Thanks for this Greg.

Do you want me to drop a note to these VoteBoth folks, and tell them to go fly a kite? (It’s national kite month…or so they claim at Trader Joe’s).

Or, should I just tell them to drop dead? That’s exactly what would ‘mysteriously’ happen to Obama if he was ‘charitable’ enough to select Hillary as a running mate. And, I’m very clear that he’s not suicidal.

This is so obviously desperate on the part of HRC and her supporters. It’s not like he doesn’t have a large number of other folks to select from. What about Kucinich? What about John Edwards? What about Bill Richards. Then there’s Chis Dodd. I’d love to have Bernie Sanders, but it’s unlikely that he’ll desert the Vermonters. (I’ve always been jealous of them for having Bernie).

Or, how about a woman? (NOT HRC) The possibilities are endless. Why do these people insist that the Clinton’s live in OUR house again. They’ve got their own, and I don’t want either of them meddling in our business.

If you all want a female in the VP slot, then think up some possibilities, and send your suggestions to Barack Obama.

I love it!

Yes, racism is alive and well, and on display in Renee’s comment. (though admittedly she’s not the only one).

And of course you’ve pointed out how we can always tell a racist when we see or hear from one. What’s Michelle Obama got to do with this, and when did she ever say this was the first time in her life that she was happy? And what difference does it make how ‘black’ she is. And how does Renee think we ‘can tell’ that Michelle Obama thinks that America owes her something? I don’t get that impression at all. Why would somebody even suggest such a thing, and on this thread. (might be semi less noticeable on the race chasm thread)

Ah yes. Racism. So, let’s break this down for Renee in even simpler terms. The black population of the US has reached 13%. It’s reasonable to say that about 6% of that population actually votes. (unfortunately, the disproportionate rate of incarceration and economic disparities don’t bode well for high voter turnout among the black population).

That said, while it is TRUE that any candidate does need some support from the Black constituency that DOES vote, the vote of the African-American population simply does not have the political capitol that many are trying to give it. In other words, it may make the difference in a general election, but the black vote ALONE will not put Barack Obama in office, just like the black vote is NOT what has won him the nomination.

I don’t know of a single Latino that would consider voting for the guy who is building the walls at our borders, and there are a whole bunch of white folks that aren’t real happy about it either, since the construction of that wall is costing many of them their property, not to mention the rest of the taxpayers, not to mention the fact that it’s not gonna work for the intended purposes anyway.

Should I add Wyoming to the list of 99.9% white populations that have so far voted for Obama in the primaries?

Renee, I think you’re counting wrong.

Renee:

By your own logic you prove the irrational position of your argument.

If there are 73 percent white voters and 11 percent black voters, then how come Obama has received more than 50 percent of the votes in so many of the states he has won?

Do you think all the black folks rushed from State to State to make that happen? Well of course they didn’t, they can’t. Nor do they need to.

By the way, in the most recent primaries, Barack Obama won a resounding 14-point victory over Clinton in North Carolina, while losing by less than 2-points in Indiana. So are you saying there are more blacks in North Carolina than whites, and 2 percent less in Indiana? I don’t think so.

Maybe what you’re really saying is you have a problem with the reality a black man will be president of the United States. Seems once again we are reminded racism is alive and well in America.

Fortunately racists are a growing minority. [but I’ll bet most of them vote republican] If Obama has any ethnic group to worry about, it’s the Hispanics. But when the Lady in the pant-suit says it’s over, they’ll come to the side of Obama. The alternative, a certain John McCain, has made no secret about his position on that wall that keeps pain and division alive and well.

You must be happy with that too. I mean those Hispanics are sometimes a different shade, right?

Somebody asked me once to explain what poor white trash means. After some thought, I came to the conclusion it has nothing to do with the bank account, but everything to do with a personal lack of self-esteem.

Kinda sad. The whites who hate blacks are pretty much the same mindset as the blacks who hate whites, because they both walk around all day suffering from the weight of slavery.

Both need to get a grip. Hundred year old grudges can be a real drag on reality.

And speaking of reality, how about those western States like Idaho and Utah that Obama won with overwhelming majorities? Not a lot of black folks out there!

That’s how Hillary has been coming off to the public. After all of her negativity toward Obama, she thinks he would select her for a running mate speaks volumes of how out of touch she is with reality. Would anyone with a sound mind want to business partner with anyone who has stabbed them in the back so much, especially doing so publicly as Hillary has done ? Don’t think so. She has even hinted at being a possible McCain’s VP choice a few months back. Is she that desperate to be back in the White House no matter what side she is on? And I am certain, any newly elected president with Hillary behind them, either side, would meet up with some type of lethal outcome and then she would become the president and I am not the only one who believes it could happen is she were the VP.

Several months back Bill Clinton, in a hostile tone toward the Obama campaign declared that the White House was theirs. Oh, really? The white House is not their, at least not yet. They only believe it. Doesn’t make it true.

Hillary has shown her true colors, as the saying goes, and it’s not pretty. Very sad really, that she would do anything to attain this highly prized goal she is trying to claw her way into. And as for the war side of Hillary, she is no better than the current maniac administration. Last year she talked about her 2 terms of being president, as if she already had it(before the Obama uprising)and said she would keep troops in Iraq until at least 2013 and start to maybe withdraw some of them in her second term. Talk about lofty plans, no wonder she is still grabbing at the quickly slipping straws from her grasp. If she had an ounce of integrity, which she doesn’t, she would graciously step aside and stop all this underhanded mudslinging she is doing to her claimed political party. She is dragging it down into the quagmire known as the Republican Party. To even think Obama would choose her shows she had no class what so ever. Also, by making this type of statement shows that Hillary already knows she has lost her bid for the 1st prize, otherwise there would be no talk about being the possible VP selection.

If Obama is stupid enough to have Shillary as his VP, he won’t be long for this earth.

Shillary, take your sorry ass and your carpetbags back to New York state.

It’s not ‘Obama’s people’ who are trying to get her to quit, nor are they trying to ‘change the rules now’.

Rather, it is the Democratic Party, (and many of their leaders as well) not to mention the party loyal constituency who is calling for her to quit, because she’s become a liability for the party in general.

OK Viktoryia? You’re not from around here, are you?

You’ve said it here Louise:

•  “and once again I am reminded Hillary makes decisions based on advise from others, and not necessarily her constituents. Isn’t that exactly what she did when she voted to authorize Bush to bomb the babies?”

And yes, it DOES make us question the “experience thing.”

But, I admit that I remain conflicted as to how much of it really IS her gut, and her own ‘wisdom’ particularly because she has authorized that war and other aggressive actions long before she put together all of these campaign advisors.

So did she have a team ‘advising’ her on that, and on the Kyle-Lieberman Amendment, and on so much else that she’s done even before the campaign kicked in to expose it to the world? THAT (for me at least) is the real concern. Maybe she IS taking some really bad advice from her campaign, (instead of her constituents) but I admittedly remain doubtful about whether or not she actually believes in all of this stuff herself. I mean, the word has been out for some years now, that Hillary has never had a problem with her or ‘the’ decision to invade and occupy Iraq, but only that they should have sent MORE troops, and MORE or the war machine, to get this out of the way long before now. How far off from McCain is she there? In my opinion, she’s NOT.

So, it’s really more than the negative campaign, even though I admit that caught me by surprise. I think Hillary is very much into the war making ventures, and would be just as devoted to maintaining the occupation in the Middle East, and expanding it. She’s on record for this far too frequently, and it’s not that hard to interpret. I know it SEEMS like a long time since this campaign kicked off, and the run up to it even longer. But in reality, Hillary didn’t start coming around to the idea of withdrawing troops from Iraq until her campaign was upon her, which is why I never believed her to be the least bit sincere about actually following through with that anyway. And, I still don’t.

And yeah, we DO hate all of this negative stuff. At least Democrats do…real ones that is. I’m more than a little bit annoyed that these people (like the Clintons) have been passing themselves off as Democrats anyway. I put up with the Centrism from Bill, because he was at least a smart guy, and could communicate with the constituents, and I could occasionally go along with his program. (at least 50% of the time). I highly disapproved of his unilateral interference in the former Yugoslavia, but then…I would, just because that’s where my professional interest lies, so I’d be more inclined to examine that action with a finer-toothed comb. Still, for the most part, he DID display his own guts and wisdom, and thoughtfulness in making decisions, even when he was wrong. For her, there really IS something wrong with the electric circuit board. And that’s just so dangerous.

But, not to worry Louise. We’ll still get us a woman in there, sooner than you think. What’s the minimum age requirement again? Maybe I can start grooming my niece. She’s pretty smart.

Like I said before a, vote for Clinton is a vote for republicans.

and it’s no longer the presidency.  Bill Clinton was once touted as the best vote-counter politics had ever produced.  He knows this game—mathematically—better than most.  He knows it would take a deus ex machina to make Hillary the nominee. 

She wants to claim her consituency, name it, value it.  “These people are going to stand up for me, they are going to stick with me, until I let them go.”

Oh, yes.  There’s a lot going on that we don’t see.  Her staying in the race improves her value, further defines the constituency that Obama’s people ultimately have to have vote for him. 

Say what you will, but Barack is no fool; he’s not going to spit on the Clintons, he needs a coalition—those people whom, as Hillary hints, are just the type to vote for McCain than Obama.  “Okay, Barack, okay, superdelegates,” she is saying, “sure, he has the black vote, but I have the potential McCain voters….”

There’s a lot going on that we aren’t privy to.

I tend to agree with you. Unless Hillary knows something we don’t know, it’s over. Perhaps she’s counting on getting those Florida and Michigan votes, but I doubt that will make a significant difference.

At the end of the day, it all comes down to the superdelegates, which explains this call. If she decides to hang on till the convention, a lot of arm twisting can happen there. Personally I hope the superdelegates, seeing nothing of any good can be accomplished by extending this out until then, will finally stand up and pledge themselves to the guy who’s obviously ahead.

After all, when someone’s as concerned about “party unity” as many claim to be, the best way to start re-building is to all work on the same side.

Hillary has a ton of personal money invested in this. But she has allowed her campaign to be overtaken with just enough negativity to turn off democrats. Including superdelegates.

Seems to me someone with enough personal wealth to keep her campaign going, while at the same time signing off on negative campaigning, isn’t operating with all circuits open. One more reason to question that “experience” thing.

Bottom line: Democrats really hate negative campaigning. We’ve had a shit-load of that from the republican party. It just plain turns the stomach.

Superdelegates, elected delegates and the folks who show up to vote democrat hate it. I can not for the life of me understand why Hillary allowed that to happen! Unless she just plain does not understand democrats!

Then I look at this guy, Harold Ickes, and listen to what he has to say and once again I am reminded Hillary makes decisions based on advise from others, and not necessarily her constituents. Isn’t that exactly what she did when she voted to authorize Bush to bomb the babies?

I want a president who isn’t afraid to make decisions based on his own knowledge and wisdom and guts. Who isn’t afraid to give thoughtful attention to what his constituents have to say. Even has the guts to put constituents views ahead of the so-called advisers who always hang around, ready to influence, good or bad.

I wish we had a woman running for president who could point to her record and say, “That’s what I do!” But we don’t.

Maybe someday.

Hillary and her jewist backers would find some way to get rif of Obama if Hillary was VP.  Ala JFK.

Sounds like a lot of ‘damage control’ talk if ya ask me. As long as she remains VERY CLEAR on not wanting any VP spot, and as long as Obama is clearly aware that we aren’t HAVING Hillary as a VP, (so he doesn’t get carried away and suggest it), then she can play nice all she wants. (she doesn’t have much of a choice).

As a matter of fact, unless she cleans up her act after this loss, she might not even be able to maintain her relationship with the New Yorkers who have allowed her to be their Senator. Presumably, they’ll be a lot more forgiving of her than Californians will be of Pelosi, because I can say that HER days are certainly numbered. (at least as a Congressional Critter).