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Ear to the Ground

Hillary Equivocates on Torture

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Posted on Oct 17, 2006
Hillary Clinton
From CNN

Hillary Clinton

Despite public statements to the contrary, Hillary Clinton now says she is amenable to the idea of the government using torture in some circumstances.


Ben Smith of the N.Y. Daily News:

Despite her apparent opposition to torture, Hillary Clinton said in a Daily News editorial board meeting [last week] that the practice is acceptable in some circumstances.

At [last week’s] Daily News editorial board meeting, it emerged that she’s not actually against torture in all instances, and that her dispute with [Sen. John] McCain and [President] Bush is largely procedural.

She was asked about the “ticking time bomb” scenario, in which you’ve captured the terrorist and don’t have time for a normal interrogation, and said that there is a place for what she called “severity,” in a conversation that included mentioning waterboarding, hypothermia, and other techniques commonly described as torture.

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By political forum, July 6, 2007 at 5:06 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Not too surprising.  Hillary will probably wait for the next poll to come out on torture and then say what she believe in then.

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By Melissa, October 18, 2006 at 5:16 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Revolting.  What is wrong with our polititions?  I am so disgusted with people who can even think about approving torture.  During the witch hunts and the Inquisition, everyone admitted to everything.  Under torture people say whatever they are told to say.  I am beginning to think they want to torture for the sake of torture.

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By Spinoza, October 18, 2006 at 1:11 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Hillary, John Kerry etc are right wingers funded by the same right wingers funding the Neo Cons.

In NY State Vote Green (we need to get our line on the ballot) except if you are in the 19th congressional district were we have John Hall running as a Democrat.  He actually is a democrat and Greens endorse him.

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By Thomas Green, October 18, 2006 at 7:57 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Thomas Jefferson would rightly horsewhip both Hillary and her sometime husband.
She is the product of Zionist power in the state of New York. That is why she equivocates on anything dealing with Iraq or Bush’s arrogance usurption of American civil liberties.
Her politics are circumscribed by her allegience to Israel first and to her personal selfish goals second.

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By Guitarsandmore, October 18, 2006 at 6:37 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

We have begun the slow slide down into fascism with the passage of the torture bill. When even Democratic leaders are nodding their heads in approval for such demonic behavior you can be sure future leaders will stop at nothing for their own selfish aggrandizement. Escape now while you still can.

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By Paul M Smith, October 18, 2006 at 3:04 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

“The Depths of Depravity”

They think they are pretty slick. They think the law is for ‘other’ people, but not them. They think the Constitution is just an old scrap of paper. They think they can cheat the game by changing the rules after the hand has been played. They think God is on their side if they only say so. They think everyone outside their circle is ignorant, stupid, & fools. They think they can do whatever they please as long as they stay in power. They think they are justified in lying, cheating, & stealing, murdering, deceiving, & propagandizing, intimidating, torturing, & threatening just to stay in power. They think they can take advantage of Americans forever and get away with it.

BUT, did they ever think what would happen if America woke up to their crimes? Apparently so, or they wouldn’t have forced this act through at the eleventh hour before we put them out of office, AND in a criminal docket where they belong.

Although I don’t like what happened today, when Bush signed this act into law, I’m not fearful of the action because just as the War Crimes Act was undone today, it can also be re-instated. I don’t believe the vast majority of Americans will disregard the values that made/make our country the beacon of liberty & fair play. Our high ideals demand from all of us we don’t demean ourselves by sinking to the low standards of our enemies. If through making torture & disregard for the laws of civilized society (Habeas Corpus) we think we are better than the barbaric people we eschew, we are actually no better than they, and we are the real losers; actually we become the terrorist ourselves. I want no part of this madness, but will fight this madness to my last breath, as is my patriotic moral & constitutional duty. Today I am shamed by & ashamed of this president and this congress. I know where I stand. What side of the fence of right and wrong do you want to stand on?-PMS

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By AG, October 17, 2006 at 11:19 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

This subject is a non-issue since nobody is really challenging the whole issue of torture, as evidenced by the continuance of Guantanamo Bay. There is no prisoner there who can possibly be giving relevant information after being confined for the past 2 years or more. My aunt has a better idea of where Bin Laden is (and no, she doesn’t have a clue either).

The real issue is why Hillary, and most of the democratic party leadership, cannot come to the realization that the Iraq war is based on lies and deceit. And no matter what the reason for their silence is, it is a betrayal to truth and justice. They are just silently following in the footsteps of Chickenhawks like Bush and Cheney who never fought for their country when they had a chance.

I hold the democrats responsible for any Iraq and US deaths after the 2004 Presidential Election when they couldn’t, or wouldn’t, utter any words about the illegality of the war. That is not leadership, it is plain old fashioned cowardship. Or just plain selling out. Peace and justice (and lives) are at stake and they refused to speak out for justice.

I will never vote for Hillary, no matter who the opposition is. I will vote Green Party, or any independent who has already stated that this war (and torture) is not acceptable to a civil society.

peace
AG

http://www.NotOneMore.US  -  Take the Pledge for Peace

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By faith, October 17, 2006 at 9:43 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Appalling !  Absolutely appalling.  Well, Senator Clinton, I believe in moral authority, justice and mercy.  It follows that I oppose torture under any circumstances.  It is unconstitutional, it is immoral and it is unamerican.  Shame on you Senator for attempting to find caveat or exception to the fact that torture of any other human being is wrongful.  In this culture, time, or space.  Furthermore it is absolutely unchristian.  Please avoid embarrassing yourself by attempting to run for the office of President of the United States. If you lack courage to stand up against the current administration’s egregious position on torture, I assure you that most of us do not want more of the same - from the Democratic party.  Shameful position.

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By Mac McKinney, October 17, 2006 at 9:15 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

So now Hillary has crossed the Rubicon too. Once you cave into the ticking time-bomb routine, you have effectively sold your soul to the Devil. It’s no different than Satan tempting Jesus in the wilderness. This was an ethical test for Hillary and she should have said, “Get thee behind me, Machiavellian editor”, but she took the sophist’s way out, equivocating all the way. This is her core character we are witnessing first hand, fellow citizens of the world. She lacks a center; she lacks a moral compass; she lacks any dedication to higher truth. She is unfit to champion humanity in the difficult struggles lying ahead. Perhaps a good nickname for her after this revelation should be Frau Hillary, defender of the Reich.

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By G. Anderson, October 17, 2006 at 8:46 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I too would like to know exactly what she said.

But if it’s true, then she really needs psychological help, some sort of counseling or psychotheray.

Obviously, this means she can’t be president, because then we’d have just another continuation of what we have already.

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By Jon, October 17, 2006 at 7:39 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Robert Sheer has written severarl articles on a wrongfully prosecuted scientist Wen Ho Lee, who was mentally and physically torture(see link to articles written by Mr. Sheer.)

Clinton was the president at that time. Hillary didn’t utter a word to this Ho the miserable soul who worked his tails off for this country.

One Bush the 43 is more than enough for this country. We don’t need another one named Hillary.

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By yours truly, October 17, 2006 at 6:11 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Who cares what Hillary says or does, or, for that matter,  what any of our wannabee presidents say or do?  They’re looking two years ahead anyway and it makes no sense right now even thinking that far in advance, what with next month’s election destined to be the great decider,  being that we win, we change the world, we lose, there is no world.  Which means it’s up to each and every one of us.  We push hard for three more weeks, that’s what it’ll take.  And from then on -  “Long live November the seventh.”.

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By Dumont, October 17, 2006 at 5:52 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

This woman has to be either the biggest sell-out or roll over patsy for approval I have ever seen. She is trying to be right-wing light for the sake or G.O.P. acceptance and what puzzles me furthermore is her still being a Dem “fav” in 2008 without study on her stances.

I say Go Biden in 2008—sometimes ya’ gotta’ say f-ck it and go with an actual Democrat. What do we have to lose? The Clintonians screwed us out of our own party’s dominance in 93—let’s not have that happen again. Let us speak out again on issues without this insipid shame in the face of blank idiocy for having well thought-out positions on our nation’s future.

This woman would go along with every freetrade (Nafta/Cafta/Safta=Daft-a) agreement that flushes us right down the can. Her stance on this torture issue to me is not surprising to anyone who has studied her policy moves since 2002.

So long Hillaryland—bye-bye.

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By harald hardrada, October 17, 2006 at 5:14 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

what hillary & georgie share is their belief that our government ought to harass innocent americans—sooner or later we’ll see that innocent americans are the only folks our government will torture

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By MARIAM RUSSELL, October 17, 2006 at 4:24 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Madame…..YOU MAKE ME ASHAMED TO BE FEMALE, BUT THERE ARE NO OTHER CHOICES.
Women need to be better than this…if not women…..then who??????????

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By Jeanie, October 17, 2006 at 4:06 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I think I would like to know what she actually said. If you read the article carefully, it appears that she was asked that stupid conservative question about whether it is ok to “torture” someone in order to prevent a bomb from destroying a city or something like that. It also says that the conversation included waterboarding, etc. It didn’t say that she said, yeah, waterboard them. Others were talking about waterboarding, etc. The wording of the sentence is deliberately misleading. I wonder why a conservative paper would do this to Hillary!

But be honest, if someone knew of a major disaster that was about to take place and they had the information to stop it, of course you’d want to try to get the information out of them any way you could. But that is an extremely rare scenario. When would that ever even happen? I think everyone we’ve tortured has lied to us because we didn’t like the truth that they were saying.

I wouldn’t be too hard on Hillary based on this information unless she ACTUALLY said that Bush & Co. are right about the torture bill. The article quotes her as saying, “In those instances where we have sufficient basis to believe that there is something imminent, yeah, but then we’ve got to have a check and balance.” The Bush administration tortures just to torture. There is no imminent threat. They do it for their sadistic pleasure. And now there are no checks or balances.

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By biggus doggus, October 17, 2006 at 3:35 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

and you wonder why the big dog would play around on this broad ????????

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By Jon, October 17, 2006 at 2:42 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Hillary supported the war and Hillary supports the “torture”. There is no significant differences between Hillary and Bush. Second, I venture to speculate that all suspects are terrorists and all terrorists are “ticking time bombs”. As a result, all suspects are subject to torture.

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