If lilmamzer typifies the average Israeli, then we can only hope those Palistinians improve their aim with those overblown unguided rockets.

I would like to see these zionist jews suffer as the Palistinians do on a day to day basis, sort of like David Duke waking up black one day.

We shouldn’t be giving AID to anyone over there, maybe some seed corn and a few tractors.

Indigenous does not mean primitive.

Every Israeli moralist justifies a holocaust.  Spy versus spy.  Israel was a terrible mistake.  Time to move to New York, but leave the skyscrapers alone.

Link for “lilmamzer’s” January 22 post - The Lessons of Violence http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/20080121_the_lessons_of_violence/

India Takes Israel Into Orbit - #By lilmamzer, January 23: “1 billion Hindus on your side who are sick of the Islamic fascist threat and the terror-enabling apologists who shill for them ...is a good thing…”

Well you might head out “for a masala dosa”, lilmamzer. It might be your last chance before the reality of the Russian-Indian version of the (Sukhoi)stealth Joint Strike Fighter co-operative venture dawns on you.

Ever since it was found out Israel sold US military secrets to China two years ago, they have become so desperate that they are now being suckered in at every turn, ha ha. Iran is in on this deal too…....

But, while you are pretending that the people who follow the Islamic Abrahamic faith are so “fascist” while those who follow the Jewish Abrahamic faith are not, let’s also look at what you posted on the other Israel/Palestine topic yesterday (and my reply):-

#why I post here - By lilmamzer, January 22: “we are GOD’S chosen people—hence all others are sub-human…”

Nice to know the REAL Jewish/Zionist ideology at last, thanks, lilmamzer. Exactly IDENTICAL to the NAZIS!!!

No doubt “all others are sub-human” also refers to the stupid fuckin’ Americans, black, white, whatever, who provide the US$ billions in aid to Israel every year and fawn over them in their pseudo-Christian churches.  LOL!!!

India Takes Israel Into Orbit - StrategyPage.com

January 23, 2008: The Indian Space Research Organization (ISRO) launched an Israeli spy satellite on January 21st.  This was the second commercial launch for ISRO, as they launched an Italian satellite last year. ISRO is a new player in this market, and has some pluses and minuses. ISRO launches cost about a third less than what anyone else charges. However, the ISRO rockets can only put lightweight birds into orbit. The Israeli Polaris satellite weighed 650 pounds. Because of rapid recent progress in electronics miniaturization, and more efficient solar panels and batteries, you can get a lot of spy satellite for 650 pounds.

Israel and India have been developing a growing cooperation in military affairs. Both nations are the targets of Islamic radicals, both nations also cooperate in the battle against Islamic terrorism, and both have booming economies. India has a Jewish minority that has been around for over two thousand years. Many of those Indian Jews have moved to Israel in the last half century. Israel can supply India with the latest military technology, as well as a partner for developing new military, and non-military tech.
====================

1 billion Hindus on your side who are sick of the Islamic fascist threat and the terror-enabling apologists who shill for them (TruthDig, that means you - especially Hedges) is a good thing.

I’m going out for a masala dosa, baby.

#Looks to me like Israel is engaged in genocide. By Louise, January 22: “What about that 3 to 5 billion in aid we send to Israel every year….... You mention Judea and Samaria. Nice to know you agree with me when I say the Nation State Israel stuck itself right in the middle of the land of Palestine….”

Israel makes enough to pay its own way - at a standard of living it deserves. Military aid is not economic aid except in that it employs more men in the military (same with Pakistan’s absurd 500,000-strong US-funded army).

What it really means is that they can afford their two nuclear reactors and their own WMD development program since the 1960’s at no extra effort!!!

If “3 to 5 billion in aid we send to Israel every year” is already too much, what are they going to do with the extra US$20 billion just promised to them???

That’s an awful lot of money for a nation of termites who have usurped 80-90% of the Palestinian land for themselves despite the fact that Judaism is only one of the three Abrahamic religions sharing Jerusalem and the region.

#Re: Israel—The Permanent Welfare Case - By Bubba, January 22: “I wonder how of much of the money they’ve been leeching off the U.S. has gone into their arms industry…”

Most of that has been in military aid recently but that’s interesting about their own arms industry. The worst thing is that (a) Israel sold military secrets to China in 2005, but (b) the USA has continued to increase military aid to Israel, regardless!!!

#By P. T., January 22: “The Zionist leeches make off with billions of U.S. tax dollars every year….”

No wonder it is “profitable” for them to run their AIPAC organization in the USA with all its nefarious activities, uhh.

#Re: Palestine Economy is a Shambles - By P. T., January 22: “They bully the indigenous Palestinian people and live off American and German handouts while doing it…”

But don’t think of Palestinians as some kind of primitive “indigene”, P.T.. They are Arabs - Moslem and Christian - an they are a race in common with the other Arabs of the M.East (and including Arab Jews, uhh!). With the resources as much as anyone else has, tey are capable of as sophisticated a standard of living as any….. http://poetryforpalestine.spaces.live.com/

Click http://www.normanfinkelstein.com/article.php?pg=3&ar=95

Of course the Zionists are bullies.  They bully the indigenous Palestinian people and live off American and German handouts while doing it.  Once in while, they bully the wrong guys, such as Hezbollah—a bad mistake.  Nobody bullies Hezbollah.

This type of bigot always manages to justify doing the wrong thing for the right reason.  The dice are always loaded and they’ve stacked the deck for every Palestinian.  Then they claim they are on a level playing field.  How contemptible.

The “Palestinian” Arabs would rather kill the Jews than improve their own lives and build their own state.

It all comes down to that.

It’s really their choice, so I say fuck ‘em all.

Gaza Delenda Est, the sooner the better.

Certainly not Israel’s fault.  Making Israel out to be a bully is nonsense.  Little tiny tiny tiny country the size of the County of San Bernadino and all the puntdits make it out to be a bully. Imagine.

Twenty-one Arab nations, plus Iran, have about the same population as the United States and Canada. Other than fossil fuels—mainly oil, of course—they export to the world less than Finland, a country of only 5 million people

Israel has vibrant modern country. Low unemployment. A growing economy, growing universities, arts and music on world class level.

Might the Pal’s copy them?  Thousandsof them worked in Israel for good wages until their incredibly wacko Hamas leaders bombed and attacked the crossover border locations. You know their goal:  Shiria law for all.

Palestinian per year per-capita income has contracted by about 40 percent since its US $2,000 peak in 1992 (before the Oslo process began) to less than $1,200 now.

Per-capita Israeli income, 10 times greater than the Palestinians’ in 1967 is now 23 times greater.
Deep poverty has increased in Gaza from 22 percent of the population in 1998 to nearly 35 percent in 2006; it would be about 67 percent if not for donations from the U.N. and food aid.

Direct foreign investment barely exists, while local capital mostly gets sent abroad or is invested in real estate or short-term trading.

The Palestinian Authority economy is largely based on monopolies in various industries granted by PA officials in exchange for kickbacks.

The PA’s payroll is so bloated that the cost of wages alone exceeds all revenues.

A dysfunctional judicial system in the PA means armed gangs usually decide commercial disputes.

A step in the right direction.

Nothing like a good killing zone.  Technology can never improve on that time honored tradition.

Most of the Israelis killed are terrorists—that is, people who are or have been in Israel’s military.

“Israel designs, develops, and builds her own indigenous Unmanned Aerial Vehicles and Remotely Piloted Vehicles, and has become a world leader in this technology, exporting to many other countries ... You might even want to buy one for yourself, eh?”
_______

No, personally I abhor killing. But you raise a valid issue.

What about that 3 to 5 billion in aid we send to Israel every year?

We send money to Israel. Israel uses money to build war stuff. Sells war stuff to nations we consider a threat to world stability and Israel, and nations that provide a huge hunk of the money we borrow to keep things going. Which we get and then we send money to Israel, which Israel uses to build war stuff to sell to nations we consider a threat to international stability, and nations that loan us operating capital. Then we send money to Israel ...

Meanwhile Pakistan gets lobbed by a missile delivered by a drone sent from India that was purchased from Israel. While we’re trying to keep a lid on the nuclear issue between India and Pakistan! Never mind the nukes Israel has ...

And there’s all those drones Israel sold to China.
What will they use them for and who have they sold them too?

Never mind, just borrow more from China so we can send more to Israel, so they can manufacture more arms with the money we send them, that we borrowed from China. Or India. Or Saudi Arabia, so they can buy or sell more arms.  And keep pretending someone actually is in control of this convoluted mess!

Meanwhile, we keep borrowing money and keep sending money to Israel and Israel keeps attacking Palestine and Palestine remains stoic in their determination to survive.

The fact that the civilians in Palestine have reframed from marching en mass on their bully neighbor Israel is a real credit to their self-restraint.

The fact that they are completely surrounded and controlled by Israel, but still suffer the horror of daily strikes indicates they are the victims.

The fact that some occasionally strike back indicates a need for self defense, and lord knows, nobody else is going to defend them!

They are in fact sitting ducks in the shooting gallery Israel has created.

But even so, many Israelis are as outraged at the deplorable situation in Gaza as the rest of the world. [except america]
http://www.uruknet.de/?p=m40319&hd;=&size=1&l=e

Webster defines genocide as: The deliberate and systematic destruction of an entire people who belong to one racial, political, cultural or religious group.

Looks to me like Israel is engaged in genocide.

You mention Judea and Samaria. Nice to know you agree with me when I say the Nation State Israel stuck itself right in the middle of the land of Palestine. 

But fear not.  Just as surely as the blind follow the blind, Palestinians in the West Bank will be targeted and destroyed in time. At least as long as time does not allow for recognition of Israel as the bully aggressor in the region.

Perhaps the IDF large scale operation to confiscate weapons from the Jewish residents of Judea and Samaria, is a precursor to an attack which will be used to justify IDF retaliation on Palestinians living in both Gaza and the West Bank.

Which in turn will bring the genocide to include all non-Israelis indiscriminately. Since Hamas has announced they will extend their attacks to the West Bank, that’s the only explanation that makes sense.

Unfortunately, we may never know if the coming battle was actually instigated by Hamas, Mossad or the IDF.
http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/terrorist.html

Now, the last thing in the world I want to do is put a crack in your closed mind, so I don’t expect you will look at this, but for those with open minds who want to know, you may want to check this out.
http://www.ifamericansknew.org/

Let’s hope those UAVs can deliver lots more ordnance in the days ahead and nail those asswipes where they live, work, and sleep.

GO IDF!!!!!!

By the way, when was the last time Amy Goodman ever did a story about the hardships of daily life in Sderot where the “Palestinian” Arab rockets fall every day? To the wingnut far-left terror-supporting crowd, of which Amy Goodman is the High Priestess, Jewish suffering at the hands of those Arabs who try to murder them isn’t even newsworthy. What complete bitch she is.

I wonder how of much

I wonder how of much of the money they’ve been leeching off the U.S. has gone into their arms industry?

Yonatan Shapira, Former Captain in the Israeli Air Force and Black Hawk pilot squadron. In 2003 he authored “The Pilots’ Letter,” refusing to participate in attacks in the Occupied Palestinian Territories.

“YONATAN SHAPIRA: You know, now they use more drones and unmanned planes to do these crimes. They don’t need anymore to convince the pilots to shoot in Gaza, although there are many attacks by attack helicopters like Apache and stuff like that. But I think that many of the missions are done by the commander, that he can sit far away in a closed room in a commander ship in Tel Aviv or something like that and just press a button, and people are getting killed. And this distance between the decision to the result is what I think in the history calls the most horrible crimes ever. And—”

“AMY GOODMAN: You’re saying that the drones release the missiles, the bombs.”

“YONATAN SHAPIRA: I don’t know in that specific case, but in many cases now and during the last years, they use drones, yeah. ... And Israel is selling these drones to other countries. It’s one of our top products in the military industry that is blooming in a way. You know, the occupation is not so bad for some people in my society and in your society. It’s actually benefiting many people.”

http://www.democracynow.org/2008/1/22/as_gaza_plunges_ into_darkness_israeli

I’ll bet on Israel as the bigger deadbeat, but I’m sure Gaza is in the running.  The truth is a little deeper than deadbeat status.  It is important to keep both countries tied in knots.  Otherwise it would be harder for crooks to steal.

I wonder how of much of the money they’ve been leeching off the U.S. has gone into their arms industry?

Yonatan Shapira, Former Captain in the Israeli Air Force and Black Hawk pilot squadron. In 2003 he authored “The Pilots’ Letter,” refusing to participate in attacks in the Occupied Palestinian Territories.

“YONATAN SHAPIRA: You know, now they use more drones and unmanned planes to do these crimes. They don’t need anymore to convince the pilots to shoot in Gaza, although there are many attacks by attack helicopters like Apache and stuff like that. But I think that many of the missions are done by the commander, that he can sit far away in a closed room in a commander ship in Tel Aviv or something like that and just press a button, and people are getting killed. And this distance between the decision to the result is what I think in the history calls the most horrible crimes ever. And—”

“AMY GOODMAN: You’re saying that the drones release the missiles, the bombs.”

“YONATAN SHAPIRA: I don’t know in that specific case, but in many cases now and during the last years, they use drones, yeah. ... And Israel is selling these drones to other countries. It’s one of our top products in the military industry that is blooming in a way. You know, the occupation is not so bad for some people in my society and in your society. It’s actually benefiting many people.”

http://www.democracynow.org/2008/1/22/as_gaza_plunges_into_darkness_israeli

The Zionist leeches make off with billions of U.S. tax dollars every year.  But don’t take my word for it, click http://www.usembassy.it/pdf/other/IB85066.pdf

Israel has been sucking the blood of U.S. taxpayers for more than 50 years.

The author of this article is appallingly ignorant.  Gaza remains under Israeli occupation (its airspace and seacoast are under Israeli control) as does all of the occupied territory.  Israel is in violation of international law banning collective punishment in occupied territory.

Its been on the world’s dole for at least 50 years, And its a 100 %  piece of welfare !!

Israel has sponged off U.S. and German generosity its whole sordid existance.

Louise, you write: Meanwhile, the genocide being conducted by that tiny Nation State that stuck itself right in the middle of the land of Palestine will continue.

The “Palestinian” Arab population is increasing in both Gaza and Judea and Samaria. So where’s your genocide?
=============

Louise, you write: <i>And where did they get that drone?<i>

Israel designs, develops, and builds her own indiginous Unmanned Aerial Vehicles (UAVs) and Remotely Piloted Vehicles (RPVs), and has become a world leader in this technology, exporting to many other countries. Check out IAI and Rafael’s websites. You might even want to buy one for yourself, eh?

By the way, what do you think of the thousands of Gazan Arab Qassam missiles they have targetted civilians in Israel with? How come you don’t mention that ongoing atrocity?

The Israeli government and the Likud have learned the arts of cruelty, betrayal and concentration camps from the best teachers in the world.  And, I used to think Jews were smart.  The crooks are in control, and the lazy cowards remain silent.

You don’t know anything about war.  But, you are certainly adept at lynchings.  Why don’t you just admit that you are a crook like everyone else?

Excellent comment!
Thanks

Meanwhile, the genocide being conducted by that tiny Nation State that stuck itself right in the middle of the land of Palestine will continue. Israel will happily consent to the pretense of caring, because now they have the drone!

That most efficient killing machine that can be sent off to deliver a bomb by remote control.

[And where did they get that drone?]

The Gaza “Blackout” and the Laws of War - J. Peter Pham

Although the so-called “Gaza blackout” was instigated by the Hamas terrorists who run the enclave as a sort of cynical publicity stunt, it has drawn the usual dire warnings of impending humanitarian crisis and protests from neighboring Arab countries and the EU. What tends to be forgotten in moments like this is that even if Israel, which supplies more than 75% of the terrorist enclave’s power, did cut off the flow, it would not only be morally but also legally justified in doing so.

As Prof. Michael Krauss of George Mason University Law School and I pointed out last year when Gaza was designated “hostile territory” by the Israeli cabinet: If Gaza is territory under the control of the enemy - as it manifestly is under Hamas - then the Israeli government is both within its rights and arguably obliged by its responsibilities to its citizens to treat the strip as “hostile territory.”

Siege and blockade of a hostile territory is a legitimate tactic of war, used in declared and undeclared (e.g., Cuban) conflicts and explicitly recognized by the 1949 Geneva Conventions. The Conventions’ sole limitation is that there be “free passage of all consignments of food-stuffs, clothing and tonics intended for children under fifteen, expectant mothers, and maternity cases” (Fourth Convention, art. 23).

Even this exception was conditioned on there being “no reasons for fearing… that a definite advantage may accrue to the military efforts or economy of the enemy” (for example, if resources destined for humanitarian aid will be commandeered by the enemy). Israel has carefully respected this requirement.

Notwithstanding the outraged howls from the external enablers of Hamas, there is no basis in international humanitarian law for claiming any belligerent is obliged to supply energy to territory occupied by the enemy, conventional or otherwise.

The writer is director of the Nelson Institute for International and Public Affairs at James Madison University and an adjunct fellow at the Foundation for the Defense of Democracies.

Once this nonsense about a humanitarian crisis is over.  A mild disruption of fuel and electritiy for 24 hours is quite tolerable compared to military options which can be put back on the table.

Now can the Gazans now start on their own to have an economic, social, educational, industrial, political, freedom, universities, sanitation, hospitals of quality and all the other things that country’s create. Israel will even help them.

What are the chances the Gazans will turn in the right direction?  Lot of nations will flood them with monies to help things going. What are the Gazans waiting for ? They can’t stay on world’s dole forever. Forward I say.

Where to start…, what to talk about…?  The crippling electricity shortages, affecting hospitals as well as civilians?  The air strikes & on-going, daily bombings by the Israeli army, their indiscriminate targeting of civilians and police stations…?  Israel’s non-accidental, enforced starvation of 1.5 million people by closing off ALL borders and not allowing in even UN aid, let alone basic medicinal, food, and construction needs…?
Shortages of fuel have re-surfaced in Gaza: most of Gaza has no electricity and even more importantly, the shortage of medicine in Palestinian hospitals continues to increase, with the Ministry of Health reporting a looming humanitarian catastrophe.
Or should I begin with the bomb which just hit a wedding close to the Ministry of Interior building in Gaza City, with 15 apartment buildings within the bomb’s target range?  One woman was killed and 47 others were injured –mostly children and women who had been inside their homes or playing on the street!!  Scenes of children injured, bleeding and crying just moments after they had been enjoying a wedding celebration in a Gaza wedding hall…a horrific sight likely to go without mention of that in most news sources.
Photos at: Rafah Today

WARNING:  The vivid pictures on this site are not for the faint hearted.  These are the sights that need to be shown on CNN and FOX, but will never see the light of day on those state-sponsored disinformation outlets.

Instead, viewers will get constant updates on what they are calling the U.S. presidential race as if it’s some type of sporting contest.

When not treating what’s left of American democracy like it was a horse race, viewers will get distracted by the FOX/CNN gruesome murder/rape/kidnapping of the week, with a running commentary that will delve into trivia and minutiae of the crime.
Reported in the sleazy tabliod style of “reporting” exemplified by the likes of the National Enquirer.
All to keep the zombiefied viewers entranced with what they call “news.” 

Is the GRUESOME murder/rape/kidnapping of the week news?  Of course, on a local level.

The U.S. has, on any given year, over FIVE MILLION violent crimes.  To take any one of these localized crimes and blow it up into a national news story is disingenuous.
This type of “news” does nothing to educate the quivering masses on issues that really affect them, like having American kids fighting and dying for Israel or the nation’s economy imploding.

Or the ongoing American funded, Israeli mandated ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians thru genocide

Offence is the Best Form of Defence - By A Khokar, January 22: “War is fought between two opposing armed conventional forces…”

Survival of Palestine on your terms is not viable, AK, simply because two thirds of the population have already fled decades ago. You really do live in some Asian medieval past, uhh.

But then, ” Returning the aggression in equal coins”  is the only option a shallow old fool like you could possibly see. That is exactly why Pakistan is such a mess. People like you are a guarantee of foreign manipulation and consequent chaotic destruction.

In reality, both Lebanon and Palestine are under Israeli oppression. One is under siege - or threat of seige - while the other has had most of its lands usurped or stolen from beneath its feet. Israel WAS only a part of Palestine and will always BE no more than a part of Palestine.

We know that it is easy to “bog” tanks and armor in any kind of warfare nowadays. They are vulnerable as never before. Even jet aircraft have become vulnerable at low altitudes. But so much for the rules of war.

You are only an engineeer, not a strategist. You have no understanding of THE ART OF WAR. It is painfully obvious in your thinking as well. Except in the most brutal of circumstances, war is not fought “between two opposing armed conventional forces”.

Rather, it is fought in policy, diplomacy, financial backing and other means of Machiavellian deception. Yet, despite all that and the covert backing by regional powers, none of these will ultimately avail the Palestinians in any way whatsoever.

Instead, the age-old saviour which the Chinese have so successfully returned to power with is their women and the increase of population by their efforts and sacrifices. An inexorable statistical march of numbers which will eventually overwhelm all opposition.

Thus it is women who will save the day and through democracy, not military means. A simple vote of the majority, in the end, will take control of their lands once again - sooner or later. That time is now fast approaching. The Jews know it and fear it.

Thus, the illusion of ‘Victory’ and ‘invincible forces’ is always eventually overturned. History (her story) has it that women rule in the end. Foolish males strut about until they destroy each other in wars. As womens’ agendas change, they re-assert themselves, their power and authority - and life goes on once again.

Offence is the Best Form of Defence; Survival of Palestine is not viable till Palestinian posses some real deterring means to ward off the oppression. Returning the aggression in equal coins is the only option. This world has to come forward to arm Palestinian. We know that in ‘Lebanon war’, Israel defence forces had no Lebanese Armed Force opposing them except a weak invisible civil resistance Hezbollah found in South Lebanon. Lebanon air space was also clear and void of any resistance.

Availing a very free hand, Israeli Air force was able to play havoc. They destroyed most of the civilian infrastructure; Airports, all major bridges, public buildings, link roads, ports, petrol pumps and other civilian facilities; what ever it could was smashed. In thousand people died, almost all the casualties were the civilian.

But an odd resistance, on the Lebanon boarder, forced the most power full, invincible ground force in the Middle East to remain bodged down for weeks. Israel well wishers did articulate some more time to mark it a success but it was in vain. Eventually Israeli Defence Forces returned bruised and bleeding under the safe cover of UN. A weak but resilient force of Hezbollah and their display of passion; has shown a new way to the tyrannized Arabs in particular and to all the resilient resistance movements around the world that nothing dares standing in the way of their will power and steadfastness.

The bruised Israeli after having destroyed any thing at will; kept on looking for a one single face saving ....word; ‘Victory’;  at least to turn the tide of humiliation away from her so called ‘invincible forces’: but it could not.

War is fought between two opposing armed conventional forces. Killing of civilian, smashing their houses, public facilities, and slaughtering them on flimsy pretext are a massacre, a cruelty and not a war.

This is time for soul searching for Israel— and a very deep soul searching… lest all the world may also start thinking again that European were right to kill the cruel Jews then!                                ———————————————-
Love for all, Hatred for none

By P. T., January 21: “Drunken Zionist Children Attack Native Palestinian Women…”

So much mere dialogue and only 30 secs at about 12.20min in of Israeli animals in their cage. All caged animals are dangerous http://www.iranian.com/Clips/2007/April/lion.html

For important information about this, click http://www.democracynow.org/2007/12/26/shooting_back_the_israeli_human_rights