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Flotilla Debate: Glenn Greenwald vs. Eliot Spitzer

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Posted on Jun 1, 2010

Who knew Eliot Spitzer was such an Israel apologist? Guest-hosting on MSNBC, the former New York governor tries to get an uncooperative Glenn Greenwald to accept Israel’s assault on the aid flotilla and Israel’s devastating blockade of Gaza as “reasonable.”

More on the exchange from Glenn Greenwald.

MSNBC:

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By last_boy_scout, June 7, 2010 at 1:22 am Link to this comment

I came across a curious investigation couple of days
ago; it was carried out
by some Israeli historian named Schlomo Sand (here’s
his wiki article).
He considered it to be the so-called “deadend of the
national mythologization”.

I’ve come to know about the guy
here

Report this

By stephen david geller, June 3, 2010 at 8:38 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I distinguish Zionism from Jewish fundamentalism. There is an enormous
difference.

I condemn fundamentalism, be it Jewish or Christian or Islamic.

The Israeli-Palestinian tragedy is an ongoing tragedy that was never addressed
with the founding of Israel, and which became central to its history, in 1967,
and is now coming home to roost.

The tragedy is that the present Israeli government is as stupid and as arrogant
as the rest of the parties involved in its history.

And the bigger tragedy is the tone of so many of these e-mails—-ill-
informed, malignant, violent, a cesspool of insults. An excuse for anti-
semitism, Jew-baiting, and self-loathing.

Every tradition asks for compassion and the obligation to treat others as you
would be treated. Give. Share. Sorry if that sounds Pollyanna-like on my part.
Give. Share. Treat others with mercy and lovingkindness.

Anything less is Gaza, whether it’s on Wall Street, at Warner Brothers or the
World Wildlife Fund.

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By LJL, June 2, 2010 at 11:10 pm Link to this comment

The person calling itself “freedom of speech my ass” is disgusting.  He is pure insane hatred.  Why the hell did he have to pull his foul speech out of his ass and smear it all over these pages?

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By Shingo, June 2, 2010 at 7:40 pm Link to this comment

“Turkey felt rejected when not qualifying for the European Union, so PLAN B SUPPORT IRAN”

Do you really think anyone’s going to fall for that BS Peter?  The French are talking about succession from the EU, which risks falling apart, so I doubt Turkey are sulking about that. Iran happens to be one of the largest states in the Middle east with massive oil and gas reserves.  Doing business with Iran makes perfect sense and trying to prevent the region descending into war is in everyone’s interests , even Israel’s,. though they don’;t seem to realize it.

Secondly, Iran has no nukes, so there are no nukes to support. Nor are they making them, which is why you won’t be able to produce one iota of evidence to prove otherwise.

“Remember Turkey and Brazil thought they had solved the Iranian issue, 3 weeks ago, only to be rejected once more!”

By the US yes.  The UN have largely embrace it as have the Chinese and the Russians.

You’re trying so desperately to make this about Iran.  First you cite nukes that the next thing you;re suggesting is that because Iran are mean to gays, that makes them a threat to Israel.

Whatever you’re smoking, it must be pretty awesome!

BTW.  Iran do not behead people.  You;re confusing them with US allies, Saudi Arabia.

I think you’re long overdue for a detox.

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Peter Knopfler's avatar

By Peter Knopfler, June 2, 2010 at 7:23 pm Link to this comment

Is it possible to stay on subject not like Glagla-Klungly, personal rudness with grade four spelling, Like a GLAD_FLY IN THE Wind, knowing little. Or is that your Technical english jibberish. Back to the subject at hand,Turkey felt rejected when not qualifying for the European Union, so PLAN B SUPPORT IRAN trying to pick a fight with Israel to show support for Iranian nukes. Remember Turkey and Brazil thought they had solved the Iranian issue, 3 weeks ago, only to be rejected once more!. So run the blockade, Turkey-Hamas_Iran what team of misfits. I hope Israel is not so kind to the next Floatkilla, as for Humanitarian. Iran-Hamas EXECUTE GAY PEOPLE, YES HOMOSEXUALS AND LESBIANS DEATH NO TRIALS, JOURNALSTS GET TRIALS THEN OFF WITH THEIR HEADS,HUMANITARIAN…WHERE? I know ITS OK KILLING GAY PEOPLE!! that is what all you critics are supporting! nice people ya!

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By Glagla-Klungly, June 2, 2010 at 3:24 pm Link to this comment

Mr knopler you almos as stupid as that spitzer guy you now he talk liked the snaked and peoples learned nothink from that guy,you say everythink ok for jew guy to do becuzz hapen many time befor.only
dum people thing like that you noo and the roket that the poor gaza is piece of garbiges what you never watched tv.you look like you lived good on the bitch but not drink to much ok sir son very stronk

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By Shingo, June 2, 2010 at 3:23 pm Link to this comment

The clip is up on Youtube if you can’t see it here.

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Ed Harges's avatar

By Ed Harges, June 2, 2010 at 3:17 pm Link to this comment

re:By PatrickHenry, June 2 at 6:55 pm:

Thanks! But hey - where is the video clip?

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By PatrickHenry, June 2, 2010 at 2:55 pm Link to this comment

Illiberal, I like that Ed.

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Ed Harges's avatar

By Ed Harges, June 2, 2010 at 2:32 pm Link to this comment

Why is the video not here? There’s not even a link to it. Has TD been hacked?

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Ed Harges's avatar

By Ed Harges, June 2, 2010 at 2:06 pm Link to this comment

Well, it’s convenient that Spitzer has so brazenly revealed his true colors.

Now we liberals, should we ever have to consider voting for Spitzer for high
national office, don’t have to wonder whether his ethnic loyalty to Israel trumps
his supposed liberal principles, making him a danger to world peace.

But you know, it so often does turns out to be the case that liberals of a
certain ethnicity are very destructively, savagely illiberal concerning the
Middle East, doesn’t it?

One might almost be tempted to avoid, as a general principle, voting for any
politician of that ethnicity - unless that politician explicitly disavows the pro-
Israel orthodoxies which have been so catastrophic for American foreign policy
over the last 40 or 50 years.

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By Sodium-Na, June 2, 2010 at 1:37 pm Link to this comment

Is Elliot Spitzer the same guy who was caught cheating on his wife by committing an act of fornication with a prostitute? If he is,does MSNBC expect me,as a viewer,to take his words seriously? Wishful thinking!!

A thousand cheers to Glenn Greenwald….

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By FiGi, June 2, 2010 at 9:17 am Link to this comment

I think Spitzer and Lawrence O’Donnell are angling for their own show on MSNBC.  They are a$$-kissing to please the Zionist overlords of the MSM.

Glen Greenwald:  You rock!!!

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By Anarcissie, June 2, 2010 at 9:15 am Link to this comment

Peter Knopfler, June 1 at 11:40 pm:
‘I find this comedy, stale, everyone of these countries, their critics of Israel, have worse records, themselves, Turkey-genecide of Armenians, Egypt like USA always tortures….’

Tu quoque is a poor defense since it begins by admitting guilt.

I think those who want to shill for Israel should relax.  It is almost certain that nothing will happen, just as nothing happened as a result of any of the previous atrocities.

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By iona48, June 2, 2010 at 8:51 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

We need more Glen Greenwalds.

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By Carl, June 2, 2010 at 8:35 am Link to this comment

You could mention that Spitzer is Jewish. Many sensible Jewish Americans suddenly become insane when discussing Israel. Bill Maher is a great example, who argued that ethnic cleansing has gone on for centuries so its no big deal when Israel does it.

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By RdV, June 2, 2010 at 7:21 am Link to this comment

It was essentially a turkish ship and most of the humanitarians were Turkish—not Hamas as Spitzer claims.
  And wouldn’t Turks on a Turkish ship defend themselves from armed commandos invading?
Do they not have the right to defend themselves?

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By altara, June 2, 2010 at 7:15 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

“What is missing so far from flotilla clips on both sides is context: it is difficult to say who attacked first.”  NY Times

Military boarding in the dead of night is not an attack?

homer   http://www.altara.blogspot.com

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By RdV, June 2, 2010 at 7:15 am Link to this comment

With Greenwald it is always about the truth.
Have to admire him for that.

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By balkas, June 2, 2010 at 6:50 am Link to this comment

Oh, c`mon folks, israeli commandos were invited to board the ships in order to ambush them and then blame israel.

Israeli commandos came on ships to help in unloading and distributing much unneeded food stuff but the vicious peace activists made fools out of them.

The damn goyim are always making fools of the `jews`!
It is got to stop!
Btw, i am 0001% shemitic;01% apache, zulu, chinese; 1% rom,roman, circasian, mongol and so on.
Thus i can`t be antishemitic, antizulish or anti-salish nor anti any ethnos.
Maybe just self hating! No maybe ab it; i hate self.
Otherwise i wldn`t be posting on 3 or 4 sites!

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By Bolton, June 2, 2010 at 6:00 am Link to this comment

As long as religions exist, there will be no peace. Religion is a primitive form of fear based control that is esculating to world war. How can educated people still believe in fairy tales? Ignorance feeds religions, and religions only bring hate, intolerance, and violence. The human race has come so far, but at the same time it has learned nothing from history. The human race is the master and destroyer of its own destiny.It is truely amazing how easy it is to brainwash people in the 21st century. Everyone needs to smoke a joint and chill out.

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By Ken Bubb, June 2, 2010 at 5:56 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Elliot Spitzer openly declared his biased reporting toward Israel in the discussion on the Freedom Flotilla.  He and his guest expert on international law argued the legality of Israel’s actions.  Very, very strange that Mr. Spitzer can’t learn from experience.  Mr. Spitzer’s past escapades lost him his position and deadened his ambitions.  His trysts were “legal” but were not considered “moral” by the public.  Israel’s actions with the one and a half million Palestinians in Gaza are “immoral”.  Don’t argue the “legality” of Israel’s actions, argue the “morality”.  But, of course, there are no valid arguments about the “morality” of Israel’s treatment of the Gazans.  A real low point in TV journalism, Mr. Spitzer!!

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thecrow's avatar

By thecrow, June 2, 2010 at 5:25 am Link to this comment

“Dispatcher: Jersey City police.
Caller: Yes, we have a white van, 2 or 3 guys in there, they look like Palestinians and going around a building.
Caller: There’s a minivan heading toward the Holland tunnel, I see the guy by Newark Airport mixing some junk and he has those sheikh uniform.
Dispatcher: He has what?
Caller: He’s dressed like an Arab.”

——————————————

“09.40 a.m. - Abu Dhabi: Report that the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine carried out the attack; later denied.”

http://www.rte.ie/news/features/oneyearon/timeline.html

“In the West Bank, Qais abu Leila, leader of the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine, denied any connection to the incident”

http://edition.cnn.com/2001/WORLD/europe/09/11/trade.centre.reaction/

———————————————

http://michaelfury.wordpress.com/2008/08/18/movers-and-shakers/

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By dsmith, June 2, 2010 at 3:46 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

Glenn ate him alive. The bottom line is…The Israelis are trying to starve and terrorize the entire Palestinian population into leaving the Gaza. The Palestinians are saying F##k you and staying put. Good for them. Stop all aid to Israel and you will see a two state solution before the end of the week.

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By diamond, June 2, 2010 at 2:58 am Link to this comment

I certainly don’t wonder Shingo. I’m angry myself and I’m not even a Palestinian, but I have the misfortune to be cursed with empathy, as I imagine the people on that flotilla were, and this is something the Israeli state does not have and does not even allow, as the treatment of Israeli peace activists and other ‘undesirables’ in Israel proves.

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By Shingo, June 2, 2010 at 2:20 am Link to this comment

Well said Diamond,

I too and looking forward to hearing McGeogh’s side of the story.  Apparently he’s not being released at this stage because he won’t do a deal to shut about about what he saw.

Israel can release all the footage taken by the members of the peace convoy to prove they were attacked first.

They wont.

Israel can give open access to Gaza for any accredited journalist to prove they are not suffering under the seige.

They wont.

Israel can ask for United Nations inspectors for clearing aid shipments to prove they have no weapons.

They wont.

Israel is keeping the Palestinians locked up in an open air prison with shattered infrastructure and conditions that the RSPCA would not allow you to keep animals.

You wonder why the Palestinians get angry?

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By diamond, June 2, 2010 at 2:03 am Link to this comment

The Israeli commandos were firing as they came down the ropes and they continued to fire while aboard the boat killing 10 and wounding dozens. So far, since the boat was in international waters and they were firing on unarmed civilians, that makes it piracy and murder. They shot an Australian in the leg. Thank you Israel for returning Australia’s years of friendship and support with gunfire. They also arrested and threw in jail an Australian journalist Paul McGeoghan and his camera person. And how was Israel threatened in any way? These terrorists were lugging flour and cooking oil , medicines and building materials, as Israel knew perfectly well. In any case it’s not going to stop because another flotilla is soon to depart for Gaza all over again. How many people is Israel prepared to kill and how much blood does America have to have on its hands before Bibi is told to lay off the people of Gaza or have all those billions from America used to arm the commandos so they could kill these people cut off?

I can’t wait for Paul McGeoghan’s report. Should be a doozy.

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By Commune115, June 2, 2010 at 1:25 am Link to this comment

First Spitzer, can’t wait to see what Bill Maher and Jon Stewart babble to try and justify this latest Israeli crime.

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By Shingo, June 2, 2010 at 1:07 am Link to this comment

“Glen. Leave us to do the world a favour.”

I see you’re still buying that crap about being a shining light unto the world Peter.

Good for you.

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By Blindboy Bob, June 2, 2010 at 12:59 am Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

What an image: Dershowitz and Spitzer dancing naked in a secret meeting on the top floor of a hotel in Dubai. Sadly I had been rooting for Spitzer’s comeback—no more. Sad to see how badly he want to make a comeback that he would lick a pockmarked and sagging Israeli ass. 

Thanks Glen.

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By Shingo, June 2, 2010 at 12:45 am Link to this comment

Again Peter Knopfler, you’re talking out of your hat.

Maybe the weed you’ve been smoking has caused you short term memory loss, but when the Iranians last seized 15 British Sailors, they were returned in better shape than when they were captured.

Not a shot was fired.

But the brunt of your argument seems to be that genocide is cool because everyone else does it.  That’ll work.

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By Shingo, June 2, 2010 at 12:40 am Link to this comment

Peter Knopfler

Where did you get the idea that Hams won the vote at gun point?  The elections were passed as free ans fair, whcih is why the wrong side won as far as Israel and the US are consider.

As for rockets, Israel has fired about 3 times as many shells into Gaza, beginning with the pullout in 2005 - 3006, where they launched 7,700 shells.

No punishment to Isarael of course.

You clearly have no idea what you’ve talking about. Maybe you’ve smoked too many herbs.

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By LJL, June 2, 2010 at 12:38 am Link to this comment

Hamas and Zionist Israel are morally indistinguishable, they are both tribal types with dirty hands. Neither deserves any sympathy from any good person no matter how much pity they really should have. I, however,  feel sorry for those poor people on the peace flotilla who sailed into that tribal savagery and were brutalized for their goodness.

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By Shingo, June 2, 2010 at 12:34 am Link to this comment

That was truly a thing of beauty.  Greenwald destroyed Spitzer.

I am astounded that someone as educated as Spitzer could demonstrate such ignorance.

Spitzer did get one lie through. Early on in the clip, he claimed that Israel just wanted to verify the cargo was free of weapons and that it was prepared to allow the ships to continue on to Gaza after verification, which is clearly false.

He also had the audacity to claim that Egypt was a democracy, which left my mouth gaping. 

Thank God the narrative is finally being allowed to go beyond the AIPAC approved script.

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By ofersince72, June 1, 2010 at 10:16 pm Link to this comment

WHAT DID YOU SAY GERARD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I AM NOT SHOUTING!!!!!!!!!!!

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By P. T., June 1, 2010 at 10:11 pm Link to this comment

Israel did not attack the ship to inspect it.  The attack was in order to seize the ship.

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By gerard, June 1, 2010 at 9:47 pm Link to this comment

Postscript:  To headline this video as a “debate” is the height of dishonesty on the part of Truthdig.  It is a shouting match and throws only invective into an already heated situation.  What is needed is fact-based discussion, not “sound and fury signifying nothing.”  Sadly, Truthdig is not alone in this propaganda-pandering.  The general understanding of the word “debate” has long since become “shouting match” in the dumbed-down wits of the under-educated American public.  But—Truthdig could do better!

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By gerard, June 1, 2010 at 9:42 pm Link to this comment

Maybe I’m wrong here, but to expect the flotilla to stop in Haifa for Israeli inspection, knowing its cargo would be confiscated and never reach the Palestinians, is unrealistic—especially since the cargo was cleared by Turkey, an ally of Israel until this incident. And especially considering the nature of the internationals on board.
  In addition, if Israel felt so worried about it, they could have made a previous announcement of their intentions and had soldiers not bearing arms board it. In all probability, if the Israelis had announced their intentions in a nonthreatening way ahead of time, they would have been allowed to board without incident and their suspicions would have been assuaged without any aggressive behavior.
  It is true that this mission lacked adequate training in nonviolent action, which put it at risk for belligerence.  But there was no reasonable ground for suspicion on the part of Israel, and it is the preemptive nature of their response that encouraged violence.  The small resistance with clubs, sticks or whatever put the icing on the cake, so to speak, as all Israel needed was an excuse: 
“We had to shoot in self-defense.”
  It is a crying shame—literally—that the specifics of nonviolent response are not well known and broadly understood, and are therefore neglected when they could be very useul in defanging dangerous situations.

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By GoyToy, June 1, 2010 at 9:40 pm Link to this comment

It is time that American Jews unequivocally condemn this outrage against the Freedom Flotilla. And, no I am not being anti-Semite because there are many good, intelligent and moral Jews whom I admire. For anyone who follows events in the ME, some of the best writing on the subject comes not from Arabs or Muslims but from Jews of conscience like Glenn. God bless them!

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By P. T., June 1, 2010 at 8:22 pm Link to this comment

The disgraced former governor ran for cover and got Glenn Greenwald off the show.

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Peter Knopfler's avatar

By Peter Knopfler, June 1, 2010 at 7:40 pm Link to this comment

I find this comedy, stale, everyone of these countries, their critics of Israel, have worse records, themselves, Turkey-genecide of Armenians, Egypt like USA always tortures,If those ships were in Iranian waters PARTY TIME, executions, Turkey has nothing to say about Human rights neither do any of the others, Saudis killing, People Of Yemen dragged the USA into that one. 11 die battling IDF Navy, Drone attacks kill hundreds, U.N. Congo troops kill rape hundreds, where is your voice when USA bombs Pakistan, Afghanistan,Iraq, Yemen,Somalia. Seems double standard. Turkey will get cooked, Lebanon will get none, Iran will turn and run, Israel stands proudly alone, thats OK!

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By PatrickHenry, June 1, 2010 at 6:37 pm Link to this comment

Elliot has got to kiss the ring if he wishes any future in the political arena, especially New York.

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By mecormany, June 1, 2010 at 6:36 pm Link to this comment

So what is it it, Spitzer? Is Israel an occupation force and they get to attack humanitarian ships to look for arms or have they left Gaza like they say they have and have NO right to interfere with these ships or maintain a blockade.
Either way, there is a axis of evil all right—Israel and the USA. Hopefully they’ll go down together—lying every step of the way. All both countries know how to do is kill innocents, play the victim and make enemies—even out of former allies.
Spitzer you are totally disgusting.

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By Peter Knopfler, June 1, 2010 at 6:10 pm Link to this comment

Hey, for public TV, Spitzer was very professional on how he handled motor mouth Gled. Glens emotional rantings and his ravings yes Hamas at gun point was voted in… rockets and all therefore collective vote… collective justice…. collective punishment, shoot rockets thousands and no punishment to Hamas. Double standards by GLEN AGAIN. Israel is absolutely correct, after many warnings, Yes time to look in the Mirror American Glen your Drone attacks and bombings of Pakistan, Yemen, Afghanistan Iraq, “When YOU AMERICAN GLEN! LIVE IN A GLASS HOUSE; THROW NO STONES” preach to your mirror, Glen. Leave us to do the world a favour.

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By ofersince72, June 1, 2010 at 4:48 pm Link to this comment

Eliot Spitzer, has absolutly no credibility except with
die hard liberals that don’t stand for anything other
than mouthy nothingness.

He ran like a coward
then wants to come back a hero

You a just a crude coward Spitzer

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By doublestandards/glasshouses, June 1, 2010 at 4:15 pm Link to this comment
(Unregistered commenter)

I’d rather listen to Eliot Spitzer than Alan Dershowitz on the ME situation.  A debate between Greenwald and Spitzer on the whole subject of the Israeli - Palestinian conflict would be good.

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By antispin, June 1, 2010 at 3:54 pm Link to this comment

There goes my respect and admiration for Elliot Spitzer.  I guess he truly is a whoremonger.

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