One reaches a point where it seems better to leave them to their self induced
nightmare than it is to try to teach those that will not learn. The truth is never
as palatable as the lovely lies that the meme is based upon. One has to wonder
if this meme is a natural consequence of over population and the crash will
just be another correction to eliminate unproductive genes.

The man and his son were right to head for the sea, at least there is water
available. I suspect that water will be the limiting factor for most life forms in
the very near future.

By Night-Gaunt, September 10 at 3:55 pm #

It is an uphill fight because this mountain arrayed against us has been growing
for some time. It isn’t new and has a huge support base. We have lost much
and it has been by little bits. I consider the post World War II gains then loses
starting in 1980 to be deliberate. The Middle Class here didn’t exist before
1945 and was at its peak in 1980. Does that indicate something? I believe so.

The counter-revolution against our secular republic is almost over and when
the economy does a hard crash that is when the Dominionists come out of
their closet to save us. They will be the only game in town. As they planned. It
is a dangerous game because if they fail we could lose everything and become
a wasteland of scattered nomads rampant starvation and such not much
different from what was depicted in the novel “The Road.”

It is an uphill fight because this mountain arrayed against us has been growing for some time. It isn’t new and has a huge support base. We have lost much and it has been by little bits. I consider the post World War II gains then loses starting in 1980 to be deliberate. The Middle Class here didn’t exist before 1945 and was at its peak in 1980. Does that indicate something? I believe so.

The counter-revolution against our secular republic is almost over and when the economy does a hard crash that is when the Dominionists come out of their closet to save us. They will be the only game in town. As they planned. It is a dangerous game because if they fail we could lose everything and become a wasteland of scattered nomads rampant starvation and such not much different from what was depicted in the novel “The Road.”

You are right, of course, that we cannot fight fire with fire in this instance
without becoming the monster. The only other solution is to teach conceptual
thought to the 300,000,000 Americans that were not taught it in the public
fool system. The desire to learn, just for the sake of learning, has been lost in
the quest for the imaginary wealth of fiat money. Education (as KDelphi
pointed out) is just a tool that the empire uses to train drones for the
corporations. Only by clearing the mind of ALL preconceived notions can the
sheep begin the process of building up their minds to where they can look at a
piece of information and know if it is true or not. The greatest obstacle is the
god meme, it is so ingrained in the culture that only the strongest minds can
kill it.

By Night-Gaunt, September 10 at 2:54 pm #

Subliminal memes are everywhere but not all of them take. Some just have the
psychological trigger in popular culture that allows them to spread and
reproduce on their own. Someone right now is trying to spread a rumor
(another name for such viral constructs) that Glenn Beck is some kind of
“murderer” in his past. Turn about isn’t fair play, it is becoming the monster
you fight.

Subliminal memes are everywhere but not all of them take. Some just have the psychological trigger in popular culture that allows them to spread and reproduce on their own. Someone right now is trying to spread a rumor (another name for such viral constructs) that Glenn Beck is some kind of “murderer” in his past. Turn about isn’t fair play, it is becoming the monster you fight.

The woman from North Carolina who CNN chose to talk
about keeping her child home from school probably
thinks the earth is flat and the sun sets.  WHO the
media choses to put on the media is important in
the indocrination process.  I thought the sight of
the republicians refusing to stand and applaud during
Pres. Obama’s speech said a lot about the ignorance,
corruption, and indocrination taking place on
Capitol Hill.  A picture is worth a thousand words!

I think that memes are implanted using subliminal messages buried within TV
signals and that digital TV will only enhance those messages. Vance Packard
was right…

However I was wrong and it was Edward Bellamy that wrote “Looking Backward 2000-1882” which I am in the process of reading piecemeal now. Interesting tome anyway.

Much ado about nothing. No one has the ability to influence the way the reich-wingers made it out to be. It takes awhile to do it, which they know well. All their indoctrinated flocked to promote this manufactured hysteria. It certainly worked didn’t it? Myths are going viral right now, memes that infect the mind with thoughts that are wrong but are believed to soon to be contradicted easily. Sometimes it is implanted and never leaves.

Indoctrination begins with your parents when they teach you to obey an
imaginary creature. By the time you get to school you are already programmed
not to think and the state adds patriotism to the load of crap that you are
expected believe. It is no wonder that so many Americans are willing to die for
a pipeline across Afghanistan, they have not learned conceptual thought.

Paracelsus—How about Arnie Duncan? j/k

Right it was Francis Bellamy and like you I don’t pledge allegiance to any one or anything.

Interesting bit of trivia, to this day when the Mexicans pledge to their flag, or a president is, he raises his hand in the Bellamy Salute!

Funny our Congress keeps the fasci symbol (which is also one that represents democracy) but lost the hand out salute to the flag. Such artifice I have no use for. Even the hammer and sickle have less emotional baggage than the swastika. Hitler vilified more than Stalin</b> though he killed many more than Hitler had a chance to. Amazing what advertising can do, and losing. If you win then it is much harder to put you down no matter how vile you are.

No Child Left Behind and unfunded mandate that <b>Ted Kennedy supported. Not one of his shining moments.

And remember that NO Child Left Behind has given the
US military 40MILLION names, addresses, social security numbers, tel. nos. and email urls of junior and senior high school students…. Recruiters lie, then sign up as many (especially students from “minority groups”) as possible and then “indoctrinate” as can.

@ Night Gaunt

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Bellamy

Mere quibbling, Night Gaunt. I don’t approve of oaths of allegiance to the flag even if it is standing in for a republic. About 20 years after this pledge was popularized, we had this egghead from Princeton telling us how to think and arresting anyone who didn’t agree with him. As to the present P of A, we had the God part inserted during Eisenhower’s administration, because some Christian ministers felt that the pledge would be confused with allegiance to socialist republics. (Francis Bellamy was a Christian socialist.) The pledge was felt to be overly generic and universal without God appended to it. The old pledge had something of a Roman salute to the flag, which Hitler had thought was useful for his own purposes. Anyhow I feel the schooling has become overly politicized from a centralized point of power. BTW, Ed Bellamy thought of popularizing the pledge as a way to sell flags. So the school systems of the States were drafted into helping a private company sell flags. Doesn’t that sound familiar?

My main point here is that school systems should be kept free of political interests, whether it be Presidents grooming youth to be future party members or a company trying to sell flags. I don’t understand the name calling, the acrimony, the accusations of extremism, racism, etc.

Indocrination means to instruct in doctrine(s).
We are surrounded daily by various indocrinations
coming from various sources.  The challege confronting us is to choose the doctrines that will
help our children in the future to understand the
knowledge and means for utilizing that knowledge
to design an environment conducive to human growth
and development of all people sharing earth at the
same time.

The current Pledge of Allegiance isn’t approved by Francis Bellamy at all. I would expect better from such and old alchemist as yourself Paracelsus. The original pledge was for “to the republic” (any one you live in) and there was no mention of “God” nor of the “United States” which adulterated it and nationalized it for one country. It was Edward Bellamy and it was for all republics. Hardly “indoctrination” from them now is it?

When you don’t teach critical thinking then all education becomes indoctrination. Like going to church is also indoctrination too for the only critical thinking is that from which you theocracy flows. It is only turned on those things that don’t fit whatever orthodoxy that is learned.

All this hysteria is hyped just to add to the fear being generated and portraying Obama as a dangerous person. Though Reagan & GHWB (who was running for president at the time) did the same thing. Also remember GWB and 9/11/01? It is nonsense.

I do not think the pledge of allegiance is appropriate either as it is a tool of indoctrination. I do not accept indoctrination from Francis and Edward Bellamy nor do I accept it from Barrack Obama.