Wow samo,

So you pretty much just read the first line of my post and then vomited all over the keyboard.  Where in my comment do you get that I want to give any money to anyone.  Take off the blinders, take off the I-hate-anything-that-even-looks-conservative glasses, and then follow this short process before posting again:  READ (preferably the whole post), THINK, THINK (really think this time), then POST.

And seriously, if you don’t have the vocabulary to express yourself without profanity, buy a dictionary.

By Jeff29, September 30 at 9:32 am

NO, you are wrong, YOU give YOUR money to those bastards on wall street and the big finance boys because it is all about GRAND LARCENY. They are crooks plain and simple seeking out any and every loop hole to get that money into their accounts and to hell with everybody else.
You obviously did not watch the whole speech and/or did not pay attention as pelosi spelled out the real issues quite well with ‘just giving these bastards $700,000,000,000.00 and paulson god type rule’ over our treasury. Crap, where have you been these past 16 to 40 years? Just what the hell do you think the ‘unfettered’ free market/capitalism/enterprise system is? Something that helps everybody? Never occurred to you it was a cover for grand larceny made up to appear legal, did it? How many times would you keep bailing these people out before you realize you could not print anymore money? You must be getting your cut through your favorite congressional crook.
Bush is responsible because this is, right now, not 8 years ago, this is his watch and he and his favorite fuck boys came up with this grand plan to siphon off another huge chunk of money wasted and stolen by incompetent and crooked bastards that will continue to steal until the end of this term and then we, the people of america are going to have to hope the next batch of newly electeds will show some balls and put in place and institute the oversight, the regulation, the supervision, the prosecution of anyone breaking the laws, new and old. If any of these pricks were honest and did and honest days work we would not be in this situation and YOU are the classic example of why we the people are just as much to blame for what has and is happening because we have learned that we don’t have to participate in the maintenance of our democracy or what is left of it.
And are you surprise at the market today? Came back almost 500 points just as would be expected with such a huge sell off from the previous day and because pelosi and other, both dem & repub, and we didn’t have to cough up $700,000,000,000.00 for a bunch of incompetent crooks.

Doesn’t this go farther back than eight years ago?Republicans have been trying to deregulate everything forever,Reagan and the air-traffic controllers,the New Deal.Could someone explain how this bail out is picking yourself up by your bootstraps?

It was a stupid speech because she was wrong.

The seeds of this problem were sewn decades ago and have been perpetuated by both Republican and Democratic administrations along the way.  The Bush administration is no more responsible than the Clinton administration who essentially made sub-prime lending a requirement for the banks (In all fairness to Slick Willey there was a lot of pressure to do this, particularly by ACORN - wait, who was their lead attorney again?).

As far as the problems with derivatives and other higher-risk investments gone bad, these are not the result of regulatory inadequacies, these are a problem stemming from the fact that these big banks believe that the government has their back.  They, therefore take risks that under normal circumstances they would not have taken (yesterday’s Citibank/Wachovia scam is a perfect example).

Anyway, I assume that Pelosi knows this and is simply playing partisan politics - shocking!

By Rus7355, September 30 at 3:00 am

Why is that a stupid speech at the wrong time? Did you just happen to be anticipating a jump in the market and bought some clever stocks to cash in on? And then had to dive for cover to avert a big loss?  What ever the reasons for your comment you apparently expected or were in position to make gains on this the great american false economy. And just like the junkie you are satisfied with our ‘strong’ economy that is based on what? And you like to believe in clowns like mccain that claim the economy is strong.
But what the difference, this will get passed and every thing the pelosi tried to bring to light about the bad of this bill will most likely stay in the bill because there are a bunch of sorry motherfuckers who will not adhere to her ‘the party is over’ and ‘regulation, discipline and oversight’ will become standard. They do intend at all costs to make sure the party continues, forever if possible.
And the market for good or bad may just drop on down the the 8k or 7k level before it bottoms out but you cannot blame anyone other than the current administration and the previous ones and most especially yourself and the rest of america because this has been going on for a long time as pelosi stated and it would take a mental retard not to have seen it OR a thief which is what the whole thing became, grand larceny because all that money was there and all the sensible barriers to its theft were slowly eroded and made readily available for the picking.
You just lack a decent amount of patience.

“I think the government should take over the financial industry.” -Big B

That was a joke, right?

James Massina raises an excellent point. When it was just the banks pulling their shell game with credit it was hurting the economy. But when regular citizens remortgaged their houses and pushed their credit in an effort to get their piece of the pie, that’s when the wheels came all the way off the cart!

I think the government should take over the financial industry. But only after it has completly failed! No half assed, ill concieved bail-out schemes. All or nothing!

We will all suffer. but we were going to suffer anyway.

Stop the Bailout
By James Messina

First let’s go back to the beginning starting at the bubble, although I’d rather refer it to a balloon. In the year 2000 just after post doomsday Y2K the balloon was just placed on the air tank stem. During that year a house, let’s say in Holiday Florida would average at $50-60k. During that same year there were many types of easy loans such as HUD and Veteran (it wasn’t necessary to actually be a Vet, one just got a little better rate if you were) which made it easy for the average individual with $500 and a job to obtain approval. Section 8 had a role in this also. If they had 20% of the price of the home they didn’t even need a job. Actually they did, but what was referred to as a “no doc” all they had to do is just say they had an income.
Now here is where the air valve just barley inflates the balloon. Keep in mind that Holiday Florida is just a reference point and places like California and Miami holds the same principle just different prices. These loans usually carried an ARM which meant 5 years down the road Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac would be tacking on another 2.5-3% interest. These easy loans that owners had to put their signatures on, selling their souls sort of speak, compounded by falling prices.
Before they got to that point there was a “get rich quick” craze going on and everybody and his brother became an overnight realtor by “flip that house.” or two or three or four, renting them or just fixing them up, and profiting by the fast rising house prices caused by the craze. 
We can argue who is to blame, apparently both the home buyer and the lender is at fault. The lender acted recklessly and lent and lent and competed to lend. Mortgage and title companies were popping up all over leading the owners like sheep before the slaughter.
The balance of fault lies on the degree of greed. Could you blame the average Joe that wanted to get rich quick or the banks who should have had more sense?
Now that it is obvious how we got there lets propose a way out. Giving 700 billion to the same banks who got us in this predicament, paid for by the average Joe’s taxes and not only that but, Joe must barrow the money with interest just to give it to the ones who lent Joe the money for the house that he is now foreclosed on. That’s like Joe borrowing money to give to heroin dealers in order to make sure they have a steady supply of heroin that they could sell him.
We have another option but of course it will not be considered because the government thinks it is in their best interest to help the banks thinking it will save Wall Street. We have to let the air out of the balloon by getting the prices of homes closer to the year 2000. The way we can do that is instead of giving the money directly to the banks; give it to the notes that are over priced. Let’s start with Joe’s house and his only house for now. If he paid let’s say $200,000 and he is in foreclosure, reset the value to the year 2003. That means rewriting the note. The year used adjusting the house value would be determined according to the magnitude of consequents’ on the little guy until the 700 billion is allocated to first every homeowner that will occupy that house(700 billion will just an arbitrary number for now or just a limit and no way should a fraction of that number be used).  This will in no doubt cause values to come down all over. This plan could be implemented to the relevance of importance. The homeless first then to the struggling families aiming at the outrageously over priced homes, this will hurt the rich and humble undeserving. There are Joe’s out there that flipped houses until he bestowed on half a million dollar house with an income that can’t support it. He may very well eventually be included in this plan when his house is appraised less.

We have become far too accustom to borrowing on credit which is fundamentally against a sound foundation that is not free from exposure to failure. This notion of using “other people’s money” to undergo a project seems to be the theme of success. While it may very well be, there is no accountability if the project failed. They will just file bankruptcy and leave the lender holding the bag. Ultimately the blessing stated in the Bible “they shall lend and not borrow” would certainly be the hope of everyone but that would be impossible, simply because if there was a lender there must be a borrower. The lesson learned we have abused the privilege of credit. This is one habit must be stopped.

It all comes down to the basics, supply & demand. Now the supply is high. By slashing prices will create gamut of demand. New loans, transparency and credit will flow like neighborhoods at a block-party. Credit that is reasonable, credit that is based assists and collateral. This is an approach to bailout Main Street & Wall Street. We can’t reward the banks with money on the backs of taxpayers that require borrowing from other nations. It is not right that government, by use of fear tactics be allowed to execute whatever it fancies regardless of the rights of people.

She still isn’t my favorite but I didn’t see anybody else put his self up there to call a piece of shit a piece of shit. Maybe she is playing a double handed game but at least she said what needs to be said but guess what, we saw it here but the people of america did not see it on msnbc or cnn.  I did not find this speech video on either site. Sure got a ear full from paulson and boenher decrying pelosi’s talking points.
I am happy it was voted down because according to pelosi’s speech, everything I feared was what the current administration was trying to get passed ASAP so no body would have time to see what the people were to really get if it passed. I still say that getting rid of the federal reserve and putting the Council on Foreign Relations and the Trilaterial Commission on notice is most imperative to get a grip back on OUR economy instead of a bunch of greedy evil criminals that have no allegiance to anything but your and my money still in charge of it.
I hope she has called it the way it will be because I would say that w’s world should be a little bit shocked itself for so bold a speech to call a duck a duck. I still don’t like pelosi because of her refusal to impeach w & dick and to sit around for the last 2 years and not doing anything about this economic pile of crap while it was piling up all that time. If she was defeated in november I would not cry but that was a hell of a thing to say and a hell of time to say it.

I agree with BlueEagle.  After hearing all that rhetoric, I cannot, for the life of me, come up with any reason supporting the bailout!  When you strip away all the surface palliatives, the only motives being served are those of shareholders.  Not only does this leave the consumers out in the cold, it also means that businesses must continue to pay more attention to their shareholders than to their customers.

The real problem is that the Congress still lacks the backbone to tell the Executive to get its priorities straight.  Paulson wants us to believe that the problem is all about credit markets:  If there is a danger of credit markets freezing, then loosen them up by pouring money on them.  Actually, the problem is about debt and how it has gotten out of hand.  When we look through the other end of the telescope, we see that debt has become unmanageable through unregulated instruments that basically turned debt into another commodity. The very idea that credit can be marketed is so patently absurd to Main Street that it is no wonder they are up in arms.  They see bailing out the credit markets as giving support to the very institutions that led them to unmanageable debt, most likely through misleading (if not fraudulent) practices.

Pelosi as much as said that doing something about debt is important.  (She said the same about doing something about jobs.) The problem is that she promised that the House would see to it AFTER the bailout bill had been passed.  Jam tomorrow, but never jam today.  What could $700 billion do if it were applied to the debt problems of the American public?  What could it do if it were applied to job creation, providing Americans with earning power to make their debt more manageable?  For further relief from nonsense, see:

http://therehearsalstudio.blogspot.com/2008/09/is-sky- falling-yet.html

Republicans often avoid the truth in the political context.  They accuse demos of being tax and spend but repubs are borrow and spend.  Anything to aviod taxes now when the bill can be put off to future generations.

After this long diatribe, she voted yes on the bailout. I think she is schizophrenic.