Neo-cons have not will not ever admit to their mistakes of de-regulation and as a consequence have no learning curve.  They cannot point to one example of success with de-regulation anywhere on the planet.

re: Haroldmh

I have skimmed through the “Canadian book” to which you referred.  I have seen much of this crap before.

His enemy is Capitalism. His solution is socialism, or a command economy. The Soviet union was a command economy, as was Nazi Germany.

In Canada we have had a socialist party that has never governed nationally, but it creates a leftward tug of social programs that are co-opted by the middle, just as the middle co-opts rightist measures at times. As often is, the mean is usually better than the extremes of purism. Socialism, or a command economy is not the answer, nor is unbridled capitalism.

In fact we have had two or three socialist governments elected at the provincial level in Canada. Like most others in the world they have been abject failures because while they knew how to spend money and bring services to people, they just do not understand how wealth is created. Command economies have made a mess of it, almost always warping the realities of economics (which apply to any hairbrained system) sufficiently to fail. About the only enterprises which have been even marginally successful are ones such as state auro insurance, and even they become bureaucratic juggernauts with premiums more than the private sector. For example, competitive systems in Maritime Canada are half as costly as British Columbia which has a provincial auto insurance system.

The renowned Tommy Douglas started several socialist enterprises in Saskatchewan - all failed because ideology clashed with the realities of economics. A giant scheme to build fast ferries in Vancouver failed because the socialist proponents did not do a workable business plan and sank multi-millions in the building of four large catamaran ferries that were inappropriately designed for the task. They were   picked for a tiny fraction of the cost by the Washington Group and lie mouldering at dockside ten years later. Costs to convert them for other customers are prohibitive because they were designed for inland waters - and poorly at that - they are simply too costly to run. 

The history of socialism is littered with such examples, or such as Great Britain where the unions took pover the country until Margaret Thatcher came into power.

There are isolated examples such as Sweden which had enlightened health and social programs - even they had to trim their sails despite a healthy steel and industrial machine (paper machines and so on.)
Governments are lousy at creating wealth.

Entrepreneurial individuals and companies are great at it, because individual self-interest drives them. At the point where it becomers greed the role of government is to regulate operations so that runaway greed does not poison the system as it just did in the US - and some other parts of the world.

In fact, Canada’s economic genius, if it has one, is that it has not gone the whole route in deregulation. Canada’s banking system is different than the US. It has very large branch banks that operate not only Canada but other parts of the word as commercial and investment banks. Let loose from regulation their greed would ultimately create the same catastrophe as in the US. And that is only prevented because the Canadian government did not deregulate as far.

Even so, Canada is affected by the US meltdown because it is by far the largest trading partner the us has, notwithstanding China, Japan and so on.

The solution is definitely not the airy fairy theories of socialism outlined in the referenced web site.  The solution, I believe, lies in a free enterprise system that is regulated and taxed so that it does not run away with the store, and provides enough tax revenue to have social support systems that are appropriate to the need and the revenue.

OIL

If you want to know why oil continues to go down despite the best efforts by OPEC, you can Google Lindsay Williams the The Energy Non-Crisis or listen to him here:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3340274697167011147

Hint: It does not have to do with the strength of the dollar or a decrease in demand.

Oil will continue its decline to 50 FRNs / Barrel and then go to 200 FRNs / Barrel. Timing is unknown.

We hear constantly many financial ‘experts’ claim that the health of the national economy depends on government incentives to businesses and entrepreneurs. I find this claim, central to the policies of Reaganomics and the Bush administration, extremely dubious.

As a typical example, here is an excerpt from a Washington Post article by Alan D. Viard, Alex Brill and Arthur C. Brooks Wednesday, October 29, 2008; Page A17, against changes in this policy.

“If rewards for America’s entrepreneurs and firms are reduced through higher marginal tax rates, their incentives to earn, invest and create jobs will be diminished. Americans will have less incentive to save, and firms will have less incentive to pay dividends. Tax avoidance will become more profitable. A smaller capital stock will mean a less productive economy and lower wages for middle-class and other workers.”

The idea that entrepreneurs and businesses need an ‘incentive’ to earn profits and invest in making more profits is ridiculous. Human nature drives all of us to better ourselves, no government incentives required.

Businesses create exactly as many jobs as necessary to operate and no more. For the thirty something years these policies have held sway, these ’jobs’ are producing lower wages in an inflationary economy, while health care benefits and pensions have been reduced or eliminated.

Americans, other than entrepreneurs and business executives, don’t save because they don’t even have enough income to pay bills, housing, and college tuition for their children.

Entrepreneurs and businesses pay dividends to attract investors, no government incentives required.

A purposefully intricate tax system, favors large incomes, like entrepreneurs and businesses, which pay tax lawyers to avoid taxes and increase profits already.

In our deregulated free market economy, profit is a runaway train and incentives are the supercharger. Before the recent train wreck, many entrepreneurs and business executives were making huge profits for themselves and their tax lawyers.

But what has been the real benefit to our national economic health? The deficit is growing exponentially. Wages for middle-class and other workers have slipped far below the poverty line. Foreign governments, many inimical to American ideals and interests, now own huge chunks of American real estate, resources and our national debt. Foreign adventures are draining our capital to no discernable benefit, except for entrepreneurs and businesses that plunder new resources (and hire mostly foreign workers.) or provide support to American troops. Our American infrastructure at home has been allowed to deteriorate while we pour billions into military aid to foreign countries, not making the world any safer for Americans that I can see.

Not our national economy, but only the economies of entrepreneurs and businesses that pay huge bribes through lobbyists benefit from incentives to entrepreneurs and businesses. The incentive relieves them of the burden of either making a profit or paying a decent wage and providing health care and pensions to their workers. Many of them with factories and bank accounts overseas simply jump ship when American workers are too expensive and too independent, or the American taxpayer is unwilling to provide them with the incentives they’ve been enjoying for so long.

‘Experts say “We need incentives to keep businesses from moving overseas.” I say “Don’t let the screen door hit you on your way out.”

Today, in a local coin shop, a lady in her late 50’s or early 60’s was selling bits of her jewelry to pay the bills and put food on her table.  She was unemployed and had just gotten a job at a local Macy’s, even though Macy’s is in trouble. She needed cash to last until that first, small check came, so she was selling her lifetime treasures, just to pay the bills and eat. She thought she could still redeem a silver certificate and get silver, which hasn’t been true since the 60’s.  The owner sadly told her that silver cert was only worth $1.25

Thousands of Circuit City employees are losing their jobs. GM is asking US to pay for GM to innovate, something they have been neglecting and fighting for 40 years, spending money on lobbies that should have been spent on new technologies.  Ever notice that the ONLY thing Chevy actually comes up with that’s new is the COSMETICS of the crappy car underneath?  Millions of Americans have lost their jobs since Bush the Disaster came to power.

But where did it start?  I place on GM, Ford, Chrysler and AMC, who, back in the 60s’ ended innovation other than styling.  When the first gas crisis hit in 1973, did Detroit change? No.  They STILL make gas-guzzling trucks today.  When the Japanese hit our shores they laughed.  When the Japanese beat them, they STILL made gas-guzzlers and learned NOTHING from their conquerers.  And so began the decline of US Industry. In 1979, an event occurred that would prove to be disastrous for the US.  A Japanese firm developed a VLSI circuit smaller, faster and more powerful than anything the US had.  They blew by us in chip technology.  And we did nothing, instead worrying about evolution vs creationism in our schools.

God doesn’t make you prosperous if you don’t educate yourself and your children.

Then in 1981 can deregulation….

And in 2001 came an insanely big tax cut…before 9/11.

And the deficit grew. And grew, and grew.  That’s, to me, the match.  And the sub-prime mess two years ago was the first symptom.  Now we see the rest…...

Fenwick:

The common wisdom is that Rome was “destroyed from within” by its “decadence.”  But most people do not realize that that “decadence” was as much economic as moral.  And in the fall of empires historically, the two go hand in hand.

Peace.

Allan Gurfinkle - Here are a few places that can help explain the Fed and the fractional reserve banking system.

The articles and films on the main page are a good place to start.
http://www.silverbearcafe.com/private/home.html

Zeitgeist: Addendum (just the first section)
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7065205277695921912

Another site that explains history well
http://fdrs.org/

A good source for Austrian Economical thought.
http://mises.org/

A few books to get you started:
Secrets of the Federal Reserve by Eustace Mullins
The Creature from Jekyll Island by G. Edward Griffin
The Case Against the Fed by Murray Rothbard

The Fed Caused the Great Depression

Milton Friedman proved it and Bernanke confirmed it.

Does anyone honestly believe that they aren’t doing the same thing once again?

————————————————————

http://www.federalreserve.gov/BOARDDOCS/SPEECHES/2002/20021108/default.htm

Remarks by Governor Ben S. Bernanke
At the Conference to Honor Milton Friedman, University of Chicago, Chicago, Illinois
November 8, 2002

On Milton Friedman’s Ninetieth Birthday

“Let me end my talk by abusing slightly my status as an official representative of the Federal Reserve. I would like to say to Milton and Anna: Regarding the Great Depression. You’re right, we did it. We’re very sorry. But thanks to you, we won’t do it again.”

Fenwick 1229
Hey, that sounds like now, doesn’t it? So who and what is waiting to take the place?

Alan Garfunkle 1208:

That is precisely correct. An increase of the money supply is inflationary.  A serious recession or depression deflates the value of the dollar. In addition, when a central bank sells bonds to other banks the banks reserves are increased and hence their lending power is increased thus causing even more inflation. In recessive times, of course, the intent is to stop a deflation, create credit and make “money” move. Much of the value of money is in its movement and all the rest is in confidence. The credit crunch has slowed movement tremendously. But often those with hands on the levers are unsure if reality equals textbook.

  Money and Banking 301 a la 1952. Probably changed.

As for American cars in later posts, ask the US makers why they continued to produce cars where the doors don’t fit, where the rate of repair is high and gas mileage is low and they fall apart the day the last payment is made (my experience with Ford, Olds, Pontiac, Chev - all except Rambler.) Since 1992 I have had three Toyota Corollas, nary a problem, very good mileage (40mpg imp.) meanwhile they big three were still making gas guzzling junk. But mind you, they had gps etc. Incidentally, Corollas are made in both US and Canada.  When North American car makers produce good cars that last at a reasonable price people will buy them. (If they have anything left after this debacle, that is.)

By Myronh, November 12 at 10:53 am

Because it is too logical and thus a not an option. Same as years, no decades ago, when the idea of fuel efficiency was discussed for lowering dependence on oil or reducing demand to lower prices. With the colusion of the car and oil industries this is never considered.
I drive a toyota pickup, 2005 model. It gets about 5 mpg less than the 1985 model I had before. But just as mpg is the first most important thing in my considering a vehicle, reliability of the machine is just as important. I would be mightly disappointed to get in a vehicle to go somewhere and it would not start or after driving is for while have it recalled for a defect.
But your idea hopefully will one day be a basis of more realistically priced vehicles and reliable vehicles instead of a greedy corporation trying to make money at the expense of inferior products, which american corporations have become quite adept at producing.

The working presumption here is that there really is some way for people trapped inside a plummeting elevator (Now there’s an intriguing contradiction-in-terms.) to “get a grip” on not just the dynamics of its fall, but on some tangible device that would enable them to at least slow the thing down some…. any effective means of actually arresting the plunge altogether now widely acknowledged as being beyond the passsenger/operators’ reach.  Given the twin- facts that, one, its owners long ago decided there was no need for brakes on this contraption, and, two, that its throttle is welded stuck in “full,” it oughta be painfully clear by now there is absolutely nothing on-board that can serve to either “manage” the rate-of-descent or “control” the damage when the allamericanpipedream comes crashing down into the firm Ground of Living Actuality.

The self-selected “elite” among you, of course, intend to “cushion” the impact on their ownselves by climbing as high as possible on the “global” pyramid-scheme of those hapless domesticated Humans self-designated as “civilized” “individuals”....hoping all of the fatal “shock” will be absorbed by the multiple layers of awe-struck-dumb “lesser orders” stacked, as it is imagined, underneath them.  Here’s the fatal flaw in that plan.  This thing is coming-down “head” first (Remember Einstein showed that the inmates of the “elevator” had no way whatsoever of truly orienting themselves relative to anything at all in the “outside universe.”), and all aboard are about to discover the absolute truth of the Dylanesque dictum:  “....when you’ve reached the top, you’re on the bottom.”

This old Savage offers this observation, made from the safe distance of Indian Country, to all here who might benefit from information not generated solely within the heterodyne whine of your vehicle’s self-contained P.A. system.  For them as still has ears, the real “race-to-the-bottom” better begin NOW!

Hokahey!

Allan Gurfinkle I don’t see any flaws in your explanation, and yes the Fed can create money out of thin air. The Fed can literally print money physically or digitally (1s, 20s, or 100s) and hand the bills out to whom they’d like.

The Fed is owned by it member banks, but is controlled by the governors of the Federal Reserve of New York. Those on the board are just puppets as are the men that met on Jekyll Island. The puppet masters are mainly the House of Rothschild and the Rockefeller Family.

They control the most of the oil and every bank in the western world and quite possible in the entire world through the Bank for International Settlements (BIS), the central bank of central banks. It’s no surprise that all central banks are reducing rates in unison.

Now think about this… the Rothschilds and Rockefellers controlled close to 1/6 of the wealth in the world before the Fed was created. Do you really think their plan was to gain more wealth?

I would argue that what is happening has nothing to do with money/wealth, but rather control. As we watch all currencies collapse, and a new one world currency be ushered in, it will be much easier to control the world.

Yes, there are arguments against this such as gold is a one world currency or the Federal Reserve Note (inaccurately called a “dollar”) is the reserve “one world” currency of the world already. Both can be manipulated, if you own most of the gold or the FRN printing press. For now, this is my opinion and would welcome others.

samosamo is was Amsel Bauer Mayer Rothschild who said, “Let me issue and control a Nation’s money and I care not who makes its laws”.

It is one of his heir, Nathaniel Philip Rothschild, who is now a “member” of the International Advisory Board to Barrick Gold and whose family was an advisor to NovaGold.

Yes, golden rule is… He who has the gold, make the rules.

I’ve added a link to this article on the site
http://www.jeremiahfilms.com/BlogWatch/Economy/
where blog posts related to the Financial Meltdown are placed. There is a considerable amount of information in your presentation - WOW ... I will ask those who are working on a documentary to look at it.

They have a long straw so they can suck deep.  With the corporations all offshore; what do they care about the U.S.?

By Zachary A. Goldfarb, in the Washington Post this morning:
“The insurance giant American International Group, meanwhile reported a $24.5 billion quarterly loss yesterday as the government agreed to offer it a more generous lifeline in the form of a new, $152 billion loan on easier terms. The government extended an $85 billion loan to AIG in September, followed by $38 billion more in October, but the company has been eating away at it at an accelerating pace.”

Everybody has heard the old saw: “you shall know the truth and the truth shall make you free”. Well in this case, when it comes to the evil that is known as corporate economics, how much of the truth you know, is how much of the pain you can bear. This is the greatest robbery in the history of the world.

By Maani, November 10 at 6:56 pm

Damn! Piranha to bloody meat. Or, they want a piece of the pie.

Yo!  Check this out!!

http://money.cnn.com/2008/11/10/news/companies/amex/index.htm?postversion=2008111019

Strange, I don’t see this going back far enough to include the secret Jekkyl Island meeting of a bunch of alias elite that gathered there to draft the federal reserve act, then the subsequent voting on the bill WHEN most of congress had left congress for christmas ensuring passage, then woody the woodpecker wilson signing it into law and his not too later lament that it was not a good law for our country(or something of that nature)and supposedly regretted signing it. Also during woody’s tenure was his buddy Col. House and others forming the Council of Foreign Relations. None of this was good for our country and I am sure all of it was part of the beginning of what has happened to our economic system when it is allowed to be unfettered for the benefit of rich people that just happened to contain a large part of the greed, deviousness, wickedness, criminality and no loyalty to the United States of America for the sake of their personal, financial and control over this country. As one of them said something like this: ‘give me control of the money and I care not who makes the laws’.
And from what I have surmised, that it would even go back further, I just have not read that part of the history. So, I can only come to the conclusion that when it involves unrestricted control of money and the ‘elite’, the criminal mind and deeds sure come forth. So add that to the timeline.

Now the Fed is being sued by Bloomberg News in an FOIA because it won’t release the recipients of more than two trillion dollars in loans.

Just saw on today´s program at http://www.democracynow.org that there may be a secretive, possibly, illegal 140B windfall for the banks. Sounds like socialism for the rich.

Just saw on today´s program at http://www.democracynow.org that there may be a secretive, possibly, illegal 140B windfall for the banks.

Sounds like socialism for the rich as remarked last week on the Bill Moyer´s Report.

I think it was Friday, nobel Prize winner Paul Krugman was on Larry King. They talked about the collapse.

According to Krugman, the bailout is not going to fix things, it’s not going to make the economy good again, it’s only going to try and keep things from becoming much, much worse.

There are still about 10 years to go before the economy stablizes, we’ll have plenty of time of time to talk about this in the future, if we survive.

A very good time line, but unfortunately, this has not stopped. Check out “A Quiet Windfall For U.S. Banks” by Amit R. Paley in The Washington Post. The dummy corporation shell game has returned, and no one seemed to notice. Congress was much too busy being patriotic by saving our beloved mega banks.
It wasn’t that long ago that Senator McCain and his Alaska sidekick were screaming that Obama was a socialist. In Amit Paley’s article he states: “Some conservative economists argue that not only should a firm be able to use losses to offset gains, but that in a year when a company only loses money, it should be entitled to a cash refund from the government.”