“President Bush has stated numerous times that he speakes with God in the
Oval Office, he even asked God for military advice before the invasion of
Iraq.”  TRUECRISTIAN56, May 14 at 10:33 pm

Right.
Typical of the entire GHWBushSr entourage, to include extended pimpery.
Solicit highly qualified advice, then do the opposite.

Lafayette, Galileo Galilei is one of my cultural heroes, but to say that he, whose dates are 1564 - 1642, was the «first [who] questioned the geocentric dogma» is ahistorical ; as you yourself point out, Nicolaus Copernicus (1473 - 1543) had earlier «posited» a heliocentric system indeed, (nota bene: prior to Galileo’s birth). Nor for similar chronological reasons, can Galileo’s work nor the fact that it was placed on the Index Librorum Prohibitorum be said to «[lead] inevitably to Martin Luther (1483 - 1546) and the Reformation», given that the latter, like Copernicus, died before Galileo was born. How that particular Reformation leader viewed heliocentricism can be deduced from an example of his table conversation in 1539 : «There is talk of a new astrologer [i e, Nicolaus Copernicus] who wants to prove that the earth moves and goes around instead of the sky, the sun, the moon, just as if somebody were moving in a carriage or ship might hold that he was sitting still and at rest while the earth and the trees walked and moved. But that is how things are nowadays: when a man wishes to be clever he must . . . invent something special, and the way he does it must needs be the best! The fool wants to turn the whole art of astronomy upside-down. However, as Holy Scripture tells us, so did Joshua bid the sun to stand still and not the earth.» The Vatican was hardly - and is not today - the only religious «authority» opposed to the Weltanschauung of the physical sciences….

Henri

Thank you, Mr. Fish, there’s nothing like a laugh or two on a dreary Monday morning at work (Oh, I read the serious stuff too!)

And don’t mind the nit-pickers, halfwits, and religo maniacs, they don’t have much else to do after the stil’s been tended and the opossum’s on the fire.

excuse the typos below…kid is trying to drag me away to his game.

” I don’t HAVE an allegiance….”

“...OR it self-consumes”

Lafayette: “There’s no sense in replacing capitalism just because its gone awry in America.”

Why not? What’s so sacrosanct about capitalism…what did capitalism replace and was the loss of that regretted in the long run?

“But at the heart of the problem is not capitalism per se, but the American notion of capitalism.”

I disagree. I find capitalism inherently black hole gravitational and in need of tempering by various redistribution mechanisms of it self-consumes.

I don’t an allegiance to any particular economic form, but I find capitalism (American style worldwide)at present to be particularly impeding to human development.

I pretty much agree with the rest of what you said.

And, oh yeah…I have a life, thanks.

OM: Like all far Leftists, Mr Fish would be better off sticking with crayons or fingerpainting.

Yep ... just the sort of addle-headed wisdom one might expect from the Ozarks.

GET A LIFE

cul: That is why capitalism and its addiction to profit must be made to take a back seat to humanity’s more pressing concerns.

There’s no sense in replacing capitalism just because its gone awry in America. However, in America, it has become unfettered with far too much political influence.

But at the heart of the problem is not capitalism per se, but the American notion of capitalism. All was just fine for as long as one could flip a condo and walk away with a tidy profit, right?

But it was awful when capitalism headed down the flush-hole resulting from the Toxic Waste Mess. Meaning what?

Meaning that an economic system cannot have both. Breakaway riches for a comparative minor percentage of the population and the pits for the rest. For economic utility to be optimal then the result of its creation of value must be fairly shared. Not evenly shared, but equitably.

CROSSROADS

We are at the crossroads now where that decision - when does enough become too much - must be made. And yet, intrinsically, we are unable to even give it thought. We are so inured to capitalism being a boon for everyone.

It is now time to move on to a point where there is no automatic benefit for all without taxation of excessive wealth redistributed downwards - to assist people in taking the economic escalator to a middle-class existence.

But which middle-class existence? One in which obesity is a central attribute or consequence of the American way-of-life? Are we to assure that the middle-class has an adequate life-style so they can become sick from any one of the multiple consequences of obesity, And have a health-care system that remedies the illness, only for them to return sick yet again some other day?

Where does that cycle end? Or does it end?

MY POINT: The Question

Which is why we have to go beyond just economics or capitalism to answering a more profound question, “What sort of society do we want?” Having answered that question, we can always tweak the economy accordingly to achieve it.

But we are not yet prepared to even ask The Question, never mind answer it.

For the moment, we are prepared to accept the widening gulf between the haves and the have-nots - just as long as the latter get their daily allotment of 180% the caloric intake necessary to survive? (See chart here.)

Get a life ...

Actually, my earlier comment about needing an editor was a bit rude.

I like the ideas here a great deal. It’s just that the long sentences pack in quite a bit. I think that they need to be broken into bit-size pieces so that they are more enjoyable for me to read. That’s just my opinion.
And its a subjective judgment.

Mr Fish said: “Like the ancient geocentrists who believed that the Earth was the center of the universe and that all other heavenly bodies revolved around it, so much of the conservative ideology assumes that its stubborn refusal to tolerate any point of view that doesn’t recognize the values of the GOP as originating from some fixed center at the very core of the moral universe is in adherence to some permanent truth and not merely proof that the GOP is too fearful and too unimaginative and too antiquated to be able to comprehend—let alone keep up with—a reality that, simply by being chemically based, is anything but immovable.”

Like all far Leftists, Mr Fish would be better off sticking with crayons or fingerpainting.

@ Lafayette: “The capitalist system suits best the nature of mankind. It provides funding for “Good Ideas” and the profit-motive rewards initiative and competence.”

I’d submit that mankind has many natures, some of which suit profit oriented competitive capitalism and some which suit non-profit altruistic cooperation. Our problem today is that the former has caused the balance to become undone, suppressing the later by force and propaganda.

Basically, unfettered capitalism has made the game not worth the candle by removing the free market impetus. That is why capitalism and its addiction to profit must be made to take a back seat to humanity’s more pressing concerns.

@ TRUECRISTIAN56,

hahahaha

DOCTRINES

Fish: Like the ancient geocentrists who believed that the Earth was the center of the universe and that all other heavenly bodies revolved around it

Well put, this remark.

It harps back to a time before the Renaissance when belief was ruled by the Vatican, which insisted that the scriptures were menaced by the “heresy” of Galileo who first questioned the geocentric dogma.

Because the dogma was a foundational pillar of Catholic belief, which is why Galileo was humbled by being forced to renounce his belief. From his astronomy research, he confirmed what Copernicus had first posited, that the earth revolved about the sun and not vice-versa - by means of observation with the telescope that Galileo had invented.

Such “heresy” had to be stopped by the Vatican - so Galileo’s work (titled, “Dialogue Concerning the Two Chief World Systems”) was put on the church’s Index for the next 200 years and could neither be reprinted nor read by the faithful.

Still, the cat was let out of the bag. The Index did not stop the Renaissance from continuing, leading inevitably to Martin Luther King and the Reformation.

WHAT’S IT ALL ABOUT?

Present political dogma is merely a reflection of the above. Some elements of the Media (namely, Fox News) will support, without the slightest shred of evidence, that the Free Market Economy is a Foundational Belief of our democracy. That belief must not be conflicted by the observation that Free Markets do not always serve best its customers. In fact, it milks them for profit.

But, we must not shake the belief in a profit-generating capitalist system ... after all, we are all shareholders and players in the Church of Equity Markets - are we not?

MY POINT

The capitalist system suits best the nature of mankind. It provides funding for “Good Ideas” and the profit-motive rewards initiative and competence.

However, human greed has entered the Market Equation in order warp how the profit is generated, at whatever cost and at whatever the sacrifice. Companies seeking profit will go to where it is easiest to obtain - meaning it Cherry Picks its markets. If a market cannot generate sufficient levels of profit, why bother entering them?

This is where the notion of Public Utility should enter the equation. After all, if a product or service is of utility to all, then its distribution should address all markets.

Which is the notion behind such markets as rail transportation and telephony. They were developed with government instance that all customers be served in all geographies. Meaning the profits from urban markets where employed to extend the service to suburban and rural markets.

Thus, if the market is for Health Care, then the service rendered is of a nature to escape the normal “rules of engagement” of the Capitalist Profit System. People need this service regardless of the profit-motive - it should thus be made affordable/accessible to them.

The old rules of capitalist profit-making must be bent by government intervention to serve those most in need and not those most able to pay for the service. It is this intervention that makes some markets (notably Health Care and Education)  both fair and accessible for all, even though less profitable for some.

Profit is not The Main Criteria for such Public Services.

POST SCRIPTUM

Let us be careful about the doctrines that we are asked to believe. Galileo proved that point long ago.

same sex religion, stuff

trookhristyan86; you manage to impugn the theory of
evolution while completely debunking the myth of
intelligent design- all in one swell foop.
allahu akbar, monkey nipples. i’ve got your one true
thing.

‘GIRLFRIEND: Well, for one thing, about 85 percent of your personality comes from your complete fascination with your own SPOKEN DRIVEL.’

‘GIRLFRIEND: You’re an idiot.’

think we all know who was responsible for that, the Godless liberals who cannot stand having their immorality shoved back in their ugly face!! The defenders of free thought, the Big Bang theory and evolution, are not only striking out at me, but at all Christians. . Last night, while I was sitting on my front-porch swing, gazing up at Heaven, President Bush appeared to me in a vision. He told me that my work was not yet finished, there were still many liberals who had not yet seen the glory of the coming of the Lord!! President Bush would not be in the White House right now if God didn’t want him there. President Bush was put in a position of leadership in order to wipe the devil’s religion of Islam off the face of the Earth, so that the Christian God can fill the world with His message of peace and love. President Bush has stated numerous times that he speakes with God in the Oval Office, he even asked God for military advice before the invasion of Iraq. Modern liberalism is the equivalent of atheism, liberals are in favor of killing babies, raising taxes, teaching evolution, and same sex marriage. Jesus is opposed to all of these horrible things.

Nut’s, no edit feature;
But, I do get the gist of what’s being said by Fish.
Maybe next time he’ll let his wife edit for him. My
wife is super at editing my stuff.

jrundin, May 14 at 6:26 pm Link to this comment
Anyone who writes a sentence like this needs an editor:
==============================
LOL; boy, do they ever.

Anyone who writes a sentence like this needs an editor:

“Like the ancient geocentrists who believed that the Earth was the center of the universe and that all other heavenly bodies revolved around it, so much of the conservative ideology assumes that its stubborn refusal to tolerate any point of view that doesn’t recognize the values of the GOP as originating from some fixed center at the very core of the moral universe is in adherence to some permanent truth and not merely proof that the GOP is too fearful and too unimaginative and too antiquated to be able to comprehend—let alone keep up with—a reality that, simply by being chemically based, is anything but immovable.”

“ - an act of “Lese Magiste” (tearing down those in authority).” John
in Kerrville

The results of investigative journalism, the results of several
professional organizations, and the comparatively clean lawn of the
Pentagon on 9-11, suggest otherwise.  Have you ever witnessed the
aftermath of an airliner crash?  TV coverage on 9-11 proved that none
occurred at the Pentagon. And the huge insurance pay-outs on the WTC
bldg. group, which were no longer producing the desired profit?  The
F.B.I. found no evidence to link Osama bin Laden. One insider
physician stated that he had already died.  For sure, Osama bin Laden
had died by 10 Feb.2002, and was buried in an unmarked grave.

Of the Watergate-associated, Gordon Liddy is the only one of the group
who completed two acts of decency, at least, afterwards, for which he
was imprisoned. As a whistle-blowing messenger, an insider, who had
documented much more than he revealed, he was not assassinated; only
imprisoned.

Its good to know that Kerrville still exists.  In spite of - - .

Mr. Fish:

“It’s a common phenomenon, this maligning of the press from the right wing”

oh yes, and how.

What has been surprising, is how weakly the press has fought back. The are “only” attempting to destroy investigative journalism.

Wowee Zowee; such eloquence from a master artist. But
then your art is certainly eloquent all by itself.
I would always be interested to hear/read more from you
as the mood dictates. Cheers.

In 1957 I was serving aboard a destroyer in the Persian Gulf.  One day we officers
gathered aboard the flagship of the 5th Fleet, a white air-conditioned Seaplane
Tender moored off Bahrain for a meeting with the admiral in command.  In his
haughty remarks he said “These Arabs can’t shoot their way out of a paper bag.”

Osama bin Laden, a young man at that time, may have heard about this and
similar remarks and decided on an act of “Lese Magiste” (tearing down those in
authority).  That’s what brought on the bombing of the Twin Towers, in my
opinion.

Brilliant as always, Mr. Fish.
It is you who should be recieving the Mark Twain award and not the obnoxious, talentless adolescent, Will Farrel.

Waw! This is possibly the best piece of wisdom, satire and reflective piece of writing on current affairs I have read in decades!

I am so impressed, Mr. Fish, that I thanked God for sending you to this tortured humanity, or rather inhumanity. I always admired your art, but never imagined that you could elevate words to such powerful levels of expression on behalf of truth.

While reading your piece I was simultaneously laughing and crying and, that’s when I knew that I am face-to-face with a powerful piece of thought and art.

May you always be blessed with your brilliant humanity, and thank you so much for transforming what started as a bad day into a very bright one!

And thank you Truthdig for publishing such wonderful piece of art and thought!

Much ado about the certainty of sophism versus the uncertainty of unregulated dialectic.

Great article and thank you Mr. Day for that info I wasn’t aware of.
On another note can someone please take away the drop-down ad that pops down every few minutes resetting ones page position. Very annoying, possibly as annoying as Guernica would have been for Mr. Powell had it not been covered up for him.

Its been so long since I have had a genuine literary hero to admire and emulate. Thanks for on-going hits of genius…it makes living here in baptist central Florida slightly less suicide provoking. Jumbo kudos.

«In fact, I still find it reprehensible how purposely incurious the general public remained during Colin Powell’s criminal behavior at the U.N. Security Council in 2002, really ground zero for the bloodbath in Iraq in which we ended up drowning.» For the sake of completeness, and as one know-it-all to another, Dwayne, Mr Powell’s command performance at the UNO Security Council took place on 5 February 2003, after the necessary preparations had been made, viz, the covering of the tapestry depicting Picaso’s Guernica which had stood just outside the Council chamber for 24 years and served as a background to press conferences, so as not to embarass poor Mr Powell with a reminder of the horrors of war. Keep on cartooning !...

Henri

Mr. Fish has quite clearly found the perfect Mrs. Fish. 

I would also like to add that I agree with the first three
comment, except for the “a little rougher than I would put
it” part.

absolutely fabulous.

Right on, Fish!  A little rougher than I would put it in my own words, but I couldn’t possibly do any better. Thank you very much.