While it doesn’t alter my support of Dennis Kucinich, Senator Gravel’s historical account of how he got the Pentagon Papers into the Congressional Record, as told today on Democracy Now! is absolutely hilarious, and ought to be viewed by all.

http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=07/07/02/1331255

Ease off a bit there, Tyler.  You can disagree with another poster but there is no call to be rude.

You are partially correct.  There is no doubt that control of “oil” is “the” major motivating factor.  But along with that are the PNAC documents revealing that it is about acquiring a permanent base of operations from which the U.S. can extend its hegemony over the whole of the oil rich Middle East, a chance to extend neo-liberal privatization schemes to another nation, large amounts of money flowing to the coffers of the military-industrial complex, crony capitalism embodied in the no-bid contracts that had been handed to the likes of Bechtel, Halliburton and Blackwater—contracts that allow the hard right to further raid the national treasury so that they can turn around and say that there is no more money for health care and social security, “and” a chance to do Israel’s bidding.

There is no validity in insisting that the “cause” of the invasion must be simplistically boiled down to one word, be that word “oil” or “Israel.

Part 2
So, suffice to say that you have not broken this down, or made any other attempt to analyze it from any intellectual foundation, and you made that abundantly clear when you simply “dismissed” Nahida’s attempts to educate you, from a different perspective of an individual who has lived this, and I know you have NOT. You made that clear as well.

There have been multiple others of these types of occasions here in our great nation, and maybe if we look to the “causes” of some of those acts, we might find some similarities to the ones that take place in the Middle East. For instance, why did home grown American white boy, ex-Military, decided to blow up the Federal building in OKC? We still don’t really know, but it’s worth considering.

Here at home, we’ve had the KKK, (terrorists but not suicide ones). We’ve had the Unibomber, the Branch Davidians, (another weirdo religious group that ended up committing mass suicide in the course of a shoot out with the ATF…you should check them out. And, we’ve had more school mass-murder suicides than I even want to think about, and for all of this, we never needed one single Arab, not one single Palestinian, and not a single solitary Muslim.

So, check yourself. Check things out before you allow yourself to get so wrapped up in this sweeping Islamophobia, because in real time, right now…THEY are NOT your biggest enemy, nor can they come anywhere close to terrorizing you as much or as easily as you have already been terrorized by your very own religious fanatic…a psychologically handicapped president, who honestly believes that God speaks to him, and that it is his job to “battle” the “evils” of the Satanic Empire. The religious “movement” called the “end-times” Christian movement or something similar, is just about the scariest thing that ANY of us have seen in this country, for over a century. Seriously. I had no idea until recently, just how creepy it had become. They should be a far larger concern to you, than any guys in turbans, who don’t even make themselves fully available to the light. And, all of this war-mongering rhetoric that has brainwashed you via the corporate and cheney controlled media, has everybody scared of something that is almost like a wizard-of-oz model. It’s totally disgusting to see everybody running from an invisible boogy-man, just because cheney told you to “stay scared”, and because the Zionists are so neurotic, that they paint themselves into a corner as well. They’re like some of the old New York walk-ups, that would have 15 different locks on the same ONE doorway leading into the apartment. Keep the bad guys out.

On to some of your questions:

•  I respond: So are you saying that those that are killing troops (ex: escorting construction workers to do sewer repairs), are secularists?  Do you actually think that’s their interest? 
No, I’m saying that those who are targeting troops in convoys, (those who are carrying supplies – specifically OIL operation supplies) are the ones targeted. They aren’t targeting troops working on sewers, because our troops are not working on sewers. OK. They don’t HAVE anything like that. Our troops, as well as the 100,000 private “support” contractors, are there for one reason, and one reason only, and that is to secure that area, in order to reestablish the oil infrastructure, to get what we went there for in the first place. And, the insurgents who are SPECIFICALLY TARGETING our troops, are Iraqis, primarily Sunnis, (at least the ones who’ve been at it from the beginning) and yes my dear, their interests are VERY secular. It is NOT about Allah, and they are not fighting “jihad”, they are simply and very basically, resisting an occupation. You can try your very best, to make it more than that, but the bottom line is, they are doing the exact same thing to US, as I would do to you, them, or anybody else who came to MY house, and destroyed it, along with a huge portion of my family and neighbors.
to be continued

Part 2
.So, suffice to say that you have not broken this down, or made any other attempt to analyze it from any intellectual foundation, and you made that abundantly clear when you simply “dismissed” Nahida’s attempts to educate you, from a different perspective of an individual who has lived this, and I know you have NOT. You made that clear as well.

There have been multiple others of these types of occasions here in our great nation, and maybe if we look to the “causes” of some of those acts, we might find some similarities to the ones that take place in the Middle East. For instance, why did home grown American white boy, ex-Military, decided to blow up the Federal building in OKC? We still don’t really know, but it’s worth considering.

Here at home, we’ve had the KKK, (terrorists but not suicide ones). We’ve had the Unibomber, the Branch Davidians, (another weirdo religious group that ended up committing mass suicide in the course of a shoot out with the ATF…you should check them out. And, we’ve had more school mass-murder suicides than I even want to think about, and for all of this, we never needed one single Arab, not one single Palestinian, and not a single solitary Muslim.

So, check yourself. Check things out before you allow yourself to get so wrapped up in this sweeping Islamophobia, because in real time, right now…THEY are NOT your biggest enemy, nor can they come anywhere close to terrorizing you as much or as easily as you have already been terrorized by your very own religious fanatic…a psychologically handicapped president, who honestly believes that God speaks to him, and that it is his job to “battle” the “evils” of the Satanic Empire. The religious “movement” called the “end-times” Christian movement or something similar, is just about the scariest thing that ANY of us have seen in this country, for over a century. Seriously. I had no idea until recently, just how creepy it had become. They should be a far larger concern to you, than any guys in turbans, who don’t even make themselves fully available to the light. And, all of this war-mongering rhetoric that has brainwashed you via the corporate and cheney controlled media, has everybody scared of something that is almost like a wizard-of-oz model. It’s totally disgusting to see everybody running from an invisible boogy-man, just because cheney told you to “stay scared”, and because the Zionists are so neurotic, that they paint themselves into a corner as well. They’re like some of the old New York walk-ups, that would have 15 different locks on the same ONE doorway leading into the apartment. Keep the bad guys out.

On to some of your questions:

•  I respond: So are you saying that those that are killing troops (ex: escorting construction workers to do sewer repairs), are secularists?  Do you actually think that’s their interest? 
No, I’m saying that those who are targeting troops in convoys, (those who are carrying supplies – specifically OIL operation supplies) are the ones targeted. They aren’t targeting troops working on sewers, because our troops are not working on sewers. OK. They don’t HAVE anything like that. Our troops, as well as the 100,000 private “support” contractors, are there for one reason, and one reason only, and that is to secure that area, in order to reestablish the oil infrastructure, to get what we went there for in the first place. And, the insurgents who are SPECIFICALLY TARGETING our troops, are Iraqis, primarily Sunnis, (at least the ones who’ve been at it from the beginning) and yes my dear, their interests are VERY secular. It is NOT about Allah, and they are not fighting “jihad”, they are simply and very basically, resisting an occupation. You can try your very best, to make it more than that, but the bottom line is, they are doing the exact same thing to US, as I would do to you, them, or anybody else who came to MY house, and destroyed it, along with a huge portion of my family and neighbors.

Oh please….way too little and way too late for me to trust these unctious rascals again.

One interesting thing, though. The Democrats are putting all their little apples in the Iraq War barrel, opposing Bush while refusing to anger the military industrialists who profit so hugely from war and anguish. How easily the GOP could pull the rug out from under them and capture the ‘08 elections, how very, very easily….....war ends in the months preceeding the election….the Dems have nothing else and appear pretty stupid, which, by the by, they really are.

In the meantime a laundry list of important issues goes begging.

#82969 by Non Credo on 7/01 at 1:02 pm

Non Credo,

You are indeed a wise one. Seriously. You hit the nail on the head again.

I have seen these statements periodically; That it is far less expensive to maintain ‘Saudi Arabia like’ relations with despots than to invade a country, etc. The problem here is that a cost/benefit analysis only makes sense if the same agent incurs the costs as enjoys the benefits. Here, the American taxpayer incurs the costs and the oil companies (potentially) the benefit.

The imagined benefits might have included a way to break the OPEC grip on oil prices (see Greg Palast below). Certainly the costs of a massive insurgency was not anticipated by everyone.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/newsnight/4354269.stm

Palast does make a point which echoes Non Credo’s statement though. Seems big oil had little enthusiasm for privatisation and did favor a more controlled version of the Saudi-like relationship.

Tom Billis, neither Bloomberg nor the hype surrounding him impress me.  All the hype about this billionaire reminds me of a line from the song, “If I were a rich man” from the movie “Fiddler on the roof.” 

“When you’re rich, they think you really know.”

The probelm with all of that is that the Democrats don’t listen any better than the Republicans.

In order to lead you have to at least know what’s going on, there are few in either party who understand how bad things have gotten for us.

They look at the stock market and say to themselves, things really must be good. But for most people the stock market is a perfect inverse barometer of their lives, the higher it goes, the more destruction that will be wrought on the masses, by the corporate elite.

Sad to say, America is on the road to a military defeat in Iraq, then a pull out will instead become a grisly negotiation for hostages, and prisoners of war. I’ts doubtful in that case that our enemy will honor the Geneva convention, since we didn’t. 

That will be the end of both parties, and the beginning of something else.

The Democratic leadership is nonexistant. They lack the courage of their convictions. All talk no guts to do what is right for every American. Worthles congress means a beaten down America. Time to kick them all out of office.

GW, Great Post!

The Democrats control congress, and especially the Senate, by a razor thin margin. Lieberman is voting Republican, Tim Johnson is still recovering from his brain bleeding episode, and Cardinal Cheney can break a tie. Overriding a veto is basically out of the question. They can subpoena, they can force symbolic votes, they can make life difficult for this administration; But in the end, they don’t have that much power. Look at how effectively the administration stonewalls in the DOJ case.

Single payer health plan? Uh, I don’t think so. Wonderful idea, but it’s just not within reach, politically. And they know it. The war just swamps out everything else.

Mike, the exception to the corrupt corporatists you speak of has a name—Dennis Kucinich.  Go to

http://Kucinich.us

Democrats Get the Message

Washington Post:

Blah, blah, blah, blah!

No Mike, it’s not.  It’s meaningless spin.  It’s a cop out.  It’s a failure to recognize the duty imposed on members of Congress to be guardians of the Constitution and the rule of law.  Our present circumstance is precisely why the framers of that seminal documentinserted the Impeachment Clause.  Until these cowardly corporatists, who masquerade as Democrats, begin to stand up to the rule of law, they are standing up for nothing but hot air.

#82600 by Ernest Canning on 6/29 at 9:42 pm

Thanks Ernest. I’m glad I read your comment before I continued to the entire article. Saved me some time.

I read the entirety of this Washington Post article.  It fails to mention impeachment.  It fails to mention Michael Moore’s Sicko!  It fails to mention single-payer healthcare or an immediate cut off of funds for Iraq. 

I’d say that the so-called Democratic “leadership” still isn’t getting the “message” and neither is the Washington Post.