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Ear to the Ground

Olmert Warns of Israel’s End If Two-State Solution Isn’t Found

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Posted on Nov 29, 2007
Olmert Bush Abbas
AP photo / Gerald Herbert

A bid for progress:  Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, President Bush and Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas strike a hopeful pose Wednesday in Annapolis, Md.

If Israeli and Palestinian officials can’t find a way to establish a Palestinian state, the state of Israel won’t survive, according to Israel’s Prime Minister Ehud Olmert.  These words of warning came on the heels of Olmert’s meeting with Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas and President Bush in Annapolis, Md., during which the three leaders laid out plans and set goals for formal peace talks.


BBC:

US President George W Bush called Annapolis, the first substantive Arab-Israeli peace talks in seven years, a “hopeful beginning” for Mid-East peace.

Mr Olmert said it was not the first time he had articulated his fears about the demographic threat to Israel as a Jewish state from a faster growing Palestinian population.

He made similar comments in 2003 when justifying the failed strategy of unilateral withdrawals from Israeli-occupied land which holds large Palestinian populations.

“If the day comes when the two-state solution collapses, and we face a South African-style struggle for equal voting rights, then, as soon as that happens, the State of Israel is finished,” Mr Olmert is quoted saying in Haaretz newspaper.

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By Howard, November 30, 2007 at 1:00 pm Link to this comment

#117105 by Tony Wicher on 11/30 at 11:32 am

Well, Tony W.

Israel is a Democracy !

Out of a population of nearly 7 million, about 1.4 million—- 20 per cent of the population—- are non-Jews (approximately 1.2 millon Muslims,  130,000 Christians and 100,000 Druze.

Arabs in Israel have equal voting rights; in fact, it is one the few places in the Middle East where Arab women may vote.  Arabs currently hold 9 seats in th 120-seat Knesset.  Arabs have held and hold currently various government posts ( which I can list, for sure).  An Arab is also a Supreme Court Justice.  In October of 2006, an Arab professor was named Vice President of Haifa University.

Arabic,like Hebrew is an official language in Israel.
In 2002, the Israeli Supreme Court ruled that the government cannot allocate land based on religion or ethnicity and may not prevent Arab citizens from living wherever they choose.

There are many Arab physicians and nurses in Israel.

If the more than 55 countries that make up the Organization of the Islamic Conference are entitled to recognition as Muslim states, and if the 22 members of the Arab League are universally accepted as Arab states, why should anyone balk at acknowledging Israel as the world’s lone Jewish state?

In fact, there are many countries in which national identity and religion are linked. Argentinian law mandates government support for the Roman Catholic faith. Queen Elizabeth II is the supreme governor of the Church of England. In the Himalayan kingdom of Bhutan, the constitution proclaims Buddhism the nation’s “spiritual heritage.” The prevailing religion in Greece,” declares Section II of the Greek Constitution, “is that of the Eastern Orthodox Church of Christ.”

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By Tony Wicher, November 30, 2007 at 12:32 pm Link to this comment

Re #117091 by Howard on 11/30 at 10:39 am
(247 comments total)

“Says you, “no Jewish state”.  Are not the 22 Arab states Islamic?”

Well, some are more Islamic than others. Iraq was secular under Saddam; he repressed the Islamists. Iran was secular under the Shah (Iran is not Arab, however). But you see, there can be no Islamic democracy as there can be no Jewish democracy. So when you say there are 22 Islamic states, why not 1 Jewish one, you are saying, “Why can’t Israel be a theocracy like they are”? You are saying that Israel should be allowed to be as undemocratic as they are. Well, I’m an American. I believe in democracy. I believe Israel should only be supported if it is a democracy. Right now it is not one, and should no more be supported by the U.S. than Saudi Arabia or the Sudan.

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By Tony Wicher, November 30, 2007 at 12:16 pm Link to this comment

Also, Howard, we cannot just “leave Israel alone”. Israel is an artificial country that only exists by virtue of vast U.S. military, economic and diplomatic support, and that is very bad for the United States. I think the U.S. SHOULD leave Israel alone, in the sense of withholding any further economic, military or diplomatic support, and voting against Israel and with the rest of the world in the United Nations, unless Israel agrees to give up Zionism for democracy.

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By Tony Wicher, November 30, 2007 at 12:08 pm Link to this comment

re #117091 by Howard on 11/30 at 10:39 am
(247 comments total)

“You’re dreaming like a you-no-what with your prediction of no Israel or Zionists in 20 years.

And your classification of Israel as an ‘abberation’ is erroneous.

More like a beacon in the night for all nations of the world.”
——————————————————————————-
Yes, Howard, I have the audacity to dream that Israel will some day be a country which is a true democracy, where Jews and non-Jews and all people will be truly equal. Such an Israel will be the true Zion and a beacon of light for the world. Right now Israel is leading the world to violence, war and destruction.

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By Howard, November 30, 2007 at 11:39 am Link to this comment

re:#117082 by Tony Wicher on 11/30 at 10:09 am
(417 comments total)

Tony W.  says:

Sorry, no Jewish state. We don’t need any Islamic states either. What we need is democracy. Israel has not been there for a few thousand years. It has been there since 1948, the blink of an eye in the history of the Jewish people. It is an aberration. In twenty years there will be no Israel and no Zionists.

=================================
========================


Says you, “no Jewish state”.  Are not the 22 Arab states Islamic? They have 800 times the land mass of Israel.  There is only one Jewish state.  I don’t think they need your ok to exist or stick around.


At least Israel is a democratic country. By any measure. After conquering the land in about 1250 B.C., Jews ruled it for more than 1,300 years and have maintained a continuous presence there for 3,300 years.

During the Jordanian occupation, Jewish holy sites were vandalized and were off limits to Jews.  Under Israeli rule, all Muslim and Christian holy sites are accessible to all faiths and maintained in good order at Israel’s expense.

You’re dreaming like a you-no-what with your prediction of no Israel or Zionists in 20 years.

And your classification of Israel as an ‘abberation’ is erroneous.

More like a beacon in the night for all nations of the world.

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By Tony Wicher, November 30, 2007 at 11:39 am Link to this comment

Re #117079 by 1drees on 11/30 at 10:00 am

1drees,

Although I agree with the point you make, I profoundly disagree with the way you make it. I like Howard. He is not a “liar”. He is saying what he really believes. Of course, I think he has been brainwashed by Zionist propaganda, and I have been trying to de-program him. But this is not the way to go about it. On the contrary, the way you talk to him will do nothing but entrench him more firmly in his position. Your post sounds hateful, whereas Howard is merely naive. As long as anti-Zionist people behave as you do, the conflict will continue, because every violent word or deed justifies the Zionist position. Listen to Desmond Tutu. In him there is no hate, there is no violence. You should apologize to Howard.

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By lastdaywatchers, November 30, 2007 at 11:26 am Link to this comment

The on source that has been correct about everthing happening in the Middle East with 100% accuracy is the May 15th Prophecy

Below is a small excerpt from the May 15th Prophecy declaration the Israeli - Palestinians “peace” deal

“Israel, Britain and the United States seeing their position weaken will sue for peace

The Vile Creature will soon amaze and flatter them about the 2 states of Palestine and Israel living side by side in peace symbolized by two holy sites living in harmony.

The Dome of the Rock for the Palestinians in Hebron, and a new Jewish Temple for Jews in Jerusalem

He will offer up his 2 of his facilitators Osama Ben Laden and Al-Zawahiri as proof of his commitment for peace

The Jews, Britain and the United States will be overwhelmed by the Vile creature proposal and will admire him and they will agree to attack anyone who speak against the new brotherhood of peace.

Last Day Watchers you will see before the 1st seal is open, the initial infestation of the placement of power through the Ummah by the spirit of iniquity emanating from Iran of those 3 nations it is allotted to uproot (Iraq, Lebanon and Syria)

Do a Google search of the May 15th Prophecy and you will see for your self

or go to
http://lastdaywatchers.blogspot.com/

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By Tony Wicher, November 30, 2007 at 11:17 am Link to this comment

In my last comment I should have said: in twenty years there will be no Jewish state and no Zionists. There will be a democratic country in the area now called “Israel” by Israelis and “Palestine” by Palestinians. What this country will be called will be up to the residents. I suggest they compromise on neither. My personal suggestion is “The Holy Land”.

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By Tony Wicher, November 30, 2007 at 11:09 am Link to this comment

Re #117066 by Howard on 11/30 at 9:16 am

Sorry, no Jewish state. We don’t need any Islamic states either. What we need is democracy. Israel has not been there for a few thousand years. It has been there since 1948, the blink of an eye in the history of the Jewish people. It is an aberration. In twenty years there will be no Israel and no Zionists.

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By 1drees, November 30, 2007 at 11:00 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Howard says :
“Little Israel can just be left alone. Been around for few thousand years.”

YET another compulsive LIAR at work here, “BEEN AROUND FOR thousands of years” IN YOUR IMANGINATION,

WAKE UP DUMMIES, GET RID OF YOUR ZIONIST BRAINWASH.

its never done you people any good.

BTW Israel does have more than 300 nukes and you people are dying to kill the neighbouring muslins so what’s stopping you,  you “chosen People” never shrunk from killing the palestinians why dont you proceed with the rest of your dream to annihilate the rest of the planet and find out what it actually means to do that.

ZIONISM is the way to DESTRUCTION OF JEWS, ALL SANE RABBIS AGREE TO THAT< ITS A SICKNESS OF POWER HUNGRY MINDS AND THE BRAINWASH BEING CARRIED ON FROM ONE GENERATION TO ANOTHER.

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By GW=MCHammered, November 30, 2007 at 10:36 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

If Bush can convince Israel of the Holiness of Capitol Hill, Israel can have it. Hell, it’s of no use to us.

Another mother’s breaking heart is taking over.
When the violence causes silence, we must be mistaken.
It’s the same old theme, in your head, they’re still fighting.
With their tanks and their bombs, and their bombs and their guns.
In your head, in your head, they are dying.
In your head. In your head.
Zombie! Zombie! Zombie!

(bastardized cranberries lyrics)

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By Tony Wicher, November 30, 2007 at 10:30 am Link to this comment

Re #116913 by P. T. on 11/29 at 4:51 pm

Thanks for this link. I find the speech by Desmond Tutu even more inspiring. Long live the Bish!!!

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By Howard, November 30, 2007 at 10:16 am Link to this comment

Why no Jewish state? No one needs a 23rd Arab islamic state.  Jordan is 87% Palestinian already.
Little Israel can just be left alone. Been around for few thousand years.

Give ‘em a break, already.

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By Yani, November 30, 2007 at 9:57 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I notice this phenomenon among commenter’s where some cherry pick comments and repeatedly quote them. It often skews the context in which they are written as seemingly intended by the offender. Is this what some of you have resorted to? An uneducated attempt to alter the author’s words or intent?

Not to pick on you Non Credo, you are just the most prevalent offender on this thread. I find cyrena far more offending along with Ernesto and some others in your hate bash clique.

Try a little originality every now and then. Dazzle me with your brilliance; don’t try to baffle me with your meaningless banter. 

Cheers

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By Tony Wicher, November 30, 2007 at 9:52 am Link to this comment

“Olmert warns of ‘end of Israel’ 

Mr Bush wants a Middle East peace deal by the end of 2008
Israel’s Prime Minister Ehud Olmert has said failure to negotiate a two-state solution with the Palestinians would spell the end of the State of Israel.
He warned of a “South African-style struggle” which Israel would lose if a Palestinian state was not established…

Mr Olmert said it was not the first time he had articulated his fears about the demographic threat to Israel as a Jewish state from a faster growing Palestinian population.

He made similar comments in 2003 when justifying the failed strategy of unilateral withdrawals from Israeli-occupied land which holds large Palestinian populations.

“If the day comes when the two-state solution collapses, and we face a South African-style struggle for equal voting rights, then, as soon as that happens, the State of Israel is finished,” Mr Olmert is quoted saying in Haaretz newspaper”
——————————————————————————-
YES!!!!!!!!!! That is exactly what is needed in Israel/Palestine: a “South African-style struggle for equal voting rights”. Precisely. It will mean the end of the state of Israel as a Jewish state. It will NOT mean the death of one single Israeli, or that a single Israeli will have to leave the country; what it will mean is the transformation of Israel from a Jewish state to a real democracy, just as South Africa was transformed. THERE IS NO OTHER WAY. This can be done, if Israelis make up their mind to do it. They can negotiate their way to peace and democracy as the Afrikaners did. There should be no Jewish state, no Palestinian state. Democracy is the one and only answer.

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By 1drees, November 30, 2007 at 9:33 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

This is just another case of the WOLF bleating like a sheep trying to throw people off course by pleading innocence which the WORLD hardly believes at all any longer.
Israel the agressor since the last 60 years who has always been up for the kill using the latest and the best American Hardware now ONCE AGAIN wants to exhibit itself as the “perpetual Innocent”.
As always showing themselves as the Innocent people under attack the Israelis forget to mention their 300+ nukes which are soon to mounted on t65he German manufactured Nuclear Submarines to further threaten the world.
Also If this was a Free and Fair Negotiation ( which Israel would never ever do, owing to their Zionist Nature) then maybe this might have been fruitful in achieving anything BUT AS USUAL Americans have chosen to invite only the people who they please ( not taking into account who needs to be called to the table eg maybe the DEMOCRATICALLY ELECTED GOVT OF HAMAS since 5the ZIONISt master do dictate America really strictly) So basically I do not really see the point of this FARCE meeting and only the NAIVE can think of it as being any other thing except a show.

Another Angle to the whole situation is that if there was a meeting to improve my house and I was told specifically to stay away from the meeting I do not think that the results would be great, same is the case of straying away from HAMAS, it is only and only Israel’s fault that HAMAS has WON, Had the Israelis ever been a little GENTLE or NICE or HUMANE maybe the Palestinains might never have Elected HAMAS BUT as usual Israelis believing in might is right managed to worsen the situations and by fixing this meeting through their American slave GWB sans HAMAS, the ELectyed power, they are making things worse for the next comming years and THAT IS WHAT I CALL PROGRESS.

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By QuyTran, November 30, 2007 at 9:22 am Link to this comment

Before talking peace destroy all NUCLEAR ARSENALS.

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By mythbreaker, November 30, 2007 at 9:16 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Welcome to Israel

A political state by day, a religious state for tax purposes, an extradition-free refuge for its citizens who commit crimes elsewhere, but always, the exhausting, manipulating and misunderstood victim that demands to be treated as the exception and always at the expense of others. Nice legacy

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By Rhonda, November 30, 2007 at 9:16 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Here we go again with Olmert predicting the total destruction of Israel…..If he sees the 2 state solution as so very essential, why doesn´t he try harder rather than refuse to discuss any substantive issues?  As occupier of Palestine why does he continue to oppress the people so terribly, when he is supposed to provide support?  Why won´t he acknowledge the Arab League plan that has been offered for five years?

There is something wierd in the Israeli mental that continues to see Jews as victims.  The real victims are the Palestinians, and I see that Olmert still wants their total and complete submission to Israel or annihilation.  And this from the Jews persecuted so horribly in WWII?

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By Howard, November 30, 2007 at 8:41 am Link to this comment

They would like security first and foremost. And that is a most reasonable goal. First base. For sure.

I do not believe Abbas can deliver that yet. Hope we are all surprised.

In agreeing to move toward a permanent status agreement with the Palestinians, Israeli negotiators have left the Jewish state between a rock and hard place. On the one hand, they must attempt to build momentum in the peace process. At the same time, they must brace for a series of terror attacks and attempts to sabotage the peace process.

And what has happened in ‘peace’ talks like this in the past? Whether the American administration is Republican or Democrat, it pressures Israel for concessions — since the Arabs won’t make any.  Prisoner releases precede each summit; territorial handovers come under discussion.

Arab leaders and their representatives assume we are all sufficiently honored if they just show up. We hear no end of nonsense about the great political risks they’re taking,etc.  We’re suckers for any fat guy in a white robe with an oil can.

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By Howard, November 30, 2007 at 7:40 am Link to this comment

Israelis want peace more than their neighbors. That’s for sure.  Hard to do though when rockets arriving daily from Gaza.

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By Jaded Prole, November 30, 2007 at 4:54 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

So, by “Israel” Olmert means an ethnically pure Jewish state. It seems his plan would be to assign an area that can be called Palestine in which all Palestinians (including those who are Israeli citizens at present) will have to live. If that is his intent, than it would be best if these talks collapse. A one state solution is far better that apartheid and a bantustan.

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By 13 Martyrs, November 30, 2007 at 4:18 am Link to this comment

The good news is that it looks like Israel and Syria are finally going to sit down and talk about the Golan Heights next year. Good move on Israel’s part. They will certainly move quicker with Syria to come to an agreement with just this one issue, but the Israeli government is too weak now to follow through with developing a strong peace plan and statehood for the Palestinians.
13 Martyrs at http://13martyrs.blogspot.com/

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By cyrena, November 30, 2007 at 2:18 am Link to this comment

•  …..US President George W Bush called Annapolis, the first substantive Arab-Israeli peace talks in seven years, a “hopeful beginning” for Mid-East peace….

But Georgie….isn’t this because YOU said YOUSELF…at LEAST seven years ago, that this wasn’t a priority AT ALL? Georgie, didn’t you make it ABUDANTLY CLEAR, that the only ‘two-state’ solution would be a ONE-state solution, as in ISREAL takes ALL, with NO PALESTINIANS anywhere in the area?

And, if memory serves me, the ONLY thing you’ve ever said about ANY of this –georgie boy- like when Israel was carpet bombing Lebanon, or building their apartheid wall, or starving Garza, or bulldozing the West Bank, was that “Israel had a right to ‘defend’ itself”. That’s all I can ever remember hearing you say georgie boy.

And now Olmert comes along and claims that unless there can be a ‘2-state’ solution, Israel (as a JEWISH state) won’t survive. Well, HE might think of that as a ‘warning’, but others might see it as PROMISE, (though not likely to be fulfilled, seeing as how Israel as a JEWISH state wouldn’t have survived this long if we taxpaying Americans hadn’t been handing over billions of our own dollars).
So Olmert, is this another THREAT, or another lying PROMISE?

And, what took you and georgie so long to figure this out?

If a ‘two-state solution’ collapses? Oh PLEASE!!!

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By Douglas Chalmers, November 30, 2007 at 12:25 am Link to this comment

“...the demographic threat to Israel as a Jewish state from a faster growing Palestinian population….”

How these unwanted European migrants can manage to see the birth of children as a “threat” takes us right back to the days of the evil king Herod and his extermination of all ‘newborn’ (or under one year-old?) Jewish boys in a desperate attempt to eliminate a new messiah as a “threat” to his rule.

What is different today? The Jews are still moaning about waitng for a messiah who will now NEVER come. They didn’t want the last one - so they won’t get another! Are they going to go out into the villages now and murder all the children??? They have managed to kill quite a few already - see “children of Palestine” http://poetryforpalestine.spaces.live.com/

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By 1drees, November 30, 2007 at 12:14 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Its just another Typically Zionistic speech to the world by Olmert, I mean Zionist speeches to Zionists are way different they go like “we own America and Americans know it” and another went like “any representative that dares to oppose Israel will be run out of office and that will certainly be his last ever term in office”,
So this speech is just another Zionist ploy to exhibit themselves are HUMANS under threat, whereas the actual truth is that its the WORLD under threat by the ZIONIST who have this weird fascination with DOMINATING the whole world and not just a couple of WESTERN countries.
Its just Typically Zionistic LIE and nothing Else, through all of my contacts with them All I ever got from ZIONISTS was “oh we are under a severe threat and that’s coz we are too good” and I cant believe that most people would go out of their way just to hurt a nice guy.
I have even heard the same kind of “under severe threat” from people who claim to have nothing to do with ZIONISM but yet in a discourse they will repeat the firm beliefs in keeping Israel alive by threat and force and then such similar perceptions which would indicate these ZIONIST people as the last lambs on Earth.
I hardly think that ISRAEL was ever under any threat, GIVEN their undeclared Nuclear Arsenal of at least 300 Nukes which are soon to mounted into the German Nuclear Submarines they recently ordered and then with the Unconditional American Support which provides any required Weapons, Vetos or Intelligence to the Israelis on top priority although there have been may Israeli spy rings busted in US and then Israel has been transferring the weapons technologies to other countries which it decides on its own. Another weird incidence of American allegiance to the ZIOIST lobby was th4e covering up of the Attack on USS LIBERTY and not just that but in the initial hours USA wanted to NUKE CAIRO for that.
So maybe what Olmert means by saying that its END of Israel; is that if EQUAL VOTING RIGHTS become a common IDEA then the “god’s chosen people” crap would be obsolete or finished and maybe he just wants that SUPERIORITY to live on in the future ZIONISTIC generations.
And just recently they CLEANED Youtube of all videos that were detrimental to their Zioistic/Israeli cause So as far as i see it its everyone BUT THE ZIONISTS that are under threat but the wolf bleats like a sheep.
BOYCOTT EVRYTHING ISREAL & ZIONIST
To give HUMANITY A FIGHTING CHANCE TO LIVE FREELY.
BOYCOTT EVERYTHING ISRAELI & ZIONIST.
AND kind of IGNORE the Ministry of propaganda people who are forced to tell lies about the greatness and normalness of ISRAEL, its just that they been taught to LIE like hell and they are just doing what MAMA told them to

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By thomas billis, November 29, 2007 at 10:55 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

What is Olmert trying to do?To make a statement like that gives anyone in the middle east who does not want Israel to succeed more incentive to kill the peace process.I do not think Annapolis has a chance in hell of succeeding but it looks like Olmert wants to guarantee that failure.

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By PatrickHenry, November 29, 2007 at 7:17 pm Link to this comment

He is only facing the inevitable tsunami of world opinion.

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By troublesum, November 29, 2007 at 6:25 pm Link to this comment

Only in the US could Olmert make a statement like that and expect to be believed.  He probably believes that it is still a secret that Isreal has nuclear weapons.

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By P. T., November 29, 2007 at 5:51 pm Link to this comment

Noam Chomsky exposes the Annapolis hoax.  Click http://www.democracynow.org/2007/11/27/not_through_annapolis_noam_chomsky_says

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