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Ear to the Ground

Bush Cronies Defend Torture

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Posted on Oct 31, 2007

CIA Chief Michael Hayden has issued a passionate defense of extraordinary rendition, claiming that the practice, which so often involves abduction and torture, is justified by the “irreplaceable” intelligence it produces. Meanwhile, President Bush’s preferred successor to loyal henchman Alberto Gonzales refuses to call torture by its name, though he claims to find it “repugnant.”

BBC:

[Attorney General] nominee Michael Mukasey condemned one technique, water-boarding, as “repugnant” and possibly “over the line,” but declined to explicitly rule it out as torture, saying he could not speculate on classified procedures.

Water-boarding simulates drowning by immobilizing a prisoner with his head lower than his feet and pouring water over his face.

Leading Democrats in the Senate have threatened to block Mr Mukasey’s confirmation if he does not explicitly rule out water-boarding as illegal.

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By rowdy, November 1, 2007 at 10:14 am #
(300 comments total)

ryan f

you shouldn’t be reading articles on this site. it might do damage to your brain. if you have one.

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By G.Anderson, October 31, 2007 at 10:01 pm #
(249 comments total)

I wonder if Jesus would think that torture is ok?

I’d like to see them plead their case for torture to St. Peter.

Turns out, that the only thing they really believe in is power, power and more power.

Yet look at what they have done with the power they have got already?

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By mike didj, October 31, 2007 at 8:47 pm #
(Unregistered commenter)

Sounds like the authorities will be using the water boarding interrogation technique on Prince Harry and his friends concerning the shooting of 2 extremely rare birds of prey on his estate in England. Story can be found at <http://bardosurfer.blogspot.com>

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By Pablo, October 31, 2007 at 12:35 pm #
(18 comments total)

The CIA chief should take his whole family waterboarding next holiday.

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By vet240, October 31, 2007 at 11:40 am #
(188 comments total)

Listed alphabetically, Germany post-revolution (1934), Japan (1931), Italy (1929), Russia post-revolution (1917)and finally America (2000).

What do they all have in common?

They all had allowed leaders to come into power that saw no reason to consider the opinions of others in the world community, They all decided to ignore basic human rights (habeas corpus), they all saw the need for centralized control of the masses including what the masses were talking about (Patriot Act) and they all found torture to be expedient to their cause or percieved threats.

All those mentioned ultimately ended in catastrophic failure except for America. How long do you think we will be the exception?

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By Eric L Prentis, October 31, 2007 at 9:41 am #
(Unregistered commenter)

Why do President Bush, VP Cheney and Republican party members think that waterboarding and other physically painful torture techniques are OK? (such as stripping the clothes from prisoners and holding them in frigid temperatures, making prisoners stand in painful positions for long periods of time, physically beating prisoners about the head and sleep deprivation of prisoners for very long periods of time). All of these torture techniques were called the “third degree” by the Gestapo and many of their agents on film have been known to say, “We have ways to make you talk,” which made everyone in the US audience hate them and what the fascist Nazis stood for.  The torture of prisoners is counter productive, like much of the Bush Administration, it did not help the Nazis or Stalin win and the torture of prisoners will not help the US win either. It is time again to become a civilized country, throw the tortures out.

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By kevin99999, October 31, 2007 at 9:24 am #
(Unregistered commenter)

Yes, I saw his interview with the right wing psycophant Charlie Rose and had the microphone all to himself on this topic. Charlie Rose was busy shaking his head in agreement.

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By Ryan F, October 31, 2007 at 9:10 am #
(Unregistered commenter)

The only problem for me with America and torture is that they’re being hypocritical. If they’re going to try to publicize a moral highground that doesn’t exist, then they need to stop torturing. But I for one don’t have a problem with using the techniques they use in order to gain information.  It’s not like you can just play nice with suspected terrorists and enemy combatants.  They’re not going to be open and honest with our military, so in order to save lives we need to do whatever we can.  It’s a matter of economics: if you can save more lives by using waterboarding and aural assault/light deprivation, then by all means do it.  War is ugly and the methods we are using are a lot better than the enemy, that’s for sure.  In a perfect world, we wouldn’t have to use such methods, but in a perfect world we wouldn’t have the need to use them.

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By mary, October 31, 2007 at 8:29 am #
(197 comments total)

At what point does an American Citizen become more loyal to his boss and the lies than to his country and the truth.  Hold up this nomination--for the country.  We haven’t had an Attorney General for almost 8 years, we surely can do better.......

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By writeon, October 31, 2007 at 6:57 am #
(Unregistered commenter)

Well, here we go again. This issue of what exactly constitutes torture keeps coming back to haunt the Bush administration. When the Republicans, or maybe we should rename them the Republicnots, claim that the Democrats are just “playing politics” about this issue, the Demomcrats should counter agressively by stating than on the contrary, they are not “playing” anything, this is “real politics” about concrete, real-world subjects, like should a democracy be resorting to the use of water torture on terrorist suspects?

And the fact that these victims are still only suspects is of vital importance. Are we to condone the use of torture on men who haven’t been charged or even tried and are therefore still innocent?

Leaving aside the massive moral and legal implications of using torture, there’s also the question of can a functioning democracy really use torture in a systematic and routine manner and still remain a democracy?

Then, if one’s tired of morality and human-rights, there’s the question of efficacy, does torture even work? What’s the real, hard, evidence that imposing massive and life-threatening physical pain, get’s results?

That stupid programme “24” sets up ridiculous scenarios to justify torture, but the real world is of course far more complicated. Torture is the fascists short-cut to making the world simple and even managable, but it’s an illusion and a very dangerous one.

Let’s have an open debate by a senate commitee into whether there’s any real evidence that torture works and get this whole dirty subject out into the open! Let’s drag the torture chamber, and the methods used, and the men who applied torture, and the victims of torture, out into the sunlight and examine this whole rationally for a change!

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By Douglas Chalmers, October 31, 2007 at 6:03 am #
(2932 comments total)

George Bush’s nominee for US attorney general - “here come de judge, here come de judge”, uhh.

Well, we must have “irreplaceable” intelligence just like we must have “the war on terror” and the Joint Strike Fighter pie-in-the-sky development project as we once had ‘Star Wars’ and the like. These are the supreme imperatives of a losing nation...... designed to produce jobs for the military-industrial complex - even if they can no longer create the world’s best aircraft. Wars must go on!?!?

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By thomas billis, October 31, 2007 at 4:07 am #
(Unregistered commenter)

I am not in favor of torture.Irreplaceable intelligence over losing the hearts and minds of over 1 billion moslems.Moreover all this spooky we cannot tell you what we learned but trust us it is really valuable.Outing a covert CIA operative for purely no political reasons no problem.But to give one example of how something so repugnant to the American people benefits them that is classified.If it was not so sad it would comical.Mark my words if we are hit again it will be because we did not torture enough and the Democrats will go right along with it.Hillary will be leading the band.

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By rodney, October 31, 2007 at 3:49 am #
(Unregistered commenter)

Somebody has to take a stand George Bush should not be allow to continue to torture. The Congress must stop him. To redefine torture to suit their purpose goes against the Constitutions cruel and unusual punishment, and the Geneva Convention.George Bush is a man who believes that laws and rules apply only to other people and other countries. He has no morals or ethics. He believes that he can do whatever he wants to whomever he wants.Whether it’s starting a illegal war,killing innocent people,giving billions of tax dollars to his friends,lying to the world and the American people and calling ,detaining and torturing anyone who doesn’t agree with him a terrorist. Bush is a mini-Hitler. The only thing that stops him from trying to become a full blown dictator is the fact that he would finally lose the few Republican lapdogs he has left and he would be impeached,jailed and tried for war crimes. Make no mistake about it,Bush is a madman and a war criminal. Unfortunately because of 9-11 America don’t have the stomach or guts to give Bush the same punishment that the Iraqi people gave Saddam. America is just waiting for the next election hoping that Bush would just hurry up and go away.

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