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Have We Gone to War Again?

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One Dove, One Hawk: The Night the Feathers Flew

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Posted on Mar 31, 2012

“What you have witnessed,” recently elected British MP George Galloway said back in 2005, speaking of Christopher Hitchens’ support for the U.S.-Iraq War, “... is something unique in natural history: the first ever metamorphosis from a butterfly back into a slug.”

Galloway debated Hitchens at Baruch College in New York City with Amy Goodman of “Democracy Now!” moderating. Americans interested in learning what sort of character the citizens of Bradford West voted into the House of Commons in Friday’s by-election should watch Galloway defend the international anti-war movement against one of the most formidable rhetorical pugilists of our time. —ARK




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moonraven's avatar

By moonraven, April 4, 2012 at 11:20 am Link to this comment

jimmy:  Are you really as thick as you come across here?

Lighten up, you are nothing special on the planet—just another militant white guy with no sense of humor nor geopolitics.

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By John Dean, April 4, 2012 at 8:47 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

One aspect of Hitchen’s world view that is rarely mentioned is his misunderstanding of the right’s agenda in Amerika. While he was focusing on the clearly brutal Hussein he missed the obvious and continued fascistization that accelerated under the guise of the GWOT. He either rejected the progressive concern with the internal militarization of domestic US security and the consumption of social progress by the corporate state or was completely unaware of this misdirection posed to Amerikan society. All in all he was more of an idea man than a true analyzer of practical security for the mass of the public whose threat comes clearly more from within than from without.

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By ian m, April 3, 2012 at 10:00 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

It was a startling metamorphosis but then again, Hitch was quite an ugly butterfly.

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David J. Cyr's avatar

By David J. Cyr, April 3, 2012 at 10:14 am Link to this comment

Since the Truthdig “progressives” chose to provide a video presenting the slug’s position in (1 of 12), here is the (3 of 12) portion of Galloway’s response:

George Galloway vs Christopher Hitchens (3 of 12):

Voter Consent Wastes Dissent:

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By John Poole, April 2, 2012 at 5:13 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

To PatrickHenry: We probably have different definitions for Deist and Theist but
maybe we can agree that someone who defines themselves with a negative (what
they DON’T believe to be the situation- Atheist) is a fool. What’s with the need to
put a label to one’s philosophical outlook?  I’m a clueless hetero earthling and
even that definition is quite provincial and lame.

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By John Poole, April 2, 2012 at 2:50 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Needing to define oneself in one camp or the other implies a closed mind. A self
defined atheist is defining himself in the negative.  Maybe there is confusion about
Deism and Theism on this site.

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By Tobysgirl, April 2, 2012 at 12:43 pm Link to this comment

jimmmmmmy, who can’t seem to get his finger off the m key, don’t get into it with moonraven because she’s about a hundred times smarter than you are.

I really wish that posters would learn to use punctuation and other minor inventions that make English much easier to read. I want to read everyone’s comments, but turn off quickly when the post appears to be nothing but a collection of various words picked out of the dictionary at random.

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By jimmmmmy, April 2, 2012 at 9:44 am Link to this comment

Moonraven a hobby horse was a wooden toy when I was a child. Maybe the term has aquired a new definition?I remember small kids rocking madly back and forth on them,thus the allusion to peoples pet peeves.

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moonraven's avatar

By moonraven, April 2, 2012 at 9:22 am Link to this comment


You don’t even read your own posts, I see—pure boiler plates?

Hobby horse, I believe, was a term you used.

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EmileZ's avatar

By EmileZ, April 2, 2012 at 4:42 am Link to this comment

Galloway CREAMED The Hitch!!!

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By Jon, April 1, 2012 at 7:52 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I just discovered this debate earlier today and enjoyed taking it in. I don’t know
anything about Mr. Galloway, but it seems to me that he never once even tried to
answer or counter the charges leveled against him by Mr. Hitchens regarding his
association with and support for despots who have of late been so much in the
news. I say this as someone who nevertheless comes down on Mr. Galloway’s side
in this particular debate, and who laments the descent into fanaticism and binary
absolutism that characterized the last phase of Mr. Hitchens’ otherwise brilliant
and inspiring career. That even he could be sucked in by the poison of neocon
thuggery - that he could not see through the smokescreen of WMD and the
spreading of freedom - ought to remind us that even the best and brightest of us
higher mammals can be blinded by our own arrogance and self-righteousness.

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By RickinSF, April 1, 2012 at 7:18 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Hitchens gave aid and comfort to the enemy.

Fuck him.

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By Face, April 1, 2012 at 6:07 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Regarding Hitchens….

How can someone so Eloquent . . Be So Wrong ?

Regarding Galloway..

The Greatest Orator in Britian Today.

Sharpe. Intuitive. and has been shown

to be Correct About Most Issues he has fought for..

While all 3 parties in the Uk are beholden to

Plutocrats and Oligarchs ...

Gorgeous George cannot be Bought

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Robespierre115's avatar

By Robespierre115, April 1, 2012 at 6:01 pm Link to this comment

@Heather and there YOU go again with your simpleton finger wagging lacking any depth or substance. Please return when you have learned how to take some ideas and actually form a coherent collection of sentences which might just contribute to a wider discussion.

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PatrickHenry's avatar

By PatrickHenry, April 1, 2012 at 4:45 pm Link to this comment

John Poole,

The difference I see between Deists and Atheists is that Deists do believe in the big spirit as a non-demoninational higher entity, Athiests are absolutists and believe what they see or have learned.

Boring for some, life encompassing for others.

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By jimmmmmy, April 1, 2012 at 4:40 pm Link to this comment

Brian its on you-tube its worth seeing if you love debate. These guys were really old school.

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By jimmmmmy, April 1, 2012 at 4:36 pm Link to this comment

John Poole. Like vector 56 your ego seems to have surpassed your intellect. If you don’t understand the differences between Deists and Atheists why are you commenting. Maybe time to do a little reading? Or is it too boring?

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By jimmmmmy, April 1, 2012 at 2:25 pm Link to this comment

moonraven. I’m a city boy I don’t get the horsey stuff . Whats your point.

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By Michael Cavlan RN, April 1, 2012 at 1:42 pm Link to this comment

While other “liberal and progressive” blogs prattle on about nothing. Here, from firedoglake an article and a candidate that they do not want you to know about.

Can ya dig it? As in TruthDig it?

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moonraven's avatar

By moonraven, April 1, 2012 at 12:55 pm Link to this comment

jimmy:  What’s the burr under YOUR saddle?

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By litlpeep, April 1, 2012 at 10:28 am Link to this comment

Was this posting an intentional selling of something that is free at utube?

Capitalism’s politics has strange bedfellows.

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By Heather, April 1, 2012 at 9:51 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

There you go again Robespierre!
Your writing is not living up to your rather grand ‘handle’.

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By jimmmmmy, April 1, 2012 at 9:17 am Link to this comment

I watch Galloway weekly on his streamed public affairs show. Maybe he could invite Olbermann on now that he’s unemployed That to me has great entertainment as well as informative possibilties. Both have “axes to grind” and “hobby horses to ride”

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By jimmmmmy, April 1, 2012 at 9:05 am Link to this comment

Galloway in ascendence and Hitch dead the worlds out of balance. Lafayette I suggest you watch Neil Olivers History of Scotland. Scots did not speak Gaelic, the Gaels did. The use of this language today is a tourist hustle or affectation of some aristocrats. HIstory has not yet proven Galloway correct . The Bush Doctrine is still spinning out in the Middle East under Obama more capable control. Which I find to be one of those enjoyable ironies. Ayn Rand And Chris Hitchens , Maybe sexually certainly not politically. Galloway require a nemisis to be effective some passionate gifted orator? Is there anybody out there? Maybe Slick Willy Clinton , how about the other corporate hero Obama ? Might be a good debate.

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vector56's avatar

By vector56, April 1, 2012 at 7:00 am Link to this comment

I too have a great respect for Galloway who seems to understand that killing other people and taking their “stuff” (in this case oil) is not civilized behavior.

Christopher Hitchens and those Ayn Rand groupies over at “Reason” magazine are giving my people (Atheist) a bad name.

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By John Poole, April 1, 2012 at 5:07 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I ignore people who are determined to establish their manhood and existential
bravery by saying daddy in the sky never existed or by now is dead. Atheists are
really no different from Deists - both types are boring.

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By Tony Vodvarka, April 1, 2012 at 3:45 am Link to this comment

Galloway has been a hero of mine ever since he
testified before a Congressional committee to defend
his reputation a few years ago and left Norm Coleman
“stunned and confused like a duck struck on the head”.

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Lafayette's avatar

By Lafayette, April 1, 2012 at 1:52 am Link to this comment

From WikiP:

Galloway was born in the Lochee area of Dundee to a Scottish trade unionist father and Irish republican mother

Wow, it is difficult to get more Left than Left in Europe. He’s got Leftist genes ... though its a shame he was not born in the Gorbals of Glasgow. That would make for the ultimate in Leftist credentials.

The Scots are funny people with a great, good grasp of a foreign language called English. (Real Scots speak the Celtic language.)

But, he’s a humorous guy with a wicked command of HMtQ’s English. Besides, his heart is in he right place. Or is that “Left place”.

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Robespierre115's avatar

By Robespierre115, April 1, 2012 at 1:08 am Link to this comment

History has proven Galloway correct while Hitchens has been reduced to a pathetic gasbag who backed imperialist wars and neocon violence. His fans cling to the fact that he poked fun at Jesus and Muhammed (how groundbreaking) to justify their adoration for the blowhard.

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By Brian Routh, April 1, 2012 at 12:10 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

you chose the Htchens speech by mistake…..there is no Galloway in the above

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