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Ear to the Ground

Wake-Up Call for Team Obama

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Posted on Aug 21, 2008
Obama in Texas
AP photo / Rick Bowmer

If Barack Obama thought he had a battle on his hands when he was vying for the Democratic presidential nomination, he’s in for an even bigger struggle now, if the latest Zogby poll represents an accurate read on American voters’ inclinations at this stage in the game.


SF Gate:

A national poll released Wednesday by Reuters/Zogby showed McCain beating Obama 46 to 41 percent, an advantage that also shows that voters now see McCain as stronger on economic issues. The latest poll erased the strong seven-point advantage held by the Democrat just last month. Other polls had the race statistically tied.

Moreover, some recent polls indicate that some red states that Democrats had hoped they could flip to blue—like Indiana and Virginia—are tacking back slightly to McCain.

The latest polls show that even with gas prices rising precipitously under a Republican administration, the candidates are unusually close on whom Americans trust to deal with the issue.

Some Democrats ... say it’s clear Obama needs to sharpen his message and get tougher on beating back attacks from McCain’s campaign, which has suggested that Obama is elitist and even unpatriotic.

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thebeerdoctor's avatar

By thebeerdoctor, August 22, 2008 at 12:44 pm Link to this comment

re: outraged

Thank you for the link. I sometimes think that organized religion is the greatest hindrance to actual spirituality. Thank you again.

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By Outraged, August 22, 2008 at 12:38 pm Link to this comment

Re: voice of truth

As I said, “...my point earlier was to highlight your perspective, which would give a “consider the source” clarity to your comments.”

To answer your question: “how does the fact that my wife knows I am a good father somehow translate to you that I am a misogynist wife beater or some other crazy thing that passes for brain function in your head?”

> I did not claim you were a “misogynist wife beater”.  But it does say something about a person who speaks for HIS WIFE on issues in which she can speak for herself.  In addition, as I’ve stated before, all to often that’s NOT the comments I’ve heard over in the “mother’s room”.  But I have heard them boastfully proclaimed by the subsequent “good fathers”.

Now I don’t know you “voice of truth” and I sincerely hope that you are a good father.  But if your responses to commenter’s here is any indication of your perspective in dealing with others, I for one, seriously have my doubts.

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By Dave in Big Pine, August 22, 2008 at 12:26 pm Link to this comment

voice of truth

just as I thought….

no wit, no ideas, no thought, no nothing, equals no repsonse.

it is bombastic cretins like you that can offer nothing but name calling and taunts.

if you can’t keep up, don’t play.

now, go away.

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By Outraged, August 22, 2008 at 12:21 pm Link to this comment

Re: Jeff29

Originally, I had questioned that you had made a comment to that effect….but I see that you only implied it.  However, to disregard the fact that you specifically choose this PARTICULAR comment of Mother Theresa’s would lead one to believe that you endorse it.  Right…?

There are issues with which Mother Theresa was not reasonable.  When you quoted this particular point it seemed you were trying to validate your premise by saying “even Mother Theresa says so”.

I believe Mother Theresa was sincere in her beliefs, but her sincereity proved to be unsustainable since it wasn’t tempered with reason.  As you know she herself basically admitted as much in her letters.  There are others who noted this also.

“Three of Mother Teresa’s teachings that are fundamental to her religious congregation are all the more dangerous because they are believed so sincerely by her sisters. Most basic is the belief that as long as a sister obeys she is doing God’s will. Another is the belief that the sisters have leverage over God by choosing to suffer. Their suffering makes God very happy. He then dispenses more graces to humanity. The third is the belief that any attachment to human beings, even the poor being served, supposedly interferes with love of God and must be vigilantly avoided or immediately uprooted. The efforts to prevent any attachments cause continual chaos and confusion, movement and change in the congregation. Mother Teresa did not invent these beliefs - they were prevalent in religious congregations before Vatican II - but she did everything in her power (which was great) to enforce them.

Once a sister has accepted these fallacies she will do almost anything. She can allow her health to be destroyed, neglect those she vowed to serve, and switch off her feelings and independent thought. She can turn a blind eye to suffering, inform on her fellow sisters, tell lies with ease, and ignore public laws and regulations.”

http://www.secularhumanism.org/library/fi/shields_18_1.html

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By thebeerdoctor, August 22, 2008 at 12:14 pm Link to this comment

re: Gmonst

Thank you for your thoughtful response. But I really think you over estimate the power of liberals, progressives to affect the outcome of this election. I understand the McCain as bogeyman chant, but the problems this world faces is way beyond who is pageant head of government. Just take a look at arms expenditures and the call to expand them. I find it rather ironic that Senator Obama appropriates some of Martin Luther King Jr.‘s legacy by delivering his acceptance speech on the same night as the famous “I Have A Dream” speech, forty five years previous.
I get the symbolism, but I wonder if his campaign teams can even fathom what a misappropriation this truly is. Senator Obama claims to be a candidate for peace, but he wishes to increase military troop strength in order to be deployed to Afghanistan. Anyone who has ever examined what Martin Luther King Jr. said about militarism and violence,  and that the U.S. is the greatest purveyor of violence in the world, can clearly see that Senator Obama’s vision has very little to do with the King legacy, no matter how it is being marketed.
No, Obama’s election problems are not with hard left liberals. His problem is with Hilary Clinton supporters, mostly disgruntled women who have grown to despise your candidate, for whatever rational or irrational reasons. Add to that the great middle of phobia inclined voters, who if told that folks such as Michael Moore support the Illinois Senator, will certainly vote against him. Try to understand that they are not voting for John McCain but against Barack Obama.
The election is not about issues. This personality pageant can depend upon very fickle details. The late playwright Arthur Miller had something to say about this.
http://www.neh.gov/whoweare/miller/lecture.html

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By Kevin James, August 22, 2008 at 12:08 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

By voice of UNtruth, August 22 at 7:03 am #

Are you kidding me?  Obama is a Marxist.  If you think he is really a centrist, then you are so out of touch with the majority of Americans that your opinion is moot.  I have no idea who or what the IMC is, and Iran will most definitely use nuclear weapons in a belligerent fashion if/when they get access to them.  If you do not believe that, then you’re living in a hole somewhere.

With this comment you come off as a clueless warmonger Right Wing crony that just dribbles nonsense propaganda! why do you even bother commenting here, doesn’t Foxsh*t news have a weblog for your kind?! you can always go to AEI and praise their sinister crap.

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By voice of truth, August 22, 2008 at 10:45 am Link to this comment

Ok Outraged

how does the fact that my wife knows I am a good father somehow translate to you that I am a misogynist wife beater or some other crazy thing that passes for brain function in your head?

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By Jeff29, August 22, 2008 at 10:37 am Link to this comment

So, Outraged, where in that did I say, “the reason there was poverty in the world was because of women who have abortions”?

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By Outraged, August 22, 2008 at 10:22 am Link to this comment

Re: voice of truth

Your comment: “Again, not sure what any of this, or my being a father, good or bad, has to do with this thread.”

The point was not whether or not you were/are a good father but more one of the perspective of someone who would proclaim LOUDLY that YOUR WIFE “KNOWS” you are a good father.  It does make a person wonder if YOUR WIFE has any other option BUT to “know” you are a good father, especially when you cannot back that up with her own voice.

So….  my point earlier was to highlight your perspective, which would give a “consider the source” clarity to your comments.

BTW, you might be interested in the discussion that I linked to in the comment to Jeff29.  Since I remember our debate was about abortion also….wasn’t it…?

Oh…. and I don’t “keep a link”, for everything, I just remember abouts where and what the topic was and go back and get it.

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By Outraged, August 22, 2008 at 10:01 am Link to this comment

Re: Jeff29

Your comment: “and OUTRAGED, I am waiting for responses”

Well….I didn’t know I was at your beck and call.  Just the same, while we were debating the contraception issue:

You said,

“Instead of continuing to argue with me, why don’t you try Mother Theresa: (then you quoted this)

““Mother Teresa Has Anti-Abortion Answer At a National Prayer Breakfast in Washington Feb. 3, Mother Teresa of Calcutta delivered the most startling and bold proclamation of truth to power I have heard in my more than 30 professional years in Washington…........She said that America, once known for generosity to the world, has become selfish. And she said that the greatest proof of that selfishness is abortion. Tying abortion to growing violence and murder in the streets, she said, ‘If we accept that a mother can kill even her own child, how can we tell other people not to kill each other? . . . Any country that accepts abortion is not teaching its people to love, but to use any violence to get what they want.’ (you summed it up this way)

  “Let me give you a few statistics:  In the 1950’s when a girl got pregnant out of wedlock, the primary courses of action were adoption or marriage, that was followed by keeping the baby without getting married (usually meaning that it was raised by grandma), and then abortion (about 1%).  Today, the numbers have reversed.  The top choices are keeping the baby out of wedlock or abortion, followed by getting married, and then adoption (0.4%).  Are we better off now than we were then?”

To which I responded,

“Do you really believe that abortion is the cause of whether we are better off now than we were then, if in fact your assumption is even valid?  Do you honestly think that abortions were not covertly done in secret during this time period?  We know that many women died because of it.  Let’s take 1941 weren’t those the “good years” according to my mother they were at least here in the states.  Yet, the world was at war and it was a particularly gruesome and death wielding time. Was abortion the cause of this war also?  What you are proposing is without merit.”

The link (just scroll down, of course)

http://www.truthdig.com/eartotheground/item/20080718_americas_war_on_sex_the_contraception_battle/

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By Jeff29, August 22, 2008 at 9:49 am Link to this comment

From Big B—“We almost always vote for the candidate that plays into our fear”.

It looks like Obama has figured this out:

“This is a defining moment in our history. Our nation is at war. The planet is in peril. The dream that so many generations fought for feels as if it’s slowly slipping away. We’ve never paid more for health care or for college. It’s harder to save and retire.”

—page 1 of Blueprint For Change

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By Dave in Big Pine, August 22, 2008 at 9:43 am Link to this comment

voice of truth

how about offering something more than insults to your reply?

why not thrill the world, if not this board, with you rapir like wit?

astound us with you literary genius.

just don’t bore us with your banality.

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By Dave in Big Pine, August 22, 2008 at 9:38 am Link to this comment

jeff29

what is wrong with conspiracy theorists? if there were more, and their voices were louder, that, I would think would be a good thing. 9/11 is a prime example, but there are many. how many government atrocities and false flags have to be exposed before you “see” that being a conspiracy theorist is to be a realist?

I don’t understand the statement you made nullifying my solutions based on my concerns. Actually I do believe that government is the solution to many problems, just not one controlled by a few people. only a strong federal government can provide single payer health care for instance. so, being a conservative is not in the cards for me.
but as I stated yesterday, I am not an Obama supporter, nor do I think he will in any way change America for the better. He is controlled, bought and paid for like the rest of them. I do not have a solution short of revolution. it has always been that the organized minority can easily control the un-organized majority, until that is, something sparks an uprising. what that is, or will be, I don’t know.

i do know that these groups exert far more than “a little” influence however.

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By voice of truth, August 22, 2008 at 9:24 am Link to this comment

Dave, you sound like a lunatic.  You should be a Hollywood writer.  Are you still searching for Bigfoot?

Don’t forget the Templars and Opus Dei, they have been popping up recently as big world controllers.

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By voice of truth, August 22, 2008 at 9:23 am Link to this comment

Dave, you sound like a lunatic.  You should be a Hollywood writer.  Are you still searching for Bigfoot?

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By Gmonst, August 22, 2008 at 9:21 am Link to this comment

re:thebeerdoctor
Pompous or not, I stand by my opinion that voters have a clear choice in this election.  In my view, McCain is clearly destructive and destabilizing.  Obama is neither a progressive nor a perfect candidate, but he is a pretty good candidate and light years ahead of McCain.  If you have got a better solution in this presidential race than voting for Obama, please share it.  His health care plan is not universal health care, but its a step in that direction, which is more than McCain will offer.  I will be the first to admit I don’t agree with Obama on all issues (such as the FISA vote) but I do agree with him more often than I don’t which is unusual for a presidential candidate.  Even though I sometimes disagree, he always seems sensible and thoughtful in his choices.  I trust him to at least be a level-headed even-handed president.  Again much more than I expect or see from McCain.

My views on big money may be cynical, but I think they are realistic.  Can you really name a time in human history where having a lot of resources/money did not translate into political power?  The influence has certainly been less at other times in United States history, but not really by much.  I don’t expect any presidential candidate could really change that.  However out of the two candidates its clear that McCain is far more of a bought and paid for kind of candidate.  At least Obama has some plans which will help average Americans ( closing corporate tax loop-holes, rewarding companies that keep jobs here, rebuilding infrastructure, making health care more affordable, and supporting the development of renewable energy) McCain has tax cuts for corporations as his plan.  Which is better? 

So I stand by my assertion that voters are presented with a clear choice of two very different directions in Obama and McCain.  Progressives/liberals who are not on board with supporting the Obama candidacy I think are being stupid.  If the left continues to undermine the Obama candidacy it makes his job a whole lot tougher.  I would expect attacks from the right, but this lack of support from the progressives is really not in their best interest.  Obama is the best choice for progressives this fall.

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By Jeff29, August 22, 2008 at 9:17 am Link to this comment

The movie is actually fairly interesting (although I’m not to thrilled about it’s explanation of religion).  The problem is this:  Yes we know those organizations exist, and yes we know that they exert some influence (by the way, you forgot to mention the Fed, which I believe may be the worst); but when you start ranting about them, you just sound like a conspiracy theororist and a shrill—nobody is going to listen.

What is your solution to these groups—and if you say Obama, you’re fooling yourself.  Most liberals play right into the hands of these groups.  Big government, social programs, world government, etc. is what ‘they’ want.  What they don’t want is Consitutionalism, Federalism, strong local govts., etc. because they cannot exert nearly as much influence.

So if you really think these groups are the biggest problem in society, you better become a Conservative (note I didn’t say Republican).  Your arguments confuse me because your solutions don’t seem to match your stated concerns.

BTW, PURPLE GIRL and OUTRAGED, I am waiting for responses.

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By Dave in Big Pine, August 22, 2008 at 8:59 am Link to this comment

jeff29

as a matter of fact, that movie is pretty good. do you have a refutation to offer? a counter explanation for the workings of the world?

or do you just want to blame the “libs” and continue to be a sychophant for those that think, and treat you, you as a sheep to be sheared again and again, and then slaughtered?

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By Jeff29, August 22, 2008 at 8:50 am Link to this comment

Dave,

Let me guess, your favorite movie is Zeitgeist.

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By Dave in Big Pine, August 22, 2008 at 8:42 am Link to this comment

voiced of truth

are you kidding me????

you don’t think a President McIdiot could get another Scalia, Roberts, Alito, or Thomas confirmed, and that it wouldn’t make a difference? what hole are you living in?

the worlds decisions, and that includes the U.S., are made primarily by the Bilderberg Group, Trilateral Commission, and Council on Forign Affairs. these people decide who is president, and decide what the president does and thinks. you think you have any voice? think again. you think either McMoron or Obama is independent to do as they please? you think either of those men were allowed to ascend to their present status through the electoral process? do you think either of those two will get to determine what happens to social security? what wars to start? the business cycle? when to wipe their ass?
the world belongs to a handful of people. they create the perception of what you believe to be, but deliver the reality of what really is. the sooner you recognize that, the better you will understand the reality in which you really exist. it’s really is analogous to the Matrix.

you don’t have a voice in anything. your life doesn’t count. my life doesn’t count. what does count is our march to the New World Order.

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By voice of truth, August 22, 2008 at 8:03 am Link to this comment

Ender

While I acknowledge you are correct in your initial point, i.e., liberal “purists” need to get on the Obama horse if he is to win, the rest of your arguments are so fraught with inconsistent logic that it amazes me.

“One or two more Supreme Court picks could give the Executive branch the power that Shrub has been trying to grab.”
Regardless of wether there is a Republican president, there is no way another Scalia or Alito would be confirmed in a nearly 60 member Democrat senate majority.  Why is it that when the court swings to ridiculous liberal opinions that is the way it should be, but when a conservatice justice actually deigns to use the constitution as a guide, it’s the end of the world?

“With four more years to place Republicans in key bureaucratic positions such as EPA, DOE(ducation) and DOE(nergy) those institutions will never recovery the ability or even the direction to act in the nations best interest. “

These three departments are hacks at best.  Every government bureau is so full of mid-level career workers that actually run the show.  The vast majority of them are democrats and union members.  The DoEd in particular is so beholden to the Teacher’s Unions that no matter what anyone wants them to do they will still bump along in a quagmire.

“The American middle class is becoming completely ‘cowed’, afraid to stand up to Corporate America and the Industrial Military Complex because they will slap us with another recession that will even eliminate the hope for our children’s future.  The destruction of Social Security, public Education, and available healthcare are the Republican Hammer to keep us in line.  This may be the last chance of electing a president that is not a member in good standing of the Reichwing.”

I’m not even sure how to reply to this.  Trust me, no one in Corp America would willingly “slap us” with a reception.  You forget that these are real people.  Not monolithic entities.  And they want to make money.  Eliminate hope for our children’s future?  whatever.  I have four, I believe there is hope for them.  Destruction of Social Security?  The only people who destroyed that, and it is destroyed already for anyone under 50, is the Congress (both sides).  Even when Clinton was crowing about a balanced budget, that was only called balanced because it “stole” the huge SS surplus.  There is no SS trust fund, never has been.  Put that in your lock box.  And healthcare is available to everyone.  What you want is someone to pay for it.  Very different proposition.

“Obama is at least a centrist.  McSame seems determined to get us into a war with Iran that we might not be able to win without going nuclear.  The IMC is determined to get this war because Iran has begun trading oil only in Euros.  Iran’s future nuclear capability have nothing to do with an attack on Iran.”

Are you kidding me?  Obama is a Marxist.  If you think he is really a centrist, then you are so out of touch with the majority of Americans that your opinion is moot.  I have no idea who or what the IMC is, and Iran will most definitely use nuclear weapons in a belligerent fashion if/when they get access to them.  If you do not believe that, then you’re living in a hole somewhere.

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By ender, August 22, 2008 at 7:23 am Link to this comment

This is an unusual Comment thread, with mostly progressives bashing each other.  I’m agree with Dave in Big Pine that Kucinich was the only true progressive in the race and really deserving of the progressive vote.

That said, Progressive Americans better get off their duffs and work for the Obama organization like True Believers whether they are or not.

In spite of a Democratic Congress, McSame can damage this nation irreparably with just a few Presidential actions:
1) One or two more Supreme Court picks could give the Executive branch the power that Shrub has been trying to grab.
2) With four more years to place Republicans in key bureaucratic positions such as EPA, DOE(ducation) and DOE(nergy) those institutions will never recovery the ability or even the direction to act in the nations best interest.
3) The American middle class is becoming completely ‘cowed’, afraid to stand up to Corporate America and the Industrial Military Complex because they will slap us with another recession that will even eliminate the hope for our children’s future.  The destruction of Social Security, public Education, and available healthcare are the Republican Hammer to keep us in line.  This may be the last chance of electing a president that is not a member in good standing of the Reichwing.
4) Obama is at least a centrist.  McSame seems determined to get us into a war with Iran that we might not be able to win without going nuclear.  The IMC is determined to get this war because Iran has begun trading oil only in Euros.  Iran’s future nuclear capability have nothing to do with an attack on Iran.

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By Jeff29, August 22, 2008 at 7:04 am Link to this comment

Outraged,

Please provide that link.

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By voice of truth, August 22, 2008 at 6:30 am Link to this comment

My dear Outraged.

Yes, I am probably am the one you refer to, which brings up two very interesting questions.

First, not sure what any of your comment re: myself has to do with this thread.

Second, and much more disturbing, why you keep links to everything you post on?

As for my silence, I can only take this site is small amounts.  I will be active for a couple of days, then eventually the sheer lunacy, hatred and stupidity gets to be too much for me, and I go back to my real life for awhile.

Again, not sure what any of this, or my being a father, good or bad, has to do with this thread.

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By Outraged, August 22, 2008 at 3:05 am Link to this comment

Re: beerdoctor

I agree.  Give us, THE AMERICAN PEOPLE the things we want and agree with.  Why should we line the pockets of insurance companies..?  Will this only result in MORE lobbying and power for them against the prudent and realistic motive of attaining FAIR and EQUITIABLE healthcare for everyone?  To claim a “just the way things are” mentality is to subvert the greater good.

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By thebeerdoctor, August 22, 2008 at 2:34 am Link to this comment

re: gmonst
Reading your impassioned pleas for Senator Obama, I notice you sometimes veer into bombast. “He has always been pretty clear as to what he wants to accomplish as president.” And what exactly is it that he wants to accomplish? He use to be an advocate for campaign finance reform, one of many rhetorical nuggets tossed about, until he saw the tactical advantage of opting out of the public finance system.
“he is the only serious candidate with any plan to move America toward universal health care” it is obvious you misunderstood what Senator Obama advocates. He wants you to be able to afford to buy health insurance. A kind of double speak that leaves the insurance industry at the trough of American suffering; never for a moment considering the idea that other western countries have already figured out, that health care of the citizens is a proper public service, never designed to line the pockets of insurance company executives. In this case you reveal a breathtaking cynicism with: “Big money has always had a big power, and it will continue to now and into the future.” And with that gem, you feel justified to support the Illinois Senator. Never mind American history where you will discover that at one time there were laws that capped the amount of interest banks could charge for a loan, or that even in the corrupt 20th century there were people who went to prison for influence peddling.
Offering the so-called fact that big money influence is here to stay, reveals a lack of faith in the democratic process. Why is it so impossible to remove an influence that is so destructive to democracy? Is it any more difficult than banning cigarette advertising on television?
Your complaints about the hard left of the Democratic party are silly. If the so-called hard left has so much influence, then why does your chosen candidate flee from the appearance of having any sympathy for their concerns?
Both his former minister and church discovered soon enough that the last thing Barack Obama wants is to appear to be a radical black. His reversal on FISA, his wish to extend the death penalty to even more crimes, his call for more troops so as to escalate the so-called war on terror in Afghanistan… reveal a candidate who simply wants to retool the status quo. So it is ridiculous to become upset when some people say, that is not change they can believe in.
Instead of posting rants against the Senator’s detractors. it might be wiser to study the avenue that can get Senator Obama elected, namely the American voters.
Odd, but I notice that some of Senator Obama’s most vocal supporters have a great disdain for their fellow members of the electorate, who simply are dubious of his campaign and motives. You are in the election now. By calling voters stupid and other names, you will achieve a result. Just not the one you desire.

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By Outraged, August 22, 2008 at 1:58 am Link to this comment

Re: Jeff29:

Your premise it seems is the attempt to subvert facts.  You can namby-pamby all you want regarding real issues, but wasn’t it YOU who told me that the reason there was poverty in the world was because of women who have abortions…?  A ridiculous assertion at best.  I can link to that if you’d like.

Re: voice of truth

Aren’t you the one who claimed that your wife was in “full compliance” with your claim that you were “a wonderful father”..?  Yet, when I challenged you for your wife’s “take” on YOUR assertion, was met with silence…  I can link to it if you’d like.

Re: adrienrain

Your quote: “The tax policies you hate were in full force in the post war era - and that was the time of the rise of the middle class in America. We also had tariffs in those days, and a strong manufacturing base.”

Thank you.  This is not only accurate but timely.  Great catch.

Re: Rightwing

Your quote: “he can do no wrong,except lean to the right, to try and make himself appear more to the middle.Your comments are right on, I agree with you 100%. You are not the only one here, a lot of us visit, cause we need to giggle.”

What is your interpretation of “except lean to the right”...?  Oh, and I find you JUST as entertaining….LOL.  Thanks for participating.

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By Vince Liberty, August 21, 2008 at 11:00 pm Link to this comment

Jim Yell says;

“Bush has left the country in a position in which the lack of a War Tax has created a situation in which taxes will be raised and if they aren’t raised enough than the level of poverty in this country will rise to the point you won’t be able to tell this country from a third world pest hole.”

Aha, Jim, that’s where you are wrong. Bush HAS instituted a War Tax - it’s called inflation. Every new dollar he prints goes to banks, government contractors, and the Merchants of Death. By the time you or I see the money, it is fully depreciated. This is an additional 6% - 10% tax on every penny we make, and it all goes to fund war.

I heard Lew Rockwell say the other day that instead of a tasteful sign on the lawn to indicate the home of the Federal Reserve, there should be a gigantic mountain of skulls. Sounds about right to me.

Add to this the deficit and the debt, this will of course add to the taxes of later generations or else be defaulted upon, sparking more war and economic catastrophe. Forget Social Security and Medicare too, they won’t survive a collapse.

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By ocjim, August 21, 2008 at 10:05 pm Link to this comment

Polls have proved to be rather inaccurate. My understanding is that they supposedly represent a cross section of would-be voters. If this represents a preponderance of landlines vs. cell phones, many of the young tend to have only cell phones and choose not to pay for landlines.

Apart from that, the past two elections are enough emperical data for thoughtful Americans to be worried. Voting “personality” in the past has given us Reagan with a weakening of unions, lower taxes for the rich, increase in poverty, the Contra scandal, the S&L;giveaway to corrupt Republican friends; and most recently the totally corrupt Bush with wars, scandal, torture, decline in rights, and near fascist leadership.

The McCain plague would bring more of the same. Of yes, he seems more personable than Obama in an empty-headed, opportunistic, Machiavellian way.

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By Brad, August 21, 2008 at 9:26 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

As mentioned above, pollsters only poll those with land-line phones. If the race appears to be more even than it really is, not only is it better for the bottom line of the all the corportate media, it is MUCH easier to steal the election, without uproar, for McCain, as was done for Bush in ‘00 and ‘04 with the vote caging, electonic voting irregularities, and such.

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By Irish Dog, August 21, 2008 at 8:32 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Dig up Adam and Eve and start over again.  They are both con men.  If our great hope is Obama, we have set the bar far too low.  I see no starch, just setting the sails to move rightward as fast as possible.

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By Big E, August 21, 2008 at 7:23 pm Link to this comment

everybody ‘knows’ that the Republicans have always done the right thing and have never been wrong on any issues, .. they’ve never been in any scandals or lied, or committed crimes…...

even if by some miracle, a ‘mistake’ was committed by a Republican it was with the full knowledge and sanctioning of God and the evangelicals…..  it really doesn’t matter anyways, as the Republicans had as their intention the ‘best interests of America’....

when Republicans are caught looting corporations and American citizens, you should always remember that the good effects will eventually trickle on down and that at it’s heart, .. sound fiscal policy….......... for them.

‘creation science’ should be taught in public schools, and should a citizen dare to have the nerve to try and run his own family regarding medical care, the president and republicans should be able to fly back to D.C. and write new christian laws so they can tell the citizen what to do…

you need to vote Republican to keep the war industries going and lock in profits
for the favored few…no regulation needed…. should something go wrong, just have the government step in and bail out the corporations who got too greedy and make the tax payers pay for it….    [ I’m feeling better already]

yes… vote Republican and all this can be yours

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By Gmonst, August 21, 2008 at 6:44 pm Link to this comment

All you Obama neighsayers what exactly is your solution?  You all keep saying unfortunately this and that, Obama is in the back pocket of corporations yada yada, will continue the neocon this or that etc.  What exactly do you propose?  I don’t see anything positive being said by the anti-Obama crowd you just nit-pick, and hate and tear him down as best you can.  Of course he’s not perfect, of course he can do wrong, and of course he will make mistakes and decisions which will sometimes be disappointing.  He’s human, and further than that he’s a politician.  What do you expect?  Why not compare the two candidates to each other?  They are not exactly the same, never have been, never will be.  Policy articulations are by necessity somewhat vague.  They are supposed to articulate the values and priorities the individual will have in office.  I think the web site now and before the blueprint were pretty clear on the direction Obama would like to take on the issues. Obama is every bit as clear as McCain, and in my view clearer.  McCain has also been a much bigger flip flopper than Obama on the issues.  However, McCain is very clear that he will be for oil and war, that much is crystal.  Still you call them the same.  I guess if you really feel that way you are entitled to your opinion, but I disagree.  I think that voters this fall have a clear choice in two candidates with to very different opinions and approaches and I am going to choose Obama.  I am not a robot, Obamamaniac, member of the church of Obama, or any other such nonsense.  I am just a guy who doesn’t want to see the US slide into perpetual war, poverty, and decay and I know that Obama is the best shot at keeping that from happening.  If you disagree that Obama is the best shot at that then fine, what do you think is the best shot at that then?  I am starting to get the feeling those on here either only know how to be haters and cynics or they actually want more war, more oil, and more chaos.  For all his imperfections, Obama is smart, savvy and nuanced.  He will make a good even handed leader, and he is the best shot we have at turning from the grave direction the United States has been taking the last 8 years.

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By Blackspeare, August 21, 2008 at 6:06 pm Link to this comment

Obama has one problem that McCain doesn’t——-he’s Black!  Most PCPs (politically correct posters) on this article omit this, but it could have an impact on the election.  No one knows the extent of the anti-black vote, but it could be enough to swing the election to McCain and the closer the election the more impact it will have!

Though hardly mentioned in the MSM, including Lieberman as his VP, Gore lost the election more than likely because of the anti-Jew vote and more than likely in his own home state of Tennessee!

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By jobart, August 21, 2008 at 5:10 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

By Kevin James, August 21 at 12:09 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)

YES WE CON!

Obama has a choice to make. He can continue being a lapdog for corps so far and appeal to the warmongering neocon cabal or he can go back and look for support from the people who put him there in the first place.
So far he conned us all. He used us to get nominated and quickly turned his back.
He would do much better to loose while energizing the left and become a ray of light in what seems to be dark years to come. He can once and for all put an end to the neo-colonialist’s hegemonic and expansionist foreign policy. He can offer hope to avert catastrophe in the making and do the biggest service to mankind. Or he could lean even more to the right to win the racist warmongers vote and keep the status quo

Mr. James,
I TOTALLY agree with your position here.  There are large amounts of the electorate, as witnessed by speech turnouts and voter registration drives that have added many more Americans into the system. I do, however, have a major problem with his “pandering” to the uncommitted voters with his FISA vote and “war talk” re: Afghanistan and the recent B.S. in Georgia.  He is coming across, to most of us at least, as just another “lapdog” of the ruling elite. Although, early on, I donated to his/the cause, I have “intentionally” held back from further support since his “shift” in both his stated policy/platform. He is, most definately, seemingly moving towards the “status quo” and I, for one,am far from happy about it. Remember the expression, “you dance with who you brung?” Well that applies here.  Barak.  You got to where you got with people who believed your message of change, and things will be, if you’re elected, that change we so badly need will be addressed. People now percieve that message/promise as unadulterated bullshit.  You are “assuming” the age-old position of most politicians.  I’ve got who/what I’ve got and, now, I have to “get” those I need to “get”. Unfortunately, for you and us, the “already” got is melting away in front of all of our eyes.  Quite painful.  For all of us.  Please, return to your roots, ignore those that you haven’t “got”, and do everything you can to “ensure” a legal voting process.  Oh, one more thing….FIGHT BACK HARD !!! There is so much negative info on the idiot that should be aired.  No “good” POW.  Traitor. No good morals.  Adulterer.  Connections to the MOB in AR.  Voting record.  Schooling. Performance as a pilot.  Forrestall?  Many servicemen dead from a “stunt”?  Angry Outbursts.  Illerate about nations/gov’t. officials real names/ geography, to name a few talking points. Come on Barak, start acting like a candidate that deserves the support of America and not just another, in a long line of lackies, that support the corporate elite and the policies that dictate.

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By Jeff29, August 21, 2008 at 4:33 pm Link to this comment

Hey Jim, there is an option to raising taxes and still being fiscally responsible—Reduce Spending.

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By RightWing, August 21, 2008 at 4:30 pm Link to this comment

eer,aah mmmm well,aaah,mmm, aaah duh, err ,Damn will someone turn on the teleprompter

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By RightWing, August 21, 2008 at 4:19 pm Link to this comment

Fenwick, are you from Lowell?, I am….

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By RightWing, August 21, 2008 at 4:14 pm Link to this comment

Linda everything about Obama is all about HIM, The One

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By RightWing, August 21, 2008 at 4:10 pm Link to this comment

Rowman/ I hate to say it but you are preaching to the members of the COB (Church of Obama), he can do no wrong,except lean to the right, to try and make himself appear more to the middle.Your comments are right on, I agree with you 100%. You are not the only one here, a lot of us visit, cause we need to giggle.Obama is a sham politician….again rowman, thank you for hanging in here. and purple girl I might be wrong, and even if I wasn’t you guys would say I was,in a recent survey Fox was the least bias, remember you have that pro Oberlman(sp) who’s legs quiver at the mention of Obama’s name…...What about Obama and his live baby lie,on the senate floor? He lies so much he cant remember his last one….. My oh My where did all you great thinkers come from all of a sudden, we will be called trolls,so get ready for the liberal name calling…

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By Kevin James, August 21, 2008 at 3:25 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

“Yes, we can. Yes, we can change. Yes, we can.”

just put the O from Obama into this slogan and you’ll have


“Yes We Con!”

which might be more appropriate.

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By Scoppertop, August 21, 2008 at 2:53 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Maybe McSame’s poll numbers come from the GOP, as in 46% GOP for McCain, 41% GOP for Obama.  That’s more true than what Zogby is saying… they sure don’t ask for MY opinion anymore now that they know I’m not a GOP, but I used to get polled by Zogby every few weeks until recently.

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By voice of truth, August 21, 2008 at 2:50 pm Link to this comment

YES WE CON!

Um, what is that?  What does that mean?  Is that to imply that it would be criminal to vote for Changely?

It’re rare that someone so emphatically says something that no one has any idea what he means!

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By Ariq, August 21, 2008 at 2:33 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I wouldn’t put too much credence in any of the polls that are currently making the rounds, they are about as accurate as the polls that were taken back in 1948 showing Truman going down to defeat to Dewey.  There is a fallacy in their methodology, just as in 1948.  In 1948 they conducted phone polls of the public, well a problem with this was, a large percentage of voting age Americans didn’t have phones.  Which lead to a false read of the electorate.  A similar fallacy is currently manifesting itself in the polling.  They are only using land line phones to canvas for their polls.  Well, as many people know most people below the age of 30 don’t have land lines, they rely on cell phones, as an increasing number of Americans do.  Finally, it is well known that Obama draws an inordinate amount of support from the under 30 crowd.  There lies the pollsters’ fallacy.  They have yet to effectively address this new paradigm

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By Jim Yell, August 21, 2008 at 2:30 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I started out with a mild optomism about Obama and looked forward to voting for him on that basis, but with some of the really bad things he has caved too I find I am left once again in the position of voting for someone just because the other fellow, this time McCain is so BAD that it passes wonder.

As to the tax issue? Grow up. Bush has left the country in a position in which the lack of a War Tax has created a situation in which taxes will be raised and if they aren’t raised enough than the level of poverty in this country will rise to the point you won’t be able to tell this country from a third world pest hole. One would hope even the most selfish and arrogant republican would not wish to see this happen to this once promising democracy.

The elections are being cobbled by greedy corporations and the military industrial complex, if they win we all lose.

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By Reubenesque, August 21, 2008 at 2:26 pm Link to this comment

Didn’t Truthdig used to have anti-mole software in place?  It must be broke.

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By Jeff29, August 21, 2008 at 1:49 pm Link to this comment

The problem, Gmonst, is that Obama has not read his own website.  He’s got staffers writing these long policy briefs, yet this man who is supposedly the most articulate candidate since JFK can’t seem to get the message across. 

It’s been a couple months since I have been to his site, but my experience was a bunch of sound-bite explanations of positions on the front page (fluff), and really long-winded explanations as support.  How about something concise but with substance?

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By rowman, August 21, 2008 at 1:44 pm Link to this comment

Oh that is such crap. They did not write the “blue print” until 7/29. Even that is full of vague statements and empty innuendo. His positions continue to evolve and change and are now in agreement with many of Hillary’s positions he objected too.  Get real.

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By Gmonst, August 21, 2008 at 1:26 pm Link to this comment

I don’t see how anyone can say that Obama is mysterious.  If one takes the time to visit his website they will see pretty clear policy articulations.  I don’t get why people keep saying Obama is a mystery.  Most of his positions have remained the same through the election.  He has always been pretty clear as to what he wants to accomplish as president. 

Its frustratingly clear that some people just want to frame this election as a no-choice, lesser of two evils, when its clearly not.  What is not clear is exactly why some continue to do so.  There is a very clear choice with two clearly different directions and approaches.  If you can’t see that you are blind.

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By Kevin James, August 21, 2008 at 1:09 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

YES WE CON!

Obama has a choice to make. He can continue being a lapdog for corps so far and appeal to the warmongering neocon cabal or he can go back and look for support from the people who put him there in the first place.
So far he conned us all. He used us to get nominated and quickly turned his back.
He would do much better to loose while energizing the left and become a ray of light in what seems to be dark years to come. He can once and for all put an end to the neo-colonialist’s hegemonic and expansionist foreign policy. He can offer hope to avert catastrophe in the making and do the biggest service to mankind. Or he could lean even more to the right to win the racist warmongers vote and keep the status quo.

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By rowman, August 21, 2008 at 12:44 pm Link to this comment

voice of truth, August 21 at 11:30 am #

lmao. you first.

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By rowman, August 21, 2008 at 12:37 pm Link to this comment

Re: Big B, August 21 at 10:45 am #

“always vote for the candidate that plays into our fear.”

Not my take. Americans have been forced to pick between the “lesser of two evils” for a long, long time. Part of the failure of our two party system Jefferson warned us about. Most Americans will still be asking this question on Election Day.

Being that many still don’t know who Obama is or what “change” means, it’s too great a risk for Jane and Joe and they will vote for McCain.

All Obama has offered is a larger, more expensive government that will be more controlling than ever. Obama is one big mystery that grown more mysterious every day.

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By voice of truth, August 21, 2008 at 12:30 pm Link to this comment

Rowman, stop whacking the baby seals.

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By rowman, August 21, 2008 at 12:23 pm Link to this comment

ted tyson, August 21 at 8:58 am #

Ha. Couldn’t find any references eh.

I did my homework and could not find any either…

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By Gmonst, August 21, 2008 at 12:13 pm Link to this comment

In my opinion Obama’s problem is coming from the unbending far left wing of the democratic party that feels a candidate needs to be perfect, promise everything they want, and essentially be what no other presidential candidate has ever been.  There are no perfect candidates.  Big money has always had big power, and it will continue to now and into the future.  No president is going to suddenly erase the influence of corporations and lobbyists, and no candidate can get to the big show without some support from them.  That being said, a look at the candidates will clearly show who is more beholden to big money, who has shifted his views more to gain their support, and who cares less about peace and negotiation in foreign relations.  Its John McCain, and everyone on this site knows it.  Its clear that while Obama is not perfectly liberal, he is the only serious candidate with any plan to move America toward universal health care, he is the only serious candidate who has spoken out against the war in Iraq, he is the only serious candidate that talks about raising taxes on corporations, he is the only serious candidate with a plan to make renewable energy a national priority, and he is the only serious candidate who has the intelligence and skill to negotiate the murky waters of foreign relations without getting us into World War III.  All in all he is an uncommonly good candidate and the left should be excited about him.  All McCain knows is more corporate tax cuts, more oil drilling, and more war.  That’s pretty much in a nutshell.  Whether you like Obama or not McCain should scare you enough to make sure that guy doesn’t get in. 

There is a lot about Obama to like, but the far left is busy pointing out every point of disagreement with him, ignoring the positives, and foolishly declaring they will vote for no one, or some no name without a shot.  Meanwhile McCain and his dangerous positions, dangerous lack of intelligence, and dangerously outdated and simplistic views of the world skim by without a lot of attack.  The left should be united in going after McCain, instead of fighting over whether or not Obama is liberal enough when he is clearly much much more liberal than McCain.

All you liberals (or republican trolls?) with your nihilistic, let the system burn and not vote attitude should be ashamed.  Letting the house crumble may assure an end of some things you don’t like but you have no idea of the horror that could replace it.  If you really care about this planet, the people in it, and your own prosperity you should vote for Obama.  I feel like he really does care about the common person a lot more than any candidate that has run during the last 20+ years.  If you disagree with that, fine, but the contrast between McCain and Obama is obvious.  The two are not the same and will not lead this country in similar directions.  To say they will is foolish, wrong, and may guarantee the enhancement of everything you are fighting to change.  Grow up and wise up!

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By Big B, August 21, 2008 at 11:45 am Link to this comment

Re roman

perhaps you have not been paying attention to the last few elections, or the point of my comment. Not everyone is racist, however there are enough of them out there, particularly the old “Reagan dimmocrates” to sway any close election to the right. I have seen enough blue collar dimmos fall for the candidate that wraps himself in the flag, saying that he will protect you from those brown people (overseas or domestic). It’s one of the trappings of our dim nation. We almost always vote for the candidate that plays into our fear. How else could anyone explain how the land of the free, the home of the brave, voted for the overtly racist fear mongers that were Nixon, Reagan, and both Bushes.
You can think more highly of the American people than they deserve if you like. But the ghosts of elections past tell a different story.

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By Alan, August 21, 2008 at 11:43 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

The too “me-too” Dems have an inveterate facility
for throwing away presidential election victories.
Obama is too timid to state the obvious
McCain is part and parcel of the negligent,corrupt,
criminal Bush regime.  Instead Obama has already
me-too’d himself into a rut in a ditch.

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By JimM, August 21, 2008 at 11:19 am Link to this comment

Sadly, most people will not read Barack’s book. Us north anmericans are too easily scared and intimidated. With the memories of 9/11 still fresh, most will back a blusterbutt like McCain who promises to protect them militarily while scaring them with exaggeration and falsehood.
I wonder if Barack’s book can be converted into either a color form game or a comic and coloring book, or one themed with sex and violence. Any of these categories would garner a bigger readership than a plain ol boring policy book.
Sigh

Jim M.

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By Dave in Big Pine, August 21, 2008 at 11:11 am Link to this comment

jeff29

didn’t think you could.

well i must be off to catch some dinner. hopefully i can get some nice size Yellowtail, and if I’m lucky, maybe a grouper. it’s still a little breezy here in the Keys, but I don’t need to go out more than 5 miles or so.

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By Jeff29, August 21, 2008 at 11:11 am Link to this comment

You made none of those points in your original post.  I mean, I think that I’m a reasonably intelligent individual, but I’m not psychic.

If what you meant was that ‘the Republican machine will once again conspire to steal the vote’, then you just should have said that in the first place

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By dr wu, August 21, 2008 at 11:02 am Link to this comment

2008—end of Democratic Party as we know it.
2009 new party forms to take on Republicans.

from the looks of it the new party,as yet unnamed, will not be another party of the rich. Rule of Rich begins to fade in US as the truly rich move to China.

US in 2010 becomes a second tier power—emerges as happy and content Scandinavian country

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By Dave in Big Pine, August 21, 2008 at 10:32 am Link to this comment

Jeff29


once again….

just because I said that there is not a numbers problem does not mean that tranlates into an election victory. turnout is a factor as is election fraud. just having the number of supporters required is not sufficient. ensuring those supporters can be turned into actual voters is what counts. and with the republicans disenfranchising the thousands and thousands of voters that they do, it’s a real question.
so, now tell me where i mispoke.

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By troublesum, August 21, 2008 at 10:24 am Link to this comment

The terrorists (followed by the Russians) are coming to get your kids.  Vote for the military hero to protect you.  That’s the republicans only issue.  Why can’t the dems ever counter that effectively?

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By Jeff29, August 21, 2008 at 10:23 am Link to this comment

Let’s see Dave,  I said:

“If by Democratic base you mean the far left, there is a reason that the Democratic politicians move away.  There aren’t enough of them to win an election.”

“My guess is that, as a whole, there probably aren’t enough democrats to win the election; thus the appeal to the ‘moderate’ republicans.”

and in response you said:

“Obama can fill a 75000 seat stadium easily, and attract over 200,000 to hear him speak from people who can’t even vote for him….and you say the democrats have a numbers problem???”

Now you say:

“nowhwere did i state a correlation between Obamas ability to attract a crowd and his electability”

What were you responding to?  I said there are not enough Democrats for him to win the election (electability) to which you responded with comments about filling a stadium, attracting people who can’t vote for him, and asking about a numbers problem (electability).

I know I mentioned Germany in an earlier post, but I assumed that we were still speaking English.

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By adrienrain, August 21, 2008 at 10:19 am Link to this comment

Voice of Truth - you may convince me to vote for Obama yet! The tax policies you hate were in full force in the post war era - and that was the time of the rise of the middle class in America. We also had tariffs in those days, and a strong manufacturing base.

And what else? No vast army of homeless people, for one thing. And we didn’t have the largest prison population in the world, either.

Almost everyone in this country wants OUT of this war - left and right. That is the issue and that is where Obama is flubbing the ball.

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By g, August 21, 2008 at 10:15 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

One thing I’ve had my fill of are personalities in leadership roles that prefer to leave all options open. No matter what the original plan was (if there even was one) or what they’ve promised (even though they deny the film). All their thinking energies are tied up in how to spin their way through their next catastrophe.

Give me a president and vice president with more introspective intuition. A team that can think on their feet adjusting policies according to a shared, democratic vision for America. Not some positivistic delusion (dogmatic assertiveness) like Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rove and Rice. Hey, maybe even a vision we, our kids and grand kids can afford! Third or Fourth Party anyone?

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By Dave in Big Pine, August 21, 2008 at 10:12 am Link to this comment

Jeff29

I cited so such thing. nowhwere did i state a correlation between Obamas ability to attract a crowd and his electability. the inference i made was between his popularity and his low poll numbers, or more to the point, McCains seeming unpopularity given his positions, and his high poll numbers.

the only thing “classic” here, is your ability to read what you want, ignore the rest, and live in your land of make believe.

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By P. T., August 21, 2008 at 10:07 am Link to this comment

Pollster John Zogby explains why Obama lost his lead.  His support among Democrats fell by nine percent over the past month.

John Zogby:  “What’s happened, number one, young people, liberals, a solid core of Obama’s base just raising some questions about him.  For liberals, maybe the perception that he’s flip-flopped on some key issues like FISA and a sense that for young people, I think, especially, that maybe he’s not the unique, different sort of political persona that they expected.”

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By Gawd, August 21, 2008 at 10:06 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Everybody who paid attention to what the primaries told us knew about these Obama weaknesses.

We were told by his supporters that his poll numbers vs McCain would surely improve when he no longer had to be bothered with running against Clinton (who’s numbers vs McCain nearly always outperformed Obama’s by a comfortable margin).

Obviously, his supporters were wrong.

What Obama ought to do is go back to those superdelegates who gave him the nomination despite what we learned during the primaries about his general election metric underperformace vs Clinton and his glaring weaknesses vs McCain and ask them what exactly it was they saw in him but that the numbers didn’t substantiate that suggested he would be the stronger general election candidate.

I mean, it couldn’t really have been just that he won those 114 extra undemocratic caucus delegates (out of over 3400) in small red states the Dems don’t win and usually don’t need to win a general election…could it?

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By Jeff29, August 21, 2008 at 10:05 am Link to this comment

“it never ceases to amaze me the sheer willingness of the American population to be so easily fooled and manipulated”

This coming from a someone who just cited a Obama’s ability to fill a stadium as proof that he will be elected.  Classic.

What we see here is the Rock Star image fading.  The people want some substance, and are not finding it with Obama.  Even if McCain has no more substance than Obama, he didn’t promise the world.  It’s a basic principle of customer service:  Under-promise and over deliver.  Obama is doing the opposite.

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By Dave in Big Pine, August 21, 2008 at 10:02 am Link to this comment

Jeff29

yes, Hannah Montana could fill a stadium too.

So why can’t McCain? you didn’t get around to addressing that.

and for the record, I am not an Obama supporter. the only person I would have voted for, get ready…..

is Kucinich. gasp!

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By ted tyson, August 21, 2008 at 9:58 am Link to this comment

rowman—
      you need to do you own homework.

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By Jeff29, August 21, 2008 at 9:57 am Link to this comment

“and attract over 200,000 to hear him speak from people who can’t even vote for him”

Yes Dave you are correct, Obama would crush McCain if the election were held in Germany.  However, just in case they decide to hold the election in the U.S., why don’t you explain Obama’s post-primary move (and the move of the last two democratic candidates) away from the far left.

“Obama can fill a 75000 seat stadium easily”.  So can Hannah Montana, but no one is voting for her for President.  Oh, and thanks for validating the Paris/Linsay/Obama commercials.  Your comment epitomized the Obamamania mentality.

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By Dave in Big Pine, August 21, 2008 at 9:53 am Link to this comment

voice of truth

it never ceases to amaze me the sheer willingness of the American population to be so easily fooled and manipulated as our friend Voice of Truth here. They can have their asses handed to them time and time again by the criminals in government and business, and far from demanding justice and reform, they just ask how far down to bend over.
don’t you know these people are just laughing at you? don’t you realize they consider you, and all their supporters as sheep, just begging to be shreared again and again? wake up man. you are embarrassing yourself.

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By Mark, August 21, 2008 at 9:48 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

You need to read his books, people.  In fact, the entire Dem party needs to read his books. They need to take his classes.  They need to listen to the man’s message.

FRAME the freakin’ issues.  FRAME them or you will LOSE, Dems.  You hear me?  Make the Republicans listen to YOUR message instead of hitting them back like bullies taking your freakin’ lunch money.

FRAME.  Listen to that message.

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By voice of truth, August 21, 2008 at 9:41 am Link to this comment

I love your thoughts that Obama is tacking too hard to the right.  Let’s see, his last commercial, promised to go after Big Oil, give tax credits to people who don’t pay taxes as it is, punish companies who “move jobs overseas”, throw more wasted dollars into education (read:  Teacher’s Unions), blah blah.  There is nothing “right” in any of those.

Let’s see, he wants to supertax the “rich”, redistribute wealth, has no understanding of basic economics, wants to heavily tax the same people who he says he wants to help (small business owners, who generate the MOST US based jobs) and confiscate profits from private entities that he decides have made too much money.  No wonder he got the endorsement of the American Communist Party.

I can see why you are scared he is moving to the right!

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By Dave in Big Pine, August 21, 2008 at 9:40 am Link to this comment

Jeff29

so lets see…

Obama can fill a 75000 seat stadium easily, and attract over 200,000 to hear him speak from people who can’t even vote for him, raise twice as much money as McMoron from a far more diverse and numerically superior base, while McSenile has to go to a bikers convention(and ready made crowd) and offer up his wife in a titty contest in order to keep them in their seats, and you say the democrats have a numbers problem???

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By Fenwick, August 21, 2008 at 9:39 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

H. L. Mencken said something to the effect that since American Presidential campaigns appeal to the lowest common denominator eventually we’ll elect a complete idiot.  What he failed to talk about is what comes after the idiot.  Now we see, Archie Andrews (of the comics) and that character represented by the schoolmaster in Dr. Zhivago who brought his teenage boys to fight in the revolution.  (They were massacred.)
People in Lowell, MA, some of whom are delegates, are still for Hilary and don’t want to go to the convention now. 
I value my vote enough to say that I’d never throw it away on either one, Archie or Grandpa. 
I fear for what is going to happen in this country maybe even in the world.
Obama’s telltale vote was his FISA vote.  His votes to fund the war were questionable but maybe they could be explained away by a glib young politician, but not the FISA vote.  That vote showed me we have one-party rule with three factions: Republican, Democrats, and the Military Brass.
With Archie sinking in the polls, it looks like, “Ho Ho, Hi Ho, It’s off to another bigger war we go.”
The middle class faction of the electorate can’t chant, “Give us poverty of give us death!”
Chalmers Johnson advises that people should have at least one escape route.
Sigh, I wish I studied in college.

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By voice of truth, August 21, 2008 at 9:37 am Link to this comment

Wow, Dave, how many more really intelligent and creative names for McCain can you come up with.  Maybe you should be McDictionary.  Or, judging by the rest of your post, McLunatic.

I am sure the polls are all fixed, except the ones that show your boy ahead.  Of course.  And the Georgia boys really did have a Big Foot body, but at the last minute, the government types came in from Area 51 and switched it with a rubber ape suit so no one would really know that Big Foot is real or that he, and not George Bush is, in fact, responsible for every bad thing in the world today.

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By boston blackie, August 21, 2008 at 9:37 am Link to this comment

I hate to say this , but Obama is tacking to hard to the right and he is losing and demoralizing the left. His campaign is starting to resemble the failed campaigns of Dukakis, Gore and Kerry! It is an old cliche, but you don’t bring a knife to a gun fight, which Obama has done so far, you bring everything you have, including the kitchen sink. If he does not take the offensive soon, he will lose! The American voter, ignorant an brainwashed, responds positively to jingoism and negative campaigning. If Obama isn’t willing to take on McDunce, then he will lose. Remember the voters gave us eight years of Bush, so what’s four years of McDunce.

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By voice of truth, August 21, 2008 at 9:33 am Link to this comment

BO is “moving away from his base”?  Duh, if he actually went out and said all the stuff he believes in, he’d get about 30 votes nationally.  It’s always been the case that what most of you on this site profess is generally discarded by the vast number of Americans (as is many ideas of the far right).

Face it, most Americans care more about Paris Hilton than any election.  That is why it is probably good for the country that this lame-o, Do Nothing Congress passed the lowest number of bills in history.  The less the government does to f-up everything the better we all are in the end.

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By Jeff29, August 21, 2008 at 9:29 am Link to this comment

P.T.—

If by Democratic base you mean the far left, there is a reason that the Democratic politicians move away.  There aren’t enough of them to win an election.  It’s kind of interesting that you have to pander to them to win the nomination, but have to move away to compete in the general election (hopefully this is not a surprise to anyone, it’s part of the election cycle)

My guess is that, as a whole, there probably aren’t enough democrats to win the election; thus the appeal to the ‘moderate’ republicans.

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By rowman, August 21, 2008 at 9:28 am Link to this comment

Re: Big B, August 21 at 4:58 am #

Your statement is the main reason people are getting turned off by him. “If he does not win, America is racist”. Pathetic!

Never mind the issues and god forbid we try to press for a better explanation of what “change” he is referring to and how he plans to do it. His “change” is shrouded in mystery and he is asking people to take a huge leap of faith without knowing what he really plans to do. He has changed his position so many times, people are confused and uncertain.

So do not blame race and do not accuse people of being racist. That is a democrat manufactured issue and a pathetic ploy for sympathy. If you want to put him in office because you feel sorry for him, that is your issue.

Many people are looking for strong leadership qualities and not some shrill playing the race card.

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By Dave in Big Pine, August 21, 2008 at 9:24 am Link to this comment

there is no way these polls are deserving of any serious merit. they are fixed, no doubt aabout it.
having said that, i agree with several of the commentors that Obama has done himself no favors by “changing” himself and moving further to the right. however, he is still not the bellicose, addle minded buffoon that McMoron is. now there is no doubt that both candidates, as are all candidates, are picked for us. and thus it really doesn’t matter much to the money men who is charge, as they own them both. But, i do not see how Obama’s shift to the right has made McSenile more popular and affected his move in “the polls.” the difference for us, in a superficial way, between the two men couldn’t be more striking. Obamas shift should in no way entice voters to consider McIdiot as a more attractive candidate. 
this is just the prelude to another stolen election. keep it close so the republicans can escape scrutiny when their boy pulls it out though he shouldn’t be anywhere close.

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By P. T., August 21, 2008 at 9:16 am Link to this comment

If Obama keeps running to the right and away from his base, they will not turn out to vote for him.  Strange how Republicans work to consolidate their base, but Democratic consultants advise their candidates to move away from their base.

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By voice of truth, August 21, 2008 at 9:14 am Link to this comment

what, and miss all the excitement of this board?

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By rowman, August 21, 2008 at 9:13 am Link to this comment

Re: ted tyson, August 21 at 5:52 am #

Yes. I must have overlooked it. Please cite the references and links to articles critical of democrats and the democratic party. And I am not refering to comments…

Far as I can tell, its 100% democrat party mouthpiece. Since the election anyway…

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By Jeff29, August 21, 2008 at 9:09 am Link to this comment

voice of truth—

You should make T-shirts.

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By linda selvia, August 21, 2008 at 9:04 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I am not happy with Obama’s wavering on issues that I thought he would be strong on.
As a critical voter who looks at leadership styles as well as issues, I would have to put Obama ahead of McCain.
Obama’s presidency won’t just be about him.It will be about handling global warming,justice issues, the economy, health care and the Iraq war.
Obama for all his faults is not insular, arrogant, ideological, or indifferent to change.That is the critical difference for me.
There are no perfect candidates.There are just better or worse.Not an ideal choice , but a choice , none the less.

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adrienrain's avatar

By adrienrain, August 21, 2008 at 8:44 am Link to this comment

This election was his to win or lose and he’s bent on following the Democratic party down to another stupid defeat. I hear that most of the support he’s lost is from the left. Hmmmmm…....wonder why?

I WAS going to vote for him. I hoped we could vote our way out of this endless, bottomless, unwinnable landscape of wars our government has laid out before us. Obama seems to just want a different set of wars. And he’s not going to bring a just and even-handed approach to the Israel-Palestine issue either.

So why bother? If I can’t make my vote for peace heard at election time, then I will truly be throwing it away. One way or another, I’ve been throwing my vote away every time I entered a voting booth since 1968.

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By voice of truth, August 21, 2008 at 7:58 am Link to this comment

Obama’s slogan should actually be

Change.  It’s all you’ll have left in your pocket.

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By Cran Berry, August 21, 2008 at 7:31 am Link to this comment

The problem is not the polls. The problem is Obama, who began his run with a lot of hoopla about change and then did himself change, and change significantly, enough to turn away many who initially supported him. Like many of my friends, I was looking for someone who offered a sincere, honest addressing of the chaos wrought by Bush over the past eight years. Instead I found a man all too willing to bend and waiver at the slightest impulse, more concerned with the acquisition of power than fulfilling any promise of bringing change to Washington, D.C. Much of his rhetoric has proven empty, lacking substance. Once he got the nomination, I expected to hear him articulate detailed plans. He didn’t. I feel let down, and regret having given him my support. Unless I see him take a different path than the one he has chosen, I will not vote for him any more than I would ever vote for the republicans, the party which gave us this sorry mess.

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By Jeff29, August 21, 2008 at 7:29 am Link to this comment

ted—
The only flaw in rowman’s statement was that he should have used the word liberal instead of democrat.

It’s really funny to read the excuses of the Obamamaniacs—and you accuse Fox News of bias and spin?  C’mon folks, don’t give up yet, you still have 75 days to live the lie, err, I mean dream.

BTW Purple Girl, why don’t you check the stats on Wall Street and K Street political donations.  They definitely are biased, but not in the direction you suggest.

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By ted tyson, August 21, 2008 at 6:52 am Link to this comment

rowman—
      you must not read this site very often.  many of its contibutors are HIGHLY critical of democrats and the democratic party.  the site definitely has its bias, but to claim it’s a democratic party bias is not accurate.

                  sincerely,

                  ted tyson
                  milwaukee, wisconsin

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By DivaJean, August 21, 2008 at 6:14 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I just get so frustrated watching the Obama team basically roll over and take it. All the double speak coming from McCain’s team, all the lies drip-drabbed over the Internet and not called on, and the failure to keep his message and platforms clear.

What he needs to do is point out what a McCain America would like: further loss of personal rights, further spiral of the economy, escalating world conflict, etc. AND explain how he would dig us out of where we are now.

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By rowman, August 21, 2008 at 6:01 am Link to this comment

PurpleGirl,

Its ok to admit that Obama is down in the polls and there is no need to search for some way to spin the news.

On the Bias piece…  I think you ignore your own. Truthdig is one of the most bias political blogs on the internet. They don’t even make an attempt at being balanced. It’s pure 100% democrat party mouthpiece.

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By Big B, August 21, 2008 at 5:58 am Link to this comment

Barry’s biggest polling problem will not be realized until the day after the election. That will be when we find out how many Americans just could not find it within themselves to vote for a black man. I hope I’m wrong, but I think it will be enough of the dimmo blue collar base to swing this election to the dumbass Mcsame.

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By Purple Girl, August 21, 2008 at 4:49 am Link to this comment

There is no way to elimiate a Pollsters innate bias.
They chose where they stand,and which people they will approach.Not to mention all those who avoid them because they don’t ahve time, or don’;t think such questions are any of their business
Then add the sequence of the questions and the construction of the question.
also since most polls have about 12% not answering-‘undecided’, that leaves a huge gap in the validity of their numbers.
Also many polls are only asking Reg voters who have voted in the past…The number of new voters- which the Obama campaign has increased expotentially - has not been surveyed.
And of course the most obvious Flaw to these ‘Polls’ is who these Companies are surrogates for. Many are as biased as FOX News.So they send their ‘pollsters’ outside their front doors, right on to Wall street,K street??
Just because those who make a living off the slightest ‘change’ in numbers from week to week think they have any idea what real Americans are thinking, does NOT mean We do.
I not only question their methodology,and their results, but their motivations.
How many viewers would continue to watch all these “politcal"Shows (Op Eds), if it was discovered Obama had Mac by a land slide? Fewer viewers, means lost of advertising revenue. And god forbid what would happen to these Pollster co’s- back to the malls next to the kioskes asking about baby diapers and floor cleaners.

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