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Ear to the Ground

Bush Wants Iraq to Be More Like Israel

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Posted on Jun 29, 2007

President Bush, in an effort to buy time and lower expectations for the surge, has set a new goal for Iraq: be like Israel.  As in a country “that can protect its people, deliver basic services for all its citizens and function as a democracy even amid violence.”  In view of daily violence that’s off the charts by Israeli standards and Iraq’s lack of a functioning government, democratic or otherwise, couldn’t he have set the bar a tad lower?  But as long as you’re aiming high, why not just change the name to New Finland and leave?


BBC:

He said: “Our success in Iraq must not be measured by the enemy’s ability to get a car bombing in the evening news.”

The terms of success set out by Mr Bush included “the rise of a government that can protect its people, deliver basic services for all its citizens and function as a democracy even amid violence”.

Mr Bush suggested Israel as a standard to work towards.

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By Neoconned, July 2, 2007 at 6:59 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Lilmamzer

Do you equate critisizm of the Bush/Cheney Neocon clan to Anti-Semitism????

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By Neoconned, July 2, 2007 at 6:50 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

#82546 by lilmamzer on 6/29 at 5:45 pm

Ohhhh there you go again with your countering of “quack” conspiricy theories.  The moment the word Israel pops up, you come out of your saloon with your Uzi unholstered.

Let’s just all ignore what has been going on since this wretched Bush/Cheney Administration took over.  Iraq is just a made for TV movies.

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By P. T., July 1, 2007 at 12:51 am Link to this comment

When Iraq acted like Israel and seized the land of its neighbor (Kuwait), the U.S. attacked Iraq.

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By sweetoldlady, June 30, 2007 at 6:49 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Did those of you who followed the

http://desertpeace.blogspot.com/

scroll down to hit the three really wicked cartoon comments, two of which were about Blair’s new appointment?

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By great_satan, June 30, 2007 at 1:44 am Link to this comment

#82620 by cyrena
  “I think it’s very intentional, and sticks with the oringinal plan of keeping the entire area as disrupted as they possibly can.
  It’s psychological warfare.”
 
  Yes, also notice the timing of the Tony Blair appointing as Envy to the Middle East” with the bloody Queen of England knighting Salmon Rushdie. What the hell is that all about?!?!?

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By cyrena, June 29, 2007 at 11:58 pm Link to this comment

#82613 by dialecticks on 6/29 at 10:21 pm


“Is that just meant ot stir up more s#1+ or what?”

I actually don’t KNOW anymore, whether or not this is really “intentional” on the part of georgie, because as has been frequently noted, the dude is just totally out there in his own little wizard of oz character world. He’s crazy. So, he honestly MAY NOT KNOW, that he was saying something that could and mostly certainly WOULD, torture the collective psychology of the people of this global region, and just thoroughly incense them. Because it’s not just Iraqis who will be totally insulted by this, but everybody in the region. It’s probably worse than the various messages that he has “directed” to the Iranians, when he calls them out specifically, (the citizens of Iran) and tells them that they are part of an “axis of evil”.

Could he POSSIBLY have a clue to what this does? I honestly have to say not. But, since george isn’t coming up with this stuff entirely on his own, SOMEBODY knows EXACTLY how this will enflame them, and that’s the point. I think it’s very intentional, and sticks with the oringinal plan of keeping the entire area as disrupted as they possibly can.

It’s psychological warfare.

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By great_satan, June 29, 2007 at 11:21 pm Link to this comment

“Oh Iraqis, why can’t you just be more like the Jews?” Is that just meant ot stir up more s#1+ or what?

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By cyrena, June 29, 2007 at 9:39 pm Link to this comment

#82534 by nefertiti on 6/29 at 5:17 pm

Thanks nefertiti, for the basic history lesson. I wish I’d had this a couple of years ago, when I was sweating through all of my Middle Eastern history courses, but it’s OK, because it has given me an opportunity to learn about each group in-depth.

I thought I would have an easier time with some of the theology and doctrine, (or dogma) because I had 12 long years of a Catholic indoctrination at my “formative” years. Fortunately, I didn’t take ALL of that bait, even at the time, and I’ve since disgarded nearly all of it, (at least for myself, though I don’t have any problems if other people still believe whatever it is that they take from these various texts and traditions)

But, I said that to say that I really didn’t find any of the Islamic doctrine or ideology to be that far off or removed from the same various components of Christianity, and if we start looking real carefully, there are MULTIPLE similarities with Christianity and Judiasm, and whatever else. My grandma genuinely believed that the Virgin Mary, (mother of God)DID in fact “ascend” into heaven, not at all unlike the Shia remember the grandson, Hussein ascending.

Same with the Wahhabi brand of Islam that the Osamas and Zawahiris embrace. They are comparable to our George Ws’, and our Pat Robertsons’, and our Lou Dobbs’

So, I was able to make some intellectual comparisons between so many of the groups, and what they have in common, and what their specific differences might be. All in all, I find them compatible enough with each other, to exist quite harmoniously, as long as they are not under attack by an outside element.

Meantime, I never doubted that this was “the plan”, actually long before they actually hijacked our own government. The PNAC documents from over a decade ago, pretty much confirmed that.

And, thanks for the peaceful Israeli website. I’m actully familiar with them as well, which is how I know that Kevin9999 is correct when he says that the greater population of Jewish Israelis DO NOT subscribe to this incredibly hateful Zionish ideology. And, most of the Jewish Americans that I know, don’t subscribe to it either.

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By republicansscareme, June 29, 2007 at 8:14 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I guess if Bush wants America to serve the interests of Iraquis more than it serves the interests of Americans, then he is right. Be more like Israel.

The Zionists are as unpopular in Israel as they are in the United States. Most Americans don’t know this.

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By kevin99999, June 29, 2007 at 7:49 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Do you mean a terrorist state that occupies other people’s lands and wreaks havoc on their lives. The U.S. is doing pretty good job of that.

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By lilmamzer, June 29, 2007 at 6:45 pm Link to this comment

#82534 by nefertiti:

Dividing the Middle East into ethnic and racial groups has been planned a long long time ago…...it was better to divide the middle east , and leave small weak communities (and probably sell them arms ) to fight each other and create more conflicts between them too.

Yes, the Grand Conspiracy by Evil Cabal shtick.
Nothing new here…..........

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By DennisD, June 29, 2007 at 6:18 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

No doubt Bu$h really is certifiably insane - every time he opens his mouth he confirms it.  Unfortunately there’s probably no Oval Office blow job on the horizon to move Congress to impeach him.
F**cking 300 million Americans at once doesn’t count.

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By nefertiti, June 29, 2007 at 6:17 pm Link to this comment

cyrena

Dividing the Middle East into ethnic and racial groups has been planned a long long time ago , they even discussed it at the Time when BEN Gurion was alive. it was better to divide the middle east , and leave small weak communities (and probably sell them arms ) to fight each other and create more conflicts between them too. the next step is to divide the syrians into christians, sunni, druzzes, Alawites , etc.. or Iranians into Kurds, shias, sunnis, jews, christians , zorostrians, Baluch , Azeris etc..etc.. it has been planned . COndoleesa rice spoke of the NEW middle East that we have to accept and she described the Destruction of Lebanon summer 2006 as the Birth Pangs of the New Middle East . people in the Region wished she was facing them , at the time so they can tell her what they thought of those birth Pangs .

Found a few interesting videos by Btselem a Peace loving Israeli organisation

http://desertpeace.blogspot.com/2007/06/peace-loving-israeli-occupation.html

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By cyrena, June 29, 2007 at 4:55 pm Link to this comment

#82480 by nefertiti on 6/29 at 1:56 pm

I found the article written by Juan cole brilliant.

I’m going to read the article nefertiti, though I know that all of Juan Cole’s pieces are brilliant.

I wanted to add an observation though, one that is maybe less obvious to the comparison of Iraq to Israel, since there hasn’t been much in the recent news.

Basically, Iraq is already well on the way to becoming another Israel/Palestine model. Those huge cement barriers/structures that our troops and private contractors have been working on since last year, are pretty much proof of it.

These are HUGE concrete barrier walls that have been erected around ENTIRE neighborhoods in Iraq, (called “gated communities” just like jails) and the Americans have about 10 of these planned now, all for parts of Baghdad.

These walls are supposedly 10 feet tall, (the concrete part, but then more razor wire extends it another few feet up) and 2 feet thick, (all concrete) and these surround miles and miles of neighborhoods. The residents have only one way in or out of their neighborhoods, and last I heard, they were somehow “requiring” that all of the residents of these various communities to obtain “proof” that they live where they do, and they need to have that, to get in or out of their neighborhoods, through the checkpoints that have been set up at the one location where they are allowed to enter and leave.

Now, there was a lot of serious protest from the Iraqis when they saw they were being walled in, (in their own communities) and even Maliki, (who happened to be visiting Egypt at the time) made an announcement (in response to the complaints) that the Iraqis did not want these walls, and that the US should stop building them.

A US military spokesman responded by saying that OF COURSE we would respect the wishes of the Iraqis, BUT…they were still gonna keep building the walls, and isolating whatever people happened to be living there.

Now, tell me this isn’t already an Israel/Palestine model. It’s already a done thing!!!

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By nefertiti, June 29, 2007 at 2:56 pm Link to this comment

I found the article written by Juan cole brilliant.

http://www.juancole.com/labels/monumental stupidity.html

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By nisse from Finland, June 29, 2007 at 1:39 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

As a Finn I am (?) glad about your idea about naming Iraq to New Finland. I don’t know where you got up our country, but I think that considering your (satiric) invention the better choice would have been Sweden, which has better standard of living than Finland. Reason: no wars in 199 years. Okay, they have been very pragmatic and during every conflict they have been keeping up with the winning side.

Most of us Finns like US American people, in fact Finland were called the most American country in Europe in the nineteen’s. But in the same time most of us dislike US government’s actions around the world, especially in the Middle East. I have been reading US history for trying to understand why US gov has to make all these interventions. What has happened to the home of democracy? Where are the small government, small army (military always expensive) and the idea of taking care of only your own business? And the civil rights – Patriot Act, wiretapping, different kind of data bases? Blame the press (yours and ours), the internet columns (like TD, Antiwar.com, American Conservative (Sic.), etc.) about the information I get, but nowadays it seems that Mr. Bush should be more interested on making USA more like Israel. Okay, maybe this isn’t a very good idea because Israel has been in a route to become a military state.

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By lilmamzer, June 29, 2007 at 1:20 pm Link to this comment

#82392 by Non Credo:

We should reduce our aid to Israel to a level where they are forced to abandon their national health care coverage system.

Right. If it’s politically unfeasible to actually bomb the Jews into submission, maybe we could let them all get sick and die that way.

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By lilmamzer, June 29, 2007 at 1:18 pm Link to this comment

#82417 by felicity:

All I want to know is which ethnic/religious group; Shia, Sunni, Kurd, other is going to be the “Palestinian” of Iraq.

Remember the Palestinian Arabs of Kuwait? When the coalition forces evicted Saddam Hussein’s army from Kuwait, the 300,000 Palestinian Arabs were expelled by the Kuwaitis because Yasser Arafat was an ardent supporter and enabler of Saddam Hussein’s regime (which resulted in the Iraqi invasion of and trashing of Kuwait). You could safely assume the Palestinians of Iraq will be Palestinian Arabs. They already expelled their Jews decades ago.

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By felicity, June 29, 2007 at 12:53 pm Link to this comment

All I want to know is which ethnic/religious group; Shia, Sunni, Kurd, other is going to be the “Palestinian” of Iraq.  Which ever one Mr. Bush designates, he’s going to have a bit of a problem convincing the group that it’s in its best interest to be the “Palestinian” of Iraq.

(Mr. Rove should really start keeping Mr. Bush under lock and key instead of marching him out, spiel in hand, to utter yet again some idiotic something.  We get it, Mr. Rove, you’ve convinced us, Mr. Rove.  Mr. Bush is a certifiable nut-case.  Enough already.)

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By lilmamzer, June 29, 2007 at 12:27 pm Link to this comment

#82398 by Non Credo:

As Juan Cole explains:

“Let’s just take the analogy [between Israel and Iraq] seriously for a moment. Israel proper is a democracy of sorts, though its 1 million Arab citizens are in a second class position.

Arguable. Even if it were true in some respects, does that make Israel different from any Western democracy with a diverse polpulation mix? Of course it doesn’t but don’t let that stop you from singling out Israel.
————————-

But it rules over several million stateless Palestinians who lack even the pretence of self-rule.

Not in Gaza. They have all the self-rule they want.

And they had it in Judea and Shomron until they the wave of suicide-bombers forced Israel to clamp down the security. Cole knows better, and that’s his tragic flaw - we know it too.
——————————-

It is hard to characterize a country as a democracy when it has millions of disenfranchised subjects.

No, it’s not. Those “subjects” have more than enough power to chart a different course for their destiny, but always return to the same maximalist, rejectionaist violence. Too fucking bad.

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By lilmamzer, June 29, 2007 at 12:19 pm Link to this comment

#82397 by Paolo:

1) Israel is NOT a “democracy.” A nation in which you have to qualify to vote by being from a specified ethnic background is NOT a democracy. In order to be a citizen of Israel, a government agency must certify that you are “Jewish.”

False. There are citizens who are non-Jews. More than a million. Some are Muslim, some are Christian, some are Hindu, some are Buddhists, and some are atheists. They vote, are elected to the Parliament, run businesses and become wealthy. You don’t know what you are talking about.

Israel IS a democracy. Unfortunately for you Paolo, the majority of citizens in Israel happen to be Jewish. Get over it.
————————————

You can either have a “Jewish State” OR you can have a “democracy.” You cannot have both.

Of course you can. If the majority happen to be Jews, so be it. And that’s the way it is, and that’s they way it shall be. Majority rules with protection of minority rights. Same as in the US. But let me guess, you hate the US, too.
————————————-

2) Frankly, I’m not impressed with the idea of “democracy” anyway.

Now there’s a shocker. What would you prefer? Hamas-style sharia caliphate? Syrian-styled Baathist-Fascist dictatorship? Saudi-styled monarchy with overtones of Wahhabi theocracy?

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By lilmamzer, June 29, 2007 at 12:10 pm Link to this comment

#82389 by Non Credo:

That is completely beside the point - as usual with you, Lilmamzer.

The point is that we provide Israel with such lavish aid that it is able to give nationally funded health care to all Israeli citizens, while we are told we can’t afford it here in the United States.

Zionist Israel allows non-Jewss to be citizens and still affords them decent health care? Zionists do that? But you always claim they are racist. Why would racists do that? Why wouldn’t these Zionist Racist Jews just keep the money for themselves?

Please show us your sources. How much aid money is given to Israel that is not in the form of military loan guarantees to be spent back in the US? And how much (if any) aid money is then directed towards health care costs?

So we should also eliminate foreign aid to Egypt, Jordan, and many African nations that use such money for health care for their citizens, too. After all, that money could also be spent gere in the US for health care. Or is it just the Zionist Jews who shouldnt be able to provide health care to Zionist citizens of all religions in Israel?

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By Paolo, June 29, 2007 at 12:01 pm Link to this comment

Two points:

1) Israel is NOT a “democracy.” A nation in which you have to qualify to vote by being from a specified ethnic background is NOT a democracy. In order to be a citizen of Israel, a government agency must certify that you are “Jewish.” Of course, we in the West are shocked—SHOCKED!—when we hear about countries where only Muslims can be full citizens. But in Israel, it’s perfectly okay if only Jews can be full citizens.

By this standard, what was wrong with South Africa having a government agency decide who was really “white,” “colored” or “black”? Was South Africa a “democracy”? By the standard we apply to Israel, I guess it was.

You can either have a “Jewish State” OR you can have a “democracy.” You cannot have both.

2) Frankly, I’m not impressed with the idea of “democracy” anyway. “Democracy” = a system in which two wolves and sheep vote on what’s for dinner. Or, a system in which slaves get to vote on who is “massah.” The fact that you get to “vote” from a list of people supplied by those in power, to see who stays in power, does not impress me.

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By lilmamzer, June 29, 2007 at 11:31 am Link to this comment

#82362 by Non Credo:

We provide Israel with such lavish aid that it is able to give nationally funded health care to all Israeli citizens

Even the Muslim and Christian citizens get decent health care?

How very Zionist of those Jews.

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By Joseph Conrad, June 29, 2007 at 11:04 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Americans need to keep their Eyes on the Ball with this Mr. Bush & Co.

His abiding mission is STILL to get Iraq’s Oil & Gas for the Wealthy of the Trilateral Commission & the US regardless of how long it takes or how many US lives it costs. Keep in mind that this is the man who with his cohorts carried off the 9/11 charade without a hitch and now is planning to sink Iran and take ITS Oil and Gas.

This is the first president to have absolutely no concern about the quality of his ‘legacy’. Though he has his father’s CIA mentality he lacks his father’s skills and intellect. This is reflected in his comments on issues in interviews and speechs. When he is as old and gray as David Rokefeller, he will need to understand why so many Americans will still revile his name and seek to expung his memory.

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By TDoff, June 29, 2007 at 9:49 am Link to this comment

By golly, that Bush, isn’t he the contrarian though, the little dickens?

He wants Iraq to be like Israel, whereas most sane folks would like Israel to be more like Iraq.

If we really wanted to make friends, and peace, in the middle east, we’d redirect our troops to the streets of Tel Aviv and Haifa, play a little shoot-em-up with the folks who are really causing the problems over there (and, not-so-incidentally, start fighting them over there so we don’t have to fight them over here).

‘Mr. Olmert, please tear down those walls.’ (To paraphrase a speech by an american ‘B’-movie actor)

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By manny, June 29, 2007 at 8:17 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Lets see, let me think about it. Yes, why not. Iraq like Israel. First have a covert and political wing of the Iraq goverment inside the American goverment. Next, get Iraq to control the major American news media and higher educational institutions and put a
stop to any kind of print that the Iraq goverment does not approve of. In Iraq let them kill and rob certain women and children and just call them all terrorists. Yes, the U.S.A should arm Iraq to the teeth. Let Iraq can get the Bomb and not abide by international law because they are our friends.
Iraq must make sure that both American political parties get enough money. Any one in American political power that even dares to express any views that are not approved by the goverment of Iraq will have their political careers ended.
Iraq should start a holocust media industry.
Have the American’s tax payers pay $1000.00 per Iraq
in govermental support. Yes, why wouldn’t Iraq want to become a democracy ?

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By DetainThis, June 29, 2007 at 7:52 am Link to this comment

Fine. Mimic the zionazi regime, but know the consequences:

“The Imam [Khomeini] said this regime occupying Jerusalem must vanish from the pages of time.” —President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad

“This neozionazi regime occupying Washington D.C. and Baghdad must vanish from the pages of time.” —DetainThis

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By DMK, June 29, 2007 at 5:47 am Link to this comment

Is he kidding? We don’t even have basic services or protection for all of OUR citizens. Just when you think he can’t get any more removed from reality, he fools you.

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By Verne Arnold, June 29, 2007 at 4:20 am Link to this comment

Ooo, Ooo, hey, I have an idea…

Oh please, why are we still listening to this moron…I say this with an apology to true morons.

Nuff said!

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By cyrena, June 29, 2007 at 3:35 am Link to this comment

Ok…so, I took the bait. Read the article twice, in an episode of self-flagellation of the psychological variety, and it’s had the predictable effect. This is yet another act of psychological warfare, on the part of the Cheney-Israel Mob, to torture us. They succeeded with me. I’m gonna go read a John Grisham novel. My mind can only take so many of these assaults, and then I have to go into some form of denial.

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