his sword and drew it out of its sheath, and killed him, and cut off his head with it…. And David took the head of the Philistine and brought it to Jerusalem; but he put his armor in his tent. And as David returned from the slaughter of the Philistine, Abner took him, and brought him before Saul with the head of the Philistine in his hand.” 1 Samuel 17:46
“at Jezreel by this time tomorrow…And when the letter came to them, they took the king’s sons, and slew them, seventy persons, and put their heads in baskets, and sent them to him at Jezreel. When the messenger came and told him, “They have brought the heads of the king’s sons,” he said, “Lay them in two heaps at the entrance of the gate until the morning.”. (2 Kings Chapter 10 verse 6) “God has now fulfilled the prophecy of the prophet Elijah. So Jehu put to death all who were left of the house of Ahab in Jezreel, as well as all of his close friends and priests, until he had left not one single survivor.” (2 Kings Chapter 10 verse 10) “He put to death all of Ahab’s house, who were left there and so blotted it out, in fulfillment of the word which YAHWEH had spoken to Elijah.” (2 Kings Chapter 10 verse 7)
Report thisBy Eray Sehrengiz, December 27, 2008 at 1:30 am #
(Unregistered commenter)
It is a shame that the Labour Party has such backward fanatic MPs as Ellman who are ready to bend the facts to the breaking point. This is a very dangerous game they are playing and this warmongering fanaticism of the “allies” is far more aggressive and dangerous than that of Iran’s.
Ahmadinejad, who is possibly a freakin fanatic just like most politicians, does not deny the Holocaust, neither does he call for destruction of Israel. These are two facts that are still being changed towards open hostility towards this country. What he opposes is the “myth of the holocaust” as in creating a whole big illusion around it. He doesn’t say “there was no holocaust” but he’s saying “stop branding anyone who doesn’t want to hear more of the holocaust as anti-semitist”. And isn’t it so true that there have been many other genocides or mass murders before and after the holocaust, but yet it is made to appear to be the biggest and worst one in the eyes of most people?
And he doesn’t call for destruction of Israel, he just says “Zionism have to be taken out of the pages of history”. The “disgraceful stain in the Islamic World” that he targets to eliminate is not the state of Israel, it is Zionism, which is the worst form of political racism being practiced today and evidently Zionism is a disgraceful stain on the face of humanity an will be remembered with a shameful past one day, along with Nazism and Apartheid. He has a very legitimate and widely supported view in this and this is why western media and politicians had to change his words and bend the facts.
“To long for modified political conditions in a country is a world-wide day-to-day business by all means. But to commute a demand for removal of a ‘regime’ into a demand for removal of a state is serious deception and dangerous demagogy.”
We need to wake up to the real reasons behind these enmities. Otherwise we won’t be any more than pieces on a checkers board.
The quotes are from:
Does Iran’s President Want Israel Wiped Off The Map?
Does He Deny The Holocaust?
http://www.arbeiterfotografie.com/galerie/kein-krieg/hintergrund/index-iran-0013.html
Report thisBy Maani, December 26, 2008 at 11:43 pm #
[The following is by Akbar Ganji, an Iranian journalist and dissident, whose writings are currently banned in Iran.)
“For many Iranian opposition leaders, as well as much of the Western media and political class, Ahmadinejad is the main culprit of Iran’s ills today: censorship, corruption, a failing economy, the prospect of a U.S. attack. But this analysis is incorrect, if only because it exaggerates Ahmadinejad’s importance and leaves out of the picture the country’s single most powerful figure: Ali Khamenei, the supreme leader.”
“The Iranian constitution endows the supreme leader with tremendous authority over all major state institutions, and Khamenei, who has held the post since 1989, has found many other ways to further increase his influence. Formally or not, the executive, legislative and judicial branches of government all operate under the absolute sovereignty of the supreme leader; Khamenei is the head of state, the commander in chief, and the top ideologue. He also reaches into economic, religious, and cultural affairs through various government councils and organs of suppression, such as the Revolutionary Guards, whose commander he himself appoints…”
“Despite all the attention he received, Ahmadinejad does not even rank among Iran’s top 100 leaders of the past 30 years…[He] is only as powerful as he is devoted to Khamenei and successful at advancing his aims…”
Report thisBy SoD1, December 26, 2008 at 10:56 pm #
Ahhh… Finally? The most important Talk that HAS to be talk, is starting to be talked!
The Untouchable Ones – who have become the root cause for so much despair and pain - will soon have to become, Regular People, like every one else.
The intentionally missed Opportunities for Peace have to be discussed. What would consequently have to mean, even a “God’s Country” like Israel be able to be FORCED with the very same vehemence we are forcing others to ‘Peace’! Even with Sanctions and threat of ANNECTIONS under U.S. FULL support and or Leadership,. If that is what Israel needs to comply , so be it!
It is time for such exceptionalness for a one small “tribe” of People due to something that happened in the past to STOP! It is time for the World to come to reason and to Peace, a Peace constantly disturbed by SOME in that ‘tribe’ solely in it for their egomaniac “interests”.
It is more than time for Power to shift “Powers”!
And the most vehement and loudest ones to point out all the FAILURES and atrocities among the mightiest ones in their very own “tribe” are and will have to be Jewish. People, who will have the courage to stand up strong against the Culprits among their own, to prevent the otherwise consequential resulting generalized hatred and prosecution of the entire Tribe in the near Future, by a gowning number of People around the World frustrated and angered by Israel’s Politics and Foreign Policies, as evidential here alone on the Comments
People like Rabbi Michael Lerner, Prof. Noam Chomsky, Naomi Klein, Prof. Stanley I. Kutler, Norman G. Finkelstein, Zbigniew Brzezinski, John Mearsheimer and Stephen Walts and many more will have to make the start and take a stand against their own people. As must at some point ,same be done by the other “tribes” with the culprits in their tribes.
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/sfgate/detail?blogid=15&entry_id=26785
http://www.commondreams.org/views02/0428-04.htm
http://www.iht.com/articles/2007/02/07/opinion/edkulter.php
Time, is running out fast…
Shalom!
Report thisSoD1
By Dyev, December 26, 2008 at 9:08 pm #
nahida,
Report thisMuslims aren’t vengeful? Ask Salman Rushdie about that. Ask the women victims of ‘honor killings’. Islam is the only religion I have heard of where any Imam can issue a fatwah calling for another person’s death. Granted fundamentalist christian minsters call for the deaths of others, but they don’t speak for the legal system. So far.
By Dyev, December 26, 2008 at 8:59 pm #
To all and sundry,
Report thisShow me one western country where the inhabitants didn’t get there by kicking out and/or killing the previous inhabitants. This is probably true for most non-western countries also. If you really want to respect and protect those previous inhabitants, why not talk about Australia, New Zealand and, of course, the United States of America.
By Crimes of the State Blog, December 26, 2008 at 6:14 pm #
Israel’s apologists continue their talking points; no surprises there.
Let’s cut the crap. Israeli state terror is the cause of most strife in the Middle East today (except for similar US state terror, which we must attempt to stop).
Israel covets their neighbor’s lands, and they have been expanding their territory for many decades, sometimes slower, sometimes faster. These historical injustices are supported by the US congress because the US Israeli lobby is very powerful—at corrupting our foreign policy. We shovel billions to the rogue state of Israel, mostly in arms and “loans” that never need to be repaid. They Israelis turn around and use a small portion of that graft to buy influence. That’s the carrot.
The stick is US media and financial power, where US supporters of Israel wield sizeable power—the kind that can make or break politicians, entertainers, authors, college professors.
Anyway, a crime against humanity continues in Palestine, and the Palestinians are displaced in genocidal fashion (something we’re supposed to be AGAINST thanks to the lessons of “the Holocaust”). And this farce continues in a sea of lies which attempt to obfuscate what is really going on there.
Iran ties in in several ways.
1. Large oil and gas reserves (big plus)
2. Natural enemy to US and Israel (we overthrew their democratic government with criminal CIA operation in 1953, and gave them death squads and torture chambers, which they rose up in revolt against).
3. Iran supports HEZBOLLAH, who kicked Israel’s ass when Israel launched yet another criminal war of aggression against Lebanon in 2006, bombing indiscrminately and showering the southern half of the country with one million cluster bombs.
Iran, therefore, stands in the way of Israeli territorial expansion. That is why it is demonized. Israel has no legitimate fear of a non-nuclear Iran attacking anytime soon. Israel has over 200 atomic bombs and the means of delivering them. That is reality. The Zionist lies are paper thin attempts to justify an illegal war of aggression against Iran, hopefully forcing the US to help.
These are monstrous crimes, and hopefully sane non-Zionists can see through this garbage.
All US money should stop immediately flowing to Israel.
Israel’s UN status should be revoked until justice is achieved for their victims.
Israel’s nuclear weapons programs should be put under a UN inspection regime and the state disarmed, much like Saddam was disarmed.
There’s a start.
http://crimesofthestate.blogspot.com/
Report thisBy Fadel Abdallah, December 26, 2008 at 5:30 pm #
By Ivan Pomidoroff, December 26 at 9:14 am #
(Unregistered commenter)
“Mohammed said in his Hadith: ‘The Hour [Day of Resurrection] will not arrive until you fight the Jews, [until a Jew will hide behind a rock or tree] and the rock and the tree will say: Oh Muslim, servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him!”
book 41, no. 6985
=====================
So what’s the point Ivan Pomidoroff?!
It seems to me that fanatic Zionists like you, in their psychology of insecurity for the wrongs they have done, are determined to leave no stone unturned in digging out all spurious literature, Christian and Islamic, and using that to justify hastening their prophetic implications.
If we add to your spurious quotation from the Islamic Hadith the prophesies of the fanatic Christian Zionists about the battle of Armageddon and the second coming of Christ, it seems to me that only fanatic Zionists are willing to take these spurious prophesies with any level of seriousness!
If you’re seriously concerned about the security of the Jews, all you need to do is to right the wrongs of the insecurity, cruelty and crimes you have committed against the native people you wrongly decided to live among by way of their dispossession, annihilation, ethnic cleansing and perpetual brutal military occupation!
Report thisBy Russian Paul, December 26, 2008 at 5:01 pm #
What makes me most uncomfortable about these discussions is the inability for some people to seperate Anti-Semitism from Anti-Zionism…
User - Although there have always been Jewish inhabitants in the area, do you really have no qualms about how the land was taken from the present inhabitants and the apartheid and genocide that followed? And if you don’t agree, why not be a little more humble with your explanation? Especially considering what the Palestinians are going through with the blockade in Gaza. Blocking journalists, food, supplies from entering…Jimmy Carter calls it a “crime and atrocity” as does Desmond Tutu and others who even agree with Israel’s right to exist.
On the other hand, Fadel - you’re comments were rather dispicable…By attacking the Talmud and their “old erring ways” you seem to be taking an issue with “Jews” as a people, not Israel as a nation. Why else use one of their ancient texts as an example of their poor judgement? The Quran and the Bible also have plenty of ancient desert prejudices and shouldn’t be used as an example of people as a whole.
And Beer Doctor is right - those who profit from the conflict are sitting on the sidelines laughing.
Report thisBy PSmith, December 26, 2008 at 4:46 pm #
How Refreshing - An Unhypocritical Christmas Message
So nice to hear a message of peace and love at Christmas. From a head of state whose government is NOT responsible for 1.3m plus deaths (in Iraq alone).
The Boy Emperor is unfortunately ineligible, as is Queen Elizabeth on that score.
Report thisBy thebeerdoctor, December 26, 2008 at 2:45 pm #
The mythology road show continues unabated. Hindu extremist combined with Jewish extremists means more profits for the war making manufacturers. While the religious ethnics hurl insults at one another, the people promoting the arms are laughing all the way to the bank. There maybe a great depression, but the forces of insanity are logically secure.
Report thisBy P. T., December 26, 2008 at 2:40 pm #
This is an outrage: Israeli president Shimon Peres was recently “knighted” by Queen Elizabeth.
In the past 60 years, Peres contributed to and was responsible for Israeli terror and the ongoing occupation. He recruited and armed the Hagana terrorists who led the ethnic cleansing of Palestine in 1948.
He is responsible for the only nuclear weapons cache in the entire Middle East. As the president of Israel, he presides over the starving of a million and a half Palestinians subject to a siege in Gaza.
Report thisBy Fadel Abdallah, December 26, 2008 at 2:14 pm #
More on the Israeli-Zionist connection to troubled areas of the world!
=====================
“India’s Reckless Road To Washington Through Tel Aviv
By Vijay Prashad
http://www.countercurrents.org/prashad261208.htm
The costs of the Tel Aviv-New Delhi-Washington axis are too much to bear, at least for India. India cannot afford to mimic Israel’s failed neighborhood
Report thispolicy, nor can it follow the U. S. example that seeks to solve its problems by aerial bombardment. South Asia requires a regional solution to what is without doubt a regional problem
By Ivan Pomidoroff, December 26, 2008 at 2:14 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
“Mohammed said in his Hadith: ‘The Hour [Day of Resurrection] will not arrive until you fight the Jews, [until a Jew will hide behind a rock or tree] and the rock and the tree will say: Oh Muslim, servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him!”
Report thisbook 41, no. 6985
By namer, December 26, 2008 at 1:55 pm #
nahida, December 26 at 8:29 am wrote:
“Hear me well clan of zion; even though we, Muslims, are not vengeful, nor are we unforgiving by the virtues of our faith; however if you continue in the same mannerism of barbaric behaviour, along with your shameless lies; you will inevitably face your retribution”
Right, Mother Of All Battles, Gates Of Hell, blah blah blah…..
Report thisBy thebeerdoctor, December 26, 2008 at 1:37 pm #
U.S. Foreign Policy mythology demands a boogie-man bad guy at all times and Ahmadinejad, being the misinformed former mayor of Tehran, fits the bill quite nicely. His anti-Israel rant is to be expected, after all, it is the Israelis who have the Hydrogen bombs, and there are plenty of extremists in Israel who would like to do what Secretary of State designate Clinton said, about “totally obliterating them”.
Report thisIsn’t it odd that the United States screams about Mr. Dinnerjacket (as he sometimes is mockingly called) for his inflammatory rhetoric, yet refuses to recognize its own? You do not have to be a Zionist conspiracy theorist to notice the strangle hold perception put forth in the United States media, that Israel is good and Arabs are bad. But that is just the ideology road show. What this is all about is keeping the billions of dollars flowing to the war making manufacturers. There is no economic depression at Lockheed-Martin, nor will there be one under the new Obama administration.
By nahida, December 26, 2008 at 1:29 pm #
Hear me well clan of zion; even though we, Muslims, are not vengeful, nor are we unforgiving by the virtues of our faith; however if you continue in the same mannerism of barbaric behaviour, along with your shameless lies; you will inevitably face your retribution
What you fail also to see is that the world around you is changing
The world is awakening to the reality of your crimes
And guess what? There is no going back
There is no way of covering up your crimes now
I know that you are still living in your comfort bubble behind your “security” wall (psychological and physical); but be absolutely sure that when you come face to face with the hard reality about the changing world around you, the TRUTH will hit you hard like a tsunami as never before
And while you are still choosing to live in a state of complete denial, refusing to see what is happening elsewhere, the truth will strike in a manner unknown
It will disturb your sleep as you wake up to the nightmare of your creation
Shatter your illusions as you open your eyes to the new reality
Paralyze your limbs as your missiles and weapons rendered useless
And silence your lies once and for all
NOTHING… NOTHING will save you then from the outrage and anger of the good people of the world except what you could save NOW of whatever little left of your morality and humanity
Things as they stand now:
You are tiny tiny minority in a sea of Muslims that surrounds you, and an ocean of world population who are sick to their bones with your never-ending crimes and arrogance
Sooner or later you are going to find yourself in a position of vulnerability
Sooner or later the scale of power will shift
This is only natural
Think…................
...........................
Think of what would you like to happen to you in this imminent future?
Would you rather carry on with your crimes against Muslims in Palestine, Lebanon, Syria, Iraq, Iran, and Pakistan…etc?
Would you rather carry on with your hateful lies and fabrication against Islam?
Would you rather create more and more enraged and infuriated enemies?
Or would you rather STOP your crimes, EMBRACE the TRUE owners of the land and WELCOME them back home, SEEK PEACE SINCERELY and bleed for FORGIVENESS before it’s too late?
I am speaking with the same words that many before me had spoken to you with
I am giving you a warning
(But don’t be so pathetic as to think that this warning is from a little exiled Palestinian woman)
Ignore it if you wish
Or be wise and heed
The choice is yours
Report this.
By nahida, December 26, 2008 at 1:28 pm #
A call for those zionists who wish to save their souls
You have come from far away countries, occupied our land by force and terror, oppressed our people with your might and power, furthermore, instead of showing good will or remorse and a sincere desire to befriend and live in peace with your neighbours; you still go beside yourselves to prove to us and to the world how reprehensible you have become, as you sink deeper and deeper into corruption, fabrication and violence
What you fail to understand is that every thing in the world is a flux
The situation in the Middle East will not stay the same for ever
The balance of power will undoubtedly change
Sooner or later it will shift, and it won’t be a shift in your favour
And before you know it, you will suddenly find yourselves surrounded by billions of outraged Muslims and angry people from all over the world
Instead of preparing for a good future with the people who surround you, who are mostly Muslims; what do you do? You go berserk with your lies and aggression; and like a mad dog, you wage a wild decadent war against Islam as a religion and against Muslims as followers
What a pathetic vision of a pathetic tribe, who chose to implant itself in the heart of two billion Muslims!
Can’t you see the pitiable sad future you are creating for yourselves, generating only anger by your arrogance and uninvited aggression?
Instead of attempting to understand the culture and the faith of those around you, you go spewing lies and propaganda in an attempt to disfigure the Islamic resistance that refuses to bow down to your arrogance and greed
Instead of embracing the humane and civilized culture that is still willing to forgive you despite the horrors you have shown, by being nothing but a revolting boil in its midst; you go attacking the very religion that teaches its followers that forgiveness is better that revenge
Instead of trying to understand those humans whom you’ve dehumanized; you still feel smug and self-satisfied, drunken by your temporary superficial might, and you keep deluding yourselves by perceiving those you’ve oppressed as monsters and terrorist
Instead of opening your hearts to learning some aspects of civilization (such as compassion, honesty, generosity, and tolerance) from your culturally refined neighbours, you deceive yourselves by the delusion of your chosen-ness and you fantasise that your barbarity is a “light unto the nations”!
Be ware poor souls of zion; this wretched attack against Islam could be the final straw that will shatter your might once and for all
You still smother yourselves with conceit and self-importance as you shrivel into your tribal mentality, obscuring every opportunity of understanding, destroying bridges and building walls around your clan, isolating yourselves further and further away from the human family
The superiority features and nauseating arrogance that you display reflects only an inferior mentality if only you could grasp
You have disfigured and blemished your own faith, if only you could comprehend!
The same religion that was once inclusive you’ve managed to reduce into the most tribalistic and exclusive ideology man had ever known!
You are very short-sighted in that sense, as you fail to look even a few years ahead!
Report this.
By jackpine savage, December 26, 2008 at 1:26 pm #
Yeah! The good Jew/bad Jew routine returns to Truthdig.
The evil thought leveled at the Jews can be pointed at either of its two little brothers just as easily…they’re all cut from the same cloth. And all three behave in the same ways.
All peoples consider themselves the first/best people, but the three monotheistic faiths take it to a new level. They can prove that they’re the best love by calling on God (which all three of them share), though they cannot prove the existence of the God who bestows their specialness.
All three believe that they can do whatever they will because their behavior must be sanctioned by God. It is sanctioned by God because it is men who decide God’s word, and other men look not to God (which would be an internal, personal quest) but to other men to find God.
All three books hold the Truth, but the Truth cannot be told in words…it is far to big and deep for words. The books hold metaphors that point to the Truth that resides within men.
Unfortunately, all three Semitic faiths have lost touch with the Truth. They cling to their metaphors and call these Truth. Because of this, they cannot allow any questioning of the metaphors. They fight, kill, and die over their metaphors.
And the Truth languishes in the spilled blood.
Report thisBy Kellina, December 26, 2008 at 12:38 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
* Who has been ethnically cleansing some of their own people for decades?
* Who continues to occupy, rob, humiliate and murder its neighbors?
* Who claims to be a Western-style democracy but is in reality an apartheid-loving ethnocracy?
* Who has ignored nearly over one hundred UN resolutions, flouts international law and is oblivious to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights?
* Who has been caught spying in the US, stealing state secrets, including nuclear technology?
* Who attacked the US in 1967 and tried to blame it on another country?
* Who by all intelligent accounts was one of the forces behind the 9/11 attacks?
* Who, along with their US sympathizers, has majority control of the US media?
* Who, along with their US sympathizers, control the political and defense structures in the US (state dept, CIA, congress, president, judiciary)?
* Who has a policy of carrying out domestic and international assassinations in lieu of trials?
* Who are the real terrorists—killing civilians?
* Who use deceit and manipulation to extract funds from the US to the tune of billions per year?
* Who has anywhere from 200-400 nuclear weapons (but claims to be in peril from the nuclear ambitions of neighboring countries)?
Yes, sadly, it’s our “friend and ally,” Israel. The above list was off the top of my head except for the first few items, which came from this article:
http://desertpeace.wordpress.com/2008/07/19/occupation -reality-check-friends-of-israel-are-blind-to-the-truth/
Report thisBy namer, December 26, 2008 at 11:55 am #
CONTINUED FROM PREVIOUS POST
azythos, December 26 at 3:27 am wrote:
“But why the childish “so-called” weasel-words?”
Because invented by colonialists around 1890, by deviating old spiritual symbolism.
That is such a lame argument. Look up self-determination, and then ask yourself why a free people in their own land shouldn’t have the right to call their state by any name of their choosing.
=============================
“Every word you write is intended to de-legitimize the State of Israel (you cannot do that; it is a sovereign nation, after all)”
Illegally formed by colonial violence.
Wrong. Legally established by any measure, and codified by the United Nations, no less. What WAS demonstrably illegal was the immediate war of annihilation launched against the nascent State of Israel by Egypt, Lebanon, Syria, Transjordan, Iraq, and Saudi Arabia. One more thing - you need to get over this ‘colonial’ fixation. By definition one cannot be colonialist if the land resides in is one’s own homeland. You could, however, say that the Gazan Arabs (Egyptian, really) are the colonialists, trying as they do to remove Israel. Same for the Jordanian Arabs of Judea and Samaria.
Report thisBy namer, December 26, 2008 at 11:53 am #
azythos, December 26 at 3:27 am wrote:
“Israel is only the Jewish national homeland”
Certainly not. How has a religion become a “nation” anyway, and how is a “homeland” on other people’s land, colonially occupied by people selected on a strictly racial basis?
Wow - I can’t decide if your responses indicate cognitive difficulties o just sloppy reasoning. The Jewish people constitute a nation for many reasons, not least among them because they identify themselves as such, and have exercised the right of any nation to self-determination. It’s axiomatic. The fact that the oldest monotheistic religion is one of the cultural condensers of that nation is actually value-added. Your mantra of “other people’s land” is smoke and mirrors. The land of Israel (aka Palestine by the Romans in a failed attempt to remove the Jewish identity of its rightful owners) has only ever been sovereign territory of the Jews, and no one else - not any Arabs nor the Ottomans. Need I point out that your use of the word ‘racial’ as a smear against Israel is bogus? The Jews of Israel are actually the most diverse racial population of any nation in the Middle East - white, Asian, Indian, African, and Middle eastern Jews of all colors live in Israel. Jewish identity is not a racial issue for those who know anything about it. Apparently you do not.
==============================
“Wanting Israel to disappear has nothing to do with Jews, right?”
Of course not.
LOL!!! You would lose THAT argument to a neo-natal infant.
============================
“After all, there are many other Jewish nations, just like all those 22 Arab nations…”
“Jewish nations” like “Presbyterian nations”.... Some logic.
You seem incapable of reading even the most obvious irony. Israel IS a Jewish nation for reasons explained above (historic homeland, unique language, cohesive common cultural and social constructs and institutions, a capital city, millions of native and indigenous people, an economy, a citizens’ army, representative government - all the good stuff (yes, even an Olympic team) universally recognized - except by Jew-haters like you), and I’ll repeat here that your refusal or inability to recognize the reality says much about your agenda, or your lack of awareness, or both.
==================================
“Yes, it IS a state, with millions of people who live there”
without a right to be on other people’s land
Asked and answered. The Jews’ claim to the land was second to none at the time of the renewal of Jewish sovereignty, and now, the modern state, as an established fact, cannot be undone except by violence of the most genocidal sort. The citizens of Israel put their lives on the line to defend their home. For you to advocate their country’s disappearance is tantamount to genocide. If only you had the balls to say it like a man.
===================================
“and a unique language”
Russian?
Guess again, Einstein. It’s called Hebrew (the unique language of the Jews, haven’t you heard?), and all new immigrants learn it regardless of any other language they may speak. The Jews who emigrated from India spoke Hindi (and other dialects) but now speak Hebrew. The Jews kicked out of Iraq, Syria, Egypt, and many other Arabic-speaking lands speak Arabic in addition to Hebrew. There are many others. It makes for diversity and richness of culture unique to the Middle East.
Report this=============================
CONTINUED IN NEXT POST
By hippy pam, December 26, 2008 at 11:05 am #
Nah…...It will be “emperor bullshit” from his multi million dollar home that is being patrolled/protected by his mercenaries[blackwater]...
Report thisBy Ivan Pomidoroff, December 26, 2008 at 11:00 am #
(Unregistered commenter)
I know Jesus hates fags, so he wouldn’t stand for them. Let fags be hanged in public? How about religious minorities? Ethnic? Women? All those who oppressed in Iran under crazy mullahs..
Report thisBy Kellina, December 26, 2008 at 10:39 am #
(Unregistered commenter)
United Nations Security Council resolutions regarding Israel (the vast majority of which have been ignored by Israel):
1. Resolution 42: The Palestine Question (5 March 1948) Requests recommendations for the Palestine Commission
2. Resolution 43: The Palestine Question (1 Apr 1948) Recognizes “increasing violence and disorder in Palestine” and requests that representatives of “the Jewish Agency for Palestine and the Arab Higher Committee” arrange, with the Security Council, “a truce between the Arab and Jewish Communities of Palestine…Calls upon Arab and Jewish armed groups in Palestine to cease acts of violence immediately.”
3. Resolution 44: The Palestine Question (1 Apr 1948) Requests convocation of special session of the General Assembly
4. Resolution 46: The Palestine Question (17 Apr 1948) As the United Kingdom is the Mandatory Power, “it is responsible for the maintenance of peace and order in Palestine.” The Resolutions also “Calls upon all persons and organizations in Palestine” to stop importing “armed bands and fighting personnel…whatever their origin;...weapons and war materials;...Refrain, pending the future government of Palestine…from any political activity which might prejudice the rights, claims, or position of either community;...refrain from any action which will endanger the safety of the Holy Places in Palestine.”
5. Resolution 48: The Palestine Question (23 Apr 1948)
6. Resolution 49: The Palestine Question (22 May 1948)
7. Resolution 50: The Palestine Question (29 May 1948)
8. Resolution 53: The Palestine Question (7 Jul 1948)
9. Resolution 54: The Palestine Question (15 Jul 1948)
10. Resolution 56: The Palestine Question (19 Aug 1948)
11. Resolution 57: The Palestine Question (18 Sep 1948)
12. Resolution 59: The Palestine Question (19 Oct 1948)
13. Resolution 60: The Palestine Question (29 Oct 1948)
14. Resolution 61: The Palestine Question (4 Nov 1948)
15. Resolution 62: The Palestine Question (16 Nov 1948)
16. Resolution 66: The Palestine Question (29 Dec 1948)
17. Resolution 72: The Palestine Question (11 Aug 1949)
18. Resolution 73: The Palestine Question (11 Aug 1949)
19. Resolution 89 (17 November 1950): regarding Armistice in 1948 Arab-Israeli War and “transfer of persons”.
20. Resolution 92: The Palestine Question (8 May 1951)
21. Resolution 93: The Palestine Question (18 May 1951)
22. Resolution 95: The Palestine Question (1 Sep 1951)
23. Resolution 100: The Palestine Question (27 Oct 1953)
24. Resolution 101: The Palestine Question (24 Nov 1953)
25. Resolution 106: The Palestine Question (29 Mar 1955) ‘condemns’ Israel for Gaza raid.
26. Resolution 107: The Palestine Question (30 Mar)
27. Resolution 108: The Palestine Question (8 Sep)
28. Resolution 111: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israel for raid on Syria that killed fifty-six people”.
Report thisBy Kellina, December 26, 2008 at 10:38 am #
(Unregistered commenter)
29. Resolution 127: ” ... ‘recommends’ Israel suspends its ‘no-man’s zone’ in Jerusalem”.
30. Resolution 162: ” ... ‘urges’ Israel to comply with UN decisions”.
31. Resolution 171: ” ... determines flagrant violations’ by Israel in its attack on Syria”.
32. Resolution 228: ” ... ‘censures’ Israel for its attack on Samu in the West Bank, then under Jordanian control”.
33. Resolution 237: ” ... ‘urges’ Israel to allow return of new 1967 Palestinian refugees”.
34. Resolution 242 (November 22, 1967): Termination of all claims or states of belligerency and respect for and acknowledgement of the sovereignty, territorial integrity and political independence of every State in the area. Calls on Israel’s neighbors to end the state of belligerency and calls upon Israel to reciprocate by withdraw its forces from land claimed by other parties in 1967 war. Interpreted commonly today as calling for the Land for peace principle as a way to resolve Arab-Israeli conflict
35. Resolution 248: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israel for its massive attack on Karameh in Jordan”.
36. Resolution 250: ” ... ‘calls’ on Israel to refrain from holding military parade in Jerusalem”.
37. Resolution 251: ” ... ‘deeply deplores’ Israeli military parade in Jerusalem in defiance of Resolution 250”.
38. Resolution 252: ” ... ‘declares invalid’ Israel’s acts to unify Jerusalem as Jewish capital”.
39. Resolution 256: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israeli raids on Jordan as ‘flagrant violation”.
40. Resolution 259: ” ... ‘deplores’ Israel’s refusal to accept UN mission to probe occupation”.
41. Resolution 262: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israel for attack on Beirut airport”.
42. Resolution 265: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israel for air attacks for Salt in Jordan”.
43. Resolution 267: ” ... ‘censures’ Israel for administrative acts to change the status of Jerusalem”.
44. Resolution 270: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israel for air attacks on villages in southern Lebanon”.
45. Resolution 271: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israel’s failure to obey UN resolutions on Jerusalem”.
46. Resolution 279: ” ... ‘demands’ withdrawal of Israeli forces from Lebanon”.
47. Resolution 280: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israeli’s attacks against Lebanon”.
48. Resolution 285: ” ... ‘demands’ immediate Israeli withdrawal form Lebanon”.
49. Resolution 298: ” ... ‘deplores’ Israel’s changing of the status of Jerusalem”.
50. Resolution 313: ” ... ‘demands’ that Israel stop attacks against Lebanon”.
51. Resolution 316: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israel for repeated attacks on Lebanon”.
52. Resolution 317: ” ... ‘deplores’ Israel’s refusal to release Arabs abducted in Lebanon”.
53. Resolution 332: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israel’s repeated attacks against Lebanon”.
54. Resolution 337: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israel for violating Lebanon’s sovereignty”.
Report thisBy Kellina, December 26, 2008 at 10:37 am #
(Unregistered commenter)
55. Resolution 338 (22 October 1973): cease fire in Yom Kippur War
56. Resolution 339 (23 October 1973): Confirms Res. 338, dispatch UN observers.
57. Resolution 347: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israeli attacks on Lebanon”.
58. Resolution 3379: “...‘establishes’ Zionism as a form of racism and racial discrimination”. Repealed by Resolution 46|86.
59. Resolution 425 (1978): ” ... ‘calls’ on Israel to withdraw its forces from Lebanon”. Israel’s withdrawal from Lebanon was completed as of 16 June 2000.
60. Resolution 350 (31 May 1974) established the United Nations Disengagement Observer Force, to monitor the ceasefire
between Israel and Syria in the wake of the Yom Kippur War.
61. Resolution 427: ” ... ‘calls’ on Israel to complete its withdrawal from Lebanon”.
62. Resolution 444: ” ... ‘deplores’ Israel’s lack of cooperation with UN peacekeeping forces”.
63. Resolution 446 (1979): ‘determines’ that Israeli settlements are a ‘serious obstruction’ to peace and calls on Israel to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention”.
64. Resolution 450: ” ... ‘calls’ on Israel to stop attacking Lebanon”.
65. Resolution 452: ” ... ‘calls’ on Israel to cease building settlements in occupied territories”.
66. Resolution 465: ” ... ‘deplores’ Israel’s settlements and asks all member states not to assist Israel’s settlements program”.
67. Resolution 467: ” ... ‘strongly deplores’ Israel’s military intervention in Lebanon”.
68. Resolution 468: ” ... ‘calls’ on Israel to rescind illegal expulsions of two Palestinian mayors and a judge and to facilitate their return”.
69. Resolution 469: ” ... ‘strongly deplores’ Israel’s failure to observe the council’s order not to deport Palestinians”.
70. Resolution 471: ” ... ‘expresses deep concern’ at Israel’s failure to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention”.
71. Resolution 476: ” ... ‘reiterates’ that Israel’s claim to Jerusalem are ‘null and void’”.
72. Resolution 478 (20 August 1980): ‘censures (Israel) in the strongest terms’ for its claim to Jerusalem in its ‘Basic Law’.
73. Resolution 484: ” ... ‘declares it imperative’ that Israel re-admit two deported Palestinian mayors”.
74. Resolution 487: ” ... ‘strongly condemns’ Israel for its attack on Iraq’s nuclear facility”.
75. Resolution 497 (17 December 1981) decides that Israel’s annexation of Syria’s Golan Heights is ‘null and void’ and demands that Israel rescinds its decision forthwith.
76. Resolution 498: ” ... ‘calls’ on Israel to withdraw from Lebanon”.
77. Resolution 501: ” ... ‘calls’ on Israel to stop attacks against Lebanon and withdraw its troops”.
78. Resolution 508:
79. Resolution 509: ” ... ‘demands’ that Israel withdraw its forces forthwith and unconditionally from Lebanon”.
80. Resolution 515: ” ... ‘demands’ that Israel lift its siege of Beirut and allow food supplies to be brought in”.
81. Resolution 517: ” ... ‘censures’ Israel for failing to obey UN resolutions and demands that Israel withdraw its forces from Lebanon”.
82. Resolution 518: ” ... ‘demands’ that Israel cooperate fully with UN forces in Lebanon”.
Report thisBy Kellina, December 26, 2008 at 10:35 am #
(Unregistered commenter)
83. Resolution 520: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israel’s attack into West Beirut”.
84. Resolution 573: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israel ‘vigorously’ for bombing Tunisia in attack on PLO headquarters.
85. Resolution 587 ” ... ‘takes note’ of previous calls on Israel to withdraw its forces from Lebanon and urges all parties to withdraw”.
86. Resolution 592: ” ... ‘strongly deplores’ the killing of Palestinian students at Bir Zeit University by Israeli troops”.
87. Resolution 605: ” ... ‘strongly deplores’ Israel’s policies and practices denying the human rights of Palestinians.
88. Resolution 607: ” ... ‘calls’ on Israel not to deport Palestinians and strongly requests it to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention.
89. Resolution 608: ” ... ‘deeply regrets’ that Israel has defied the United Nations and deported Palestinian civilians”.
90. Resolution 636: ” ... ‘deeply regrets’ Israeli deportation of Palestinian civilians.
91. Resolution 641: ” ... ‘deplores’ Israel’s continuing deportation of Palestinians.
92. Resolution 672: ” ... ‘condemns’ Israel for “violence against Palestinians” at the Haram al-Sharif/Temple Mount.
93. Resolution 673: ” ... ‘deplores’ Israel’s refusal to cooperate with the United Nations.
94. Resolution 681: ” ... ‘deplores’ Israel’s resumption of the deportation of Palestinians.
95. Resolution 694: ” ... ‘deplores’ Israel’s deportation of Palestinians and calls on it to ensure their safe and immediate return.
96. Resolution 726: ” ... ‘strongly condemns’ Israel’s deportation of Palestinians.
97. Resolution 799: “. . . ‘strongly condemns’ Israel’s deportation of 413 Palestinians and calls for their immediate return.
98. Resolution 1559 (2 September 2004) called upon Lebanon to establish its sovereignty over all of its land and called upon Syria to end their military presence in Lebanon by withdrawing its forces and to cease intervening in internal Lebanese politics. The resolution also called on all Lebanese militias to disband.
99. Resolution 1583 (28 January 2005) calls on Lebanon to assert full control over its border with Israel. It also states that “the Council has recognized the Blue Line as valid for the purpose of confirming Israel’s withdrawal pursuant to resolution 425.
100. Resolution 1648 (21 December 2005) renewed the mandate of United Nations Disengagement Observer Force until 30 June 2006.
101. Resolution 1701 (11 August 2006) called for the full cessation of hostilities between Israel and Hezbollah.
Report thisBy azythos, December 26, 2008 at 8:27 am #
namer:
“Israel is only the Jewish national homeland”
Certainly not. How has a religion become a “nation” anyway, and how is a “homeland” on other people’s land, colonially occupied by people selected on a strictly racial basis?
“Wanting Israel to disappear has nothing to do with Jews, right?”
Of course not.
“After all, there are many other Jewish nations, just like all those 22 Arab nations…”
“Jewish nations” like “Presbyterian nations”.... Some logic.
“Yes, it IS a state, with millions of people who live there”
without a right to be on other people’s land
“and a unique language”
Russian?
“But why the childish “so-called” weasel-words?”
Because invented by colonialists around 1890, by deviating old spiritual symbolism.
“Every word you write is intended to de-legitimize the State of Israel (you cannot do that; it is a sovereign nation, after all)”
Illegally formed by colonial violence.
Report thisBy MzScarlett, December 26, 2008 at 5:13 am #
Alas & alack: free press is always altered & nothing is what it seems to be. USA Gov deliberately tortures with the uttermost depravity & sadism ever known on the Earth & they are behind portraying what they want in the press, deliberately manipulating for “people perception” to make it appear that they are a “force for good” which was deliberate fabrication based on lies & falsehoods as shown in the power of nightmares on youtube. Don Rumsfeld was one of the ones behind it & has to be worse that Marquis de Sade & the top democrats went right along with it including Peloshi as seen on http://www.torturingdemocracy.com; by their ACTS you shall know them; any person with a shred of decency inside of them should rise up & condemn their atrocities.
Report thisBy namer, December 26, 2008 at 2:34 am #
azythos, December 25 at 8:54 pm wrote:
“Death to Israel” has nothing “anti-Semitic”.
Now why would it? Israel is only the Jewish national homeland. Wanting Israel to disappear has nothing to do with Jews, right? After all, there are many other Jewish nations, just like all those 22 Arab nations…..
=========================
“The so-called “Israel” is a state.”
Yes, it IS a state, with millions of people who live there, and a unique language, and all the attributes (and more, actually) than any other nation-state on the planet. At least you got THAT right. But why the childish “so-called” weasel-words? You are azythos. Are you “so-called”? Every word you write is intended to de-legitimize the State of Israel (you cannot do that; it is a sovereign nation, after all). I kinda like that the realization of the Jewish people’s self-determination as embodied in the renewal of Jewish sovereignty in their homeland just sticks in your craw. I do like the Israeli people, I admit it. There is much to admire about them and the nation they have built and defended.
============================
“Millions of people, including very many people of Jewish religion or nominal origin, legitimately consider that it should disappear.”
Let them consider whatever they want. That doesn’t make them right, moral, or very reasoned, either. Maybe I think YOU should disappear because, well, I just don’t like you. That’s too frickin’ bad for me, isn’t it? You also need to do a better job of trying to divorce Israel from the hearts and minds of the vast majority of Jews all over the world. Not buying that line.
============================
“This has nothing genocidal, as the disappearance of a racist, agressive and atomic-armed state only diminishes violence.”
And this “disappearance” you speak of will diminish violence? Have you not noticed that the citizens of Israel wish very much to remain free and independent in their own country, and have been willing to put their lives on the line for more than 60 years defending it against openly genocidal Arab regimes? Do some minimal research see how many thousands of times the rallying cry when making war against Israel was to push the Jews into the sea. Oh, right, flowery Middle Eastern vernacular.
In any case, your premise that Israel is the cause of wars and instability is specious. Standard anti-Israel talking points. Cooler, calmer, reasoned heads know better.
==========================
“You are not gifted enough to play the Israeli shill.”
That much is true - I am not an Israeli shill; just an American citizen who knows bullying, bigotry, and demonization when he sees it, and really doesn’t like it.
Report thisBy namer, December 26, 2008 at 2:06 am #
Crimes of the State Blog, December 25 at 7:56 pm wrote:
“The only alleged “anti-Semitic” quote I ever hear is a false quote. He was quoting Khomeini saying that the Israeli REGIME (GOVERNMENT) must “vanish from the pages of time…” which was repeatedly and deliberately mistranslated to say “wipe Israel off the map.” That’s a lie.”
So you say. But then, you are rather paranoid about Zionists (read: Jews) pulling the secret levers of power in the USA and around the world, aren’t you? That’s a classic Jew-hating canard, perfected by Hitler and now effectively emulated by the likes of Muslim fanatics, Ahmadinejad’s regime included, and you, given your post here. What do you think the Iranian Islamist regime actually means when they have Ahadinejad make a major speech at a lectern with a glossy poster emblazoned with the words “A World Without Zionism” atop a graphic of a Star of Dvid falling down and cracking into pieces? Since the State of Israel IS the sovereign homeland of the Jewish nation, and Zionism is, by definition, the idea of and belief in the right of Jews to self-determination in their own homeland, can you not connect the frickin’ dots? Most people who are not fixated by the Zio-Boogeyman are perfectly capable of understanding what the meaning of the poster and Ahmadinejad’s words are. And I believe you are, too, whoever you are. I believe your hatred of Israel is such that you are either willfully ignorant or just flat-out lying. No matter; Israelis and Jews and friends around the world know bald code when they see it.
==============================
“That’s numerous lies by repeating a lie in an endless echo chamber. Iran is not “preparing” to do such a thing either. That’s another lie.”
And you know this because…....???
Report thisWhat expertise do you have to make such an assertion? Are you privy to the hearts and minds of the Islamist regime’s leaders? Are you in on the strategic policy planning meetings of the Islamist regime in Tehran?
By azythos, December 26, 2008 at 1:54 am #
namer:
“You haven’t finished your genocidal apologetics. You’ve left out the ubiquitous Iranian Islamist regime’s mantra of “Death To Israel” and “Death To America””
So what? “Death to Israel” has nothing “anti-Semitic”. The so-called “Israel” is a state. Millions of people, including very many people of Jewish religion or nominal origin, legitimately consider that it should disappear. This has nothing genocidal, as the disappearance of a racist, agressive and atomic-armed state only diminishes violence. You are not gifted enough to play the Israeli shill.
Report thisBy namer, December 26, 2008 at 1:36 am #
Crimes of the State Blog, December 25 at 7:56 pm wrote:
“Is that why he is never accurately quoted in these hit pieces?”
You haven’t finished your genocidal apologetics. You’ve left out the ubiquitous Iranian Islamist regime’s mantra of “Death To Israel” and “Death To America”, best served up when painted on the Shihab-3 IRBM’s that are routinely paraded through the streets of Tehran.
Go ahead - tell us it doesn’t really mean death - it’s just a flowery Middle Eastern metaphor. It’s just a cultural misunderstanding, right?
Report thisBy Crimes of the State Blog, December 26, 2008 at 12:56 am #
“Ahmadinejad’s words and actions speak for themselves;”
Is that why he is never accurately quoted in these hit pieces?
The only alleged “anti-Semitic” quote I ever hear is a false quote. He was quoting Khomeini saying that the Israeli REGIME (GOVERNMENT) must “vanish from the pages of time…” which was repeatedly and deliberately mistranslated to say “wipe Israel off the map.” That’s a lie. That’s numerous lies by repeating a lie in an endless echo chamber. Iran is not “preparing” to do such a thing either. That’s another lie. That’s a lie about a non-existent cassus belli (like Saddam’s WMD’s, arguably another Zionist lie), so as to allow Israel and the US to bomb Iran with impunity.
These are monstrous lies, and are blatant and easily seen through.
Iran’s big offensive move has been to buy some defensive anti-aircraft missiles from Russia, so as not to be bombed without inflicting a cost on aggressor nations who commit Crimes Against Peace.
Quite sick of the endless Zionist lies. You stole the country. You demonized the natives and pretended they had no claim to their own land, despite UN resolutions to the contrary. You commit egregious acts of war against Palestinian civilians, daily, in the hopes of driving them away and stealing more of their land.
Quite despicable in any rational analysis of the “facts on the ground.”
http://crimesofthestate.blogspot.com/
Report thisBy sophrosyne, December 26, 2008 at 12:35 am #
(Unregistered commenter)
Iran has never attackied anyone and has not called for another holocaust, the end of israel, or anything else. If you read what the clown-prince and powerless figure head president says it is conflicted, confused but threatens nobody. Israel is the real threat to peace in the mid east and their so-called “alliance” with America has cost us hugely.
Report thisBy namer, December 26, 2008 at 12:25 am #
By Folktruther, December 25 at 7:14 pm wrote:
“It is strong enough in the US so that Zionist drivel and repression is repeated in pseudo-Progressive newsletters like TD.”
Zionist repression? LOL
Why, then, can it not keep you from yapping all day, every day? If only “Zionism” gave a rat’s ass. LOL!!!
========================
“So they naturally oppose any effort to subvert their demonizing of Iran’s leaders and their distortions of his comments repeated endlessly in the Zionist media.”
Huh???? WTF are you trying to say?
Report thisThe only thing more twisted than your tortured prose is your chronic panic attack caused by Zionist Boogey-Jews. And by the way, Ahmadinejad’s words and actions speak for themselves; no Zionist intervention necessary. Even a non-Zionist non-Jew can see that.
By Folktruther, December 26, 2008 at 12:14 am #
It’s good to see that Zionism is not strong enough in Britain to stop the airing of the views of opposing heads of states. It is strong enough in the US so that Zionist drivel and repression is repeated in pseudo-Progressive newsletters like TD.
Zionism is the chief force that wants war with Iran and they may get it under Obiden. So they naturally oppose any effort to subvert their demonizing of Iran’s leaders and their distortions of his comments repeated endlessly in the Zionist media.
Report thisBy Little Brother, December 25, 2008 at 11:20 pm #
To transpose someone’s comment on Obama in another thread, Queen Elizabeth is teaching us tolerance.
Whoda thunk it?
Of course, the contretemps could have been avoided entirely if Her Majesty had thought to instead extend the courtesy to Reverend Rick Warren.
Report thisBy namer, December 25, 2008 at 11:14 pm #
One more thing, Fadel -
The majority of your posts (the ones with your proclamations of Jewish conspiracies and general ugliness of Jewish culture and tradition) come straight off those neo-nazi and white supremacist websites. If you are not a contributor to those sites yourself, or an avid reader, I would be shocked, because you have their hate-speech crap down cold.
Anyone who has been to one of those sites will know exactly what I mean.
OK, I’ve said my piece, carry on Fadel, carry on…...
Report thisBy namer, December 25, 2008 at 10:49 pm #
Fadel Abdallah, December 25 at 3:24 pm wrote:
“Another example how the Zionists want to control and dominate the airwaves, even when the news is related to one universal personality who made his revolution by opposing their old erring ways!”
So now the Jews control the UK government? Where does your Jew-phobic paranoia end?
================================
“Just examine their Talmud and see the horrible language they used to describe Jesus Christ and his mother, two personalities highly revered in both Christianity and Islam. “
But why stop at the “Jews Seeking Control Of The World” nonsense? Why not just go for the jugular and regurgitate the oldest Jew-hating cnard of all-time?
You have a Jew-problem. Why not go out and do something about it instead of making lame posts on an obscure website?
Report thisBy annunaki, December 25, 2008 at 10:04 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
When one looks at history, religions, bloodlines, prophets and leaders one finds that all come from and originate in same place. This place encompasses present day Tigris and Euphrates rivers and delta, originally called Summer or Sumeria.
Present day monarchy and leaders [all of them] have direct relations and bloodlines to those times and areas. They practice a form of sun worship. What many today call Satanism or Lucifer worship [Bal or Baal].
Prophets are not part of their cast and are considered anarchists. True Christians, Buddhists, Islamic, Hindus, and other tribes who follow prophets that preach peace and harmony are not, let me repeat, ARE NOT part of the Sun cult or monarchy.
For over 6,000 years the monarchy has been systematically killing off anyone who’s for peace and harmony. Monarchy is responsible for all wars to date, all tyranny, slavery, lies, manipulation, distribution of drugs, power through money and anything else to complete their New World Order. They are the true nature of evil while subjugating the true nature of human beings.
Please read the original records of all tribes worldwide to piece the facts together, all predating the bible yet, and where bible got it’s watered down information. Some of these are said to predate humans.
You can even google:
Enki Sumerian Tablet translation
Dogon code
Maya translations
Ancient Indus valley
Hopi
Sacred knowledge
and anything related.
The further back you go the more you will find it to be the truth. Keep in mind in ancient times for a scribe to make a mistake meant to loose a finger or as far as a limb, to scribe a lie meant a quick death. The hardest part of these records is translating them to present terminology.
It is only in the last 3,500 or so years that lies have been prominent and perpetrated by the sun cult. This sun cult has also been systematically destroying ancient records, hiding them in museums, private collections, secret societies and military installations. It is one of the main reasons why US military went to Iraq and didn’t protect main national museum as asked.
US military and contractors reaped thousands of tablets and other ancient pieces and scuttled them away while walking right past gold and precious stone artifacts worth millions and leaving them for looters. US industrial military complex is controlled by the monarchy out of three places, London Britain [that little city within London England], Vatican city and Washington DC.
This should give you a basis to finding out the real truth.
Report thisHappy studying.
By espaz, December 25, 2008 at 9:38 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
that goddamn free speach thing is a real pain in the ass !
Report thisBy P. T., December 25, 2008 at 9:35 pm #
“Who will deliver next year’s alternative Christmas message?”
Ehud Olmert? Ariel Sharon? Tzipi Livni?
Report thisBy bogglesthemind, December 25, 2008 at 8:32 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)
“Who will deliver next year’s alternative Christmas message?”
Dick Cheney?
Report thisBy Fadel Abdallah, December 25, 2008 at 8:24 pm #
Another example how the Zionists want to control and dominate the airwaves, even when the news is related to one universal personality who made his revolution by opposing their old erring ways!
Just examine their Talmud and see the horrible language they used to describe Jesus Christ and his mother, two personalities highly revered in both Christianity and Islam.
If you believe in Jesus Christ and have the stomach to hear what his enemies said about him may I suggest that you read “Jesus in the Talmud” by Peter Schafer.
Report thisBy azythos, December 25, 2008 at 7:40 pm #
So, the “Foreign and Commonwealth Office”, a branch of a government that is documented as an unrepentant high criminal against peace and criminal of war, a murderer and a willing accessory in the ongoing intentional murder of certainly more than half a million of people, has the immortal crust to point the finger for “statements” (more “appalling” than their own murderous actions?) that, by the way, still have to be clearly documented.
Report this